Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 14 Mar 1951

Vol. 124 No. 12

Committee on Finance. - Vote 49—Gaeltacht Services.

Minister for Lands (Mr. Blowick)

I move:—

That a supplementary sum not exceeding £10 be granted to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending 31st March, 1951, for Salaries and Expenses in connection with Gaeltacht Services, including Housing Grants and the purchase and sale of Homespuns.

This Supplementary Estimate for £10 is intended to allow of the utilisation for the activities of the Gaeltacht services division of the Department of Lands of the £35,000 estimated Appropriations-in-Aid, treated in the original Estimate as Exchequer extra receipts, and additional Appropriations-in-Aid which it is estimated will be received.

The additional receipts thus brought into account will be utilised to meet additional estimated expenditure (1) under sub-head D (6), which provides for the purchase of yarns and other manufacturing materials mainly for the use of the knitwear industry; (2) under sub-head D (8), which provides for the purchase of materials and machinery and the meeting of other expenditure in connection with the toy industry; and (3) under sub-head D (9), which provides, principally, for the purchase of wool for use in the spinning industry.

Under each of these sub-heads the additional expenditure is necessitated by the increased cost of materials since the original Estimate was prepared and by a decision to start the building up of reserves of supp lies against a possible emergency.

Of the total estimated additional expenditure of approximately £65,000, approximately £10,000 is offset by savings on other sub-heads, leaving a balance of something under £55,000 to be met out of the additional amount now shown as Appropriations-in-Aid.

The sales of the products of the rural industries of the Department have shown some degree of recovery during the year. As a result, the receipts have been sufficient to cover the full amount credited as Exchequer extra receipts in the original Estimate and to provide, apart from that amount, over £28,000 towards meeting additional expenditure out of Appropriations-in-Aid and the net additional expenditure under the debit sub-heads of the Estimate.

Provision has had to be made for a deficiency of over £7,000 in the receipts from sales of marine products. This deficiency is due mainly to the fact that the purchase of sea-rods this season has been greatly retarded because of weather conditions, which did not allow the sea-rods to be dried sufficiently for earlier purchase and disposal. Expenditure which normally would have fallen on this year's Vote will fall to be met out of next year's Vote with consequential effect on receipts.

It is estimated that an additional £3,000 will be received from the disposal of materials no longer required for the use of the industries.

In order to provide for the additional expenditure contemplated, it is necessary to ask the Dáil for £10 only as a token Vote.

E. Ó Ciosáin

Ní mór an méid airgid atá á iarraidh ar an Dáil i gcóir an Mheastacháin Breise seo agus is é mo thuairim gur ceart go mbeadh níos mó. Táimid ag fáil lochta ar an Rialtas mar gheall ar an méid caiteachais atá á dhéanamh acu fé láthair ar Ranna Rialtais ach dá mbeadh níos mó caiteachais ar Roinn na Gaeltachta ní bheadh aon locht le fáil againn orthu, mar teastaíonn borradh agus dul chun chinn sa Ghaeltacht chun saol na ndaoine a ghealú ann agus a chur i bhfeabhas agus ní féidir é sin a dhéanamh gan airgead.

Ní dóigh liom gur féidir liom ceist foirleathan na Gaeltachta a phlé ar an Meastachán Breise seo agus, dá bhrí sin, caithfidh mé bheith sásta caint a dhéanamh ar an méid atá ar an bpáipéar anseo.

Tá tagairt déanta ag an Aire do cheist na dtithe sa Ghaeltacht agus is tábhachtach an cheist í sin, tithe oiriúnacha a thógaint do mhuintir na Gaeltachta. Níl fhios agam i gceart cad é an dul chun cinn atá á dhéanamh maidir le tógaint na dtithe sin ach tá fhios agam go bhfuil difríocht anois idir an méid airgid a tugtar do na daoine sa Ghaeltacht i gcóir tithe agus an méid a tugtar do dhaoine sa Ghalltacht i gcóir tithe. Is amhlaidh atá an buntáiste ag muintir na Galltachta fé láthair mar do réir an Achta a ritheadh tríd an Dáil seo tamaillín o shoin, 1950—

C. Ó Liatháin

Bhfuil sé seo in ordú? Níl focal i dtaobh tithe, ná ceist na dtithe, sa Mheastachán.

E. Ó Ciosáin

This is a Supplementary Estimate for the amount required for the year ending 31st March, 1951 for salaries and expenses in connection with Gaeltacht Services, including housing grants.

C. Ó Liatháin

Níl focal mar gheall ar sin i Leabhar na Meastachán.

E. Ó Ciosáin

Including housing grants.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Níl aon bhaint ag an Meastachán le tithe in aon chor.

C. Ó Liatháin

Níl figiúr amháin ann i dtaobh ceist na dtithe.

E. Ó Ciosáin

Tá go maith. Ba mhaith liom mar sin cur síos ar cheist na mbréagán.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Ar na rudaí atá sa pháipéar.

E. Ó Ciosáin

Agus ar cheist abhair a chur ar fáil do na ticnscail atá ar siúl sa Ghaeltacht fé láthair. Ní fheadar an amhlaidh atá na rudaí sin dulta i ndaoire fé láthair a rá is go bhfuil an tAire ag lorg tuille airgid ina gcóir, agus, má tá, ba mhaith liom a fháil amach uaidh cad iad na habhair ata dulta i ndaoire. Ba mhaith liom a fháil amach chomh maith, cad é an dul chun cinn atá déanta maidir le tionscail na mbréagán a leathnú sa Ghaeltacht. Nuair a bhí an príomh-Mheastachán Ós cóir na Dála dheineas tagairt don rud sin agus chuireas ceist ar an Aire chun a fháil amach uaidh conas a bhí an scéal maidir leis an tionscal seo, mar b'é mo thuairim go bhféadfaí níos mó a dhéanamh maidir leis, dá gcuirtí chuige, mar níl a leithéid de thionscal ar siúl ach i gcúpla áit sa Ghaeltacht, i dTír Chonaill, agus in Iorras, Co. Muigheo. Bhí ceann eile, leis, i gConamara, sa Spidéal, ach is dóigh liom gur chuala tamall ó shoin go bhfuil sé sin dúnta. Ní fheadar cé acu deineadh é sin d'athoscailt ó shoin nó nár deineadh. Ní bhfuaireas aon chuntas mar gheall air le déanaí. B'fhéidir go bhféadfadh an tAire insint dúinn anois.

Having spoken in Irish, I would just say a few words in English on this Supplementary Estimate. It is a rather confined Estimate and I have been told that I am not at liberty to discuss anything connected with housing grants on this. I do not know if I am correct in putting that interpretation on Deputy Lehane's intervention.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Deputy Lehane does not give rulings.

Mr. Kissane

And the Leas-Cheann Comhairle's ruling afterwards.

Mr. C. Lehane

Deputy Lehane was only looking for information.

Mr. Kissane

I came to the conclusion, when I saw housing grants at the top of this page, that I was entitled to raise a point or two connected with housing grants, but there is one thing I would like to raise, and that is that, since the passing of the general Housing Act of 1950, through the Oireachtas, the people of the Gaeltacht are at a disadvantage because the amount of the grant now available to the people of the non-Irish-speaking districts—the Galltacht—is greater than the grant which is available to the people of the Gaeltacht who want to build houses.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

It is clear that the Deputy is not relevant in that connection. That is clearly policy.

Mr. Kissane

It is a question, a Leas-Chinn Chomhairle, of bringing the people of the Gaeltacht into line with the people of the Galltacht as regards the legislation that passes through this House.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy knows perfectly well that on a Supplementary Estimate one can discuss only what is on the Estimate. If the Deputy wants to raise matters of policy of a wider and more extensive nature of that kind, the proper place is on the main Estimate.

Mr. Kissane

I do not know.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

But the Deputy can clearly see the sub-heads.

Mr. Kissane

I can see them all right.

Mr. Blowick

If I might explain. The text of the motion is taken practically word for word from the heading in the Book of Estimates, which covers the whole Vote. While the words "housing grants" are used, that is not an indication that I am asking for any supplementary for housing grants. If the Deputy looks at the heading in Vote 49 of the Book of Estimates, he will see there an estimate of the amount required for salaries and expenses in connection with Gaeltacht services, including housing grants and the purchase and sale of homespuns.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The sub-heads are the guide.

Mr. Blowick

I am not asking anything for housing grants.

Mr. Kissane

The reason I wanted to raise this matter now is that I consider it one of urgency. Regarding materials for Gaeltacht industries, as I have already asked in Irish, is it because these materials have become more expensive, dearer to purchase, that the Supplementary Estimate is required? What materials are these? I did not hear the Minister giving a list of the materials, but I suppose we will come to it later on.

I should like to say a few words on the toy industry. It is in my opinion a very important industry for the Gaeltacht and I believe it is capable of greater expansion. Up to the present it has been confined to one place in County Donegal, a place called Crolly. There is also a place in the County Mayo Gaeltacht, Erris, and there was also, if I remember rightly, a toy industry in Spiddal. I remember on the occasion of the presentation of the main Estimate to the Dáil reference was made to the Spiddal toy industry. So far as I could gather from the speakers in the debate on the Gaeltacht Estimate, the Spiddal toy industry had closed down. I do not know whether it has reopened. Perhaps the Minister will enlighten me and the House, because if it is the case that an industry of that kind has been allowed to lapse, I would consider it a retrograde step. On that occasion I understood the Minister to say that the toys that were being produced in the Gaeltacht factories were comparable with those produced elsewhere, if not better.

Mr. Blowick

That is right.

Mr. Kissane

I also understood him to say that some of these toys were being exported. Apparently there is a demand for them even outside this country. If that is the case I believe the time has arrived when we should expand that toy industry. If there is an export market and if these toys are suitable for our people at home I do not see why we should not try to establish a few more toy industries in other parts of the Gaeltacht. Once or twice I had the pleasure of visiting the toy industry in Donegal and I was delighted to see the number of young people especially who had employment in that factory. The employees there seemed to be quite satisfied with the nature of their employment. I was wondering when would the time come when similar employment would be provided for our people in other parts of the Gaeltacht, especially down as far as the Kerry Gaeltacht.

Unfortunately the Kerry Gaeltacht has not been receiving very much attention as regards industry. I really do not know why. I had a question recently down here. I asked the Minister for Industry and Commerce about a certain industry that I was told flourished in the Dingle Gaeltacht some years ago. It was the growing of a kind of flax for rope making and I was informed that at one time several acres in the Dingle peninsula, around Dingle, were under this crop. During the emergency there was a shortage of rope fibre here and it would have been a good thing if we had that industry. Indeed, it would be a good thing now because a similar shortage might arise again. The Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Industry and Commerce informed me that such an industry would not be an economic proposition, so I suppose that they must have investigated it; the technical advisers to the Department must have investigated the possibilities of that industry.

However, there may be an opportunity of starting some other industries in that part of the Kerry Gaeltacht, thereby keeping as many people as possible at home. Unfortunately, as I need scarcely remind the Dáil, there has been an exodus from the Gaeltacht, from every part of it, north, south and west. Even now I understand that whole families are leaving the Gaeltacht and going to foreign countries. I consider that a national tragedy in a way. It is very hard to find the remedy.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy is now discussing the whole Gaeltacht problem.

Mr. Kissane

I am discussing the advisability of expanding the toy industry.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy is discussing rope fibre. He should confine himself to the items in the Estimate. He will have an opportunity later of going into what he wants to discuss when we come to the main Estimate.

Mr. Kissane

To come back again to the toy industry, I consider there is room for the establishment of more factories for the production of toys in the Gaeltacht. I do not know whether I am right or not in that, and I would like to hear the Minister's views on it, especially since, apparently, it is established that these toys are of very good quality and that there is a good demand for them, not merely in this country but outside it.

Under sub-head D (9), I do not know what to say about the spinning industry. I have not any great knowledge of it myself since it is confined mostly to Donegal. Probably, some Deputy from that county will have something to say about it.

Conchubhar Ó Liatháin

Nuair a chuireas isteach ar an Teachta O Ciosáin, nuair a bhí sé ag caint, ní hamhlaidh a theastuigh uaim in aon chor cosc a chur leis in aon ní a bhí le rá aige. Ba mhaith liom an míniú pearsanta san a dhéanamh. Is é rud a bhí uaim ná eolas, mar níor thuigeas féin ón Meastachán Breise seo conas d'fhéadfaí an cheist sin a phlé. Sin é an chúis gur chuireas isteach air. Níor mhaith liom cosc a chur ar aon Teachta ná cur isteach ar aon Teachta a bheadh ag plé aon cháis ar mhaithe leis an nGaeltacht nó le muintir na Gaeltachta. Tá rud amháin gur mhaith liom miniú d'fháil air, rud nach léir dom: an deighilt atá idir na trí fó-mhíreanna D 6, D 8, agus D 9, agus cuirfidh mé ceist mar gheall air sin ar an Aire nuair a bhead ag labhairt as Béarla.

I dtaobh tionscail na mbréagán agus tionscail an bhréidín is dóigh liom gur cóir dom a rá go borb agus gan fiacal a chur ann nach aontaím in aon chor gur leor tionscail den tsaghas seo don Ghaeltacht. B'fhéidir go bhfuil míthuiscint orm ar an scéal ach do réir mar chítear dom é níl ins na tionscail seo ach "sopanna" in ionad na scuaibe.

B'fhearr i bhfad tionscail a bheith againn a bheadh bunaithe ar dul ar aghaidh a bheadh déanta againn i bhforaoiseacht, slite nua agus dearcadh nua ar thionscail na hiascaireachta. Ní dóigh liom go n-éireoidh leis an Aire riamh, ná le haon Aire eile, tionscail mar thionscal na mbréagán a leathnú sa tslí a bhí á moladh agus á cheapadh ag an Teachta deireannach a labhair. Níl ansin ach tuairim pearsanta—ní tuairim ó mo phairti atá á lua agam, ach ní dóigh liom go dtógfadh an tAire orm é más tuairim féin é. Sa Mheastachán Breise seo ní fheicim aon fhocal in aon chor—níl aon mhíniú ann pé scéal é—go bhfuil breis tuarastail ag dul do na hoibritheoiri sa dá thionscal atá luaite ann, agus ba mhaith liom a chloisint ón Aire nuair a bheidh freagra á thabhairt aige ar an díospóireacht cé acu atá breis pháighe ag dul dóibh nó ná fuil.

I do not intend to delay the House on this Supplementary Estimate, but there are one or two things which, I think, I had better refer to in English since I am anxious to get an explanation from the Minister about them. I presume it is a tradition which has grown up in the preparation of the Estimate for this Department—but I have never succeeded in understanding it clearly—to have different connotations of the three sub-heads or rather of the first sub-head and the other two. There is a reference under sub-head D (6) to materials, and under sub-head D (8) and (9) to the toy industry and spinning. I should like to know in respect of what the revised Estimate is brought in for materials if not for the toy industry and spinning. I am sure there is an explanation, but it is not apparent from the Supplementary Estimate itself. I would be glad if the Minister would clarify the matter when replying.

There is one comment that was not made on the Estimate, and in fairness to the Minister I think it should be made. It is that, however gloomy a view we take of the picture of the Gaeltacht generally, and I am not one of those who sees it through rose-coloured spectacles, I do not believe that half enough is being done. If five times the sum of money asked for were provided, I still would be inclined to say that, for the job in hands, it would still be insufficient. I think that a certain meed of praise and of congratulation is due to the Minister in connection with the Appropriations-in-Aid. These are very substantial and spring from additional receipts. I do not know to what extent that is due to the inflated money values which appertain to-day. Taking the matter at its face value, the Minister, I think, does merit a certain meed of praise in that respect.

Perhaps the Chair would allow me to refer to a matter which I dealt with when speaking in Irish. I do so for the benefit of the Minister. I would be glad if he would let us know whether any provision is being made for increased wages for the workers engaged in the toy industry and spinning industry. It is not apparent from the face of the Estimate that any such provision is being made. If not, then to that extent the Minister has failed in his job, because, I think, such a provision should have been made. Quite frankly, I am not an enthusiast about the types of toy industry and spinning industry on which such reliance is placed by the Gaeltacht Services section of the Minister's Department. I believe that if we are going to keep the people in the Gaeltacht at home, we will have to provide a much more solid and less exotic type of industry than the manufacture of toys.

I am not going to suggest specifically to the Minister the particular direction which that industrial expansion should take. I do feel, however, on this occasion, as I felt before, that the whole question of the development of industry in the Gaeltacht is so completely and inextricably tied up with the development of an afforestation programme and the basing of industries on a developed afforestation programme that to look in any other direction without taking that into account is, to a certain extent, a waste of time. I may be completely wrong, but I have the feeling that an undertaking like the toy industry, while it may, as Deputy Kissane said, produce goods which are uniformly excellent and commercially saleable, would be difficult to develop in a real way that will solve the endemic unemployment problem that you have continually in the Gaeltacht. That can be solved by a vigorous and consistently pursued policy of afforestation, by the development of industry based on the utilisation of fish and fish products, and I think only in that way.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy is travelling a long way over the whole Gaeltacht problem.

Mr. C. Lehane

I admit that, but in extenuation I plead that I am dealing with the expenditure under D (8) and D (9), particularly D (8). I am endeavouring to point out to the Minister that it might be possible to expend that money in perhaps a wider manner.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy must not discuss every other industry in the country except the toy industry.

Mr. C. Lehane

I shall pass from it. I always have the feeling that this Estimate is one which has the goodwill of the Minister, and if the Minister is not presenting a bigger bill to the Dáil, it may not be the Minister's fault. I repeat to the Minister what I said on at least three occasions already in this House, that as far as the provision of services for the development of the Gaeltacht and the setting up of industry there are concerned, he need never worry about the size of the bill as far as our Party is concerned, because we will back him to the last penny.

Mr. Commons

I have very little to say on this Estimate, even though I come from a constituency practically one half of which belongs to the Gaeltacht area. The Minister is better aware of the situation in that Mayo section of the Gaeltacht area than I am and I am glad to see that he is making every effort to help out the people of the Gaeltacht and to do as much as he can for them. I am in agreement with Deputy Lehane that the population of the Gaeltacht is declining. That may be because successive Governments have not done sufficient for the Gaeltacht and the people in it. It may be that there has been so much emigration to England, the United States and elsewhere over a considerable number of years that when people come back they put it into the minds of other people in the Gaeltacht that there are better things for them across the seas. That may be the cause of a certain amount of restlessness which there is amongst the Gaeltacht population. However, the responsibility is on the Government and on the Minister and his Department to try to help out the Gaeltacht people as best they can.

I find myself in agreement with Deputy Lehane that the establishment of an industry like the toy industry will not be a proper solution and will not satisfy in full the wants of the people in the Gaeltacht. I do not want to go outside the scope of the Estimate, but there are at least three or four different Government Departments which should be as interested in the Gaeltacht as the Department of Lands. The Department of Agriculture should help out with the fisheries and the Department of Industry and Commerce should also help in the matter. The effort that is being made by the Minister, particularly in regard to the forestry programme which he is now introducing into the Gaeltacht——

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

There is not a word about that in the Estimate.

Mr. Commons

It is a Gaeltacht problem all the same.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

We have to deal with what is in the Estimate only.

Mr. Commons

I think the start which the Minister has made in that direction is deserving of praise, because it is the first real effort which has been made towards the development of forestry industry in the Gaeltacht. It would be a wise policy if the Minister could introduce into the Gaeltacht some other type of industry as well as the toy industry and he would have the co-operation of Deputies on all sides of the House. I do not think the Minister for Finance would stint him in the spending of money. I hope that the effort which the Minister is making will be continued with even more success.

We are told that the products of the toy factories and the spinning industry in Tourmakeady are satisfactory and of good quality and are fit to compete in an outside market. That is something which we should be proud of. We are able to say that the Gaeltacht people can come up to scratch when asked to do so in regard to the products of their little factories, and the expansion of these should get every consideration and encouragement. The kelp industry and other industries in the Gaeltacht have also been of benefit and shown a profit, and when the Minister decides to spend more money on these things, he deserves every praise and encouragement. I agree with Deputy Lehane that the best approach to the Gaeltacht problem would be the expansion as far as possible of the forestry industry in that area.

Mr. Traynor

It is rather difficult for Deputies, speaking on this Supplementary Estimate and anxious to aid the people of the Gaeltacht to the extent that they would like, to keep within the bounds of relevancy. But Deputy Lehane and Deputy Commons were somewhat pessimistic when speaking of the toy industry. I am sure that both of them are aware that this is only a beginning of an industry. There has to be some beginning. It is a matter of nursing it carefully, encouraging it by every means possible and eventually developing it to the stage when it will be of much greater value to the people than it is at present. I had the pleasure of seeing some examples of the toy industry some time ago at the Royal Dublin Society Spring Show or Horse Show. They happened to be those little lead soldiers, the things that we used to get from Germany years ago. I was astonished to learn at the time that these experiments were carried out completely and solely in the Gaeltacht. The colouring of the uniforms of the toy soldiers was something that had to be seen to be believed. I think that industry should be encouraged as much as possible, particularly from the point of view of developing it to the fullest extent. That does not necessarily mean that other valuable and useful industries should be excluded. Deputy Commons and Deputy C. Lehane must be as well aware as I am of the magnificent industry that was established in Germany mainly among the Bavarian peasants; that toy industry was second to none in the whole world. It employed vast numbers. There is no doubt that if we could establish a toy industry on similar lines in the Gaeltacht it would be of inestimable advantage to the people in those areas.

Mr. Blowick

The lead toys that were turned out, particularly in Spiddal, were certainly excellent in quality and very attractive. Strangely enough, they sold very well during the war— sold as the saying goes, "like hot cakes." The moment war was over, the demand dropped and we had to temporarily close the factory in Spiddal. The factory did not close down for good. It was closed for a period of two to three weeks while a change over was made from the manufacture of lead toys to soft toys, such as dolls and parts of dolls.

Mr. Kissane

It is going ahead now?

Mr. Blowick

It is. At the moment there are 30 employed there constantly and we hope to expand a little further in the near future. There is no market at the present time for the lead toys, but the soft toys that we are now producing are selling all over the world. The following figures will give the House some idea of the market: Ireland, £41,230; Britain, £27,421; Canada, £180; Gibraltar, £10; U.S.A., £7; Sweden, £11, making a total of £68,859, or nearly £70,000 on toys alone. The quality is good. While there is no danger of toys being left on our hands through over-production there is not at the moment room on the market for an expansion of the industry. The three factories, Elly Bay in North Mayo, Spiddal in Galway, and Crolly in County Donegal, are turning out our full requirements. We are not faced with a flood of orders that we cannot cope with, but we are constantly exploring markets in an effort to discover if there is any room for expansion.

Mr. Traynor

Is there any advertising campaign in respect of these toys?

Mr. Blowick

There is. Whether or not the tempo of that campaign could be increased I do not know. I prefer not to say anything on that point at the moment. We adopt all the usual means of displaying the toys at shows, in hotels, airports, and so on. Christmas is the peak period and the whole production aims at meeting market requirements at that period. There is a small demand throughout the rest of the year.

Deputy C. Lehane said he was not quite clear as to what is needed under the various sub-heads. Under sub-head D (6) we want woollen yarns for knitwear. Under sub-head D (9) we want yarn for spinning and turning out tweeds and so on. We have to keep each sub-head in a separate compartment though the materials may be fairly closely allied. The amount required to meet price increases under sub-head D (6) is £3,621 and for stockpiling £14,120. That is for woollen yarn for the knitwear industry. Under sub-head D (8) we have the toy industry; the money there is required mainly for materials like plush, cotton and packing material, £4,700 to meet price increases and £10,720 for stockpiling. Under sub-head D (9), spinning, there is only one item, wool. The price increase there will not come as a surprise to Deputies. The amount required is £7,500 and the amount for stockpiling is £24,080.

Deputy Lehane mentioned the increase in wages in the toy and spinning industries. There was an increase in January, 1950, and another as late as last October. These matters are looked after by the Department, as otherwise there would be a good deal of criticism in the House if our workers were not paid a satisfactory wage.

Deputy Commons and Deputy C. Lehane both mentioned forestry. Forestry does not arise under this Supplementary Estimate and we cannot discuss it. No doubt it will arise on the main Estimate. When that is introduced I shall have good news for the House in relation to an expansion in forestry, particularly in the Gaeltacht areas. I am aware that industries so far in these areas cater specially for women. I hope to rectify that in the future and I hope that my attempts will have the desired effect of stemming emigration and the flight from these areas.

Mr. J. Flynn

I regret I was not present for the discussion on the Estimate.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy may ask a question.

Mr. Flynn

Could the Minister see his way to examining the possibility of establishing a toy factory in the South Kerry Gaeltacht, Ballinskelligs, and will he reintroduce the kelp industry on which a good deal of research is taking place at the moment?

An Ceann Comhairle

There is no money for kelp in this Vote at all.

Mr. J. Flynn

It is an industry.

An Ceann Comhairle

Quite, but there is no money for kelp here.

Mr. J. Flynn

It was formerly being tried out in the Gaeltacht and I would be glad if the Minister could see his way to re-establish it.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Minister would not be in order in discussing kelp any more than the Deputy is. It is not in the Vote. It will appear in the main Estimate.

Mr. Blowick

The establishment of a toy industry in Kerry is dependent upon the market for toys generally. If the three factories at present in production were not able to meet the demand it would then be possible to consider the establishment of a factory somewhere in the Kerry Gaeltacht.

The question of establishing a toy industry in Kerry, should the necessity arise, would receive very sympathetic consideration both from myself and the Department. There is no money in the Vote for kelp, but sea rods do come in. I understand they are there to be gathered along the coast of Kerry. We are paying £4 12s. 6d. for dried sea rods anywhere we can get them and there is no limit to the market. The Deputy might do a vast amount of benefit to his constituents along the coastal area if he makes that known. If they gather sea rods and do them up in bundles and dry them, as they do from Donegal to County Clare, they have £4 12s. 6d. a ton to get for them. It is a useful source of remuneration to many people along the sea coast who have, perhaps, small holdings and no fishing industry to supplement their earnings.

Vote put and agreed to.