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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 27 Nov 1940

Vol. 81 No. 5

Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Milk Prices in Kilkenny.

asked the Minister for Supplies whether he sanctioned an increase from 1/6 to 2/- per gallon for milk in Kilkenny, and, if so, whether he will state the grounds for his doing so.

The price of 1/6 referred to in the question is the summer price for milk which has been, for some years, less than the winter price. The price of 2/- per gallon has been provisionally sanctioned by me as the current winter price in Kilkenny.

The increase has been granted on the grounds of increased costs of milk production and distribution. The price is on a par with that in other urban areas in which the conditions are similar, and has been agreed after consultation with the Department of Agriculture.

Retail milk prices in Kilkenny and other districts have been under review in my Department since the outbreak of war and the present position in the country as a whole is under consideration.

I do not think the Minister has fully answered my question. The people of Kilkenny are anxious to be informed of the facts and figures submitted by the Milk Vendors' Association which convinced the Minister that 2/- per gallon should be sanctioned for milk. I wonder if the Minister has heard since that has been done that the milk vendors would be well satisfied with 1/8 per gallon, but like many people looking for increased prices they asked for more than that amount. Will the Minister make available for the public the facts and the figures which led to the sanctioning of the present price?

The retail milk supply in Kilkenny, I understand, is in the hands of a large number of small land owners, from whom it is impossible to secure costings and accounts of the usual kind. In order to determine what would be a reasonable price for milk at different periods of the year the practice is to compare conditions in Kilkenny with those in other centres, in which it is known competition is in full swing, to determine the price. It was considered that conditions in Kilkenny were similar to those in the City of Cork, and the price fixed for Kilkenny was based on the same level as that fixed for Cork. It is apparent that the distribution of milk for retail sale in Kilkenny is neither economic nor efficient, but it is equally clear that costs of production and distribution have increased substantially since the outbreak of the war.

The Minister made an order under the Emergency Powers Act concerning the price of milk in Letterkenny. I should like to know what is the difference between the position in Letterkenny and Kilkenny.

The price in Letterkenny is the same as in Kilkenny.

How would Kilkenny compare with Cork?

Conditions are the same.

Are not farmers selling milk to creameries at 5d. a gallon?

I am talking about the price of milk sold retail to consumers and costs of distribution must be taken into account.

Would the Minister be prepared to have the matter reconsidered in relation to the Government's policy regarding an increase in wages? If the Minister is prepared to sanction an increase of 25 per cent. for such a necessary commodity as milk can the Government refuse at the same time to allow local authorities to increase wages?

There has not been an increase of 25 per cent. in Kilkenny.

Thirty-three and one third.

The prices set out in the question are not correct. Do not compare winter and summer conditions ! If a comparison is made now it must be with the winter price last year. It is practicable to fix a lower price for milk knowing that it will put a large number of people engaged in the trade out of it and confine it to a smaller number with more efficient methods. That course we may have to adopt.

Mr. Morrissey

Would it not be a graver source of injury if the Government should make milk so dear that children would not be able to get as much as they should get? I think that would be more serious than putting a certain number of people out of the trade.

Seeing that the delivery of milk in Kilkenny is carried out by horse-drawn vehicles, will the Minister say where the increased cost of distribution arose?

There are items in which the Department is satisfied specific increases in costs have taken place. Our concern at the moment is to ensure that no unreasonable profits are taken. We are satisfied that unreasonable profits are not taken. The question of the reorganisation of the methods of production and distribution, so as to reduce costs, is a matter that is directly the concern of the Department of Agriculture, but in relation to it discussions are taking place between my Department and the Department of Agriculture.

Mr. Morrissey

Are we to understand that the Government is prepared to sanction increases to meet increased costs to other sections except in the case of ordinary workmen? That is what it boils down to.

Our policy in relation to prices is to permit such increases as can be shown to be unavoidable, as in the case of milk.

Mr. Morrissey

Does not the same thing apply to men with low weekly wages? They have to get increases to meet increased charges.

That is a wider question.

Is it not a fact that the people of Kilkenny are no worse off in this respect than people in other places?

They were never worse off.

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