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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 31 Jul 1929

Vol. 31 No. 6

Finance Bill, 1929.—From the Seanad.

The Dáil went into Committee on Finance.

I intend to propose the acceptance of all the Recommendations from the Seanad to this Bill. The first Recommendation is:—

Section 5, sub-section (9). That a new sub-section be inserted before the sub-section, as follows:—

"(9) Every re-hearing of an appeal by the Circuit Court under Section 196 of the Income Tax Act, 1918, shall be held in camera, and every hearing by the High Court or the Supreme Court of a case stated under Section 149 of the said Act or under that section as extended by Section 10 of the Finance Act, 1924 (No. 27 of 1924) shall, if the person whose chargeability to tax is the subject of the case so desires, be held in camera."

This recommendation covers a matter which was raised when the Bill was before the Dáil by Deputy J.X. Murphy. It is a matter which had not been brought to my attention previous to its having been mentioned by Deputy Murphy, and I was not able to accept it then as I felt that it required some consideration and also, if it were accepted, that it might cause the Finance Bill to be no longer a Money Bill. As it was raised again and became a Recommendation in the Seanad, I see no objection to it. It will not prevent the reporting in the Law Reports of cases which may be decided in camera, but such cases will be reported as the case of X. or the case of Y. As I say, I have not heard very much about it. I heard, first, Deputy Murphy's complaint, and a few other instances. I cannot see that the adoption of this Recommendation will do any harm, and it may, in certain cases, prevent what individuals would feel as a hardship, namely, the divulgence of matters connected with their private affairs which so far as the hearing before special Commissioners or before the Circuit Court in the ordinary way is concerned, did not come to the public notice at all heretofore.

We are in agreement with the Recommendation.

Question—"That the Recommendation be accepted"—put and agreed to.

The second Recommendation is:—

Section 23, sub-section (1). That the word "five" be deleted in line 16 and the word "two" substituted therefor.

This deals with the question of the new exemption limit in respect of woollen cloth. As Deputies will remember, the section adopted by the Dáil provided that the new exemption limits should hold for a period of five years. I was asked, I think on the Committee Stage of the Finance Bill, whether I could make any statement as a result of certain discussions that had taken place with the woollen manufacturers and others in regard to the matter. I said that I might be able to make a statement on the Report Stage. As a matter of fact, I was not in a position to make any statement on the Report Stage. This matter seems to me to be extremely complicated, and it is extremely difficult to feel with any certainty that we have got all the facts. Undoubtedly the woollen manufacturers assert rather strongly that in a comparatively short time they will be able to make the bulk of the cloth required by the wholesale clothing manufacturers, but, on the other hand, those statements and assertions vary somewhat and have varied in their terms from time to time.

I have already stated in the Seanad that I saw myself a deputation of woollen manufacturers, and in conversation with me they said that they would be able to supply the goods required to the extent of 80 or 90 per cent. in a period of 18 months. A few days afterwards I had a letter from a representative of the woollen manufacturers who put the period at six months. In view of that, and in view of other circumstances, it is difficult to come to any conclusion about which one could feel certain as to what rate the manufacturers will make progress towards being able to supply the needs of the wholesale clothing manufacturers, and how soon they will be able to supply the bulk. It was the desire of the Government, and the original report shows that it was the desire of the Tariff Commission, to include the greatest possible bulk of cloth within the scope of the tariff. In pursuance of that desire I propose to accept this Recommendation from the Seanad limiting the life of the section which fixes the new exemption limit to two years. It may be, to take one point of view, that the woollen manufacturers will make no great effort to meet the requirements of the wholesale clothing manufacturers in the next two years, or to put themselves in a position to show that they can meet the demand. If that were to happen, it might be necessary to re-enact the section which is now only given a life of two years.

If, on the other hand, the manufacturers do demonstrate that they are willing to take all the steps they can take—I do not include in that the actual manufacture of cloth, because orders must be obtained before manufacture is undertaken—if they commence the preparation of designs and the actual issue of patterns, if they show that they are prepared to take all steps which it seems reasonable they should take to put themselves in a position to supply the requirements of the wholesale clothing manufacturers, then there will be no case for the re-enaction of the section, and at the end of the two year period the scope of the tariff would be as it was originally proposed.

This is a further change in the device which the Government have been elaborating for the purpose of repairing the mistakes they made when they acted on the report of the Tariff Commission. It is a further indication, if a further indication were necessary, that their one desire is really to avoid taking the obvious remedy, the remedy we suggested, of increasing the duty on ready-made clothing. So long as they avoid taking that remedy they will be coming to this House with new proposals, each as bad as the other, to try to remedy the situation which they have created.

We desire to say, at the same time, that we are not opposing the Recommendation.

Question—"That the Recommendation be accepted"—put and agreed to.
The Dáil went out of Committee.
Acceptance of Recommendation reported.
Question—"That the Dáil agree with the Committee in its Report"—put and agreed to.
Amendments made accordingly to the Bill.
Message ordered to be sent to the Seanad acquainting them accordingly.
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