Horse Breeding Bill, 1933—From the Seanad.

It is proposed to accept all the Seanad amendments to this Bill.

Any objections?

After the love feast in the Seanad there could not but be harmony.

The following amendment was agreed to:—

Section 2. The words and figures "not earlier than the 1st day of January, 1934" deleted in lines 23-24.

Dr. Ryan

I move: That the Committee agree with amendment No. 2:—

2. Section 4. The section deleted and six new sections substituted therefor as follows:—

4.—(1) The Minister shall cause to be kept a list to be called and known as "the list of exempted stallions" (in this Act referred to as ‘the list").

(2) The list shall be in the prescribed form and there shall be entered therein and removed therefrom the matters respectively required by this Act to be entered therein and removed therefrom.

(3) Any person may inspect the list on payment of such fee, not exceeding one shilling for each inspection, as may be prescribed.

5.—(1) The owner of any stallion (in this Act referred to as an exemptible stallion), which is entered in a prescribed recognised stud book and which—

(a) is used for the service of no mares other than mares which are either

(i) entered in a prescribed recognised stud book, or

(ii) approved by the Minister,

or

(b) is used exclusively for racing,

or

(c) is in training for racing,

may make application to the Minister requesting him to enter such stallion in the list as the property of such owner.

(2) Every application made under this section shall be made in the prescribed form and manner, shall contain the prescribed particulars, and shall be accompanied by such fee, not exceeding two shillings and sixpence, as may be prescribed.

6.—(1) On receipt of any application made under and in accordance with this Act for the entry of a stallion in the list, the Minister shall, if he is satisfied that such stallion is an exemptible stallion, enter such stallion and the prescribed particulars relating to such stallion in the list.

(2) Every stallion for the time being entered in the list shall, save as otherwise provided by this Act, be an exempted stallion within the meaning of and for the purposes of this Act.

7.—The Minister shall remove from the list any stallion entered therein which has ceased to be an exempted stallion on the Minister becoming aware of such cesser.

8.—(1) Any stallion entered in the list shall cease to be an exempted stallion on the happening of any of the following events, that is to say:—

(a) the expiration of six months from the death of the owner of such stallion where the personal representative of such owner has not during those six months transferred (whether by sale, assent to a bequest or otherwise) the ownership of such stallion, or

(b) the expiration of a period of thirty days from the date of any transfer of the right to the ownership of such stallion, unless the person to whom the right to the ownership of such stallion is transferred applies within such period, under this Act, for the entry of such stallion in the list as the property of such person, or

(c) such stallion ceasing to be an exemptible stallion.

(2) It shall be the duty of the owner of any stallion entered in the list and of the personal representative of any deceased owner of any such stallion to notify the Minister of the happening of any event by reason of which such stallion ceases to be an exempted stallion.

(3) If any person fails to comply with the obligation imposed on him by the immediately preceding sub-section, such person shall be guilty of an offence under this section, and shall on summary conviction thereof be liable to a fine not exceeding forty shillings.

9.—(1) The list shall be—

(a) deemed to be in proper custody when in the custody of the Minister or any officer of the Minister authorised in that behalf by the Minister, and

(b) admissible in evidence without further proof on production from the proper custody.

(2) Prima facie evidence of any entry in the list may be given in any court or any legal proceeding by the production of a copy of such entry purporting to be certified to be a true copy by any officer of the Minister authorised in that behalf, and it shall not be necessary to prove the signature of such officer, or that he was in fact such officer, or was in fact so authorised.

(3) A certificate purporting to be under the hand of an officer of the Minister, authorised in that behalf by the Minister, that any stallion specified in such certificate is not entered in the list shall be conclusive evidence of the matter so certified, and it shall not be necessary to prove the signature of such officer, or that he was in fact such officer, or was in fact so authorised.

(4) Any person may—

(a) obtain a copy certified in the manner hereinbefore mentioned to be a true copy of any entry in the list on payment of such fee as may be prescribed;

(b) obtain such certificate as is hereinbefore mentioned that a stallion is not entered in the list on payment of such fee as may be prescribed.

Amendment No. 4:—

Section 6. The Section deleted.

I wish to raise a question on this amendment. The amendment says "the Minister shall cause to be kept a list to be called and known as the list of exempted stallions." Does the Minister intend to publish copies of this list?

Dr. Ryan

A copy will be available, as set out here, for a fee of 1/-.

I think that is for inspection. Will the Minister give me the place where it is stated that this list is available?

Dr. Ryan

I am afraid the Deputy is right.

A question arises about the list. This list will be one of five or six hundred horses. The usefulness of this list will arise where the sale of a colt is taking place. One can discover for the payment of a 1/- whether a colt is on the list, but it often happens that when a man goes to buy a particular animal he may not purchase that animal, he may purchase another animal. In a case of that sort it is quite apparent that a list would be very useful to purchasers because the list is a certificate that the horse is not subject to any disability. I would suggest that such a list be published. The list will be compiled annually, as a general rule I should say, at the beginning of the year. There may be some erasures or some eliminations from the list. Some changes may take place during the year from one cause or another but that could not form the subject of any serious objection to the list being available, and, in consequence, I think it would be well that a copy of the list could be procured for a nominal fee. A single inspection only costs a 1/-, but if one had to examine 40 horses it may cost £2.

Dr. Ryan

He could examine the whole for 1/-.

As I said, while one may go to buy one particular horse that particular horse may not be bought, and the would-be purchaser may want to buy another of the lot offered for sale instead.

Dr. Ryan

Of course, the Deputy realises, as he has shown by what he said, that the list will be changed from time to time. In fact, at all times, horses may be going off the list and on to the list and there is provision made for supplying a certified copy of any particular entry in the list or a certificate to show that the horse is not on the list, if necessary, for a prescribed fee. That is provided for in the new Section 9, sub-section (4). I think that would meet the Deputy's point.

That is a certificate in respect of one animal, but one may go down, for instance, to one of the big training stables. I know one stable where there are over a 100 horses in training. A man may go down to buy one horse. He may see two or three horses that he likes and takes the owner's word for it that these horses are exempted, that they are on the exemption list, but it follows that he must come here in order to see the list, to make sure that he is all right. I would say that all that trouble would be obviated if copies of the list were available. The alterations that take place in so far as additions are concerned, are negligible in number. They would refer only to whatever number of horses would be brought into this country for racing or for other purposes in respect of which exemptions would be made. I would say that additions of that sort, if any at all, would be negligible. On the other hand, the names of certain horses may be removed from the list for a particular purpose. If they were sent out of the country, that would be one of the purposes, but normally the erasures would not be so many and it would be an enormous advantage if the list were available.

Dr. Ryan

I think I can meet the Deputy as well on this point. It says here:—"that any person may inspect the list on payment of such fee... as may be prescribed." The fee an individual pays would be nominal and we can, I think, arrange to give any particular list of horses to a particular owner for a very small fee. If a person had 100 horses we could give him a certified copy for a very small fee or a certificate that they were in the list.

You would not confine the list to his own horses? He might have some others in training.

Dr. Ryan

If he is interested in any other horses there would be no difficulty about it.

Question put and agreed to.

Dr. Ryan

I move: That the Committee agree with the Seanad in amendments Nos. 3, 4, 5:—

Section 5. The section deleted.

Section 6. The section deleted.

Section 25. The words "certificate of exemption" deleted in line 18.

Question put and agreed to.
The Dáil went out of Committee.
Agreement with Seanad amendments reported.
Report agreed to.