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Normal View

Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 11 Mar 1976

Vol. 288 No. 12

Social Welfare Bill, 1976: Second Stage (Resumed).

Question again proposed: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

The extension will, in the same way as I have explained for flat-rate unemployment benefit, apply in the case of persons who had exhausted their full pay-related benefit entitlement within 78 days of the operative date of the extension and who still retain their entitlement to flat-rate benefit.

I am convinced that the success to date of the extended pay-related benefit system in terms of reducing the financial impact of sickness and unemployment has been of the greatest social and human importance. It is out of the question that we should allow our fellow-citizens who have in effect been betrayed by the inefficiency and unequal working of our economic system to suffer substantial deprivation.

In introducing the Social Welfare (Pay-Related Benefit) Bill, 1975 in this House I stated that an analysis of the operation of the pay-related benefit refuted absolutely the idea that this system provided some form of bonanza for malingerers. I pointed out then that the pay-related benefit scheme does not give the average unemployed man more than he could get if he were at work, but that it does keep his head above water. I said then, and I repeat now, that it is the purpose of all income-maintenance payments to cushion a person to the fullest extent possible if he becomes unemployed or ill and, further that before people condemn or distort the working of the pay-related benefit scheme and its effects, they should think very carefully and they should examine how it operates and what it is designed to do.

I have repeatedly stated in this House that the development of the broad range of social welfare services demands a continual process of review and, where necessary, of reform and change. We have in three years brought about a really major advance in many areas of social welfare and have created a new basic level of provision which cannot be reversed. Further improvements and structural progress in the system are being worked on in the Department of Social Welfare at present in active pursuit of the declared aims of the Government.

Review of the system has led in this year's budget to a change in the arrangements relating to the range of benefits available to unemployed persons and section 12 of the Bill is designed to facilitate the making of regulations to implement this change by restricting the total amount of the benefits payable to a wholly unemployed person to 85 per cent of net current earnings.

This decision arises from a detailed study carried out by an inter-departmental working group set up by the Government to make appropriate investigations with a view to assessing the possible disincentive effects of benefits and concessions available to unemployed persons. The establishment of this working group followed a report prepared for me on the working of the pay-related benefit system.

The study carried out by the working group was intended to look at the effects of the whole range of benefits and concessions which may be available to unemployed persons. These include, in addition to unemployment benefit, pay-related benefit and unemployment assistance, the weekly redundancy payments scheme, tax rebates, relief from tax and social welfare contributions and, in certain cases, reduction of differential rents. If inequalities exist—if there are situations in which people can become caught in the "welfare trap" where an unemployed worker could suffer financially by seeking and accepting a reasonable job offer—then this can arise only through an interaction of a number of the available concessions. This was the general conclusion of the working group and one which gives rise to very serious implications.

The working group concluded that it is not possible to say whether or to what extent the levels of income available to the main groups of unemployed persons do act as disincentives to seek employment. Incentive and disincentive relate to personal attitudes as much as—and perhaps even more than—to money. Research being carried out for my Department indicates clearly to me that unemployed men and women want to work and that there is little or no evidence that most of the unemployed see their situation as a tenable or lasting way of life, despite improved benefits. This is exactly what any reasonable person would expect.

I must reiterate my view that certain critical attitudes of some workers worried about their own jobs, and of opponents of the social welfare and other social services, are a reflection more of the psychology of recession than of the facts of the situation. The working group were of the view that the basic objective of the pay-related benefit scheme to which I have referred—to ensure that workers do not suffer a serious drop in disposable income on becoming unemployed—is being achieved even without the intervention of the other available scheme.

The study carried out revealed the existence of certain definite anomalies in the concurrent working of a number of schemes and the logical recommendation was made that there should be a rationalisation based upon the establishment of a unified wage-stop. This will now be introduced under the terms of the budget announcement.

The new approach will be brought into effect by appropriate regulations which will be made shortly. However, in general, the procedure will be along the following lines. When a worker becomes unemployed, his or her average net weekly income prior to unemployment will be calculated on the basis of the income tax cessation certificate with appropriate deductions for tax and social insurance contributions. A figure equivalent to 85 per cent of this average will then become the wage-stop level.

The flat-rate unemployment benefit, pay-related benefit and redundancy weekly payments where applicable will be calculated in the normal way. Where the total of these payments exceeds the maximum permissible income the total payable will be reduced accordingly. Where, however, the person concerned is entitled only to flat-rate unemployment benefit no reduction in this amount would be made. If the person concerned is entitled to a rebate of income tax an appropriate reduction in his total payments will, if this is necessary, be made to keep him within the maximum laid down. His position will have to be further reviewed on cessation of the tax rebates.

Subject to the other conditions provided for, the maximum weekly amount of benefit payable by way of flat-rate unemployment benefit, pay-related benefit and weekly redundancy payments to a person who is eligible for weekly redundancy payments would then be £50. An example of the working of the new scheme could be given in the following terms.

Under the present arrangements pay-related benefit payable to a person currently becoming unemployed is based on his earnings in the 1974-75 income tax year. If we take the case of a married man with a wife and two children who earned £2,500 in 1974-75, his reckonable weekly earnings are £50. Under the present system his total benefit made up of flat and pay-related cannot exceed £50 which represents the "wage-stop" at 100 per cent. In fact, his flat-rate benefit would amount to £21.95 and his pay-related to £14.40 making a total of £36.35, leaving him well inside the "wage-stop".

Under the proposed scheme this man's "wage-stop" level would be 85 per cent of net current pay, that is, after deduction of income tax and his share of the social insurance contribution. Allowing for wage increases over the past 18 months, his current gross weekly earnings would be about £70. After deduction of income tax and social welfare contributions his net pay would be £54.55; 85 per cent of this is £46.40 and this is his "wage-stop" level under the new scheme. Accordingly, in this man's case the application of the new scheme would make no difference. He would still receive the same amount of flat-rate and pay-related benefit as under the present scheme. If this man was entitled to a tax rebate he could get as much as £10 a week by way of such rebate before the new 85 per cent "wage-stop" would apply.

The new approach will apply only to new claims received as and from an appointed day. It will do away with an anomaly which has arisen in a large part due to the operation of a number of relatively new schemes. I have repeatedly made clear the need for review of such schemes to ensure their proper working. It does not result from a widespread abuse and certainly does not represent a general level of benefits which is destroying the will and the incentive to find work. An adjustment was necessary and it is being made.

Much—indeed most—of the public criticism of the pay-related benefit system has been ill-informed, crude and confused. It has come from persons and groups who have shown little or no concern for the poor, or for the unemployed. I continue to be contemptuous of critics who have never faced—and who will never face —unemployment and its attendant stresses and strains. My job is to make provision for those who have and it is my concern to ensure that this is done.

The purpose of pay-related benefit is to improve on the position under the old flat-rate system by relating both benefit and contributions to earnings to some degree and to provide rates of benefit which will better enable persons to maintain, during sickness and unemployment, a standard of living reasonably close to that to which they have been accustomed. I have given it as my opinion—based on my assessment of its working over a year and a half—that the system has achieved that purpose.

I come now to the question of the increase in the rates of social insurance contributions which cover all benefits of the social insurance system. The increase in the contribution this year must provide for the appropriate share of the increases in benefits and pensions provided for in the Bill and for the general improvements to be made in the social insurance scheme. It must also include an element for the part financing of the extension of the unemployment benefit scheme for a further three months to which I have already referred.

Provision must also be made for the increases in contributions arising from the decision announced in the budget statement to transfer £8 million of charges from the Exchequer subsidy to the social insurance stamp as part of a phased reduction of the Exchequer contribution. The overall increase, in the case of contributions which count for all benefits involved is £1.53, of which the employer will pay £1.03 and the employee £0.50. Lesser increases will apply where the rates of contribution do not cover all social insurance benefits. The same section of the Bill provides also for the continuation this year of the special increase of 31p made in the Social Welfare Act, 1975, to meet the financial implications of the current abnormal unemployment situation.

The ordinary rates of contribution covering the social insurance services administered by my Department, including the increase of £1.53 and the special unemployment increase of 31p, will thus rise to £5.64 a week for men, of which the employer will pay £3.50 and the employee £2.14. For women, the new ordinary rate will be £5.56, of which the employer will pay £3.48 and the employee £2.08.

The rates of voluntary contribution will be correspondingly raised to £1.10 a week at the low rate and £2.83 a week at the high rate. Section 15 of the Bill provides for an increase of 39p to £1.73 in the new rate of voluntary contribution introduced in the Social Welfare Act, 1975, to cover the situation of a certain category of insured persons affected by the abolition from April, 1974, of the remuneration limit for the insurability of non-manual workers. Contributions payable in respect of occupational injuries insurance are to be increased by 2p a week to 14p for a male employee, and 11p for a woman—all borne by the employer. All of these new rates of contribution will be effective from Monday, 5th April, 1976.

The practical effect of these financing proposals is to continue the recent trend which has shifted the balance as between the Exchequer grant to the social insurance fund and the direct social insurance contributions. Both in relation to the social insurance fund itself and in relation to overall social welfare expenditure under insurance and assistance categories, the Exchequer share has been reduced over the past few years.

The financing of social welfare expenditure, and indeed of the social services as a whole, is a matter which gives rise to a great deal of comment and concern, in particular at a time of economic stringency such as we are now experiencing. It is my belief that a very significant change in the basis of financing social welfare expenditure is needed and the special working party established last year by the Minister is engaged in the preparation of recommendations for such a change.

This is, of course, an area of some complexity and one which calls for a lot of detailed research and analysis. Until such changes can be introduced as a permanent feature of the social welfare system the present unsatisfactory and, indeed, regressive system of flat-rate contribution must continue. I am aware that the burden of this particular form of taxation falls especially severely upon lower paid workers, and especially on many women workers, and that it can create difficulties for some firms.

The working party on financing will, of course, take into account the developments in social security policy which are taking place at the EEC level and will seek to produce a system which will be, at once, in line with general, progressive European practice, and appropriate to our particular circumstances. Ireland is in a very different position demographically, in terms of industrial employment pattern, and in terms of relative economic development to many of the more advanced countries with which comparisons are too often glibly made.

The Bill contains one or two reform measures which have been designed to deal with gaps or anomalies in the existing legislation.

There is provision for the payment of a benefit, at a rate equal to the contributory widow's pension, to a widower whose wife, immediately prior to her death, had been in receipt of a retirement pension which included an increase in respect of him because he was wholly or mainly maintained by her because of his physical or mental infirmity. This will bring the retirement pension scheme into line with the contributory old age pension scheme.

Section 18 deals with the payment of child dependant allowances to recipients of contributory widow's pensions. At present, these allowances are payable in respect of children who normally resided with the widow or the late husband prior to the date of the husband's death and, also, in respect of the children, grandchildren or step-children of the widow or of her late husband, or adopted children, who came to reside with the widow after her husband's death. The Bill provides for payment of allowances in respect of all qualified children normally residing with the widow, regardless of the date on which they became normally resident with her. A similar provision is being made in respect of the scheme of non-contributory widow's pensions.

I began these remarks by referring to the general economic situation and to its impact on social welfare policy and performance. Perhaps no Department of State is more aware of the importance of economic growth and of overall national development than the Department of Social Welfare. My Department find themselves faced with the task of providing a part of the response to the problems created by the ups and downs of the economy, whether because of unemployment, or low pay or poverty. Deprivation and financial need are caused by the failures of our economic system to a large degree and in a society with any claim to be caring or compassionate there must be an immediate response to such problems designed to alleviate their impact on individuals and families. This is the first rule of the social welfare system and I believe that it is my responsibility to work for the highest possible level of development and perfection of that system.

I recognise that the Bill now before the House reflects the impact of the current economic situation. However, by far the most important consideration is that the progress made to date in improving the level of payments should be maintained. This has been done.

There is a great deal of discussion on social welfare policy at present and, in general, I welcome this. It is essential that the development of our policies and programmes in this area —which is of direct concern to so many of our fellow-citizens who are deprived in one way or another—should be the subject of debate and, indeed, of critical assessment. At budget time and at the time of the introduction of the Social Welfare Bill, this aspect of public policy becomes of even greater interest because of the cost to the community involved in maintaining even our present standards of provision.

I deplore, however, the tendency of some people to distort what is being attempted and what is being done. First, I regret the inaccuracy of much comment. For example, to suggest that social welfare has been cut back in this budget is totally incorrect. Also, to speak or write as if social welfare were just about unemployment benefit and assistance—and pay-related benefit—is to mis-state the true position.

Let me repeat that unemployment benefit, pay-related benefit and unemployment assistance together will account—even in this year of continuing high unemployment levels—for only 24 per cent of total social welfare outlay. By far the largest share of the money spent—£180 million or 45 per cent of the total—will go on pensions of all kinds.

My major concern about the present criticism of the social welfare system is that it can lead—often on the basis of quite inaccurate statements—to very negative public attitudes to social welfare as a whole and to the need for further improvements in the system. Such criticism, and such attitudes, can do a great disservice to our less well-off fellow citizens.

I have absolutely no illusions about the size of the problem facing a country like Ireland, with serious economic difficulties and with pressing social needs, when attempting to provide adequately for the old, the sick, the unemployed and the deprived. Despite the very real advances which we have been able to make in recent years, and despite the great measure of expansion of our social welfare schemes which has been possible, the task remaining is a major challenge to us all.

In facing up to that challenge it is essential that we get our facts right and that we assess the situation objectively and honestly. I believe that the truth of the position in relation to social welfare policy is that success in tackling our social problems depends upon our success in evolving and implementing a total national strategy for development in all sectors—economic, social, cultural and political.

I now recommend this Bill to Dáil Éireann for speedy and favourable consideration.

I can assure the Parliamentary Secretary that this Bill will receive reasonably expeditious consideration. The problem we find about the way the Bill came before the House was the lack of notice we received about the matter. We received the Bill yesterday morning and we were told—we were not asked— that it was coming before the House today. We assumed it would be taken this morning but the previous Bill held up the business of the House, as it was entitled to do, until just before Question Time.

Deputies should have more time to study Bills of this nature. In this instance the Bill is very important. The first inkling we got of the extension of the pay-related scheme was in the Bill itself. The Fianna Fáil Parliamentary Party had a meeting yesterday morning and we had an opportunity to discuss the Bill in a full and frank fashion. If we had not that meeting yesterday I would have come here without having discussed the Bill with the full parliamentary party, which would have been an unfortunate situation. To be presented with a Bill the day before it comes before the House is not the proper way to deal with the Dáil in the first place and with the Opposition in the second place.

Some of the provisions of this Bill will come into effect on 2nd April and others on 5th April. We recognise there is a need for this measure and it will not be the Opposition's intention to hold up its implementation. Quite the contrary is the case. However, it is now Thursday afternoon and I hope the Parliamentary Secretary does not think he will have the Bill in its totality today or even Second Stage today. There are other Deputies on both sides of the House who will have a point of view to put on a Bill of this nature. The Department of Social Welfare affects the structure and fabric of our society.

Despite what scribes and others may think, public representatives have a certain dedication to the problems of the people. Most, if not all, are there for the benefit of the people rather than for their own benefit. This type of legislation goes to the heart of our society. It affects almost 900,000 people directly or indirectly. It must have a tremendous impact on legislators. The Parliamentary Secretary will appreciate that members of my party wish to express a point of view on the measures before us and the only opportunity they have in that respect is on Second Stage.

It does not surprise us that we get a Bill the day before it is put on the table of the House; it is common case now. It is the way the Government order their business and show their lack of appreciation and sensitivity for the other man's point of view. I am not blaming the Parliamentary Secretary for this; it is not his problem; it is the manner in which the business of the House is ordered. If that business is ordered in the fashion in which this Bill was ordered——

I am reluctant to interrupt the Deputy but I have allowed him to continue for some time on that theme. This Bill is before the House with the agreement of the Opposition.

The Bill before the House came into the hands of the Opposition yesterday morning.

The Bill was circulated on Tuesday evening and was delivered to Deputies in the normal post yesterday morning. The matter was raised on the Order of Business yesterday morning when it was pointed out that the only reason I wanted the Bill dealt with today was to ensure the maximum time possible for the Opposition to discuss it. The Bill is before the House not by the insistence of the Government but by normal agreement with the Opposition.

That was not my interpretation of the agreement. Obviously, the Parliamentary Secretary has information available to him which I do not have. I accept what he has said.

Once more, in fairness to the Parliamentary Secretary, he indicated his concern for the plight of the unemployed, widows, deserted wives and the broad spectrum of the social welfare structure. The Parliamentary Secretary is a man concerned and a man caring. However, he is subject to the availability of money to implement all the schemes. It is a matter for the Government to give him the money for these schemes and he does not have direct access to Cabinet meetings. The money he gets to implement social welfare schemes comes directly from the Exchequer and the availability of so much cash depends on how the Government are dealing with the country at a given time. That is the real problem the Parliamentary Secretary faces.

The main purpose of the Bill is to give effect to the 10 per cent increase in the rate of payment and the other changes in the schemes of social assistance and social insurance as announced in the January budget. I wonder whether the Parliamentary Secretary is satisfied that a 10 per cent all-round increase measures up to the savagery of inflation and the rate of inflation we are faced with. It appears that the Government are powerless, and leaderless, in the face of inflation and price rises. The newspapers daily give us bad news. It is not the fault of the newspapers that they continue to give us such bad news; they must report the news as they find it. If people find themselves out of work the newspapers cannot report a tale of joy; they must report the loss of jobs.

In today's issue of The Irish Times under the heading: “7.1% rise in prices in 3 months” the Economics Correspondent reports:

Prices in Ireland are again beginning to rise rapidly. In the three months to February, prices rose by 7.1 per cent, according to a survey of the Irish cost of living carried out recently by a British group, Regional Surveys. The rate of inflation in the three months to February would suggest an annual rate of price increase in excess of 28 per cent.

While I agree that the Parliamentary Secretary was not breast-beating about the great man he was on this occasion, but with a price rise in excess of 28 per cent a 10 per cent increase as envisaged in this Bill is derisory to say the least of it. The article in The Irish Times continues:

The survey also points out that average consumer prices in Ireland are now some 6 per cent higher than in Britain. However, the effect of cheaper housing, together with a lower burden on incomes to £5,000 makes it cheaper for a family of four to live in this country. Those who have incomes in excess of £5,000 would be better off economically if they lived in Britain.

I am glad that correspondent stressed the word, "economically". That is the only way they would be better off. The article continued:

A spokesman for Regional Surveys said yesterday that consumer prices in Ireland would rise more rapidly from now on, as the effects of the subsidies introduced in last June's supplementary budget begin to wear off.

That was an independent survey and it is bad news by any standards. It must be seen in the context of the Bill which gives the "huge" increases promised by the Government. In another part of that paper there is a heading: "£ hits new low" and another: "Building industry job fears". The story under the latter heading tells us that the volume of output in the building and construction sector could fall by a further 4 per cent to 5 per cent during 1976, according to the director of the Building Materials Federation which is attached to the Confederation of Irish Industry. That story stated that the public capital programme for this year had been given no impetus to stimulating recovery in the building and construction sector. Also on the front page of that newspaper there is the heading: "30% cost rise for private patients". About 500,000 people are affected by that. They are private patients, they are not socialists, smoked salmon or otherwise. As Irish citizens——

The Deputy could get objections from the NUJ.

The Deputy sounds like the fellow who reads "It Says in the Papers" after the eight o'clock news.

If it ever happens that I am beaten at the polls I could always apply for the job. I have obviously impressed the Parliamentary Secretary by the effect of my reading, without even turning to the inside of the papers as this decent gentleman does in this programme after the eight o'clock and nine o'clock news. I do not want to turn to the inside of the paper because I do not want to add to the tale of woe.

If the Deputy turns to the inside pages he will see the Bill referred to and the extent and eligibility of people.

We are going to deal with all that. This is only an aside.

The Government have a great capacity for telling the country what they have done in the field of social welfare. While there are schemes initiated and programmes being set up and functioning, poverty continues to exist. There is a real poverty being created by this Government. I basically agree with the Parliamentary Secretary's well-reasoned views on the question of the extension of and the philosophy behind the pay-related scheme. However, the House may agree that this further extension of the pay-related scheme is an indictment on the Government's incapacity and unwillingness to provide employment.

Okay. The Government have created unemployment. We are leaderless as far as the economy is concerned. Unemployment and inflation are not being tackled. These are matters of record and fact. A feeling of hopelessness pervades this area with which the Parliamentary Secretary in particular and the Minister for Labour are charged. I know certain individuals on the pay-related benefits scheme who are benefiting by it would prefer the dignity of work rather than the indignity of unemployment and of queuing outside shabby labour exchanges for the State to provide them with what can only be described as subsistence during their period of unemployment.

Fianna Fáil introduced the pay-related scheme. We accept that we were the authors of it. However, our philosophy has been, is, and will always be that the less well-off sections of the community should be provided for. On the considerations of the introduction of the scheme we felt that in relation to the other entitlements of people during their period of unemployment, they should be in addition, given further cushioning against temporary unemployment. When Fianna Fáil began this scheme there was reasonably full employment. The scheme was intended to carry individuals who were out of work from one job to the other. It was not envisaged originally as a permanent feature. We ask that the Parliamentary Secretary extend his thinking a little bit more and tell us if the pay-related scheme is to become a permanent feature of social welfare benefit. What is the policy in relation to the scheme? Will the Parliamentary Secretary come back in three months to look for another extension? These are important questions.

I have explained basically the Fianna Fáil philosophy behind the scheme. It was a scheme brought in to cushion men between jobs where there was job availability. There is not job availability at the moment nor any prospect of such. It is an appalling position to be in. It is not the intention of the Opposition to attempt to exacerbate the situation, quite the contrary. The spokesman on Finance has been more than responsible in relation to his duty to the nation in the context of the present economic tragedy.

In spite of the price rises and so on the Government are calling for wage restraint and pay pauses and pay pacts. While Fianna Fáil are in favour of wage restraint in the current economic climate, it must be extremely difficult for those people who are being asked for restraint, and being asked to do so by a Government who do not know the meaning of the word "restraint". If somebody is asked to do something the person being asked hopes and expects that the person who is asking would have certain standards. The Government are now operating with a permanent mentality of economic siege. No later than the day before yesterday we had in Dublin County Council, with the compliments of the Minister for Local Government, huge chunks of money being taken off various schemes, again to the detriment of those people who would be operating those schemes within the Dublin County Council. It is appalling. People as of right and as citizens of this country are entitled to employment. The only people who can provide that are the Government by virtue of whatever economic strategy they have worked out. It appears clear that they do not have an economic strategy.

They have not even got tactics.

The Deputy is good on tactics.

No later than last week we had the Parliamentary Secretary himself, "Corish's call backed by Cluskey", and I have described the Minister, Deputy Corish's call for an economic plan as his Portrane policy. I am quite sure the local Labour branch had at least a handful of members when the Minister condemned all entrepreneurs and capitalists out of hand and lauded a socialist society. The Parliamentary Secretary blandly supports the Minister's call and one can only hope that the Leader of the Government knew about the Minister's intention to call for an economic and social plan. The Parliamentary Secretary is reported in The Irish Times for 5th March as follows:

The call for an economic and social plan made last week by the Tánaiste, Mr. Corish, was supported last night by his Parliamentary Secretary for Social Welfare, Mr. Cluskey.

Unemployment was our most important economic and social problem and could only be met by radical thinking and radical policies, Mr. Cluskey told a meeting of the Labour Party in Dún Laoghaire.

"The time has come—in the face of this crisis of unemployment— for some very straight thinking and for some very straight talking by the Labour Party" he declared, according to a supplied script.

"We know from our experience in the last three years both the opportunities and also the difficulties of putting our principles into practice. With this knowledge as a guide, and with the realisation that the present difficulties of our country call for the solution which we in the Labour Party alone offer, we must now move to make a decisive and positive contribution to national policy."

A number of points arise from that, the first being that the Labour Party alone have the solution to the exclusion of their Coalition partner. All I can say is it is about time they made a decisive and positive contribution to national policy because the Fine Gael Party have made no contribution whatever to an economic and social plan. For three years we have been calling for an economic plan and so have many spokesmen on economic affairs and now the Parliamentary Secretary has decided that it is time the Labour Party made a positive contribution to national policy. The Irish Times goes on:

Mr. Cluskey emphasised that the basic position of the Labour Party was that burdens and the efforts which would be called for must be borne by all in accordance with their capacity to do so. For the period ahead the whole community must be asked to work together towards a common objective which could be seen to be, and accepted as being, for the long-term benefit of all.

That was a very praiseworthy call by the Parliamentary Secretary in the context of his Social Welfare brief but the way to achieve objectives is not by leaving the people leaderless and there is no real leadership in the country today. If people are to be asked to work towards a common objective, first of all the objective must be spelled out to them by a leader. The report of the Parliamentary Secretary's speech continued:

That kind of discipline and shared effort in the community will be forthcoming only if, within a coherent plan, the way forward is indicated to concrete and lasting social, economic and community progress. In the context of such a plan it will be possible for everyone to accept discipline and constraints and therefore, to contribute fully in the knowledge that real advantages will be forthcoming.

Presumably a Labour Party plan only. The report continues:

Mr. Cluskey added that he believed the desired goal of full employment could not be attained unless our plans and programmes were designed to deal with injustices and anomalies in our social, legal and administrative system.

We are now told by the Labour branch of the Coalition that the country is in need of a social and economic plan. I expect the Taoiseach has listened to his Deputies calling for such a plan and that all going well for the Coalition, there will not be a general election——

The Deputy is getting away from the Bill.

It was very decent of me to take the trouble on 5th March to make the speech that Deputy Andrews is delivering on the 11th.

There is another feature of the current unemployment situation which is being glossed over in a rather crude fashion by the Government. It is the whole question of young people in our society. We know the Government's attitude to equal pay so it is consistent that they would decide that the 18 year old girl does not have the same right to employment as the 18 year old boy. It is also consistent that they discriminate against women in employment just as they have been doing against unemployed women.

Could the Parliamentary Secretary direct his energies in the next three to six months to provide a scheme by which young people might become involved in community effort, some scheme which will give those young people hope, because the Parliamentary Secretary will be aware that idleness may have a very dangerous effect on young people? It will no doubt introduce elements of cyncism and frustration and related feelings which unemployment gives rise to particularly in the minds of the young. If we want democracy to survive and flourish and if our democratic institutions are not to be brought under attack then we must provide work for our young people. They can justifiably ask: "Why will you not provide us with work? Is there any hope of work in the next 12 months?"

Who can blame them for taking the emigrant ship? Our people want work. The Parliamentary Secretary said there is some fashionable point of view that people want to malinger. I accept there are abuses of the social welfare system and the Parliamentary Secretary has figures to prove it. Daily he must get evidence of abuses of the various schemes but I do not think he can blame all society because of a few malingerers. It has been said there are people on the dole who are doing "nixers" at the same time and the Parliamentary Secretary well knows there are such people. Are we to damn the whole system because of the few? Quite the contrary. The Parliamentary Secretary's function in relation to abuses is to root them out and make sure they do not happen again.

It is as well to remind those people who abuse the social welfare structure that the people who are being deprived are the less well-off section of the community. If more money were available to the people at the end of the social welfare scale, the standards could be uplifted in some fashion. Abusing the welfare system is sheer robbery. The Parliamentary Secretary must agree with me on this. If we are concerned about the less well-off sections of the community, as I believe we are, then it is as well to remind these people that they are committing an offence against the laws of the State, but more particularly against their fellow citizens; against the widow living on her own; against the deserted wife; against the old age pensioners—non-contributory in the main—against the lonely, the sick, the indigent. These are the people against whom these offences are being committed by those who abuse the system.

When he is replying to the curtailed debate on the Bill before us, would the Parliamentary Secretary give us a general treatise on the general abuses, and the number of prosecutions he, by definition, must bring if he is doing his job properly, and I believe he is, within the limits of the resources made available to him by the Government's mishandling of the economy. No doubt the Parliamentary Secretary will answer these questions honestly and factually, and must agree with my views on those people who abuse the social welfare system. We are a small enough nation, and to have the system abused by the few to the detriment of many is an appalling prospect. Let us not pretend that it does not exist. Those people who boast about getting away with it—and there are a few of them about—have nothing but the contempt of the community. They might as well be putting their hands into the handbag of some old widow who is living on her own.

To return to the question of the unemployed young person and the serious effects that will have on the future of the country, apart from the fact that the young person may emigrate—and if he or she does not emigrate, may take the view that the institutions of the State are not worth supporting on the basis that those institutions will not support him or her —this is the really urgent plan I would ask the Parliamentary Secretary to look at and to examine, the possibility of getting one of the committees within his Department to help—and he has a few reasonably good committees. If these committees are not capable of implementing some sort of community youth plan, would the Parliamentary Secretary set up a committee of five or six people and involve young people on the committee to get their views and in some way produce a plan as a matter of urgency, say, within three months? He will have had time enough to study the real problem within that time, and within another period of two or three months he should have these people working. The community plan has been articulated on many occasions by the leader of our party, Deputy Lynch. Deputy Lynch stated in his address to the most successful of successful Fianna Fáil Ard-Fheiseanna at the RDS on the 14th February, 1976:

Take our young people leaving school and college. Why should they bear the brunt of the economic crisis and be demoralised by the lack of job opportunities? We suggested setting aside a sum of £5 to £10 million to set young people to work on projects for community improvements in their own areas. We had in mind a minimum of red tape, with young people using their skills and knowledge in association with voluntary bodies and community leaders to plan and provide these badly needed projects.

The Chair does not want to interrupt the Deputy at this stage, but he seems to be getting away from the Bill which is before the House.

We are proposing solutions to the problems——

Under the law passed by the Oireachtas I have no function in the creation of employment. It is a matter for other Departments.

If the Parliamentary Secretary would listen to the solutions proposed by the Opposition, I assure him that he would not have to be dealing with as many unemployed persons as he is dealing with at present in the context of State assistance. If I may just conclude with Deputy Lynch's very worth-while contribution on this area of unemployment and the reinvolvement of young people in society:

In this way thousands of young people could be employed and would be given the chance to do something valuable and worth while, while we of the older generation, would be showing them in a practical way that we do care for them and do want to see their energies and enthusiasms put to work in the service of the people.

That is a positive contribution by the leader of the Fianna Fáil Party to a real problem which besets this community, a community with unemployed young people, apart from our older citizens who are also entitled to work. It is a sick society, particularly in relation to our young people. If the plan as envisaged by the Leader of the Opposition were implemented the Government would have not less than 3,000 or 4,000 people off the unemployment register.

The Chair asks the Deputy to keep to the Bill.

That is what I am doing. I am keeping very much to the Bill. This Bill presents a golden opportunity to offer solutions to a Government who do not appear to have any solutions to their problems at all. If we offer these positive answers to various problems it is not unreasonable that we, as an Opposition, will not get the benefit of them, but by offering solutions we will in some way be helping the nation, as any responsible Opposition must do in a situation of Coalition-created crisis.

Another feature of the Bill is section 13. It is an unlucky number for employers and employees alike. I consider it a direct and violent attack on the jobs of the people. Somebody —this is not my original thinking— described it as an employment tax. The so-called socialist element in the present Government would appear to have affected their conservative colleagues in the Fine Gael Party with their syndrome that the harder one works the more one has to pay in taxes. This increased contribution will have a disincentive effect. It is a direct tax on the work rate of men and women and on those who provide employment. It is a penal tax, neither more nor less, and it is as well to read that into the record.

Section 13 provides the new rates of employment contributions. These increases are required to meet the employers and insured persons part of the allowances payable under the social insurance scheme:

Provision must also be made for the increases in contributions arising from the decision announced in the budget statement to transfer £8 million of charges from the Exchequer subsidy to the social insurance stamp as part of a phased reduction of the Exchequer contribution.

I shall come back to this again.

The overall increase in the case of contributions which count for all benefits involved is £1.53, of which the employer will pay £1.03 and the employee £0.50. Lesser increases will apply where the rates of contribution do not cover all social insurance benefits.

This section also provides for continuing for a further year the provision made in the Social Welfare Act, 1975, for a special contribution increase of 31p to help meet the expenditure arising from the extended unemployment situation. The Government create unemployment and then ask others to pay for their creature. Employers will pay 21p and employees 10p.

We come then to the ordinary scales. The present rate for the employer for a male employee is £2.47 while the employee pays £1.64, giving a total of £4.11. The proposed new rate is £3.50 for the employer and £2.14 for the employee, giving a total of £5.64 as compared with £4.11. The woman employee is no better off. The present rate for the employer is £2.45 and for the employee £1.58, giving a total of £4.03. The proposed new rate is £3.48 for the employer and £2.08 for the employee, giving a total of £5.56. The woman in the context of employment contribution is eight pence better off than her male counterpart. I expect this is some sort of sop or benediction to the position of women in our society. If you do not recognise women as existing in the context of unemployment at 18 years of age when they get a job you reduce the combined employment contribution by eight pence. This is a recognition by the Government that the woman is not the equal of the man. Of course she is and she has a right to equal pay for work of equal value. The thinking which pervades the Labour Party is crystal clear in this section 13, the bad news section, the unlucky section. The harder people work, the more you grind them down under taxes and the more they should be asked to pay.

I understood that the special contribution increase of 31p announced in the 1975 Social Welfare Act was to be abandoned on this occasion. That was the undertaking given at the time. It was to be a temporary measure. Of course, we were also told unemployment would be a temporary condition, but it goes on and on with all its tragic consequences. The question is from where will the money come for the social welfare pay out. We were told last Tuesday by the Minister for Finance that on 31st December, 1975, the national debt had risen to £2,600 million. On 31st March, 1973, the national debt stood at £1,431 million. By continuous borrowing the Government have doubled the national debt from 31st March, 1973, to 31st March, 1975. It is an appalling prospect. This money will have to be repaid but it certainly will not be repaid in an era of quite appalling unemployment.

There is another matter the Parliamentary Secretary must consider. This 10 per cent average increase should be reviewed again, as it was last year. Is it the intention of the Parliamentary Secretary to review the situation in the light of the figures I have read out with price increases in the coming year in excess of 28 per cent? It is an appalling prospect. To give an increase of 50p in social welfare benefit if it were not so serious would be laughable, but it is extremely serious for those people who are most in need of protection.

On the Supplementary Estimate for Social Welfare, 1975, we had a full discussion on poverty and what gives rise to poverty and the people most affected by it. We decided generally that poverty does not necessarily relate to lack of capital or lack of cash, that there was another ingredient which must be taken into account when one discusses people's conditions under the heading of poverty. The Parliamentary Secretary stated at that time that he was setting up poverty projects. Would the Parliamentary Secretary be good enough to tell us what progress has been made in relation to these matters?

The reduction of the pensionable age on this occasion appears to have escaped the memory of the Parliamentary Secretary. Certainly I cannot find a reference to it. As I understood it, the pensionable age was to be reduced annually, according to the 14-point programme articulated by the Government prior to the last election. Of course we are not meant to mention this; it is probably an abuse of the privileges of the House to mention that the Government are in dereliction of their promises in this respect.

We are not supposed to criticise them.

The Opposition are supposed to criticise them, but on a factual basis. That is what presents the problem.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary saying the pensionable age has been reduced this year?

No. What I am saying is that there was no commitment in the 14-point programme to reduce it annually.

The Parliamentary Secretary has obviously got the programme and censored it, because the programme I have—I must look for it somewhere——

I am sure the Deputy has it framed.

I had it framed but somebody took it as a keepsake. It is certainly not in this speech.

It is not going down this year.

The Parliamentary Secretary has a well-prepared brief here and there are 24 pages in it. There is not one mention there of a reduction of the pensionable age.

Is the Deputy sure of that?

I am almost certain, but when I go home this evening I will study it in greater depth and I will come back and apologise to the Parliamentary Secretary if there is a mention of it in his brief.

The Deputies are like Morecambe and Wise.

It is there somewhere, according to the Parliamentary Secretary, but I cannot see it. The Parliamentary Secretary in his statement on the Supplementary Estimate on Social Welfare stated in regard to poverty and redistribution:

Social welfare provision can always and too easily be reduced to merely coping with the effect of need and deprivation. It must be recognised that in so far as poverty in our society is self-perpetuating— and it does appear to be so—then proportionately more national resources will have to be made available if society wills to end this situation. Social policies will have to be more rather than less distributive in their impact, and they will have to take effect at a rate which will ensure a proper sharing out of the increased resources of the nation. That is the challenge which faces us if we are serious about combating poverty.

Quite clearly the Government are not serious about the intent here expressed honestly and no doubt sincerely by the Parliamentary Secretary. What we have done in this Social Welfare Bill effectively is a minimal, mechanical readjustment of certain social welfare entitlements, and that is the size of it.

The Parliamentary Secretary undoubtedly came into the Department in a reforming mood, absolutely confident that he could restructure all the various schemes in this well-presented booklet. Now he comes back rather quietly to the Dáil and presents us with a Bill which mechanically readjusts upwards the social welfare entitlement. But how far upwards? That is the question those people in receipt of the pension and the various other entitlements will be asking themselves when the increased benefits become operative. One can only describe the increases as a pittance and paltry in their effect having regard to inflation.

The increases being sought are being paid for by those people who are lucky to have jobs. Let us be fair to the people. We have a tremendous social conscience and the vast majority of the people are willing to pay their fair share in taxes to ensure that their less well-off brothers and sisters are not to be deprived. However, the people also look for fair play and to be treated properly. What is happening here is that the middle income group, and the lower income group to a lesser extent, are being crucified by the Government. They have taken the joy out of motoring. They have taken the joy out of the pint of stout, to the point where now the publican is going on short time and many of his staff are working shorter hours.

Debate adjourned.
The Dáil adjourned at 5 p.m. until 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 23rd March, 1976.
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