asked the Minister for Local Government and Public Health if he is aware that Patrick Carpenter, 15d Pearse House, Number 309323 on National Health Society register, has been refused payment of benefits by that society, although he has been paying into it since the introduction of national health insurance; that Mr. Carpenter is aged 67 years, worked in England from August to December in 1943 and broke down in health, and on his return to Éire was disqualified from the insurance benefits; and, if so, if he will see that benefits are immediately paid to this man and that all such persons returning from England or Northern Ireland will be kept in benefit for national health insurance.
Ceisteanna. — Questions. Oral Answers. - National Health Insurance Benefits.
I am aware that Mr. Patrick Carpenter, 15d Pearse House, Pearse Street, Dublin, aged 67 years, was a member of Cumann an Arachais Náisiúnta ar Shláinte (National Health Insurance Society) under No. 309323, and claimed benefit from the society from the 24th March, 1944. His claim was refused by the society on the grounds that in the absence of evidence of insurable employment or of incapacity since the 28th February, 1943, his insurance and membership of the society was treated as having terminated on 28th February, 1944, in accordance with the provisions of the National Health Insurance Acts. Mr. Carpenter was employed in England from August, 1943, to December, 1943, when he returned to Dublin. In accordance with the provisions of the National Health Insurance Acts in operation in Great Britain he, being over 65 years of age, was not insurable for health purposes in respect of his period of employment in England. That employment did not, therefore, serve to prolong his health insurance in this country.
On the 13th October, 1944, Mr. Carpenter's medical attendant certified that Mr. Carpenter was attended by him about the 19th January, 1944, that is, before the date upon which his insurance was regarded as having terminated. A further medical certificate, which Mr. Carpenter furnished on the 9th November, 1944, specifically stated that he was incapable of work from the 19th January, 1944, to the 28th March, 1944. The society has accepted this certificate for the purpose of extending his insurance to the date of his claim and has now paid benefit to him, subject to the provisions of the National Health Insurance Acts and the regulations made thereunder.
As regards the latter portion of the question, reciprocal arrangements are in operation between this country and Great Britain and Northern Ireland for preserving the continuity of insurance under the National Health Insurance Acts and title to benefit of a person who, being insured in one country, is or becomes insurably employed in the other country.
Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that the society definitely refused benefit to this man until a member of the House brought his case up in the Dáil? Is it the position that if that man had not a friend to bring his case up here, he would have been turned down completely? Since this question was put down, he has been reinstated, which shows that he had a good case. Why should men be made victims of a rule, regulation or decision of the board?
I do not think the Deputy's question in the Dáil had a thing to do with the payment of benefit to the person referred to in the question.
Yes, it had. I saw the letter.
If the Deputy had listened attentively to my reply, he would have heard me say that a medical certificate was furnished on 13th October to the effect that the doctor had attended him about 19th January. The doctor merely certified that he had attended him—he did not certify as to whether the man was capable or incapable of work. The matter was pursued by the society without any reference whatever to the Deputy's question and the doctor certified on 9th November, 1944, that the man was incapable of work. He completed the certificate which he should have completed on 13th October. The Deputy's question had nothing to do with it.
That still does not answer my question. This man had got a letter from the authorities definitely turning him down.
The Deputy cannot get any credit for it. It is of no political use to him.
Will the Parliamentary Secretary give us an assurance that the society will be more careful in future and will not turn down these people, putting them in the position that they have to find somebody in the Dáil to bring up their cases?
It is of no use at all to the Deputy.
Has the Parliamentary Secretary had brought to his attention any considerable volume of complaints from men who went to work in England and subsequently came home ill, and has he found that a number of persons in these circumstances have been unable, for technical reasons, to get benefit under the National Health Insurance code? If so, can he assure the House that sympathetic consideration is being given to that problem of the peculiar times in which we live, with a view to ensuring that persons who have been insured in Éire and who go to work in England and maintain national health insurance there will get benefit when they come home, even though there is some technical imperfection in the continuity of their insurance?
Very few cases have come to my notice. Where a person is insurable under the British National Health Insurance law, there is no difficulty about the operation of our reciprocal arrangements. In the particular case under discussion, the claimant was over 65 years of age and was not insurable in Britain at all. That was the difficulty.
Have cases not been brought to the notice of the Parliamentary Secretary of men who were qualified under the British code and who have been returned to Éire on that ground that they are permanently disabled, whereupon the British society says that they are no longer permanently resident in Great Britain and they will, therefore, not pay them benefit; but inasmuch as they are entitled to insurance under the British code, the Irish society disclaims responsibility for them? In such circumstances, will the Parliamentary Secretary, on such cases being brought to his attention, give favourable consideration to them and find a way round, if it is possible?
If it is at all possible. The most sympathetic consideration will be given to such cases when brought to my notice.
I did not quite hear the last portion of the Parliamentary Secretary's reply. Is it a fact that reciprocal arrangements exist as between this country and Great Britain?
Yes, so far as national health insurance is concerned.