Michael Noonan
Question:3 Mr. Noonan asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his recent contacts with the British Government; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9338/01]
Ceisteanna–Questions. - European Council.
Austin Currie
Question:4 Mr. Currie asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his most recent discussions with the British Prime Minister; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9577/01]
Michael Noonan
Question:5 Mr. Noonan asked the Taoiseach when he next expects to meet the British Prime Minister; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9623/01]
Ruairí Quinn
Question:6 Mr. Quinn asked the Taoiseach if he will make a statement on the outcome of his bilateral discussions at the Spring European Summit in Stockholm with the British Prime Minister, Mr. Tony Blair. [9627/01]
Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin
Question:7 Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin asked the Taoiseach the recent contacts he has had with the British Prime Minister, Mr. Tony Blair. [9701/01]
Michael Noonan
Question:8 Mr. Noonan asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his recent meeting in Sweden with the British Prime Minister; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9967/01]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 3 to 8, inclusive, together.
I refer Deputies to my Dáil statement of 29 March on the outcome of the European Council in Stockholm and my bilateral meeting with the Prime Minister Mr. Blair. During our meeting we assessed the current situation in Northern Ireland.
The statement of 8 March by the two Governments set out the framework for continuing work which would help increase the momentum behind the implementation of the Agreement. There are ongoing contacts at official level between both Governments and the pro-Agreement parties as we continue our efforts to make progress on the outstanding issues. This work will continue in the period ahead. It is extremely important that we advance our consideration of all the outstanding issues in the coming weeks so that we are in the best possible position to achieve a comprehensive agreement by the June target set by the two Governments at Hillsborough.
In this regard, I have welcomed the statement by the Independent International Commission on Decommissioning on 22 March in which the IICD confirmed that a meeting had taken place between it and an IRA representative. I particularly welcomed the IICD statement that at its meeting with the IRA representative a basis had been established for further discussions and that it considered the re-engagement to be "in good faith". I also welcome its statement that it would build on the re-engagement at future meetings which it expected would occur soon. I now look forward to a further meeting taking place quickly and to early progress being made on this important issue.
I am in regular contact with Mr. Blair and we will meet again as and when necessary.
I wish to ask two supplementary questions one concerning Northern Ireland policy and the other concerning the foot and mouth disease epidemic.
On Northern Ireland we had an extensive question and answer session here about two weeks ago. Everything the Taoiseach said was based on the premise that there would be a general election in Great Britain and Northern Ireland on 3 May. He talked about moving back from active negotiation towards a solution on demilitarisation, decommissioning, policing and persons on the run and said he thought that process would carry us through the election period and that he would get back to negotiation towards a settlement. In view of the deferral of the election in Great Britain by the Prime Minister, Mr. Blair, does the Taoiseach believe there is a new window of opportunity now where active negotiations could recommence towards finding a solution to these four outstanding matters so that the Good Friday Agreement can finally be put in place? The Taoiseach will recall saying on that occasion that he had only about a fortnight. Another five weeks can be added, which gives a seven week window.
At the bilateral meeting with Mr. Blair in Stockholm, did the Taoiseach raise the issue of sheep smuggling, of sheep whose origin is in the United Kingdom, who are usually traded through the market in Carlisle, who are brought into Larne in lorries and transported south of the Border to meat factories without laying foot in Northern Ireland and which could not be described in any manner as sheep originating in Northern Ireland? Did he point out the grave concerns which arise in the area of animal health from the continuation of the smuggling of sheep?
There is no doubt that the postponement of the election creates a different context. The original plan was that the election would take place on 3 May. The tradition in the UK and the North is that most members get a break for a fortnight after the election. Towards the end of May we would have been able to get back into negotiations on the issues – not having put them totally on the back burner for the period of the election but keeping them going at official level while at the same time recognising we would not make much progress – and have an intensive effort and commitment by everyone to make progress during the month of June and try to reach conclusions on issues in advance of the difficult period of the year, Drumcree Sunday, the first Sunday in July. Clearly that position does not hold any more. If 7 June is the date of the election and it is followed by a break, we would come back in the last week of June which is almost on top of Drumcree Sunday. I see great difficulties with that. We are reviewing that to see if we can get more engagement now, otherwise it will be very difficult. The experience of recent years is that, for a myriad of reasons, from Drumcree Sunday no more work is done until the second half of September. Given that probably we will not get much work done in the three or four weeks up to 7 June we have to make progress. That would be our strategy. In the context of an election perhaps we may not get as much done as we would wish but we need to get further. Since Monday we have been trying to re-engage the effort of my officials, the small group of people who work on this issue and the small group on the British side who were about to pull out.
I had a long range discussion on the second issue. We had breakfast with Mr. Blair on the Saturday of the weekend of the Stockholm summit where we discussed foot and mouth disease in all its aspects, including smuggling. I do not want to give the impression that we reached any resolution but I pointed out the grave difficulties it was causing for us. It is not the first time I have discussed smuggling, not only animal smuggling but other kinds of smuggling, into the Border regions in south Armagh and other regions. We have had that discussion several times. Deputy Currie has raised that issue here with me many times and the funding of paramilitaries and others. With the new emphasis on the whole area of animal health this has already been identified by Bríd Rodgers and the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Rural Development, Deputy Walsh, at their discussions at the North-South Ministerial Council meeting. As I said this morning we can make much progress through the North-South Ministerial body. More enhanced security operations are required to try to deal with what comes through Carlisle in particular. From an island economy position, Mr. Blair is aware of what is happening in the UK but the North-South Ministerial Council needs to admit that we have to look afresh at the efforts we can make in the area of animal health for the future. In recent years we have seen salmonella, BSE, swine fever and now foot and mouth disease. While there is free movement, outside of smuggling, there has to be a fresh approach to many of these issues. That process started in the North-South Ministerial Council arising from BSE and has intensified due to the events of the past five or six weeks.
I welcome the Taoiseach's emphasis on the time constraints between now and Drumcree Sunday. Given the urgency of the situation, what additional pressure does he intend to place on the republican movement regarding putting arms beyond use? Is he prepared to tell the republican movement that no further pussy-footing will be tolerated on the issue? Has he ever said to Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness that they are members of the IRA Army Council on which Sinn Féin has a majority? Has he ever asked them to outline what is holding up decommissioning?
The British media reported that the Taoiseach had discussed the general election with the Prime Minister. This fact was of some embarrassment to Mr. Blair at a later stage. Did the Taoiseach indicate to Mr. Blair how illogical it is that, in Northern Ireland, proportional representation is used for local, assembly and European elections, but not for the Westminster election? Did he further indicate that PR is used in elections to local assemblies in Wales and Scotland and in the European elections? Will the Taoiseach impress on the Prime Minister the necessity for action to prevent abuse of the electoral process which could decide results in certain constituencies in the forthcoming election? Will the Taoiseach ask the Prime Minister to ensure these abuses do not take place, particularly with regard to postal voting, as there may be more postal voting if the foot and mouth disease emergency lasts until the election?
I did not make the point regarding the voting procedure, but have heard that view many times. I will communicate it to the Prime Minister. I have raised the issue of proportional representation. John Hume has also made this point forcefully and I support his view. However, it is unlikely that there will be any change for the coming elections. I have heard the points made by the Deputy on a number of occasions. We support these views, but there has been no change in the position.
I may not have put it in the terms used by the Deputy, but I have made his point on many occasions to the Sinn Féin leadership, and will continue to do so. I am due to meet Sinn Féin this week or early next week and will again emphasise that there should be no further delay in the re-engagement with the second series of discussions with John de Chastelain and the Independent International Commission on Decommissioning. It is important that this happens and that the commitments, as we understood them, are fulfilled as soon as possible.
Even after the courts' findings regarding the reinstatement of the two Sinn Féin members of the Executive to the North-South ministerial bodies, the situation is not being helped by the continued suspension by the First Minister which has, effectively, ceased the Sinn Féin members' operation of the North-South ministerial bodies. There is not much we can do about this, even though we continue to press for a resolution which is not within my hands. I have made the point that the courts have given their views in their own jurisdiction. The way to find a resolution might be through everyone helping each other. The Deputy knows what I mean by that comment.
What was the response when the Taoiseach made the point about the IRA Army Council?
The response is never a secret. They said that they use their best efforts to try to find resolutions.
Sinn Féin has a majority on the IRA Army Council. All it has to do is vote in favour. It is like looking in the mirror.
The decommissioning legislation introduced in 1997 in advance of the Good Friday Agreement included regulations to provide for the full decommissioning of all paramilitary groups within two years, effectively, by May 2000. The regulations introduced in 1998 were due to expire in May 2000. They were extended for one year and will expire on 22 May 2001. What plans does the Government have to further extend them? What is the Taoiseach's assessment of the willingness of the IRA and Sinn Féin to make real progress on decommissioning which would remove the problems faced by the First Minister regarding the suspension of Sinn Féin's participation in the cross-Border institutions?
That is the issue. The statements of 5 and 6 May outlined that the IRA is prepared, agreeable and committed to dealing with the arms issue in a manner which will find favour with the population at large. It more or less restated that position on 8 March and in subsequent statements. The question is whether that process will be precisely within some of the original schemes. There has been considerable discussion about amendments to the schemes to allow for other schemes. No one objects to this approach once the conclusion is the same. We share that view and have no problem if the changes are acceptable to the international commission. The objective is to put arms beyond use in a way which is acceptable to the public at large. I hope that is still the position. However, one is always concerned when progress one expects to take place quickly does not materialise.
Will the regulations be extended?
We will have to do so. As far as I recall, General de Chastelain's remit will have to be extended this year because the remit of the commission will also end. It will be essential to extend the commission's remit. I have informally discussed the Government's view with General de Chastelain and indicated that we would like him to remain after the summer in order that the matter is seen through. It would be disastrous to start a new process.
The Taoiseach spoke about the difficulties of making progress after the end of June when we face into Drumcree Sunday, 12 July and the marching season. He also stated that nothing will happen until October. I agree with this analysis. Did the Taoiseach put this analysis to the Prime Minister and did Mr. Blair agree? Is the Prime Minister willing to push in the next five weeks for progress on the four main outstanding issues?
When the Taoiseach discussed foot and mouth disease with the Prime Minister, did he raise the specific issue of paramilitary involvement in sheep smuggling and what was Mr. Blair's reaction?
I have not spoken to the Prime Minister since Monday. The United Kingdom is a large country and there are many items on the Prime Minister's agenda. However, in my discussions with him in Stockholm he was conscious that the analysis I have given is correct and that the postponement of the British general election would make matters tighter as regards the talks. We have to give some time to the issue. As the Prime Minister will devote all of this week and next week to foot and mouth disease, there is unlikely to be much progress. However, at official level we will try to get matters moving next week. That is our plan. The answer to the second question is "yes" on this occasion and on many others. I think there is a great deal of evidence that paramilitaries of one kind or another are, to a substantial part, behind smuggling both in Northern Ireland—
Mr. Hayes
Not just in sheep smuggling.
Not just in sheep but in fuel, drink and in other items, although maybe not so much in drink now.
Direct involvement or protection?
It is hard to get a straight answer on that from security sources but there is certainly involvement, and among some of the newer paramilitary groups also. That is a major concern. I purposely spoke out on this last week on the Border, because I thought it was the place to do so. I get the feeling that the reluctance of people in these communities to speak out on these issues is because they are afraid to do so. That is sad but I understand it. I met members of a particular family which would be well known in this House. It would be inappropriate to mention the name of the family but the father was killed a decade ago in this area. It is a matter of concern and it is not acceptable that people are intimidated by bully boys trying to operate these businesses. That is why people are afraid.
It is time to let the Criminal Assets Bureau at them.
There are issues outside the foot and mouth disease crisis and there were issues before it and we must face up to our responsibilities in these areas.
Did the Taoiseach have discussions with the British Prime Minister regarding the possibility of an all-Ireland status as far as animal health is concerned? Is the Prime Minister aware of his responsibility as a good neighbour, in light of the serious ongoing outbreaks of foot and mouth disease in his country, to help to maintain security of the ports and other means of entry into this country to save us from the disease?
We have made the points very strongly. I have to acknowledge that the weekend before last, Mr. Blair directly intervened in regard to at least ten ports and took action. I understand there has been an enormous improvement. I take this opportunity to state again that we should not relax any of the measures on the day that the number of cases in the United Kingdom has gone over 1,000, which is very unfortunate and tragic for them. They are calling it a national emergency on their airwaves today. It would be absolutely wrong for us to ease up on any of the measures we are taking. The disinfectant and restrictions, other than those allowed to be lifted by the expert group, should continue.