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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 31 Oct 1985

Vol. 361 No. 4

Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Mining Policies.

20.

asked the Minister for Energy if in view of the collapse of the proposed take-over of Bula by Tara Mines and the continued failure of Tara Mines to make either royalty or tax payments to the Exchequer, he will indicate: (a) the plans he has to ensure that the Bula orebody is brought into production as soon as possible; and (b) the changes, if any, the Government intend to make to their mining policies to ensure that the people of this country receive adequate royalties from the development of ore deposits.

25.

asked the Minister for Energy the reason the Tara-Bula take-over deal collapsed; if he will explain his handling of the negotiations, which led to the failure to finalise the agreement; and if he will give details of any other negotiations that are taking place and the amounts of interest paid to the banks on behalf of Bula Mines Ltd. during the years 1983, 1984 and 1985.

I propose to take Questions Nos. 20 and 25 together.

The sequence of events which gave rise to the collapse of the arrangements for the take-over of Bula Ltd. by Tara Mines Ltd. was as follows. On 11 September 1985 Bula Holdings, the principal private shareholder in Bula Ltd., rejected the Tara offer and on 26 September Bula Holdings demanded further substantial consideration for their shareholding and for certain substantial advances they had made to Bula Ltd. On 4 October Tara Mines Ltd. rejected the further Bula demands and withdrew their offer entirely but my Department had good reason to understand that the Tara withdrawal was a tactical move and that the offer would be reinstated if Bula Holdings decided to accept it. On 8 October a receiver was appointed over Bula Ltd. and on 9 October Bula Holdings accepted the Tara offer.

After a series of Tara board meetings, the board decided not to reinstate the offer, stating that the board did not believe that it would be in the best interests of Tara Mines Ltd. to do so. In a press statement issued by the board, it was stated that Tara had suffered a significant deterioration in their trading position due to a fall in the price of zinc and a less favourable dollar-punt relationship and that the company were incurring heavy losses on their operations.

In the context of these trading changes I would like to point out these were not overnight happenings but had been gradually developing over the period of the negotiations during the past year. Nevertheless Tara had not only stayed with the negotiations but they had in fact improved their offer on 16 August, they had expressed satisfaction at the settlement of all outstanding issues on 23 August and they had been in correspondence with my Department about aspects of the contract documentation up to the end of September. I was greatly surprised and disappointed therefore at the totally unexpected about-turn in Tara's attitude very shortly after. I would also remark that whilst undoubtedly there has been a significant downturn in Tara's trading position, cyclical ups and downs have always been a feature of trade in lead and zinc and it is not the practice for lead and zinc mining interests to take investment decisions on the basis of prevailing market conditions. It would have been more appropriate to base a decision in this case on expectations of future trading conditions in the circumstances that if the takeover had gone ahead Bula ore would not have come on stream for about two years after conclusion of the deal. It is noteworthy in this regard that it was stated in the Tara Exploration and Development Company Ltd., 1984 Annual Report that, whilst prospects were that zinc metal prices would decline in the short term, the company anticipated that with increased zinc demand, metal prices will increase.

In summary, collapse of the deal was due in the first instance to the new demands put forward on 27 September by Bula Holdings which were greatly in excess of terms which that company had accepted in principle in December 1984 and, secondly, it was due to the fact that Tara most unexpectedly pulled out of a deal finally agreed in the terms they had offered and to which they were fully committed up to a very short time before they retracted it.

I most strongly reject the suggestion of disastrous handling of the negotiations by my Department who had acted as intermediary between the companies in the deal at the request of Tara Mines Ltd. The Minister for Energy, myself and officials of my Department had spent long hours over the past ten months in the task and had eventually brought the deal to a point that there were agreed terms for a settlement. I continue to be of the view that the national interest, the interests of the people in the Navan area and the longer-term interests of Tara Mines Ltd., would best have been served by integrated development of the Tara and Bula portions of the Navan orebody.

The development of the Bula ore reserves depends at this juncture on action by the receiver over the company in regard to the company's assets. In the meantime certain contracts involving the possibility of development of the ore reserves by other interests will be pursued. At this stage it would not be appropriate for me to furnish details on these contacts or to anticipate what the outcome will be. Any arrangements which may emerge would be subject to the receiver's approval, of course.

Loans totalling almost £900,000 were advanced by the Department to Bula Ltd. at certain stages to avert action by the banks when serious negotiations were in progress that held out the prospect of development of the Bula orebody.

The payment of royalty to the State by Tara Mines Ltd. is based in the first instance on a calculation of the company's profits by the Revenue Commissioners. The profit of the company for tax purposes have not yet been settled by the Revenue Commissioners who are in correspondence with the company on a number of outstanding issues. Apart from those issues a number of complex questions relating to the calculation of profits for royalty purposes are being actively addressed, but it may be some time before they are resolved as arbitration proceedings may prove necessary. I can assure the Deputy that the State's rights in the matter will be fully enforced. No basic changes in mining policies relating to royalties are contemplated but, depending on the legal advices my Department receive and the outcome of discussions with Tara on the points at issue, which may not be resolved without arbitration hearings, some clearer definition as to the calculation of profits for royalty purposes my be called for in the future mining leases.

From time to time there are calls for the levying of royalties on a per ton of ore raised basis rather than on profits. Such a basis could have a seriously damaging impact on a company such as Tara in their early years of operation when capital expenditures were very high and when the company were in a substantial loss situation; the royalty would be an "off the top" cut off cashflow, irrespective of the company's ability to pay. A further drawback of a tonnage royalty is that it would be too low in boom years when a percentage of profits basis would yield a better return to the State. It has been the practice in the case of large mining undertakings in this country, and elsewhere to the best of my knowledge, to levy royalty as a percentage of profits.

On a point of order, I seek your guidance as to what is to be the position in regard to priority questions today in view of the way we have arrived at this stage. Will the House allow an extra five minutes?

Unfortunately the Chair has no discretion in the matter.

I know, but it is totally unreasonable. I have got no question on priority as yet.

The order leaves me no discretion on the face of it. It is absolutely positive. My trouble is also the possibility of creating a precedent. However, if the House agrees, I am prepared on this occasion to allow five minutes by way of supplementaries on the strict understanding that it will be concluded at 3.50 p.m. and that I am not creating a precedent.

That is only on this question and no others.

I think it is in order that we have an extra five minutes on it.

What happens to the other two? Do they die? I want to put on the record, in case people over there have any doubts, that this side of the House and this party are fully committed to the opening of Bula Mines as soon as possible to get the jobs and the benefits to the national economy in the interest of the taxpayer.

You could have fooled me.

Order, please.

Let me ask the Minister of State a straightforward question that I put last night and which was not answered. How much money did this Government pay out to the banks on behalf of Bula Mines? That is part of the question. He did not answer it despite taking ten minutes to make out an answer. How much money was paid out and on what date was it paid out?

My reply was necessarily long because I wanted to give a comprehensive account of the negotiations.

(Interruptions.)

When? How much?

There have been three payments, three advances by the State to Bula Limited in respect of interest due to the company's banks as follows: February 1984, £162,960.34, a decision which was taken, as a matter of interest, in October 1982.

Do not try to misrepresent the situation.

(Interruptions.)

That is a fact. Since the Deputy has been so interested in the development of Bula I want to put it on record that, when he was Minister, he did very little to bring the Bula orebody into production or to seek a solution to the problem.

Give us the figures.

(Interruptions.)

I did not have a champagne party.

Neither did I.

There is too much secrecy.

On 18 August 1983, £502,257.29 was paid and on 14 December 1984, £234,317.95 was paid, all in respect of interest owing. These were given in the expectation that we would be able to reach a solution to this problem.

(Interruptions.)

I appeal to the Minister and the Deputy not to waste time.

It will not be very difficult for me to give a correct picture. These payments were made in an effort to bring a solution to this problem. The Minister for Energy and I have have been gravely disappointed by the withdrawal of Tara, but I want to point out also that on reflection the efforts made by that side of the House when they were in power were pitiful.

Could the Minister answer a clear cut question?

(Interruptions.)

It is easily known that somebody is hidden behind secret doors.

It is easily known why the Chair should govern strictly according to the rules.

Will the Minister accept that it was a gross miscalculation, a misjudgment on his part when he believed he had the deal in place on both sides, when he went to the trouble of having a champagne party in his Department to celebrate it, when Bula Mines came in with an additional demand for £10 million? It was the duty of his Government, his Minister and himself to say: "The deal is done; come in and sign." That is where he slipped up. He misjudged at a crucial stage of the negotiations and the market slipped out after that. I want to add——

Will the Minister accept that he has paid out something around £1 million more of taxpayers' money to the banks? Where in this House did he get the authority and why did his Coalition Government in the budget that they prepared for 1982 think it necessary to highlight £1.75 million for the Bula-Tara situation? Where did they get this money that we heard about and that was not presented in any Estimate? Under what subhead has the money been spent?

Question Time has concluded.

It is very unsatisfactory for me not to be able to reply to those illogical allegations.

Because of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I should like to raise the matter on the Adjournment.

It is now too late to seek to raise a matter on the Adjournment.

It is regrettable that I cannot reply to the Deputy.

I will raise the matter again next week and there will be no champagne party when I conclude.

(Interruptions.)

Order, please.

On the Order of Business this morning, in response to a question raised by the Leader of the Opposition regarding the transfer to the Minister for Labour of a parliamentary question tabled by me in relation to Gaisce, the President's award, the Taoiseach undertook to try to be helpful to us and to communicate with us in relation to this matter. So far we have had no such communication and I have now been informed officially in writing by the General Office that the transfer is to take place. In order to avoid a situation in which the House is brought into disrepute, I appeal to you to ensure that members of the Government——

I have no notice of this and there is nothing I can do about it.

The House is being brought into disrepute by the failure of the Taoiseach to honour a commitment given here this morning.

That should not surprise many.

I have called the next item. The remaining Questions will appear on the Order Paper for Tuesday next, 5 November 1985.

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