It happened. Take the case of lorry traffic. We have harbours along the western coast which were doing a big and thriving business and handling a vast volume of traffic 20 or 30 years ago. They have fallen into disuse and, in most cases, the grass is growing on these quays and harbours.
If we want to make a genuine effort to develop particularly the West the first thing we should do is to try to restore the trade, traffic and commerce that these harbours are capable of handling. It would need a very small outlay. Several Deputies have mentioned these harbours and there is no need to go into them in detail. We have them all along the west coast. Galway Bay handled ocean-going liners before the outbreak of the last war. While I do not advocate building up harbour facilities for ocean-going liners to dock, it should be possible to develop the port to handle normal cargo traffic at least.
I think that this Bill has met with approval on all sides of the House, but that approval has been qualified and given hesitantly by Deputies. They do not seem to think that it meets the problem. Personally, I do not think so either. I do not think that the Bill is even a good beginning. I regard it as a plunge in the dark by the Minister for Industry and Commerce. I think that the Minister for Industry and Commerce—I hope that the Minister will not think I am saying it disparagingly—is the wrong Minister to handle this problem. The Minister for Lands or the Parliamentary Secretary, whose office was established here the other day, would be a more proper person to handle this problem and also the other allied problems that face us if we are to give the undeveloped areas what is their due.
I think that, side by side with this Bill, we should examine another problem that confronts us. What is it? The very first thing we find is that there is emigration on a terrific scale from the West. I think that all sides are genuinely anxious to stop that, at least as far as possible. I do not think it will ever be possible without encroaching on the constitutional rights of the individual completely to stop it, but we should and could go a long way towards ending that heavy volume of emigration, particularly from the western areas.
I would like to have seen something in the Bill which would enable the board to make a survey of the resources of the undeveloped areas first. Bear in mind that the undeveloped areas as described by the Bill are not a barren sheet of rock. They have their resources. Apart from the industrial development envisaged in the Bill— because the Bill ties the Minister and the board down to industrial development alone—we can do a great deal towards putting an end to the flight from the land and to the conditions which are forcing young people particularly to fly from it. First and foremost we have the very land or ground within these areas. We have the sea, which gives us fish, and there is also a certain industry in seaweeds that could be very usefully developed. We definitely have minerals, perhaps not in abundance but minerals that were worked in the past, and the mines in most cases have now fallen into disuse. We have turf and we have electrical development, either by developing our watercourses or, as was mentioned at Question Time to-day, by the development of wind power to help the present network. I mentioned the harbours. We could develop those harbours, decentralise the commerce of the country and, if possible, establish a coastal trade. Last, but by no means least, we have tourism. These are the advantages, the raw materials, we have at our disposal.
While I certainly give my blessing to the Bill and wish the Minister and the board he will set up under it God speed in its implementation, it falls very short of what I would like to see and even at this late stage I would like to see the Minister withdrawing the Bill in its present form and introducing a fresh one which would embody some of the proposals I have mentioned.
If we take the land which is the most valuable asset we have in the undeveloped areas, the first thing that must be attended to is rearrangement and the work of the Land Commission. That does not come within the scope of the Bill and the Minister for Lands cannot possibly use the Bill to speed up the work of the Land Commission. Secondly, the reclamation under the Department of Agriculture of certain lands is absolutely essential. I do not intend to go into details because I do not think I would be strictly within the rules of order and I am afraid I would stand accused of straying from the debate, but seeing that the Bill has primarily been brought into the House for the development of the undeveloped areas I think that as one coming from those areas I might give a few hints and ideas. As I might claim to be fairly familiar with the problems there it will not perhaps come amiss if I make some suggestions to the Minister.
I hope that the Minister will take heed of one of the most important industries we have apart from the work of the Land Commission in the rearrangement of holdings and the elimination of congestion in so far as it lies within their power to eliminate it. This industry which was getting a grip during the period of the inter-Party Government is afforestation. I hope that Deputies will not take it that I am sounding my own horn when I say that the Parliamentary Secretary in his opening speech a few days ago mentioned the fact that he found a lively interest among the people in these areas in afforestation. As ex-Minister for Lands may I say that I met with a response in the drive for afforestation in those areas that literally took my breath away because fast as I was inclined to go I found that the people wanted to drive me still faster? We would be foolish if we disregarded this enthusiasm among the people for an industry that does not need bolstering up or subsidising. It utilises the land of the area and further it will establish industries and give a healthy, clean form of outdoor work to the men. It will contribute more to the stabilisation of the population in the Gaeltacht and in the areas prescribed in the Bill than any other industry the Minister can establish.
In that connection I want to say that the Minister, being in charge of the Department of Industry and Commerce, knows what a pretty huge drain on our resources is the supplying of our needs of timber and of timber and wood products. In these years I think it has soared into the region of £8,000,000, and while afforestation will not give us timber to go to the sawmills inside 25 years at the very soonest, nevertheless I would say that the Minister in his effort to tackle the problem of the flight from the land in these areas would be well advised to use the land in the development of afforestation along the line I was developing it. If he tackles the problem it will be money well spent and well invested. I know that the argument will be put both to the Minister for Lands and to the Minister for Industry and Commerce: why bury money now that will not give a real visible return for 20 or 25 years? That is true.
Afforestation is, if you like, sinking money, but it is wrong to say that it does not give a return. It gives an instantaneous return in the form of employment and the circulation of money in those areas with its corresponding flow into the Treasury in a very short time as a result of the increased purchasing of dutiable goods. I want to impress on the Minister for Industry and Commerce, whom I would not expect to be very familiar with the problems at least of the particular areas which he is tackling now, that afforestation is the kingpin of the whole lot. I do hope that any financial consideration about investing money in such a way that it might not show a visible yield for 20 or 25 years will not influence him. That is not the proper way to look at it. If a Government 20, 25, 30 or 40 years ago had established afforestation in this country we would save that £8,000,000 which we pay out annually to countries that do not take 6d. worth from us in return and we would be very thankful to them.
We would say that at least they were far-sighted in having established them. It is the one way to keep men at home. Views were expressed here that if industrialisation of the congested areas takes place it may have the effect of killing the Gaelic language. I do not know. I shall not venture an opinion as to whether it would or not. It might do the language no good. We must admit that it does appear that if we are to save the language it is in the rural areas it must be done. That would appear to be the trend so far, but I am not in a position to speak on that subject. It does appear that, if the language is to be preserved in the Gaeltacht, it is in the rural areas rather than in the towns or in the vicinity of factories that the language lives best. That is one added reason why I would impress on the Minister that afforestation is one of the best means of providing employment, utilising the land that does not give much yield at the present time.
When I was a member of the inter-Party Government I got figures from the Department of Agriculture or some other place. I recollect that the figures given for sheep population of most of these areas showed that there is one sheep per three and a half acres, taking the valleys and the barren mountain tops. One sheep per three and a half acres is a poor way to use the land. Having been only a short time in charge of the forestry division, my opinion is that forestry properly developed in these areas will maintain the same population in the same comfort and prosperity as a similar acreage of the best land that is utilised for agricultural purposes. That is a pretty stiff claim, but if the Minister has a talk with some of the higher officials in the forestry division and reviews what has been done there already he will find that I am not exaggerating by one iota.
Next comes the question of the deep-sea fisheries. These are well worth developing. In my opinion, the way to develop deep-sea fisheries is not by giving boats or this, that or the other. Secure a steady market and a price for the fish and the sea fisheries will develop. Then, if the fisheries section of the Department of Agriculture have the boats and the gear ready for the fishermen, it will give good employment.
In that connection may I say that there was a sea rod industry established during my time? It had been begun some few years before that but it was only in the early stages. It was put on a firm foundation during the years 1949 and 1950. The sea rod industry is capable of further expansion, perhaps not to a much greater extent but at least to some extent. Experiments were made during my time in connection with what the people who live near the seashore call bladder weed but which is officially known as ascophyllm. Alginic acid can be produced from it.
Minerals are well worth investigating and there are minerals all over the west coast from Kerry up to Donegal. The Minister knows as well as I do that industries for which the raw material is available in the locality are certain of success, while industries, the raw material of which has to be brought into the area, may not be so sure of success. That is why I am stressing the importance of using in the first instance whatever materials are available locally, whether they are in the sea, on the land or under the ground.
In Connemara there is a very valuable kind of marble. I do not know a great deal about it, but it seems to have gone the same way as some of our slate quarries in the West. There are slate quarries in the West which should be opened up and developed properly. A wrong approach has been made to slate quarries, particularly in Mayo and Galway. The Killaloe slate quarries seem to have met with greater success, although the quality is no better than the quality of the slates in Mayo and Galway. I believe that a wrong approach that was made in the past has led to two quarries being abandoned. One is at Louisburgh and the other is in County Galway, right across from the Mayo border. That matter needs to be dealt with.
The question of turf production has been a controversial one in this House. Turf production should be and could be developed. Let me say to the Minister, as I said to him years ago, when he was Minister for Supplies, that the principal way to ensure the development of turf production is to see that turf reaches the consumer in good condition. That was not the case during the war years, but perhaps there was a good explanation for that. It might not have been so easy to ensure that turf reached the consumer in good condition. If the consumer in the city or town got turf of a good quality, as good as every farmer gets it, that is, dry as a bone, that will make a cheerful fire, the people would be glad to take it, and there would not be the clamour that arose in 1946 and 1947, as soon as the war was over, to bring in coal at any cost. It was not Fianna Fáil or the inter-Party Government, but it was the way in which turf was given to the consumers in the cities and towns during the war years, that was the principal cause of the setback that the industry suffered. Even at this late stage that difficulty can be overcome. The people down the country will produce the best of turf, and put it on the train or lorry in the best condition. It is not fair to ask consumers in the city to pay for water. Turf which left the bogs in a dry condition became soaked with water, and if the city consumers had to pay for it, it is no blame to them if they are disgusted at the very mention of the words turf.
I do not know what can be done on the lines of development of water power for generating electricity in those areas, but I am sure there are still sources that are untapped. There is one lake near Newport, North Mayo. It is a vast expanse of water and reasonably above sea level. I do not see why it should not be developed. Perhaps it is that the E.S.B. are engaged in developing greater waterfalls in other parts of the country and have not yet reached it. The matter is worthy of examination.
The Minister and the Parliamentary Secretary might contribute something useful, particularly to the Gaeltacht areas, by further expansion of the various industries that are already established. No doubt they are small industries but nevertheless they are very useful and give a nice form of employment and there is a ready market for their products. There is one near Belmullet which is employing almost 100 hands. There is one in Crolly, County Donegal, employing 70 to 80 hands constantly. The Minister, I am sure, is aware of the fact that the toys that they turn out are considered second to none in any market in the world. The same applies to other industries. I would like to see them developed to a much greater extent.
I want again to impress on the Tánaiste that, in my opinion, while this Bill provides for the establishment of a board, the board cannot do a great deal. It gives me the impression that it is a plunge in the dark but in the right direction. Let us take care, however, that we do not miss the bigger things under our eyes—that we cannot see the wood for the trees. The last Government were paying attention to the points I have mentioned. They were travelling along these lines and developing these things. These are the right lines on which to go if you want to stabilise the population in those areas.
With regard to the establishment of industries, the Minister's speech rather left me with cold feet with regard to the Bill. He pointed out the difficulties which would beset the establishment of industries. As I read the Bill, the board cannot operate or start an industry. All it can do is purchase land and, if necessary, erect buildings, and then induce industrialists to come in. I cannot see industrialists taking that bait.
