asked the Minister for the Environment if it is envisaged that a fee will be charged by local planning authorities for applications for planning permission.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Planning Permission Applications.
10.
I have no proposals to amend the Planning Acts to require the lodgement of fees with applications for planning permission.
I do not wish to monopolise Question Time, but would the Minister not consider that in some areas there is a legitimate charge open to an applicant? The instance I am thinking of is one in Harcourt Terrace where there have been ten applications and ten refusals by the local authority. We are now incurring our third appeal to An Bord Pleanála and the developer in this question—a major financial institution—has not paid one penny of the administrative cost of these ten applications which have been refused. Would the Minister not consider having something equivalent to a vexatious application, which is equivalent to the provision in the 1976 Amendment Act of a vexatious appeal?
The question relates to legal costs. There is no requirement on anyone to have legal representation at an oral hearing.
(Cavan-Monaghan): There is nothing about legal matters in this question.
Perhaps I am looking at a different question. I am looking at Question No. 10.
Sorry. Yes, it has to do with legal planning authorities but not with An Bord Pleanála.
Through the Chair, the organisation, whose name is not relevant to the debate, have made ten separate applications to the planning authority as set out in this Act. The planning authority have processed the application on ten separate occasions, on each occasion saying it was in contravention of development. The cost of the administration of this processing has been carried entirely by the Minister and myself and the taxpayer. These, I would argue, are vexatious applications, as distinct from vexatious appeals, under the meaning of the 1976 Act. In the light of that application, which comes from a colleague of the Minister's own backbenches, would the Minister not consider, under the orders open to him under the 1976 Act, suggesting provision for the recognition of what I would describe as a vexatious application, which the Harcourt Street Terrace application undoubtedly is?
The Deputy is making a long drawn-out statement.
I shall have that matter checked out—if vexatious is properly defined in the Act; as far as I know, it is. How one would recognise a particular application as being vexatious is another matter. I am prepared to consider the Deputy's question, but it seems to prevent difficulties with regard to the description of vexatious.
I shall write to the Minister. This is a specific case which has arisen.
(Cavan-Monaghan): A very short question. Would the Minister not think that ten successive planning applications in respect of the same property, the first nine having been refused, are at least, an abuse of the planning procedure?
It would seem vexatious, but I have only become aware of it now. The question has nothing to do with that.
(Cavan-Monaghan): They are sometimes simultaneously submitted.
11.
asked the Minister for the Environment if he is aware that some applicants for planning permission under appeal are unable to engage legal representatives to act on their behalf at appeal hearings because of financial circumstances, if he will give financial aid to such persons and if he will make a statement on the matter.
I have received no complaints from applicants for planning permission that they have been unable to engage legal representatives for appeal hearings because of financial circumstances, and I have no proposals to give financial assistance to any such persons.
(Cavan-Monaghan): Arising out of that answer, it can happen, in some cases, that one side is represented by the best legal and specialised consultants in the country; the objectors might not be able to afford any sort of legal or professional assistance and would be at a decided disadvantage.
All oral hearings are held in a very informal way by An Bord Pleanála. It is a matter of choice with regard to the authorities concerned. Not trying to cast any aspersions on the legal profession, often a person with commonsense and no legal knowledge can explain his case just as effectively. I have seen that happen at arbitration hearings in such places. However, some people feel that they should have legal representation. There is no requirement whatsoever on them to have such representation.
(Cavan-Monaghan): I appreciate that, but would the Minister not bear in mind that this question of planning law is a highly specialised section of the law, is so recognised and was so stated not so very long ago. There are only about five or six people here really specialising in this part of the law. In those circumstances, objectors, in particular, could find themselves at a decided disadvantage or, indeed, a poor applicant for planning permission could find himself faced by a very heavy armoury of legal people in support of an objection.
That is right. It can happen. There are very many planning applications coming under the recently popular heading of planning appeals, which are vexatious and done on a kind of professional basis by certain individuals. It would not be proper for such people to have legal representations for this kind of appeal, or for an oral hearing either. Apart from the question which is down, there is no pressure for legal representation. I do not know. It may not be a good thing to have legal representation.
Arising out of what the Minister has just said, would he enlighten the House as to what particular applications or third party appeals he has been referred to recently which, in his view, would not warrant, or merit, financial or legal aid?
No. I cannot.
I can readily understand the Minister's reluctance to name someone who is considered to be exercising his democratic right. He is challenging the principle of An Bord Pleanála.
They have every right to apply, but a number of them are refused and had no merit anyway. I shall not be specific. I can assure the Deputy that the question has nothing to do with this specific issue.
In view of the fact that the concern in the question is to ensure that there is justice for people who might feel, to put it mildly, ill at ease or disadvantaged through lack of legal assistance when confronted by people who are expertly legally supported, is the Minister aware of whether or not the forthcoming civil legal aid scheme will facilitate such people, or would he make enquiries to ascertain whether such people will have access to the scheme so that they would be so represented?
I will make inquiries, but I could not answer the Deputy's question now without making inquiries.
Has the Minister been in touch with his colleague in the Department of Justice to ascertain if he would value such assistance?
I will certainly make inquiries.