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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 23 Jun 1999

Vol. 506 No. 6

Ceisteanna–Questions. - Computer Programmes.

Ruairí Quinn

Question:

1 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach the number of members of staff from his Department involved in interdepartmental groups examining the year 2000 problem; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [15351/99]

John Bruton

Question:

2 Mr. J. Bruton asked the Taoiseach the number of staff from his Department on interdepartmental groups working on the year 2000 issue; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [15786/99]

I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 and 2 together.

Two IT staff from my Department are members of the interdepartmental year 2000 special interest group which was set up specifically to examine the year 2000 issue. This issue also arises in the context of other interdepartmental groups without it being their primary focus. These include the Civil Service IT group and the IT managers' network. My Department is represented on both groups.

Is the Taoiseach aware of the survey of the Small Firms' Association which shows that up to 70 per cent of small firms surveyed are not yet Y2K compliant? Does he accept a major job of work remains to be done? What is the readiness of other Departments to meet the target the Taoiseach has set himself of being Y2K compliant by the end of July? Has all the £40 million allocated in the last budget to address the Y2K problem been taken up? How was the money spent? Will further money be required?

I will confine my answer to what I have said in reply to previous questions on this issue. The year 2000 interdepartmental committee secretariat is under the remit of the Minister for Finance who has answered questions on it. The Minister of State with responsibility for science, technology and commerce has responsibility for the Y2000 problem. I answer only questions that relate to my Department.

We have set the summer for our Department to be fully Y2K compliant and other Departments and agencies have also set that as their target. It appears as if everything is on schedule. The unit working on this in my Department has moved on to examine the contingency requirements for key business processes. The Minister for Finance submitted the eighth report to Government this week and I am sure he will answer questions on that. All my ministerial colleagues have had meetings with agency leaders to ensure everything possible is done in their areas of responsibility. Campaigns are also being conducted by the ESB and other State agencies to ensure people are Y2K compliant.

There has been a huge improvement in the business area with which the Minister of State, Deputy Treacy, has dealt. The awareness and advertising campaigns conducted through Enterprise Ireland must be maintained. The focus has changed recently towards countries supplying goods to Ireland which would not be as advanced as other countries in working towards being Y2K compliant. There is concern in that area but many legal issues are involved. It is, therefore, receiving a great deal of attention.

On Y2K, is the Taoiseach aware of the widespread concern about air navigation equipment, all of which is computerised? Will he take a flight in full confidence on 1 January next? Will he ensure, under the interdepartmental committee, with regard to the Irish Aviation Authority, Eurocontrol and air carriers, that all the necessary arms of Government examine this matter so that people can be assured of complete air navigation safety at a holiday time of year when large numbers of people travel by air?

I am not going to become involved in a debate on that because I do not have overall responsibility for Y2000 issues. That matter has been addressed previously at Question Time by the Minister, Deputy O'Rourke, who spoke extensively about it.

Does that mean the Taoiseach will take his chances?

I take more chances with my life than that.

We know that. We know how fast and loose the Taoiseach can be.

Deputy Yates would take him to the airport if he could find it.

I consider it an easy challenge.

All the Taoiseach is doing is risking his life.

I hope he has a soft landing.

Air navigation, as well as many other areas, have been extensively examined because they are serious issues. Having spoken to many of the people on the committees involved with this issue, I am told it is embedded chips which matter, and we will find on 1 January next that they are located in places where we did not think they were. I was amused to find in my Department that an old alarm system in Government Buildings had embedded chips which meant it would have broken down on 1 January. I do not consider myself technical by any stretch of the imagination, but I am surprised there were embedded chips in such things. I can imagine what could happen with alarm systems, not to mention more sophisticated appliances. We will ring in the new year in more ways than one.

I will stay with areas for which the Taoiseach is responsible. Regarding the assigning of responsibility for ensuring industry is Y2K compliant to the Minister of State, Deputy Treacy, does the Taoiseach believe the results of the Small Firms Association's survey indicate we have fallen behind and that this is possibly attributable to the other activities in which the Minister of State was involved? Was another Minister of State assigned to cover for him while he was seeking election to the European Parliament?

I thought it was a little the other way, that the Minister of State was so involved in—

All kinds of everything?

—Y2K projects and launches that it gave the issue a high profile. I pay tribute to the Minister of State and the people who worked with him on this issue. He has a good group comprised of people from within and outside the public service. The latter has given much time to this. The Minister and his team have driven this issue to ensure compliance across Departments and across the State. There has been an enormous effort in small business. I have attended many of the launches held by the chambers of commerce, the Small Firms Association and IBEC. The chambers of commerce have been responsible for driving this issue forward. There are small businesses that deal with it on a day to day basis. The accountancy associations and many other groups have been pressing hard for compliance, with the result that a great deal of progress has been made.

This time last year I was very concerned about this matter because only the banks, insurance companies and other major interests had made preparations. However, an enormous effort was made, driven by the roadshow with which the Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment, Deputy Treacy, and Enterprise Ireland co-operated.

Deputy Treacy's roadshow was not as effective as it might have been.

Perhaps he spent too much time working on this matter.

Does the Taoiseach agree that Departments will be compliant by September and that the business sector is the cause for concern? Does he find it alarming that the small businesses survey shows that there is a serious dividing line between awareness and activity, for whatever reason? This division is not due to lack of advertisements on public radio, but many small and medium enterprises are not taking the necessary action. That is serious, particularly in terms of the economic damage that might be done. In the time that remains, does the Government intend to consider taking further measures? Has the Government made representations on this matter to Britain in respect of its nuclear industry? A number of nuclear reprocessing plants are situated a number of miles from the east coast and it is particularly important that we reassure our citizens about safety in that regard.

Contact has been made with Britain on the last matter to which the Deputy referred and many others. However, I will raise the issue of the nuclear industry at the next available opportunity. I am aware that an enormous list of contact points was identified over a year ago where follow-up action was needed. I will again mention to the committee the issue of the nuclear industry.

There are a number of institutions within the State sector which have to carry out work on compliance and we are pressing them to see that this is rapidly concluded. We are in a fairly good position but the interdepartmental committee continues to follow through in respect of the institutions that are lagging behind. The committee's work is particularly focused on elements in the security sector such as the Garda Síochána and the Defence Forces to ensure that their systems are year 2000 compliant.

A survey conducted last autumn by the Irish Computer Society concluded that almost nine out of ten businesses were aware of the problem. As Deputy Rabbitte correctly pointed out, the survey showed that most companies were not translating that awareness into action. When one reads articles about SMEs, one can see that the problem of non-compliance is a worldwide phenomenon. In the UK, despite an extensive and costly media campaign during the past 12 months, the level of action in respect of compliance is a matter for concern.

We must press ahead with our campaign to ensure compliance. Last December we asked Enterprise Ireland, by means of its new information service, to step up activity in this area. More recently, to deal with the division between awareness and action, Enterprise Ireland launched a practical "how to" guide on SMEs and a comprehensive directory of Y2K service providers and consultants. It also established a professional help desk to support the implementation of the guide and put in place networking shops to provide assistance for SMEs and intermediaries. I referred earlier to the chambers of commerce but Enterprise Ireland has also supplied information and copies of the guide to county enterprise groups and small business associations. There is also a website containing regularly updated guide material primarily targeted at accountancy groups which deal with small and medium-sized businesses. In addition, a media campaign was launched to prompt business interaction with that service which has attracted interest from representative groups as opposed to individual companies.

It was also decided that the county and city enterprise boards should play a major part in the national campaign on compliance. Recently the boards issued 110,000 copies of the documentation they have made available. Approximately 180 executives have been trained by the development agency, advice and support has been given to the 1,800 companies which sought it, 400 mentors have been trained and public advice and development sessions have been held. A supplement was provided in one of the Sunday newspapers which provided in clear, user-friendly language a complete overview of the issue.

I am not ruling out further action and we must continue to publicise this problem. I recently addressed one of the sessions to which I referred earlier. I spoke to representatives of one accountancy group which represented between 400 and 500 small businesses and I made them aware of some of the services Enterprise Ireland is offering. Within a week they linked into the system and obtained the data they required. I do not believe that individual business people such as shopkeepers etc. will not take a day off to attend one of these sessions. I attended the sessions for large business concerns approximately 18 months ago which were attended by representatives of all the companies that were invited.

We must continue to press home the message in respect of compliance. I agree with Deputy Rabbitte that people should see it as an effect on economic development because if their systems are not compliant problems will arise with their suppliers and others.

In respect of his reference to large business concerns, does the Taoiseach agree that the financial institutions and major banks, which have spent large amounts of money to ensure that their systems are year 2000 compliant, ought to make a greater contribution towards assisting the small companies with which they do business? Given that one of their advertisements says "If you are in business, we are in business", surely the major banks could make a greater contribution in terms of assisting small and medium enterprises.

In fairness, the financial institutions and major banks are involved with the various groups. However, it must be a concern to them that a large number of people's systems remain non-compliant. I am aware that concerns have been raised with them in respect of the number of staff they have appointed to promote awareness of the need for compliance. I will raise that matter again because the financial institutions and major banks, which have long been Y2K compliant, have the resources necessary to provide assistance. At the same time, however, I thank them for the work they have done with the national group.

With regard to the county enterprise boards, does the Taoiseach agree that these bodies tend to move away from the purpose for which they were originally established? Does he have proposals to study the current structures within county enterprise boards to see if they are communicating with local enterprises?

That is a separate question.

It is an important question.

It may be important but it is not directly relevant to this matter.

We are discussing the role of county enterprise boards.

Not in respect of Questions Nos. 1 and 2.

I have no intention of delaying the proceedings, I merely wish to ask the Taoiseach to consider this matter. I was a member of a county enterprise board when they were first established and I thought they had much to offer. However, I recently made representations on behalf of a small enterprise in my area and the person in question received a telling off from the chief executive for approaching public representatives.

The matter to which the Deputy is referring is totally irrelevant to the questions before the House.

It is very relevant to the people who are seeking assistance from these bodies.

The Deputy should table a separate question. It is not in order to raise this matter in respect of the two questions with which we are currently dealing.

If I table such a question, the Taoiseach will not answer it because it will go to the relevant Minister.

The Taoiseach cannot answer it now because it is not in order.

The Taoiseach is anxious to answer.

Be that as it may, we must proceed to Question No. 3. The Deputy should pursue the matter in another way.

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