This section means that the Minister is taking over the making of regulations from the Commissioner. Heretofore, the Commissioner was responsible for the enforcement of the regulations as well as the making of them. A difficulty which I adverted to yesterday is that we have a number of traffic laws which are not being enforced, with the result that the whole code is coming into disrepute. There are problems of road discipline generally. The Minister says he is not responsible for enforcing the law in this respect and that therefore it is not relevant for me to go into police policy.
However, I wish to emphasise now that it is not the fault of the Garda. They have not got the resources in manpower or otherwise. Therefore, there are certain facts relevant to the situation to which the legislating authority should have regard. In the making of the law, the Department, whichever it may be, should have regard to the practical question of enforcing that law. It is a very relevant question for all legislators, be it Oireachtas Éireann or any delegated authority empowered by us to legislate. It is important that they should ask the question whether the law can be enforced. There is the collective responsibility of the Executive.
What is the position in regard to our traffic laws in this city at the moment? We have blanket speed-limits. I have studied one stretch of road—I have made a personal study of it—the stretch between Irishtown and Merrion Gates. In my personal study of that stretch during the past number of months, its history has been first, a 30 mile per hour limit, then 40 miles and then back again to 30 miles. Before it was 40 miles, nobody observed the limit. When it was 40 miles the traffic was about geared to it. On the average, then, the traffic was in line with regulations.
About a year ago the speed was reduced again to 30 miles per hour. I frequently have come in at either end, driving steadily with 30 miles per hour on my needle. Invariably a number of cars not only have passed me but have roared past. Some law-abiding citizens will queue up behind you and then you cause a jam of cars. On top of that, somebody in the rear comes blasting out through the entire street and the person who is observing the law is really in the position of being a public nuisance. That is not my experience during one or two days, daylight or evening. I have given the summarised result of controlled experiments I have carried out during a period of at least 18 months on that stretch.
It is not the fault of the Garda. I remember that once there were some gardaí on the stretch and the speed came down. I am not asking for 100 per cent enforcement—you cannot have that—but you must have a certain minimum of policing when you have regulations of this nature, to ensure that road discipline is maintained. I emphasise it now to bring home to the Minister the futility, in the first place, and the danger to public morale as well as the physical danger that can be inherent in legislation which may seem fine—perhaps I was a little hard yesterday when I called it window-dressing legislation—but which is not good unless we are in a position to enforce it. If we are not, it should not be made.
I mentioned parking lights. We have legislation in that respect and I invite Deputies, gardaí, anybody, even the people who draft these things in the Department, to walk around the town at night and to see how much the regulations about parking lights are observed. Quite apart from the difficulties the gardaí have, are we any better off than we would be if we had not these regulations? When we come to this stage, we are in danger of bringing the whole question of law, order and discipline among citizens into disrepute. I have given examples.
I may be a bit hard in suggesting that this is a blameworthy situation. It may have arisen from the best intentions. These regulations are made undoubtedly with the best intentions but do they achieve their object? I was amused, last night, to notice that a certain traffic light in Ailesbury Road, which for a couple of weeks has been out of order, was working again. I do not want this to be taken as blaming the people who are responsible for these things but I do wish to emphasise that we can be too ambitious in our legislation, that we can legislate beyond our capacity to secure compliance with that legislation, and I strongly urge everybody responsible for this very complex and difficult problem of road discipline, which is basic to the whole question of road safety as well as order in the community, to approach the whole question of road discipine from the point of view of getting effect, not merely from the point of view of getting it into the statutory rule of order. The job is not done when this is made a rule of order. It is only done when the law is made a reality. I have memtioned a few places where this thing can be checked. I do not make an argument; I make statements and all I ask is that everybody concerned will check the statements I have made and see whether I am right or wrong.
I know of another avenue which is a short-cut for motorists. It is a 30 mile an hour avenue and there are schools on it. I observed cars doing more than 30 miles an hour. A child was knocked down and some time after that there was a police trap there. There was discipline for approximately a week but now it is as bad as ever. I am saying these things to the Minister, and in connection with this debate particularly, because an authority who will not be responsible for enforcement is now being charged with responsibility for making the law. My plea is, and it is only a plea, that the feasibility and the practicability of enforcement must be more than ever carefully looked at by the people who are making the law.
My second point—although it is not relevant to this debate—is that in all fairness the fault is not that of the Gardaí. I am amazed that the morale of the Gardaí stands up to the load of responsibility for enforcement that is thrown on them because of their numbers. There are not sufficient gardaí nor have they the resources but that is not the responsibility of this Minister. However, he should take it into account when framing these regulations.
I say these things in a helpful way. I do not mean to be critical of the law-makers, those responsible for enforcing the law, or even the citizens who are breaking the law because, as Deputy Tully, who I think will agree with me, remarked many people exceed the 30 mile limit in certain circumstances. We have all done it through inadvertence or because of the fact that a road is open, or that a car in front is doing it and one is liable to exceed it by five miles or so. There is a good deal of that. That brings home the importance of being a realist with regard to specifying the speed regulations. The people responsible must not just bow to every bit of pressure. One should assess the situation as it is. It is easy to say that there was an accident on that stretch and we should bang on some limit.
I am interested to know the situation on the Naas stretch but this can be ascertained through Parliamentary question later and it is not a matter for this debate. I should like not only the Minister but also the Government to have regard to that point. In making a plea to the Government with regard to putting load after load of responsibility on the Garda it is true that enforcement or discipline in such a Department as this in the last analysis is the responsibility of the police authorities. Are we being fair to them? Are they in a position to carry the increasing loads that have been put on and on and on? Surely these considerations should be borne in mind when making this legislation.
There is one other question which out of curiosity I should like to ask. Frankly, the Minister may have answered it and it may have slipped my memory. If that is so, I am sorry. I am curious to know why it is better to transfer the jurisdiction to the Minister without leaving it to the Commissioner. During the passage of the 1961 Act it was assumed that the Commissioner, when it was enforced, would be the best person to make a balance. This change is something that must make the balance more specific and it must be adverted to. It would be interesting if the Minister would now say why it was thought desirable to do this.
