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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 30 Nov 1977

Vol. 302 No. 3

Finance (Excise Duty on Tobacco Products) Bill, 1977: Second Stage.

I move: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

The purpose of this Bill is to meet Ireland's obligation, as a member of the European Communities, to introduce with effect from 1st January, 1978, the Community system of levying excise duty on cigarettes. The Community system was introduced in 1973 in all member states except this country and Britain who during the accession negotiations were given until 1st January, 1978, to change from their traditional system. This postponement was allowed because of what was involved in changing to the Community system. Both countries have been taxing by weight of the raw tobacco, whereas the Community system involves charging on the manufactured cigarettes an excise duty which combines a specific element calculated at a flat-rate per cigarette, and, secondly, with an ad valorem element proportionate to the retail price of the product.

Each member state is free to decide, within upper and lower limits, the precise combination of flat-rate and of proportional duty it will apply. It is, of course, free to determine the actual rates under each of these elements. The Community, however, aims at progressively narrowing the gap between the upper and lower limits so as to achieve, in the interest of facilitating trade within the Community, a larger degree of harmonisation of the structure and basis of charge to the duty in all member states. The first stage of harmonisation which commenced in 1973 provided upper and lower limits on the specific element to be applied by the member states of 75 per cent and 5 per cent of total excise duty. Discussions are at present proceeding with a view to setting narrower limits for the second stage which will probably commence in July next year.

The structural change required to comply with EEC obligations will of itself change the relative impact of taxation in Ireland on different sizes and qualities of cigarettes and so will affect to some extent the market pattern and consumer choices. The flat-rate element in the Community system, because it is the same on all cigarettes, has the effect of narrowing the spread of cigarette retail prices, while the ad valorem element increases with higher prices and consequently facilitates a wider retail price spread. For the reasons I will now indicate, we will be applying a relatively high flat-rate element and this will result in a narrower price spread on our market.

In implementing this new excise duty system, it is necessary to achieve a combination of the tax elements which will meet the interests not only of revenue, but also take account of the position of the Irish industry. The Irish tobacco manufacturing industry, which currently employs some 2,200 people, has been influenced by the form of tobacco duty prevalent over many years. The impact of the essentially different composite taxation system required by the EEC will inevitably cause significant changes in the market pattern, and it is important that, at least in the initial stages, the resultant difficulties should not be compounded for the Irish industry by the adoption of such combination of the flat rate and proportional elements as could be prejudicial to their competitiveness. With this consideration in mind Ireland has, during the discussions in the EEC on the proposals for a second stage of tobacco tax harmonisation, indicated unwillingness to agree to any appreciable lowering of the upper limit for the percentage of total taxation to be attributed to the flat-rate element.

The precise combination of the elements will be applied here from 1st January, 1978, is at present being considered and an announcement will be made shortly. The rates for each element will be calculated in such a way as to preserve the revenue yield. Our Community obligations in regard to the structural harmonisation of excise duty on tobacco products extend only to cigarettes. However, as it would be inconvenient both to manufacturers and to the Revenue administration to maintain, in conjunction with a post-manufacture excise on cigarettes the existing pre-manufacture excise arrangements on tobacco for manufacture of other products, the Bill provides for the levying of an end-product duty, which will be proportionate to the weight, on pipe tobacco, cigars, "roll-your-own' tobacco and chewing tobacco. This change, which is essentially an administrative one, should not result in any price increases.

Deputies will notice that snuff is not included in the scope of the Bill and, accordingly, it will not be excisable with effect from 1st January, 1978. My concern in exempting snuff from duty is to protect Irish manufacturers from possible effects of the decision that, from that same date, the duty on snuff in Britain and Northern Ireland will cease. If the British decision were not reciprocated here, a large price differential would result, which would expose our manufacturers to risk.

Under the new system, excise duty will be levied at the point where the manufactured goods are invoiced to traders; at present the duty is levied on the unmanufactured tobacco leaf at the point where it leaves the bonded warehouse for the factory. Following from this change, section 3 of the Bill provides that the period of deferment allowed to manufacturers for payment of duty will run from the new point of charge of the duty, but in order to minimise the revenue shortfall over the financial year as a whole a "catch-up" mechanism will apply which curtails deferment arrangements for the final month, making due before the end of December half of the payment in respect of goods released from bond in that month.

Deputies may also be interested in the provisions of section 6 which deals with duty-paid tobacco stocks held by tobacco manufacturers on 1st January, 1978. In order to avoid double duty payment on these stocks, it is proposed that the duty charged on the stock then held be offset against the duty payments due from the manufacturer at the end of January. This will enable the new system to operate fully from 1st January, 1978, establishing a clean break from the existing system.

The provisions of the Bill are described in some detail in the accompanying explanatory memorandum. I shall be glad, however, in the course of this debate to reply to any points on which Deputies may wish to have further clarification. I commend the Bill to the House.

We accept this Bill as part of our obligations under the EEC. As the Minister said, it is a first step towards the harmonisation of duties on tobacco and the Minister is including pipe tobacco and cigars. It is important to ensure that Irish manufacturers are not exposed to outside competition which would damage their interests and interfere with their employment prospects. I understand the trade here is worth something in the region of £150 million and, as the Minister said, over 2,000 people are employed.

A matter which should be discussed between the officials of the Department of Finance and the officials of the Treasury in England is that a reasonably sizeable proportion of the cigarettes manufactured here are manufactured under licence for houses in England and become part of the British market. If the balance between the rates of ad valorem and flat rate-duty in England interferes with the competitiveness of British industry and allows imports from the mainland of Europe which would undercut British manufactured cigarettes, the effect will be felt here also. This may have an adverse effect on employment here. That is a point the Minister should watch.

The Minister said:

For the reasons I will now indicate, we will be applying a relatively high flat-rate element and this will result in a narrower price spread on our market.

This is one effort to reduce the element of competition between manufacturers throughout the Community. There are other elements which the Minister should look at also. I believe the Dutch give three months credit on duty. The last paragraphs of the Minister's speech suggest he intends to collect the duty on the last day of January for January.

Some years ago, the cheque for tobacco released from bond had to be paid to the Government before the tobacco could be released. I believe in recent times there has been some change. I am not sure what it is, but there is an element of credit. As opposed to our Dutch competitors, we are at some disadvantage. The greater proportion of the investment in tobacco is in the duty element so that a two months' differential between Dutch manufacturers and Irish manufacturers, in conjunction with a number of other elements, might put us at a disadvantage.

Our manufacturers are probably at a little disadvantage anyway, because of the fact that the quality of the tobacco smoked or consumed, whichever is the correct word, here is higher and more expensive than on the Continent. Some countries on the Continent grow their own tobacco. There are State monopolies in France and Italy at the manufacturing and retail levels, which could operate in the future to the detriment of Irish manufacturers.

It is important to ensure that the harmonisation of our laws with the EEC will not affect employment here. We all agree the most important problem we have to face is unemployment, and it is a problem which has to be faced by the whole of Europe in the years ahead. With six million people unemployed in the EEC, it will not be easy to lower that figure. Every other country will be adopting an attitude somewhat similar to ours in an effort to improve their competitiveness and open export markets which will allow them to increase the number of people in employment in their own countries. We must be watchful to ensure that what they do to increase their employment is not done at the expense of people at work here.

The levels between the two rates of tax to which the Minister referred are very important from the manufacturers' point of view. The Minister might have indicated what precisely the levels will be on 1st January. I endeavoured to find out this morning from the Taoiseach when the budget will be introduced. It will probably be at the end of January. Judging by the emphasis put on the harmful effects of smoking and drinking on health in the campaign conducted by the Government over the past month, it would seem they intend to raise the excise duty on alcohol and tobacco in the budget.

In fairness to the manufacturers who will have to cope with the situation between 1st January and the date of the budget, if these increased duties are being brought in, they should be told as soon as possible exactly on what basis they will be charged for the month of January. The Christmas tobacco trade is more than 8½ per cent of their turnover. I understand they will be paying the duty in the middle of December which should have been paid on 1st December. I am not absolutely sure of that. Is it 1st January? It is not clear from the Minister's speech exactly how this will be operated for the manufacturers.

We will be speeding up the payment period for December.

They will be paying in advance?

Not in advance. They will not be paying so far behind. For the rest of the year they will have a fairly long period.

The Minister is cutting the amount of credit they are receiving on the duty they are paying on the tobacco. Is that correct?

As I said, at the moment they pay the duty on the tobacco. Now they will not have to pay the duty until they have a manufactured product. We simply switched the point at which the duty is levied. There will be a very substantial lengthening in the period of credit for the manufacturer and, therefore, there would be a substantial once and for all fall in the Exchequer revenue which is why we are providing the "catch-up" mechanism.

A halfway house.

No. On balance, there will be some net gain for the manufacturers. We are providing a catch-up mechanism which, on balance, still may result in some shortfall to the Exchequer.

The intention is that the Government will suffer a once and for all loss, and the manufacturer will gain a fortnight's credit, or half a month depending on when he pays. He has to pay the duty when the manufactured product leaves his premises. In turn, he gives credit to the retailer which means he is out of his money for that period of time, money which he has already paid to the Government. As I pointed out earlier, in comparison with his Dutch competitor he is at a disadvantage. I am not sure what the consumer purchase of the product will be but it is probably considerably less than three months so that the Dutch manufacturer has a very favourable cash flow situation as compared with the Irish manufacturer. It is probably not a point of great significance; I am not sure how many Dutch cigarettes are sold or how many it is possible to sell in this market. The Minister will have to watch continuously to see that other Governments do not seek this method of undercutting (a) the Irish manufacturer in this market and (b) the United Kingdom manufacturer for the reasons I have explained, that we export perhaps 10 per cent of our manufactures to England. If we are undercut there, naturally the home companies of the manufacturer here will take up the slack in their own factories in England and stop the importation of cigarettes from Ireland.

Tomorrow is the first day of December and this is coming into effect on 1st January. I think at this stage the Government should know what the breakdown between the two rates of tax will be and the manufacturers and this House should be told that as soon as possible, since the Bill comes into effect in a month's time.

Our first concern should be with the interests of the people employed in the industry to ensure that any changes necessary, any harmonisation or structural changes in the taxation levying system here would not adversely affect employment in the industry. The Minister for Health and other Members of the House have spoken against the incidence of cigarette smoking. The fact is that at this time of high unemployment, changes brought about by us, especially in the taxation sphere, must be such as to maintain the employment position of the industry. Apparently, this change will alter the taxation system relatively and it is admitted that it will affect the market pattern of the industry. Perhaps he has already done so but it is necessary that the Minister should make the position clear. Obviously, there are consequences arising for the retail end of the industry from this legislation. If our first concern is the maintenance of employment I should hope that there would be full consultation with the manufacturers to ensure that the changing market pattern or any changes brought about by us as a result of our EEC obligations will not drastically affect the industry with the long-term effect of, perhaps, curtailing employment opportunities.

I should like the Minister to let us know as soon as possible what changes he proposes will be introduced from January, 1978, the precise combination of elements that will apply here. If I understand correctly, he has indicated a preference for heavier reliance on a flat rate contribution in the composition of the new tax so as to have a more uniform price structure and meet the demands of our own industry. I should like him to elaborate on this, and say if it is the reason for his seeming support for greater reliance on the flat rate in the new structure. The new obligations relate only to cigarettes and the Minister explains that it would be inconvenient to manufacturers and to the Revenue administration to confine the changes to cigarettes. Therefore, the Bill provides for the levying of an end product duty, proportionate to the weight, on pipe tobacco, cigars, roll-your-own tobacco and chewing tobacco. He does not say whether the inconvenience would be greater for the Revenue administration than the manufacturers. In fact, it would be more inconvenient for the Revenue people but I would like an assurance that the change will not result in any price increase. The Minister says this but I would like to have this assurance categorically, that it will not lead to any price increase in relation to pipe tobacco because, while the industry does not have a high employment content and the manufacturers have been maintaining for years that the industry is in decline, it has very old traditional roots in the country and I think that nothing we do here to comply with EEC regulations should be such as, perhaps, would do further damage to that old industry based in a part of the country that in the main has suffered tragic industrial loss over the last few days. I should like reassurance in that regard and in the other respects I have mentioned.

As regards making an announcement about the precise rates, I can only say at this stage that it will be made as soon as possible and I anticipate that will not be very long.

That is not very informative.

I agree, but I do not wish to indicate the precise rates at this time. I can assure the House the announcement will be made in adequate time for the industry's needs.

To take the points in reverse order, the question of the impact of retail prices because of the effect of this change over was raised. As has been indicated, on balance it will have the effect of somewhat raising the price of cheaper cigarettes and somewhat lowering the price of dearer cigarettes. Middle grade, on balance, should be unchanged. Therefore, while it is not possible to say precisely what the combined effect of all these changes will be because we do not know to what extent consumer preference will shift and consequently sales, there is no reason as of today to believe that there will be any overall, noticeable effect on revenue.

Deputy Barry spoke about the effect on imported cigarettes and so on, and the effect on our exports, primarily into Britain. Perhaps I should mention that there is a possibility of an effect on imports here also in the sense that under the present arrangement the duty it levies on leaf tobacco which has a somewhat lower moisture content than that of finished cigarettes and their tobacco products. I understand that the net effect of this would be that, since we would not be able to distinguish in future between domestically manufactured products and products from other EEC member states, or certainly, to discriminate between them. The sensible thing is to apply the same rate to both in order not to have any net effect on the Irish industry or to increase prices, there would be on balance a net reduction in the effective duty being levied on imports of tobacco products from other EEC states. I do not regard this as being a substantial effect.

In reply to Deputy O'Leary's query about whether the switchover in the arrangements for products other than cigarettes was for the convenience of the Revenue Commissioners or the convenience of the industry——

Pipe tobacco.

——the industry prefers the changeover. They would be happier to operate a single system and to have the same arrangements applied to all products. The effect of this duty credit was also raised. This is slightly more complex. I will have the Dutch situation looked at in some detail but I do not have precise information on it at the moment.

Also the French and Italian situations?

Yes. At the moment the duty becomes payable during a month but, in practice, is paid by the end of the following month. With the changeover to the new system the same time scale will operate so that the simple switch to the new system will result in a significant lengthening of credit to the manufacturer by comparison with the present system.

It should have an effect on prices.

It should tend to lower them.

Or to stabilise them.

It will put the Irish manufacturer in a stronger position to meet increased competition in home and export markets. The catchup mechanism to which I referred applies to the month of December. It will ensure that for the financial year as a whole there will be no substantial loss in revenue to the Exchequer, but in cash flow terms there is a running balance for the bulk of the financial year, which significantly benefits the industry. Even in December the catchup mechanism does not wipe out the advantage completely.

Is it an advantage to the Exchequer in the current financial year?

Since we are operating the existing system in the current financial year it has really no effect this year on the Exchequer.

It will be to December of the following year.

We are thinking in terms of December, 1978, of December, 1979. That is when the catchup mechanism will apply. For this year we deal with stocks of duty paid tobacco held by tobacco manufacturers on Ist January, 1978. In order to avoid double duty payment on these stocks it is proposed that the duty charged on stocks then held be offset against the duty payments due from the manufacturers at the end of January and since the manufacturer can offset them against these payments this should not affect this financial year.

This is a rather technical Bill. It is something we must have but it should also change the competition from advertising to price. That could be one of the beneficial effects although not from the point of view of the Department of Health but it might have that effect if the balance between the two duties was correct.

Most of us are already aware that manufacturers are advertising the price effect on the better quality cigarettes. They have already started to anticipate the changeover to the new system. The sensible thing in that area is to give the industry time to adjust. I must emphasise that arrangements were discussed with the industry and they would be happy to have the system proposed here put into operation. These arrangements can be reviewed if some unforeseen anomalies or difficulties arise.

I presume that they are happy as long as the flat rate is high enough. They would want the flat rate of tax.

I think it better that we do not start discussing the details, but on balance the answer is yes.

They will obviously be at a disadvantage if the balance between them is wrong.

I have indicated that in any movement towards the second stage of the EEC harmonisation, we are not willing to see any substantial reduction in the ceiling of the flat rate element.

Question put and agreed to.
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