Vol. 501 No. 6
4 Mr. J. Bruton asked the Taoiseach if he will elaborate on the points he made in a newspaper interview (details supplied) on 14 February 1999 regarding decommissioning; his views on whether the newspaper misrepresented his position; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [4754/99]
5 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach the plans, if any, he has to meet Senator George Mitchell during his planned visit to the United States in March 1999; his views on whether Senator Mitchell could play a role in overcoming obstacles in the way of full implementation of the Good Friday Agreement; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5046/99]
6 Mr. J. Bruton asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his recent meeting in Germany with the British Prime Minister, Mr. Blair; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5782/99]
7 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his meeting with the British Prime Minister; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5966/99]
8 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach his views on whether his comments to the The Sunday Times on 14 February 1999 were misrepresented; if he, or any member of his staff, has been in contact with the newspaper or its editor since the publication of the article; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5973/99]
9 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach the engagements he will be undertaking in his visit to the United States later this month. [5974/99]
10 Mr. Sargent asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his meeting in the past week with the British Prime Minister, Mr. Tony Blair; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5984/99]
11 Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin asked the Taoiseach the contacts, if any, he had since 2 March 1999 with the British Prime Minister in relation to the implementation of the Good Friday Agreement; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [6860/99]
12 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach the contacts, if any, he has had last week with the leaders of the political parties in Northern Ireland; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [6865/99]
13 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach the outcome of his meeting with the First Minister of Northern Ireland, Mr. David Trimble; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7053/99]
14 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach if he has finalised his itinerary for his visit to the United States for St. Patrick's Day; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7055/99]
15 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach the contracts, if any, he has had in the last week with the British Prime Minister; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7056/99]
16 Mr. Sargent asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his meeting in Dublin last week with Mr. David Trimble; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7074/99]
17 Mr. J. Bruton asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his meeting in Dublin on 4 March 1999 with the First Minister of Northern Ireland, Mr. Trimble; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7192/99]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 4 to 17, inclusive, together.
I dealt comprehensively in the House recently with all the issues arising from my interview with the Sunday Times several weeks ago. I do not intend to run over the same ground again.
I will depart for San José in the United States on 11 March where I will commence my programme of engagements for the St. Patrick's Day period. While in San José I will meet representatives of companies which have significant operations here. I will attend an IDA Ireland lunch and the launch by Enterprise Ireland of its new Silicon Valley network as well as the Spirit of Ireland awards dinner.
On 14 March I will attend the St. Patrick's Day parade in San Francisco which will be followed by a lunch at the United Irish Cultural Centre. Before departing for Washington I will deliver an address at the Commonwealth Club of California. While in Washington I anticipate meeting senior figures in the US Administration. I will have a meeting with Senator Kennedy and The Friends of Ireland in the House of Representatives. On the evening of Tuesday, 16 March, after attending the official opening of Doyle's Hotel on New Hampshire Avenue, I will attend the American Ireland Fund dinner.
On St. Patrick's Day, in accordance with tradition and established practice, I will meet President Clinton at the White House and subsequently attend a dinner hosted by Speaker Hastert on Capitol Hill. I will participate in a number of receptions, including the White House reception. I will also participate in various media events. On Thursday, 18 March, I will chair a meeting of the Ireland-America Economic Advisory Board after which I will return to Dublin.
There are no plans in the programme for a formal meeting with Senator Mitchell, but it is possible that if he is in Washington I shall have the pleasure of meeting him. He put so much time and effort into bringing about a peaceful accommodation on the island. We all owe him so much.
We are all extremely grateful for the engagement and support of the United States Administration throughout the process, including the key role played by Senator Mitchell as talks chairman. President Clinton has made it clear that he remains available to help in any way he can as opportunities arise. We are grateful for that assurance and shall be alert to every opening for his constructive involvement, not least in coming weeks. In the meantime it is vital that the two Governments and all the parties to the Agreement continue to work intensively to get over current difficulties. If we all put our hearts and minds to it, we can make the necessary progress in the period immediately ahead.
I met Prime Minister Blair in Bonn on Friday, 26 February. I am reporting in a reply to a subsequent parliamentary question on the European and international issues on which we focused. On Northern Ireland, the Prime Minister and I discussed progress in implementing the Good Friday Agreement in all its aspects, including the establishment of the North-South implementation bodies and the finalisation of legislation to establish them. Following an intensive programme of work we have now concluded the necessary four treaties. We are now in a position to proceed with the necessary legislation. In this regard the British-Irish Agreement Bill, 1999, which provides for implementation bodies covering inland waterways, food safety, trade and business developments, special EU programmes, language, aquaculture and marine matters, comes before the House today.
The Prime Minister and I also reflected on useful progress which has been made over the past few months working with General de Chastelain and progressing the resolution of the decommissioning issue through the decommissioning body chaired by him, as set out in the Good Friday Agreement. We also reviewed the Drumcree issue.
Last Thursday I met with the First Minister designate, David Trimble, at Government Buildings. We had a very useful meeting at which we settled a number of significant political aspects with regard to the supplementary international agreement to set up the North-South implementation bodies. Following further intensive work up to Sunday, full agreement was reached and the Minister for Foreign Affairs and the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland signed the requisite four treaties in Dublin yesterday. These treaties provide for the North-South implementation bodies, the North-South Ministerial Council, the British-Irish Council and the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference.
This latest achievement marks another significant milestone in our ongoing efforts to progress the implementation of the Good Friday Agreement in all its aspects. I pay tribute to all involved in this. The work will, of course, continue and with the commitment of all concerned I hope we will be in a position to report further progress soon. I had a further conversation with the British Prime Minister yesterday as well as a substantive, useful meeting with Mr. Gerry Adams. We will continue with our efforts in co-operation with the relevant parties until we succeed in securing a resolution to the current difficulties surrounding the formation of the Executive.
Given the effect deadlines have in concentrating minds, will the Taoiseach outline the reasons for the timing of the announcement of the postponement of the 10 March deadline and whether there was a possibility that something more might have been done in the intervening days if it had been deferred?
That may have been possible. It was for the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland to decide and I understand she made her decision in consultation with the Prime Minister. It was realised that the deadline of tomorrow would not be reached and she therefore set what she believed to be a realistic date. I was not party to the decision but I have no great difficulty with it.
What does the Taoiseach envisage is likely to happen during what may be called the American interlude as far as moving the process forward is concerned? Will any substantive discussion take place during the period when many of the participants are in the US? Do the Governments envisage making a joint proposal to the parties with a view to seeking to break the current deadlock?
I hope that the period before the departure to the US and while most of the main players are abroad will be used to continue close dialogue. The format has not been worked out but I hope people will continue to engage directly. The more discussion and understanding between the parties the better. A host of agenda items relating to areas of partnership, including North-South bodies, the implementation bodies, the British-Irish Council and the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference, have been under consideration over recent months. These continued to deflect away from direct engagement when the parties met. I am not sure if this was always justified and I expressed my impatience on a number of occasions. However, we have now moved beyond that phase and none of these items is now on the agenda. I am grateful to those involved and to the parties in Opposition. I especially thank the officials from a number of Departments and the parliamentary draftsmen who worked horrendous hours on these issues.
People need to discuss the current situation and what is there to be achieved and lost and to reflect on the few issues which will move us on. The parties have asked me on a number of occasions if the British and Irish Governments can achieve constructive movement on other issues without another impasse. They do not want one step taken, such as movement on the Executive, only to find there are no North-South bodies, or movement on North-South bodies but no British-Irish Council. The benefit of what we are debating later today is that if the impasse is overcome, we can move straight to the Executive, the North/South Ministerial Council, the British-Irish Council and the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference. There is no obstacle to moving on any of these issues. Parties must reflect on that and realise the prize is a working assembly and Executive and other institutions.
I hope people get the opportunity, whether privately or collectively, during St. Patrick's week to reflect on this issue. We and the American Administration are prepared to do anything we can to encourage that. This issue has been fairly clear to me for a long time and now the agenda is clear. I hope people will see what is to be gained.
I endorse what the Taoiseach said about the need for the participants to look at the big picture and at what could be lost if an agreement is not reached on the one issue which remains unsettled. Does the Taoiseach accept that everyone in this House is anxious to see this matter resolved quickly and in a statesmanlike fashion by all concerned?
I appreciate what the Deputy said and the support of the House in bringing these matters to this stage. I hope people will realise we have brought this process to an important stage. Last week the Human Rights Commission was set up and its makeup got broad agreement from all parties. I will continue to do all I can but I cannot bring people across the line as that requires them to work together.
The Taoiseach answered 14 questions together but he inadvertently omitted to answer Question No. 8 about The Sunday Times interview. I want to ask him a question about his meeting yesterday with Mr. Adams because the subject matter is the same. Did the Taoiseach confirm yesterday with Mr. Adams the view he was quoted as having expressed in The Sunday Times that it would be impossible for any elected Executive to take office and to form a Government if a party to that Executive or that Cabinet office had links with paramilitaries? If he confirmed the substance of the story in The Sunday Times to Mr. Adams during his meeting yesterday, what was Mr. Adams's response to that view, if the Taoiseach still holds that view?
I said in my reply that I dealt comprehensively with the interview in The Sunday Times two weeks ago in this House. It was not directly related to parliamentary questions but it came up and we discussed it for a considerable length of time. I have no difficulty with the full text of that interview. However, the situation has moved on and I have spoken to Mr. Adams a number of times since then. We discussed the impasse and the number of means by which we can attempt to move it on. Everybody else, including Mr. Adams, is engaged in trying to find a resolution of this issue.
I do not doubt that everybody is trying to move on the issue, but did the Taoiseach express his view, as publicly quoted, that it is inconceivable that an executive could be formed in which one of the parties represented in that executive would continue to have links to a paramilitary organisation which had refused to decommission? If the Taoiseach conveyed such a view, if he still holds that view, what was the response yesterday, in his most recent contact with Mr. Adams, to that point of view?
My point of view yesterday, and for months, has not changed. This was a private meeting but the clear response from Sinn Féin is that it is doing all it can, under the terms of the Agreement, to find a resolution of this matter with General John de Chastelain. It is putting considerable effort into finding a way to deal with this item. That has not yet given us a way of getting around the impasse but the intensive discussions are ongoing. More effort has been put into this item than any other but we still have not found a resolution.
In meetings with representatives of my own party and elsewhere, Mr. Adams has stated that in his view, as President of Sinn Féin, decommissioning will never take place. Has Mr. Adams conveyed that view to the Taoiseach in recent times?
I believe the Good Friday Agreement, which states that the decommissioning of arms is a central part of the Agreement, must stand. Mr. Adams, or other loyalist political groupings which have close associations with paramilitary groups, must accept that. I understand Mr. Adams, Mr. McGuinness and others in Sinn Féin are doing all they can to achieve that. The suggestion that what we are trying to achieve is impossible is not acceptable to me or anybody else.
The Taoiseach did not convey that view?
That it was impossible? No.
That it would not happen?
Does the Taoiseach share the grave concern of many at what is now a crisis in the peace process? Does he accept that the various elements of the Good Friday Agreement are being addressed, including the issue of decommissioning, which remains unresolved, just as the issues of the RUC, reform of the courts and Judiciary in the Six Counties, demilitarisation and the implementation of the equality agenda remain unresolved? Will he agree that none of these unresolved issues, including the issue of decommissioning, must be singled out and used by anyone to exercise a veto over the entire Agreement?
It is important that people do not talk up a crisis.
Hear, hear.
Or work up a crisis.
It is easy to talk up a crisis. Contacts between the parties and the two Governments are continuing, and that should be welcomed and encouraged. All of the issues Deputy Ó Caoláin mentioned are being worked on in one form or another. The Patten Commission did excellent work over the winter and I believe it is on target to produce its report in the summer. The human rights commissioner was appointed last week and the equality agenda is moving on. We have had a fair amount of demilitarisation with a decrease in the number of troops and bases. We must continue to ensure that all these elements work together over time. Decommissioning, which is part of demilitarisation, is another element. During meetings I do not put more emphasis on one of these issues than on another. I try to move them all together and that is what I will continue to do.
If progress is made on what was created in the past there will be a great deal of activity. Within a number of weeks there could be meetings of the Executive and the Assembly could be functioning properly. The North/South Ministerial Council could be working on the everyday issues that affect the lives of Nationalists, republicans, Unionists and loyalists. The British-Irish Council, in which Members of this House and the other parliaments will work together, could be operating, as could the intergovernmental conference. All bodies could be dealing with the business within their remit—
A Cheann Chomhairle—
The Deputy should wait until the Taoiseach finishes his reply.
I do not seek to set down preconditions. I am trying to work all these matters through so that the Good Friday Agreement, in all its aspects, is implemented. I believe that is possible and I hope everybody else does too.
I asked the Taoiseach if he agreed that none of the unresolved elements of the Good Friday Agreement should be singled out and used as an obstacle to progress in the implementation of all the essential elements and bodies within the Agreement. Does the Taoiseach agree that none of these issues should be singled out in the way I outlined in my question?
I have said a million times that there are no preconditions in the Good Friday Agreement. Political logic dictates that we move everything we can and try to overcome each impasse, and that is what we are doing.
I urge the Taoiseach to press forward with confidence to an eventual successful outcome despite the efforts of those on both sides who wish to talk up a crisis. Does the Taoiseach agree that both sides have gone too far and that there is too much to lose for this process to fail now? Does he agree it is necessary that the two Governments, supported by President Clinton, do not give in to pressure from any source, whether the blackmail is green or orange?
When one looks at the Order Paper and sees listed in the Order of Business motions on establishing a North/South Ministerial Council, implementation bodies, a British-Irish Council and a British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference—
The Deputy is making a statement. He must confine himself to asking a brief supplementary question.
This is a basis for confidence in moving forward. There is only one negative aspect of this which must be carefully watched. I note with concern, and I have received reports on, the increase of sectarian attacks in Northern Ireland, particularly in the Dungannon area. Will the Taoiseach, through the British Government, inform the RUC that this effort to increase tension in the community must be stopped immediately?
I agree with all the questions on which Deputy Currie sought my agreement. I will check with the staff in the Northern Secretariat about the last matter.
I wish to clarify the Taoiseach's reply to a supplementary question from Deputy Bruton. He said with regard to the decision by the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, Dr. Mowlam, to postpone the 10 March deadline to a later date that he had not been consulted or, to use his precise words, he had not been party to that decision. Am I to take it that the Taoiseach was not consulted and was not aware in advance or was there some communication between both Governments before this decision was taken by the British Government? The Taoiseach's earlier reply appears to imply that this was a unilateral decision by the British Government.
I do not want to make too much of this. The first I heard of it was yesterday evening. A Sinn Féin staff member, who was in a corridor with Mr. Adams, informed me about this.
I do not want to make too much of this either. Was anybody else in the building or in the Taoiseach's office at the time? Was communication made with anyone other than the Taoiseach? Did he make inquiries subsequently to find out if the normal channels of communi cations had been open and that this decision was flagged in advance or was there any consultation?
There probably was later in the day. I do not want to make too much of this.
Will the Taoiseach accept that one of the reasons there is a reluctance in the republican community to move forward with decommissioning is concern about matters in the 1970s when neighbourhoods were attacked by mobs and so forth? Will he also accept that reassurance must be given as to the adequacy of protection, given some of the threatening noises made in loyalist quarters? Will he equally agree that it falls to the republican community leadership to show leadership and not to put up murals that blame the other side all the time or that promote a one dimensional victim culture when the truth of the matter is that everyone is a victor in the peace process? Ultimately, there will be no victims if the peace process is a success. In loyalist and republican heartlands it is important that the culture of victimhood should be replaced by a culture of self-confidence.
I agree with Deputy Bruton. I am sure he would agree that it will take a long time for people to think that way. Last week I had the opportunity to meet groups from loyalist and republican strongholds. They feel strongly about these issues. One issue taxing their minds is the increase in what we would call ordinary crime. That affects them and leads to the issue of RUC reform and how that will be linked in. The Patten Commission is very conscious of this. These groups have fears about these issues. As much as we would all disagree with the structures that have been in place there for the past number of years, those are the issues that are taxing their minds. We must build confidence to enable people think differently from the way they thought in past decades, but it will take time to do that. We must move forward to a situation where people do not look to others to sort out policing problems. That is still a problem area in the North, for which I do not have a ready solution. It is highlighted by representative groups who are concerned about these matters. I refer to groups who are representative of human rights, justice, truth and other groups who do not support violence. This is a problem area we must try to resolve.
