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Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 9 Oct 2001

Vol. 541 No. 4

Priority Questions. - School Services Staff.

Michael Creed

Question:

100 Mr. Creed asked the Minister for Education and Science if he will pay the salaries of secretaries and caretakers in primary and post-primary schools. [23017/01]

My Department provides funding towards the cost of secretarial and caretaking ser vices in primary and secondary schools under two separate schemes. One scheme is the 1978-79 scheme for the employment of school secretaries in primary and secondary schools, and caretakers in primary schools, under which my Department meets the full cost of salaries. While these posts are fully funded by my Department, the secretaries and caretakers involved are employees of the individual school authorities. This scheme is being phased out as posts become vacant and no new posts are being created. It has been superseded in the PESP agreement of 1992 by a more extensive grants system.

The PESP scheme provides additional per capita grants for primary and secondary schools towards secretarial and caretaking services. These grants are paid as additions to the standard per capita grants. The scheme, by its nature, is flexible and gives boards of management discretion as to the manner in which secretarial and caretaking services are provided.

At second level, in addition to the arrangements outlined above, schools currently receive additional annual funding of £20 per pupil, with a minimum payment of £4,000 per school under the school services support fund. Provision for secretarial and caretaking support is a particular focus of this fund.

The Deputy will be aware that I have recently secured the transfer of £46 million per annum to my Department on a phased basis between now and 2003 as the FÁS school based community employment schemes come to an end. The availability of this funding will enable me to make significant progress in relation to the provision of secretarial and caretaking services for schools by putting in place an equitable system of funding for ancillary services throughout the free education school system. My Department will receive a total of £32 million in this school year.

Proposals for the redistribution of the moneys received this year at primary and post-primary levels are now almost finalised and I expect to be in a position to launch them within the next week. My Department is arranging for circulars to be issued to all primary and post-primary schools. These circulars, which will be available shortly, will outline details of the new funding arrangements.

May I draw the Minister's attention to a press release issued by his Department on 4 July, the heading of which was "Massive enhancement of caretaker and secretarial support?" Does he accept that, nearly two months after primary and post-primary schools reopened, there is unbridled chaos throughout the country? Schools that have caretaker and secretarial staff, not to mention classroom assistants, library assistants etc., under FÁS funded schemes are now very uncertain what their regulations and entitlements will be under a new regime.

Was it not ridiculous and irresponsible of the Minister to pull the rug from under one scheme – the FÁS funded scheme – which provided these services cheaply for many years for the Department of Education and Science without having in place a replacement regime? When will his Department be in a position to provide schools with some certainty? The press statement proceeds to assure schools that they will have enhanced caretaker and secretarial provisions. It now transpires that many schools will have a lower level of service than they enjoyed previously under FÁS.

Does the Minister not accept that the mere transfer of funds that were available to FÁS, which provided the service cheaply for schools, is not sufficient to mainstream caretaking and secretarial needs? He has previously paid lip-service to the Blackstock report. If that is to adhered to in terms of equity and adequacy of funding, it will require significant additional funds over and above those available from FÁS, not merely moving the deck chairs on the Titanic.

The Deputy is talking about my pulling the rug from under something. I did not pull the rug from under anything. As the Deputy will be aware, FÁS decided in conjunction with the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment that these would be phased out. I then made sure—

The Minister did not—

It was decided then, yes.

The Minister had no say in it.

Order, please.

Not at all. That was what was decided and we insisted that we receive the money for those schemes and that, following the PPF negotiations, they would be transferred to the Department of Education and Science on the basis of what is being implemented. Our difficulty, in the first instance, was the finalisation of the figure. The figure available within the scheme is £32 million. I negotiated with the Government and we concluded that £46 million would be transferred. That has been agreed.

The Minister made no arrangements yet.

Order, please.

How much this year?

That made it possible to proceed with the scheme on a very enhanced and strong basis. That is what will happen.

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