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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 9 Jul 1959

Vol. 176 No. 7

Export Promotion Bill, 1959—Second Stage.

I move that the Bill be now read a Second Time.

The purpose of the Bill is to establish Córas Tráchtála as a statutory board to carry on the functions of promoting, assisting and developing exports at present carried on by Córas Tráchtála Teoranta, which is to be wound up.

Since its establishment as a limited company in 1951 C.T.T., with the assistance of annual Grants-in-Aid, has filled a very important role in our economic life by stimulating interest in exports and by giving to exporting firms assistance without which they would have in many cases found it extremely difficult, if not impossible to export. Amongst the ways in which the company helps exporters are the investigation in detail of export market prospects, sending trade advisers to overseas countries to carry out market investigations on the spot, watching for openings for Irish products in foreign markets, organising collective marketing plans, supplying importers in overseas countries with information on Irish goods, advising on channels of distribution, methods of salesmanship and on the selection of agents. The company also arranges participation in trade fairs and in addition it provides publicity for Irish goods overseas through Press, television and radio.

The results achieved by the company were reviewed by the Government in connection with the preparation of the programme of economic expansion. The Government were satisfied that it was in the national interest to maintain as a permanent feature of our industrial policy an organisation specifically charged by the Oireachtas with the task of advising exporters and potential exporters and, where necessary, the appropriate Ministers, on all aspects of export development. Accordingly the introduction of legislation to establish Córas Tráchtála as a permanent State agency for the promotion of exports was announced in the White Paper on economic expansion.

The establishment of Córas Tráchtála as a statutory body will add considerably to its standing and authority in implementing a long term policy of export development. It will also influence and increase that confidence which is necessary for the developing of new types of goods as well as increased quanities of existing goods for export. Córas Tráchtála's ability to contribute towards the realisation of the programme for economic expansion in the export field will undoubtedly be strengthened by this measure.

I confidently commend the Bill to the House.

One matter that the Minister did not refer to in the course of his speech was how it is proposed to finance the new company to be set up when this Bill is passed. I understand from the Schedule that it is proposed to transfer the property and liability of the existing company to C.T.T. and to that extent it may have a certain initial foundation. I should be glad, however, to hear from the Minister what arrangements will be made for permanent financial backing.

This company has done very useful work since it was established and has helped many individual traders and companies in getting markets and in facilitating them in developing trade. While that has been the case, I wonder to what extent the work of this company has been impeded by Government policy in other directions. I referred to this matter on a previous occasion, but I want to do so again now, because if there was ever a case of one hand not knowing what the other was doing, it is evident in some of the figures published in the booklet, Economic Development. It concerns one of the most valuable export trades which we had and which I hope, as a result of efforts being made, is again growing.

On page 170 of Economic Development, figures are given for the export of spirits, mainly whiskey, in the three pre-war years, 1937, 1938 and 1939. These figures show that in those years a total of 230,000 gallons a year with an average annual value of £179,000 was exported. Details are then given of the countries, the quantities and the value in each case. Then we come to the post-war period and we find that the export of whiskey grew steadily from 1948 to 1951, reaching a peak in that year of 438,000 gallons, valued at £558,000. It goes on to say that they declined steeply in the next three years but have since begun to recover.

If you examine the exports for 1951 and contrast them with the figure for 1954, you find they were less than half in 1954 what they were in 1951. There was a subsequent recovery in 1956 and 1957 and I gather from some recent information that that trend is continuing. Here is the real kernel of the matter. Córas Tráchtála were provided last year with a special sum of £25,000, in addition to the money which was provided by the distillers who were concerned to develop the market for whiskey abroad. At the same time the effect of taxation in the 1952 Budget, and for the next couple of years, was such that it depressed the whole export trade in whiskey.

I know it may be argued that exports of spirits are not liable to taxation, but the fact that exports dropped substantially is clear evidence of the deterring and retarding effect which heavy taxation on spirits has had on this old-established industry. It is an industry which gives male employment, uses raw materials which are home-grown and home-produced, and provides a manufactured article second to none in quality.

I notice that one of the specific responsibilities assigned to the new Board is that "it shall be the duty of the Board to advise the Minister on matters affecting or in any way connected with the development of exports". I hope that when this new Board is set up, it will quite freely tender advice to the Minister, and through him, to the Government. It is bad national policy, on the one hand, to have a special board or company charged with the responsibility of developing exports and, on the other hand, the effect of Government policy operating to depress that industry and reduce rather than expand the exports concerned. I mention that because I believe it is a good example. I do not say that there are not a number of other comparable examples but that certainly is one. Another example which was referred to on a previous occasion was our valuable export trade in biscuits. Happily, recent information on that matter shows an improvement again. Surely it is to the advantage of a company of this sort that it should advise and investigate, and supply information on the various factors which affect the trade and which limit or facilitate, as the case may be, the development of the trade.

One of the problems confronting firms in this country is that a great number of them are small firms. Some of them are family businesses run by individuals and their resources are limited. We have had experience of traders making efforts to get into the export market and finding administrative or other obstacles put in their way and then, for one reason or another, they had not sufficient resources available to pursue the matter sufficiently vigorously, or they had not available to them the technical advice or assistance necessary if they are to develop a technique of getting into the foreign market.

While this country has a number of trade agreements with foreign markets—I have in mind our agreements with Continental countries—in all those agreements, the balance of trade is heavily adverse, so far as we are concerned. While on paper an agreement may entitle us to facilities or to the right to send goods into these markets, nevertheless, in practice, on occasions we have found administrative difficulties put in the way of individual traders, or some other restrictive practice applied, which prevented exporters from getting a foothold in the market concerned.

In matters of this sort, a body such as C.T.T. can be of invaluable assistance and it has, I believe, helped many people very considerably since it was established in 1951. It was originally established as a result of the findings of a committee which was set up by the first inter-Party Government. After very careful consideration, that committee recommended its establishment. Steps were being taken to have it established when there was a change of Government and the succeeding Government proceeded with its establishment. Since then, I believe that decision has been more than justified, and the work which Córas Tráchtála has carried out has reflected credit on the Director and staff of that organisation.

I hope, therefore, that when it is established on a more permanent basis, when its functions are set out as they are being set out in this measure and when the company has statutory recognition, the full potentia-utilised of this organisation will be utilised to the maximum extent by all concerned with developing their export trade and that in whatever sphere they are this board will be in a position to assist them; but, on the other hand, I hope the board itself will freely express its views to the Government, or anyone else, on all the steps or measures that should be taken to develop our export trade, and that they will say what factors they consider are militating against the proper development of the export trade of this country.

I do not know whether it is possible for the Minister to give any indication of the volume and value of exports developed as a result of the initiative or efforts of Córas Tráchtála. That information may be difficult to give because some of their activities are additional or ancillary to the individual efforts of traders and companies. If, however, some indication could be given of the extent of the exports which have been developed as a result of the activities of Córas Tráchtála, it might be of interest. Some matters may arise on the Committee Stage and further consideration of the measure can be deferred until that Stage.

As Deputy Cosgrave said, the C.T.T. organisation came into existence as a result of a committee set up during the period 1948 to 1951 to ascertain the possibilities of exports to the dollar market so that we might earn urgently required dollars to pay for portion of our imports from the dollar area. As a result of the recommendations made by that committee, C.T.T. was crystallised into its present form. For some years past the question of giving it a statutory basis and allowing it to function as a statutory body has been under consideration. Pressure of other business of a more important character resulted in delay in giving effect to that proposal. Beyond its conversion from a non-statutory to a statutory basis, this Bill does not, in fact affect its over-all activities to any extent.

My main purpose in intervening in this discussion is to pay tribute to C.T.T. for the very valuable work it has done, not merely in the general national interest but also on behalf of a number of enterprising firms which have been encouraged to go into the export market. Before C.T.T. was established, there was no single organisation which could tell one that it had carried out market surveys or that it had made any gains in promotional activities in foreign markets, so far as Irish goods were concerned. There was no single organisation to which a business firm could go in order to ascertain what were the procedures associated with exports to foreign countries. As a result of the establishment of C.T.T., all that work was taken in hands.

C.T.T. studied the problem of what a foreign customer wants, in quality, in style, and in packaging. It studied the customs and import regulations in a vast variety of countries in which we either had no trade at all or trade of a microscopic character. By dint of sustained effort, it was able to build itself into an expert organisation which knew the complexities of trading with foreign countries, the difficulties of currency regulations, the difficulties embodied in the simple phrase "c.i.f." and the interpretation it had in the different countries. It learned, too, of the necessity for guaranteeing traders against risks in politically volcanic countries. All that information was assembled and utilised for the benefit of Irish industrialists.

As a result of the activities of C.T.T. we are now exporting goods which, if it had not been brought into existence would probably never have been exported. Today, industrialists are exporting to many countries, industrialists who have been encouraged and inspired by the example given them by C.T.T. That is creditworthy; that is praiseworthy. Having had a good deal to do in the years 1948 to 1951 and 1954 to 1957 with C.T.T. activities, particularly in the latter period, I want to put on record now my appreciation of the excellent work done by the Chairman, the Directors and the staff.

In a matter of this kind in which one has to marry two organisations in order to achieve results, it is not always easy to guarantee that the success of one of the partners will necessarily be the measure of speed of both when harnessed together. C.T.T. had a difficult job in persuading industrialists that there was money to be made in the export market. They had to teach them the way in which they should price for the export market and the quality, style and packaging required for the export market. That was not an easy job. Very frequently, people who are protected by a high tariff wall are inclined to take the attitude that they are doing all right and do not want any headaches with export markets. They know the people they are dealing with at home. They know they will get their cheque and everything will be all right.

People had to be torn out of that slumber and inertia in order to induce them to go into the export market. In that field, C.T.T. did an excellent job. Its activities, and the success of its activities, are in direct ratio, of course, to the energy and enterprise of the firms engaged in the export trade. C.T.T. cannot after all compel people to export. They can only show them the advantages of exporting. In that direction, C.T.T. has done very valuable work in soil which was pretty difficult to plough and still more difficult to harrow and to sow. We can be satisfied now that they have done a pretty good job in difficult circumstances.

The field staff of C.T.T. is microscopic as compared with the field staffs employed by other countries engaged in the export trade. In every State in America, you will find continental travellers with bags of literature. In one bag alone, there is more than C.T.T. has under its entire control. Travellers fan out all over the States, selling the advantages of buying from their particular countries. In other countries, the C.T.T. staff does not exist at all. If occasion arises, someone has to be sent out. Even in the United States, with its enormous market potential from the export point of view, the staff scarcely numbers half a dozen. If you subtract the office staff proper, then there is only one man. I know of one. There may possibly be two. Remembering that, and remembering the problem of trying to make contacts in America, one has some appreciation of the Herculean task we set C.T.T. in asking them to invade the foreign markets without giving them an army to carry out the invasion, but, despite all those disadvantages, C.T.T. has done remarkably well.

If we are going to have any problem with that organisation in the future, it will be a problem of finding more money to finance its activities on a wider scale. Exports are essential to our existence as a viable economy. Whatever the cost, we shall have to face up to the necessity of doing what other countries have done, namely, sent their commercial travellers, or their field officers, in adequate numbers into potential markets. If it pays other countries to export, it will pay us to export. Now that there are such substantial tax concessions in respect of the export of manufactured goods, I hope that an augmented and statutorily endowed body will utilise every opportunity to its fullest, aided by additional Government finance, in order to push on with the drive to sell more Irish goods abroad.

First of all, I am not quite clear from the Minister's remarks as to the necessity for changing Córas Tráchtála from its present form of a company into a statutory body. However, if it will increase its efficiency and make for expanded efforts and more success on the part of Córas Tráchtála, I have no objection. I have some misgiving every time we are presented with another board. I have no great objection to boards as such but I do think that in this country in recent years we have tended to place our faith rather too much in boards of one kind or another. It should not be forgotten that, long before Córas Tráchtála Teoranta or any other promotional body was set up, there were old-established Irish industries exporting all over the world. Some of these industries continue to export and some, unfortunately, have declined, not through any fault of the directors or owners, but because national policy tended to inhibit their efforts. By the tariff policy that was followed here, particularly over the last 25 years, costs were raised all round, to such an extent that certain industries could not export at an economic figure.

While giving every credit, and while I should like to be associated with the remarks passed with regard to the efforts of Córas Tráchtála Teoranta, particularly in the case of small businesses that cannot afford an export department, in my view the best way of securing exports is for the individual owner or director or associate of a company to go out and explore the markets himself. It would be foolish for us or for business in general to assume that, because we set up an Export Promotion Board, all that the individual factory owner or industrialist has to do is to sit back and wait for Córas Tráchtála Teoranta to produce the markets. As Deputy Norton rightly says, in the final analysis, it does depend on the energy, enterprise and hard work of the industries concerned to sell their goods.

Possibly for good national reasons at the time, we have tended to look more to the home market than to the export market for a great number of our factories. That has produced an attitude of mind that, certainly, is not conducive to going out and getting export markets in the teeth of competition from other countries. What we really need here, more than any Promotion Board or anything else, is a change of attitude of mind from buying Irish to selling Irish and, in the final analysis, that does depend on the individual industrialist or businessman himself. If encouragement is to be given, the best place to give it, as the Government have, indeed, recognised, is to the manufacturer or the industrialist concerned, to encourage him to go out and look for exports and to make good profits on them and to show that his enterprise will be rewarded.

There is just one small point in the Bill to which I should like to refer. I notice that if a member of the board is nominated as a candidate for election to either House of the Oireachtas, he shall thereupon cease to be a member of the board. Would it not be desirable that he should wait and see if he is elected to either House of the Oireachtas? He might find himself neither elected to a House of the Oireachtas nor continuing as a member of the board. I do not know if that follows the usual procedure but, if it does not, I would suggest that at least the member concerned might be allowed to wait and see if he is successful at the hustings before he loses his seat on the board, as he may be a very useful member indeed.

I ask myself, what is the purpose of this Bill? I have studied the Minister's speech most carefully. I have been asking myself that question since the Bill was first circulated. What is the purpose of changing the company into a board? I read the Bill. I did not find anything there. Now I have discovered the secret.

A good deal of brouhaha has been going on about the White Paper on Economic Development, Mr. Whitaker's book, and what the Government were going to do, and the devil in the bag, and this shower of Bills that has descended on us is all a flexing of muscles in public. In fact, it is the mountain heaving and the extremely moth-eaten stuff coming out, because I am informed by the Minister:

Accordingly, the introduction of legislation to establish Córas Tráchtála as a permanent State agency for the promotion of exports was announced in the White Paper on Economic Expansion,

and the reason for the introduction of this Bill is to show that they are all as busy as bees.

But, while this Bill is being drafted to promote exports, I am informed in this morning's paper that one of the most important concessions under the Trade Agreement made in 1948 to promote exports of agricultural produce from this country has been lost. While our trade competitors were taking from us the advantage that we had acquired in our principal market for agricultural exports with blood, sweat and tears, in the 1948 Trade Agreement, we were careering around the country chewing the rag with the present President and the present Taoiseach and his colleagues as to whether we should elect Deputies by proportional representation or not and we are all expected now to get up and cheer——

The Danes are interested in bacon while the Government are interested in P.R. We lose again.

We are expected to get up and cheer because a Bill has been brought in here to make Córas Tráchtála Teoranta a board instead of a company. We are all meant to say, "Is that not wonderful? Look at the way the Government are breaking their necks to get exports for the country. Are they not marvellous?" Is there to be no end to this fraud and codology?

I do not think people realise the gravity of today's developments for this country. The agricultural export potential from this country has suffered more in the last 48 hours than Córas Tráchtála will ever remedy. If this were a Bill to implement a new Trade Agreement with Great Britain, then I would feel that we were doing something significant for the expansion of profitable exports from this country but this is a Bill to turn Córas Tráchtála Teoranta into a board.

Compare the volume of exports which this body, either as a board or as a company, can conceivably be interested in with the volume of exports on which the survival of this country depends. Remember, Córas Tráchtála Teoranta takes no part, and should not take a part, in the marketing of 90 per cent. of our agricultural exports but we are told that the Government provided two and a half years ago £250,000 to examine that question. Has any Deputy read either of the two reports we have got so far? One of them informs us that there is no market for eggs; the market is gone— we knew that, without spending £250,000 for anyone to tell us— and there is no other place to sell eggs. We knew that also. We knew that 27 years ago, when Fianna Fáil started the economic war and started looking for alternative markets. I still remember going to the Department of Agriculture then and meeting a decent civil servant, who is now in Heaven, wandering around a corridor with a sheaf of papers in his hand. I said: "Where are you going with that sheaf of papers?" He said: "Well, to tell you the truth, I am carrying out my Minister's instructions to look for an alternative market for eggs that I know does not exist. I am paid to go and look for it."

It is most unlikely that a civil servant would say that to the Deputy.

He did, 27 golden years ago. We have been looking for these alternative markets, ever since, most industriously. We have at last reconciled ourselves to the conclusion that there is no alternative market for eggs. Where will we get an alternative market for bacon? Who is worrying now about our markets for 80 per cent. of things we have to export?

This Bill is cod. I do not think it makes any difference to anybody. I think it has been introduced for no purpose other than to create the impression that the Taoiseach, since he got into power, is like a human dynamo, and that is all. It makes me almost frantic that we should be engaged in Dáil Éireann with that kind of claptrap——

Like the Deputy's speech.

——on the same day as we are faced with the fact that a large part of the benefit we have enjoyed over the past ten years under the 1948 Trade Agreement has been swept away, with no effort on the part of our Government to salvage any part of the wreck. Deputy Loughman's comment on all that situation is that to attempt to protest against it——

We have too much talk about claptrap and codology from the Deputy.

I do not blame Deputy Loughman for at last beginning to feel a little ashamed of his performance in this regard. We are getting along splendidly. We shifted Deputy Corry into the open a week ago. We shifted Deputy G. Boland into the open the day before yesterday, and Deputy Bartley, too. Maybe Deputy Loughman is beginning to see the light.

Talk a bit of sense.

We are getting away from the Bill.

Apparently no Fianna Fáil Deputy was allowed to talk on Thursday.

That is not true, either.

Indeed it is.

There was a wall of silence.

They were told to sit down.

The Taoiseach has given these instructions. I know he gave instructions for fewer speakers from Fianna Fáil.

It is just malice. I take it that it is not a malady.

Deputy Norton has already spoken on this.

These Fianna Fáil Deputies must have ideas.

I do not think so.

The great danger is that, of recent times, when they communicate their ideas to us, they have a very disturbing effect on their colleagues. I do not blame the Taoiseach if he has issued a ukase that there is to be less claptrap from the Fianna Fáil benches.

The Deputy should return to the Bill.

I am talking about the Bill and about Deputy Loughman's unique intervention because nobody else has said a word. I am protesting against the appearance of the Government doing the devil with a bang when in fact they are doing nothing in the sphere that matters most. It shocked me that the Minister for Industry and Commerce should move a Bill of this character, while his colleague the Minister for Agriculture is told he is not to say a word, as he was the day before yesterday, about the events transpiring throughout the principal export market we have.

I want to ask the Minister if he has adverted to one of the greatest dangers into which a body of this kind can fall, that is, to undertake the sale of commodities that we have not got? There is only one thing more dangerous to our export programme than lethargy and that is misguided zeal. Incalculable harm can be done by rushing out to promote markets for a particular product and then discovering, when the orders come in, that you are not in a position to supply them. I want to ask the Minister for Industry and Commerce if he is authorised on the part of the Government to give us any indication of the Government's intention to set up any body corresponding to Córas Tráchtála to assist in the marketing of agricultural products. We shall need it.

I do not think Deputies have awakened to the fact that the only agricultural produce left to us now with a secure market are live cattle. Standing, as we do today, outside the Common Market, the Swedish seven-nation agreement, in association, I understand, with Iceland, Turkey and Greece, we shall find ourselves in a very awkward situation. It ought not be any consolation to Deputies here to learn that we propose to convert Córas Tráchtála, Teo., into a board. They will have no function to discharge if our agricultural markets wither away.

I think something possibly could be done if some energetic measures were taken to promote sales organisations in Great Britain for Irish bacon and Irish butter—at least by way of a holding operation until such time as we are in a position to re-negotiate a trade agreement with Great Britain. I am getting extremely apprehensive of the situation which threatens to develop in default of something along those lines being done.

It shocks me that this House should congratulate itself on the kind of legislation we are now considering in the context in which we find ourselves at present. As usual, we are in the awkward situation that the Minister for Industry and Commerce will say it is outside his responsibility, that the marketing of agricultural produce is the responsibility of the Minister for Agriculture. The Minister has a dual function now. He is not only Minister for Industry and Commerce at the moment. He also speaks on behalf of the Government in this House at the moment.

Will the Deputy give way for the one minute which remains and he can resume next Tuesday?

Certainly.

It is not true to say that the Government are standing by and doing nothing, having regard to the events which happened in London yesterday. As the House is aware, the concept of the Outer Seven and the negotiations of the talks in Stockholm began only in recent weeks. Following on the commencement of those talks, the Minister for Agriculture and the Minister for External Affairs visited London and had certain negotiations there. In the meantime, the Danes came to London. I want to assure the House that it is not true that the Government are standing by and doing nothing having regard to the events which happened in London yesterday.

The Minister will acquit me of any discourtesy when I say that the production of a Bill of this character does not correspond with what I think it is necessary to do in relation to the events which happened in London yesterday.

Debate adjourned.
The Dáil adjourned at 5 p.m. until 3 p.m. on Tuesday, 14th July, 1959.
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