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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 20 Jul 1960

Vol. 183 No. 14

Business of the Dáil.

Before the Taoiseach resumes on his Estimate, perhaps he could tell us what arrangement has been made with regard to the sitting.

There has been consultation and I gather there have been some moves. There is a suggestion that we should move to sit late. That will have to be done before 8 o'clock. It is a matter of getting agreement, then, as to how late we should sit.

As I understand it, discussions are proceeding. The tentative suggestion is that we might later on move to sit to midnight, provided the Taoiseach would be allowed to reply to the debate at a fixed hour, and leaving time to deal with consequential financial business.

On this matter of discussions between the Whips, I should like to remind the Taoiseach and the Leader of the Fine Gael Party that, on prior occasions, it has been known to happen that a number of speakers who offered themselves at a late hour on the Taoiseach's Estimate were guillotined, or ruled out of order, on the ground that agreement had been reached.

It cannot be reached without the consent of the House.

I want to put it on record now that I personally intend to intervene in this debate. I am not a party to any arrangement which shall say that, in order to meet the convenience of somebody else in this House, I may talk for only five minutes.

The House is master of its own service, and Deputies will take the decision of the majority on it.

If necessary, we shall take that decision by a majority vote, and the Taoiseach can steamroll it through.

I do not think anybody need get hot under the collar. Discussion can take place. I take it if the House wants to sit tomorrow, the next day, and the day after, nobody will stop them.

We want to establish that. Deputy McQuillan made the point that he had been stopped on another occasion.

I have sat long enough on these benches to have established these things without there being any need for a "guffuffle" about them now.

Deputy Dillon will, I think——

There will be no agreement from here, or any other part of the House, to exclude anyone from talking in the debate. I intervened to mention that discussions are proceeding. If the House wants to sit tomorrow, and the day after, there is nothing to prevent its doing so.

The suggestion I made was that the hour to which we may sit can be settled by agreement.

I think Deputy Dillon will agree that on former occasions Deputy Sherwin and others were not allowed to speak because of an arrangement—an arrangement to which they were not parties.

The Deputy will also agree that, many a time when it was necessary that they should speak, those Deputies could not be found to speak. There are two sides to this argument. The idea that we should carry on the debate while others kick their heels——

Deputy Dillon is the Leader of the Opposition——

Exactly. I am the Leader of the Opposition holding the fort for you.

Arising out of this discussion, on a former occasion I sat here for three hours and, when I tried to get into the debate, I could not get in. I was told time was up. I left making a protest. We would all like to get in, if only for ten minutes.

On the occasion on which Deputy Sherwin was ruled out of order the House had agreed previously to call the Minister at a stated hour.

I accept that, but the fact remains that I was here for three hours and could not get in. That is my point.

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