asked the Minister for Health whether in accordance with the public undertakings given by him he has had discussions with representatives of the Irish Medical Association with a view to the solution of outstanding difficulties.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Discussions with Irish Medical Association.
3.
On 13th March last, in response to a request from the Irish Medical Association that I should receive a deputation to discuss certain matters, I caused a letter to be addressed to them informing them of my willingness to see the deputation on the condition that a ban which they had sought to impose on recruitment to certain medical posts in the public service was withdrawn. The relevant quotation from that letter is as follows:—
"I am also to state that, in view of the request for a discussion and in order that the discussion may be without prejudice, the Minister would expect that steps would be taken by your Association to withdraw the proscription which has been placed on recruitment to several important posts concerned with the provision of health services to the community and to restore the status quo in regard to these posts. When an intimation has been received to the effect that action on these lines has been taken, the necessary arrangements for the fixing of a meeting can be completed."
On 23rd May last, the Association, far from withdrawing the ban on the posts already covered by the ban announcement, published a notice seeking to extend the ban to recruitment to all medical posts in all local authority hospitals.
On 13th June, the Association issued a statement disclaiming the existence of any ban. I interpreted that statement in good faith, mistakenly as it has subsequently transpired, as a withdrawal of the existing ban and caused a letter to be addressed to them on 15th June intimating my willingness, in view of the disclaimer, to receive the proposed deputation. That letter has already been published.
Shortly afterwards I was invited to attend, as the guest of the Association, their Annual Dinner, to be held in Killarney on 1st July. Information which had just come to my notice seemed to indicate that the Association was continuing to boycott a particular post and, on 26th June, I wrote to the senior officers of the Association who were readily available at the time making it clear that while, as a gesture of good-will to the Association, I would like to attend the dinner, I would not be able to do so or to receive the deputation if the ban were continued.
On foot of certain undertakings given to me, I attended the dinner and in the course of my address on that occasion I said—
"... When the Central Council of your Association by the public statement which it issued on the 13th June, created the conditions in which a meeting to discuss fundamental matters, far removed from trivia like the rent of houses or mileage allowances, could usefully take place, I hastened to indicate my readiness to participate in such a discussion."
Early in July I sought to arrange the discussion on a date later in the month but was told that certain senior officers of the Association would not be available at that time.
Meanwhile, however, the Association continued to publish in its Journal the notice of the ban, notwithstanding their public disclaimer in June and the assurances given to me before I attended the Dinner. There was accumulating clear evidence that a ban existed and that the Association was trying to enforce it. Even in face of this, however, I renewed, as recently as 24th and 30th September last, my offer to receive the deputation; but on the same condition as I had indicated in the original letter of 13th March last, and as I had consistently indicated ever since.
If the Central Council of the Irish Medical Association wishes to discuss with me the existing difficulties which are largely of their own creation, the first essential conditions are that they should clearly and unequivocally withdraw the ban which they have sought to impose on posts in the service of local authorities and of my Departments and that I should be fully satisfied that that ban has, in fact, been effectively removed.
Does the Minister not accord to the Irish Medical Association the right to advise its members as to terms and conditions prior to applying for a particular post?
I do not accord to the Irish Medical Association the right to double-dealing with me.
Would the Minister mind answering the supplementary question which I directed to him?
I have nothing to add to the reply I have given to the Deputy.
Is it not-correct that what the Minister pleases to call a "ban" is merely a request to applicants for particular posts to discuss with the Irish Medical Association the terms and conditions of these posts?
I emphatically deny that that is the purpose of the ban. On 23rd May, 1959, the Irish Medical Association published the following notice in the daily Press. It followed, I may say, the removal from office of Mr. Hurley, the County Surgeon for Mallow Hospital:
In view of the Minister for Health's letters dated 14th April, 1959, to the County Cork County Manager, as published in the daily Press of 1st May, 1959, medical practitioners who have applied for, or are considering applying for, resident or non-resident posts in local authority hospitals are asked to approach the Medical Secretary 10 Fitzwilliam Place, Dublin.
That has nothing to do with terms of service.
Does the Minister not accord to a professional body the right to advise members as to terms and conditions? Are we to have dragooning in this country?
All I can say is that if the experienced practitioners who apply for these posts are not themselves able to understand what is implied by the printed text of conditions and qualifications which they receive from the Local Appointments Commissioners then I suggest they might be classified as medical morons.
I suggest to the Minister that it is in accordance with established practice that trade unions and professional bodies are entitled to advise their members in relation to these important matters.
This body claims that it is not a trade union.
Question No. 4.
I want to give notice of my intention to raise this important matter on the adjournment of the House either this evening or later next week.
The Chair will consider it.