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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 1 Dec 1993

Vol. 436 No. 5

Greyhound Industry (Amendment) Bill, 1993: Second Stage.

Question proposed: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

The Greyhound Industry Act, 1958 was enacted to provide for the improvement and development of the greyhound industry, greyhound racing and coursing and for the better control of greyhound race tracks and coursing grounds. The Act established Bord na gCon and gave to it the responsibility for the control of racing and the improvement and development of the industry. Up to 1958 greyhound racing had been controlled throughout the 32 counties by the Irish Coursing Club. That club continues to control racing at Northern Ireland tracks and coursing throughout the 32 counties. The 1958 Act recognises the Irish Coursing Club as being, subject to the general control and direction of Bord na gCon, the controlling authority for the breeding and coursing of greyhounds and gave it responsibility for the maintenance of the greyhound stud book which it had been producing since 1923.

The greyhound industry is a significant source of employment in rural areas. I understand about 8,000 people are involved in the industry as breeders, owners and trainers. If those involved in operating racing tracks or in the supply of ancillary services are included, it is estimated that some 10,000 people derive their livelihoods either directly or indirectly from the industry.

Greyhound breeding and rearing are integral parts of rural life in Ireland. It is primarily carried on by the agricultural community, in particular on the smaller, less economic holdings, to augment the earnings of small farmers, agricultural sector employees and rural dwellers. The profile of a typical Irish breeder is that of a small farmer or rural dweller who keeps one, two or three dams for breeding purposes; who sells some of the puppies produced at 8 to 12 weeks old to other neighbouring farmers and rears the balance of the litters to racing age. The greyhounds are then raced to demonstrate their capabilities for sale or export.

According to recent surveys carried out by Bord na gCon and the University of Limerick, farmers, mainly with small holdings, account for 6,000 of the total of 8,000 breeders, rearers and trainers. These activities generate an estimated farm income of about £16 million or an average of £2,600 per farmer. It is estimated that the industry is worth about £40 million per annum to the economy. As such, it must be regarded as a genuine alternative farm enterprise making a significant contribution and capable of making an even greater contribution towards retaining people on the land and in rural areas.

It is an enterprise with a long tradition in which we are skilful, have natural advantages and market potential. It is basically export orientated, its main market being the United Kingdom. The industry at the breeder and rearer level is in reasonably good condition. However, if the sector is to reach its full potential existing export markets must be exploited to the full and new markets identified and developed. Apart from the many merits which the greyhound racing sector has to recommend it on its own account — such as the direct and indirect employment that it provides and its contribution to the quality of life for residents and tourists — it is also the shop window for the industry. Without this the breeding and rearing sector cannot develop fully. It is the performance of greyhounds at top quality racing meetings which attracts buyers from abroad and encourages them to pay top prices.

I regret that the current state of the greyhound racing industry could not be described as healthy. Attendances at greyhound race meetings fell from 1 million in 1975 to about 700,000 in 1992. Bord na gCon's main sources of income, in other words the sources of income available to the industry for its development, are the on-course betting levy, profits from tote betting, Government grants and sponsorship. The levy income increased between 1981 and 1991 only from £1.1 million to £1.2 million. This represents a substantial reduction in real terms. Levy income is believed to have dropped to a figure slightly in excess of £1 million in 1992. Reduced attendances have also affected the tote. Net proceeds from the tote dropped from £700,000 in 1981 to £169,000 in 1991. Provisional figures for 1992 show a slight recovery to about £300,000.

On the other hand the board's contribution to prize money has been well maintained over the last decade. In 1991 and 1992 its contribution represented about 55 per cent of its operating income. Total prize money has seen a marked increase since the mid-eighties with the contributions from private sector sponsors increasing steadily. The sponsors were recruited by the board and the track managements themselves. However, the board's contribution is by far the greatest at over £800,000 per annum. Sponsorship by outside commercial interests has reached a record high of £560,000 i.e. almost 30 per cent of the current total prize money of £2 million.

The board's income has been supplemented in recent years by grants-in-aid from the proceeds of the off-course betting levy. These grants-in-aid amounted to £0.5 million in 1990 and £0.75 million in each of the years 1991, 1992 and 1993. Despite this, all of the board's income is now used up on administration and prize money, leaving no funds available for developing the industry or for grant-aiding the maintenance or improvement of facilities at tracks. The tracks themselves have to rely on income from admission fees, trial fees, bookmaker pitch fees and profits from bar and catering activities. The tracks find it very difficult to operate profitably on this basis and there are no funds generated which could be used for reinvestment in facilities. The net result is that the tracks have become progressively run down.

In the current climate with an ever-increasing array of leisure time activities to choose from, I believe that there is little prospect of attracting the punters back to greyhound racing in increasing numbers unless the facilities provided are upgraded to the standards expected today.

Bord na gCon is at present in the process of implementing a five-year plan which was adopted in 1990 in order to restore the organisation to profitability and to redevelop the industry. The main features of the plan are computerisation of operations; adoption of cost cutting measures and the reorganisation of management functions; reallocation of prize money with emphasis on raising attendances at the premier tracks; securing increased sponsorship and other income generating activities; introduction of improved controls of racing and betting; greyhound breeding to be designated as an alternative farm enterprise; a national stud and a marketing centre to be established and Shelbourne Park to be developed as the premier greyhound track in the country. Under this plan Clonmel track was sold and the board is now seeking to sell its track at Youghal. It is also considering the possibility of selling Harold's Cross track and of transferring its racing fixtures to Shelbourne Park. However, the implementation so far of the development plan has not had the desired effect on the fortunes of the industry which remains in a depressed state.

It was in these circumstances and in view of the fact that current legislation governing the industry is now 35 years old that the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry, Deputy Joe Walsh, in July 1992 established a task force consisting of representatives of Bord na gCon and officials from the Department to examine the structures, financing and legislation governing the industry. The remit of this group also included the issue of coursing. The task force concluded its deliberations some time ago. Subsequently, the Department submitted a position paper on the industry to the Minister, Deputy Walsh, and me. Following consideration of the issue by us proposals were put to and approved by Government last June.

The Government recognised that a comprehensive amendment of the Greyhound Industry Act would be a time consuming and complex exercise. They therefore approved the preparation and introduction into the Dáil of a short Bill dealing with three issues of an urgent nature. Heads of a more comprehensive Bill updating and amending the provisions of the 1958 Act are at present in the course of preparation in the Department and I will be pressing to have this work completed as soon as possible.

The Bill now before the House proposes to amend section 9 of the 1958 Act so as to give the Minister power to appoint the ordinary members of Bord na gCon without reference to vocational background and to provide that the term of office of directors shall be three years, terminating on a rotational basis; to amend section 36 of the Act to empower the Minister to make regulations providing for the muzzling of greyhounds at coursing meetings and for veterinary supervision of hares before, during and after such meetings; to amend section 23 of the Act so as to remove the ban on greyhound racing on Sundays, Good Friday and Christmas Day.

The board consists of a chairman and six ordinary members. Under the current Act three of the six members, and not more than three, shall be members of the standing committee of the Irish Coursing Club. I believe this provision is too restrictive. It means that only three places are available for all other sectors of the industry such as owners, breeders, trainers, private track owners and bookmakers. A case could also be made that the board should include someone with good business and financial experience and expertise.

I fully recognise that members of the ICC could claim to represent greyhound owners, breeders, trainers and even private track owners and, indeed, a new board might well contain several people who happen to be members of the standing committee of the ICC. However, I believe that the statutory requirement is no longer valid and should be removed.

The inclusion of this provision in the 1958 Act must be looked at in the light of the circumstances obtaining at that time. Until the 1958 Act was adopted and Bord na gCon established, the ICC was the controlling body for both greyhound racing and coursing. It was logical that, as the body with the expertise at the time, it would, in the interests of continuity, be given a major role in directing the new body. That situation no longer exists and I propose to avail of this opportunity to remove these unnecessary restrictions on the Minister when appointing a new board.

The current legislation also provides that the ordinary members of the board are appointed for a five-year term of office and that a new board is appointed during every fifth year. In the interests of greater flexibility and continuity I am proposing that membership of the board will be for a three-year term and that vacancies will occur on a rotational basis. In other words, after the initial "running-in period" two vacancies will fall to be filled each year.

Deputies will recall that earlier this year the question of coursing was given a comprehensive examination by the House in the context of the Wildlife Bill, 1993. During that debate I announced that I had reached agreement with the ICC that controls aimed at eliminating the kill during coursing meetings would be introduced. These controls include rule changes which would reduce the number of courses, improve veterinary supervision and provide for better conservation of the hare stock. The club also agreed to complete its research programme aimed at developing a muzzle which, while having regard for the welfare of hares and dogs, will lead to all dogs participating in enclosed live hare coursing being muzzled. The club further agreed that a significant number of courses in the current coursing season would be used as trials to allow for the introduction of muzzling for all courses at an early date.

I have established a monitoring committee within the Department to oversee the implementation of these measures and to assess their impact. In accordance with their agreement, the ICC commenced the phasing in of muzzling on a trial basis at the beginning of the current season. In the initial stage of the trials the greyhounds participating in the semifinals and finals of all stakes were muzzled. The ICC recently agreed to extend these trials on muzzling to more than 50 per cent of all courses.

Muzzling has certainly brought about a considerable improvement. The latest information available, covering the period up to 21 November, is that out of 1,029 courses involving muzzles four hares were killed and eight were injured and were put down. The momentum towards increasing the level of muzzling will continue with all greyhounds being muzzled at enclosed coursing in time. My target is the elimination of the kill and I will continue to work towards that goal. Initially a soft leather muzzle was used and more recently a plastic one. The search for the ideal muzzle will continue. I will continue to monitor the situation, the ultimate aim being the elimination of the kill.

The agreement we reached with the ICC will be observed without the necessity of legislative backing. Nevertheless I consider it prudent to avail of this opportunity to include a provision authorising the Minister to make regulations providing for the muzzling of greyhounds at coursing meetings and for the veterinary supervision of hares before, during and after such meetings. These are enabling provisions which will give the Minister power to introduce the required measures without delay if the need arises. Deputies will also observe that these powers are being given added teeth by the level of the penalties being prescribed.

The third provision in the Bill proposes to remove the ban on greyhound racing on Sundays, Good Friday and Christmas Day. Various interests within the industry have represented to me that several highly remunerative meetings could be held on Sundays if this ban were lifted. As I stated, the greyhound industry is in competition with a variety of other forms of entertainment, none of which suffers from a similar ban. I am therefore proposing its removal in the interests of fair competition.

Both the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry and I have accepted for some time that this ban should be removed but its removal got caught up in the wider issues which were under consideration. Two Sunday race meetings were held during the past year in the knowledge that steps were being taken to have the ban removed. I am now proposing that the removal of the ban will have effect from 1 December 1993 in accordance with an established precedent whereby the amendment gives legal effect to the provision from the date on which the policy decision was taken. The removal of the ban on Sunday racing and the reconstitution of the board were recommended by the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Commercial State-sponsored Bodies in its report on Bord na gCon. The remaining recommendations of the committee can be classified under two headings. They are either matters for Bord na gCon and as such need not directly concern us here or they are proposals which require legislative changes. I can assure Deputies that these latter proposals will be given careful consideration when the comprehensive Bill is being drafted but I will comment briefly on some of the more important issues raised.

I consider that satisfactory and generally accepted control structures which will win the confidence of the punter are essential if the fortunes of the industry are to be reversed. A major cause of the current lack of confidence in the controls derives from the fact that the board owns seven out of the 18 tracks currently operating. The general public are not convinced that the one organisation can satisfactorily operate racing tracks and at the same time objectively administer the various control procedures necessary to ensure scrupulously fair treatment for everyone. This is a matter to which I will have to give serious consideration before drafting the second Bill.

Another issue which will require careful consideration is the statutory relationship between Bord na gCon and the ICC. The Oireachtas Joint Committee recommends that there should be no statutory relationship. This begs the question of whether it is wiser to allow the ICC to operate as an entirely private body or to retain some control over its activities.

Regarding the Joint Committee's recommendation that the international marketing centre should only be proceeded with if it has a high chance of commercial success, I fully appreciate the concerns expressed and in fact the project was not proceeded with during the programme which is now drawing to a close. However, the motives behind this proposal deserve some sympathy in my view. As I stated, the industry is basically export orientated. A very attractive potential market exists in the United States. Unlike other markets, the emphasis in North America is primarily on stamina. While greyhounds in Ireland run in track racing of six-dog races, mostly on grass and to an outside lure, in the United States they run in eight and sometimes nine-dog races on sand to an inside lure.

American buyers are not prepared to hold Irish-bred dogs for the recommended acclimatisation period. Major US buyers have recommended that Irish greyhounds destined for export to North America should be trained in Ireland for US conditions. This was the function which the proposed marketing centre was intended to fulfil. Because of the emphasis on stamina in the United States, greyhounds have also to be specially bred for this market. The original marketing centre proposal envisaged a national stud and marketing centre. The Department has discussed this matter with Bord na gCon and as a result I am hoping that the new structural funds programme when finalised will include more flexible arrangements in relation to this issue. I fully recognise that a venture of this nature cannot be guaranteed to be a commercial success but I consider that the allocation of a certain amount of funds to the projects is justified.

I would again draw the attention of the House to the substantial nature of this industry. It employs about 10,000 people, mostly in rural areas, thereby helping to maintain the demographic balance between urban and rural areas. Greyhound rearing and breeding are genuine alternative enterprises in the agricultural secor. In terms of overproduction in our main agricultural products this sector has an important role to play in maintaining farm incomes.

The role of this House is to provide the legislative framework which will enable the industry to reach its full potential. The current legislative framework is the Greyhound Industry Act, 1958. A thorough overhaul of this legislation is now called for.

Meanwhile a preliminary Bill dealing with three urgent matters is being presented to the House for adoption. The issues, namely, the reconstruction of the board of Bord na gCon, the removal of the ban on Sunday greyhound racing and enabling provisions empowering the Minister to make regulations governing the muzzling of greyhounds at coursing meetings and veterinary supervision of hares are not controversial and I recommend their adoption to the House.

There is an astonishing air of unreality about the way this debate has started. In his final words, the Minister of State spoke of the measures he contemplates here as being uncontroversial. The only way in which they could be regarded as uncontroversial is that the Minister of State has deliberately avoided any area of controversy in presenting these proposals.

I intend to show that a series of controversial areas are not dealt with in this Bill. There is an even greater element of unreality about the fact that for the first time in a long time we have the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry in the House when we are dealing with a Bill to do with agriculture, and he has said nothing. The Minister sat through this presentation of his proposals without saying a word. Is he muzzled, or has he volunteered to be muzzled? Maybe the Minister is quiet because he wants to avoid controversy. That would be very much in keeping with his conduct. He avoided controversy yesterday when the IFA held a major rally in Dublin on GATT. The Minister came in, said his party piece and left immediately. He did not wait to hear any of the controversial matters that other people, including myself, wanted to raise. The Minister may have thought he had honeyed words for those people yesterday but none of these people believe that he understands the issue before us well enough to do anything worthwhile.

Yesterday, we had the Minister running away from a GATT debate and today we have the Minister of State saying a lot of overblown things in his presentation of the Bill. He spoke about the importance of greyhounds as an alternative farm enterprise and how important alternative farm enterprises are. For a great many people who are involved in this industry the keeping of greyhounds is not in any sense an alternative farm enterprise. It is something they enjoy doing and many continue to do for as long as it does not cost them too much money. Most people do not make a substantial amount of money from keeping greyhounds. In presenting this as an alternative farm enterprise, the Minister is badly mistaken.

I am sure the Minister, of State in his heart of hearts knows that what I am saying is right, although I am not so sure about the Minister for Agriculture. He does not seem to have time to bother with these matters. I am afraid my words will be borne out in the future. There is no point in looking to alternative farm enterprise such as this to take up the slack, to make up the losses that Irish farmers will suffer because of what the Minister for Agriculture has failed to do about GATT on account his connivance in the ridiculous CAP reform manufactured by one of his predecessors, Ray MacSharry, of which he personally approved. He has gone to some trouble in this House, Sir, to tell me it was the CAP reform he approved of and not the GATT. I have looked over the references and, as Deputy Rabbitte would say, the Minister's well tailored posterior is well out the window on both those issues. To present greyhound keeping and participation in this industry as an alternative farm enterprise——

Is the Deputy still running for leadership?

——that can help to make up the deficit that the Minister will impose on farm families is a vain enterprise.

The Deputy is the born again leader of Fine Gael.

Has the Minister something to say? The Lord be praised. The Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry has finally found his voice.

What price does the Minister want?

Is the Deputy still running for leadership?

Deputy Dukes, without interruption from any side of the House.

If it were in order I would gladly sit down and yield to the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry to hear what, if anything, he has to say. That is the first reaction we have had from the Minister in years.

We know how the Deputy's party dealt with him. They shafted him. His term as leader of Fine Gael was the shortest.

And the dumb have been made to speak.

The Deputy's party shafted him.

I have achieved a miracle.

What happened to Charlie?

Deputy Dukes must be allowed continue without interruption.

The Minister need not bother whispering sweet nothings across the floor to me about leadership because the way he is going now——

The Deputy's party shafted him. It dealt with him after his short term as leader of the party.

——the Minister has not a snowball's chance in hell of ever aspiring to the eminence of being a former party leader. In fact after 15 December the Minister will not last long in this House.

The Deputy's party dealt with him after a very short time as leader of the party. The Deputy is still keeping up the smart alec act.

Order, please. Deputy Dukes must be allowed to speak without interruption.

The Minister should leave it for the GATT talks.

There should be a special place in the Official Report for Wednesday, 1 December 1993——

For Deputy smart alec Dukes who was found out by his own party very quickly.

——the day the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry broke his silence. I will put it in my CV that I achieved the miracle of making the dumb speak.

The Deputy has a very interesting CV.

I am delighted.

The Deputy has a very interesting CV especially in view of his short term leadership of Fine Gael.

For the last time, Deputy Dukes must be allowed continue uninterrupted.

I find it curious that when the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry breaks his silence of ages all he has to talk about is something that has nothing to do with farmers.

The Deputy should get back to the Bill.

There is more roasting coming for the Minister. He should stick around. Patience, all will be revealed. He will have more to say as I continue.

The Deputy's party dealt with him.

This Bill is being presented as being only a part of a wider review of the Greyhound Industry Act, 1958 and we are told that the rest is to come at some time in the future, although we are not told when. The Minister of State indicated he is now in the process of preparing the heads of a Bill. I would like to know why there is a delay. What is there in the animal that is being gestated in the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry that has taken so long in the birthing? How long will we have to wait for the review to appear? How long will we have to wait to see the full picture? By the Minister's admission this Bill is only part of the picture. The explanatory memorandum states that the Government recognises that this comprehensive amendment of the 1958 Act would be a complex and time consuming task which apparently is not even yet in its early stages. The three measures proposed in the Bill are being brought forward to deal with immediate problems and perhaps to whet our appetites. That is not a satisfactory way of dealing with this industry.

On the Minister's admission it is an industry that is experiencing serious difficulties. The Minister devoted a great part of his speech to illustrating the situation in the industry. He painted a fairly accurate picture of the position. There are some matters he did not mention which I intend to refer to later. He referred to declining attendances which dropped to 700,000 in 1992 from one million in 1975. I believe there has been a peak in the intervening years. In ten years levy income increased from £1.1 million to £1.2 million and it is believed it will decrease this year. Net proceeds from the tote dropped from £700,000 in 1981 to £169,000 in 1991, although there is some hope of an increase in 1992. It is curious that on 1 December 1993 the Minister is in a position to give only a provisional figure of the proceeds of the tote in 1992. Surely that is indicative of another problem which the Minister has not mentioned in his remarks this afternoon.

The Minister has told us how difficult the situation is in the industry, yet he has come into the House with a Bill that will deal with only a small part of the problem. He expects us to believe that what he is doing will be worthwhile for the industry which, on his own admission, is in a very poor state. Why are we not presented with a proper and comprehensive response to the problems of the industry?

The Minister did not mention a number of matters, some of which are difficult and some controversial. I will elaborate. At present there are very serious difficulties in the relationship between Bord na gCon and the rest of the industry. People in the industry, the Irish Coursing Club, trainers, track owners and even Deputies, find it difficult to get information from Bord na gCon. Some time ago when a colleague of mine, Deputy Ivan Yates, asked the Minister in this House for some pertinent information about the greyhound industry the Minister referred him to Bord na gCon, who replied voluminously but without giving the required information.

In addition, there seem to be serious difficulties of communication internally in Bord na gCon, and that is putting it mildly. For example, if my information is correct, last July the members of the board of Bord na gCon felt so strongly that they passed a motion of no confidence in the chief executive of that body. Apparently there has been no response, neither has there been a meeting of the board since then. There is nothing in this Bill about the structure of Bord na gCon. I am not even sure if the Minister intends to include provisions about the structure of Bord na gCon in the next Bill that is supposed to be introduced. The Minister is making proposals which he pretends will help make some progress in this industry. However, far from alleviating the problems in the industry the Minister's proposals will further exacerbate them. I am talking about difficulties that seem to exist in terms of communication within one of the main agencies of the industry and between that agency and other people involved in the industry.

The Minister proposes to delete from the legislation the explicit provision for the participation of the Irish Coursing Club in Bord na gCon and that seems to be unjustified. I have looked in the Bill and the explanatory memorandum and I listened to what the Minister had to say but nothing indicates that this is a measure that will achieve a constructive result. The current problems in Bord na gCon do not arise from participation of the Irish Coursing Club in that body. If the problems are to be addressed they will have to be addressed on their own merits, not by coming sideways at the problem by this measure which the Minister has not explained, defended or justified in any way.

In the Greyhound Industry Act, 1958, the Oireachtas went to the trouble of drawing up a constitution for the Irish Coursing Club, which is included as a schedule to that Act. The Oireachtas felt it was important to legislate for a constitution for a body representing private individuals in the industry. It was felt at the time — I have no doubt for very good reason — that that was appropriate. The 1958 Act set out specific functions which the Irish Coursing Club would carry out. It seems entirely proper and logical that explicit provision be made for participation in Bord na gCon of the Irish Coursing Club, with its constitution and functions determined by statute.

I wonder why the Minister proposes to depart from that arrangement. He has given no clear explanation in this regard. Perhaps that provision is founded on some proposal the Minister has in mind to make a fundamental change in the status, constitution or functions of the Irish Coursing Club which he wants to hide from us. Is this change part of what the Minister has in mind for the next Bill, the heads of which are being drafted in his Department? Is it part of the further plan the Minister will not reveal until he is ready to do so? If that is what the Minister has in mind the honest, open and constructive thing to do is to abandon this Bill and not come before us with a proposal of that kind until we see the whole context of the measures he is proposing. I do not say that lightly, and I am normally of a very open disposition, but when Ministers come into this House proposing to make changes in bodies of this kind without explaining what is involved, particularly when they tell me that another Bill will be introduced shortly, I become suspicious. That is a political recipe for the sucker punch, and we will not see the sucker punch until the other Bill has been drafted and the Minister's proposals are outlined.

I wonder why the Minister would want to do something like that. There are few indications in his speech as to why this proposal is before us. He said he believes that the provision governing participation of the Irish Coursing Club in Bord na gCon is "too restrictive and means that only three places are available for all other sectors of the industry such as owners, breeders, trainers, private track owners and bookmakers". The category to which the Minister did not refer is political hacks. At present the Minister appoints the chairman of the board and three ordinary members. Not more than three members are members of the standing committee of the Irish Coursing Club which has some status under the Act. If this measure is passed the Minister will appoint one chairman and six ordinary members of the board.

The explanatory memorandum states that this proposal would give the Minister power to appoint the ordinary members of Bord na gCon "without reference to vocational background". The Minister has not explained why he believes it is appropriate or desirable to appoint members of the board without reference to vocational background. That does not seem to be what he said in his speech, which is that he recognises the Irish Coursing Club could claim to represent other people but that there is not room to represent all of them on the board. The Minister stated: "I believe that the statutory requirement is no longer valid and should be removed", without giving any evidence on which he bases that proposal.

The Minister also stated in his speech:

Another issue which will require careful consideration is the statutory relationship between Bord na gCon and the ICC.

The Oireachtas Joint Committee recommends that there should be no statutory relationship. This begs the question of whether it is wiser to allow the ICC to operate as an entirely private body or to retain some control over its activities.

That statement is of some significance as a pointer to what the Minister will do in the next Bill. It confirms my suspicion that the Minister has plans to create a statutory relationship between Bord na gCon and the ICC which he is not telling us about. We can equally read, with some justification, the words "statutory relationship between Bord na gCon and the ICC" as "the position of the ICC". If, as I suspect, the Minister has some plans in mind for the ICC he should tell us, withdraw this Bill and not come back before the House until he has shown us the shape of his proposals. Anything else will be deception.

It has been represented to me in my contacts with the industry that the Minister gave or caused to be given certain implicit undertakings to the effect that interests in the industry other than the Irish Coursing Club would be included in Bord na gCon. The Minister referred to some of these interests — bookmakers, track owners, etc., those legitimately interested in participating directly in the work of Bord na gCon by having representatives on the board. However, the Bill contains no guarantees, either explicit or implicit, possible, probable, contemplated or thought about to that effect. There is nothing about this undertaking in the Bill. I wonder whether this omission is an indication that the Minister wishes to have enough leeway so that he can renege on any implicit undertakings or commitments which may have been given.

Taking all those thoughts together, I find that the Minister has not presented a case that is in any way articulate or comprehensible of why he wants to take the measures proposed in section 2. This House should not be asked to agree such a measure in isolation without being given the full picture. I cannot see any urgency in doing this, especially as the situation in the industry is as bad as the Minister said. We should not be expected to agree measures without knowing why we are agreeing them or in what framework we are agreeing them.

Section 3 provides for ministerial powers to make regulations providing for the muzzling of greyhounds of coursing meetings and for other matters concerning the conduct of meetings. I have to say — this is not a criticism of the Bill — that for once I can agree the provisions for the making of regulations in a Bill before this House. The matters which require to be regulated under this Bill should properly be regulated in this way, and the Minister should not be required to come before us to get the active assent of the Houses of the Oireachtas to the regulations. I am not going to sing my usual part on this occasion and make my normal case for not accepting the regulations. This type of regulation is entirely appropriate in this case.

The Minister pointed out that the ICC has already embarked on the practice of muzzling dogs at, I think, 50 per cent of the coursing meetings which have taken place. We have heard reports about this practice but it was not until today that we heard anything which would pass as a comprehensive report on the experience in this area to date. The Minister gave us an indication of the experience to date in this area when he said:

The latest information available to me covering the period up to 21 November is that out of 1,029 courses involving muzzles, four hares were killed and eight more were injured and were put down.

The least one could say about this issue is that if the system currently being operated by the Irish Coursing Club is satisfactory and worked reasonably well on a trial basis, being monitored as it is, I do not see any reason to push ahead with this partial and ill-considered Bill merely to enact it.

The ICC has made it clear that it will continue this practice during the current season, and may do so on a wider scale than that suggested by the Minister. This does not seem to be a matter which requires immediate legislation. In fact, it seems that the process of legislation, and the making of regulations in this regard, might well gain in relevance and perception if we were to wait until the end of the current season for the more detailed Bill the Minister spoke about. We could then have a debate in the House on the basis of a full season's experience and make some sensible decisions.

Section 3 as drafted seems to be deficient in a number of respects, and I will table a number of amendments to it on Committee Stage. In order to ensure that we do a proper job, we should wait until we see the full picture. If we wait for that long we will not be running the risk of any reversals on this issue. Indeed the Minister pointed out the following:

I believe that the agreement which we have reached with the ICC will be observed without the necessity of legislative backing.

Is the Minister going to come before the House early next year with a more comprehensive Bill? We do not know when this will be and, having regard to the promises made by the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry as to when matters, such as the payment of money to farmers, will be brought before this House, the only thing we can be sure of is that it will take longer than promised. We would do a much better job and be in a much better position to judge what should be done if we knew how this practice worked on the basis of a full season's experience.

In regard to this Part of the Bill the Minister said:

These are enabling provisions which will give the Minister power to introduce the required measures without delay if the need arises.

Although the Minister is proposing to us on 1 December that we should pass this Bill, not having presented much evidence and not having waited for an entire season, he is still saying he will have the power to introduce the required measures without delay — who would believe that of the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry nowadays? — if the need arises. He is not saying he will bring in the regulations immediately and he is not saying that if the Bill is passed he will adopt these provisions. Indeed the Minister's demeanour and presentation of this Part of the Bill indicates a fairly relaxed attitude; he does not want to do all this in a hurry. Why are we being asked to pass this partial Bill without being given the entire picture? Why did the Minister not bring the full design before the House? What is so complex about the plans put before the Government, and which are now being translated into the Heads of a Bill, that the Minister feels he has to have this Bill passed urgently while the other measures will take some time? Until we are given answers to those questions we can only be suspicious of this Bill.

It is fair to say that we can expect a general welcome for section 4 which opens the way for Sunday racing. The Minister dealt with the issue in a way which did not answer the question I have in mind. Is he saying that he wants to promote greyhound racing on Christmas Day and Good Friday, days he mentioned. If he does, he should make the case for this. However, if he does not want to promote greyhound racing on those days then section 4 has been very sloppily drafted. He was a little ambiguous about that in his speech.

The Minister then goes on to make some extraordinary statements about two Sunday race meetings that were held this year and the necessity for retrospective approval. I am not in the business of handing out prizes to Ministers or Ministers of State for Agriculture but the comments the Minister makes in his statement about Sunday race meetings and retrospective approval represents the greatest gobbledegook I have ever heard. If the Minister has something to say he can say it much more clearly than that. It is extraordinary that the only part of this Bill that deserves to be taken on a stand alone basis, which is the section 4 provision, is the one that is wrapped up in the greatest amount of gobbledegook.

I ask Deputy Dukes to conclude as he has overrun his time slightly.

I am concluding now, Sir. What we should have before us today, if there is a need to have anything before us, is a simple Bill to provide for the licensing of greyhound racing on Sundays. That seems to be the only part of this grand plan that the Minister will not reveal to us. It is the only part with which we must deal and unless the Minister has some very solid answers to give when he responds to us on this Bill, the rest of it should be treated with the greatest of suspicion unless and until we are shown the remainder of that grand design.

I do not intend to delay the House. The Greyhound Industry (Amendment) Bill contains two main proposals. The first proposes changing the method of appointment of members to Bord na gCon and the second is the granting of powers to the Minister to require that muzzles be worn by all greyhounds at coursing meetings.

From the Minister's long introductory speech it is clear that our greyhound industry is in a very bad state. I am referring in particular to the greyhound track racing industry. The large fall off in the numbers of people attending race meetings and the fall off in the revenue are clear indications of an industry in decline. The greyhound industry in general is worth approximately £40 million or £50 million to this economy and it is incumbent on any Minister who holds the portfolio with responsibility for this industry to take positive action to deal with the obvious crisis in the industry.

Of course, this Bill was not brought forward because of the Minister's concern for the industry, despite the fact that in his introductory speech he refers to a more detailed Bill which he has prepared. It is fair to say that we are here today because of a Private Members' Bill which was introduced by Deputy Gregory at the end of the last session and the commitments which were extracted from the Government during the course of that debate that some action would be taken in regard to the kill in coursing. The Minister has fulfilled his commitment in that regard but has totally ignored the broader needs of the industry and the crisis with which it is confronted. The industry certainly has not thrived under the 1958 Act which established Bord na gCon and which introduced heavy handed bureaucracy into the industry. There is need for radical reform to instil into the greyhound track industry the enthusiasm, the commitment and the hard work of the greyhound owners which was so evident in the past but which seems to have been stifled due to the structures that are in place at present.

The Government should introduce some major measures to deal with that and to free up the market forces within the greyhound industry to enable it to thrive in a way which it did in the past because of its value to the economy and the huge number of people who derive an income and employment from it. The industry has got a very bad name because of the revulsion of the public at the events that take place at some coursing meetings arising from the killing of hares and the circumstances which allegedly led to those events. I would express appreciation to Deputy Gregory for highlighting this issue and forcing this House finally to face up to it. I hope that the proposal in this Bill, which is a direct response to Deputy Gregory's Private Members' Bill, will prove to be effective.

In regard to the third main item in the Bill, to which Deputy Dukes has referred, the idea that the Minister would amend the Bill to enable greyhound racing, I presume coursing and track meetings, to take place on Christmas Day and Good Friday is quite extraordinary. The State does not allow public houses to open on these two days but now a special Bill is being introduced to enable greyhound racing take place. Obviously, the Government feels some distinction must be made between these two leisure activities. I see no demand to have greyhound racing on Good Friday or Christmas Day and I would ask the Minister to reconsider his position in regard to what he is proposing.

The Progressive Democrats have very serious reservations about the changes in the method of appointment to Bord na gCon proposed in this Bill. We see them as a retrograde step to old style political patronage where the Minister, by personal selection, appoints all six members and the chairman of Bord na gCon. I will elaborate on this at a later stage and I hope to move amendments on Committee Stage to give vocational groups the right to nominate members. One can easily identify the types of vocational groups who should have the right to nominate people to a body such as Bord na gCon. I hope it will be a reformed Bord na gCon under whatever new legislation this House accepts following the Minister's second proposal.

It is imperative that the Irish Coursing Club should have the right to nominate some of the members of Bord na gCon. The greyhound owners have a legitimate right to have a representative on Bord na gCon, as have the employees of the tracks and of the industry in general and the track management. In addition, bookmakers and veterinary surgeons should also have representatives. The Minister should have an official on the board holding a watching brief, namely, a representative from the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry.

It is extraordinary that this same Minister proposes vocational group nominations to his new Irish Horse Racing Authority while, at the same time, withdrawing the only vocational representation that exists in the case of the Greyhound Racing Authority.

The proposal in section 3 that muzzles must be worn by all greyhounds at coursing meetings is in direct response to Deputy Gregory's Private Members' Bill. In that debate I outlined my revulsion at the practice where hares are chased to be killed and I accept that the new requirement of wearing muzzles is aimed at removing this objectionable aspect of coursing.

I understand that the new plastic muzzle which has been devised has worked reasonably well in all the coursing meetings held so far this year. The Minister has given more up-to-date statistics than I had available to me. He states that four hares have been killed and that a small number of others had to be put down subsequently because of injuries received. I understand that the hares killed during the course were hit by the muzzle. Obviously, there is a need for ongoing research to determine the right quality, texture and shape of a plastic muzzle that will eliminate this possibility, no matter how rare its occurrence.

The provisions of section 3 give the Minister power to introduce new regulations as well as muzzles. These include veterinary supervision of hares which is designed to ensure that rigid controls apply at all coursing meetings in the future. I wish to sound a note of caution. While these provisions constitute a major advance on the position obtaining, it must be remembered that this overall matter is still at experimental stage and developments will have to be monitored on a continuous basis.

This Minister may convince us of his interest and commitment to introduce extensive and effective regulations. But this Bill, as worded, does not place any legal compulsion on him to do so. Therefore, it is imperative in order to satisfy genuinely held concerns that the provisions of the Bill when enacted require the Minister to do the things set out in section 3 rather than merely allow him to do so if he so desires, as provided in the Bill as published. In other words, when we reach Committee Stage we will be proposing that the word "may" be substituted by the word "shall" on page 3, line 30.

I want to revert to the principle of vocational representation. I believe this principle has been generally accepted in legislation introduced in this House in recent years establishing State boards or introducing some amending legislation in regard to existing State boards. Indeed, the principle has been strongly advocated by the spokespersons of different parties in this House. Certainly on numerous occasions I can recall spokespersons for the Fine Gael, Labour, for my own party, the Progressive Democrats, and Democratic Left strongly advocating that there should be the right to nominate members to State boards from various vocational groupings.

I can recall the present Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs providing for this principle in the Bill which established the current An Bord Pleanála. When Minister for the Environment he introduce amending legislation which altered the method of appointing the members of that board. Indeed, the method which the then Minister for the Environment, the present Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs, put to the House and was accepted was that various vocational groupings who had an involvement in the planning sphere would have the right to nominate people to make up the membership of that board, thus changing the position that had obtained heretofore when the Minister made his own personal choice and appointed people on whom he personally decided.

In more recent times Deputy Mary Harney in introducing the 1992 Bill to establish the Environmental Protection Agency, went to very great pains to ensure there was full representation of vocational groupings on the board of that agency. I myself, when introducing the Radiological Protection Bill, 1991, amended that Bill in the course of the debate in order to strengthen the representation of outside groups and to reduce the involvement of the Minister in making personal selections with regard to who should be represented on the board of that institute. Indeed, in more recent times, in the debate on the Animal Remedies Bill, the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry, Deputy Hyland, accepted Opposition party amendments tabled along those lines and introduced the right to nominate members of the special advisory committee being established under the provisions of that Bill from various vocational groups, and he has acted on that principle since.

I understand, from information passed on to me, that the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry, who has just left the House, himself is proposing to do exactly the same thing in relation to the new Irish Horse Racing Authority and that in that case he proposes that the following be nominating bodies: the Turf Club would have the right to nominate three members; the race courses would have the right to nominate two; the horse owners would have the right to nominate one; the horse trainers would have the right to nominate one, horse breeders one, employees in the horse racing industry one and that the bookmakers would have the right to nominate one.

What about the punters?

And the punters. Why not? These are people who are involved, have an interest and who can make a contribution? It has been considered proper and correct to remove as far as possible the stigma of political appointees, or "jobs for the boys". Political patronage of a blatant kind has brought politics in general in this country into disrepute. The more enlightened approach of recent times of nominating representatives of different vocational groups has been widely acclaimed.

Therefore, I am astonished that there is now a reversal to the old system of political patronage, that we have this Minister seeking to revert to the old, discredited practice of Ministers making all the appointments. Experience has shown that in the case of Ministers who appoint political friends from their own party — it has often happened — that such appointees had little knowledge or expertise to bring to the boards to which they were appointed and, that outstanding committed people were ignored.

From my past experience, both as a member of the Fianna Fáil Party in the past and as a member of Government, I am only too well aware of the mad scramble that goes on every time a vacancy occurs on the board of Bord na gCon. The people who were appointed in the past would have had to have very strong party affiliations before even being considered for appointment. That does the industry absolutely no good. From the sad history of Bord na gCon which the Minister of State outlined in his introductory remarks, obviously they have not had any great success in managing this industry; whereas it is an industry with committed people, whose energy, enthusiasm and commitment has not been harnessed for the betterment of the industry. Therefore, there is resentment, a kind of holding back, when it is seen that those who have been put in charge of the industry are not those who have the greatest interest in it in all cases.

Obviously, there would be some people who would be genuine, who would do their best and would have a valuable contribution to make; but the present appointments system have not led to the kind of development we should like to see because of the structure under which Bord na gCon operates. It would be a very retrograde step indeed to revert to allowing the Minister make all of the appointments. I would suggest to him that he should give this matter very serious consideration. He should increase the numbers on the board of Bord na gCon from the six ordinary members in order to ensure there is widespread representation on that board so that the organisations requesting representation who are deemed to be suitable would be examined by the Minister and that he would make provision for them, as has been done in legislation introduced here on numerous occasions in recent years. It is very audacious of the Minister to seek to do to the greyhound industry that which he would not dare to do in the case of the horse racing industry. Why the distinction? I suspect it was a feeling that he might just get away with it on this occasion. But Dáil Éireann must not allow him to get away with this.

I shall be requesting the Minister to consider tabling amendments himself or to accept amendments tabled by us on Committee Stage in relation to that representation aspect. It is necessary that the Bill be altered to ensure that these regulations regarding muzzles are put in place, because some other person taking over the Minister's office may not feel as committed to do so. Therefore, the provisions of this Bill should place that responsibility squarely on the Minister of the day.

One has to accept that we are still at the experimental stage, that this is a matter which must be kept under close scrutiny and be the subject of review. I would urge the Minister to come forward with the major Bill for the reform of Bord na gCon and the greyhound industry in general within a reasonable period of time. By then we shall have had the benefit of the experience of this coursing season to ascertain whether the experiment with muzzles achieves the desired objective of eliminating the kill from coursing.

I understand that at all of the coursing meetings — and we are now halfway through the coursing season — the muzzle has been used at different stages, and the Minister says now it will be extended to 50 per cent of course meetings. For the remainder of the coursing season it would be important that muzzling be a requirement for all meetings, that all dogs coursed between now and the end of the season should have to wear a muzzle. The industry, knowing the concern of the general public, knowing the concern expressed in this House, should respond to that call from this House, from me, and, I hope, from others today and agree, prior to the provisions of the Bill being enacted, to do that for the remainder of December.

If the Bill is passed and comes into operation, as the Minister proposed, on 1 January 1994, then I hope the Minister will act immediately to ensure that it applies to all dogs participating in coursing for the remainder of the 1993-94 coursing season. This House should be able to review its operation and should have ample evidence before it from the officers of the Minister's Department who will be observing and reporting to him on its success or otherwise. We have not yet reached a stage where one can say one is satisfied that the kill has been eliminated or that the kill will be eliminated because of these muzzles. Certainly, it is a major step forward, but the matter must be kept under review.

Acting Chairman

I am calling Deputy Gregory, who has 30 minutes.

I thank Deputy Molloy for his references to my Private Members' Bill. It must be acknowledged that the Bill before the House was precipitated by the coursing issue, but whether it was precipitated by my Bill is a matter of argument. Two of its three proposals relate to coursing: the muzzling issue and the removal of the obligation to appoint members of the Irish Coursing Club to Bord na gCon. Yet it was not until he got to page six of his speech that the Minister first referred to the word "coursing". The whole issue was glossed over right down to the extraordinary final sentence where the Minister said:

enabling provisions empowering the Minister to make regulations governing the muzzling of greyhounds at coursing meetings and veterinary supervision of hares are not controversial and I recommend their adoption to the House.

I have to disappoint the Minister when he suggests that the cruel treatment of wild animals is not controversial. Muzzles do not remove the cruelty involved in coursing. I will deal at length with that issue in my contribution. To suggest that that whole area is not controversial shows, with respect, that the Minister has his head in the sand. The whole issue of wildlife and cruelty to animals is a major issue, certainly in Western Europe and around the world, and it is becoming an increasingly important issue in this country also.

This Bill, despite some positive features and despite the very good intentions of the Minister in presenting it so speedily to this House, is essentially a dishonest and flawed attempt to sanitise, to clean up live hare coursing by the cosmetic innovation of muzzling, which clearly cannot and will not remove the fundamental cruelty involved. This Bill is a last ditch attempt to save what is now a discredited activity in this country before Western European and world opinion eventually brings us to our senses and forces us to follow the example of most of the civilised world by banning any and all forms of cruelty to animals.

The Bill is a capitulation to a small but aggressive minority who insist on clinging on, in any shape or form, to a cruel and immoral activity which involves the terrifying of a timid and gentle animal, the hare — one of our protected species under the Wildlife Act, 1976 — under the guise of sport or rural culture and tradition. Both the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry, Deputy Joe Walsh, and the Minister of State in their speeches on my Private Members' Bill referred to the inextricable link to the greyhound industry in this country. The truth is that it is none of these things. To say it is a sport is an insult to sport. To say it is part of rural culture and tradition debases and is unfair to our fine rural culture and traditions. To say that cruelty to animals is inextricably linked to the greyhound industry is a falsehood, easily rejected by the huge success of drag coursing, which does not involve live hares, in countries such as Australia, Canada and many other countries around the world.

I do not wish to be over critical of the Minister for Agriculture, Forestry and Food, Deputy Joe Walsh, whom, I accept, firmly and honestly believes he is taking a major step forward with this Bill. Equally, I firmly believe that the Minister is mistaken in his view. On 30 June 1993, at column No. 649 of the Official Report, in response to my Private Members' Bill, the Minister stated that "There will be no delay in introducing changes...". In that regard the Minister has been true to his word. In my view the Minister has shown considerable resolve and courage in facing down the very aggressive coursing lobby by imposing muzzling on them.

Only a short time ago the June 1992 edition of The Greyhound News had a banner headline entitled “Coursing's future secured — muzzling ruled out” over an exclusive article by John Martin which claimed that the Irish Coursing Club “had received Government assurances that the muzzling of dogs had been ruled out”. Little more than a year later at the annual general meeting of the Irish Coursing Club in Portlaoise, according to the Irish Independent of 12 August 1993: “media representatives were asked to leave the chamber while they discussed the vexed issue of muzzling”. The report continues: “The in camera debate took up the whole afternoon and ended with an acceptance that they would have to bow to change, albeit reluctantly”. Ironically, the report was by the same John Martin. It had a very apt headline entitled: “Irish Coursing Club put muzzle on media”.

It is interesting to note the inconsistency of the executive director of the Irish Coursing Club, Mr. Gerry Desmond, on the issue of muzzling. Mr. Desmond earned himself a quote of the week in the Sunday Independent of 20 October 1991 with the statement:

There were, in fact, trials carried out by the Irish Coursing Club a number of years ago and it was found that the hares were being damaged by the muzzles. We felt that it led to suffering by the hares afterwards. When hares get injured they find it very difficult to recuperate from any form of injury.

Exactly two years later, on 12 October 1993, in The Cork Examiner Mr. Desmond has seen the light, and I quote:

So far muzzling is working out quite satisfactorily. The dogs are galloping freely and normally. There are no negative effects yet. It is an innovation and a change to see dogs muzzled and it has been very well accepted by people. The feedback has been generally quite positive.

I do not know how anyone can take that man seriously following that display. However, I want to say why muzzling is not the answer. In this House on 30 June 1993, at column No. 649 of the Official Report it is stated:

The object of these controls will be to prevent cruelty and eliminate the kill.

Muzzling certainly results in a huge reduction in kills. Yet when 160 lbs of muscle comes thundering down at 40 miles per hour on a weak little creature it will inevitably result in kill. Even the most closely monitored courses in the whole history of coursing, which we have had during the past couple of months, have resulted in four direct kills, as we have been informed by the Minister today, and eight hares so badly injured that they had to be put down.

Whatever validity arguments about eliminating the kill may or may not have, to suggest that muzzling prevents cruelty simply does not stand up. The hare does not know the dogs are muzzled and runs for its life in terror. Is it cruel to terrorise an animal in this way? Perhaps the Minister or other Members who speak on this Bill might answer that question.

Let us take the evidence presented by the general purposes committee of the Irish Coursing Club. In its report on the high number of kills at Clounanna last February it was claimed that some of the hares were in fact drowned when they ran into a drain at the end of the coursing field, as stated by the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry, Deputy Joe Walsh, in the Official Report of 30 June 1993, volume 433, column 645. Those unfortunate hares were so terrified that they drowned in their desperate efforts to escape the greyhounds. There have been instances where the hare simply collapses and dies of fright, as Deputy Brendan McGahon, who is present, has told us in the past. If the Minister genuinely believes that his new measures prevent cruelty, may I put his case to the test by drawing to his attention the Protection of Animals Act, 1911, section 1 (1) (a)? This provides that if any person "shall cruelty infuriate, or terrify any animal, or permit any unnecessary suffering to any animal, such persons shall be guilty of an offence of cruelty within the meaning of this Act, and be imprisoned with hard labour for six months." However, section 1 (3) (b) provides that "Nothing in this section shall apply to the coursing or hunting of any captive animal."

Let me put it to the Minister, as I did on 7 April 1993 in a parliamentary question, that he should amend this Act. In his reply to my question the Minister stated that his comprehensive review of the Greyhound Industry Act, 1958, will of necessity include the relevant provisions of the Cruelty to Animals Act, 1965. I again challenge the Minister. If cruelty has been prevented by muzzling, then he should remove the exemption from coursing and let the courts decide whether muzzled hounds terrify hares during coursing. The Minister will get six months if he does that. If, one the other hand, he refuses to amend the Protection of Animals Act in the way I suggest, it defeats his whole argument that he has taken cruelty out of coursing.

Of course, the essential cruelty does not begin or end during the actual coursing meeting. Dr. John Whelan of the environmental study section at the department of agriculture in UCD, has studied the hare and is accepted as an expert in this field. He points out that the hare is a solitary and most individual of creatures and that the real cruelty is in netting and trapping the hares. He states that taking them from their natural habitat is a most stressful and deeply cruel experience for this little animal. Hares are injured during the netting process and when packed into carrying boxes and transported in the boots of cars. They are then herded in scapes for five to six weeks before coursing and often injure themselves trying vainly to escape through wire fences. The hares are terrorised during the so-called trials and training procedure. Will the hounds be muzzled for trials and training sessions? This Bill refers only to greyhounds participating in events. I hope the Minister takes note of this and clears this up on Committee Stage. Furthermore, there is a high mortality rate among hares held in captivity and disease spreads rapidly through the hares herded in what is a most unnatural way for them.

All of this constitutes an obscene and immoral abuse of little animals. This whole practice should be banned. That would be the only acceptable solution to the coursing issue. I do not think the day is very far off before a more courageous and a more just Government will ban coursing, or be forced to do so. As long as live hare coursing remains legal, whether the dogs are muzzled or not, and as long as the netting of this otherwise protected species is provided for in law, we will facilitate the most despicable of all the ingredients that make up the coursing scene. I refer here to the odious practice of blooding, which I also referred to when introducing my Private Members Bill on 22 June 1993, as reported in the Official Report at columns 1605-1606. Since then additional cases have been brought before the courts and one very interesting case is before the court on this day. I will briefly repeat one of the accounts I gave on 22 June, at column 1605 of the Official Report:

The Cork Examiner on 11 September 1992 reported the following under the head-line: “Two found guilty of blooding a greyhound by using a live hare”:

Two men were convicted in Tipperary yesterday of blooding a greyhound by using a live hare.

Is the Deputy saying they should not be?

The report continues:

Both defendants were employed by Matt O'Donnell at the time. The ranger claimed Matt O'Donnell abused him when he went to his house about the matter... Judge William Harnett convicted both men.

As Members may know, Mr. Matt O'Donnell is a leading greyhound trainer, a most respected greyhound trainer in the greyhound world. Recently a case before the courts was reported in The Irish Press on Friday, 12 November 1993 and I understand the same case is before the court today. The headline was “Dog trainer charged — three accused of causing unnecessary suffering”.

Top greyhound trainer Matt O'Donnell was one of three people who appeared at Killenaule Court, County Tipperary yesterday, on charges relating to the blooding of greyhounds. O'Donnell of Mountaylor, Killenaule, was charged with permitting unnecessary suffering to be caused to a rabbit at Mountaylor on November 18 last year.

After reading about this type of activity, which apparently is quite commonplace, it is appropriate to refer to two video nasties, one of which featured prominently in recent weeks and is called "Child's Play III". I am sure Members saw references to it in the newspapers recently. The other is a video which the Irish Council against Blood Sports sent to every Member of this House of an Irish coursing meeting, not a prominent coursing event that one gets snatches of on RTE. It is video of a local run-of-the-mill coursing event. I, most reluctantly, watched both videos. One is restricted to viewers over 18 years — and Members probably know the one I am talking about — the other is for general family viewing. I have seen very small children with parents at such coursing events. In the video "Child's Play III" good eventually triumphs over evil, but in the other evil in the form of brute savagery triumphs over the weak, vulnerable and the gentle. I challenge any Member of this House, including the Minister, to view both of these videos and tell me which of the two he or she finds the more repulsive and which of the two he or she would rather not look at a second time. In truth, I have no doubt what the result would be.

I mention this because I believe it is the duty and obligation of this House to set proper standards of behaviour and decency for the general community. This Bill does not do that. In fact, it does the opposite. It sends out the message that unleashing two large, aggressive, savage and bloodthisty hounds in an enclosed area, surrounded by a bellowing crowd, and pitting them against defenceless hares, of terrorising and terrifying these gentle animals, is inherently acceptable and good. That is the message from the Government. I believe that such a message is extremely dangerous. We must ask why not extend it to pitbull terriers and Dobermans, as they have to be muzzled too. But against whom or what will they be set? That is the moral of the Minister's message in this Bill. When young people are allowed to witness such violence towards animals it is a signal to them that this violence is acceptable, even desirable. A few years ago an American psychiatrist, Doctor Boris Levinson, found a strong connection between children's violence to animals and their subsequent violence to people. We cannot really blame it all on videos and television. According to psychologist, Miss Geraldine McLoughlin, it is all about power and control. Whether they are torturing animals or other children a common factor is a complete lack of empathy with the victim. If we as a society were to promote care and affection for animals and an abhorrence for any form of cruelty we would all be the better for it.

Anyone who read the supplement to The Irish Time of 27 November, 1993 and the report on the Jamie Bolger murder trial will see a frightening context. A reference to Robert Thompson, one of the ten-year-old boys involved, was as follows:

He twisted the heads off live pigeons, didn't he? The baby was just an extension of that, they treated him like an animal.

Only this week six young men from Kirkby, the area of Liverpool where the Bolger family lives, who were on a youth training scheme in the south were brought to trial for kicking a wild rabbit to death. What is the difference between kicking a wild rabbit to death and throwing a live wild rabbit to greyhounds? I suggest there is none. I have to mention again what I witnessed at a coursing meeting in Ballymore which was documented in a letter to The Irish Times on 29 November, 1991:

During the first half of the event a hare turned towards us and tried to escape between the cars, but two young boys, no more than 14-years old shouted and shooed the poor desperate hare back into the jaws of the dogs. Both dogs caught the hare simultaneously and tugged wildly at the screaming victim,...

In that context, making a virtue on economic, sporting or traditional grounds of inflicting terror on a defenceless animal is essentially wrong and dangerous, no matter what cosmetic changes are made.

Hear, hear.

Muzzling is only a tiny step away from what I witnessed at Ballymore. The terror of the little animal remains. Are we to make a sport and indeed a virtue of terror? This Bill legislates to provide terror. I have listed my fundamental reservations and that is the context in which I deplore this Bill.

Section 3 is grossly inadequate. It is essential that there be independent supervision of the release of the hares after the coursing meeting. It is essential that the hares be released into the wild and not onto some coursing club preserve to be re-netted some time later and that this distinction is made clear in the Bill. It is essential that the hares be marked or tattooed to prevent them being recoursed and that this be independently witnessed. The only accountable independent witness would be an officer of the Wildlife Service or an official of the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry. There is no reference to any of this supervision in the Bill, despite the Minister's commitment on 20 June, 1993 as recorded at column 649 of the Official Report.

The statement of Deputy Noel Dempsey on 2 September this year that the release of the hares after all coursing meetings will be carried out under the supervision of control stewards of the Irish Coursing Club is a bad joke in very poor taste. To then infer as Deputy Dempsey did that there would be spot checks by wildlife officers is an insult to our intelligence. In reply to Question 116 on 17 December, 1991 it was revealed that out of approximately 80 coursing meetings held, only nine were attended by wildlife rangers, all of whom are well known and readily identifiable. Spot checks are ineffective. A member of the Northern Ireland Assembly after they voted overwhelmingly to ban live hare coursing in the North was reported in the Belfast Newsletter of 11 October, 1984 as saying:

To leave the control of this so-called sport in the hands of those who have been inflicting such senseless cruelty over the years is like leaving Dracula in charge of the blood bank.

Incidentally the British Government at the time refused to ratify that ban.

Another matter not even mentioned in the Bill is the length of time and the conditions in which hares are held in captivity prior to coursing meetings. The fee-paying public and the media must be given unrestricted access to all coursing meetings and should be permitted to witness the release of hares if they so desire. As coursing enthusiasts here will know, a coursing card often contains the phrase "no photography permitted without special permission". All that needs to be eliminated if there is to be any real step forward, although I doubt if that will be possible in the context of this Bill. The type of Mafia operation which controls many local coursing meetings should be rooted out.

It has been reported in papers recently that observers from the Irish Council Against Blood Sports have been beaten up and ejected from coursing meetings for committing the sin of observing. I hope some of the enthusiasts of coursing, one or two of whom are here, will enlighten us on how they feel about that type of thuggery at coursing meetings.

The requirement that all greyhound owners be members of a coursing club must be removed. That was mentioned in the debate on my Private Members' Bill but it seems to have been forgotten. I can guess why. I hope the issue is resurrected because I have received letters from greyhound owners who do not want to be members of coursing clubs as their one interest is in their dogs and in racing. They do not want to be associated with the cruelty of using live animals whether dogs are muzzled or not.

All these matters are straightforward and should be dealt with in the Bill and I hope the Minister will see to this before Committee Stage. I generally welcome section 2 of the Bill, although it is open to abuse. Provided the section is used to prevent any one interest from controlling the board it is acceptable. A recent study showed that all the members of Bord na gCon and its chief executive had a long involvement with coursing. It was the one common factor among all members. A copy of that report was submitted to the Oireachtas in the past and it is there with all the details. I trust section 2 of the Bill will remove from Bord na gCon the undemocratic dominance of people with a vested interest in coursing. I hope that is the motivation and that it is used by the Minister for that purpose. Nevertheless, I accept the reservations of other Members in that anything which allows a Minister to appoint all members to any such body is, unfortunately, open to grave abuse.

I wish to share my time with Deputy O'Keeffe.

Is that agreed? Agreed.

I support this Greyhound Industry (Amendment) Bill, 1993. The greyhound industry has great potential for growth and employment. However, of late it has faced challenges which must be tackled. That is the ultimate aim of the Bill. The greyhound industry has not had a fair hearing recently with undue criticism coming from certain quarters concerning coursing. Fortunately, those who breed, rear and train greyhounds are committed to the long-term future of the industry. Trainers, along with Bord na gCon, are taking steps to increase the number of people attending greyhound meetings. Anyone who has attended such meetings will testify that they are good entertainment and excellent value for money, particularly when one considers how much one might pay for other forms of entertainment such as concerts or going to a pub for a few drinks.

The greyhound industry is a great Irish tradition, but a tradition with a future and one which needs to be developed. It must evolve to suit changing times if it is to meet its full potential. For that reason I welcome this Bill. It will usher in a new phase in the history of the industry.

Hare coursing arouses extremes of emotion both for and against it. I support our coursing industry, not merely for economic and employment reasons but for broader social ones. Rural Ireland is subject to a variety of pressures at present. Emigration and unemployment have taken their toll and there is a real need to maintain the cohesion of rural communities. One way that vital cohesion can be achieved is by maintaining rural traditions and the values which bind our communities. Hare coursing is one of those traditions and it is important that we recognise its inherent social value. Much of the debate on hare coursing ignores that factor.

As I stated already, coursing has important economic benefits. Greyhound exports are a multi-million pound industry and our greyhounds are in great demand in Great Britain. It is significant also that in recent times breeders in the United States and Australia have been importing greyhounds with coursing bloodlines to rejuvenate the bloodlines of their own animals. Coursing bloodlines were present in the pedigree of 77 per cent of winners of major track events in England and Ireland during the past ten years. Irish greyhounds are top quality, much sought after by foreign importers, and enjoy a status to which other branches of Irish industry should aspire.

Coursing makes a major contribution to the commercial life of rural Ireland. A study of the economic significance of coursing was carried out in 1990-91 by the department of agricultural economics in UCD and revealed that the value of coursing to the economy is in excess of £14 million per annum. That is a massive figure and it can be increased. As a whole, the greyhound industry is estimated to be worth £40 million per annum to the economy.

Employment generation is the central task of this Government and now is as good a time as any to refer to the employment provided by the greyhound industry, which includes greyhound trainers, their assistants, veterinary surgeons and their assistants. The Minister stated that they number in excess of 10,000. Spinoff employment is provided in manufacturing specialised dog food, medications, tonics, collars, car trailers and so on.

In 1958 the Irish Coursing Club was reconstituted under the Greyhound Industry Act, 1958. That Act states that the Irish Coursing Club should be the controlling authority in matters relating to the breeding of thoroughbred greyhounds and greyhound coursing here and should have such functions in relation to greyhound racing and the training of greyhounds for reward as may be in accordance with law. It states also that the objects of the club shall be the promotion of the breeding of thoroughbred greyhounds. All supervisory officials, such as judges, slippers and control stewards are licensed by the club.

Since 1927 the regulation and control of greyhound racing in Northern Ireland has been the responsibility of the Irish Coursing Club. That club issues licences to all racing officials on affiliated tracks in Northern Ireland and to those who train greyhounds for reward, subject to conditions. It appoints control stewards who report directly to the Irish Coursing Club on every greyhound race meeting conducted on the three tracks in Northern Ireland affiliated to the club. The Irish Coursing Club is a member of the World Greyhound Racing Federation because of its responsibility for greyhound racing in Northern Ireland. A special Northern Ireland sub-committee has been appointed by the Irish Coursing Club and that sub-committee has been consulted by Northern Ireland Government departments on many occasions on aspects of greyhound sport.

The use of drugs has always been prohibited in track and coursing events in Ireland. In 1988 the rule on the prohibition of the use of drugs in coursing was amended and strengthened, reflecting the determination of the executive committee to enhance the image of the sport and the Irish greyhound in that regard. The executive committee of the Irish Coursing Club comprises members elected by the four provincial committees whose members are elected from the representatives of the various clubs and track executives. Every person involved in greyhound racing and coursing has a voice in the election of his or her representative member through club membership. The process is clearly enunciated in the Greyhound Industry Act and is adhered to rigidly. It is structured so that as many as one-third of the membership of the executive committee may be changed each year and the entire membership of the executive committee can be changed within three years, should the various representatives of the clubs and greyhound tracks so decide. The executive committee also appoints sub-committees to deal with specific matters in accordance with the Greyhound Industry Act.

Under the terms of that Act, three members of the executive committee are nominated by the Minister as members of Bord na gCon. They are appointed as individuals and have no responsibility to the Irish Coursing Club for duties carried out in connection with Bord na gCon. The positive and impartial contribution by such appointees to the greyhound industry down the years is widely acknowledged. Through the system of election to the executive committee, members of the executive committee are the only truly democractically elected representatives of all greyhound owners and breeders. The appointment of executive committee members to the board of Bord na gCon guarantees greyhound industry expertise on the board as well as nonpartisan representation of owners and breeders at that level.

It is in the best interests of the industry that such representation continue. As in the case of the proposed new horse racing authority, the Minister will appoint the members of the authority as follows: three members from the regulatory body, two representing race courses, one each representing trainers, breeders, owners, bookmakers and employees and three others at his discretion. At least one will be representative of the industry in Northern Ireland.

The greyhound industry has a very positive commercial effect. It benefits not only those immediately connected with the industry, but also a wider circle of individuals. Hotels, guesthouses, bars and restaurants benefit from the influx of people to an area where a greyhound meeting is taking place. At present we are only scratching the surface of the employment potential of that sector; much more can be achieved. We need to market greyhound-related activities to boost its undoubted potential. The industry has had to cope with a great deal of negative publicity, much of it inaccurate. I hope the provisions of this Bill will put an end to such publicity and allow for a more reasoned and rational appraisal of the greyhound industry.

Like any other industry, the greyhound sector must adjust if it is to continue to prosper. This Bill recognises that basic fact and I commend the Minister for introducing it. It is timely legislation. I welcome in particular the proposal to amend section 36 of the Greyhound Industry Act, 1958, the section which proposes to muzzle greyhounds while also introducing the veterinary supervision of hares before, during and after coursing meetings. While the protestations of the anti-coursing lobby have been much exaggerated, those measures more than adequately address the concerns. It is the wish of everybody with an interest in the greyhound industry that the killing of hares is kept to an absolute minimum.

At a recent coursing meeting in Kerry where the dogs were muzzled only two hares were killed. I welcome the Minister's statement that out of a total of 1,029 coursing meetings held up to 21 November this year where dogs were muzzled, only four hares were killed and eight were injured and put down. I hope these new regulations will be strictly adhered to. The Bill provides for penalties in the event of a breach of the regulations. These should be applied without hesitation.

Despite these measures there are still those who are vehement in their opposition to coursing. It is regrettable that these individuals have failed to acknowledge the moves the Minister has made to protect the hare. Their criticism is no longer valid. As a result of this Bill coursing will be no more cruel than shooting or angling. Will anti-coursing protesters now target their opposition at anglers, like Jack Charlton, on the grounds that it constitutes cruelty against fish? I think not. They should give credit where credit is due.

The Bill highlights the fact that the greyhound industry is now at an important turning point. It has faced difficulties in recent times but there are opportunities for the taking also. The 1958 Greyhound Industry Act is no longer adequate in allowing the industry to fulfil its potential. This Bill paves the way for growth and development. I hope it marks the beginning of a series of positive measures on the part of the Government. It is well intended and balanced legislation and I am happy to commend it to the House.

I thank Deputy Foley for sharing his time with me and allowing me to make a contribution on this important legislation. I am happy to commend it to the House as it is both apt and timely. The Minister of State should be congratulated on introducing it.

As Members may be aware, I have a keen interest in the greyhound industry, which has terrific economic and employment potential. This Bill goes some of the way towards tapping its potential and I hope it is the first of many such measures. In many ways this Bill has been introduced in response to Deputy Gregory's Wildlife Bill. While I do not doubt his sincerity, that Bill betrayed a profound lack of knowledge about the realities and traditions of rural life. Tolerance is a virtue. However, Deputy Gregory revealed a high level of ignorance about rural life. In this regard we would like him to visit Munster during the next few weeks when many of our coursing meetings will be held and I am sure he would learn much. What was most distressing was the dismissal of the right of rural communities to maintain their traditions and sports and to make a living in this way. This was not only intolerant but undemocratic. I am relieved that it did not succeed. The Bill before the House is a much more balanced and a well considered creation.

The anti-coursing brigade has displayed intolerance, and despite the measures contained in this Bill I have no doubt that it will continue its dogmatic opposition to coursing. Ultimately, they are zealots, and history has taught us that zealots are not rational people. It is impossible to negotiate with them and in the case of this Bill they will not give credit where credit is due. However, the vast majority of people will be more than satisfied with this Bill as it allays any fears and concerns they may have about coursing, even though these were unfounded and based on anti-coursing propaganda.

I am glad that Deputy McGahon is present in the House as he is a great believer in traditional rural field sports.

The Deputy is back to his best.

I have never been found wanting. There has been much talk about the potential of the greyhound industry. Now is the time to allow it to fulfil that potential. What we need is a coherent national plan to be implemented over a period of years to modernise and develop this industry. This should provide for the modernisation of tracks around the country and a marketing drive to develop greyhound related activities as a leisure industry and as events to be enjoyed in the same way that people enjoy a night out in the pub or the cinema. The industry has a bright future. In this regard the Bill represents a vote of confidence and as such I am glad to commend it.

I would like to make a number of other points. I understand that the members of the new board may not include members of the executive of the Irish Coursing Club, which has been to the forefront of this industry for many years. When Bord na gCon was set up in 1958 under the Act of the Oireachtas the Irish Coursing Club was the body with expertise at the time. Much has happened since then and every effort is now being made to modernise the industry. The Irish Coursing Club has always been responsible for the registration of greyhounds and the stud book. I understand that it will continue to fulfil this important role, which it has carried out with efficiency, dedication and sincerity. By and large, no mistakes have been made. Despite this, it has been much maligned. However, I support it in every way possible. We should never forget that it has played a major role in the greyhound industry. It was founded in 1916 and has stood the test of time.

If one wants to discover just how popular the greyhound industry is one should look at the sponsorship figures. I should say in this regard that the anti-coursing lobby has been active to discredit sponsors in the industry and those who are prepared to make funding available. This is absurd. No one should adopt the tactics that they have adopted. The attendance figures for track meetings are substantial. I understand that in 1990 approximately 704,000 attended track meetings.

One of the major problems that the board has faced during the years has been a lack of funding. Substantial funding will be needed if the new board is to be successful in putting the greyhound industry on a proper footing. In this regard we may need to introduce a leavy. Recently, the new racing board was set up. I compliment the Minister, Deputy Walsh, for making the much needed changes and also the Minister of State, Deputy O'Shea, for putting these proposals to the House. I understand that the racing industry is to receive a share of the funds raised by way of off-course betting. I suggest that something similar should be put in place for the greyhound industry.

I support everything that the Irish Coursing Club stands for. It has made no mistakes and is a credible organisation. It has never interfered, maliciously or otherwise, with anyone outside the business. It is therefore heartbreaking that the anti-coursing lobby has adopted such a negative attitude.

I thank the Minister of State for introducing the Bill. It gives us an opportunity to debate a number of issues in relation to the greyhound industry. This is a positive first step in the revision of legislation dealing with the industry.

As previous speakers have mentioned, the greyhound industry is now worth about £40 million to the economy. It provides about 10,000 jobs in rural Ireland which is a figure to be reckoned with. Trainers, veterinary surgeons, suppliers of equipment such as leads, muzzles, dog food etc. depend for their livelihood on the greyhound industry and if it were disrupted in any way these people's livelihood would be endangered.

The coursing industry makes a major contribution to the greyhound industry. It is worth £16 million of the £40 million already mentioned. The greyhound industry is confined mostly to rural Ireland not alone in the south but in the North. People who oppose coursing fail to recognise that it is a 32-county sport which brings together all sections of the community of all religions and from all strata of society. It is a sport that, more than any other, transcends all boundaries.

Coursing is an integral part of the greyhound industry and should be recognised as such. Buyers of dogs from abroad look for dogs with coursing bloodlines because they are the strongest and have more stamina. They are the most sought after. That is why, within the framework of the greyhound industry, the coursing bloodlines must be preserved and that can only be done if coursing is retained and allowed to develop further.

I wish to deal with the reconstituted Bord na gCon. I was amazed at the two previous speakers, Deputies Denis Foley and Ned O'Keeffe. I recognise they are both committed coursing supporters. They praised the work of the Irish Coursing Club and so on but forgot to mention that the ICC is concerned about this Bill. They quoted extensively from the briefs supplied to all of us by the ICC which were quite useful and saved much of the time it would have taken to carry out research. Neither Deputy went to the core point of this Bill, that is, that if the Minister's proposals got through the ICC will no longer have a say in running the greyhound industry here. It is true the Minister can appoint people from the ICC to that body. However, because the membership is so small, it will be very difficult for the Minister to look after the interests of bookmakers, owners etc. and still make provision for ICC members. The ICC has played an important and historical role in the development of the greyhound industry and they should therefore have a right to nominate perhaps not three but two members to the board. This would lessen the monopoly that Deputy Gregory referred to but it is important that they be included as members of the board.

I find it objectionable that the Minister has decided to amend section 9 of the Principal Act by removing the automatic right of membership of Bord an gCon of three members of the executive committee of the Irish Coursing Club. We should compare this to membership of the proposed horse racing authority a draft of which I have in my possession. The regulatory body, the Turf Club in this instance, will be entitled to three members on the authority set up by the Minister. Why treat the ICC differently in the context of the reconstituted Bord na gCon?

The system of election to the executive committee of the ICC ensures that those elected are totally representative of all greyhound owners and breeders in the 32 counties and are possessed of immense knowledge and expertise in the greyhound industry. Nobody in this House would dispute that. Why have a different approach to the reconstituted Bord na gCon as opposed to the proposed horse racing authority? Perhaps the Minister is giving in to pressure from the anti-coursing lobby and wants to marginalise the ICC. I appeal to the Minister to seriously reconsider this section and, before we leave here tomorrow, put down an amendment that restores the right to the ICC to have at least two members on the proposed reconstituted board.

It would be no harm to state the importance of the ICC in the context of the world greyhound industry. I wish to cite information which was supplied to me by the ICC for which I thank them most sincerely. The Irish Coursing Club is a member of the World Greyhound Racing Federation which is recognised as a controlling authority by all the greyhound control agencies throughout the world. The chief executive of the Irish Coursing Club is currently General Secretary of the World Greyhound Racing Federation. The Irish Coursing Club is a member of the International Stud Book Alliance and other members are the National Coursing Club of England, Australian and New Zealand Greyhound Associations and the National Greyhound Association which covers the USA. That involvement of the ICC on the international pitch is very important to further promote the export of greyhounds from Ireland and ensure that the revenue we derive from such exports is maintained and improved upon.

The club's status as a controlling authority within the industry would be undermined and its position marginalised if it were excluded under this Bill. Furthermore, the ICC contends that any Act dealing with the greyhound industry and excluding the ICC would be merely a greyhound racing industry Act rather than an all-embracing greyhound industry Act.

I sympathise with their fears and reservations about this section. Under the terms of the present Greyhound Industry Act three members of the executive committee are nominated by the Minister as members of Bord na gCon. They are appointed as individuals and have no responsibility to the ICC for any duties carried out in connection with Bord na gCon. This has been pointed out already by Deputy Foley. The positive and impartial contribution by such appointees is widely acknowledged and could not be questioned. It should be noted that through the system of election to the executive committee, members of the executive committee are the only truly democratically elected representatives of all greyhound owners and breeders. The appointment of executive committee members to the board of Bord na gCon guarantees greyhound industry expertise on the boards as well as nonpartisan representation of owners and breeders at all levels. It is also widely acknowledged that the Irish Coursing Club is an integral part of the coursing industry and it would appear totally illogical to deny its representatives the right to membership of Bord na gCon.

I fail to see why the Minister excluded them. The importance of the ICC to the development of the greyhound industry, the fact that they control all the greyhound industry in Northern Ireland, should surely be a factor to be reckoned with when we are trying to hold out the hand of friendship to the people in Northern Ireland at this time. We must recognise that historically they are the people who got the greyhound industry off the ground in Ireland. They have every right to be annoyed in regard to this provision. Before the Bill is put to a vote tomorrow I appeal to the Minister to reconsider this section. I ask him to consider reducing the monopoly of the ICC on the board to allow just two of its members, selected by the Minister to join the Board.

I agree with the provisions in section 3, which are similar to those put forward by Fine Gael in a Bill which I drafted last summer at the time we discussed Deputy Gregory's Private Members' Bill. Section 3 provides that the Minister may make regulations providing for the muzzling of greyhounds participating in events, and the manner and type of muzzle to be used. That is welcome. The section also provides for the supervision by a veterinary surgeon of hares coursed in events prior to, during and after the events and that is a provision which we sought. The section prohibits the coursing of a hare in an event if it is not fit to be coursed and it includes other provisions to which I will not refer now. I agree with those provisions and they are similar to those suggested by the Fine Gael Party during the debate on Deputy Gregory's Private Members' Bill last June.

I do not claim to be an avid coursing supporter but there are times when I would attend a coursing meeting. For example, at Christmas, people return from England, America and other parts of the world to attend the Abbeyfeale coursing meeting. I attend the meeting the odd time to meet old friends and to make new friends. The Minister should attend the meeting to witness the spirit and sense of occasion. If Deputy Gregory realised the importance of that type of event at Christmas he would review his total opposition to hare coursing. I would like to refer to some of his statements on hare coursing. I notice he referred to old quotations. I do not justify the ill treatment of a hare or any animals. Deputy Gregory should consider this matter in context. Some of the examples he raised today and in the past are disgusting. I hope the Deputy reads an article on coursing on pages 18 and 19 of today's Irish Press.

I would be the first to acknowledge that certain coursing meetings have been poorly run and scant respect has been shown for the hare in the past. That is why the hare coursing industry is under scrutiny at present and probably why the Minister has responded by introducing this legislation. In many cases the blame lies with the hare coursing clubs. The message from the debate on Deputy Gregory's Private Members' Bill in June was clearly that the coursing fraternity must get its house in order if the sport is to survive. Since that debate the ICC has responded positively. It has issued all clubs with medication for coccidiosis and worms. It has insisted that veterinary inspection of hares take place prior to and during each coursing meeting. It has appointed an expert to visit each club and advise it on hare husbandry, conditions of the escapes and so on. It has also experimented with different types of muzzles, starting with a leather muzzle which was found to be unsuitable because of breathing difficulties experienced by the greyhounds. It has now introduced a plastic muzzle which has proved effective. Now that this Bill has been introduced and the ICC committed to ensuring that the sport continues, it will experiment further. I am confident that the ICC will provide an ideal muzzle after a period of time. Muzzling has proved to be effective. The Minister gave us an answer in that regard today. At 129 course meetings involving muzzles four hares were killed and eight were injured and put down. That is a miniscule fraction of 1 per cent of the hares killed on Irish roads and elsewhere during that period. Deputy Greogry and the other people who are so concerned about hares should consider that statistic.

I am convinced that if the dogs are muzzled and the hare is given fair play no pair of dogs will be a match for a good hare. I did not get an opportunity during the last debate on this matter to expand on this because I shared my time with colleagues, some of whom were for and others against Deputy Gregory's Bill. As a person from the country I know a fair bit about hares because I have observed them from my youth. Nature has equipped the hare with a number of vital attributes. The hare's heart is five time larger in proportion to its body weight than that of a rabbit. As a result it has a corresponding increased blood supply which gives it tremendous stamina. It has a powerful pair of back legs which give instant acceleration to get it out of danger. Its most outstanding attribute is its ability to turn at right angles without losing pace. It can stop and reverse direction almost as quickly, which gives it a great advantage over a dog. The dog has only one asset, speed. It has very little stamina and cannot turn well in tight circles. All things being equal, the hare will win 99 times out of 100. However, all things are never equal. The dog is a well fed and efficiently trained running machine but more often than not the hare does not get the same preparation.

Regarding hares being collected for a meeting, I understand one-third of those hares are not fit to course, being too young, too old, too thin or diseased. I am convinced that a professional input as proposed by the Bill and by Fine Gael would be beneficial. Clubs' hares stocks should be subjected to an individual veterinary inspection before the draw for the meeting takes place. This would allow stakes to be cancelled if there were not sufficient hares stocks.

All hares deemed fit for courses should carry an identity tag to enable the organising committee to monitor further the hare's progress as the meeting continues. All hares should be dosed for coccidiosis on entry to the paddock, followed by a second compulsory dose about two weeks before the meeting. That could be made to coincide with the veterinary inspection and tagging.

The most crucial point in hare management is feeding. A high proportion of post mortem's show that hares suffer extensively from malnurtition. Many clubs use only grain oats in trays which is unsatisfactory. It is alien for a wild animal to learn to eat out of a tray or a pan in a few weeks. Many of them would go hungry rather than eat from such a container. There is no substitute for good sheaf oats. Three hares could thrash the grain from two sheaves every night. Therefore, hares and husbandry is very important. Adequate drinking water should be provided at a number of points together with a coccidiostat. It should be changed every day as the hares contaminate it by washing in it. The size of the paddock where the hares are kept in captivity is important. It should be regulated — at present it is not. It should be well drained and dry and provided with numerous shelters and feeding points. Consideration should be given to a longer slip.

If Deputy McGahon or Deputy Gregory wish to find out about hare coursing they should read the article on pages 18 and 19 of the Irish Press by Zarina Geloo, a visiting journalist from Zambia, who said, “I saw no savage exaltation on the faces of the crowd”.

The debate on the Bill is, I hope, the start of the revitalisation of the industry which is of critical importance to the livelihood of many people in all parts of Ireland. I welcome the fact that the debate is taking place in a much calmer atmosphere than that which prevailed during the recent debate in Private Members' Time on coursing. Deputies on all sides should realise that coursing is an integral part of the industry and must be not only protected but developed. The Minister of State deserves great credit for handling this matter in an even-handed and objective way. This represents the most progressive change initiated and implemented by the Irish Coursing Club and will ensure that coursing will take place as long as greyhounds are bred, despite the best efforts of a very small, misguided group who are prepared to stop at nothing, even the destruction of our tourist business, to achieve their aim to have coursing banned.

The media has been somewhat one-sided in its coverage of hare coursing. However, I would like to put on record some statements from the objectives and balanced article referred to by Deputy Deenihan which appeared in today's Irish Press. The article was written by a visiting Zambian journalist who attended a coursing meeting and she concluded that coursing does not live up to its reputation as a barbarian or uncivilised sport. She said she had travelled thousands of miles to see what she had been told was the worst possible sign of Irish barbarism. She wanted to see the barbaric people who had hares killed for fun, but to her surprise the picture that emerged was quite different. She said:

I saw a watchful vet look out for unfit hares. Cheers went up for the hare. I saw no savage exultation on the faces of the crowd when two hares got killed, the only indication I got that something had happened was the silence from the crowd at a time when I expected them to go into a wild frenzy.

Adjectives like ‘criminal', ‘barbaric', ‘uncivilised' etc, were used to describe coursers. But what I saw were ordinary folk who simply had different interests from most urban dwellers.

Earlier in the debate Deputy Gregory described people involved in coursing in local areas as the mafia. Deputy Gregory owes an apology to the people in parishes of rural Ireland who run coursing meetings. The Deputy will see plenty of examples of the mafia in his own constituency; he certainly will not find them in rural parishes where coursing meetings take place. Deputy Gregory had to resort to the same rhetoric last June during the debate on coursing. Unfortunately for the Deputy, time has passed him by and, despite his best efforts and those of other people, coursing is and will continue to be a success.

Deputy Gregory also referred to statements made over the years by a number of members of the Irish Coursing Club in relation to muzzling. Many years ago trials with muzzling took place, but what the Deputy refused to acknowledge was that these were wire muzzles which caused more damaged to the dogs and hares than the plastic muzzles which are used at present. Some newspaper coverage of coursing is an absolute disgrace. Some papers grudgingly publish the bare results without any comment. Others try to find a negative issue of a particular coursing meeting about which to write, without any reference to the actual meeting.

The introduction of muzzles on a phased basis has been an unqualified success and this will encourage more people to attend meetings who heretofore may not have wished to do so because of the occasional killing of the hare. I predict that the national meeting in February in Clonmel will have a record attendance. I would bet any day with Deputy McGahon that the record will be broken because more people are now interested in coursing than ever before.

As this Bill is the first step towards improving the whole structure and management of the industry, it is imperative that the make up of the new board clearly reflects the expertise of all strands of the industry. Deputy Dukes earlier complained about the board and said that he and others are unhappy with the present board. Was he suggesting that that board remain in office until it comes to the end of its term on 31 December? An important proposal in the Bill is that the new board will exist for three years rather than five years. It is proposed that the Irish Coursing Club will lose its right to nominate three people from its executive. As other Members said, when appointments are being made this body cannot be ignored or forgotten as it was that organisation who introduced, organised and controlled greyhound track racing in Ireland, North and South, between 1927 and 1958 when no-one else was interested or in a position to do so. Since 1923 it has published the stud book which is recognised worldwide. Like other Members, I appeal to the Minister to reconsider that aspect of the Bill.

Since 1958 there have been three members of the Irish Coursing Club on the board of Bord na gCon. Deputy Deenihan suggested that at least two members of the Irish Coursing Club be appointed to the board, but I will be the honest broker and ask that at least one person be nominated from the Irish Coursing Club. In doing so, the Minister would have the support of the vast majority of Deputies. The Minister should reconsider this matter before Committee Stage.

Serious consideration should be given to the establishment of an advisory body to the board which would embrace all strands of the industry, including the Irish Coursing Club, breeders, owners, coursing people, trainers, track management, bookmakers, punters and anybody else involved directly or indirectly in the industry. Such a system operates in Britain and its introduction here would be of great benefit to the board in the coming years. I concur with the views of other Deputies in that at present there is much discontent within the sport.

The recession has hit greyhound racing in the same way as it has hit other sports. It has been indicated that if adequate funding was allocated to the industry facilities could be improved, thus making it more attractive for people to attend meetings, which would generate extra revenue. It is necessary to provide funding for the development of this industry. The amount allocated should not be less than £5 million over a three-year period. This would allow for the necessary improvements to be carried out at tracks to make the facilities more comfortable for the public. It would require a development plan for all tracks, with priority being given to tracks with the worst facilities. Difficulties will arise in relation to privately owned tracks. Nevertheless the board must accommodate these tracks, many of which were kept open by owners who had a genuine love of the sport. I know families who have owned tracks for generations and who have not received a dividend of any kind from that property, some of which is worth a considerable amount. I have no doubt that if these tracks were owned by other people they would have sold them long ago for housing or commercial developments.

The new board must address the issue of marketing and seek to promote the sport as an entertainment, encourage more sponsors and create a better image for the sport. The breeding and selling aspects of the greyhound industry must be developed and expanded to meet demands from new markets which must be explored by the board with great vigour. If greyhounds are needed for new markets in Denmark, Sweden, Turkey and Russia, together with the lucrative and expanding markets in Great Britain and the United States, we should be able to meet the demand. The sales aspect of the industry must be developed so as to encourage more buyers from abroad to come to Ireland to purchase all breeds of greyhounds from the average to the top class. This will required a marketing expertise which has not been applied previously. We should aim to have greyhound sales similar to the horse sales at Tattersalls and Goffs. We have the necessary raw material for this industry and what we require is a board which will have the necessary drive, incentive and expertise to meet the challenges in this area and develop a thriving industry.

There is no reason any track should be closed down. The closure of a track leads to a reduction in the number of breeders and owners in the surrounding areas. Many breeders and owners will not run their dogs in tracks in other areas as it is costly to travel and it is not always easy to get races for the average dog. This industry should not be let fall into the same trap as the horse racing industry which believed that a few tracks for the best horses was the way forward. One has only to compare the Phoenix Park race track with the tracks in Kilbeggan, Bellewstown, Tralee and Listowel to understand what I am saying. People who go to greyhound racing meetings want proper facilities where they can meet, chat and have a drink, place a bet, run their dogs or support their neighbours' dogs.

The introduction of Sunday racing should benefit the greyhound industry. However, there must be astute planning to ensure that the industry capitalises fully on the removal of the ban. There is no point in the industry trying to compete with other established Sunday sports. The timing of meetings will be of critical importance. In addition, there will have to be co-operation with the horse racing board to avoid clashes in timing.

I ask the Minister to amend section 3 on Committee Stage to provide that the Bill will apply only to enclosed hare coursing. The Minister referred to enclosed hare coursing in his speech and I hope the Bill will be amended accordingly. If the greyhound industry is to move forward less emphasis will have to be placed on peripheral problems such as hare coursing, the relationship between the ICC and Bord na gCon, the membership of coursing clubs, the affiliation fees, the registration of litters and adult dogs and the keeping of stud books. These issues are deemed to be problems by people who do not understand the industry and whose only interest is to ban or curtail coursing. I have been attending dog racing and coursing meetings for years and I meet the same people on the coursing fields as I meet at the tracks. These people do not complain about hare coursing. They regard it as part and parcel of the industry and do not think it should be interfered with as it has a proven record which will stand up to scrutiny.

The greyhound fraternity want better conditions for the public, more prize money, better conditions for owners and trainers, better equipped tracks, more incentives to breed greyhounds and a proper sales and marketing strategy. I appeal to the Minister to give favourable consideration over the coming months to the points I have made and to ignore the spurious arguments put forward by people who do not care if this industry is let die. I know the Minister is committed to ensuring that this industry does not die, and I look forward to the introduction of more changes in this area over the coming months which will guarantee the future of this industry.

As a one time owner of a number of rather slow track greyhounds, I can speak with some "hands on" experience on this issue. I come from County Sligo which, unlike other parts of the country, is not well known as a good greyhound area. However, Sligo has consistently produced some of the best greyhounds over the last number of years. The number of owners, breeders and trainers in the county is not very large but they are all very dedicated followers of the sport. All these people have a great interest in other sports, for example, gaelic football, soccer and golf; they are among the best supporters of sport in the county. It is only correct to put that on the record.

Not so long ago, say, 30-35 years, every second household in County Sligo owned a greyhound. I am not talking about the pampered, well fed greyhounds one sees at coursing or track meetings but rather about greyhounds which had to catch their own dinner if they did not want to go without food for the rest of the day.

Greyhounds which run a time of 29.50 seconds at a race in Shelbourne Park, Harold's Cross, Dundalk or Navan are entirely different. People used to keep greyhounds for hunting in the fields and bogs near their homes. One of the great sources of entertainment for young people at that time was to go out with their neighbours hunting hares over their own territories and their own runs. Sometimes the hares were caught and other times they escaped, but apart from the fact that a greyhound was accompanied by a terrier, which is better at sniffing out hares, the entire pursuit was as near to the natural order of things as one could get. I do not know whether this would now be regarded as cruelty, but for those who took part in it, it was simply sport, a contest between the hares and the hounds. Very often the hares won in their own habitat; but, more important, it was your hound which won against your neigbour's hound.

I totally accept that closed coursing is very different and I agree that something had to be done about it. Indeed, action should have been taken in this area before now. I am glad that the present Minister and the Minister of State have finally addressed those problems to some extent. The Minister proposes muzzling of the greyhounds at selected coursing and race meetings; and it must be said that the figures the Minister gave us here this evening are impressive, particularly in a trial period. I welcome also the veterinary supervision of all hares that will be in place before, during and after coursing meetings. I would like the Minister of State in this reply to assure us that no hares would be used at more than one particular coursing meeting.

The future of coursing depends on the success or otherwise of the muzzling that is taking place at present. Under this Bill the Minister is giving himself authority to introduce regulations for muzzling. He should tell us now that once this Bill becomes law, dogs will have to be muzzled at all meetings. He should make the declaration at this stage because it is an important issue for the future of coursing.

This sport has a great tradition and that is why I am interested in it. It is part of the way of rural life and is also an important industry in its own right. It is an important source of income to many people. Not in GATT terms or matters of that nature, but vital to a well targeted area. The Minister gave figures this evening, arising from the research by the University of Limerick and Bord na gCon, that of the 8,000 breeders, rearers and trainers, 6,000 were mainly small farmers and their activities generated an estimated farm income of approximately £16 million or an average of £2,600 per farm. The Minister stated that the industry is worth approximately £40 million. They are impressive figures because extra income is needed in that area. I would regard the greyhound industry as an ideal type of agri-business. It provides additional income for the farmer and an interest, in sport, with the chance, of course, of hitting the jackpot and producing a great champion such as Spanish Point, which, incidentally, was owned and bred by a former Member of this House.

The Minister has outlined the necessity for a more detailed Bill. However, he has referred to the complexities of such a Bill and that he cannot introduce it at this time. But the Minister is aware of the need for this Bill since the Government came into office a year ago. With all the expertise at his disposal in the Department and the advice of the parliamentary draftsman's office, surely he could have produced a comprehensive Bill at this time. That would have been a better way to approach this issue.

There are a number of other areas which the Minister says he will examine, but the most important aspect of this Bill is the introduction of the muzzling of greyhounds at all coursing meetings and the veterinary supervision of hares before, during and after those meetings. From the figures the Minister has already given us it would seem that his aim is the total elimination of the kill. From what he has told us about the experiments that are taking place, I believe that is possible and would prove to be a solution to what has been a very difficult problem.

Regarding the Minister's intention to seek to develop the American business, I believe he is going about that in the proper way. That would be an appropriate use of Structural Funds. A different system is in operation there, which includes the use of eight or nine hounds on the track per race. It is necessary for the industry here to carry out some work in this area because otherwise we will be unable to develop this very useful market, which is worthy of an allocation of Structural Funds.

One aspect of this Bill rather intrigues me and it is in relation to the provision for the appointment of directors to Bord na gCon. If the appointments follow the normal pattern in Irish politics, they will be "doggy men"; and if the Minister subscribes to the gender balance, women will be appointed also. We wish all of those directors well and certainly the last thing anyone would wish is that they should die, but the Minister is making a provision in this Bill for a director dying in the period between his or her appointment to the board and this Bill coming into effect on 1 January 1994. In such an event the Minister states that the person who, say, dies on 20 December, will, for the purposes of this Bill, not be deemed dead until 1 January 1994.

Take the case of a person who before his death met my colleague, Deputy Ivan Yates, in his capacity as a bookmaker or, more likely, if these appointments follow the normal political pattern, met the Minister's colleague, Deputy Seán Power, and placed a £1,000 bet on a dog running in a race on Christmas Day. What complications would arise if that person died in the meantime and the dog won the race? Would the bookmaker be required to pay out the winners because the man was deemed to be alive under the provisions of this Bill? The Minister should clarify that matter for us.

There is a more urgent need now for the Minister to bring in a more comprehensive Bill as far as the greyhound industry is concerned. I am glad the Minister is introducing regulations for the muzzling of greyhounds. That is an important aspect of the Bill and I wish it well. I would like to give the remainder of my time to Deputy McGahon.

My views on the coursing industry are well documented and I am sorry to have to cross swords with my friend, Deputy Brian Fitzgerald, who I know has a great interest in this area. Many Deputies here have been force-fed propaganda by the Irish Coursing Club. It is extraordinary to see how successful that propaganda has been on an issue that is repulsive to so many people and which brings international shame to this country.

I am not against the greyhound industry. In fact, in an hour from now I will be, I expect, the only Deputy who will be present at Shelbourne Park. Therefore, I welcome some of the proposals in this Bill, an amendment of the 1958 Act which has not been updated for 35 years.

Debate adjourned.
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