asked the Minister for Labour if he is aware that a person (details supplied) in County Dublin has been making a claim for an unpaid salary and holiday pay since bringing it to the attention of his Department in February 1984; the action he intends taking in the matter; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
Ceisteanna — Questions. Oral Answers. - Unpaid Salary Claim.
8.
The person in question has applied to my Department under the Protection of Employees (Employers' Insolvency) Act, 1984, for payment of an award of £278.92 under the Minimum Notice and Terms of Employment Act, 1973, also for payment of arrears of wages amounting to £4,630.45 and arrears of holiday pay amounting to £278.92.
The problem is that the company concerned appears to have ceased trading but has not been formally put into liquidation or receivership. Consequently, the employer cannot be regarded as insolvent under section 1 of the 1984 Act.
However, there is provision in the Act whereby the Minister may, be regulations, provide that employers may in certain circumstances be deemed to be insolvent for the purpose of the Act so that payments may be made to the employees of such employers. The making of such regulations has been under active consideration but this has given rise to substantial legal and administrative problems. I hope that these can soon be resolved but in advance of the making of regulations it would not be possible for me to say that they would apply in the circumstances of the case referred to in the question. The case has, however, been noted in the Department and it will be considered as quickly as possible when the proposed regulations are made.
This individual is very temperate and I am sure the Minister will agree that it is unconscionable and socially unjust that he should be left without much needed money since February 1984. Surely the Minister can tell the House how soon the resolution of this problem will come about and when the regulations will be introduced? Will they be introduced before or after Christmas or are we talking about Christmas 1987 or 1988? When can this individual expect his entitlement which is all he is looking for? Can the Minister put the company concerned into liquidation as a matter of urgency to give him — and others in the same position — justice?
I should like the regulations to be drafted at a very early date which would allow payment to be made to the individual concerned. However, the whole area of insolvency is very complicated and particular difficulties have arisen in formulating regulations to cover the whole range of matters which might arise. There could be major legal implications in designating individual employers as insolvent, even for the limited purposes of the 1984 Act. These complications are being examined and I hope the regulations will be drafted at an early date but I cannot give a specific assurance on that point.
Can the Minister say how many applications are before the Department arising from insolvencies? Is my constituent's problem the tip of the iceberg?
I do not have that information.
I am not a civil servant beater but this reeks of bureaucratic inadequacy. The Minister said that regulations may be introduced which will give rise to serious legal implications. Can he not anticipate the implications before introducing the regulations to ensure the speedy expedition of my constituent's problem?
The Act allows for the Minister to make payment by declaring particular companies to be insolvent. The drafting of these regulations has apparently created legal difficulties which may well have been under consideration by the Department prior to that. It is very complicated and until the regulations have been drafted the individual concerned cannot have payments made to him.
Does the Minister foresee a time when the individual's money will be paid to him? We are talking about a sum of about £5,000. In the event of these regulations being passed and the resolving of legal difficulties, can the Minister say whether this individual and others will be paid their moneys?
I assume that when the regulations have been drafted and cleared from a legal point of view, the applicant's claim for payment can be dealt with immediately.
This is the second time in recent months that a question of this kind was asked. The last time we were told that it was being actively pursued by the staff in the Attorney General's Office——
A question, please.
Will the Minister confirm that legislation for the protection of employees in relation to insolvencies which was passed in 1984 has not resulted in payment being made to anybody owed money by companies who ceased trading?
That is a separate question.
The legislation is two years old——
The question on the Order Paper deals with a specific case.
Legislation went through this House under your guidance two years ago to try to speed up payments to people who had lost their jobs because their employers were insolvent. There has been a failure to find a legal solution to give people money which is owed to them.
We are getting unnecessarily bogged down.
In this House people are allowed to air their grievances.
Not necessarily.
The legal entitlements due to these people are not being paid by the State because a legal expert cannot work out the wording involved.
Deputy D. Andrews rose.
I have been very reasonable in regard to this matter.
You have been most gracuous and I appreciate it. The Minister is introducing regulations and anticipating legal problems in that regard. Why can the Minister not give the regulations legal purity without having to raise another hare?
That is a comment.
This is a very important matter about which I feel very strongly. My constituent has been waiting for a long time and it emerges that others are in the same position in relation to payment of money.
The Deputy is making a long speech.
Has the Minister any social philosophy on the matter?
The Deputy is out of order.
May I raise on the Adjournment the subject matter of the southern cross route as it affects part of the south county?
That is another matter.
May I raise it on the Adjournment with your permission? Will you examine my application?
Of course, I will.
Thank you.