Vol. 549 No. 2
7 Proinsias De Rossa asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the action which has been taken by the Garda authorities arising from the serious criticism of the conduct of two Garda officers made by a judge in the Special Criminal Court in a case (details supplied); if the two gardaí remain on normal duties, including the questioning of witnesses; when the Garda inquiry will be concluded; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [6062/02]
The investigation by the officer appointed by the Garda Commissioner is proceeding and, I am assured, will be concluded as expeditiously as possible.
In relation to the two gardaí involved, one was transferred on 1 May 2001 into a designated clerical position where he is currently employed. The second member remains on normal duties as he was prior to the commencement of the investigation.
This serious matter involves conduct described by Mr. Justice Barr, a High Court judge, as outrageous. He said it involved persistent lying under oath. In relation to the garda not transferred to clerical duties, is he still involved in interrogating prisoners or suspects, or in taking evidence?
The situation is that the allocation of duties of the Garda Síochána is an operational matter for the Commissioner. I have no function in the matter. Any criticism of Garda conduct is a serious matter and there should be a comprehensive inquiry. It is also right that every individual should be presumed innocent until proven guilty.
It was deemed appropriate by Garda authorities that one of the two individuals would be moved to clerical duties. What is the Minister's opinion on the other individual? Is it appropriate that an individual who is subject to investigation in relation to the matters described continues to be involved in the taking of evidence or the interrogation of prisoners? What is the Minister's view on that? It is not good enough for him to say he has no role in the matter and I would like his opinion as the Minister charged under the Constitution and the law with responsibility for the administration of justice.
I am not charged with responsibility in relation to the operational functions of the Garda Síochána. The question of the transfer of a garda is a matter for the Garda Commissioner.
Has the Minister a view on it?
I am assured by Garda authorities that the transfer which the Deputy mentioned took place in the normal course and had no connection with the incidents which are the subject of criticism by the Special Criminal Court. Should it subsequently transpire that the gardaí in question should be disciplined that will be made public.
The Minister acknowledged that it is in the public interest that members of the Garda Síochána conducting investigations and interrogations are not open to critique and that what they do does not give rise to credibility difficulties. Does he acknowledge, in view of the serious criticisms voiced about these two members of the Garda Síochána by a judge in the High Court, that until the matter is fully investigated it is not in the public interest that either of them should be involved in normal duties? Does he also acknowledge that their being involved in duties of the nature described could undermine the integrity of an investigation? Will he agree that it is desirable that the matter be reconsidered by the Garda Commissioner and that it would be preferable if the matter was investigated by an independent Garda ombudsman with an independent inspectorate rather than it being an internal Garda investigation? Will he also inform the House whether it is intended to publish the outcome of the internal investigation?
If disciplinary procedures arise from the investigation they will be made public. I already stated that the operational functions of the Garda Síochána are a matter for the Garda Commissioner. I favour an inspectorate which will deal with complaints. In order to implement this, legislation is necessary and desirable. We need a robust, rigorous, independent mechanism for the investigation of Garda complaints and we are committed to such changes. In the interim it is important that the matter be investigated and that justice be done. It is equally important from the perspective of both the Garda and the public that the rule of law be observed.
Does the Minister accept that what is at issue here is not a wild allegation but an assertion prima facie by a member of the High Court that such an activity occurred? In those circumstances does he not accept that it is inappropriate for either of the two gardaí to be involved further in taking evidence or interrogations which could compromise any investigation they are currently on until the matter is resolved?
I have confidence in the Garda Commissioner to manage his force in such a way as to ensure that all investigations stand up to scrutiny. In that context I am confident that he places his personnel in a manner which fits the role of a member of the Garda Síochána in so far as retaining public confidence is concerned.
