Private Members' Business. - Rail Service: Motion (Resumed). – Dáil Éireann (28th Dáil) – Wednesday, 10 Dec 1997

Private Members' Business. - Rail Service: Motion (Resumed).

The following motion was moved by Deputy Yates on Tuesday, 9 December l997:

That Dáil Éireann calls on the Government to provide the necessary investment to upgrade the national railway network with continuous welded rail, automatic signalling and adequate rolling stock to ensure a safe, reliable and efficient public transport service.

Debate resumed on amendment No. 1:

To delete all words after "That" and substitute the following:

"Dáil Éireann — welcomes the £275 million programme of investment in the renewal of railway track, upgrading of signalling and replacement of rolling stock, co-financed by EU and national resources, being undertaken in the period l994 to l999 and notes that studies are already well under way to determine rail investment requirements for the post-l999 period; and welcomes the decision by the Minister for Public Enterprise to commission an independent consultancy study into all aspects of railway safety.".

—(Minister for Public Enterprise).

Mr. Spring

The motion is timely in view of what has happened in recent weeks on the railway system. The number of accidents and the risk to life and limb have been well documented in the past 24 hours. It is well known from my time in Government that I am a supporter of public transport. As a tourist destination, the need for an effective and efficient rail service is greater than ever. There are, however, serious problems.

One could discuss this issue from a local perspective or a national point of view. There are lines on which there is a particularly good service and others on which the service lags way behind what I would regard as acceptable as we approach the turn of the century. The service between Dublin and Cork is second to none. It is one we all envy. We would like to see the same standard applied on all lines. It is of the highest standard, for which management should be complimented. The same could be said about the service between Dublin and Belfast. We are not talking only about comfort, speed and efficiency but safety also. We should be able to guarantee reliability, efficiency and effectiveness as well as passenger safety. That is the most important criterion. Given our experiences in recent months this is highly questionable.

The Minister has commissioned an independent consultancy. I hope this is not a gesture that is too late because there are serious problems. We should be able to identify the weaknesses in the system to the extent that we can give the guarantees mentioned. Some years ago we secured £275 million in European funding but it is apparent that this will not be effective in relation to a certain number of lines, including the lines to Mullingar, Mayo, Sligo, Rosslare, Kilkenny, Waterford, Killarney and Tralee. It appears jointed track on timber sleepers is no longer acceptable and does not have a future.

There is another aspect to this debate. We have all heard about the increase in the volume of traffic and fatalities on our roads. It is important that we are in a position to offer a viable alternative, particularly to those who wish to travel from peripheral areas, Kerry, Wexford, Galway, Mayo and Sligo. Difficulties have been encountered at weekends in transporting students and sports fans. We do not have the capacity to offer a reliable service to all those who want to use public transport. It behoves all of us, as public representatives, to ensure funding is available to provide a service second to none which is able to carry the public at reasonable expense in a safe and reliable manner.

I have listened to what the spokespersons for Irish Rail have had to say in recent weeks. While our track record during the years has been satisfactory and one we could defend, there is substandard track and a risk to the travelling public. The Minister did not give the impression that she acknowledges there are serious problems and that she will argue at Cabinet to secure the necessary funding. It is known that millions of pounds are required for track, signalling and rolling stock on the lines mentioned. One gets the distinct impression that it is the Minister's view there is nothing she can do about it. She was always the first one into the Chamber to find the responsible Minister. She is now responsible for passenger safety. I am not being alarmist but realistic. I have been at pains to defend workers in Irish Rail.

The time has come to make decisions. The Minister should outline how she will find the funding required for investment in passenger and freight services. We all accept there are no absolute guarantees in life but the test is one of reasonableness. I would like to think that we can have renewed confidence in the service on offer and that a viable alternative will be offered to the travelling public who should not use their cars because they are afraid the train will not be on time owing to obstructions on the line, because they are afraid of derailments and because they are hearing about the quality of the service on offer. The Minister should indicate that in the next two to three years she can guarantee development of the service.

I am particularly worried about the line between Killarney and Tralee which has not been upgraded. I have been told that EU funding is not guaranteed. There have been some improvements on the line between Mallow and Killarney. As the premier tourist destination, the rail service is extremely important to the county. Funding is required to maintain a quality service. If one were to grade services, the service between Mallow and Tralee, apart from the first train out of Tralee at 7.30 a.m. and the evening train from Dublin, leaves much to be desired.

The motion is timely. We are facing serious problems in terms of the quality of the service on offer. The Minister has ultimate responsibility for providing a safe and reliable transport system. Her efforts to avoid this responsibility do not augur well. I hope she will outline how she will upgrade the services which are badly needed.

Mr. M. Kitt

I wish to share my time with Deputies O'Flynn and Cooper-Flynn.

Acting Chairman (Mr. Foley)

Is that agreed?

Agreed.

Mr. M. Kitt

The Minister announced a £275 million investment programme to renew the railways between 1994 and 1999. This programme was negotiated by the former Taoiseach and the Minister, Deputy Cowen. Investment post-1999 is also an important matter. The question of safety on our railways has been raised on a number of occasions recently. The Minister intends to commission a consultancy study into all aspects of safety on our railways. The recent rail accidents have caused some concern and if circumstances were different they could have been much more serious. If people had been standing between the carriages on any of those trains, there could have been fatalities or serious injuries. The person who provides the trolley service on trains and looks after the needs of passengers has a very difficult job.

Some months ago I suggested that Iarnrod Éireann should provide morning newspapers and other reading material on trains. While safety must always be a priority, this matter should be considered. Despite the best efforts of Iarnrod Éireann there have been many complaints about the services from Dublin on Friday evenings. Many of the trains travelling to Galway are over-crowded, but the extra service at 4.50 p.m. is a welcome development. Overcrowding may be acceptable on trains taking large groups of people to sporting events or concerts, but there is no excuse for people standing on trains that are taking people home on Friday evenings. The £275 million investment programme will benefit lines radiating from Dublin.

Iarnród Éireann has failed to address the question of the western corridor. I am a member of the western inter-railway committee which has been trying to secure a radial route from Sligo to Limerick to Rosslare and even to Derry. I am disappointed Iarnród Éireann and recent Governments have not given this serious consideration. The Minister should endeavour to secure Structural Funding for that purpose in the post-1999 period. Some of the £200 million that will be made available to the western development commission should be spent on our railways.

If the western region achieves Objectives One status I hope extra funding will be made available for railway development. Funding for roads in the west out of the last round of Structural Funding was 20 per cent less than for the rest of the country. Iarnród Éireann has invested £350 in the eastern corridor, but it should not forget the western corridor, which has great potential for tourism and the transport of goods, particularly timber. There is a rail link to the Louisiana Pacific plant in Waterford, to Medite in Clonmel and to the new Masonite plant in County Leitrim. CIE and Iarnród Éireann should adopt a positive approach to these types of developments. As well as being used for tourists, the new rail cars could be used to take commuters to Galway, workers to their place of work and students to school. I hope we can quantify the amount of timber, cement, fertiliser and other bulk cargo travelling north-south and south-north. An actively used railway would relieve the traffic on our roads.

I am pleased the section of line from Portarlington to Galway will be co-funded by the European Union and Iarnród Éireann to the tune of £20.8 million, bringing the total figure to £22.4 million. That is a welcome development for that Cinderella line. Passengers will be delighted the route is to be improved.

Mr. O'Flynn

I give my unqualified support to the Minister's approach to the Fine Gael Private Member's motion. I agree with her view that while investment is an essential ingredient, it is not the only factor that will contribute to rail safety. Her decision to have an external review of larnrod Éireann's rail safety policy and practice announced in Dáil Éireann was a timely and wise assessment of the position. The brief of the independent consultants to be appointed will be to ensure that safety standards comply with the highest international standards.

Fianna Fáil has a strong commitment to developing our national railway. The current major investment programmes will be completed and further investment will be pursued. The railway is a vital part of our transport infrastructure. If it is made attractive and competitive people will use it. There is cross-party agreement that we cannot have anything less than the maximum level of safety on our railroad. The help and advice of the consultants will be greatly appreciated by all Members.

There has been a dramatic increase in the number of people using mainline and commuter services. This is a direct result of the investment already in place which has resulted in major upgrading of infrastructure, signalling, locomotives and rolling stock. The introduction of the Arrow railcar on the Cork-Cobh line has been welcomed by the public. The recent introduction of this diesel railcar has shown that people will use a decent commuter rail service. Passenger numbers have grown substantially since the new railcar was introduced. The associated improvements in the stations at Cobh, Fota, Glounthaune and Little Island have guaranteed a continuation of the 25 per cent growth in the past two to three years. A similar investment in the closed Cork to Midleton line would make a major contribution towards getting the east Cork public to use the railroad. Commuter services from Mallow, Blarney, Kilbarry and Blackpool are also urgently needed. There is untapped commuter potential in those areas. The availability of an alternative transport system would be of great benefit. It would ensure a substantial decrease in the road carnage which is occurring every day.

In Cork, all approach roads have become more congested. Routes from north, south, east and west are clogged from early morning. Statistics related to this traffic show an alarming multiplication in the number of accidents each day. Commuter services, with strategic vehicle parking areas, would encourage drivers to avail of this safer and less stressful mode of transport. For example, the boom in population in Midleton alone would guarantee support for a rail service. All road users are becoming increasingly conscious of the risks they face daily and of the time they lose sitting in endless queues. There is no need for a debate on the desirability of providing the service, it should be put it in place The Government is continuing the biggest ever investment programme in the history of the railway. This £275 million investment programme supported by EU Cohesion and Structural Funds is well under way and is transforming the mainline railway. The Government is determined to see this programme through to completion in 1999 when the current programme runs out and it will continue to seek further EU assistance. As part of this programme I understand that more than 300 miles of new track will be relaid.

The Cork, Belfast and Limerick lines are completed and work is under way on the Sligo, Galway, Waterford and Tralee lines. Modern computerised signalling will also be installed on those lines. The 32 new locomotives will greatly improved reliability. New trains have been acquired for the Belfast service. The new enterprise service on the Belfast line compares with the best in Europe.

Many stations have been upgraded and it was reassuring to pass through Heuston Station recently and see a new concourse being provided. The old draughty and uncomfortable layout will be replaced with a state of the art modern facility.

I am delighted that Cork will have a new station shortly because the board of CIÉ agreed to it last week. This investment is already beginning to have an impact as passenger carrying is at record levels and growing. Railway passenger numbers are now almost twice the volume they were in the 1970s. The railway has an important role in reducing congestion on our inter-urban roads and in our major towns and cities.

However, I recognise that in 1999 it is possible that a new programme will be brought about to service the remaining 30 per cent. The Minister, Deputy O'Rourke, takes the same train to Athlone as I do to Castlebar. I sincerely hope that in 1999 the money will be invested in that line. I note it says this will be considered, but that is not good enough. It must be implemented as a matter of urgency. I have every faith that in this Administration, the Minister, Deputy O'Rourke, will recognise that fact and do something positive about it for a change.

Mr. Higgins

(Mayo): Recognising is no good, action is required.

The last train to Sligo from Dublin leaves Connolly Station at 6.20 p.m. Many people need a later service but CIE is not in a position to provide it. Iarnród Éireann needs to look at a number of issues, such as the condition of rolling stock and the need to maintain a proper and regular service and I have no doubt it will. At weekends, as Deputy Cooper-Flynn said, one is lucky if one gets a seat by the time the train reaches Mullingar, while if one is unlucky one must stand from Dublin to Sligo.

As far as Deputy Yates is concerned there is a reasonable service to Rosslare and he is happy and does not care about the rest of the country.

Mr. Browne

(Wexford): I welcome the new-found interest of Deputy Yates in the national rail system. However, I compliment the Minister for Public Enterprise because at least she has a direct interest in upgrading our rail lines. I tabled a number of parliamentary questions to the former Minister, Deputy Lowry, about the Dublin to Rosslare link and he refused to answer them on the basis that rail lines were being funded by the EU. He was so out of touch with reality, it was unbelievable.

The rail line between Dublin and Rosslare does not have a Rolls Royce service and is one of the worst in the State. There is a state of the art harbour in Rosslare which has a very substandard rail link running into it. On the odd occasion I have travelled from Enniscorthy to Dublin, it took approximately two and a half hours. One of my daughters made that journey today. She left Enniscorthy at 8.20 a.m. and arrived in Dublin at 10.50 a.m. using a rail system that is obsolete and out of date. The track is shaky and trains must slow to a crawl on certain sections. It hangs over the bay as one approaches Bray and many people refuse to travel on the line because of that. The rolling stock is outdated with carriages which were cast off from the Belfast and Cork routes. There are no facilities for wheelchair passengers and dining facilities are basic when any are to be found. Old-fashioned signal systems are used and comfort in stations between Wexford and Bray is practically nil as these stations are obsolete. This does not encourage people to travel, but from Bray onwards one finds state of the art facilities and modern stations.

I call on the Minister to move as quickly as possible with Iarnród Éireann to upgrade the Dublin to Rosslare route. One million passengers pass through Rosslare Port annually but very few of them travel on trains. It is important that a modern railway system is created to take people to Dublin as quickly as possible. Even at peak times, such as Christmas, people have very little time to spend shopping in Wexford or Dublin as they arrive at 11 a.m. and return at 6 p.m. when on a day trip. Surely some person in Iarnród Éireann has the ingenuity to put on later trains at Christmas, Easter, etc. When Wexford were on the march to All-Ireland glory last year, trains were packed every Sunday. People are prepared to travel on trains if proper facilities are made available.

I welcome the Minister's review on safety as it is very important. Iarnród Éireann's safety record is very good and while I am naturally concerned about safety, I am more concerned that the line between Dublin and Rosslare be upgraded and that passengers on that line are provided with the same facilities as those travelling from Dublin to Cork, Belfast or Galway.

Mr. Higgins

(Mayo): I wish to share time with Deputies Sargent and Currie.

Acting Chairman

Is that agreed? Agreed.

Mr. Higgins

(Mayo): I listened with amusement to Deputies O'Flynn and Cooper-Flynn. Neither was in the House in 1994 when the last gravy train left for Brussels and we put the national development plan through the House. We submitted a five year plan, 1994-9, to Brussels to secure the last big drawing down of Structural and Cohesion Funds for roads, rail, airports, ports and the agricultural sector. We put through this House a plan that omitted three railway lines. At the time all the Deputies in the constituencies involved made the strongest possible case. We pleaded with the Minister for Transport, Energy and Communications at the time, Deputy Cowen, to put the Claremorris-Castlebar-Westport and Ballina lines in the plan. Likewise, my colleague, Deputy

Yates, pleaded with him to include the Rosslare line in the plan. He was asked also to include the Sligo line and it got a partial reprieve although it did not get the money. The line on the map was changed but the investment did not arrive.

In Mayo there was a deep-seated resentment and, understandably, we highlighted the fact that Mayo was left on the hind tit because we got nothing. We got a blue dotted line which meant there would be no investment from Europe — Cohesion or Structural Funds. Any resources had to come from the national kitty, in other words we would get the crumbs that fell from the rich man's table some time in the next millennium.

This more than any other issue was the one that decided the last election. When the people of Mayo went to the ballot box they gave the first two seats to Fine Gael, the third to Fianna Fáil, the fourth to Fine Gael and three outgoing Fianna Fáil TDs fought for the final seat. The people of Mayo have not forgotten that.

I do not take any comfort from the speech in the House last evening by Deputy O'Rourke given that there is still no sign of any money for the railway line in question. We are now carrying out a mid-term review. There is no reason the strongest possible case could not be made to Brussels but that is not being done. The people of Mayo have long memories and this will be remembered on the occasion of the next election unless there is a substantial improvement in the quality of the rail service.

To fully appreciate the trauma of travelling on the Dublin-Westport line or the Dublin-Ballina line one must use it and I have being using it consistently since 1981 when I was elected to the Seanad. It was not great but it was adequate: the train departed and arrived on schedule. The service was spartan enough but the basics were sound.

A few elections ago Fianna Fáil coined the phrase "health cuts hit the old, the sick and the handicapped". Travelling on the safari train to Mayo is a hazard. The 18.05 train from Heuston Station on Thursday, Friday and Saturday is an experience. The queue starts 50 minutes before the train's departure. People queue for the best part of 45 minutes while the train is being cleaned following the upward journey. After the whistle goes and the green flag is raised there is a stampede. On occasion I have seen elderly people tumble, children crushed and people left behind. With ten minutes to go the train is choc-a-bloc. I am amused sometimes at the sign inside the train in Irish, ná fágtha bágaiste ins na pasáiste — do not leave baggage in the passages. There is bágaiste, pasáiste, daoine de dhuile shórt, people who have had hip replacement operations in Cappagh Hospital standing in the aisles or between the wagons and litter everywhere. People who entered a contract with a State company for £25 to take them on a journey have to stand until they reach Athlone. This is not good enough. It is more like the Calcutta express than the Castlebar express. It is chaos. If one thinks the Westport train is bad the junction from Manulla to Ballina can only be described as wanderly wagon because it literally wanders all over the track. I doubt whether Iarnród Éireann is covered by insurance in terms of the safety of its passengers. Any insurance company would not be in a position to cover the chaos that ensues on the train.

The upward journey is not much better. The train never departs or arrives on schedule. Its arrival time is not as late as the downward journey. It does not sit down on the track as often, it has to yield to the Arrow train going to the city to take commuters from the perimeter of the Pale but it is never on time. It is impossible to make an arrangement for a hospital appointment, an interview, a job, a plane or the boat, based on the standard timetable as it operates. There is no standard, no safety guarantee and no satisfaction. It has come to a head. I have no doubt there are other accidents down the line. It was probably a blessing in disguise that the accident at Roscommon took place because it focused attention sharply on the situation. There was a similar accident on the Tralee line a few days later, and likewise on the Carlow line.

We can have all the inquiries we want and we can bring in as many international consultants we want but all we need is a plan, imagination and investment. Unless we get the investment we are not going anywhere. It grieves me because I like the train. Many people have genuine goodwill for the train service and the staff but if they are not given the tools and the wherewithal to operate they cannot provide the service. Unfortunately they are the people at the butt-end of the criticism.

The train service is not the same as any other service and should not have to answer to a commercial remit. Its huge potential is not being exploited. There is goodwill from the passengers. From the point of view of freight there is a strong argument for ensuring it realises its full commercial potential. Many more people would use it for the transport of their goods and services if the service was reliable. There is a case to be made for major investment on the railway line. One has only to look at costs and investment. One mile of rail track replacement costs £330,000 while one mile of road costs up to £6 million. One articulated six axle lorry and heavy suspension will do more damage than 3,000 cars on the roadway. I ask for a commitment to those three lines. I ask that a case be made to Europe and that we do not take no for an answer. We have enough friends in Brussels who will listen to our case. We are not asking for the sun, moon and stars but a reliable train service that departs and arrives on schedule.

Mr. Sargent

I am extremely incensed by this topic. I live in north County Dublin and along with many others I frequently use the mainline service when travelling outside the constituency. Fianna Fáil backbenchers are impressed by the allocation of £275 million under the Operational Programme for Transport 1994-9. If they were to look, instead of listening, at the Minister's propaganda they would note that the spending on roads is astronomical — £1,655 million compared to the £275 million for the rail lines. It is time we began to compare the reality and tried to focus on the larger picture. How can the Government be content with the allocation for the rail service under the that operational programme? Clearly Iarnród Éireann is not content. It has to borrow from private banks to fund capital investment. A considerable amount of the subvention goes to private banks to pay interest on loans which it has been forced to take out to continue operating and prevent accidents happening. Meanwhile, the needs of the rail service are great. It needs new lines, new signalling and more carriages. In my constituency at rush hour there is only a two-carriage Arrow train available, onto which people are crammed and there is no suburban rail service on Sundays. There is no late night service and there are two hours between train times on Saturday afternoons. The last train leaving Dublin on Saturday night is at 8.40 p.m. while the last train from Balbriggan is 7.11 p.m. What kind of service is that?

Wheelchair users have to be very courageous and swallow their pride to seek help getting on and off trains because there are no ramps. People do not know when the Arrow train will arrive because there is no timetable. There is lack of priority in terms of public transport. We should work towards achieving an efficient service. While 450 or 500 people are killed per year on our roads, it is a miracle nobody has been killed on our rail service.

It is stated in the operational programme that the policy of traffic restraint is difficult to pursue in the absence of high quality public transport services. Is the Government seriously saying it will provide a high quality public transport service? That must be done, but it is not possible without doubling the subvention. There is no point talking about money on the horizon. The money available in this area is infinitesimal compared with the provision for road transport. There are one million cars on the roads and it is estimated that by the year 2011 that number will have increased to one and a half million.

What is the Government's policy on transport? Will Ministers come back from Kyoto and tell us climate change is a threat and we must take direct action? Scientists say a 60 per cent cut in CO is needed, meanwhile we are doing very little to reduce the number of cars on our roads. In most cases cars come from France, Germany and Japan and those countries benefit from the fact that so many of our people buy cars.

The 1996 CIE report states that as a result of congestion, the cost to Dublin alone is £1 billion every year, ten times the annual subvention. We are throwing money away on short-sighted policies that do not solve the problem. Is there a prejudice in that money made available for road transport is called investment but for rail transport it is called a subsidy? It is illogical to differentiate between the two.

I have more than 4,600 letters from disgruntled railway users in Dublin North, begging the Minister to take decisive action on measures to which I have referred. It was difficult enough to get a meeting with the previous Minister. I ask the Government to stop trying to placate train users by soft talk. It rings hollow and is not working. Ministers should use trains and see the position for themselves. The Government must invest in a proper rail service.

Mr. Currie

I intend to be unashamedly parochial in my comments. I represent the two fastest growing areas in the State, Blanchardstown in Dublin 15 and Lucan. Some people may have heard on radio or television today the prediction that to buy a new, reasonably sized house in Dublin next year will cost £100,000. We are fast approaching that position in the Dublin 15 and Lucan areas.

Traffic on our roads is so heavy that people leaving their houses, worth £90,000 to £100,000, in the morning can hardly get out of their estates and when they return in the evening they can hardly get back in, and the position is getting worse almost daily.

Since the last election I received a large number of letters, telephone calls and other representations on the subject of transport. One, signed by a number of people from the Castleknock area, states:

The following is our list of concerns:

(a) Lack of safety due to overcrowding on most trains.

(b) Infrequent service at peak times.

(d) Inadequate number of carriages for the number of users.

(e) Trains are dirty and therefore uncomfortable.

(f) No long-term plan to cater for the expansion of West Dublin.

Another letter from the same area in Dublin West states:

My main gripe lies with the extremely poor west bound service in the evenings. If like myself a commuter cannot make the 17.52 service from Connolly, there is a wait of over three hours before the next train at 20.54. In practice of course no-one waits that long and instead make alternative arrangements for their return journey . or don't bother using the train in the first place.

My second point of concern lies with train overcrowding. Both the 08.00 and 08.20 services are crammed to capacity by the time they reach Coolmine. Whilst I would rather stand than not have the service at all, it is a sad reflection on the Irish public transport system that every morning, fare paying commuters consider themselves lucky to find a safe standing spot against the end of a pair of seats or on the edge of a table (do we need tables on commuter trains?). Most others are forced to balance, sway and heave in the aisles and passageways of trains which were never intended to cater for standing passengers (i.e. no hand holds etc).

Those are just two of the many letters and phone calls I have received from people concerned about the dangers of travelling on trains.

I welcome the Minister's decision to appoint independent consultants to carry out a strategic review of rail safety, hopefully, within six months, although she seemed to be vague on that commitment. That review will not be a day too early for my constituents. I recognise there are problems with finance. I listened with interest to a Fianna Fáil Deputy from Mayo, as if the problems with the railway system started when the rainbow coalition came to power — that Government was in power for two and a half years. Obviously the present state our railway system is a sad reflection of the resources made available to it over many years. That is no reflection on the people who work on the railways. I have the greatest admiration for those who work on the railway line to which I have been referring, that from Connolly Station to Maynooth, who have some awful tasks to perform. For example, there is a regulation stating that a train may not stop at a station unless that station's platform is sufficiently long to accommodate the longest train. The fear is that people will alight from a train in the dark where there is no platform. The staff on that line have the intolerable task of endeavouring to prevent passengers alighting from coaches in such circumstances. One can well imagine the position on a Saturday or other evening trying to dissuade some people from stepping out into the dark, one of the tasks of those unfortunate staff in whom I have the greatest confidence.

I recognise that no real improvement will take place on that line until such time as there is a double line in place between Connolly Station and Maynooth. It is unacceptable that there is a single track between those locations. I look forward to the money being made available by this Government to ensure that that is done in addition to the necessary improvements at Connolly Station.

Very soon Blanchardstown will have a population in excess of 100,000 whose inhabitants should have a DART-type service, probably utilising the tunnel under the Phoenix Park, to provide the type of rail transport required by inhabitants of a town of that size. Neither am I forgetting the other end of my constituency. I hope the Lucan south station will be reopened because of the phenomenal growth there also.

The number of houses being built and those scheduled to be built between Lucan and Newcastle —in my opinion too many — will certainly justify the opening of that station, hopefully in the not too distant future.

Mr. McGahon

I thank Deputy Currie for affording me an opportunity of saying a few words on this subject.

As a regular rail commuter from Dundalk to Dublin over the past 15 years, I want to express my appreciation of the improvements recently carried out by Iarnród Éireann. I also thank the European Union for the large amounts of money made available for the upgrading of that line and congratulate Northern Ireland Railways on its initiative in prodding Iarnród Éireann and the Irish Government into providing matching funds, the net effect of which has been a tremendous improvement on that line. I invite everybody to take a journey on the new express train from Belfast to Dublin, which is on a par with any European railway on which I have travelled. I also commend the tremendous initiative of Dundalk railway station manager, Mr. Brendan McQuaid, and his staff who have carried out delightful work at that station.

Next I want to express my fear about safety regulations on Irish trains. On sitting days I stay in Blackrock, County Dublin and travel on the DART, a magnificent facility for those living along its line north and south of the city. However, in the mornings, scenes at many stations defy description, as passengers endeavour to gain access to already over-crowded carriages, hanging on in a fashion reminiscent of trains one sees on television in Delhi in India. That leads me to question whether safety regulations are observed on our trains or whether safety is a high priority of Iarnród Éireann. Many a morning I have allowed four or five trains to leave a station rather than cram into the scrum on them. If there were even a minor impact, there would be severe casualties because too many passengers are allowed on that excellent DART service. Surely Iarnród Éireann could organise its train services more efficiently, guaranteeing greater safety for its passengers.

I also draw the attention of the House to the scene at Amiens Street as the 5.20 p.m. train departs from there. It also defies description. As Deputy Sargent said, it is like a cattle train, lurching backwards and forwards almost to the extent that one cannot draw breath such is the density of passengers. The risk of a collision or derailment is always present and it would result in significant casualties.

When I heard of this motion being tabled I wanted to avail of the opportunity to air those concerns. I expressed them to high ranking personnel in Dundalk recently but was dismissed in a rather cursory fashion. I had a very unsatisfactory interview with them and was treated in a rather flippant manner. My concern is to ensure that reasonable, stringent safety conditions are laid down and implemented on all rail lines nation-wide. Unfortunately, a tragedy will probably occur before any such action is taken, following which there will be much hype and public relations announcements to the effect that such action was intended. As a matter of urgency, I ask the Minister to ensure a limit is placed on the numbers of passengers permitted to board any train.

Mr. Deenihan

I thank Deputy McGahon for giving me an opportunity of contributing to this debate.

As a frequent rail traveller, I too should like to express my concern at the quality of our rail services. Rail travel has become ever more popular in recent years, principally because of the traffic congestion on roads and the dangers involved in driving. Greater numbers of people now possess cars, usually with more than one per household, in both urban and rural areas. Our roads have not the capacity to accommodate these levels of traffic. Despite the many road improvements implemented in recent years, subvented by EU Structural Funds, they are not adequate to meet the present demands.

For that reason alone, there will have to be greater investment in our rail network generally, similar to that taking place throughout Europe and in the United States — which I visited recently — where major emphasis is being placed on investment in its rail network. It is all the more important, therefore, that even greater emphasis be placed on upgrading ours.

Some years ago one could be guaranteed to arrive at a destination on time but that is no longer the case. On two occasions last week trains from Dublin to Limerick and Cork were delayed a number of hours. On Tuesday morning, the Dublin train to Limerick was delayed by an hour and a half because of some incident on the line.

Deputies will be aware that there was a serious incident on the Mallow-Tralee line a few weeks ago which was raised in the House by concerned Kerry Deputies. It was fortunate that nobody was injured on that occasion as there could have been carnage. Unfortunately, the Minister is not here. We all know that our rail network does not have the capacity to cope with existing demands but we need a programme of action, not another inquiry.

As Kerry is the premier tourist county, it is vitally important that there is immediate investment in that line. One-third of the tourists visiting our county use the rail network and it is important that there is investment in it.

Minister of State at the Department of Public Enterprise (Mr. Jacob)

I am delighted to have the opportunity to make the closing remarks on this important motion. I was pleased that Deputies took the opportunity to compliment the staff of Iarnród Éireann who have had to operate the railway system in difficult circumstances. The future is much brighter now and I am sure the staff at all levels will rise to the challenge.

Last night the Minister focused her contribution on two areas — investment and safety. The existing programme of investment on the railways is a complete turnaround from the unhappy period in the 1980s when financial support for the railways was allowed to decline. To be fair to the people at that time, there was probably a widespread view throughout the world that railways had a poor future and that enormous investment could not be justified.

There has been a marked change of attitude in most countries since then. The key cause of this change has been a growing awareness of the problems of traffic congestion and air pollution. Where once there was a general belief that the traffic problem could be solved by building more roads, it is now clear, even in countries where the motor industry is an important part of the economy, that we cannot continue to dig up our fields to make more roads.

Deputy Stagg yesterday cited the experience of the Lucan bypass, which is typical of roads everywhere. Only a few years after its construction traffic congestion on what is now a much larger road is as bad as it was on the old road which it replaced.

In July 1996, the EU Commission published its White Paper entitled A Strategy for Revitalising the Community's Railways. This is a watershed document clearly underlining the practical role which railways should play in our transport systems. In that paper the Commission was critical as well as supportive of railways. It pointed out that railways had failed to improve their share of the transport market even though they have been sheltered from market forces. It also stated that a clearer division of responsibilities between railway authorities and Governments is essential. In particular, it said there is a need for explicit accounting for the public service aspects of the railways. The Commission also underlined the opportunity provided by our railway systems in the fight against congestion and pollution.

Last night Deputy Kenny alleged that, at any one time, 45 rail carriages are undergoing repair in the Iarnród Éireann workshops and if these could be maintained more quickly and put into service it would help to alleviate overcrowding. I have checked with Iarnród Éireann and I understand that approximately 28 carriages are undergoing maintenance at any one time. The recent accident at Knockcroghery caused this number to peak at 35 but matters are now back to normal. The numbers using the railway at peak times are currently at an all time high and Iarnród Éireann is making every effort to minimise the number of carriages out of service.

Some Deputies commented on the lack of EU funding for the westernmost extremities of the rail system. I assure Deputies that this was not for want of effort by Ministers or officials. As with everything else in life, resources are limited and difficult choices have to be made. In our negotiations with the Commission, its emphasis was on the economic impact of investment. This meant that priority was given to the most heavily used sections of the network. Nevertheless we succeeded at our first attempt in getting its agreement to invest in a substantial part of the network.

The Minister indicated last night that she intends to make the best possible case for further EU funding under the next round of Structural Funds. I am sure that public support for railways as a means to deal with transport problems will continue to grow and that the case for further funding will continue to improve.

I thank Deputy Stagg for putting the issue of safety into perspective. Rail travel is significantly safer than road travel. This is due to the care and attention given to safety by railway engineers everywhere. From the earliest times, railway operators realised, that as with airlines, an unsafe system would be economic suicide. Passengers would simply not travel if they considered trains unsafe.

Iarnród Éireann has a good safety record and management at all levels is fully committed to maintaining and improving safety standards. It is worth pointing out that without sufficient public attention, Iarnród Éireann has significantly upgraded its passenger rolling stock in recent years. All the carriages are now steel bodied and over 65 per cent have automatic doors. The position will improve further with the arrival next year of a further 27 diesel railcars.

While it is obviously essential to maintain the infrastructure in a safe working condition, passenger safety also relies on investment in good quality rolling stock to provide protection when, on rare occasions, accidents occur. As the Minister said, operating a safe railway system requires attention to all aspects of the work. Investment on its own would not be enough. Neither would the most exhaustive inspection system be sufficient without investment. The purpose of the safety review the Minister announced, and which I am delighted has been welcomed by all sides of the House, is to gather the facts based on the latest thinking about rail safety. Without that all-embracing view of the complex interaction of activities on the railway, it would be all too easy to spend an enormous sum of money on improvements which may only marginally improve safety while other more important issues are neglected.

I commend the amended motion proposed by the Minister. The current £275 million programme of investment marks a new and exciting beginning for the railway system. The railway safety review will complement this investment by providing the information necessary to take the right decisions so that passengers can continue to enjoy the high level of safety provided by our railway system.

Mr. Perry

I wish to share my time with Deputies Belton and Yates.

An Ceann Comhairle

That is agreed.

Mr. Perry

The Dublin-Sligo line has three daily passenger services each way. Over 500,000 people use these services each year. There is a daily commuter service from Longford to Dublin in addition to a daily scheduled liner train carrying freight. According to Iarnród Éireann, a large proportion of the trackwork on the line is reaching life expiry leading to speed restrictions and uncomfortable travel. Approximately 25 per cent of the line has modern continuously welded track.

The EU Cohesion Fund recently approved grant assistance towards a £12.5 million investment programme which is to be concentrated between Dublin and Mullingar. This decision was made on cost benefit grounds which indicated that the busier section of the track showed the best returns. The Dublin-Mullingar section is in good condition but substantial investment is required between Mullingar and Sligo where a further 80 miles must be renewed if the line is to remain competitive with the ever improving road network.

The total cost of completing the remaining 80 miles between Mullingar and Sligo is approximately £30 million. The trains currently in use are second generation carriages. The entire line is currently undergoing a transmission signal improvement scheme. The future of the railway line in the west depends on Iarnród Éireann working in partnership with the local community and local development agencies.

Will a copy of the application made by Iarnród Éireann for upgrading the Sligo-Dublin line be made available? Also, will a copy of the EU consultants' report on this application, which apparently rejected the allocation of funding to the Mullingar-Sligo section, be made available? Who were these consultants? Did they visit the west and did they seek the observations of any economic development agencies, community groups, local authority or public representatives in Sligo, Roscommon, Leitrim or Longford?

Ireland is one EU region. The case has been accepted in Europe for a trans-European network between Belfast and Cork serving the east and south of the country, including Waterford and Galway. While the west is committed to maintaining and increasing its population, it is incomprehensible that there is a lack of commitment to upgrading the railway infrastructure. If EU resources are not available for railways in the west, the Exchequer should commit itself to funding it from its own resources.

In her reply two weeks ago, the Minister stated that £2.5 million would be spent between 1996 and 1998 on the Mullingar to Sligo line. Will that money come from the operational budget because, if so, it means that no track will be renewed. If track is to be renewed, will the Minister indicate the location and when the work will commence?

Mr. Belton

I welcome the opportunity to contribute to this debate and I thank my colleagues for sharing the restricted time available. I emphasise the importance of the Sligo line for Longford and other parts of the midlands. Four or five years ago it was strongly rumoured that the future of that line was in danger. A major campaign was launched at that stage by communities from Sligo to Dublin, especially by communities from Sligo to Mullingar, including my town of Longford. It was only at that stage the importance of the railway line to that region was emphasised. The future of the line appeared to be secure and we were given guarantees that improvements would be made because the service was particularly poor. At that time the locomotives were not working properly on some days and on others the signalling system was wrong. There is also the general problem of overcrowding on that train route. I asked the Minister about that rail line in a recent debate on our railways. I now ask the Minister of State to ensure something is done to improve the rolling stock on that line and to alleviate the overcrowding problem. This matter should be taken up in the not too distant future with Iarnród Éireann.

The Sligo line has always been given the hand-me-downs in rail transport; the rolling stock taken off the southern lines. It would remind one of the dinky cars passed by one family to another. That is not good enough. The people of the midlands, counties Leitrim Sligo, and Donegal deserve as good a service as that enjoyed by others. Will the Minister of State ensure the Sligo line is provided for? The signalling system and the rolling stock must be upgraded to the standard of other lines. There have been problems in the recent past and, knowing the Minister, her announcement on television yesterday that there will be a report on this was dramatic and timely.

I pay tribute to my colleague Deputy Yates who was the prime mover in getting action from the Minister on this matter. I hope her announcement was not a PR exercise by the Minister and her commitment will be fulfilled. If not, I will raise this matter again, as will my colleagues, particularly Deputy Yates, with the Minister and ask her to upgrade the tracks to get the trains moving. That is what we want and what the people deserve. Funding for that is available from Europe and it will be most unfortunate if our Government does not avail of it. If that money is spent now, more funding may be made available. I compliment Deputy Yates on moving this motion and bringing this important matter before the House.

Mr. Yates

I thank the Deputies on both sides of the House who spoke in this debate. The number who have spoken is a clear indication of the genuine strength of feeling about this matter in the constituencies affected by this issue. There is no doubt it has a resonance and an echo on the east coast and particularly in the west and north-west where people have always valued their railways. They consider them an integral part of a national transport policy and regional policy which gives their communities access to the capital city.

Regarding the two ministerial speeches, I welcome the terms of reference of the study. Some weeks ago I called for an independent international assessment of a safety review of our railways. I am concerned that Iarnród Éireann is the judge and jury as well as the practitioner in all aspects of rail safety. While its track record cannot be questioned, an external evaluation would be useful.

A lack of investment is the key to this issue. A number of Deputies opposite began their contributions by praising Deputy Cowen's commitment, as Minister, and the Fianna Fáil Administration for investing £275 million in our railways in 1994 and by the same token they then skipped a jump and said Fine Gael was to blame for the lack of investment in our railways. They complimented the investment plan that excluded the Mullingar to Sligo route, the Dublin to Rosslare route and the Athlone to Ballina and Westport route. My point is that the decision not to provide £85 million for those three routes is the reason for tonight's debate.

I am particularly concerned about the safety of level crossings and I ask the Minister of State to take up that matter. There are two types of level crossings here, one is operated by automatic signalling or manually and crosses roadways and the other is private level crossings which cross people's lands in respect of which farmers must commute back and forth. Various people have told me there are tens of thousands of those level crossings throughout the country and their safety is very questionable. If the response to this motion is a focus on safety, I hope that aspect will be clearly included in the terms of reference of the study.

The Minister, Deputy O'Rourke, who I regret has not had the time to be present for the full debate, has a penchant for commissioning studies to deal with difficult issues. I welcome this study only on the basis that it will not be a substitute for action. There is a study commissioned on Luas, multi-channel TV, a strategic alliance with Aer Lingus, the ESB and there is endless pro-crastination and paralysis by analyses, but if a rail accident occurs, it will be too late. In this regard, the House does not need £85 million in l998, but an indicative commitment that £15 to £20 million will be provided over a four year period for step by step upgrading of the railways. We should bear in mind that if a rail accident occurs, Bus Éireann, Irish Rail and Dublin Bus do not have insurance. They carry their own insurance and, therefore, the taxpayer has to fund the current claims arising from the Claremorris accident some years ago and they will have to fund claims arising from any future rail accident.

The Minister made the point there is no such thing as risk free travel and she is right. She said there is no point in saying that if an accident happens it might necessarily be the Government's responsibility. If a motorist drives on the wrong side of the road, the chances of him being involved in an accident are greater than if he drove on the correct side of the road. The Minister has fair warning and after the accident at Knockcroghery it has been put up in lights that jointed track with metal fatigue on fishplates is a recipe for disaster in a derailment. Concrete sleepers, continuous welded rail and automatic signalling are the only way to secure the types of speeds that intercity rail needs to be reliable, safe, popular and efficient.

Crocodile tears shed by certain Members from a constituency perspective will not be enough unless they exert leverage. I noticed during this debate that the real Taoiseach, Deputy Healy-Rae, fleetingly came into the House and I welcome his interest in this matter, but I want the Independent Deputies to put their feet down on this vote and exercise their leverage. I call on Deputies Fox and Blaney to do that. We know the people who hold the balance of power in this country and the Members who hold the balance of power in this House. They have appointed a special programme manager to look after their specialist needs. They need only moan and groan about this issue to get action. This debate has been a constructive and positive one but at the end of the day, the Minister, who was so quick when in Opposition to come into this House to find the Minister accountable for everything that went wrong, is now in the position where the buck stops with her. She is responsible for railway investment and consequently for railway safety. There will be no hiding place in the event of a horrific accident occurring. I hope the Minister will bring a memorandum to Cabinet in the near future and get results on this issue. We will then have a national railway network of which we can be proud.

Amendment put.

The Dáil divided: Tá, 71 ; Níl, 61.

Tá

Ahern, Dermot.
Ahern, Michael.
Ahern, Noel.
Ardagh, Seán.
Aylward, Liam.
Blaney, Harry.
Brady, Johnny.
Brady, Martin.
Brennan, Matt.
Brennan, Séamus.
Briscoe, Ben.
Browne, John (Wexford).
Byrne, Hugh.
Callely, Ivor.
Carey, Pat.
Collins, Michael.
Cooper-Flynn, Beverley.
Coughlan, Mary.
Cowen, Brian.
Daly, Brendan.
de Valera, Síle.
Dennehy, John.
O'Kennedy, Michael.
Ellis, John.
Fahey, Frank.
Fleming, Seán.
Flood, Chris.
Foley, Denis.
Fox, Mildred.
Hanafin, Mary.
Haughey, Seán.
Healy-Rae, Jackie.
Jacob, Joe.
Keaveney, Cecilia.
Kelleher, Billy.
Kenneally, Brendan.
Killeen, Tony.
Kirk, Séamus.
Kitt, Michael.
Lawlor, Liam.
Lenihan, Brian.
Lenihan, Conor.
Martin, Micheál.
McCreevy, Charlie.
McDaid, James.
McGennis, Marian.
McGuinness, John.
Moffatt, Thomas.
Molloy, Robert.
Moloney, John.
Moynihan, Donal.
Moynihan, Michael.
O'Dea, Willie.
O'Donoghue, John.
O'Flynn, Noel.
O'Hanlon, Rory.
O'Keeffe, Batt.
Doherty, Seán.
O'Keeffe, Ned.
O'Malley, Desmond.
O'Rourke, Mary.
Power, Seán.
Roche, Dick.
Ryan, Eoin.
Smith, Brendan.
Smith, Michael.
Treacy, Noel.
Wade, Eddie.
Walsh, Joe.
Woods, Michael.
Wright, G.V.

Níl

Allen, Bernard.
Barnes, Monica.
Barrett, Seán.
Bell, Michael.
Belton, Louis.
Bradford, Paul.
Broughan, Thomas.
Browne, John (Carlow-Kilkenny).
Bruton, John.
Burke, Ulick.
Carey, Donal.
Enright, Thomas.
Farrelly, John.
Ferris, Michael.
Finucane, Michael.
Fitzgerald, Frances.
Hayes, Brian.
Higgins, Jim.
Higgins, Joe.
Hogan, Philip.
Howlin, Brendan.
McDowell, Derek.
McGahon, Brendan.
McGinley, Dinny.
McGrath, Paul.
McManus, Liz.
Mitchell, Gay.
Mitchell, Olivia.
Moynihan-Cronin, Breeda.
Neville, Dan.
Clune, Deirdre.
Connaughton, Paul.
Cosgrave, Michael.
Coveney, Hugh.
Crawford, Seymour.
Creed, Michael.
Currie, Austin.
Deasy, Austin.
Deenihan, Jimmy.
Dukes, Alan.
Durkan, Bernard.
Noonan, Michael.
O'Keeffe, Jim.
O'Shea, Brian.
Owen, Nora.
Penrose, William.
Perry, John.
Quinn, Ruairí.
Rabbitte, Pat.
Reynolds, Gerard.
Ring, Michael.
Sargent, Trevor.
Shatter, Alan.
Shortall, Róisín.
Stagg, Emmet.
Stanton, David.
Timmins, Billy.
Upton, Pat.
Wall, Jack.
Yates, Ivan.

Tellers: Tá, Deputies S. Brennan and Power; Níl, Deputies Barrett and Sheehan.

Amendment declared carried.

Motion, as amended, agreed to.

Dáil Éireann debate - Wednesday, 10 Dec 1997