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Dáil Éireann debate -
Friday, 9 Dec 1988

Vol. 385 No. 5

Supplementary Estimates, 1988. - Vote 36: Tourism and Transport.

I move:

That a supplementary sum not exceeding £1,000 be granted to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of December, 1988, for the salaries and expenses of the Office of the Minister for Tourism and Transport, including certain services administered by that Office, and for payment of certain grants and grants-in-aid.

When my colleague, the Minister for Tourism and Transport, moved the main 1988 Estimates for his Department in this House he had, because of time constraints, to limit his remarks on the tourism sector. However, he promised Deputies he would deal mainly with tourism matters when the Supplementary Estimate was being taken for his Department. The Minister is attending a ministerial meeting in Brussels today and cannot be with us but I, on his behalf, will honour that promise now.

I would ask the House to look on this Supplementary Estimate not just as a simple book-keeping exercise but rather as part of the ongoing development strategy that we have pursued since taking office. The occasion offers me an appropriate opportunity to review the progress that has been made and to sketch the path of our future progress.

The economic philosophy behind this Supplementary Estimate is the use of buoyant revenues, generated by our imaginative tourism and air transport policies, as the feed stock investment for further development in the tourism and aviation sectors.

I will deal with gross expenditure first. The main proposals in the Supplementary Estimate are to allocate an additional appropriation of £5.3 million to tourism, the provision of £1 million for grants for local airports and to make a number of minor adjustments within the other expenditure subheads in the Department's Vote.

As an offset to these the Appropriations in aid for the Department of Tourism and Transport are £7.1 million higher than forecast in the 1988 Book of Estimates due principally to a £2 million increase in the Aer Rianta surplus, being surrendered to the Department, and £5.1 million in additional receipts from the Eurocontrol user charges.

I would now like to address myself to the question of our tourism policy and performance. As the House is aware this Government have chosen tourism as a sector for special development because of its potential for wealth and sustainable job creation. We set ourselves high standards and targets.

The targets as set out in the Programme for National Recovery are: to create an extra 25,000 jobs; to attract an additional £500 million in foreign tourist revenue; to double the number of foreign tourist visitors. These are ambitious targets. We were confident, however, that with hard work, the right policies and increased investment they would work. In the course of my remarks I propose to show that our policies are working and that they provide a sound base on which further development can take place. Our core strategy to maximise the potential of Irish tourism was set out in the Programme for National Recovery. Briefly it is to improve our price competitiveness; develop and improve the quality of existing products and expand our product range; improve the promotion and selling of our tourism products. The results that we have achieved speak for themselves.

1987 was a record year. For the first time ever, total tourism revenue topped the £1 billion mark-up 18 per cent on 1986. Out-of-State tourism revenue amounted to £723 million — up 12 per cent on 1986. Over 2.1 million overseas visitors came to Ireland — an increase of 12 per cent over 1986. The domestic market, disappointing in previous years, also improved dramatically with revenue exceeding £290 million, a 34 per cent increase on 1986.

The momentum seen in 1987 has been maintained in 1988. Estimates for the first nine months show an almost 13 per cent increase in visitor numbers compared with 1987. All the indications are that we will be very close to achieving our 15 per cent growth target for 1988 as a whole. However, for me the most gratifying indicator of our success is that an estimated 12,000 new jobs have been created both directly and indirectly because of the increases in tourism numbers and revenue in the past two years.

These results amply confirm that we are on course to achieve the targets in the Programme for National Recovery. However there is no room for complacency. We must press ahead, continuing to keep our costs under control and improving the quality of the product.

In the growing international tourism market, price is a significant factor in the choice of holiday destinations. A major handicap for Irish tourism before we took office was the level of price inflation here and the impact which it had on our competitiveness. A central plank of the Government's overall economic policy is to control inflation. Our inflation rate for 1988 is estimated at about 2 per cent which is well below the average predicted for EC and OECD countries and has helped keep price increases in the tourism product to the absolute minimum.

At the level of the industry itself, we have also tackled price competitiveness. Among the measures we have taken have been a pilot car rental bonus scheme in autumn 1988 under which US visitors hiring a car for seven days were entitled to a $50 discount and the amendment of the VAT Refund Order, 1986, so that more imported tour coaches will benefit from the effective 10 per cent rate of VAT. Tour coach operators can thus improve their product and compete effectively with UK operators.

I singled out increased investment as a key factor for maintaining a buoyant and developing tourism industry. We have achieved this by direct action and by creating an environment conducive to and rewarding for investors.

The extension of the business expansion scheme to the export tourism sector has been a remarkable success. Already Bord Fáilte have approved marketing and development plans for 28 projects involving planned investment of about £23 million.

We have negotiated substantial special assistance for tourism development in the Border counties and Sligo through the ERDF and the International Fund for Ireland.

Last but by no means least in our list of direct achievements is the package we announced in August for the development of regional airports for tourism development purposes.

The various practical initiatives in increasing investment, improving the product and providing the infrastructure are essential ingredients for a vibrant tourist industry. However, we then have to sell our wares in international markets against fierce competition. When we took office we recognised that our marketing was jaded and lacking in penetration and that an urgent reappraisal of our approach was necessary. We introduced our own crash programme in May 1987 as a stop-gap measure. We then did something that no other Government in this country had done before. We went to the coal face to meet the practitioners in the industry. We convened a tourism forum involving some 100 representatives from the industry to get the industry's views on the marketing and other initiatives which were needed for the development of the industry.

The forum was a resounding success and as a result of its recommendations the Government allocated an additional £4 million for a special marketing programme for the 1988 season. This involved an innovative series of marketing measures recommended by a specially established tourism task force which significantly boosted tourist traffic in 1988.

The tourist industry reacted most positively to the campaign contributing over £2 million to top up the Government's contribution. This was a most heartening and welcome development not only for the extra resources provided but also for the clear demonstration that the industry again had the confidence and commitment which had been sapped by ineffective leadership in previous years.

In 1988 we continued at many levels the constructive dialogue we had established with the industry. In September Bord Fáilte convened a forum of both domestic and foreign operators in the Irish tourism market. Once again we have taken full account of the industry's views in adapting and developing our policies for tourism development. We were also thrown out a challenge by the industry at this forum. The President of the ITIC stated that if the Government allocated an extra £5 million to tourist promotion this would be matched by the industry. We took up this challenge in the spirit in which it was offered.

As a result the main provision in the Supplementary Estimate before us provides Bord Fáilte with a further £5 million for marketing purposes to boost traffic in 1989. However, the industry are also making a matching contribution, so that we now have a special £10 million marketing programme in place for 1989.

I am sure the House will agree that the direct involvement of the industry in this way is a welcome reversal of past trends when many operators in the industry tended to sit back and wait for the tourist to land on their doorstep.

Before concluding I feel I should notify the House of a few very important developments in EC tourism policy over the past year. In May the first ever meeting, albeit an informal one, of Ministers of Tourism in the Community took place. It was convened by the German Minister for Tourism. Mr. Bangemann. In September the Greek Presidency also convened an informal meeting of Tourism Ministers. However, on Wednesday next, 14 December, we will see the first formal meeting of Ministers of Tourism since the Community was founded. It may be a small step but it is a welcome one which shows that the importance we attach to tourism is also being accepted by most of our EC partners.

I would also like to assure the House that we will take full advantage of this new and improved environment for tourism within the EC when devising our national and regional programmes for assistance from the Structural Funds. We have continually emphasised to our colleagues in the various Councils of Ministers that there is no shortage of good quality tourism generating projects, particularly in the cultural and specialist leisure areas available in Ireland but the finance is not there to develop them as quickly as we would like. Financial assistance from the EC would not only make a major contribution to accelerating the provision of such facilities and support services expected by tourists but would undoubtedly encourage further successful investment by the private sector in these products.

A lack of appropriate resources is also responsible for our inability to develop major products such as the theme parks and outdoor pursuit centres which are now being established in other Community countries. These developments incorporate accommodation, all weather cultural, recreational and day visitor attractions and act as major tourist magnets for a region with significant spin-off benefits for the economy, especially in terms of employment creation. We have had discussions with a range of national and international entrepreneurs on the question of establishing such major projects in Ireland. However, because grant assistance or other incentives are not available currently for such projects entrepreneurs could not proceed. The lack of such facilities places us at a disadvantage with our Community competitors in the international tourism market. Therefore, we have argued that funds should be made available for the specific purpose of attracting such large scale projects here over the next four years. We will keep the House informed of progress in this area.

In conclusion I would like to pay tribute to all who have contributed to regenerating the Irish tourism industry over the past two years. I do not have the arrogance to pretend that we in Government did it on our own. We provided the leadership, resources and the framework but, without the co-operation of the industry, these would not have yielded the excellent results we have achieved. We were also fortunate in receiving some excellent advice from a range of sources, including I readily acknowledge, Members from all sides of this House.

The theme of a Bord Fáilte promotional campaign this year was "together we can do it". I would prefer to change the word "can" to "should" because, mar a deirimíd inar dteanga dúchais, "Is ar scáth a chéile a mhaireann na daoine". Molaim an Meastacháin Breise seo don Teach.

It is a pity that the Minister's gracious remark at the end of his introduction was preceded by some rather ungracious ones earlier. I am afraid I would have to make some comments on some of those less gracious remarks. For example, I could not possibly let pass the following statement from the Minister:

A major handicap for Irish tourism before we took office was the level of price inflation here and the impact which it had on our competitiveness.

I might point out to the Minister that Fianna Fáil left this country with an inflation rate of 21 per cent which was reduced by the Coalition Government, of which I had the honour to be a member, to 4 per cent. It is important to remember that inflation was galloping out of control under Fianna Fáil.

The Minister mentioned also the crash programme they initiated in May 1987. Those were an unfortunate choice of words because the greatest crash in Irish tourism was occasioned by the utter bungling of the rod licence issue, leading to so many losses for people all along the west coast and which is on course for even more losses next summer. The results of that crash programme are unknown as yet because of the late production of statistics.

I welcomed, as did many other people, the establishment of the Tourism Task Force. We have yet to ascertain the results of their efforts. I note that everybody leaving the country, including emigrants being forced to do so by Fianna Fáil, is being asked to sell Ireland abroad. However, I wish we had some earlier indication as to whether such endeavours have any real effect on the tourism market abroad.

We welcome this Supplementary Estimate. Even if it came rather too late we are glad that Bord Fáilte's marketing efforts have been allocated some extra money. Of course they are experiencing some difficulty because many of the private sector who are required to match that input have already spent their allocations to tourism for 1988 and are now having to borrow. Bord Fáilte, in turn, are having to accept promises because people just have not got the money.

Since every time the Minister for Tourism and Transport speaks he implies that everything is wonderful, that we have the best of all possible worlds, I regard it as my job to talk about reality. The reality is that Irish tourism is beset with difficulties. I readily acknowledge that some of these are outside our control. Of course the biggest problem is caused by the wrecking of our image abroad by the violent men here, in particular the IRA, who destroy the work of so many good people in the tourism industry and that of so many well-intentioned Ministers for Tourism. That is a sad feature of our overall tourism.

There are other factors outside our control also — such as shifts in exchange rates — but others that are within our control. For example, we are becoming a smoggy, dirty place in a Europe increasingly in search of pure air. It is disgraceful that our capital city should be so far behind environmentally that we allow such impure and dirty air to not alone clog the throats and chests of our unfortunate people but give us a very bad name abroad.

We charge outrageous prices for car hire here. We appear to be unable to improve that position or tackle its root causes. This problem could be tackled by deferring the payment of excise duty on cars until they have been sold on after use by the hiring public. We seem to adopt short panic-stricken, Mickey Mouse measures in an endeavour to tackle some of these problems, such as the once-off cheap car hire arrangement which was too little and too late. Again it is too little, too late. There is a fundamental problem here and every tourist interest identifies this as a major one.

I would have appreciated if the Minister in his speech when talking about what had been done by the previous Government had been gracious enough to mention the sterling work done by Deputy John Bruton, when he was in charge of that area. We reduced VAT rates on meals and hotels and reduced air fares by introducing competition. The tourism industry is ready to recognise that the beginning of the reduction in Irish costs and considerable steps on the road were taken by the former Government and that this Government are continuing some of them.

We are forcing more and more people off the beautiful countryside because we refuse to exempt landowners, including the State, from totally unjustified public liability claims. By doing that, we are storing up trouble for ourselves. The countryside has great tourism potential. In Great Britain, 10 million people are involved in outdoor walking activities. Here, this week, we had an announcement from the Department of Energy refusing to open two new walking routes, one on the border of Dublin and Wicklow and one in Galway-Mayo, on both of which a considerable amount of public money was spent. The Department of Energy will not now open them because of the public liability claims they have had to deal with. I raised this issue with a number of Ministers, including the Minister for Agriculture and Food, who may not have noticed himself signing a letter about it to me, as it was only a letter passing it on to someone else.

Finally, I decided I would go to the oracle of all wisdom, the Taoiseach, who passed me on to Deputy Séamus Brennan, who is supposed to look after insurance. Last week, I got a letter from him saying it was a matter for the Minister for Justice. About six Ministers, including the Taoiseach, have passed this on to somebody else. This is a problem that must be dealt with. The countryside offers a potential golden egg because of the growing interest in health and activity holidays. In Britain they have a countryside Act which enables people to open their land for recreation purposes and which exempts them from public liability insurance. I cannot get any Minister in the Government to even listen to this idea, but I will keep pressing it until I do.

We appear to be passively accepting one of the greatest threats to tourism which is on the horizon, the imposition of high VAT rates on European sea and air fares in 1992. I have made the point time and again about the dire implications for what will be, in 1992, the only island nation in Europe. This could easily set back efforts that have been made to reduce our costs. I am very unhappy with the laid back attitude of this Government to that enormous threat to our tourism industry.

I brought up the question of the refusal to issue any plan for tourism. We have money dished out in fits and starts and today we are passing some of the latest money which should have been available to the industry last January. One of the greatest unsolved mysteries in tourism under this Minister is a speech made by the Taoiseach in the Royal Hospital, Kilmainham, in November 1987 to the Irish Tourist Industry Confederation when he talked about the ambitious targets that had been set in the Programme for National Recovery and said that the means by which they will be achieved would be set out in a medium five year programme for the development of the tourist industry to be published shortly.

The Taoiseach went on to say that an action plan for the tourist industry would be produced by the end of the year and that it would concentrate on improving competitiveness, reducing access costs, internal costs, effective development, and marketing of special interest holidays and that it would involve a new mechanism for ongoing close co-operation and so on. The Irish Tourist Industry Confederation who had been calling for a plan of the tourist industry were delighted with that speech. However, no plan appeared and again the industry has been left dumbfounded as to how they can be presented with targets and no plan as to how they can be reached, except task forces, late money, rod licence debacles and no co-ordinated transport policy. Neither have the Government faced up to the European challenge in relation to tourism for 1992. Tourism is beset by problems, a great many of them of our own making.

I am disappointed at the extremely late appearance of all the relevant statistics on tourism, statistics such as hotel bed occupancy which is a real measure of how we are doing in tourism. We should have statistics on how the new specialist holidays are doing. If we had those figures in the autumn, we would be able to plan properly for the following tourist season. The statistics should be broken down as between what we are called real tourists and emigrants visiting friends and relatives. The Minister mentioned a 13 per cent growth this year. It should be noted that that has gone down from the 15 per cent which the Taoiseach repeated again and again. I do not understand what the Minister is basing his figure on because he has not got the statistics. We do not know how many of that 13 per cent are returning emigrants visiting friends and relations. This is far too late in December for us not to have the full figures available.

Since planning of the following year should be in full operation by early November, I wonder has the Minister ever heard of computerisation, of setting up a system in conjunction with the Tourist Industry Confederation, the hotel federation and Aer Lingus to get all the statistics as they come in so as to have a really good information bank available before Bord Fáilte try to sell this country abroad. We do them damage enough with debacles like the rod licence one, where Bord Fáilte had to put stickers on brochures saying that they were not sure if there will be any fishing in that area and advising people to check before they come.

Deputy Hussey has about a minute and a half left.

It is up to the Minister to get all these figures together. The EC transport infrastructural fund which we are most anxious to see up and running should have £485 million available over a five year period. I will question the Minister next week on how much he has achieved this week in Brussels on that point. We must reduce transport costs which amounted to 9 per cent of total export values, compared to a 6 per cent average for our competitors. The CII have identified £480 million savings which are possible and necessary. Airport costs are very high in Ireland. Why? Aer Rianta charges are way out of line. Why should that be at a time of huge increased traffic, when we should be lowering Aer Rianta's costs. What about the unfair competition which the road hauliers face from Northern Ireland and so on?

When we get euphoric statements about wonderful progress, with every thing being great in the tourist and transport industry, it is time for realism to be brought to bear and for somebody like ourselves in the Opposition to point out some of the realities and make sure that we get answers and actions on our points. If we do not have a unified, realistic, energetic policy coming from this Government in the transport area, we will fail in 1992. We will also miss, and miss grievously, the targets so grandiosely produced on tourism in the Programme for National Recovery.

The bulk of the Supplementary Estimate introduced by the Minister really relates to additional promotional expenditure which is being made available to Bord Fáilte. As the Minister has said, it is being matched by the industry. I welcome this, because promotional expenditure is obviously very much needed if we are to improve on the number of visitors coming to the country. It is a good example of a State agency combining with the private sector to achieve a common objective. That objective is very much in the national interest. The more visitors we attract to the country, the greater the benefit to our economy.

Tourism, as we in this House all know, is the fastest growing industry in the world. Promotional spending is necessary if we are to be effective in our efforts to get a greater share of that expanding market. Having got it — and that is another area that needs to be looked at — we must be able to hold on to it. The tourism industry is vitally important to us. It is a major foreign currency earner and if the industry is properly developed it can lead to major job creation opportunities, particularly in remote parts of the country where the likelihood of getting other industries located is not very good. Tourism has that great capacity to generate jobs in remote areas.

Undoubtedly, a more sophisticated marketing strategy is needed, particularly targeting in on niche markets. If this is done sucessfully, the promotional investment made both by the State and the industry will pay dividends quickly. Research has shown that every £1 spent on promoting tourism generates about another £2 in tourism revenue and out of that revenue about 49p in every £1 goes back to the Exchequer through direct or indirect taxation. When we are allocating funds for promotional expenditure, we must realise that Ireland will never be a major holiday destination since it does not meet the international tourism market's main demand, which is for the sun. By its very nature, size and geographical position, Ireland will always be a marginal market in that sense. That does not mean that it cannot be a successful market. If we are to succeed, we must compensate for the drawbacks and cultivate those areas where the country enjoys significant natural advantages.

What we need is to have a sharply focused strategic plan. Deputy Hussey spoke about plans and I agree entirely with her. There is a dearth of them as far as the tourist industry is concerned. We need a strategic plan and it must be based on individually small but overlapping niche markets. We have identified those markets before in this House. We are talking about the leisure areas and the specialty markets. We can talk about sporting areas, cultural and historical tours, golfing, angling, equestrian sports and activities of that nature. We have a lack of indoor leisure facilities. They are very badly needed if we are to overcome the natural disadvantages, the main one being the undependable weather. The ongoing development and selective marketing of this type of facility and pursuit would clearly attract new visitors to Ireland, as well as encouraging the domestic market to holiday at home.

On that latter point, it is quite clear that the Irish tourism market has lost the support of its own domestic consumers. Irish holidaymakers have become disenchanted with holidaying in Ireland and spend more money on holidays abroad than they do in this country. The primary reason for that is the climate but, equally important, domestic costs and lack of wet weather facilities are also major factors. The industry and the Government will have to make strenuous efforts to reverse this trend, as every £1 switched from a foreign holiday to a home holiday by a domestic consumer is every bit as valuable to the balance of payments as £1 spent in Ireland by a foreign tourist.

Bord Fáilte have correctly put great emphasis on the need for promotional funding, but it is only one factor in a whole range of actions that are required if the targets which the Government have set themselves in their Programme for National Recovery are to be achieved. Market research is one of the areas that need to be tackled urgently. We can no longer rely on the ethnic markets in the United Kingdom and the United States to sustain growth in this industry. We must determine what will attract people to this country who have no connection with it. There is a vast market, as we know, in the European Community. Germany is the largest tourist market in the world, greater even that that of the United States. We must tap into those markets, but first we must establish what will entice these new visitors to come here.

I note that the Irish Tourist Industry Confederation have commissioned a major research project which is funded by its own members. Aer Lingus have contributed £200,000 out of a total cost of £500,000 for this project. This will undoubtedly be of great help to the industry in determining what market strategy should be pursued. Having identified those new markets, we must also ensure that we make full use of modern technology, such as computerised information, reservation and selling systems that are plugged into the principal tourism markets and which foreign travel agents rely on to sell holidays to foreign destinations such as Ireland. That is a very important development which needs to be addressed. We have moved into the technological era and tourism cannot be excluded from that.

Deputy Hussey mentioned the high cost environment of Ireland. Undoubtedly, that is one of the major handicaps to the growth of the industry. This has been borne out by surveys carried out by Bord Fáilte last year. Only a quarter of the visitors to this country confirmed that Ireland, in their opinion, was good value for money. Two out of every five visitors thought that it was poor value. That is very serious because we all know that a bad experience in relation to high costs is likely to be talked about much more frequently than any good experience a tourist may have while here. It also has another adverse effect in that, apart from inhibiting new visitors from coming here, it certainly does not encourage or entice those who have already visited here to come back for a repeat visit. Our high cost environment is undoubtedly a major problem for us.

The factors contributing to the high cost environment were touched on by Deputy Hussey, among others. They are mainly car hire rates and also high petrol costs and eating out in restaurants and so forth is particularly costly. On the car hire aspect, I would agree with the Deputy. I have suggested before to the Minister that we should defer payment of duties on new cars being used by car fleet hire companies until the cars are being sold. Duty should then be paid on the written down value of the car at that point. This would help enormously the cash flow in a car fleet car company. It would lead to a greater uptake of car hire facilities here, which would have very beneficial effects in that one would have visitors travelling to the more remote regions of the country and their stay would be likely to be longer if they obtained satisfaction in the level of car rentals. In the context of 1992, if we are to harmonise duties and taxes generally, we should certainly start with car hire because it would have an enormously beneficial effect on the tourist industry. It makes no sense that we should have such very high costs here in comparison with what is available in competitor countries.

I want to deal now with the targets set out by the Government in their Programme for National Recovery with regard to the tourism sector. That programme states that, within a five year period, 25,000 jobs will be achieved and that there will be a doubling both of tourism revenue and tourism numbers in that time. These targets are very ambitious, but I believe they can be achieved. However, they can be achieved only if we approach them in a planned way. There is an absence of a coherent strategic plan to ensure growth in the tourism industry to the extent that the Programme for National Recovery claims.

If the targets set out in the programme are to be achieved, we need a 15 per cent growth rate per annum. We are now two years into the programme and the Government claim that their efforts in this area have been successful. The Minister said that the growth rate this year was 13 per cent and Deputy Hussey rightly pointed out that, up to recently, the Taoiseach was claiming it was 15 per cent. The growth rate last year was 12 per cent and the percentages are not meeting the 15 per cent required to ensure that the programme will be achieved within the five year period. In any event, in relation to the claims the Minister made, where is the evidence? The claim is not supported by the industry, hoteliers or restaurant owners and shopkeepers are not saying that things have improved to the extent that they would measure them in terms of 15 per cent, 13 per cent or even 12 per cent.

How can the Minister claim a growth of 13 per cent this year when, on his own admission, they have not even quantified the statistics for this year? Deputy Hussey also drew attention to this. We do not have any details about the revenue losses arising from the rod licence dispute on the basis that the figures have not yet been compiled. Similarly, the Central Statistics Office on the passenger inquiry figures for 1988 say that they will not be able to extract the information in that regard until early next year. We are operating in a vacuum and it is very difficult to know on what the claims for growth in the tourist market are based.

The chairman of the Irish Tourist Industry Confederation, a body comprised of everybody in the tourist business and who are highly respected, wrote to me on 25 November in relation to the growth and achievement of targets. He said that experience this year tends to confirm that, despite lower access fares and improved competitiveness of the product in Ireland, the significant growth rates required are not being achieved. That is the view of someone who has his finger on the pulse of the industry and knows what he is talking about. He does not accept the Minister's claims. We must listen to factual comments like that instead of the unsubstantiated points the Minister made in the House.

Access air fares have, undoubtedly, made a great contribution to tourism but, in the context of a five year period, they cannot go on making that level of contribution each year. Lower air access fares must be looked at on a once off basis, somewhat like the recent tax amnesty. They can certainly make an initial, major contribution. They have been reduced vis-à-vis the UK to a level where they are unlikely to be reduced further. There is plenty of scope for reducing them vis-à-vis continental Europe but, in any event, they can only make a sharp contribution at a particular point in time. We must identify other areas for growth over the whole programme period of five years. There is nothing in any Government programme to indicate where that will come from.

Deputy Hussey also touched on the fact that 35 per cent of the visitors are Irish people returning home to visit their relatives. They are very welcome and make a contribution to the economy but, in terms of sustained growth to the tourist industry, they are not particularly effective because they do not stay in hotels, eat out or spend in the areas on which we have to rely if the tourist industry is to develop and if encouragement is to be given to the private sector to expand and provide the facilities to which I referred earlier.

I reiterate that we need a strategic plan. The Government's claims have not been accurate. I quoted the remarks of the chairman of the Irish Tourist Industry Confederation who confirmed that the targets are not being achieved. If we are to have any meaningful debate on this issue it would be far more appropriate if the Government produced factual evidence instead of us having to talk in a vacuum. The people in the industry, who have their finger on the pulse, do not agree with the claims of the Government.

Deputy McCartan rose.

I am advised that I should call Deputy Stafford on the Government side. You will be called after him.

I welcome this Estimate as it shows the Government's feelings about the potential in relation to toursim which is one of our greatest assets. One of the best things at present is the control on inflation. Irish people who spend holidays in Ireland are always saying how expensive things are and, naturally, inflation is one of the major causes. The Government's actions over the last two years have helped greatly in that regard and they should be commended.

One of the things with which I have been associated for a long time is the car hire business. Many times I approached various people as to what is the best course to follow regarding its high cost. This year, a grant was introduced — especially applying to American visitors — in relation to cars hired outside the country. That was a move in the right direction. It should also be noted that the Government have been in office for only two years and it takes quite a while for major changes to come into force. When someone brings a car from England they can drive to Holyhead and travel to Dún Laoghaire at a very reasonable rate. This service operates every day but I hope the ferry terminal in Dublin will be used more often and that any moneys available will go towards developing the port.

We were looking at statistics in relation to the new channel tunnel between France and the United Kingdom. They carried out a survey in one of the major airports near London which showed that 50 per cent of people who travelled by air would be prepared to use the channel tunnel if it was cheaper. It is surprising that such a high percentage of people were willing to travel by the tunnel. One of the things that should concern us is that we will be the last major land mass in the Community following the completion of the channel tunnel in 1993, that will have access only by air or sea to the rest of Europe. We will be completely dependent on the car ferries and airports. Only a short few years ago many of the present Government were severely criticised about Knock Airport. It is now a commercial success and there is a move to have more airports built throughout the country. All these moves are good for the tourist industry.

I spend most of my holidays in Ireland and have always got great value for money whether it be in the west, Cork or my favourite place, Wexford. A family can have a very good holiday without spending an arm and a leg. Many people have been complaining about the fishing licences, but the fee is very reasonable if you want to fish in the rivers. I have always gone sea fishing and there is no licence fee involved. There is a small charge to hire a boat and one can spend many wonderful hours sea fishing. These are the advantages we should be selling — our beautiful seas, mountains and rivers.

What about the rod licence?

We must all pay for our sport, and the present Minister has done everything in his power to solve the rod licence problem. He has worked very hard and I compliment him for all he has done. He considered every suggestion put to him and he tried to sort out all the problems. Many of the people who do not accept what he says are doing a great deal of damage. In my opinion they are misguided. However, I know this problem will be sorted out to everybody's satisfaction.

We have some of the greatest sea fishing waters in the world and we should do more to promote this amenity. A few years ago when in Fenit I caught a 148 lb. skate, one of the biggest caught in Irish waters. People interested in this sport would say that was not possible, but it happened. Sea fishing is one sport which is not promoted enough as a tourist attraction. People do not realise the great potential that exists from hiring boats, renting equipment, selling bait and so on. All these activities can provide a very good living for many people for the best part of the year, because people can go sea fishing until the end of October.

My colleague across the Floor mentioned smog in the city. We had a bit of smog which was very dangerous admittedly for a short period, but this is the first time any Minister has attempted to sort out this problem.

Complete rubbish.

(Interruptions.)

This is the first time any Minister has——

What has he done?

This is the first time any Minister has tried to do something about this problem, a problem that councillors have been discussing since before I became a council member three years ago and we got great co-operation from the Minister. Everybody will admit that the smog would not have been as bad if the weather had been——

The Deputy is now blaming the weather?

I am saying the smog would not have been as noticeable. Within the next two years this problem will be sorted out.

Pray for different weather.

At this time of the year we have very few visitors and we should not get too involved in discussing smog in Ireland. Last month, before the smog was bad, we had a wonderful American football match here, about which I was very wary because I did not believe it would be successful.

Was it not lucky there was no smog that weekend?

It was. As I said, the Minister will be sorting out this problem very soon. I met some of these Americans and had a chat with them. They told me they had enjoyed Dublin. Approximately 10,000 American visitors that weekend thoroughly enjoyed themselves. Making these people feel welcome is as important as spending millions of pounds providing new buildings or something like that, important as they are. The average Irish person can play their part in attracting tourists by looking after visitors, particularly those who have come to Ireland for the first time and do not have any family connections. These people enjoy our atmosphere, pubs and so on. The first thing they ask is to be brought to an ordinary pub and we usually bring them into some pubs in town.

Promoting tourism is something like the "Buy Irish Campaign". People say if we spend money in Ireland or if we holiday in Ireland we are protecting our neighbours jobs. These are areas we must promote and as politicians we must ensure that this is done. I am a member of the Dublin Regional Tourism Organisation and consider that we should look at the larger hotels which provide more specialist type holidays. I believe each area should have a specialised office, whether in the west, the south or in Dublin. People only stay a few days in each place and these offices could help them plan their holidays.

I contributed to this debate to compliment the Government on their attempts to look at these areas. So many people say we should do this or that, but in my view we have started off extremely well and I want to compliment the Minister on his hard work, which I hope will show great dividends next year.

I was very happy to give way to Deputy Stafford but I think the good practice of this House is to allow the Opposition parties a brief say in advance of calling in a second Government speaker.

I have to go by the rule of the House.

I was cut out from a previous debate on the Estimate and, had another representative from another party offered, I would have been cut out again. It is only fair to order things properly.

However, having said that, I want to take up a matter immediately with Deputy Stafford, that is, the question of smog. I am also a Dublin City Councillor. We well know that the Minister for the Environment has gone against the considered view of the council and their officials by allowing two things: first, peat briquettes and, second, the full burning fire from CDL which will only help to engender the culture of burning smoke-emitting bituminous fuels in areas where these fuels should be banned entirely. That is a regrettable development and something the Minister will ultimately answer for. The Minister is not dealing effectively with the smog problem.

I want to deal, in particular, with the points raised in the Minister's speech today. The romantic view of Ireland with its mountains and clean air, beautiful fishing facilities and other natural amenities which Deputy Stafford spoke about is matched only by the very unrealistic overview in the Minister's statement on the present position of tourism. Some of the major statements in the Minister's speech must be challenged. With regard to the overall targets and trend developments, the Minister says the indications are that we are on target to meet what was set down in the Programme for National Recovery.

Let us remind ourselves that the targets for the five year period 1987-91 were, it was hoped, to double the revenue from tourism, to double the number of visitors travelling to this country and to create 25,000 new jobs in this sector alone. It has been admitted that to meet the targets of that type of programme requires a 15 per cent compound annual growth in tourism. At the moment the Minister says we are proceeding towards a 13 per cent increase but independent commentators and people who have studied the statistics in depth concede that, in fact, the real rate of growth in this current year will be closer to 10 per cent. I believe that is something the Minister must deal with. How is it that independent commentators in the market-place do not agree with the Government estimates? Even if we accept the figure of 13 per cent growth, it is still short of the Government's target for the current year. In that context it must be said that the forum convened by Bord Fáilte in September was a salvage operation to try to put right the very worrying statistics developing from the summer trade in order to see what could be done in the final three months of the year to put things back on track.

At that time it was established that the number of visitors from America was 6 per cent down on the figures for September 1987. However, 10,000 Americans came over en bloc to the American football game, but where would we have been if we had not had the major event of the Dublin Millennium running throughout the year? International conferences, competitions and events attracted an inordinate number of visitors and were an unexpected boost to the tourist industry. I wonder what would have happened to the Government targets if we did not have that particular boost. We do not have another millennium to celebrate in 1989, so I seriously question whether the Government can maintain the momentum to reach their targets in the coming years.

The Minister and the Government have restated their commitment to the development of tourism as a major industry. This has to be looked at a little more closely. The net contribution of tourism to the economy is negligible in the overall Irish economy and even in the overall figures of the industry itself. The figure we have to look at much more critically is the figure of the net balance, that is, the difference between what we gain from tourism spending in Ireland as opposed to what Irish people spend on holidays abroad. That figure vacillates almost uncontrollably from year to year. I believe that the absence of a plan contributes primarily to this. In 1981 there was a £10 million deficit. In other words, we were spending more money on holidays abroad than we were gaining from tourism spending in Ireland. In 1986, the deficit stood at £18 million but for the first time in 1987 it showed a surplus of £25 million — a modest figure when one considers the overall £1 billion tourism budget.

From the figures available, I understand that over £1 billion was spent by Irish people on holidays generally, but only 13 per cent of that came to the Irish Exchequer, either from moneys earned by the carriers taking Irish people abroad or on holidays at home. While Deputy Stafford enjoys holidays in my home county, the problem is that he is an exception. I, for one, rarely spend a holiday in Ireland because it is simply not a place where one can expect to get sun and a good deal. Let us face up to that fact. We do not facilitate Irish people who wish to spend their holidays at home. The country is expensive, it is ill-equipped with facilities and that has to be challenged. When the Government say they are targeting tourism as a major industry and as a major input to our economy, we have to understand that they are a long way off in terms of correcting the balance between what we spend abroad and what we should, in fact, be spending at home.

We will have to bring Deputy McCartan down to some of the good traditional pubs in County Wexford.

I have been around them all in my day. However, I still make the point that the Deputy's over-romantic approach is not a good enough answer. We have to tackle in a concrete fashion the problem of getting Irish people to spend more time at home or, in particular, in developing the real attractions of Ireland which are in adventure type holidays which bring in more British and Continental tourists.

They cannot do that because of the insurance problem.

Our reliance on the American market exclusively is fraught with difficulties, particularly when one considers that country's economic problems and the great drive now afoot to keep Americans at home instead of going abroad which adds to their deficit problems.

This exposes in part, if not entirely, the very highly vaunted words of the Minister in promoting what he believes is an entirely successful package for tourism in the current year. It is anything but that. What must be challenged in the Minister's statement, which I believe is entirely inaccurate and erroneous, is the suggestion that 12,000 new jobs have been created in tourism this year. That is not so, and cannot be so if one begins to examine the figures.

Unemployment has virtually remained at the same number, with 240,000 on the live register this year, which is much the same as it was last year and, indeed, the year before. In the current year we know — and this has been admitted by the Government — that 30,000 people have emigrated. The Government also maintain that they have created 20,000 new additional jobs in manufacturing. If the foregoing figures are correct, there is no way you can maintain that 12,000 other jobs were created in tourism. The figures simply do not add up. We are maintaining the same number on the live register. A huge number are emigrating. The Government take credit for creating jobs in the manufacturing area, but the figures do not add up. There is something wrong with the figures somewhere. If we look more closely at what the Minister said in his statement, we might begin to understand that he has not said what he intended to say. I quote from the Minister's statement:

However, for me the most gratifying indicator of our success is that an estimated 12,000 new jobs have been created both directly and indirectly.

That expression "directly and indirectly" and estimated numbers and indicators add up to the Minister picking a figure and hoping it will be passed over uncritically and accepted as an achievement. To me it means the Government do not know how many new jobs were created in this sector, if any at all. In any event, the overall figures available to us on unemployment, emigration and jobs in other sectors do not add up to a suggestion that 12,000 new jobs were created in the industry. I do not believe anyone out there would support the Minister on that statement.

I have said one important area we must try to develop in tourism is the adventure sport area which previous speakers have mentioned and I wish to add my voice to theirs. The rod angling dispute must be resolved without delay. Last year I had the benefit of visiting areas of Europe and in the course of that the opportunity of speaking with a Bord Fáilte representative in the north European area. The adverse impact that dispute was having on the tourist figures from Germany, Belgium and the north mid-European area was immense. It must be put right. We thought it might be put right even in time for last year's angling season but now it drags over into yet another year. That is regrettable when one thinks of the figures involved and where the Government together with the industry are putting up a £10 million additional promotional package which obviously must centre on adventure sports which do not rely on the sun but on our clear air, outdoor sports such as golf, riding, swimming, sea angling and so on and angling on our inland waters. It is a huge gap in the portfolio of promoting Ireland that we cannot assure travellers coming to this country that they will receive a welcome and unimpeded access to our inland waters to engage in what is clearly a very important aspect of tourism here. We are spending £10 million. Are we going to raise even a fraction of that if the rod licence fee is imposed fully and comprehensively?

The Minister referred to an increased allocation to Aer Rianta. It would be wrong to pass from this debate without paying tribute to the pioneering work of that company in expanding markets for the Irish tourist transport industry and in particular the new pioneering work being done with Aeroflot in Moscow and the ongoing contracts and revenue that is offering. Often it is not appreciated, both in the work done there and in the reciprocal revenues received from Aeroflot involvement at Shannon. If I recall correctly, the figure is about £60 million over a five year period in revenues at Shannon. That is to be welcomed and we hope it will develop. In particular, one would hope that soon the agreement with the Cubana airline will be completed between the Minister's Department and Cubana who are anxious to open up a traffic route for travellers through Shannon.

Finally, while the Estimate deals primarily with the tourism aspect of the Minister's portfolio, he has another job, that of transport. I have to make an urgent plea here today that on his return from business abroad the Minister for Agriculture and Food will impress on him the urgency of dealing with bus transport in Dublin city with is now chaotic and almost at a standstill. It is a great pity to see the innovative "nipper" service which was introduced on the streets in the past few days being completely put at nought by snarled up traffic and buses practically at a standstill. Dubliners badly need a good, effective, public transport system and the current state of affairs in Bus Atha Cliath is not satisfactory. I hope the Minister will take that on as a major issue on his return so that in the new year we can get back to moving in Dublin again.

First, I assure the Deputies who have spoken, and who obviously have a deep and in general positive interest in this area, that I will, of course, as a matter of priority relay all the points made today by them to the Minister. I thank them for participating in the debate. The Minister will want me to acknowledge that this has been a feature of the attitude in this House on this issue in relation to tourism, and that all the points that have been made will be taken on board in what is a crucial area for our economic development programme where we have a great potential.

Deputy McCartan talked about a romantic view of mountains and clear air and seemed to convey, in response to what Deputy Stafford was promoting very effectively as being a special advantage, that this did not somehow match reality. This is an area where the reality measures up to the romantic view, and it is very important that this unique advantage we have be promoted at every possible time in every possible way. When we do an objective analysis and maybe make an appropriate criticism of our failure to exploit potential, we should be very careful not to denigrate in any way the most unique characteristics we have, namely, the mountains, the clean air and, let me say, the climate. I know there is concern that we have adequate facilities for weather and I take Deputy O'Malley's point on that, but let it also be acknowledged that the international perception of Ireland is a very positive one towards our climate. Just now we are facing the middle of winter. Where anywhere in Europe will you get a climate such as we are enjoying?

There is no smog in Europe.

It is time we used and promoted that. Let me say as Minister for Agriculture and Food, because the matter here is interlinked with what I am responsible for, that the perception of Ireland abroad is very positive at this moment in terms of our climate and all the natural characteristics of Ireland including our quality products. We need an integrated approach to all of this. People who come here from the FDR, the Netherlands and anywhere else come to appreciate especially what we alone have and that includes our wholesome food produced in a natural environment. It is very important that we continue to promote that. Now donning my appropriate hat, let me say I have been in constant contact with my colleague on this area in promoting what is special, and equally it has to be said that we are seeing results.

I would like to refer to some of the points raised because there seems to be some degree of doubt about some of the statistics. I had better take things seriatum, in the order in which they were taken. I appeal to Deputies, in the manner in which they have approached this debate generally, to use every possible means to support the programme the Minister launched last Wednesday which is called the new ambassador programme for Ireland. This scheme is designed to get every Irish person wherever and however occupied to involve himself or herself abroad as an ambassador for Ireland. People will respond to that. There is a sense of pride and patriotism out there and it is time we acknowledged that, and instead of what has been a trend of promoting cynicism, which I am glad to say is dying every day, we now promote that positive element of patriotism, an old-fashioned virtue but one that can be applied even more effectively now. Members of the House particularly through their own friends and contacts can be assured they can get the available literature for this promotion. I ask everyone to take as active a role as possible in that.

In regard to the rod licence the Minister for Tourism and Transport made a significant statement on 8 November. In view of what I have heard I would assume that each Member of this House, particularly the spokespersons, associate themselves fully with that statement and I would have expected that they would actively and vocally support it. I was in the House at that time and I recall that Deputy Hussey's party vigorously supported that issue when it was introduced. I do not see where the change has arisen.

We did not support false claims.

In order to be consistent they should, as I have invited them to do, acknowledge that this is of such national importance——

Nobody disputes that.

What are you talking about?

These claims that the Deputy has made.

Answer the questions we are asking. What about the figures?

If people vigorously support the principle will they at least be consistent in calling for those who are damaging our tourism to withdraw?

You are avoiding the issues. Answer the question.

I am not. In regard to the extra £5 million for 1988, Bord Fáilte have actually got commitments for the matching of the Government's extra £5 million.

Next year's money.

That is all we asked for and that is what we got. I would ask Deputy Hussey to read the speeches of all of the leading members of the tourist industry who welcomed this.

They all welcomed it.

There seems to be some confusion. We have always recognised the role of the Opposition but when I, on behalf of the Minister, introduced the Estimate, I did mention that there were contributions, to pick out for instance that of Deputy Jim Mitchell——

About time.

——in relation to introducing competition to the airline sector. We are in the business of action and inviting people to support us. Our comment is that they were, necessarily, ad hoc actions and there was not a coherent plan.

There is no plan now.

Let me now come to that. We do have a plan.

Where is the plan?

That is what I am going to tell the Deputy and it has been brought to her attention more than once. It is set out in great detail in the Programme for National Recovery.

Those are targets.

That is only an aspiration.

I understand the Minister for Tourism and Transport already told the Deputy this is in a reply to a recent parliamentary question. It may be good news for the Deputies opposite, or bad news for them, but the Irish tourist industry all involved in it accept that there is a plan.

No, they do not. You are quite wrong. Deputy O'Malley read out the letter.

I have the letter here. I quoted from it.

What about the Taoiseach's speech.

This is a problem we have had in many sectors. I want to thank the Deputy for her constructive remarks. We will try to follow them up.

He has got wise.

Deputy Hussey also raised a list of questions on the transport front which she will raise with the Minister for Tourism and Transport. I have no doubt that he will deal with these. I will tell him he may anticipate them.

Deputy O'Malley stressed the economic importance of tourism, particularly its job creating potential. I want to endorse his remarks on lease marketing which were apposite and he also mentioned sharper marketing focus. Again we agree on this. His approach to product development is something I share with him and I have no doubt my colleague does as well. There must be more emphasis on wet weather facilities. I know that Deputy O'Malley is also a Connemara man. He was not going down there as early as I was but that is not a criticism of him— maybe the years gap accounts for that. In any event I was going before it became a congested political district. Nevertheless we can enjoy the place. Let us acknowledge, however, that wet weather facilities need to be provided. On the other hand we should also promote the fact that our weather is one of the great attractions——

For the Arabs; they love it.

——particularly the fact that this is mid-winter and look at the weather we are "suffering" from. Is it not time we stopped complaining?

I endorse Deputy O'Malley's comments on home holidays. Every Irish person who stays at home instead of going abroad makes a contribution to economic development. There is no question about that, and it is an important import substitution, if one likes.

In relation to the high cost environment it is fair to say that we have reduced inflation dramatically but we do accept that some items are dear, for example, petrol, car hire and drink. We must remember also that the high taxes derive almost directly from public expenditure but we are making effective and rapid progress in that direction.

Will you do anything specifically about car hire?

The question of targets needs to be cleared up. Deputies O'Malley, Hussey and McCartan all mentioned targets and I accept that the targets that were referred to are ambitious; but let me clear up the point about the 13 per cent. The 13 per cent increase in quotas is for the first nine months of 1988. Bord Fáilte say that for the year as a whole they will be close to 15 per cent.

How is it broken down?

We have many unsolicited letters from hoteliers around the country saying they had a bumper year.

How many visiting friends and relations?

Would you listen to the facts? The president of the Irish Tourist Industry Confederation, as recently as last week, at the annual dinner of the confederation said the targets could be achieved and were being achieved.

I have a letter dated 25 November ——

Some people said that we had special potted developments this year because of the Millenium. There was also the special fact this year that American tourism notoriously drops in an American presidential year and has always done. The fact is that one can reasonably expect that there will be a major increase in American tourism next year over this year. This has always been the case. Allowing for the drop our numbers here have been much better than elsewhere. The 6 per cent drop in American tourism this year refers to Europe generally. The drop in respect of American tourism to Ireland was only 1 per cent, showing that we have a very positive position vis-à-vis others and we will have a very big increase next year. There should be no criticism of the visiting friends and relatives plan.

Nobody is criticising them. We want to know the figures.

They make a significant contribution to our economy and their money is as good as that of others.

(Interruptions.)

Deputy Stafford made some good points about sea fishing which seems to be the Cinderella of angling. I fully agree with him that this should not be so. In the light of his own experience with his 146 lb. skate, it is something we should be promoting more widely. He also referred to the quality of our environment. We did have problems in Dublin at a particular time but that is not to say but that the special unique environment here is probably the most attractive feature of our tourism, and let nobody do anything to undermine that.

Deputy McCartan questioned the figures. We have firm figures from Bord Fáilte for the first nine months.

They are not broken down.

We did have a big influx in October and November with the football game and Bord Fáilte are confident that it will be close to 15 per cent at the end of the year and that optimism is shared by the president of the industry most directly concerned.

What about the hotel bed occupation?

Will you take it up with the Irish Tourism and Hotels Confederation?

We will take it all up. The Deputies should not be discouraged by our success.

(Interruptions.)

We invite everyone to join with us in this effort.

(Interruptions.)

As my colleague, the Minister for Education, says, I am writing and inviting Members on the other side of the House to join with us in the success and then we will allow them to share in the kudos as well. Míle bhuíochas do gach éinne a ghlac páirt sa díospóireacht seo. I enjoyed it greatly myself. As in the area for which I have regular responsibility the perception of what we have both in terms of our food and quality is so positive that we should not do anything to undermine it. Go raibh míle maith agaibh.

Vote put and agreed to.
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