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Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 11 Mar 1980

Vol. 318 No. 9

Private Members' Business. - Abolition of Home Improvement Schemes: Motion.

I move:

That Dáil Éireann deplores the decision of the Government to abolish the Home Improvement Grants Scheme and the Household Grant Scheme having regard to the need to extend the life and capacity of our national housing stock and to conserve energy and further deplores the prolonged delay in the processing of current grant applications.

I welcome the new Minister of State for the Environment, Deputy Connolly, and I commiserate with his rapid change of role, having been brought in specifically to administer a grant scheme and suddenly finding that, unique among his Government colleagues, he was redundant. The political position of the Minister of State demonstrates the absurd position in which the Government find themselves in relation to house improvement grants.

We on this side of the House have always maintained that an effective and progressive housing policy must rest as much on what it does to conserve the existing housing stock as on the promotion of additional new housing units being built in any year. This decision was taken in panic by the Government. There is no rational reason for it and one must assume that there is some residue of reason on the Government's side. It is a decision which has seriously damaged the progress of conservation and improvement which is an essential part of housing policy if we are to maintain our housing stock. In real human terms its effect has been to destroy and distort the private household budgets of numerous families, perhaps in the region of 30,000. It has had a disastrous effect on the position of the small builder employing two or three people.

We were one of the first states in Europe to devise and implement a system of home improvement grants. It has had different forms at different times. At some times the amounts were too little and at others the means test excluded too many people from the scheme. At no stage, however, was it argued that the system was ineffective or wasteful or that it did not fulfil the national need.

In two White Papers published by Fianna Fáil administrations, Housing in the Seventies and Prospects and Progress for Housing—the latter published in the sixties—there were frequent references to the very high rate of home ownership in this country in comparison with any other European country and the consequent validity of maintaining in some form a scheme of home improvement grants. That tradition goes back a long time and I will not take up the time of the House in attempting to document it historically. I will start with the last chapter in its demise—until the next election when, no doubt, it will be produced out of the hat when the manifesto mark 2 is published and there is money galore. I will start with the last described as the most important book in Ireland since the Bible.

Prescribed reading for all students of politics.

I am grateful for the corrections which school teachers voluntarily give. The manifesto stated that Fianna Fáil would improve the system of housing grants. The first instalment of Alice in Wonderland, the White Paper on National Development published in June 1977, stated that it was the Government's policy to help and encourage as many as possible to provide their own homes, with which everybody agreed. It further stated:

The new £1,000 grant for first time owner/occupiers of new houses will considerably ease the other major problems of potential house buyers, namely, the raising of a deposit.

I take it that "Alice in Wonderland" is not the name of the document. This is just for the record.

The White Paper went on to state:

The attainment of a general improvement in housing conditions depends not only on a high level of new house completions as in recent years but also on effective management of the existing stock. The Government have substantially increased reconstruction grants and loans and have also extended the range of housing eligible for such grants. This programme should ensure an improvement in the quality of the stock of existing housing as well as leading to its more effective use.

What can we presume will be the effect on housing stock of this first instalment?

The White Paper Development for Full Employment of June 1978, states as follows:

In conjunction with the steps already taken by the Government in introducing the £1,000 grant, abolising domestic rates and increasing the local authority house purchase loan limits, adoption of the suggestions listed in preceding paragraphs should contribute greatly to advancing the goal of increased owner-occupation and so of reducing the need for local authority house building.

In the third version of the approved text published in January 1979 there was another reference to the housing stock. Paragraph 5.6 states:

The maintenance of the existing housing stock in good repair is an important element of housing policy. Following the recent substantial increases in improvement grants and loans, the extension of the range of housing eligible for such grants and the derating of private houses, there has been an unprecedented increase in the number of improvements being carried out to existing dwellings. This is shown by the fact that the number of applications for improvement grants for houses at almost 35,000 in 1978 was nearly double the number in 1977. The value of grant-aided improvement work in progress has reached a record level of the order of £30 million. Since the labour content of such work is high, there have been corresponding benefits in the form of higher employment.

Not only is the housing stock seen as benefiting from the scheme but there is an employment spin-off as well.

I am at a loss to describe the last White Paper, which was published and withdrawn almost the same day. Given its unique status and the fact that it has a certain twilight quality, it is interesting to see what this White Paper had to say in relation to housing stock and housing policy generally. Presumably somebody on the Government side wrote part of it.

The Chair is always anxious that the names of documents or their date of publication should be given.

I am referring to four White Papers which are like the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse.

The Deputy seems to be worried about the author.

We all know who the author is.

Perhaps the Deputy would put it on the record of the House for the benefit of those of us who are not so well up.

At this stage I am not interested in the name of the author as long as the title of the document is on the record.

I am referring to the White Paper Investment and National Development 1979-1983, paragraph 5.17 of which states as follows:

An important aim of national housing policy is to maintain and improve the existing housing stock. Improvement work on about 30,000 dwellings (or 3 per cent of the total housing stock) will be grant-aided in 1979. It is expected that activity in this area will continue at a high level reflecting substantial investment by householders in maintaining and improving their property.

This document was laid by the Government before each House of the Oireachtas in January 1980. Within three weeks the Minister for the Environment went into a meeting hall in Clarecastle, did not even deliver the full text of this document and simply left it with the meeting and said "Watch the news tonight, fellows. There is an important announcement in relation to grants". He buried 40 to 50 years of housing policy in a miserable, cowardly runaway from the reality of what had been sound Government policy over the years.

This motion has been put down to discover why it has become necessary for a Government to abandon the entire system of housing grants because the Government's management of financial affairs has got totally out of control. Why, politically, did it become necessary to throw the baby out with the bathwater? That in essence is what we are discussing. One can only be forced to the conclusion that the 1977 manifesto, drawn up we are told by a think-tank, did not fully understand, or was unable to compute, or disregarded the financial implications of a free for all grant scheme that was so flaithiúl and generous and so anxious to buy votes that it did not realise the housing implications, the financial implications or the administrative implications of the promises put before the electorate.

The reason why this grant scheme has been buried or abandoned is that it got totally out of control administratively. Every Deputy in the House knew about it beforehand. I have a letter from a Labour councillor in Clare—I think he is well known to the Minister—who refers to his first cousin's husband who applied for a £1,000 grant in August 1979 but is still waiting for it. It is a thing that is easy to measure—it is either a new house or it is not, it concerns somebody who is eligible or who is not. Think of the hundreds of people around the country—Deputy Flynn has them in his constituency——

We do not have that in County Mayo.

They would not be writing to me if they did not.

Labour people in County Clare are very scarce on the ground anyway.

Money is scarce on the ground now.

One Deputy at a time, please.

The entire political administration of this system has broken down. During the Housing (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill, on Second and Committee Stages, I said that the Custom House under the stewardship of the Minister—I do not lay any responsibility on the Minister of State—allowed itself politically to be relegated into the Fourth Division, virtually out of the league altogether—and the Department of Finance ran the operation; somebody at the level of assistant principal officer had told the people who had been responsible for our housing policy during the past 30 or 40 years how to operate it. Between early December and Christmas a mad instruction, Santa Claus in reverse, demanded that the scheme be abandoned overnight because the level of applications was running too high. In a hit and run speech in Clarecastle on 21 January the Minister announced he was ending these grants.

In February I received a reply to a question to the effect that the grant applications in 1977, 1978 and 1979 had run at 18,000, 37,000 and 52,000 respectively. They included home improvement grants, solid fuel grants and water and sewerage grants. So clever was the way in which the Minister handled the cancellation of the grant schemes that in reply to a second question by me about the number of grant applications received from the night he announced in Clarecastle the cancellation of the scheme, he said that up to the closing date, 1 February, he had received a total of 24,142 applications for the solid fuel boilers. The total number of applications for that period, 21 January 1980 to 1 February 1980, was 44,816, including the solid fuel installations.

Peace commissioners had pains in their wrists certifying applications.

The smallest shopkeeper knows he must run his cash flow with some degree of regulation and of even balance. The Department's alleged problem was that the schemes had been costing the Exchequer too much, that applications were running at around 52,000 per year. With the elegance for which he is renowned, perhaps Deputy Flynn will tell the House how he will tell his constituents, and how Deputy Kenny will tell his Mayo constituents how the Government propose to pay grants to people legitimately entitled to them.

There will not be any pain at all for the constituents in Mayo because of the proper way in which the scheme was withdrawn by a caring Minister.

Deputy Flynn may get a chance later. Deputy Quinn's time is limited.

I should like to think the Government's is as well. It is good to see Deputy Flynn being comforted by the state of housing in his constituency to the extent that he can view with equanimity the burial of this type of housing scheme. I can assure him that in the constituency I represent the abolition of the scheme will cause undoubted hardship. First of all, it will cause fierce personal cash flow problems for people who had committed themselves to certain kinds of construction and who now, because of economic policy on a general front find that the banks are closed as far as any credit is concerned. It is causing serious problems for small builders who are employing themselves and three or four other workers and who make up 80 per cent at least of the building industry. These small contractors depend on this kind of work.

Many of the people who were looking for such grants desperately needed to improve their housing because they knew they have not a hope in hell of getting local authority houses. Now they are obliged to stay in the houses they occupied. Deputy Lawlor, with experience of the general position in Dublin, will agree with me about this situation. In this country we prided ourselves on the percentage of home ownership and the assistance in the form of grants to provide bathrooms and toilets and so on.

Think of the damage that has been done to the credibility of this system: the number of builders who on trust took contracts from householders to do work and the builders who had to wait for six or nine months to get their money. Will they do that again? Of course they will not. They are going bankrupt. They are caught on the one hand between cash demanded for building materials, no grants coming from the Government, and the banks unable to extend any credit. That is the real harvest of the profligate manifesto of 1977. In attempting to buy votes the scheme was made so generous and was extended to categories of people who were not in the same need of housing as those who desperately needed home improvements that the thing got swamped. In the traditional right wing Fianna Fáil way we have seen so often in the past, the people who effectively benefited from this, because you needed to put up money to get money in the new house grant scheme, already had it. Now, when the Government run into difficult times there is no suggestion of a means test or any suggestion of restricting it and saying that the people who want weather glaze windows can finance them themselves or those who want to convert their grates can finance them themselves, because they already had the rates abolished so that people who want bathrooms, toilets or running water in their houses might get some degree of preference. No, the whole thing goes. That is housing policy from the party of reality.

In the current edition of the White Paper there is reference to employment, and the employment content of home improvement schemes for 30,000 applications a year or approximately 3 per cent of housing stock. What happened to that? What happens to the job creation programme relating to the construction industry? What happened to the frequently boasted 5,000 extra jobs created in the construction industry in the first year of the present Fianna Fáil administration? They were funded by schemes like this. It is reasonable to assume, if the market is in any way rational, that if you eliminate or withdraw the funding the jobs will go with it. Not only has the housing stock been damaged but the building industry in general has been damaged, particularly the most vulnerable section of it. In addition an unspecified number of people will be out of work because of this.

I know that no Deputy in the House welcomes the abolition of those grants. I know that Deputy Flynn and Deputy L. Lawlor are doing a loyal job in the House tonight. I also know that they have received the same kind of representations in relation to the abolition of those grants as I have received. I am sure they have also read the story about how the office of the Minister for the Environment ran out of application forms in Ennis half an hour after the announcement. It was Labour councillors in Clare who were making application forms available which now flood the desk of the Minister of State, to which he is courteously replying giving an acknowledgement. It is a much more difficult thing for the Minister of State to indicate when those grants are likely to be paid, assuming they are in order, in that the effect of 44,000 applications in the first three weeks of the year is a nightmare for the Minister for Finance because they come due at approximately the same time.

What system of priority will there be? Will there be an allocation? How long will they be on bridging finance? How long will the builders have to wait for their money? What special kind of pleading can a Deputy make to the Minister of State? Can he say that a particular case has been in for nine months and will he kindly do something about it because the bank will close on the builder? What special kind of argument will have priority for getting those grants out in time? If the argument is that the Government had to terminate the grants because they had an unexpectedly high level of demand running at 52,000 for the year, then it is 100 times more valid if they get 44,000 applications in the first three weeks of the year. I would like to hear the Minister of State, besides describing his attempts to enter his office on a famous occasion——

(Interruptions.)

It hardly arises on the motion.

It hardly arises on the motion and I withdraw it. I must say that the incident was humorous and the way in which the Minister related the story was even more courageous. He demonstrated in that story the panic which was generated by the administrative decision for which he is not responsible. I would like the Minister, in moving his amendment, to indicate how he will redeploy the public funds which are already committed as a result of the three weeks open season on those grants to those people who are entitled to them. There are people at the moment who are legitimately entitled to those grants. The frequent source of complaint now is that those people who applied in that threeweek period do not know when they will get paid. We understand that the Department is closed for business until 1 April which perhaps is an appropriate date for reopening for business.

It is good administrative procedure.

It means that the efficiency has dropped by two weeks. They will need an extra two weeks. When have we had the occasion of Government Departments closing for business to the extent that this administration have exhorted? The tax offices have been effectively closed and we now have the Department of the Environment effectively closed until 14 April.

It is one small section in the Department.

I am sure that is exactly what Deputy Flynn says to constituents who come to him in Castlebar over the weekend looking for their grants and what he says to builders looking for their money.

They have no difficulty in that regard.

The Chair would be happier if this exchange of views did not occur between the two Deputies. Will Deputy Flynn leave Deputy Quinn to deal with the motion.

It is good-natured back chat.

Even good-natured back chat is not in order.

Over the last two and a half years we have repeatedly asked the Government to put some kind of flesh to the frequent well-meaning phrase they published in their White Paper and the Government announcements on housing policy in relation to the conservation of the housing stock. As far as I remember, on Committee Stage of the Housing (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill the Minister indicated that there was a good future for measures relating to the conservation of housing stock. He was asked on a number of occasions if he would introduce some kind of energy conservation grants to counteract the disastrous loss of heat and energy we have in our housing stock. The House is probably well aware that 70 per cent of the energy consumed in the country is consumed in building either for space heating or for related purposes. We have probably the worst system of heat conservation, including insulation and building standards generally, of any country in northern Europe. Belatedly —perhaps it was a taste of the chaos that was to come—the Minister introduced a grant scheme for the back boiler, then cancelled it, then had a think again and reintroduced it. In his opening speech on Second Stage of the Housing (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill, 1979, a large amending piece of legislation enabling him to do many things, he stated in this House on 27 June:

The grant provisions of the Housing Acts, 1966 to 1970, are inflexible in that the amounts of grants payable, floor area limits and other detailed qualifying conditions are specified by the Acts so that changes which were found to be desirable from time to time in grant schemes required amending legislation. This situation has proved to be unduly rigid in the light of the frequency of these changes. To meet this situation, sections 4 to 6 of the Bill have been drafted on the basis that a broad general power is conferred on the Minister or a housing authority to pay a grant for specified purposes, subject to such regulations as may be made by the Minister for the purposes of the section concerned.

We welcomed that amending legislation. But little did we believe, in our innocence, that it was the forerunner of the abolition of virtually the entire scheme. If the Minister had indicated at that stage that, not only was he going to remove the minor details and constraints that were embodied in the legislation, but that he was, in effect, going to abolish the entire system, we would have had a much different debate. I will accept that perhaps the Minister did not know at that time. I have frequently stated that as far as we are concerned politically on this side of the House—and it is not meant to be a personal slight on the occupants of the ministerial chair at the Custom House—the Department of the Environment have been on automatic pilot since 1977. There is no political direction. Consequently I say to the present incumbent, who is a new Minister of State who has responsibility for housing and for housing grants generally, that he should, for God's sake, rescue the Department of the Environment and particularly the housing section from its relegation to the fourth division which has taken place over the last two and a half years. It did not have that status when Deputy Blaney was there. It certainly did not have that status when Deputy Boland was there and, while it went through a shaky period with Deputy Molloy, it was more than rescued by Deputy Tully in the politically heavyweight Department. That is not the case any more and because that is not the case any more the Department of Finance were able to run the raid on the grant scheme which makes, perhaps, financial sense to some accountant in the Department of Finance. But, in one fell swoop, it has done two things; it has made it administratively impossible for the grant section in O'Connell Bridge House to administer the 44,000 grant applications received in the period of three weeks and it has done untold damage to the housing stock and to the building industry that has grown up around the repair and maintenance of the housing stock.

There are two last points I want to move to before I finish. If the housing stock is not maintained, extended and developed people who live in substandard housing, who occupy inadequate housing or who are forced to take a second family, for example, a married daughter or son, into an unreasonably small house and who do not have the financial assistance to extend or amend or improve that house in one shape or another will be undoubtedly pushed on to the local authority housing list.

The entire drift and direction of Fianna Fáil's housing policy since they came back into office in 1977 has been to encourage home ownership by reference to the private market. It is quite clear that the financial institutions combined with the building industry have put private housing costs beyond the reach of many lower income families. That was bad enough. At least there was the grant scheme that enabled them to try to put on some kind of extension. Now that has been taken away too and many of these people are going to be forced on to the local authority housing lists. The Minister for the Environment, Deputy Barrett, has had the unique privilege of presiding over a continuous decline, to all intents and purposes, of local authority housing completions since he took office in July 1977. It is much more expensive, if one is simply using an accountancy chart taken from the Department of Finance, to house somebody in a local authority house, as Deputy O'Donoghue frequently pointed out in the White Paper, than to extend the grant scheme to enable somebody to put on an extra bedroom or an extra bathroom. This is going to be one of the effects of this grant scheme abolition. People will be forced on to the local authority housing list who otherwise would not find themselves there.

The second reason to which I want to refer is the question of energy conservation generally. We had started, belatedly and after much prompting from this side of the House, a system of energy conservation grants for our housing stock and, for all its flaws—and there were many—it was a start. The principle of the grant scheme had been accepted and it was something upon which successive administrations, and indeed successive Ministers of the same Government, could build upon and argue the case. As the price of energy inevitably rose each year, and indeed each month, the logic of such a scheme and the immediate cash benefit and return to the national economy could be accurately measured. This has been abandoned, too, and it is quite possible that the alleged savings which will arise as a result of the abolition of this scheme will be more than offset by increased demands for energy and the consequent cost which householders will now make, that is, assuming they can get it. We, on this side of the House, must draw the conclusion that whatever about the technical competence of the officials in the Custom House which is undoubted so far as we are concerned, the political chaos and confusion that rages in the Minister's office, whether it be in the Custom House or in O'Connell Bridge House, is something which if the public were really to see it in operation would cause a scandal in this country.

A tradition of maintaining the housing stock which has been validated by successive Governments here and recognised by numerous external agencies as being the correct kind of policy for a country like this to adopt has been thrown out in one fell swoop in a miserable speech delivered in Clare castle to a small audience who did not even hear the full text but were directed to watch the news at 9 o'clock on RTE. The effect of it will be to make the housing position of many people more miserable than it is at present, to create extra unacceptable financial pressures on numerous small builders who are the first to go to the wall in the kind of recession that we are currently experiencing, and to destroy the credibility of any grant scheme.

In conclusion, the Minister and the Deputies on the Government side of the House recognise the kind of political damage that has been done. The Minister, in the Fianna Fáil Ard-Fheis in the RDS a couple of weeks back, indicated that he was considering a couple of proposals to introduce a new form of means tested grant. Undoubtedly it will be unfurled with a great fanfare of trumpets three weeks before polling day. I ask the Minister of State present and the Government backbenchers who may speak on this matter to say if they think the Irish public will believe that. Does it take an election to extract from Fianna Fáil the kind of housing policy that is so desperately needed?

I move amendment No. 1:

To delete all words after "Dáil Éireann" and substitute the following:

"welcomes the steps taken by the Government to redeploy the public funds available for housing in the current year, to ensure that priority is given to the most deserving categories of housing need".

I am grateful to the Deputies opposite who decided that this motion be discussed. The debate gives me a welcome opportunity to correct some misrepresentations and misunderstandings which have been aired both within this House and outside it. It is right and proper that the reasons for the Government's decision about house improvement grants should be put on the record and I have no doubt that fair-minded people, irrespective of their political affiliations, will agree that the package of measures taken including the abolition of house improvement grants, is in the best interest of the national housing programme.

The Labour Party motion criticised the decision to end the house improvement grants scheme, including grants to reduce dependence on oil for domestic heating purposes. Their motion ignores some basic facts governing the situation which were made clear by the Minister for the Environment in his public statement on the subject on 21 January last—in particular, that the amount of money which the State can afford to provide for housing operations this year is not unlimited and that the decision in regard to the grants was only one of a comprehensive set of actions taken to redeploy the available finances in such a way that assistance from public funds would be channeled to help persons who genuinely need and merit that help.

To put our country on a sound economic footing it is necessary that the community should stop living beyond their means, and especially that the extent of taxation on public borrowing should be rigidly controlled. In this context every aspect of public expenditure has had to be critically examined and some services, however desirable from a public viewpoint, suspended or curtailed. Against that background it was inevitable that the nature and scope of the Government's investment in housing would have to be included in that review. The Government's investment in and subvention of housing operations rose from £130 million under the Coalition's last budget to £180 million in 1978 and £212 million, in round figures, last year.

If the financial arrangements which applied in 1979 were to remain unaltered in the current year, it is estimated that more than £250 million would be required to fund the operations. Having regard to the scale of these and other demands on the Exchequer, the present economic situation, the outlook for the immediate future and anticipated international developments, it was clear to the Government that expenditure of this order from public funds on housing would not be feasible in 1980. Immediate and radical measures were necessary to bring the spending within the limit of the public funds which could be provided. It was in that situation that a decision was made to end the house improvement grants scheme.

In deploying the total provision expected to be available for housing in the present year, the Government were concerned to ensure that the major part of the funds would be applied to deal with the housing needs of the less well-to-do and most deserving categories in the population. It was also considered that schemes of assistance which, at public expense and without regard to the means of the beneficiaries, increase the value of existing houses should not be continued.

I challenge any Deputy opposite to condemn the policies inherent in that reallocation, to advise that the unprecedented increases in local authority house purchase and repair loans and in the income limits applicable to these loans should be cancelled or that the allocations for local authority housing programmes should be cut back in order that the house improvement grants scheme could be revived.

The general scheme of house improvement grants had no regard to the economic circumstances of applicants. The work which qualified for grants was very wide-ranging, including the extension, enlargement, improvement or repair of a house which were reasonably necessary to make the house more suitable as a dwelling. Grants were paid for sun parlours, playrooms, the conversion of garages into living accommodation tion and the provision of extra rooms which were in no way needed to relieve overcrowding.

I would like to remind the House that while the basic scheme of grants has been ended, the Government have decided to continue paying grants in cases in which exceptional conditions justify such exceptional treatment as for essential repairs to old rural houses, for the provision of accommodation for elderly persons and for the adaptation of existing houses to make them suitable for occupants suffering from physical disability or acute mental illness or mental handicap. Grants for the provision of group piped water and sewerage schemes are, of course, being continued.

It has been argued that the termination of the grants to reduce dependence on oil is a retrograde step, having regard to the need for energy conservation. I would suggest, however that the massive price increases and the occasional scarcity of supply of oil in 1979 and the rather grim prospects in this regard for 1980, should make people in their own interest convert from oil-fired to solid fuel heating. In fact this was being done independently of the grants and a survey by An Foras Forbartha of private house building in Ireland in 1976 and 1978 showed that between those two years, while no grants to reduce dependence on oil were available, the proportion of new houses being provided with solid fuel systems increased from 13 per cent to 33 per cent or a 150 per cent increase. This trend obviously is continuing and advertisements for many new private houses feature the provision of solid fuel systems.

Persons of modest means will be more than compensated for the termination of the open-ended scheme of house improvement grants by the concurrent big increase in local authority loans for house improvement work. The maximum unsecured loan which was a mere £200 before the change of Government in 1977 was increased to £600 in November of that year and has now been raised to £1,000 for work started on or after 1 February 1980. Where security can be provided a loan of up to £4,000 may be advanced. The interest rate on these loans is substantially lower than that charged by banks and other commercial agencies.

Deputies opposite have a hard neck in criticising the action taken last January in connection with the house improvement grants. They have short memories indeed if they cannot or do not choose to remember that under a Labour Minister for Local Government reconstruction grants were suddenly restricted in January 1977 to houses with low valuations with the result that only 11,517 reconstruction grants amounting to £2 million were paid in that year—this notwithstanding the abolition of the valuation restrictions by the present administration immediately on resuming office in July 1977. Compare that record with the 29,764 grants, over and above water and sewerage grants, totalling £15 million which were paid last year.

I would remind Deputies also that the severe restrictions on eligibility for reconstruction grants introduced in January 1977 came into operation without any warning and without giving an opportunity to persons excluded from eligibility who might have entered into binding commitments or bought materials in the expectation of obtaining a grant. The previous administration gave no notice and did not give a hoot about anyone. In contrast, my Government allowed a period of grace of two weeks up to 1 February 1980 to allow people in such circumstances to submit their applications for grants. In consequence, 44,800 applications were submitted to my Department in that fortnight alone, corresponding to the total intake of applications during the first nine months of 1979.

In January 1977, when the Coalition Government introduced the restrictions on reconstructon grants, the building industry was barely beginning to recover from the recession which occurred in the mid-seventies. It was not until 1978, as a consequence of measures taken by the present Government, that the output of the industry again reached the level it had achieved when we left office in 1973. In other words, when the industry most needed additional capital expenditure and investment, the previous Government were, in fact, reducing the capital available to it.

The situation in January 1980 was precisely the opposite to that which obtained in January 1977. During the past two years the building industry had experienced rapid and unprecedented growth. Indeed, the industry had grown at such a rate that there was evidence of a certain degree of overheating in some areas. This was reflected in the difficulty experienced by builders in recruiting skilled workers in 1978 and 1979 and by the shortages of some building materials, notably cement, in 1979.

If I have dealt at some length with the matter of house improvement works, it is necessary for the purpose of clarifying the Government's decision in relation to this particular scheme of grants to deal also with the question of new housing.

It has been the basic principle of the Government's housing policies to encourage and assist every household to obtain a house of good standard, located in an acceptable environment, at a price or rent which they can afford, The only qualification on the implementation of this fundamental principle is the availability of the necessary national resources. As a natural corollary of this policy the Government are committed to promoting the concept of home ownership. Our achievements in this regard have been so successful that we have the highest rate of owner-occupation of any European country.

At the same time the Government also accept their responsibility to provide sufficient capital to enable local authorities to maintain a steady programme for the accommodation of persons living in unfit or overcrowded accommodation who lack the personal resources to rehouse themselves. The local authority programme which had run into a serious decline from 1975 onwards has now been put on a basis in which about 6,000-plus dwellings are being completed at a steady rate year by year. One of the results of the discontinuance of the house improvement grants is that practically £100 million is being made available to local authorities for their direct house building operations in 1980.

The Government felt that they had a strong commitment to facilitate persons who did not already own houses and were not accepted for rehousing by local authorities to purchase dwellings for their occupation. The claims of these people were felt to be more genuine than those of individuals who already had homes of their own and who, if the grants scheme were continued, would probably turn to the State for grants towards improving their existing accommodation.

When we resumed office two and a half years ago the maximum annual income for qualification for a local authority house purchase loan was £2,350 and the maximum loan that could be obtained was £4,500 only. Those limits had not been increased since 1973; four and a half years almost in which the Coalition had to do it but they did not. We increased the income and loan limits on three occasions in less than three years. Now the maximum income is £5,500 a year, the maximum loan for new housing being £12,000, representing increases of 134 per cent and 166 per cent respectively over the July 1977 limits.

The success of this policy of regular revisions of the limits is shown by the fact that last year local authorities approved 8,850 house purchase loans, including loans under the low-rise mortgage scheme, amounting to £72 million and that at the end of last December they had on hands over 14,913 applications for loans totalling £97.5 million. The policy is an indication of the acceptance by the Government of the importance of these loans schemes in enabling persons in the middle and lower income groups to house themselves.

The provision of mortgage finance from public funds for these categories was matched by the activities of the other main lending agencies and, during 1979, a total of £293 million in respect of a record 24,742 new and previously occupied houses was advanced by all such agencies, compared with £223 million for 22,648 houses in 1978. Loans approved by the agencies totalled £374 million in value, representing 30,051 loans of which 15,833 were in respect of new houses. Each of these three figures was a record for any one year.

I am particularly happy to report that despite the huge and continuing volume of new house building in progress, stimulated by this massive investment of public and private funds, for the second consecutive quarter the Bulletin of Housing Statistics published by my Department has recorded a decrease in the average gross price of new houses for which loans were approved by the main lending agencies. This welcome outcome is due in large measure to the measures taken by the Government to ensure that new houses for which loans are sought represent reasonable value for the price charged.

Our success in pressing forward the objective of owner-occupation can be gauged from the fact that the number of now private houses built last year, at 20,330, was the highest total ever recorded. This form of tenure makes for national social stability. It provides the householder with an asset the value of which is constantly increasing and, at the same time, vests in him a stake in the local community and a positive interest in working for the improvement of the standard of public services in his neighbourhood and the quality of his environment.

I want now to deal with the delay in dealing with grant applications. I do not deny that there are, and have been, delays on the part of the Department in dealing with grant applications. From my own direct personal association with the working of the grants section I am satisfied that these delays are due to the huge growth in the numbers of applications for house improvement grants and particularly the unprecedented inflow during the fortnight ended 1 February 1980. For example, the total numbers of such applications received in 1977, 1978 and 1979 were 18,907, 37,550 and 52,533 respectively. The total number received between 1 January and 1 February 1980, was 49,381, including 44,800 in the final two weeks of that period. In other words, the house improvement grant applications received in the five weeks of 1980 up to 1 February was almost the equivalent of the number received in 1979.

I admit that there has been a delay. Steps had to be taken to enable the staff to deal with this unprecedented volume of work. The public offices were closed, the telephone service suspended, staff was assigned temporarily from other sections to help and constant overtime was worked. The position now is that all applications received have been acknowledged and practically all have been indexed, recorded and filed. If there are now any outstanding cases they will be dealt with within a week.

I want to say also that I am the first Minister to set up office in O'Connell Bridge House, where all the sections of the Department dealing with housing have been located for several years past. I did so because I considered housing too important and sensitive a matter to be dealt with by remote control from the Custom House. I want to say also that I know every member of the staff in O'Connell Bridge House. I wish to refer to remarks made by Deputy Tully last week and by Deputy Quinn. An article appeared in the Irish Independent of 25 January last stating that because of the queues of people waiting outside the office in connection with house improvement grants I was unable to gain admission to my office. The story is without foundation. When I pointed this out in a letter to the Editor he had not the good grace to admit that the second- or thirdhand report which he had accepted for publication was a fabrication but suggested instead that his reporter had merely mistaken the date of the imaginery incident.

I refer to this, not because I am thin skinned—what politician is? —but because the story reflected on the competence and intelligence of the staff concerned and also in the hope that the truth of the matter will register with Deputy Tully who gave the fairy story an airing in the Dáil last week. Deputy Tully knows how unwilling some prominent newspapers are to say honestly that they mistook fiction for genuine news. The staff in O'Connell Bridge House are competent to deal with the position as they always have been. The manner in which they dealt with the public was courteous and efficient and I thank them for that. I am sure they will continue to deal with the public in regard to all grant applications in the same way. If any Deputies write to me I will answer them and will not send a stereotype letter.

(Cavan-Monaghan): I do not intend to become involved in the controversy as to whether or not the new Minister of State found it impossible to get into his office.

However, the Deputy will mention it anyway.

(Cavan-Monaghan): It is not necessary for the purpose of this debate. One thing is beyond doubt and that is that a precedent has been established by excluding citizens from access to the housing department of the Department of the Environment for a number of months. They have been locked out and their phone calls are unanswered. Of that there is no doubt. That is a queer situation to find in a Department which only a short time ago abandoned another scheme, the licensing of motor drivers, because they found themselves in such a mess that they were unable to handle them. That aspect, followed by the locking out of the public from the Department of the Environment and refusing to answer phone calls, reflects no credit on the Minister.

made history by taking up residence in O'Connell Bridge House. I hope to find that the doors will be open again to the people who keep him and his staff there.

I deplore the withdrawal of the house improvement grants by the Government. It represents a cruel attack on householders, who badly need assistance, living in houses unsuitable for them. They find it impossible, because of the extraordinary price of houses at present, to provide new houses and want to prolong the life of their existing house and modernise it by adding rooms or providing essential facilities such as bathrooms and toilets, improving roofs and carrying out such repairs. It is a shameful and disgraceful attack on people who badly need help. We must consider the withdrawal of these grants in the light of the cost of providing new houses. That is the yardstick we must judge this conduct by.

Since 1976 the average price of a new house qualifying for a grant, according to a bulletin issued by the Minister's Department, has soared from £12,113 to £24,206 to the end of last year. As far as I can see prices are still soaring contrary to what the Minister thinks. I put a question down to the Taoiseach which was answered on 20 February asking him the average percentage increase in building materials per month in the years 1977, 1978 and 1979. The information I received was that the average percentage monthly increase in building material was 1 per cent per month for 1977; 0.7 per cent for 1978; for the first ten months of 1979 it was a massive 1.8 per cent increase, nearly 2 per cent. Surely if there was ever a time when it was reasonable and necessary to preserve the life of the existing housing stock this was the time. The Government, when they came to office, found that there were housing grants available for the people who required them and money was not being squandered on them. Deputy James Tully, then Minister for Local Government, modified the scheme by confining it to those who reasonably required it and fixed the poor law valuation of houses which would qualify for reconstruction grants—as they were then called—at £10. I could not readily find statistics but I suggest that a £10 valuation covers the vast majority of our houses needing reconstruction. It would cover and include the vast majority of our as yet unmodernised farm buildings which need water and toilet facilities. It would cover all the local authority houses which have been vested in tenants, many of these houses without bathrooms, many without toilets. It would cover the vast majority of private houses needing reconstruction. When this Fianna Fáil administration came into Government there was a grant available of £400 for reconstruction—I hope I did not hear the Minister say correctly that it was £200. There was, of course, £200 payable by the State and £200 payable by the local authority.

Yes, under a means test that was cumbersome.

(Cavan-Monaghan): Under a poor law valuation. Now, I did not interrupt the Minister.

No, but I just want to put the Deputy right. I do not want the Deputy to go off the main road.

(Cavan-Monaghan): The best possible type of means test is a means test that will measure the type of house with which we are dealing.

And bog down the whole system.

(Cavan-Monaghan): This was confined to houses with a poor law valuation of not more than £10.

Even if it was bought by a millionaire as a country cottage.

(Cavan-Monaghan): Modest houses. We will come back to that in a couple of moments. I would be grateful not to be interrupted. Those grants were available to the people who wanted them, to thousands of small farmers who need grants to modernise their houses and improve them; to local authority tenants who buy houses that may have water but that certainly have not sewerage, and the many thousands of private householders who are in such an income group that they cannot possibly buy a new house. Grants of £400 were available for those. This administration promised that they would introduce a better housing grant scheme, a better house improvement grant scheme.

Which we did.

(Cavan-Monaghan): They did that all right. They increased it by one-third to £600 maximum, which did not keep pace with the increase in the cost of building and the cost of reconstruction since that Government came into power, as the figures that I have show. Having operated that grant which, in real terms, was not as good as the National Coalition Government's grant to those who needed it for two and a half years, this Government cut it out altogether and now there is no grant available to the man who wants to improve his house.

Arising out of what Deputy Flynn said about the man who bought the bungalow for a holiday home, the position at the moment is that a very wealthy man can qualify for a £1,000 grant to build a new house, but the man who buys his house from the local authority for £1,000 or £2,000—a house that was built 30 or 40 years ago—and wants to replace doors and windows and to install a bathroom or put in a back scullery cannot get a shilling of a grant. That is the sort of social conscience that this present Government have. It is a disgrace.

Why did the Coalition dump the grants out overnight? Why did they cut them out?

(Cavan-Monaghan): It is an absolute disgrace. I put up with listening to the Minister.

Deputy Fitzpatrick is in possession.

(Cavan-Monaghan): We did not cut the grants out.

Your Government did. They made them impossible.

Deputy Fitzpatrick, without interruption.

(Cavan-Monaghan): We did it with a means test.

A cumbersome means test.

(Cavan-Monaghan): With a realistic one, an effective one. The Minister's Government cut them out on two weeks' notice and locked the people out of his office—locked them out.

What did the Coalition Government do?

Deputy and Minister, please.

(Cavan-Monaghan): He locked the people out of his office. I know the Minister——

I know the Deputy does not like to hear the truth. I understand and can appreciate that.

(Cavan-Monaghan): I know it is hard to listen to.

Deputy Fitzpatrick, without interruption.

(Cavan-Monaghan): I listened to the Minister and did not say a word.

My apologies.

(Cavan-Monaghan): I listened to the Minister and did not say a word.

The Deputy could not.

(Cavan-Monaghan): Well, if that is the use the Government are going to make of the new Ministers of State, to send one in here to interrupt on behalf of another who is speaking, to interrupt on behalf of the man in charge, that is not a good use of the new Ministers of State. I am sorry to say that, but the Ministers provoked me. The Ministers have other jobs to do than that.

There are many local authorities who are letting hundreds of houses in towns without water facilities or sewerage facilities. I know of one local authority who were planning to install 100 to 150 bathrooms in houses without them. Under Deputy Tully, as Minister for Local Government, they would have qualified for a water and sewerage grant. The plans were going ahead to install bathrooms in these houses, but the Minister for Local Government on 21 January last withdrew those grants. As a result the local authority will not be able to proceed with the scheme.

But will they not get a group grant? Will they not qualify for a group grant?

(Cavan-Monaghan): Will the Minister grow up?

I think the Deputy should.

(Cavan-Monaghan): Surely local authorities do not want group water schemes. There is water in the towns. I am talking about bathrooms. We are not that bad. We are not uncivilised altogether.

What were the Coalition Government doing for the last four and a half years?

(Cavan-Monaghan): The water is there. I am talking about the bathrooms. As a result of the Minister withdrawing these schemes these people will have to soldier on without bathrooms. I say it is not good enough that that should be done. The position is that houses are gone beyond the capacity of people to buy or to build.

There is another phenomenon appearing here at present and that is unfinished houses. Many houses were started and have remained unfinished for months and months because the people who started to build them hoped that they would be able to get finance and cannot get it. They cannot get ordinary loans or bridging loans.

In other words, the Deputy did not want this Government to increase the new house loans?

(Interruptions).

That will do now. We have a minute to go and if the Members stay quiet——

We did something about it.

(Cavan-Monaghan): Let me make my contribution. The point is, and the Minister cannot but notice it, the number of partially built new houses over this country. This is visible to everyone. The fact is that people cannot get loans and if they get them they cannot afford the £50 or £60 a week bill for services.

Debate adjourned.
The Dáil adjourned at 8.30 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on wednesday, 12 March 1980.
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