Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 23 Feb 1944

Vol. 92 No. 12

Committee on Finance. - Vote 56—Transport and Meteorological Services.

Minister for Industry and Commerce (Mr. Lemass)

I move:—

That a Supplementary sum not exceeding £10 be granted to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending 31st March, 1944, for Transport and Meteorological Services, including a Grant-in-Aid.

The Dáil will have noticed that the Supplementary Estimate is required in consequence of increased expenditure under four sub-heads. The increased expenditure under two of these sub-heads is due solely to the payment of additional bonus to members of the staff. An amount of £5,130 is required for the payment of compensation for lands and property acquired in connection with the Shannon Airport. Certain property at Foynes had to be acquired for circumstances associated mainly with the expansion of activities at the airport. Included in the sum is an item of £630, which represents compensation payable for a holding of land, which was acquired some years ago in connection with the construction of the airport at Rineanna, but which could not be paid because of difficulty in determining title. That difficulty has been resolved and the compensation is now due for payment.

There is also a new sub-head, B. 8, for a Grant-in-Aid in connection with the establishment of a clubhouse at Foynes. With the growth of flying operations there, a considerable increase in the number of State staff and operating company personnel has taken place and the absence of a social and recreational centre for these staffs has been felt. Discussions took place between the three operating companies and the airport authority, which led to arrangements whereby each of the parties will contribute a sum of money to the provision of a suitable building for a staff club. The club will be run by a committee, of which the airport manager has been elected chairman and, as well as having a value as a focal point for social activities, it will, it is hoped, afford an opportunity of promoting good feeling and mutual understanding between all the members of the various staffs and thereby promote the harmonious working of the airport.

Savings under sub-heads of the Vote more than equal the additional expense on these sub-heads and only a token amount is, therefore, being asked for. It is necessary to have a Supplementary Estimate, because the two matters to which I have referred were not covered in the original Estimate.

Sir John Esmonde

Would the Minister state roughly how many persons are employed or form the personnel at this airport, just to give an idea of the size of the operation?

Mr. Davin

Under sub-head B (7), would the Minister give particulars of the acreage of land required in this particular place or the nature of the other property in addition to the land? Would he also say how this land was acquired, whether by agreement or by some Emergency Powers Order, or whether it was acquired in the usual way through the Land Commission? I would also like to know the price per acre for the land so acquired.

Mr. Connolly

In reference to sub-head E (1), would the Minister give some information as to the nature of the meteorological services rendered? I take it that this will become more and more important as time goes on, particularly in reference to air traffic. As I understand the situation, this service in most countries is rendered particularly by staffs of observatories and I think I am correct in saying that we have only one State observatory in this country, and that is at Armagh.

Mr. Lemass

It is not provided for in this Vote.

Mr. Connolly

Is it not time that we did something about getting an observatory going here in the south or about reviewing the position of the Dunsink observatory?

Mr. Lemass

I intervene merely to say that that is not a matter for the Minister for Industry and Commerce but for the Minister for Education. The meteorological service provided by this Department is purely utilitarian.

Mr. Connolly

That is what I am pointing out. For instance, the observatory at Armagh is purely utilitarian, in so far as it aids the Air Force and other traffic. Where I thought the Minister for Industry and Commerce came in here was that it would be essential for the future development of air traffic to take steps to provide meteorological services here in the South, and I think that in the future he will be very handicapped by the fact that we have no observatory here. As I understand things, the observatories have been closed down, and the only observatory in this country is in Armagh. I am asking the Minister whether, in view of the growing importance of the air service in the future, he would not reconsider this question of opening up an observatory in the South, with particular reference to the utility of the meteorological service which is attached thereto.

Mr. J. Larkin (Junior)

Might I ask the Minister whether the services of this meteorological station are only made available for purposes of aircraft? Could they not be available for the benefit of the farming community? There may be certain difficulties at present—I can appreciate that—as weather reports are discontinued elsewhere. It is a point which might be kept in view and which could be considered possibly in relation to the activities of the Agricultural Advisory Council.

In connection with sub-head B (8), the Minister has indicated that the growth of traffic at Foynes has occasioned necessity for facilities for the staff. Could he indicate the number of services utilising the airport at present? Finally, regarding sub-head B (1) —Salaries and Wages—there is another airport which is not completely under the control of the Department but in that case, while the subsidy is the main basis of the payment of wages and salaries, the standard that has been set is not a very good one. In so far as the Department has direct responsibility, it should set a better headline than the other civil airport, where considerable difficulty has arisen, owing to the low wages in force and to the fact that, when the standstill Order came along, it was not possible to improve the conditions, except by a very limited bonus.

Mr. L. Cosgrave

Could the Minister say whether, in regard to the State service he mentioned and the air transport companies, any contribution is received from other users of Foynes, who might contribute not alone to the clubhouse but pay a rent?

Mr. Connolly

On the point which has been raised, wherever there is a law case or a dispute which has something to do with the weather or the meteorological conditions, the farmers here have to apply to Armagh observatory for such data in regard to the state of the weather on the particular day in regard to which the dispute has arisen. Therefore, it would be of use in that way to establish observatories in the South.

Mr. Lemass

The number of persons employed by the State in the administration of the airport is approximately 100. In addition, there would be about 250 people employed by the operating companies, so that the total staff for which the club-house is intended to cater would be about 350. The property acquired for which the money is needed was not land: the greater part of the sum is needed for the purchase of a building on the pier at Foynes. This building had been purchased originally from the harbour trustees by the British Overseas Airways Corporation. At that time, the British Overseas Airways Corporation was the only company using the airport, but when other companies began to use the airport it was considered more appropriate that the building on the pier should be the property of the airport authority and not of an operating company. The building was then purchased, by agreement, from the British Overseas Airways Corporation. The Monteagle Arms Hotel at Foynes was taken over for staff accommodation, but the bar portion of the hotel was not acquired at that time. Subsequently, with an extension of the staff to be accommodated and the need for providing better facilities for the provision of meals and the refreshment of people using the airport, the bar premises of the hotel were also acquired. They were acquired compulsorily, and provision is now being made for the compensation that will be payable to the owner. In addition, there was a gravel pit acquired to facilitate constructional work which is proceeding there at the moment.

I think Deputy Connolly misunderstands the position concerning our meteorological services. His references to Dunsink misled me. There is, I think, some idea of reopening Dunsink, or of having some similar establishment for educational purposes, to enable students to acquire training in this science. We have established here a very elaborate and highly organised and, I may say, very efficient meteorological service. I think the scope of that service will be indicated by the fact that the salaries of the staff employed in connection with it amount to £40,000 a year. That service was established by us some years ago. Subsequent to the Treaty of 1922, the meteorological service continued to be operated by the British Meteorological Department. Some years ago we took over the meteorological services and extended them very considerably. It is true that since the beginning of the war the publication of daily meteorological information has been suspended, but there is a full information service in existence which can be availed of when necessary and which will permit of the publication of regular information when normal conditions are restored. Not merely is it not correct to say that there is no observatory here but we have, in fact, a number of observatories. A number of new observing stations are being opened in different parts of the country.

Our meteorological service at the present time is mainly employed in connection with civil aviation services. I think it is true to say that it has been very efficiently run, so efficiently that it has established an international recognition for competency. I have received from other Governments that have had contact with our service very substantial praise of its efficiency. We are, of course, in a key position so far as the meteorological services in Europe are concerned. All weather comes from the west, and the efficiency of the meteorological services in all European countries depends very largely on the efficiency of the service in this country. Consequently, it helps to enhance our prestige internationally when our meteorological service is fully developed and efficiently run. I think it is, but the use that can be made of it is, of course, limited in present circumstances. There are three companies using the airport at the moment—the British Overseas Airways Corporation, the Pan-American Airways, and the American Export Airlines. The number of services operated by each company in a week varies considerably. The companies pay rent to the airport authority in relation to the number of services that they operate.

I do not think there was any other point raised on this Supplementary Estimate. The main Estimate for the Department will, of course, come before the Dáil in the course of the next few months, and it will enable Deputies to raise other matters that do not necessarily come within the purview and scope of this Supplementary Estimate.

Mr. Larkin (Jun.)

I understand that an international aeronautical conference is to be held in the United States this year. Will the Minister say if this country will be represented at it?

Mr. Lemass

Certainly. International meteorological conferences have been held here in the past couple of years. They are held regularly in connection with particular inquiries. There is, as the Deputy can understand, daily contact with the meteorological services of all countries to which air lines are operating.

Mr. Larkin (Jun.)

I understand that this conference will be of a wider scope.

Mr. Lemass

There is a permanent conference, of which we are members and to which we contribute every year.

Mr. L. Cosgrave

In connection with the civil aviation conference which is to be held in England or Scotland in the near future, will the Minister say if we are to be represented at it?

Mr. Lemass

Yes. There is a scheme for the protection of aircraft, and that has to be drawn up in connection with every air service. That scheme is operated on our behalf by the meteorological service.

Vote put and agreed to.