There appears to have been agreement amongst most of the Deputies who spoke that this discussion on our fuel problems was useful. I hope that time will justify that conclusion. I am very doubtful if it is going to prove as useful as some Deputies suggested. I think it is necessary that we should deal with realities and realities only in such matters. Them eluctance of many Deputies to face realities and their apparent willingness to delude themselves as to the facts is going to be a new problem for this House in dealing with the conditions that will undoubtedly emerge for our consideration in the course of the year.
I am not sure that all the misstatements made in the course of the debate were due to lack of knowledge or that every speaker had concern only for helping the country over its difficulties. However, to confine ourselves to the immediate problem with which the original notice of motion dealt, I want Deputies to appreciate that the restrictions which have been imposed upon the use of coal for transport, gas production, electricity production, industrial production, or any other purpose have been occasioned by the realities of the situation—realities out of which Deputies can neither talk themselves nor shout themselves. I do not think that the advent of these exceptional fuel difficulties came, as was suggested, as a surprise or a shock to the people. Not merely has the possibility of rapid accentuation of our fuel difficulties existed at all times for a few years past, not merely has that been emphasised by Government spokesmen on all suitable occasions during that period but, as recently as the 1st March, I went specially to the Dublin Broadcasting Station to talk about fuel and to draw public attention to the fact that our available supplies of coal were barely sufficient for the maintenance of our essential services and industries. I pointed out that the possibility of curtailment could not be ignored and that this was bound to mean serious inroads upon the supply of essential services and goods which could be made available for our people. I do not think that there was any attempt to keep the public from knowing the facts of the situation in so far as a reliable statement of the facts could be given.
Nobody here—and I emphasise the word "nobody"—can say what the fuel position will be in the future. We know what it was in recent weeks. We know the supplies that are available now, but nobody can plan a fuel utilisation programme for many months ahead. Yet, if we are to meet the requirements of essential services and industries, we must attempt to do that without definite knowledge of the quantity of fuel that will be available. The public were told of the possibility of the advent of new fuel difficulties. They were told when these fuel difficulties did emerge. They were told what measures had been taken to secure the conservation of coal and other fuels. They were given ample advice as to how they should co-operate in any such scheme of conservation and, at all stages since this matter developed through the Press and by other means, the public were as fully informed as they could be of what the situation was and what measures to deal with it were being taken. Deputy Dillon says that I should have met the editors of the newspapers. I met the political correspondents of the newspapers and discussed the position fully with them and I must say that we have got from the newspapers a great deal of cooperation in bringing the facts to the notice of the public. I do not know what purpose there is in suggesting that attempts have been made to withhold from the public information that it should have. So far as I am aware, there was no such attempt. On the contrary, our whole aim in recent weeks has been to get the maximum of publicity for the situation and to have its gravity appreciated, so that the public would understand what they have to face. I fully appreciate that it is only by taking the public into one's confidence in these matters that one can get them to stand up to whatever inconveniences and hardships are involved.
I do not know what to do to get Deputy Hughes down to earth. He tells us of the hardships that will arise if coal cannot be given for this, paraffin for that, and petrol for something else. We all know of the hardships that will be involved if supplies of these commodities cannot be made available for different purposes, but complaining about these matters will not make supplies available. We have got to deal with realities. If we cannot get kerosene for agricultural purposes, we must try to do without kerosene. All the available kerosene in our hands now, or which may become available in a month or two, will be reserved for agricultural use. But if we got no more kerosene, we cannot do anything more about it, and Deputy Hughes' telling us of the difficulties which will be created is not going to help us to get supplies any more than the problems of the farmers in the beet growing areas who will be unable to get dried pulp if we cannot give the sugar factories coal to dry the pulp can be solved by deploring the situation in the manner which Deputy Hughes did.
I can well understand the desire of Deputies for reliable information. I myself should like to have reliable information. Deputy Hughes complained that I did not give statistics of the extent to which employment and production will be affected by the curtailment of supplies. I should love to have statistics—reliable statistics—as to the extent to which employment and production will be affected by the curtailment of supplies. But I have not got them. It would be impossible for anybody to have them. I doubt if anyone could say more than that employment and production will be adversely affected by the curtailment of our coal supplies. We shall make the coal supplies at our disposal available to industries in proportion to their essentiality. We shall encourage managers to make the best use of that coal; to supplement it where possible with other fuels or to do without fuel, if possible. We shall give the best expert advice available to those concerned to assist them in getting over the difficulties which the short supply of fuel will cause, but to what extent they will succeed in getting over those difficulties by our advice or with our co-operation nobody can say.
The curtailment of railway services will, of course, affect all commercial interests. I should like to assure the House that there would be no curtailment of railway services if it could be avoided. References were made here to a conference which was, apparently, held yesterday between the management of the Great Southern Railways Company and the unions representing its employees. I pointed out when the first reference to that matter was made that the details of management of the Great Southern Railways Company, the precise method by which it conducts negotiations with representatives of its employees or the agreements which it makes with the representatives of its employees are not a Government responsibility and that nobody here can be held accountable for them. We know from a statement which appeared in the Press that a conference was held and that it was agreed, according to the announcement, that no statement should be published——
