Vol. 508 No. 5
1 Mr. Kenny asked the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands the position in relation to the Asgard II project; her views on whether the vessel should be restored or retained as a museum piece; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [19163/99]
2 Mr. O'Shea asked the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands the proposals, if any, she has in relation to the future of the Asgard; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [19447/99]
I propose to take Priority Questions Nos. 1 and 2 together.
I refer Deputies to my replies to Questions Nos. 705, 710, 716, 720 & 721 of 29 Meán Fómhair last.
The Asgard Restoration Project, or ARP, has made an application for a licence, under the National Monuments Acts, to alter the original Asgard in order to refit it for sailing. This vessel is currently stored at Kilmainham Gaol and is in the ownership of the Minister for Defence. In accordance with standard practice I sought the advice of the National Museum of Ireland on the application as the Asgard is considered to be an archaeological object as defined in the National Monuments Acts by virtue of its historic associations. I understand that in order to fully consider the application for a licence the National Museum requested additional information last January from the applicants. The additional information sought was received in July by the National Museum, which then proceeded to examine it in detail. A recommendation has been received in recent days from the National Museum by my Department.
I should explain separately that the waterways and industrial archaeology committee of the Heritage Council met with the ARP in late 1996 and indicated its support for the project. However, in December 1998, the Heritage Council's chief executive advised me of the council's intention to form a working group to re-examine the issue, as it is statutorily entitled to do. This working group was comprised of representatives of the Department of Defence, my Department, the National Museum of Ireland, the ARP and the Heritage Council, with an independent chairman, Mr. Peter Delamer. I am advised that the group met on three occasions and made a report to the Heritage Council on its findings. The Heritage Council wrote to me on 30 March 1999 stating that the council, having considered the working group report, now recommended that the ideal solution for the boat was its full conservation, display and interpretation as a land based exhibit in a suitable location.
The advice from the National Museum and the other advice and views in the matter will be taken into consideration by me in the coming weeks in arriving at a considered decision on the application for a licence. My role in the vessel's future at this point is strictly confined to deciding the issue in relation to the licence to alter it under the National Monuments Acts.
The ARP restoration committee outlined the three possibilities that exist – full seagoing status, display in a maritime setting or a land based museum exhibit. Articles written about this famous yacht indicate that it is not just stored in Kilmainham Gaol, where it was ignominiously lifted over the wall on its last journey 30 years ago but that it is now decaying. The Minister for Defence, who has responsibility for the Asgard, has already indicated his willingness to put up £250,000, which the ARP is willing to match pound for pound. This would allow the Asgard to be redisplayed in a maritime setting. Surely, given its history, its architectural and archaeological importance under the appropriate Acts and its part in Irish history as well as the fact that it is a yacht that was built to sail, it should now be preserved in a maritime setting for the next 50 years. Irrespective of the advice the Minister receives, will she make a decision to back up her colleague and allow this licence so that the ARP can do its job at no cost to the Exchequer?
First, I concur with the Deputy that this vessel is of particular historical significance and I also agree that this issue should be addressed without undue delay. It is important to have a decision as the Deputy is right in saying that while the vessel is stored in Kilmainham, it certainly needs immediate attention. I accept that and the Deputy is also right in saying that the owner of the vessel is not the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands but the Minister for Defence, who has made his views on this matter known. My role as Minister relates to the licence and to obtaining all views. Obviously there is tremendous interest in this historical artifact and letters have been written to me from home and abroad about it. I want all the information from the public and from such organisations as the Heritage Council and the National Museum. As I said, I have only recently received the National Museum's final report and to be fair to all concerned, as this is a rather complicated debate, I want to give due consideration to the points put forward by all sides. There is no question of delaying this decision. I agree with the Deputy that it is important a decision is made so that the matter can be taken forward.
What proportion of the timbers of the Asgard are original timbers? In the context of a full restoration to seagoing standards, how many of the present timbers would need to be replaced? Regarding the future of the Asgard, has the Minister looked at the possibility of the future exhibition of the vessel as a land based museum exhibit? On the other hand, bearing in mind the Asgard's importance not just in the context of Irish history but in its design and because of its famous builder, an exact replica of the Asgard could be made available for seagoing activities.
As Deputy O'Shea says, the options are to build it to sail in a maritime setting, as Deputy Kenny suggests, or make it a land based exhibit, and a further option is to make an exact replica. I must consider these options in granting the licence, that is the nub of the issue. With regard to the timbers, I am told if we go that route that extensive work would have to be done and, again, we would have to examine this. A number of people have raised the issue of costs but that does not come under my responsibility as Minister; it affects those directly involved in the project and the Minister for Defence. Deputy O'Shea has outlined the options which I must consider and I have only recently been in a position to make that decision. I assure the Deputy it will be made without undue delay.
I favour the Minister granting a licence to the ARP and the Minister for Defence putting up £250,000. It is well accepted by international experts that the best preservation method for timbers on sea-going craft is in a maritime setting. The cost to the Minister or anyone else in having a land based, climatically controlled exhibit would be in excess of £100,000 per year. The Government's philosophy is, in part, in favour of public-private partnerships. In this case, interested people with a great deal of experience are willing to raise £250,000, supported by the Minister for Defence, if this Minister gives a licence, and they will use the craft and keep it in a maritime setting where it can remain for the next 50 years. At that point, a future Minister – be it the current Minister or whoever – would be able to maintain it as a land based exhibit from then on. For the moment, its future should be in a maritime setting. I thank the Minister for agreeing to tackle this urgently because it has gone on for long enough. She has all the information and I urge her to decide about granting the licence as quickly as possible.
I thank the Deputy for his remarks and on foot of the information, to which I will give my full attention, I will put this to my colleagues in Government.
I do not say this to delay matters but given that the Asgard belongs to all the people of Ireland, it would help the debate, and help the Minister in arriving at her decision, if the specialist information available to her were made known to the public, and if the public were invited to make its views known to the Minister. The Asgard is unique in our history, a feeling of ownership of the ship should be cultivated and that should be the background to her decision.
I am always in favour of consultation and hearing people's views and many people have not been shy about writing or making representations to me about this matter. I assure the Deputy that in coming to my decision I will take into account the views of constituents, in the broadest possible sense. Those who are interested in this matter and have written to me will have their views taken into account, as well as the more scientific and specialist approach. I must take both on board and I intend to do so without further delay.
