asked the Minister for Health the average waiting list for admission for non-emergency cases to (a) St. James's Hospital, Dublin 8; (b) St. Vincent's Hospital, Dublin 4; (c) the Adelaide Hospital, Dublin 2; (d) the Meath Hospital, Dublin 8; (e) the Mater Hospital, Dublin 7; (f) Beaumont Hospital, Dublin 9 and (g) the James Connolly Memorial Hospital, Dublin 15; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
Ceisteanna — Questions. Oral Answers. - Hospitals' Waiting Lists.
20.
Information is not available in the form requested by the Deputy. However, information relating to the numbers on waiting lists is set out in a table which I propose to circulate in the Official Report. I will communicate with the Deputy at a later date when the information requested in respect of St. James's Hospital becomes available.
Waiting lists are of themselves very unreliable as a gauge of how well a particular service is operating. Waiting lists for in-patients include (1) patients presenting for first time treatment and those receiving continuing care and (2) patients who may be on one, or more than one, consultant's list for the same condition.
Waiting lists are also distorted by different consultants' policies on whether patients who are unlikely to be operated on, or patients who do not currently but will in the near future require admission, are added to the lists.
In any event waiting lists should be viewed in terms of the throughput of elective admissions and day cases. Between January and March of this year 23,394 of these patients were treated by the hospitals referred to. If this level of activity is maintained a total of 93,576 non-emergency patients would be treated this year in these hospitals. This level of throughput places the number of people on waiting lists for elective procedures in the appropriate context.
|
Hospital |
Waiting list for non-emergency cases |
|
St. James's |
Not readily |
|
available |
|
|
St. Vincent's |
2,369 |
|
Adelaide-Meath |
3,203 |
|
Mater |
3,436 |
|
Beaumont |
2,500 |
|
(approx.) |
|
|
James Connolly |
|
|
Memorial |
54 |
I am not surprised that the health services are in such a state when the Minister for Health does not know the average waiting list. I should like to give him that information.
That is not in order.
Will the Minister confirm, as is stated in the annual report of the Adelaide Hospital, that there is at least an 18-month waiting list for elective surgery in that hospital? Is the Minister aware that the position is the same in most hospitals in Dublin? Will the Minister confirm that the position is so bad that GPs are telling their patients to call an ambulance and go through the accident and emergency service in order to get a bed in a Dublin hospital? I should like to ask the Minister to open the two new hospitals in Dublin as an emergency and make sufficient resources available to ensure that the 23,000 people on waiting lists for hospital beds are attended to as quickly as possible.
I do not accept the allegations made by the Deputy. The Deputy should recognise the excellent work being done by the staff and management of so many hospitals and, in particular, the six hospitals the Deputy referred to.
The Minister has made the situation worse.
The Minister cannot ignore the problem.
Will the Minister publish the report he got from——
Deputy Harney has asked a question and she might be courteous enough to listen to the reply.
Certainly, if I get one.
A Deputy
The Deputies are not interested in listening.
In 1988 there were almost 90,000 admissions to the hospitals the Deputy is talking about. That is approximately 300 admissions per day into the six hospitals; yet Deputies come into the House and say there is no service. There were almost 500,000 out-patient attendances at those six hospitals alone and 33,000 day cases attended to in the Dublin area. There is a good service there.
A Cheann Comhairle——
May I——
Deputy Ivan Yates.
Would the Minister accept that in the same way as he said questions can be raised about statistics on waiting lists, questions can be raised about the statistics he has just read out? The same patient can be treated several times on the revolving door policy which is now in operation. Would the Minister agree that, in relation to some specialities for these hospitals, such as ENT and out-patient services, the waiting lists are now so long that permanent damage may be done to the health of patients if the problem is not resolved?
No, I do not accept that. I accept that there is a waiting list in certain specialities, for example, orthopaedics, hip replacement operations and for tonsil and adenoid operations in children, although some people are of the view that in the past perhaps tonsils and adenoids were removed more frequently than they need have been. With regard to orthopaedics I should like to say that——
Pensioners are in agony.
——there has been a greater demand in that area since the technique was improved. Twelve years ago there were no hip replacements. During the first five or six years patients were reluctant to have hip replacements but now patients want hip replacement operations done as rapidly as possible. There is a waiting list, but there has always been a waiting list. Since we came into office——
They have got worse.
——two new operating theatres have been built in Cappagh Hospital which is the largest orthopaedic hospital in the country.
The people must be getting sicker because the lists are getting longer.
A new theatre will also be added on to Kilkenny hospital which will improve the number of hip replacement operations and orthopaedic work carried out.
(Interruptions.)
Deputy Brendan Howlin.
May I ask the Minister to comment on the now near universal practice of non-confirming admissions for elective surgery until the day of admission? This is causing trauma for people who have made arrangements in regard to the families and jobs for the day of admission but on the day of admission they find there is no bed for them. In some instances this is happening again and again. Is the Minister satisfied that this is now near universal practice, and what does he intend to do about it?
The resources available for health services are limited and will be limited in the future. There will never be sufficient resources in any developed country to provide the type of service Deputy Howlin would like to see.
Is the Minister satisfied at that practice?
They are basic services.
Therefore, it is necessary to make sure that the most efficient use is made of beds. With regard to elective admissions to hospitals, 54 per cent of admissions in Dublin are elective and if day cases are added it goes up to 68 per cent.
That was not my question.
The figure of 68 per cent is not too bad when we consider the impact of the accident and emergency——
What about the rest of the people who are in pain?
(Interruptions.)
Deputy Howlin.
The question I posed to the Minister was whether he is satisfied that people have not had their admissions confirmed until the day of admission and that these people found themselves without a bed on the day of admission even though they had made domestic arrangements for their families and work? Does the Minister think that is an acceptable practice and, if not, what does he intend to do about it?
They were sent home. The Minister should recognise the problem.
That is not the routine for all admissions——
It is a near universal practice.
The Deputy's concept of near and my concept are so far apart——
I will give the Minister the list of cases I was working on this morning. The Minister is out of touch.
Please, Deputy Howlin.
(Interruptions.)
I call Deputy Mary Harney.
May I ask the Minister if he is satisfied at the situation where 200 people who have cancer are now on a waiting list trying to get into St. Luke's Hospital in Dublin but, according to his reply yesterday, they will not be taken in until the end of June even though he told me in February they would all be taken in by the end of March? Does the Minister not believe it is very serious that people who are suffering from cancer should have to wait so long for hospital beds and will he do something about it?
The people who are on the waiting lists now were not necessarily on the waiting lists at the end of March.
Many of them were.
The waiting list changes.
(Interruptions.)
I have been assured by St. Luke's Hospital that none of these people need emergency admission to hospital and that the 199 people on the waiting list will be called in within the next month.
Let them eat cake.
It is a disgrace.
Unfortunately, it is a feature of health services around the world. When the NHS was brought in in Britain in 1947 there were 500,000 people on the waiting list. The number of consultants in the UK has quadrupled since then but there are still 500,000 people on the waiting list.
(Interruptions.)
Waiting lists will always be a feature of health services.
It is a disgrace.
(Interruptions.)
That disposes of questions for today.
The Minister has been saved by the bell.