With reference to the excitement that arose in the debate last night in connection with the Baltinglass Post Office appointment, a compromise solution, let us say, has been reached by permission of the House. Deputy Lemass will speak for five minutes and the Minister will have ten minutes in which to reply.
Baltinglass Post Office Appointment.
What is the position with regard to the notice which I gave to raise the subject matters of Questions 87, 88 and 89 on the Adjournment?
That will be at five o'clock.
Before the Minister speaks on this Baltinglass affair, I think it is desirable to remind him and the House of the nature of the charge which has been made against him. In April last the postmistress of Baltinglass, Miss K. Cooke, resigned. She was an old lady whose health did not permit of her continuing the work of the office—the work having, in fact, been done for the previous 14 years by her niece, Miss Helen Cooke, and done by her to the general public satisfaction. I understand that, in circumstances such as existed there, where a relative of the postmistress is available and qualified to carry on the work in the same premises, it has been the invariable practice of the post office not to advertise the vacancy, but to appoint the relative. In this particular case, however, the vacancy was advertised. It was assumed locally that the advertising of the vacancy was merely a formality and that inevitably Miss Helen Cooke would be appointed to the post. In consequence of that understanding, a number of people, who might otherwise have been candidates, either did not pursue their candidatures or withdrew them. Only one candidate sought the appointment in opposition to Miss Cooke, a Mr. Michael Farrell. When it became known that there was opposition to the reappointment of Miss Cooke from that quarter, representations were made in favour of her appointment by representatives of every class and section in the area. Miss Cooke had, in the opinion of the people using the post office, every qualification for the appointment. She was personally efficient and popular. She had 14 years' experience in the working of the office. She had available to her, premises which were in use as the post office in the area for some years and to which the telephone cables had recently been brought at considerable expense underground. She, as I said, had every possible qualification except one. She had no political pull.
The other candidate for the position was a Mr. Michael Farrell, and he, so far as the views of the local inhabitants are concerned, had no qualifications for the office except one. He had a political pull. This Mr. Michael Farrell in the son of a prominent supporter of the Minister in his own constituency. He was a member of the Minister's Party on the Wicklow County Council. He was selected by the Minister's Party, the National Labour Party, to contest the Kildare seat in the last general election against the present Minister for Social Welfare. He failed to do so by reason of the fact that he was two minutes late with his nomination paper. He has, in the views of local people of all political opinions and all classes, no outstanding qualifications for the office. Let me say that in my view his political opinions and association with the Minister's Party is not necessarily a disqualification. The general view locally is that he is not a desirable person to be appointed. His father owns a public house. His father also owns a grocery business, a butchery business and a large drapery business in the town of Baltinglass.
A Deputy
More power to him.
There used to be a regulation in the Post Office which debarred the appointment to the position of postmaster or postmistress of any person who is concerned either directly or indirectly in the control or management of a licensed premises if other applicants had suitable premises available. I would be desirous of knowing from the Minister whether that regulation has also been amended or cancelled to permit of this appointment. The Minister has a choice between this person, whose father was a prominent and wealthy business man in the town of Baltinglass, and who was without experience or qualification, as against a lady who has no other means of livelihood, who had 14 years' experience of the post and who was recommended by the great majority of the local interests which used the post office.
I want to remove, if I may, the rather mean insinuation which the Minister atempted to make yesterday that the lady, Miss Cooke or her family, were in some way associated with the Castle tradition. The Minister tried to justify his appointment on that insinuation. It is not a matter which concerns this issue. Even if the lady was not of the political opinions or religion of the majority, she would still be entitled to the appointment under the practice of the Department. But, in fact, the family have been for a long time intimately associated with the nationalist movement. On the face of it this looks like a discreditable political job. It is not merely a charge against the Minister. The Minister may have made a mistake. He may have been subjected to political pressure to make this appointment, but having made this appointment and having brought his Department into contempt it becomes a matter for the Government and not for the Minister. The Government cannot wash their hands of the blame in this matter by leaving it entirely to the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs.
Did you not make your brother Córas Iompair Eireann manager?
No.
The difficulties which have arisen in filling the sub-postmastership of Baltinglass arise from a decision of mine in 1948. Some time after I became Minister for Posts and Telegraphs, I instructed my Department that, in future, sub-offices should not be transferred to relatives except when the applicant was the husband, wife, son, daughter, brother, sister, widower or widow of the outgoing sub-postmaster. Before that, sub-offices could be transferred at the option of the retiring sub-postmaster to a wider range of relatives. I saw, and see, no reason whatsoever why sub-postmasterships, unlike all other public appointments in the State, should be handed on by inheritance. I did not, however, make a complete break with the previous practice, as I felt it might be unfair to serving postmasters and, accordingly, I permitted transfer to immediate relatives. That decision was given by me in December, 1948, and I informed the sub-postmasters' union of it at an interview with them shortly afterwards.
Yesterday, I stated specifically at Question Time that it was I who had made this decision. My predecessor in office should be well aware, from his experience as Minister, that the application of the old regulation gave rise to grave difficulties.
I am not aware of it.
The Deputy knew there was bargaining and that money passed between people.
I knew nothing of the sort.
It must have come to the Deputy's knowledge.
There are difficulties, no matter what regulations one makes.
A person could not transfer the postmastership unless someone was getting money from it and we were not in a position to say whether this was happening or not.
You were not forced to do it.
The sub-postmistress of Baltinglass tendered her resignation on the 14th April last and accordingly the post was advertised. I should like to stress that this was done as a routine matter by my Department without any previous consultation with me. There were two candidates. One was Miss H.H. Cooke, the niece of the retiring sub-postmistress. She had been working in the office as assistant since 1936. The other candidate was Mr. M.T. Farrell.
Both were good candidates. Miss Cooke has a satisfactory record as assistant and I do not wish to say anything which would appear to cast a reflection on her. The fact that she was an assistant confers no entitlement on her to appointment as sub-postmistress. Practically every day, and long before my time, assistants have been passed over in favour of other candidates. The strongest point, however, in Miss Cooke's favour, so far as I can judge from the arguments put forward, was that members of her family had held the office over a long period of years. It seems to be argued that she should, therefore, have been automatically appointed. My inclination, frankly, was in the opposite direction. This family has held the sub-office over a long period of years. Miss Cooke is not an immediate relative of the outgoing sub-postmistress and it did not seem unreasonable that the benefits of the employment should now go elsewhere in the event of another candidate, at least as good as Miss Cooke, offering. I consider Mr. Farrell to be a better candidate.
The people of Baltinglass do not think so.
On all the usual grounds of character, financial stability, etc., he is a good candidate. He is at least 30 years younger than the other candidate, he has had a college education and has given much voluntary service to his country. He became a lieutenant in the L.D.F. and Deputy Brennan was his district leader.
I am giving him all credit for being a member of the L.D.F. There were several others as well as he.
In the L.D.F. days Deputy Brennan was supporting a recruiting drive and promising that preference would be given to members of the Defence Forces seeking Government employment. This young man is still a member of the F.C.A. and was highly recommended for the position of sub-postmaster by his commanding officer. I might mention that Mr. Farrell was also recommended to the Department by at least four Fianna Fáil T.D.s and Senators.
That was the deciding factor?
You cannot have it both ways. He was recommended by four prominent members of the Fianna Fáil Party.
Name them.
The Fianna Fáil Party is right, no matter which candidate is successful. They back both horses. I, however, had to take a decision as between these people and, on mature reflection, I regarded it as my duty to give the position to a person about whose qualifications I had no doubt whatsoever and who had served in his country's forces during the emergency. This step, I feel, will encourage other men in similar positions, and will let them see that the promises given to them on recruitment are not being broken.
I make no apology for giving preference to a young man like Mr. Farrell, anxious to secure employment in this country, in preference to another person who, while in no way personally objectionable would, in the natural course of things, probably be retiring from office in another ten years or so.
With the development, during this Government's term of office, of the various Post Office services, particularly the telephone service, greatly increased demands are being made on postmasters' efficiency, and, bearing this in mind, I am anxious that appointments to that class should be given to active young people wherever it is reasonably practicable to do so. Another motive which I have in doing this is to give young men and women an opportunity of making a home and a livelihood for themselves in their own country. I do not agree that because a grandmother has held a semi-Government job only her relations in this generation have the right to the job, notwithstanding that other citizens may have better qualifications. I was never in favour of the closed trade policy which debars a man from a living simply because his father had not a similar one.
Reference has been made to the expenditure involved in changing the office from the present building to the new one. Such expenditure is normal in practically every sub-office appointment and while it could have been avoided had I selected Miss Cooke, I would not be prepared to let that consideration influence me in turning down the better candidate. As Mr. Farrell may be expected to hold the office for a long period, the amount involved is a very small capital charge.
As regards representations made by the local people, I have considered those. I am not sure that they are altogether disinterested and I feel quite confident that, if the people in the Baltinglass area as a whole had an opportunity to make their wishes known in the matter, Mr. Farrell would be supported by at least as strong a body of opinion as that which supports the other candidate.
According to the Official Debates, Vol. 123, No. 9, column 1384, for last Wednesday, Deputy Cogan put the following question:—
"Is the Minister aware that the business has been transferred now to a public-house, which has been the headquarters of the Minister's Party in West Wicklow and that the position has been given to the son of a county councillor, a member of the Minister's Party?"
I wish to take this opportunity of making it clear to the House that the allegations in that question are incorrect. Mr. Farrell's premises where the post office business will be transacted is a draper's shop and not a public-house. Mr. Farrell's premises was not my Party's headquarters. All our meetings were held in the local cinema. Anyone who knows me knows also from my record that I am a bad supporter of the publicans. Again, it is not true to say that the position has been given to the son of a county councillor, a member of my Party. Mr. Farrell, Senior, is not a member of the county council. At least, Deputy Cogan owes it to the House, if not to me, to give the facts of the case.
He was a councillor until the last election.
I have no apology to offer for making the decision. I am taking full responsibility for it. The person was qualified and if Deputies require the names of the four Fianna Fáil representatives who supported him, they are Deputies Davern and Bob Ryan; Senators Andy Fogarty and S. Hayes.
On a point of privilege, is the Minister attempting to suggest that, in making appointments of this kind, he is influenced by recommendations from members of the Dáil or Seanad?
That is not a point of privilege.
It does not make it any the less a dirty job.
It is not a point of privilege, on which the Deputy ostensibly arose.
Mr. Cogan rose.
I will not hear any more about the question.