Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 12 Jun 1930

Vol. 35 No. 8

Issues Out of Central Fund. - Vocational Education Bill, 1930 — Fourth Stage.

Minister for Education (Professor O'Sullivan)

I move:

In page 6, Section 4 (1), to delete all words from the words "and includes education" in lines 34 and 35 to the end of the sub-section and substitute the words "and in subjects bearing thereon or relating thereto and includes education in science and art (including, in the county boroughs of Dublin and Cork, music) and also includes physical training."

This is an amendment that I promised in connection with an amendment moved by Deputy Anthony in Committee. On that occasion I indicated that I would accept the principle of his amendment, subject to redrafting, and I also promised, in connection with the definition of technical education, to safeguard the schools in Dublin and Cork.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Mr. Fahy

I move:

In page 7, Section 8, lines 41, 46 and 52, to delete in each line the word "five" and substitute in each case the word "eight."

There are two amendments in reference to this matter, largely to the same effect, the other being in the name of Deputy Anthony.

Professor O'Sullivan

Does the Deputy think that Deputy Anthony's amendment is the same as his?

Mr. Fahy

I do not, but if mine were beaten I might accept Deputy Anthony's.

Professor O'Sullivan

Because his really aims in an opposite direction.

Mr. Fahy

I do not know. There are two interpretations of that. Section 8 says that the vocational education committee for a borough shall consist of fourteen members. When the Bill was introduced it stated that eight of these should be members of the council. The Minister has changed that to five, and that does not leave the rating authority with a majority on the committee. The purpose of this amendment is to secure that the rating authority shall have a majority on the committee, which will, of course, draft the scheme of education for the area and more or less bind the rating authority. On reconsideration we thought it advisable to restore the eight, if the Minister would agree.

Professor O'Sullivan

I indicated my purpose on Committee. I had a double purpose, as I said then, in proposing the change. On the one hand, I wanted to make it more clear that the county council representatives on the vocational committee would have control of the rating; on the other hand, I wanted to give some liberty to the county council in their choice of members. As the Bill originally stood it provided, as the Deputy has pointed out, practically for a majority from the county council on the vocational committee, but that did not give them control of the rates, and it limited them in their choice of members. As I said, one of the most important tasks that the committee will have to do will be to draw up an educational scheme. The county council might be very strongly of the opinion that they were not the people to do that. Therefore, I wish to give them more freedom, and, on the other hand, I wish to give them fuller control over the rates, and that is the reason why I reduced the eight to five, but, on the other hand, gave to these five the final word in the matter as to whether or not any additional rate should be struck. I am afraid that, to a certain extent, the Deputy's amendment would go back on the principle that we agreed to in Committee, and that is the reason why I cannot accept it. If the House wishes it, I have no objection to accept Deputy Anthony's amendment.

Mr. Fahy

The Minister, of course, has made a specious argument with reference to these committees drafting the educational scheme. He has conveniently forgotten that there might be ad hoc sub-committees. They are empowered to have sub-committees.

Professor O'Sullivan

I was answering the argument made by the Deputy.

Mr. Fahy

There might be ad hoc sub-committees to draw up these schemes.

Professor O'Sullivan

If the House wishes I will accept Deputy Anthony's amendment. I would point out that that amendment is only to one of the sub-sections.

Mr. Fahy

One of the three.

Professor O'Sullivan

I take it that the House agrees that it should go into the three places, that is, for the county boroughs, for the urban districts, and for the county councils. Deputy Fahy moved his amendment in the case of all three.

Deputy Anthony's amendment — In page 7, Section 8, lines 41, 46 and 52, after the word "five" to insert the words "nor more than eight"— put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move: —

In page 11, Section 18 (6), lines 41 and 42, to delete the words "and the business to be transacted at all or any such meetings."

This amendment is moved in response to an objection that was made here that Section 18, sub-section (6) seemed to give power to the Minister to intervene in practically every detail of business discussed, and I think I have met that by moving the deletion of the last line, which was really the cause of the objection, in Committee.

Professor Thrift

I think that is quite satisfactory.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move: —

In page 12, Section 21 (2), line 14, before the word "may" to insert the words "shall consist of not more than twelve members, and."

There was general agreement on the Committee Stage that we should limit the number of members of the sub-committee to twelve.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move: —

In page 12, Section 22 (3), to delete all words from the word "and" in line 46 to the end of the sub-section.

It was pointed out that the sub-committees might not meet five times and therefore that the committee would be deprived of the power of paying them for attendance. This amendment is to meet that objection.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move the following two amendments: —

In page 13, before Section 25, to insert new section as follows:—

(1) Every vocational education committee shall be deemed to be a local body within the meaning of Part IV. of the Act of 1925, and that part of that Act shall apply to vocational education committees and their officers accordingly, subject to the modifications hereinafter mentioned.

(2) Section 50 of the Act of 1925 shall not apply in respect of vocational education committees and their officers, and in lieu thereof it is hereby enacted that every sum payable under the said Part IV. of the Act of 1925 as applied by this section in respect of an allowance or gratuity granted thereunder to a person who was previously an officer of a vocational education committee shall be paid by the local authority which under this Act pays the annual local contribution to the expenses of such committee and shall be raised by means of the same rate and be paid out of the same fund and be charged on the same area as such annual local contribution is raised by means of, paid out of and charged upon, but no such sum shall be reckoned for the purposes of any enactment (including this Act) limiting the amount of such rate.

(3) There shall be paid out of moneys provided by the Oireachtas to a local authority paying any allowance or gratuity in pursuance of the foregoing sub-section, in aid of the rate or fund out of which such allowance or gratuity is so paid, one-half of every payment made by such local authority in respect of such allowance or gratuity.

(4) Section 47 of the Act of 1925 as amended by Section 9 of the Act of 1927 shall not apply in respect of vocational education committees and their officers, and in lieu thereof it is hereby enacted that —

(a) whenever an allowance or a gratuity is payable in pursuance of sub-section (2) of this section by a local authority (in this sub-section called the paying body) to any person under Part IV. of the Act of 1925 as applied by this section in respect of his ceasing to hold office under a vocational education committee and in ascertaining the service of such officer at the date of such cesser any service under another local authority (in this section called the contributing body) has been aggregated and reckoned, the contributing body shall refund to the paying body a part of one-half of such allowance or gratuity reckoned according to the service and pay of such officer under the contributing body and to the circumstances under which he ceased to hold office under the paying body, and such part shall be settled by agreement between the two bodies, or in default of agreement by the Minister for Local Government and Public Health, and

(b) for the purposes of the foregoing paragraph an officer's service under a committee of a contributing body shall be deemed to have been service under such contributing body and an officer's service under a joint committee of two or more contributing bodies shall be deemed to have been service under every such contributing body.

In pages 13 and 14, Section 25, to delete sub-section (1).—

These amendments I propose to take together, because the second amendment proposes the deletion of the first sub-section, and the first amendment really proposes a new section instead. This is to carry out the promise that I made in Committee, that whereas up to the present in practice the total burden of pensions was borne by the local authorities, in future the State will recoup the local authorities to the extent of 50 per cent.

Amendments put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment No. 9: —

In page 14, to insert at the end of Section 26 a new sub-section as follows: —

(2) The Minister shall not remove under this section from his office an officer of a vocational education committee unless and until he has caused a local inquiry to be held under this Act in relation to the performance by such officer of his duties as such officer and considered the report of the person who held such local inquiry.

The House will remember when this section was under discussion that from various parts of the House objection was raised that it gave too much power into the hands of the Minister. Apparently without any reason or proper inquiry he was empowered to dismiss an officer without any complaint having been made and on the vague grounds that he contended he was unfit. I promised on that occasion to bring Section 26 into harmony with Section 103. It is now provided that such action will not be taken until an inquiry is held in accordance with Section 103 of the Bill.

Mr. Fahy

I think this sub-section now added goes a long way to meeting the objection raised to the wording, particularly to the first line of Section 26 as it was in the original Bill and it is pleasing to see such sweet reasonableness in the Minister.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 10: —

In page 16, Section 33, line 2, to insert before the word "outside" the words "within or."

I think it was Deputy Thrift who raised the objection that Section 33 as it stands seemed to be rather lob-sided and unreasonable, on the grounds that it gave power to the committee to do in an outside area what apparently it could not do within its own area. I was under the impression that other sections of the Bill gave power to the committee to do it, especially with regard to the provision of scholarships under Section 38 of the Bill as it stands, but in order to remove any doubt I have inserted the words the Deputy suggested.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment No. 11: —

In page 17, Section 40 (1), line 24, to insert before the word "approved" the words "prepared by it and."

This is simply to show that there will not be a general scale of fees for the whole country, but that the committee will in each area consider the circumstances of its area and, in conjunction with the Department, draw up a scale.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 12: —

In page 18, Section 42 (2) (a), line 17, to insert after the word "county" the words "other than the County of Cork, to the amount of a rate of one penny three farthings in the pound on the rateable value of the area of charge at the commencement of such year or, where the rating authority is the Council of the County of Cork."

An amendment was moved by the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs on the occasion of the Committee Stage reducing the minimum fee from 2d. to one penny three farthings in the case of the counties. I pointed out I was quite willing, on the whole, with a certain amount of hesitation, to come down to one penny three farthings as the minimum rate, but that an exception had to be made in the case of one particular county, because there already a rate of 2d. is being struck for the purposes covered by this Bill. This amendment and the corresponding necessary changes in the Schedule, namely, amendment 28, are in consequence of a promise I then made. There is really no discrimination against Cork; it is only praise for Cork really.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Mr. Doyle

On behalf of Deputy Anthony I move amendment 13: —

In page 21, Section 50 (4) (b), after the words "(Ireland) Act, 1878," line 60, to insert the words "and may where it thinks proper borrow money for the purposes of making a grant under this section from the Commissioners of Public Works in Ireland and these Commissioners may, if they think fit, lend such money to such council under the Public Works (Ireland) Acts, 1831 to 1866, and notwithstanding anything in those Acts such loan may be made for such term as the Commissioners think fit."

The object of the amendment is to secure that a rating authority which borrows money to provide buildings for its vocational education committee may be empowered to borrow on terms equally as good as those given to the vocational education committee itself. As the Bill stands the rating authority is empowered to raise only what must be a short term loan with annual repayments. As it stands the Bill discourages the rating authority from borrowing as the money may be raised on better terms by the vocational education committee.

Professor O'Sullivan

Deputy Anthony suffers from a certain lack of vision in these things. He only sees the City of Cork. This is the second time he has forgotten that there are counties in Ireland as well as the City of Cork. I must confess there is not as much likelihood of this happening in the case of the counties as in the case of the county boroughs. However, I am quite willing to accept the principle with a slight change in the drafting, and as this is the Report Stage I have redrafted the amendment. My amendment will solve the difficulties and it is as follows: —

13a. In page 21, to insert at the end of Section 50 a new sub-section as follows: —

"(5) A rating authority borrowing money for the purposes of making a grant under this section may where it so thinks proper borrow such money from the Commissioners of Public Works in Ireland and those Commissioners may, if they think fit, lend such money to such rating authority under the Public Works (Ireland) Acts, 1831 to 1866, and notwithstanding anything in those Acts such loan may be made for such term as the Commissioners think fit."

That meets the Deputy fully. It is only a mere question of a slight change in the drafting. I am not quite sure whether the amendment is necessary or whether under the existing law the commissioners of public works would not have power to lend to a rating authority. They would not have power to lend to a vocational committee without special provision, but it is probable that under the existing law they have such powers. However, to put the matter beyond all doubt, I am quite willing to accept the amendment in the form I have indicated.

Amendment 13 withdrawn.

New amendment by the Minister put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment No. 14: —

In page 21, to add at the end of Section 50 a new sub-section as follows: —

"(5) Whenever a rating authority which has borrowed money for the purpose of making a grant under this section pays any sum in repayment of the money so borrowed or in payment of the interest thereon, the Minister may, with the consent of the Minister for Finance and out of moneys provided by the Oireachtas, make to such rating authority in aid of the rate or fund out of which such sum was so paid by such rating authority a payment of such amount as the Minister with the consent aforesaid shall think proper but not exceeding one-half of the said sum so paid by such rating authority."

This is a point which was raised by a few Deputies on the Committee Stage. At that time I expressed the view that I thought that the provision under Section 60 of extra grants by the local authorities was a pious hope and aspiration expressed in the Bill, but I gather that is not so, that it is not merely an indication to the councils of what we would like them to do, but that there is a possibility of this section being made use of, especially in the case of some of the county boroughs and some of the urban districts. Accordingly, I am moving that the Minister will have power, with the consent of the Minister for Finance, to make grants to the local authorities to help them to repay portion of the loan if the local authorities make additional grants of this kind for the purposes of this Bill.

Professor Thrift

I am glad the Minister is doing this and I hope it will not prove to be useless.

Professor O'Sullivan

I hope not; there are indications that it will be effective.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment No. 15:

In page 21, line 65, Section 51, to insert after the words "credit of" the words "or due and payable to."

This is really a drafting amendment to make it quite clear that if moneys are not merely in the possession of the committee that actually are due to them that this provision will hold.

Amendment put and agreed to.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Amendment 16 has been met by amendment 14.

Amendment 16 not moved.

Mr. Doyle

On behalf of Deputy Anthony I move amendment 17.

In page 26, Section 69 (1), line 47, after the word "the" to insert the words "principal or."

Professor O'Sullivan

This is the second time I have met this. I do not know what the precise force of the amendment is. We have a chief executive officer and everyone else is either a teacher or a principal teacher, so far as they are engaged in the teaching side of the scheme, and what the objection is to be dubbed a principal teacher I do not know. There seems to be a slight matter of pride involved in it, but I am not prepared to accept the amendment. At the same time I am not prepared to resign if defeated on it.

Amendment put and declared lost.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 18:

"In pages 34 and 35, Section 98, to delete sub-section (6)."

I think Deputy Goulding, amongst others, expressed some anxiety as to the effect of sub-section (6). It was really unnecessary in the Bill. It did apparently give rise to a certain amount of anxiety because bodies representing officers who would be affected have made the same point to me that Deputy Goulding made. I thought and the draftsman agreed the best way to meet the situation was to propose the deletion of sub-section (6). In that case the position of the officer is fully safeguarded by the Local Government Act of 1925, which says that the officer can count his service under various local bodies and not merely under one. It is really to meet a point made in Committee that this amendment is introduced.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Mr. Doyle

On behalf of Deputy O'Connell I move amendment 19: —

In page 35, Section 98, to add at the end of the section a new sub-section as follows: —

(9) In this section the word "officer" includes "servant."

Professor O'Sullivan

I explained my attitude to this on the last occasion. I cannot accept it. It ties the hands of the Committee to a tremendous extent and establishes rights, so far as local bodies are concerned, in a rather casual fashion without full and definite consideration for the point involved. It includes people who at the moment hold their positions on possibly the condition of a weekly or monthly notice, and brings them into the same lines, so far as tenure of office and rights are concerned, with those who have certain statutory rights and whose position is more definitely certain, namely, the officers. I am sorry I cannot accept the amendment.

Amendment put and declared lost.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 20: —

"In page 37, Section 101 (4), to delete paragraph (a)."

The same explanation applies to this amendment as applied to amendment 18.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 21: —

In page 38, Section 102, to delete sub-section (4) and substitute the following sub-sections:

"(4) The Minister may, by order made under this sub-section, declare that any particular portion or portions of Saorstát Eireann specified in such order shall form part of the Gaeltacht, and whenever any such order is made the portion or portions of Saorstát Eireann to which such order relates shall be deemed for the purposes of this section but no further or otherwise to form part of the Gaeltacht.

(5) Every order made by the Minister under the foregoing sub-section shall be laid before each House of the Oireachtas as soon as may be after it is made, and if a resolution is passed by either such House within the next subsequent twenty-one days on which that House has sat after such order is laid before it annulling such order, such order shall be annulled accordingly but without prejudice to the validity of anything previously done under such order."

I think I indicated that I was not satisfied with the definition of the Gaeltacht contained in sub-section (4). I promised on that occasion to get that whole sub-section redrafted. As the sub-section stood, I am not sure that it meant anything definite. It does now. It may be made something definite. There is a power given to the Minister to make the matter definite and to change it wherever a change is necessary.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 22:

In page 40, Section 110 (1), line 16, to delete the words "the minimum rates" and substitute the word "scales," and in sub-section (2), line 19, to delete the words "at a rate lower than the rate," and substitute the words "which is not in accordance with the scale."

I think there was objection raised to the question that minimum rates might not include increments. The suggestion was actually made that the word "scales" be introduced instead. I am actually doing this in the amendment.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 23:

In page 40, Section 112 (1), to insert at the end of the sub-section the words "and any school or course which is maintained or assisted by a vocational education committee."

I think it was Deputy Anthony on behalf of Deputy O'Connell who moved the substance of this amendment on the Committee Stage. I think the amendment is reasonable, and I indicated that there was a point in it, as Deputy Anthony explained it on the last day, that I had not seen before. I promised to reconsider it in the interval. I have considered it again and adopted his suggestion.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 24:

In page 41, Section 116 (2), line 22, to delete the words "certificate of the date of" and substitute the words "certified copy of the entry of."

It is a purely drafting amendment.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 25:

In page 41, Section 116 (3), line 32, to insert before the word "registrar" the words "superintendent registrar or," and in sub-section (4), page 41, line 38, to insert before the word "registrar" the words "superintendent registrar or."

This is a purely drafting amendment also.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move amendment 26:

In page 42, Section 121 (2), line 28, to insert after the word "to" the words "anything referred to in Section 116 (which relates to inspection and copies of registers of births and deaths) of this Act as prescribed or to."

This is also a drafting amendment.

Amendment put and agreed to.

Mr. E. Doyle

On behalf of Deputy Everett, I move amendment 27: —"In page 42, First Schedule, to insert in the appropriate place the words ‘Bray Urban District.' The population of Bray is 9,000 and the population of Blackrock Urban is only about 9,080. Deputy Everett contends that Bray should be also included in the Schedule to the Bill. In 1904 the enrolment in Bray Technical Schools was 156, and in 1928-29 it had increased to 369.

Mr. Moore

I would like to support the amendment. In the Committee Stage I pressed the Minister to introduce an amendment of this kind himself. Since then very strong representations have reached the Minister, I believe, and there is no doubt that there is very considerable local feeling on this matter. There would be no great sacrifice of principle. I suggest to the Minister that he is going to lose a great deal of concentrated enthusiasm by the abolition of the present North Wicklow Technical Education Committee. There is no town in which public men have given more of their time to developing an interest in technical education and there are very few towns where there has been more success attending these efforts. If the town of Bray is now merged in the county it means that a great deal of that enthusiasm will be lost, since the town will be only entitled to two representatives on the county committee and it will inevitably result in a decline of interest in the classes. I hope the Minister will be able to make a favourable statement on the subject.

Mr. Fahy

I suppose this would be an appropriate place in which to refer to other towns as well as Bray, merely to elicit information from the Minister. I noticed a letter in the Press the other day from the Tralee Technical Committee in which they stated that when amalgamated with the county council their income would be £450 plus £450, pound for pound grant from the Government, or £900 in all, and that their present income is £4,000. If that is true, of course, Tralee technical education would be very hard hit and as Bray seems to be in much the same position and desires to get on the First Schedule the Minister may discuss the two points together and give us some information upon them.

Professor O'Sullivan

With regard to the last point that has been raised, I have some slight knowledge of the Tralee situation. The Tralee argument was not quite as stated by the Deputy but was somewhat like this. They fear that owing to the finances of the Bill they would be forced into an amalgamation with the county. As the Deputy indicated, they pointed out that at present they have an income of £4,000, that in future they could only raise so much from the rates and only get so much from the Government. They pointed out that with the amount made available in that way they could not run the school and therefore would be forced into amalgamation. It is possible that what I said on the Second Reading of the Bill and also on the Committee Stage was not fully reported. I cannot say that because I do not read my speeches in the papers. Anyhow there are no grounds for that fear. If we schedule an area here it is not to buoy up a committee with the hope that they are going to continue in existence and then when we get the opportunity to wipe the committee out of existence. Of course, there would be no such intention. I think I indicated pretty clearly on the occasion on which we discussed the Bill before that it was not proposed to interfere with the present grants and that the 50-50 proposition did not apply to present grants. That apparently was not noticed by those who expressed fears in the case of the Tralee scheme. On the Committee Stage Deputy Fahy utilised another amendment and section to extract information from me and I then indicated that the 50-50 would apply to future improvements, but that, in addition, there would be a number of smaller schemes in which it might be necessary to give more owing to the fact that a penny rate produced so very little. A number of urban schemes such as Cork, Limerick and others might require more than 50-50, but Dublin would not. There are, therefore, no grounds for the fears expressed in the case of Tralee.

I want, however, to make myself quite clear on this. I am not quite sure — Deputy Doyle, of course, is only deputising for another member at the moment — that Bray wants an amendment such as this, because Deputy Moore made it quite clear in his speech — at least, there was the hint in his speech — that he wanted something different. To schedule the urban district of Bray would undoubtedly be in keeping with the general provisions of the Bill, with the general plan of the Bill. I might consider that if the Bray authorities put it up to me as to how far they could be met in that particular case. But this amendment is a different thing altogether from the present Bray scheme, and from the Tipperary scheme, where you have an urban authority forming the nucleus of a district which does not belong to the urban area. That is a difficulty which cuts across the whole rating principle of the Bill. You are putting Bray under an urban scheme with portion of the county rate. That is my difficulty. We could have set out to draft the whole Bill on these principles. We might have made a city like Drogheda or Dundalk the centre of a scheme of that kind. It could have been done, but the whole Bill was drafted on entirely different lines. That is why it is found difficult to accede to the request of the Bray Committee, but if Deputy Doyle, who has spoken for Deputy Everett, or Deputy Moore, or the Bray people, think that to some extent their wishes could be met by scheduling Bray Urban District, I would be willing to consider that. They cannot get a rate from the county. There might be some diminution of the actual grants they get.

They will probably read what I am saying, and if that would in any way meet their wishes I will indicate that to them. It might be possible in the Seanad to get an amendment of this kind inserted, but I wonder whether it is really worth it. Blackrock and Dún Laoghaire, assuming the Greater Dublin Bill passes, will be amalgamated, but if you compare Bray with some of the other places, such as we have scheduled here, the case is not by any means as strong for Bray from the point of view of technical education, as some of the other smaller places that appear in this schedule. There is a case in Bray for continuation education, but, if so, that is no barrier to their being absorbed into the general Wicklow scheme. I ask Deputies to consider the general effect on County Wicklow as a whole. It is not a big county and not thickly populated, and it is possible to run a combined scheme for the whole county, including Bray. We find no difficulty in that way in Cork where we are absorbing Cobh into the whole scheme for the County of Cork, but if Bray puts up a case for being scheduled as an urban district, while I do not promise that I will accede to their wishes, I will certainly consider them. I will write to them to that effect.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Professor O'Sullivan

I move: —

In page 14, to delete Part II. of the Third Schedule and substitute the following: —

"PART II.

In Counties.

Local Financial Year.	Number of Pence in the Pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1931.	In Co. Cork, 2d. in the pound.In every other county, 1¾d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1932.	2d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1933.	2¼d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1934.	2½d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1935.	2¾d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1936.	3d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1937.	3¼d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1938.	3½d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1939.	3¾d. in the pound.
Year commencing on 1st April, 1940, and every subsequent year.”	4d. in the pound.

This is consequential on the amendment in connection with the three-farthing rate. It is only changing the Schedule in accordance with the amendment that has been accepted. As I indicated on the last occasion, I have no objection to the Act stopping so far as this matter is concerned at the year 1940.

Amendment agreed to.

Question —"That the Bill, as amended, be received for final consideration"— put and agreed to.

Professor O'Sullivan

If there is no objection I would like the next stage to be taken now.

Agreed.

Question —"That the Bill do now pass"— put and agreed to.

The Dáil adjourned at 10.15 until Friday, 13th June, at 10.30.