On a point of order, it is now almost 10.40 a.m. We normally start at 10.30 a.m. At this stage the Opposition has not been supplied with the normal courtesy copy of the Government's proposed Order of Business. The courtesy is extended to us to allow us to consider whether we agree with the order or wish to amend it. As of now we have not received it and I would be grateful, Sir, if you would consider a short recess to allow the Taoiseach to give us the Order of Business so that we can consider it.
Order of Business.
I understand there was a Whips' meeting this morning but as far as I know nobody from the Fine Gael Party attended.
Where was Deputy Bruton?
It is normal to communicate the Order of Business to the Opposition before the House commences business, regardless of whether there is a Whips' meeting. The Taoiseach has not furnished the Order of Business to us. I understand it has not been settled. The Taoiseach made a cheap remark concerning an unscheduled Whips' meeting. There was no expectation that the meeting would be held. Will you, Sir, allow a short recess to allow the Whips receive the Order of Business?
I confirm that we have not received the normal courtesy copy of the Order of Business. It has not been circulated to date.
I have no problem with a sos. I have just received a copy of the Order of Business.
Is the Taoiseach saying he has only received a copy of his own Order of Business?
Taoiseach, I ask you to move that the sitting be suspended for ten minutes.
I move that the sitting be suspended for ten minutes.
Sitting suspended at 10.39 a.m. and resumed at 10.49 a.m.
The Order of Business today is as follows: item 39, Stamp Duties Consolidation Bill, 1999 – Report and Final Stages—
(Dublin West): On a point of order, where are our copies of the proposed Order of Business? Are the photocopiers down?
The Chair has no responsibility for that. The Taoiseach to continue.
—item 40, ICC Bank Bill, 1999 – Order for Report Stage and Report and Final Stages; item 41, Intoxicating Liquor Bill, 1999 – Second Stage (Resumed) and Remaining Stages; item 38, Financial Motions, 1999, by the Minister for Finance (resumed). It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders that the Dáil shall sit later than 8.30 p.m. and business shall be interrupted not later than 11.30 p.m.
Report Stage, including recommittal, and Final Stages of item 39 shall be taken today. The proceedings thereon, if not previously concluded, shall be brought to a conclusion at 12.15 p.m. by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include those set down and accepted by the Minister for Finance. Report Stage, including recommittal, and Final Stages of item 40 shall be taken today and the following arrangements shall apply. The proceedings of the recommittal motion shall not exceed 30 minutes and shall be confined to the speech of a Minister or Minister of State and the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party which shall not exceed ten minutes in each case. Proceedings on the Report and Final Stages, including proceedings on recommittal, shall be brought to a conclusion at 5 p.m. by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include those set down and accepted by the Minister for Finance.
Second Stage (Resumed) and Remaining Stages of item 41 shall be taken today and the following arrangements shall apply: Second Stage to conclude within 30 minutes if not previously concluded, Committee Stage to conclude within one hour if not previously concluded and Report and Final Stages to conclude at 7 p.m. if not previously concluded. The proceedings thereon shall be brought to a conclusion by one question in each case which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform.
The sitting shall be suspended from 12.45 p.m. to 2.30 p.m. Private Members' Business shall be item 65, Private Security Services Bill, 1999 – Second Stage (Resumed) to conclude at 8.30 p.m.
(Dublin West): To give due respect to the Members of the Dáil, the Chair should arrange for us to be given copies of what the Taoiseach has just outlined. It is a complex and long proposal that was impossible to absorb as he spoke.
That is not a matter for the Chair.
(Dublin West): For whom is it a matter then?
We do not have a copy of the Order of Business either. The Taoiseach referred to the Whips' meeting this morning. Will he confirm that there will be nine hours for debate—
There have been questions on that already. Is the proposal for the late sitting agreed? Agreed.
No. This is ridiculous. We do not even have a copy of the Order of Business.
Is the proposal for dealing with item 39 agreed?
On a point of order, we do not have a copy of the Order of Business.
We heard the Deputy's point of order. Is the proposal on item 39 agreed?
Why is the Deputy not in the Glen of the Downs?
The Government has gone underground in the past 24 hours.
It has become the practice to circulate copies of the Order of Business to facilitate Members. Surely the Minister of State's office can, as we speak, supply photocopies. The services of the House should facilitate all Deputies.
We have the Deputy's point.
You do not give a toss about what we are saying.
(Dublin West): Excuse me, a Leas-Cheann Comhairle—
I am dealing with item 2. Is the proposal for dealing with item 39 agreed?
No, we cannot agree something we do not know.
Is it agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with item 40 agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with item 41 agreed?
All Stages of this Bill are being taken today. It is a large Bill and the Government plans to put down a large number of amendments although these have not yet been circulated. Given that drinking hours are a controversial issue on which there are differing views, I counsel the Government against taking all Stages today. While there is some urgency due to the imminent Christmas holiday, the legislative changes involved are so profound in some cases we should not rush them through all Stages, particularly when the Government amendments are not available for consideration.
This is a substantial Bill which affects many people. The amendments have not yet been circulated. That might be in train but they have not been received by our parliamentary office. The Taoiseach might consider scheduling a break between Second Stage and Committee Stage to facilitate consideration of the amendments and any other proposals that might have arisen in the course of the Second Stage debate. We are aware the Government is anxious to enact this legislation before the recess and we are not trying to delay it. However, a break between Second and Committee Stages could be arranged.
That seems—
Deputy Gormley rose.
Deputy Gormley on the same issue.
I want to find out when we resume on item 38.
We have not yet reached that. I will call the Deputy when we do.
On item 41, we could adjourn at 7 p.m. and the Whips could agree an arrangement at their meeting tonight. The important thing is to get the legislation finalised and through the Seanad. We need not finish it today.
That is acceptable to us.
I do not want to get into conflict about this issue because we have enough to fight about. However, there is no need to get this legislation passed before Christmas. Some of the changes involved are profound. There are five Stages in the legislative process for a good purpose, to allow Members to consider the provisions. In the case of profound legislation such as this, which brought Governments down in the 1920s, it is surely possible to arrange a gap of one week between Committee and Report Stages rather than dealing with it as proposed.
That matter is best discussed by the Whips.
At the end of the day, business is ordered by the House, not the Whips. While the Whips can discuss matters, the House must make the decisions. There is a proposal before us today—
The Taoiseach decides the business and he stated that this item need not finish at 7 p.m.
Is he amending the Order of Business to delete that proposal?
This matter should be left to the Whips.
I am suggesting that instead of concluding at 7 p.m. the Whips can agree, on the basis of whatever stage is reached at that time, to find a slot to conclude it. However, the Bill must be concluded because it includes the provisions for changes on 31 December. It must be passed. This is the short Bill, not the long Bill.
When is the long Bill due?
February.
What year?
Is the Taoiseach saying there will be a holy hour after Second Stage?
Yes.
Is the amended proposal for dealing with No. 41 agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal that the sitting be suspended from 12.45 p.m. to 2.30 p.m. agreed? Agreed.
The Government certainly needs a lunch break. There should be equal treatment of two income and one income families across the board in all circumstances as regards income levels. Is it proposed to introduce individualisation in the social welfare code so that people will be able to apply individually for benefits? Is it intended that individual members of families – spouses – would be able to apply for medical cards individually and have their means assessed individually, now that the Government is committed to the concept of individualisation in general? Can the Taoiseach indicate the financial implications of individualisation in these circumstances?
I understand that, following the Whips' meeting this morning, we now have additional time to debate the budget comprising of three hours this evening and possibly further time, should that be required. Is it the Government's intention, following the U-turn on the out line of the budget, that the changes which will be negotiated at the parliamentary party meeting or by the Cabinet will be announced formally in the House and not by a procession of penitents out to the plinth in front of the House as was the case yesterday? If the budget is to be recast, the place to announce the recasting is in the House.
There are two Bills on these matters. The Social Welfare Bill should be introduced around March and the Finance Bill must be passed by the House within four months of budget day.
I call Deputy Sargent.
I thank the Taoiseach for that helpful information. Will individualisation be introduced into the social welfare code?
I have called Deputy Sargent.
In the event that the Government decides to change its budget in an important respect—
When it changes it.
—can I take it that any Deputies who have already spoken in the debate on the existing budget will not be disqualified from speaking on the new budget?
It is called a double whammy.
(Interruptions.)
Deputies should show Deputy Sargent some courtesy and allow him to speak.
Maidir le reachtaíocht atá geallta, táimid ag fanacht le fada an lá ar an Wildlife (Amendment) Bill. Foilsíodh é roimh an samhradh agus dúradh linn go mbéadh sé sa Teach roimh Nollaig. Níl sé de réir dealraimh. Cathain a mbeidh sé linn? Leis an méid atá ag titim amach i gCill Mhantáin fé láthair, is léir go bhfuil an-chuid daoine imníoch faoi chúrsaí dúlra agus eile. Cathain a mbeidh an Bille ós comhair an Tí?
As the Deputy stated, the Bill is published and it is a matter for the Whips when Second Stage will be taken.
I wish to return to the question I put to the Taoiseach on the Order of Business. If, as has been widely signalled, substantial changes to the budget are decided upon by the Government, will the Taoiseach indicate if those changes will be formally announced by a Government speaker or by the Minister for Finance during the course of the now continued budget debate?
If any amendments and changes are made to a budget, they are normally made to the Finance and Social Welfare Bills. If there are any amendments to this budget, they will be made in the normal way.
If a radical budget is radically changed, Deputies should be allowed to speak on it again.
There was an attempt yesterday to close down the budget debate. This is a superb budget.
The Taoiseach should ask his backbenchers.
It is £1.5 billion, and the longer we can debate it so that people see how excellent it is the better. If there are any other amendments, we will enjoy having those also.
I call Deputy Rabbitte.
The budget is superb—
Deputy Bruton should allow Deputy Rabbitte to speak. Other Members have rights.
I know, but I cannot restrain myself.
I have called Deputy Rabbitte. I will call Deputy Bruton again.
The Leas-Cheann Comhairle is the worst heckler in the House.
The budget is superb in the same fashion—
No Deputy can monopolise the business of the House.
The budget is the greatest political own goal in my time in the House.
I know the Minister for Finance considers it a superb budget, but what does he think of his party organising its backbenchers to speak out against his budget?
The Deputy should ask a question appropriate to the Order of Business.
When the Taoiseach is engaged in the renovation of the budget, will he undertake to deal with the discrimination against low income earners which is just as serious as the discrimination against single income families?
That does not arise now. There will be an opportunity to discuss that during the budget debate.
Could the Taoiseach indicate if the 20 members of the Fianna Fáil party interviewed on the plinth will move to this side of the House during the day?
The Deputy will not be moving to this side of the House.
Deputy Roche started off in Fine Gael.
Does the Taoiseach agree that there is urgency in discussing the Wildlife (Amendment) Bill—
That matter has already been dealt with by the Deputy's colleague.
What is happening now—
Deputy Gormley is out of order. I call Deputy Gay Mitchell.
Will the Taoiseach ensure the Bill is taken soon?
It will be taken as soon as possible.
Has Deputy Roche gone underground in Wicklow?
After yesterday, it seems we are witnessing the individualisation of the Fianna Fáil parliamentary party.
Has the Deputy something appropriate to the Order of Business?
When will the debate on international human rights begun by the Government and adjourned 12 months ago, and to which there is an amendment in my name seeking the appointment of a Minister to co-ordinate immigrant affairs, be resumed? I have sought the resumption of that debate for some time so that we can have a discussion on the co-ordination of immigrant issues.
That is a matter for the Whips.
There are two matters involved. There is a debate in the next few days on one of the Bills concerning immigrants. Perhaps the Deputy can make his arguments then. As far as the debate is concerned, it is a matter for the Whips. A large number of people wish to give priority to additional matters. We can only do it so many times and, as it happens, the House will sit until midnight for most of the remainder of the session.
Now that the Fianna Fáil backbenchers have come out of their traps, although there was one who never left his trap, when will we have the greyhound industry Bill?
I am sure the Deputy's leader would like to keep him in a trap now and again.
He is the best coursing dog we have.
Allow the Taoiseach to speak.
Deputy Ring is so far back we cannot hear him.
Allow the Taoiseach to speak.
Why does Deputy Bruton not bring him down to the front bench? He wants to come down.
The Minister should allow the Taoiseach to respond.
Deputy Bruton does not want to hear.
Deputy Ring is the Master McGrath of the House.
This is the first time Deputy Ring has asked me a question in about two years and I want to answer him. The text of the Bill is expected early next year.
(Dublin West): The Fianna Fáil backbenchers look like people shaken out of trees rather than greyhounds—
Has the Deputy a question on the Order of Business?
(Dublin West): Does the Taoiseach regret the destruction of mature oaks in the Glen of the Downs? Will he ask the county council to stop—
That matter has already been dealt with by Deputy Sargent.
(Mayo): In Counties Carlow, Kilkenny, Laois, Mayo, Offaly, Sligo and Tipperary there is a minimum processing time of 60 weeks for land registry files. This is unacceptable, and it is almost as bad in other counties. What is the position on the Land Registry Bill? Is the Land Registry one of the agencies due for decentralisation in the context of the Budget Statement? Does the Taoiseach agree it would make far more sense to transfer the Land Registry down the country rather than transferring the Legal Aid Board to Cahirciveen?
The heads of the Land Registry Bill are being finalised and are expected to be completed before Christmas. The Bill will be introduced next year. As far as I know, some of the Land Registry is already decentralised to the south-east.
Does Deputy Bruton intend to amend the Fine Gael policy document on taxation, particularly in view of—
That is out of order. I call Deputy Michael D. Higgins.
I thank Deputy Carey for his interest and support. He will be very welcome on this side of the House.
Yesterday an announcement was made regarding the future chairman of the RTE authority. Will that appointment be made under the new legislation on broadcasting which is before the House? Does the Taoiseach agree it was singularly inappropriate that this announcement coincided with a unique attack by a Minister of State on RTE's coverage of the budget? It was an usual assault on the RTE authority.
It is not appropriate on the Order of Business.
Will the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands, Deputy de Valera, speak with the new chairperson of the RTE authority about the decision to close Cork Local Radio?
That is not appropriate to the Order of Business.
It is an excellent public broadcasting service.
Tomorrow's schedule for the House includes Report and Final Stages of the Statute of Limitations (Amendment) Bill. In light of the growing concern over the inadequacies of this measure and the difficulties in its implementation—
We cannot have a speech on the matter.
Does the Taoiseach agree it is not appropriate for the Government to guillotine the Bill tomorrow and that extra time should be given to Report Stage?
That will be raised on tomorrow's Order of Business.
It concerns pending legislation.
We have waited months to finalise this Bill. The times have already been agreed.
It is flawed and inoperable.
Last week I asked about the outstanding publication dates for various legislation and I acknowledge receipt of the communication from the Taoiseach's office. It is expected that seven Bills will be published but that there may be some delays, namely, the Insurance Bill, the Nitrigin Éireann Teoranta Bill, the Teaching Council Bill, the Local Government Bill, the Courts and Court Officers Bill, the Criminal Justice (Sex Offenders) Bill, and the Prevention of Corruption Bill. We are now in the second last week of this Dáil session and I wonder if the Taoiseach can give an indication regarding the status of these Bills which have been promised.
Five more Bills are expected before the end of the year.
Which ones will not be published?
The ICC Bank Bill is before the House, the Consolidation Bill—
The communication from the Taoiseach's office said there might be some delays. What Bills will be published before Christmas?
The list concerns those Bills to be published before the start of the next session. I think most of the Bills are on track. The Mental Health Bill will be published in the next few days. The Local Government Bill will be published in January.
In light of the orchestrated Fianna Fáil backbencher mutiny which we saw yesterday—
Has the Deputy a question appropriate to the Order of Business?
Is it the case that the McCreevy budget is dead in the water? Does the Taoiseach expect a no confidence motion in the Minister for Finance and all the Ministers who supported the budget at the meeting of the parliamentary party this morning?
I call Deputy Belton.
The budget is dead in the water. How can the Minister for Finance continue in office? How can Ministers who support the budget remain in public office or maintain any credibility?
Ask Bernie Malone.
If Deputies Roche and O'Flynn were opposed to me I would be worried.
Deputy Shortall is being disorderly and I ask her to resume her seat.
Under the current livestock mart legislation, it is not possible to sell turkeys at marts. Does the Government plan to amend the legislation to allow the sale of turkeys at marts?
That certainly would create a problem for Deputies Roche and O'Flynn.
That is very unfair to the Fianna Fáil backbenchers.
Please allow Deputy Belton to ask his second question.
Has order been restored? In light of the water quality report on the Shannon River, has the Taoiseach any plans to appoint a Minister with responsibility for the Shannon River basin?
That question is out of order.
I understand there is no provision in the Bill to sell turkeys at livestock marts.