Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 12 Mar 1992

Vol. 417 No. 3

Order of Business.

The Taoiseach

It is proposed to take No. 10. It is also proposed that statements shall be made from 12 noon, under Standing Order 41, in relation to the situation at United Meat Packers Ltd. and the following arrangements shall apply: (a) the statement of the Minister for Agriculture and Food and other speakers shall not exceed 10 minutes in each case and (b) the Minister shall be called on not later than 2.20 p.m. to make a statement in reply.

Subject to the agreement of the House, it is further proposed that: the Dáil meet tomorrow at 10.30 a.m. and shall adjourn not later than 4 p.m.; at the conclusion of business tomorrow, the Dáil shall adjourn until 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 24 March 1992. the following arrangements shall apply on the debate on No. 7, which takes place tomorrow: (a) the speech of the Minister for Finance and the main spokesperson nominated by each of the groups, as defined in Standing Order 89, shall not exceed 30 minutes in each case; (b) the speech of any other Member called on shall not exceed 15 minutes; (c) the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture and Food shall be called upon not later than 3.45 p.m. to reply to the debate and any division demanded tomorrow shall be postponed until 6.45 p.m. on Wednesday, 25 March 1992.

An Ceann Comhairle

Are the proposals for dealing with the statements agreed to?

Mr. Barry

We would, naturally, prefer to deal with the matter by way of motion but I accept that the Taoiseach has seen the sense that he should have seen before the Order of Business and will allow a party of our size, with 55 Deputies, more than a 10 minute contribution period. Several Fine Gael Deputies' constituencies are directly concerned in a very serious way by the proposed closure of the United Meat Packers Ltd. plants and the House should provide them with an opportunity to make a contribution on the matter. I am glad that that has now been recognised.

The Taoiseach

The Taoiseach is always prepared to be reasonable when allowed to operate reasonably.

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

When forced to.

Mr. Connaughton

When forced to be reasonable.

Mr. McCormack

Did Deputy Terry Leyden have a word with the Taoiseach?

An Ceann Comhairle

I take it that the proposals for dealing with statements are agreed to. I must now ask whether the proposal that the Dáil shall meet tomorrow at 10.30 a.m. and adjourn not later than 4 p.m. is agreed to. Is that satisfactory? Agreed. Is the proposal that at the conclusion of business tomorrow the Dáil shall adjourn until 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 24 March next, agreed to?

Proinsias De Rossa

I fail to understand the reason the House is not to sit next week, given the range of business that needs to be dealt with by the House. There is a serious backlog of legislation. I am particularly concerned that the Social Welfare Bill has not yet been introduced. If the House does not sit next week and that Bill is not introduced next week, there will then be only five sitting days left before the end of March. We have been informed on numerous occasions that the Social Welfare Bill must be passed by the end of March.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy has made his point.

Proinsias De Rossa

May I ask the Taoiseach, in relation to this matter, when it is proposed to deal with the Social Welfare Bill if we are not going to deal with it next week?

An Ceann Comhairle

We must proceed seriatim; one thing at a time. The latter matter is one for the Order of Business proper.

The question now is: "That, at the conclusion of business tomorrow, the Dáil shall adjourn until 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 24 March 1992". That is the question, Deputy, let us have no extraneous matter.

Proinsias De Rossa

You leave me with no option, Sir, but to oppose the proposal that the House shall not sit next week. It is disgraceful since there is so much business for this House to get through.

Mr. Garland

I wish to protest in the strongest possible terms at the proposal to adjourn this House until 24 March 1992. We have just begun Committee Stage of the most important Environmental Protection Agency Bill, 1991. We shall lose three hours of that business today and there is to be no sitting next week.

An Ceann Comhairle

I am putting the question: "That, at the conclusion of business tomorrow, the Dáil shall adjourn until 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 24 March 1992". Is that agreed?

Proinsias De Rossa

Vótáil.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will the Members claiming a division please rise in their places?

Deputies Mac Giolla, De Rossa, Rabbitte, Gilmore, McCartan, Sherlock, Byrne, Garland and Gregory rose.

An Ceann Comhairle

As fewer than ten Members have risen I declare the question carried. The names of the Members who claimed the division will be recorded in the Journal of the Proceedings of the Dáil.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle

Are the proposals for dealing with the debate on No. 7, which takes place tomorrow, satisfactory and agreed? Agreed. Is it also agreed that any division demanded tomorrow shall be postponed until 6.45 p.m. on Wednesday, 25 March? Agreed.

Mr. Barry

Will the Taoiseach take the earliest opportunity to disassociate himself from the vicious attack made on the Supreme Court by a member of his party in Seanad Éireann last night?

An Ceann Comhairle

There should not be any reference to Members or incidents in the other House. There is a long standing convention. Let us adhere to it.

Mr. Quinn

In regard to the Order of Business, I wonder if the Taoiseach, or perhaps the Chief Whip, could confirm that we will be shortening by one week the normal Easter recess, so as to accommodate the adjournment next week to accommodate the St. Patrick's Day national holiday and the fact that Ministers will be abroad on Government business?

The Taoiseach

That discussion is continuing between the Whips. It is traditional that we do not sit on the day after the bank holiday, which is Tuesday. The hours that will be lost on Thursday will be made up in subsequent weeks and the Social Welfare Bill will get its normal run and will be finished on time.

Proinsias De Rossa

Now that Deputy Quinn has salved his conscience——

(Interruptions.)

Mr. Wilson

He has one, and that is important.

Proinsias De Rossa

With regard to the St. Patrick's Day arrangements in New York, has the Taoiseach instructed the Irish ambassador not to participate——

An Ceann Comhairle

It does not arise now, Deputy.

Proinsias De Rossa

——on the platform in the New York parade in view of the fact that an admitted member of the Provisional IRA is the marshal of that parade and Irish citizens are being refused permission to march in that parade because——

(Interruptions.)

Proinsias De Rossa

Will the Taoiseach indicate that Ireland will not be represented on that platform?

An Ceann Comhairle

No, he cannot. It does not arise now.

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

Will the House give an opportunity to the Taoiseach to disassociate this House and this country from the actions of the organisers of the parades in both New York and San Francisco——

An Ceann Comhairle

I have ruled on that matter. It is not in order now, Deputy O'Keeffe.

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

——in appointing as honorary marshals, IRA members? It is a disgrace to this country.

An Ceann Comhairle

I am very sorry that the Deputy should show such disdain for the Chair as to raise again, a matter that I have already ruled out of order.

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

The parades will take place next week. There will not be a further opportunity to raise this matter, and I would ask the Taoiseach——

An Ceann Comhairle

I am calling Deputy Howlin.

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

——to disassociate himself and the Government of the country from——

An Ceann Comhairle

There was plenty of time to raise this matter all along. Deputy Howlin has been called.

(Interruptions.)

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy O'Keeffe will resume his seat.

Mr. Howlin

Will the Taoiseach make some time available today to the Minister for Labour to report to the House on the progress to date of the Labour Relations Commission in relation to the worsening bank dispute? I understand that one of the major banks is going to lay off staff.

An Ceann Comhairle

That can be raised in so many other ways. It is an ongoing matter which could have been raised in so many ways in this House.

Mr. Howlin

I am asking for time for the Minister for Labour——

An Ceann Comhairle

No, no.

Mr. Howlin

Is it in order to ask for time to be given to the Minister to make a statement?

An Ceann Comhairle

No, it is not in order now. The issue is ongoing.

Mr. McCartan

Will the Taoiseach arrange at the Whips meeting, which I will not be able to attend today——

(Interruptions.)

Mr. McCartan

——for the Whips to discuss the status of the crime committee who were established by order of this House and who were unable to obtain a quorum at its last meeting? Will the Taoiseach in consultation with the Whips review their terms of reference so that they can sit in public and see that they are given the resources——

An Ceann Comhairle

It seems to me that what the Deputy is raising is quite out of order.

Mr. McCartan

It deals with the business of the House, although in committee.

Mr. Wilson

The Workers' Party is on its feet.

Mr. McCartan

It requires urgent review.

An Ceann Comhairle

I suggest that the Whips might look at the matter and discuss it. Deputy Mac Giolla is offering. I will call Deputy Deasy.

Mr. McCartan

As the door has been closed to me, may I ask that the Taoiseach will raise the matter?

An Ceann Comhairle

No.

Tómas Mac Giolla

In view of the Taoiseach's statement to the Dublin Tribune will he confirm the plans of Delta airlines and Aer Lingus to fly direct to New York, thereby providing 30,000 extra——

An Ceann Comhairle

I am sorry, Deputy, I thought you had something relevant to raise.

Tómas Mac Giolla

Will the Taoiseach say if they will do this? We are losing the whole tourist season if we do not do it now and make up our minds about it.

(Interruptions.)

Mr. Deasy

I am appalled by the reaction from the Government side to the comments and statements made by Deputies De Rossa and J. O'Keeffe. There was a lot of noise and jeering when they suggested that there should be an unequivocal statement from the Government——

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Deasy, please desist. I am proceeding now to the business ordered.

Mr. Deasy

——that we denounce the taking over of parades in New York and San Francisco by the Provisional IRA. The Taoiseach should be ashamed of himself.

(Interruptions.)

Mr. Deasy

We should be unequivocal in stating that we oppose any involvement of these people in these parades.

Mr. V. Brady

On the Order of Business, I would seek the Chair's assistance——

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

This is more ambivalence on the part of the new Taoiseach.

The Taoiseach

No, certainly not.

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

Why do you not disassociate yourself?

An Ceann Comhairle

Please, Deputies.

Mr. V. Brady

I tried unsuccessfully yesterday to raise the matter of Tuesday night's "Today Tonight" programme in which a private individual was tried and judged, apart from the distress brought to his family. I know the Broadcasting Act is being reviewed. Therefore the Minister might have some part to play in this. I seek the Chair's assistance as to how I might raise this matter.

An Ceann Comhairle

This matter was raised by another Deputy yesterday morning. The Chair is anxious to facilitate Deputies in a matter of this kind about which they are obviously so aggrieved. At the moment I can only say that it is a matter for the Broadcasting Complaints Commission under the appropriate Act of 1976. Nevertheless, I would ask Deputy Creed and Deputy Vincent Brady to communicate with my office to see if we can facilitate them in another way.

Mr. V. Brady

I will certainly have a cup of coffee with the Chair and discuss it with him.

Mr. J. O'Keeffe

Has the Taoiseach anything to say before he leaves?