Eric J. Byrne
Question:6 Mr. Byrne asked the Taoiseach when the former UCD College of Science in Merrion Square, Dublin 2 will be available for use by the Oireachtas; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Government Buildings.
Roger T. Garland
Question:7 Mr. Garland asked the Taoiseach the cost involved in the planning, designing and construction of the fountain in front of his Department's new offices at the old UCD School of Engineering, Merrion Street, Dublin 2; the reason this was not included in the original schedule of works and costs; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
I propose to take Questions Nos. 6 and 7 together.
The engineering block building, which is part of the former College of Science complex, together with the corridor linking the building to Leinster House will be completed today, 13 November, and both are being handed over to the Houses of the Oireachtas for final fitting out.
The building has been finished to a standard suitable for use by Deputies and staff. There are 34 offices in all and, as is normally the case, the Government Chief Whip will be in contact with the other Whips about the allocation of rooms.
The fountain, in the quadrangle, is not an afterthought but has been part of the architect's design from the earliest sketch scheme.
May I say to the Taoiseach that, while we may all like nice things, very often we cannot afford them. In the light of the estimated cost of £17.6 million — coupled with the image of the Government spending to the tune of £10 million on presidential jets, the cost of the EC Presidency and the refurbishment of Dublin Castle — would the Taoiseach not agree we have gone slightly over the top on expenditure in these areas? Given the amount of poverty and educational needs of the unemployed would he not agree we have stretched our budget far beyond the limit to which it should have been stretched on these occasions?
I dealt fairly fully with this matter before at Question Time. Of course there is always room for argument on these matters. No, I do not believe we have gone over the top at all in view of the job we have to do. I believe that what we are doing in the case of these major public buildings in our capital city is very acceptable to the general public. We have not that many important public buildings. There is a general wish on the part of the public that we should proceed with this programme. The comments I hear from the general public are to the effect that they are all very pleased and proud of the fact that at last these buildings are beginning to get their due as important buildings of our capital city.
Absolutely.
I was amazed at the Taoiseach's reply to the effect that the fountain was included in the original plans because my information is to the effect that it was not. Can the Taoiseach please confirm that it was definitely included in the original plans?
Yes.
In that case obviously I will have to look into the matter because there must be some misunderstanding somewhere.
I would be very surprised if an environmental Deputy would not be totally in favour of having a pleasant environment in our capital city preserved.
Not at the expense of the poor and underprivileged on whom the money would be better spent.
As the Deputy should know all environmental matters have a cost.
Would the Taoiseach not agree that the general public are not happy with the amount of funds being spent in these areas; rather that they would be much happier if the Government spent less money on such schemes and devoted the surplus — which appears to be endless — to the hospital and educational services? Furthermore would he agree — although this is a capital city within Europe — we do not have the same gross national product as other capital cities in Europe? Would the Taoiseach agree that it is somewhat like Marshal Bokassa who, in his ostentatiousness, spent huge sums of money in somewhat similar circumstances?
This is a very long question, Deputy.
Well the comparison is that, as Marshal Bokassa was surrounded by poverty, this is a capital city surrounded by poverty. Yet we inject huge, seemingly endless, sums of money on such grandiose schemes, which is totally unsatisfactory, while there are so many people out there who are not benefiting from these funds.
I am calling Question No. 8. Does Deputy Garret FitzGerald wish to come in on this question?
I hope the Deputy is coming in to my aid.
What proportion of the additional accommodation released has been made available to the Houses of the Oireachtas?
There will be 34 additional rooms.
What proportion of the total extra released does that represent?
I have not got that figure offhand.
Will the Taoiseach let me have it?
I want to deal for a moment with the point raised by Deputy Byrne. It is always possible to advance that sort of argument. In this case, first of all, we took a decision that the cost of providing a proper Government centre for this nation would be offset to a considerable extent by the sale of the property opposite. We would not have gone ahead with it were that opportunity not available to us. Therefore, to that extent, the net cost will not be as awful as the Deputy seems to think. Secondly, the Deputy should keep in mind — I think it is in his constituency — that a very considerable amount of these moneys will be spent on wages of craftsmen and tradesmen.
Will the Taoiseach let me have the information I sought?
I will try to get it for the Deputy.
In regard to the College of Science, would the Taoiseach not agree that the conditions under which Deputies and staff work in this House are absolutely deplorable and would not be tolerated in any factory or hospital anywhere in the country; that it is time money was spent to render those facilities more in keeping with the 20th century?
As one of the Deputies who work in these deplorable conditions may I say that, were I asked to choose between continuing to work in those conditions——
A question.
I am asking the Taoiseach to indicate what would be his priority and whether that money will be provided, for instance, to improve the services and residential accommodation which is not available to the handicapped. I would choose for the money to go to the handicapped.
Deputy Deenihan must be very brief. I am going on to another question.
That is a cheap form of publicity.
No, it is correct.
(Interruptions.)
The Taoiseach has lost his sense of priority.
Question No. 8.
On Question No. 7, are there plans for recreational facilities in the new accommodation?
Yes, it is being examined.