Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 25 Feb 1992

Vol. 416 No. 2

Adjournment Debate. - Agriculture and Food and Industry and Commerce Matters.

Mr. Nealon

I congratulate the Minister for Agriculture and Food on his long overdue elevation to Cabinet rank. I wish him well.

There is a considerable fear amongst small dairy farmers in the west that the new milk hygiene regulations may put them out of business.

As the Minister knows one half of all the milk offered for surrender under the present EC buy-up scheme came from Connaght/Ulster. This is a grossly disproportionate amount, and bad for the industry in the west. Very many farmers are selling out their quotas because of the fear of having to spend thousands of pounds — which they do not have — to bring their milk facilities to the required standards of refrigeration and quality.

Everyone accepts that we must have good quality milk. There is no argument there. The farmers are not too excessively worried either about the EC directive. What they are worried about is the interpretation of this directive by the Department of Agriculture and Food.

There are also serious infrastructural problems in some places, like Tireragh in County Sligo where there is no piped water in large areas. There is an excellent source supply from Lough Easkey in the pipes. The group schemes are ready, but the Government will not provide the money to get the water into the taps.

The water available in the Castleconnor area is so bad that it actually introduces new bacteria in the cleaning operations, but Castleconnor people cannot get the funding for their group water scheme, even though they are seeking it for ten years. What will happen to those dairy farmers under the new regulations? Will we see them wiped out? They have even formed a new farmers grouping to fight against this possibility.

I ask the Minister to contact his colleague, the Minister for the Environment, to work out ways and means, maybe with European money, to help out farmers caught in this difficulty such as those in Castleconnor, Skreen, Dromard, Kilglass and in Culleens all in the Tireragh area of Sligo, and in other similar areas that do not have piped water.

I also ask him to ensure that in the general application of the EC Directive common sense prevails. Good housekeeping is demanded not an elaborate set-up costing thousands of pounds. I am confident the new Minister for Agriculture and Food coming from south-west Cork, will adopt a realistic approach. I hope he will be able tonight to allay the fears of the farmers in my constituency.

Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mr. Walsh)

I thank Deputy Nealon for his good wishes. I hope that generosity will last for a long time.

The matter Deputy Nealon raised is causing a degree of concern not alone in the west but also in the south-west. The draft text of the proposed directive on the rules for the hygenic production of milk is at present under discussion in Brussels. I should emphasise that these are only proposals at this stage and are very likely to be amended in a number of areas before final decisions are made by the EC Council of Ministers. As it stands, I accept that the requirements of the directive would not be satisfied by a considerable number of those smaller farmers who rely on inadequate water supplies — and since the group water schemes are a matter for the Department of the Environment, I will not go into that.

To overcome these fears I have established a working group representative of the various sides of the agricultural industry to prepare a submission for Community aid to help finance the necessary investment in water treatment equipment as well as other work on the upgrading of farms, dairies, and milking premises. I can tell the House that considerable progress has been made on this and that the submission will be sent to Brussels shortly. I can assure Deputy Nealon and the House that I will be doing my utmost in the Council negotiations to ensure that the proposed directive will not present any insurmountable obstacles for the small dairy farmer. I agree with the Deputy that what we want is a functional system on the farm that will produce quality milk and not the Rolls Royce system envisaged in some parts of the directive.

Mr. Farrelly

I congratulate the Minister on his appointment and wish him every success as Minister for Agriculture and Food.

The Minister is aware that many farmers throughout the length and breadth of the country are experiencing problems with the premium and headage payments to which they are entitled. The general opinion in the farming community is that the Government are holding back the money to boost the Exchequer end of the year returns. I have no doubt about that having looked at the way people are being dealt with and the reply I received no later than today which stated that the 1991 premiums which people applied for as far back as last June are being dealt with only now in February 1992. That is not acceptable. Is that the way we are going to continue? Will people have to wait well into 1992 for the 1991 premium payments?

People who have not paid their Land Commission annuity find that their premium payments are being withheld to meet the debt owing to the Land Commission. Many farmers who have come to me in the past two months do not have enough money to buy food or clothing for their families. Indeed, if there is no immediate improvement in this serious situation, we will see many farmers in deeper trouble than they were in previous years. I am not only talking about small farmers and beef farmers but many farmers find that because they made a single mistake in the application form they are being ruled out for the beef premium. Have the Commission been in contact with the Department in view of the fact that the former Minister requested that 85 per cent or 90 per cent of the payment be made this year?

I ask the Minister to clarify the position because the situation is very serious in the farming community.

Mr. Walsh

I understand that my colleagues, Deputy Sheehan and Deputy Farrelly had their names appended to this matter. If Deputy Sheehan wishes to embellish the case I can give him some of my time.

Mr. Sheehan

If the Ceann Comhairle thinks it fit, I will do so.

An Ceann Comhairle

It might be appropriate for Deputy Sheehan to make a statement as the matter is related and then the Minister can reply. We will hear a two minute statement from Deputy Sheehan.

Mr. Sheehan

Is the Minister for Agriculture and Food aware of the serious situation in which a large number of farmers find themselves, particularly in his own constituency of south-west Cork, because they made minor technical errors completing their application forms for the EC premium schemes during 1991? I would also like to mention the problem that special payments, such as the beef premium, suckler cow and cattle headage grant payments, have not yet been paid to all farmers even though the money was due at the end of June last.

Let me remind the Minister that the beef premium was granted to offset the sharp drop in prices over the past decade, it is a form of compensation for the farmers concerned, yet payment is being withheld by the Government thus making life difficult for many. Farmers are being penalised too heavily for having made minor clerical errors. In some cases the penalty for such minor technical errors is that the farmer is debarred from the scheme for a further two years in addition to the loss of payment for the current year. In my opinion this is like taking a sledgehammer to crack a hazelnut.

I appeal to the Minister to make his Department understand that many farmers who have to fill out these application forms may not be able to complete them properly and they are not trying to cheat the system. Genuine mistakes were made. Indeed, in some cases the sex of the animal was incorrect on the card before it was ever delivered to the farmer.

I urge the Minister to reverse the decisions in such cases and to approve payment to all farmers who were refused due to technical mistakes completing the application form. I ask the Minister to rectify this anomaly immediately.

Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mr. Walsh)

Let me thank Deputies Farrelly and Sheehan for bringing this matter to the attention of the House. I am aware of the problem. While in many cases relatively minor errors were made, some of which were not created by the herd owner as the Deputy said, I am, and have been, looking at the matter to get an early and urgent resolution of it.

In some cases, of course, applicants for both the suckler cow and special beef premium schemes are being refused payment because they failed to comply with the EC regulations governing schemes or because they made false claims either deliberately or through negligence and not because they made minor errors. The penalties imposed are those set out by the EC Commission and I do not have the discretion to alter or reduce them. Nevertheless, I have already been in contact with the Commission with a view to having the penalties for irregular claims reduced because I feel they are quite severe.

I have had a reply from the Commission which indicates that changes in the arrangements are not being considered at present but that they will be considered in the context of the negotiations on the new premium system proposed as part of the reform of the Common Agricultural Policy. I have arranged for early discussions on this point with the Commission to be continued. I will be in Brussels next week and intend to take up the matter again because I believe in genuine cases people have been wrongly deprived of their payments. Additionally I recognise that a great many herdowners and farmers are not very familiar with paper work and I would like to have the application form simplified. To that end a departmental task force are investigating as a matter of urgency the problems with the administration of the 1991 cattle and sheep schemes.

The task force were also asked to make recommendations on the application forms to be used for the 1992 schemes and on any changes which they considered might make it easier for farmers to understand the schemes and abide by their terms and conditions. I will wait for the recommendations of the task force, which are expected next week, I hope, before announcing any changes in the schemes.

Any farmers who have genuine explanations for errors in their applications are free to give those explanations to the local offices of my Department. Where mistakes are made without fraudulent intent and where there is some reasonable explanation for the mistake, the Department make every effort to treat the case with flexibility and understanding. I cannot give an undertaking, however, that such explanations will resolve their difficulties since EC Regulations oblige farmers to take reasonable steps to ensure that their claims are accurate.

As many applications are still to be processed and many more are awaiting replies to queries, it is not possible at this stage to indicate the number of applications with minor or major irregularities.

Mr. Sheehan

That is poor comfort to the farmers.

Mr. Hogan

I congratulate the Minister of State on his recent appointment.

The Minister for Industry and Commerce will recall that in 1990 I put down a parliamentary question to him in respect of the urgent need to review the operation of the Casual Trading Act, 1980. I was duly informed that he was aware of this urgency in the knowledge that all local authorities were under great pressure to deal with the convoy of vans, jeeps and luxurious trailers descending on them without warning and parking indiscriminately on the approach roads of some of our most important and beautiful tourist locations. I can only conclude that in the meantime the Minister himself has been casual in the extreme.

Over one year later, and with the same Minister in the Department of Industry and Commerce, the citizens of Kilkenny must continue to be patient until the law is amended to ensure that the approach roads, and particularly the ring road, are safe and clear of any indiscriminate parking. This happens all too often in the shadow of one of our finest hotels, the Hotel Kilkenny.

Kilkenny County Council have had to spend thousands of pounds in court and otherwise to prevent these vehicles from parking and trading illegally, in spite of the fact that the council have provided ten halting bays in the environs of the city. These traders have no licence to trade casually as required under section 3 of the Act. Kilkenny city has a designated trading area under section 7. Under section 11, the powers of the Garda Síochána are obviously insufficient to move people to the designated area or other halting areas.

The general public deserve a more disciplined and ordered society than what is now experienced on a daily basis due to the inoperable nature of the Casual Trading Act, 1980. I look forward to action rather than words from the Minister.

Minister of State at the Department of Industry and Commerce (Mr. M. Ahern)

I thank Deputy Hogan for his good wishes. The Casual Trading Act, 1980 provides for the control and regulation of casual trading. Under the Act "casual trading" means selling goods by retail at a place — including a public road — to which the public have access as of right or at any other place that is a casual trading area.

The Casual Trading Act, 1980 was deliberately framed to give local authorities the power to regulate and control casual trading in their own functional areas. Local authorities are empowered under the Act to designate casual trading areas and where such areas are designated it is an offence for a casual trader to trade elsewhere in the functional area of that local authority. By designating areas, local authorities can exercise control over casual trading in the location of the trading, in the number of permits they issue and through conditions attaching to the casual trading permits. The Casual Trading Act requires casual traders to have a licence from the Minister for Industry and Commerce and, if a local authority have designated casual trading areas, a permit to trade in the designated area. It is the Garda Síochána who, in the main, enforce the Act.

In view of the fact that the Casual Trading Act, 1980 has been in operation since 12 February 1981 and because difficulties have arisen in its enforcement, the Minister for Industry and Commerce stated in the Dáil on 5 December 1989 that a review of the Act should be undertaken and that the removal of the exemptions under section 2 of the Act, which defines the types of selling activities which are not covered by the Act, would be considered as part of this review. In this connection all county councils, local authorities and relevant Government Departments have been consulted and, with the exception of a small number of local authorities, submissions have been received from all of these sources. Among the submissions which have been received are those from Carlow Urban District Council, Kilkenny County Council and Kilkenny Corporation. In addition, submissions have also been received from the Irish Hardware Association, the Casual Traders Association and the Dublin City Centre Business Association. In the submissions received attention has been drawn to a number of difficulties in enforcing the Act and various constructive proposals have been made for amending it to resolve these difficulties.

While there are a number of common features in the experience and comments offered by the local authorities, there are also some significant differences. In drawing up proposals for reform to submit to Government we want, as far as possible, to accommodate these divergences as well as the common features.

Mr. Sheehan

I congratulate the Minister of State and wish him well. I want to impress on the Minister the fact that energetic, enthusiastic young entrepreneurs are being refused financial assistance for projects that could provide extra employment in job-starved rural areas. There is a necessity for the Minister's Department and the Government to keep in touch with ordinary people. Many living in rural areas have very good ideas on ways and means of setting up small industries in which countless numbers of people could be employed. Each small industry created would have a job creation potential of between five or ten jobs, or perhaps up to 20 in some cases. Neither the Government nor the IDA are as yet prepared to give the necessary capital to get these projects off the ground, while countless millions can be given to foreigners to set up here. They are also given tax incentives as sweeteners. Those who have unlimited finance will always get more.

The target for the Government and the IDA must be to channel money towards those who have proven ideas in rural Ireland. The emphasis must be directed to local people who come to the IDA seeking aid of £5,000 to £250,000 to finance worthwhile projects. I urge the Minister to give serious consideration to this very important matter. He knows the situation in County Cork. I represent the three peninsular areas of the county which are job-starved and crying out for industry.

Minister of State at the Department of Industry and Commerce (Mr. M. Ahern)

I should like to thank Deputy Sheehan for his good wishes. This Government's primary goal is to bring about increased employment, greater wealth and higher living standards for all our citizens. To do this we must have a strong internationally competitive industrial sector, allied to a positive business environment.

Our economy has come through a difficult period over the past 12 months. The external environment continued to be hostile mainly due to the Gulf War and the recessions in the UK and US economies. In spite of these difficulties, real output of about 2 per cent was achieved in 1991. While this level of growth will not generate significant employment nor resolve the other economic difficulties facing Ireland, it compares quite favourably with growth in most other European countries and especially in the United Kingdom. Our strong export performance which, at £15 billion represents an increase in value of 4 per cent over 1990, demonstrates the continuing competitiveness of Irish industry which has managed to increase its market share despite the difficult trading conditions.

I am also glad to be able to say that, in the face of this demanding economic environment, the State industrial promotion agencies turned in a creditable performance by creating over 18,000 jobs last year, which substantially met the job creation target for manufacturing and internationally traded services industry which had been set under the Programme for Economic and Social Progress.

The south-west region of the country continued its growth in manufacturing employment during 1991 with 1,868 first-time jobs being created in new and expanding IDA-backed companies, while a further 577 jobs were recovered in companies which in previous years had cut back their employment. These new jobs more than offset total job losses, giving a modest increase of 150 in total manufacturing employment in the region. The region benefited from a strong number of projects grant-approved during 1990. Many of these companies started recruiting in 1991, including QC Data and Motorola in Cork city and Mitsumi in Mallow. The year 1991 also saw a continued emphasis by the IDA south-west office on improving linkage between Irish-owned companies and the established original equipment manufacturers — companies like Walsh Western, Hoermann Electronics, Chip Electronics and BG Turnkey. This continued to give valuable local employment by exploiting the many linkage opportunities with the larger companies in the region.

The IDA are confident that 1992 will see a continued modest growth in manufacturing employment in the region. They have assured me that they will be making a concentrated effort, in co-operation with local communities, to help create employment opportunities in the more rural locations throughout the region. The IDA have been to the forefront in decentralising functions and devolving powers to regional level in the regionalisation of their small industry programme. In fact, the regionalisation process commenced in 1983 with the setting up on a pilot basis of a regional small industry board in Cork. Encouraged by the Cork regional board experience and as required by the 1984 White Paper on Industrial Policy, the IDA small industry programme was formally regionalised in 1985. All the operational elements of the programme for promotion, through project negotiation and evaluation to grant payment and after-care was then decentralised to regional level. This ensures that the IDA, together with other local bodies and community groups, can maximise the talents and strengths of individual regions.

It is generally recognised that we have not enjoyed the same success with the development of Irish-owned firms as we have with foreign companies. Most recently, the Industrial Policy Review Group, chaired by Mr. Jim Culliton, concluded that future employment growth and living standards will be severely constrained unless we succeed in developing a strong indigenous sector of industry. There is little doubt that our industries will face the most serious challenge they have ever known as the Single Market takes effect. Therefore, one of the principal concerns in the years ahead must be to tackle the urgent need for Irish companies to grow and achieve the scale necessary to be successful in the new Europe. If we are to generate jobs and wealth in Ireland we must build indigenous companies of sufficient quality, scale and strength to win and sustain profitable positions in international markets. With a view to achieving this goal, the IDA will be concentrating their efforts both in the Cork region and throughout the country on supporting Irish companies, both big and small, who demonstrate a willingness and capability to inter-nationalise their businesses.

The Dáil adjourned at 9.30 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Wednesday, 26 February 1992.