Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 2 Jun 2004

Vol. 586 No. 6

Priority Questions.

Planning Issues.

Bernard Allen

Question:

2 Mr. Allen asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the position regarding the contact he has made with local authorities about the serious lack of planning enforcement by a number of local authorities as set out in a recent television programme (details supplied); if extra resources will be made available to local authorities to ensure that planning enforcement is effective; and if the matter has been discussed with the association of city and county managers. [16761/04]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Mr. Cullen)

A major concern behind the revision of the planning code which occurred in 2000 was to ensure increased compliance with planning law, in response to complaints about failures in the planning enforcement system from both individuals and local authorities. The introduction of a culture of enforcement is critical to ensure that the planning control system works properly and for the benefit of the whole community.

Part VIII of the Planning and Development Act 2000 greatly simplified the existing statutory provisions to make it easier for planning authorities to take enforcement action in cases of breaches in the planning code. The Act also made a number of significant improvements to the enforcement provisions for persons who make complaints, in particular that all well founded complaints must be investigated by the planning authority and that complainants must be told of the progress of their complaint. The Act also contains special provisions relating to certain issues that were difficult to address through the normal enforcement process, including applications by persons who have repeatedly breached previous planning permissions, unfinished housing estates and quarries.

While these provisions set out a strong legal framework for planning authorities to take enforcement action where necessary, statutory responsibility for the operation of the planning code is vested in each individual planning authority. Decisions on enforcement in particular cases are, therefore, matters for the planning authorities in question.

My Department has been concerned in recent years to ensure that planning authorities have sufficient resources available to them to carry out their functions under the Planning Act. The Department has assisted planning authorities in the recruitment of planning staff by sanctioning additional planning posts, by liaising with the education sector on ways of training more planners and, as an interim measure, by assisting with the recruitment of planners from abroad. The latest figures provided by planning authorities show that there were a total of 1,567 staff, professional, technical and administrative, employed in planning departments in the county and city councils in March 2004. This is an increase of 43% over the numbers employed three years ago. The 2000 Act also allows planning authorities to recoup the cost of each enforcement action directly from the developer and to benefit from any fines imposed by the courts.

Part VIII was commenced on 11 March 2002. While it is early to establish its impact on the overall level of enforcement activity by planning authorities, preliminary figures on enforcement actions by planning authorities in 2003 indicate that there has been an increase in the level of convictions, as compared to 2002.

Additional information not given on the floor of the House.

The Ombudsman in her recent report also acknowledged that there appears to have been some improvement in local authority performance on enforcement generally, although she noted that it is too early to make an accurate assessment based on performance over a period of less than two years since the introduction of the Act.

I will continue to keep under review the implementation of the enforcement provisions of the 2000 Act. Issues such as enforcement are regularly raised through the formal consultation mechanism established between the city and county managers association and my Department, and I will continue to press planning authorities to improve their performance on planning enforcement. I also welcome the statement by the Ombudsman that she intends to continue to monitor whether the Act is being properly and fully utilised and to be proactive in protecting public confidence in the planning system.

Mr. Allen

Does the Minister agree this is not just a local problem, but rather a major national problem? The "Prime Time" programme to which I referred in my question highlighted very serious breaches of planning laws which seem to go unchallenged by local authorities. This occurs through a lack of commitment or will in some cases or through a lack of resources in other cases due to the pressure on planning departments. The Minister stated that there was a 40% increase in personnel in planning departments. However, does he not agree that the programme highlighted serious breaches of planning laws? These have done irreversible damage to the environment in the areas concerned, have degraded the quality of life for many people and in many cases highlighted a "David versus Goliath" tussle between millionaire developers and individuals who had to put up their own resources to challenge the breaches in the courts.

Does the Minister accept that this is unsatisfactory and that he must bear responsibility for the problem? Will he give details of the steps the EU is taking against us as a result of our failure to deal with so many unauthorised quarries and mining developments throughout the country and which were the subject of a number of issues raised by that programme?

Mr. Cullen

I will deal in detail with the quarry issue in another question.

I agree with the general point the Deputy has made. As Minister, I would not stand over lack of enforcement or implementation of the law. I believe the Deputy was involved in many of the discussions on the Planning Act 2000, which brought in many important new measures. Those measures are only being put in place throughout the country at the moment. I would not accept that there is widespread disregard for the law. Many people tell me that the law is implemented too harshly. However, the Deputy is right when he says that any flagrant breaches of the law cannot and should not be tolerated. The number of prosecutions rose substantially from 2002, when there were only 32 convictions, to 137 convictions in 2003. That is a substantial increase, which is the effect of the legislation passed by the Houses and the implementation of Part VIII of the Planning and Development Act 2000.

It is, of course, important that local authorities exercise their statutory duty in full and put much emphasis on enforcement. I provided substantial resources on a range of enforcement matters for local authorities. I expect them to use those resources, whether human or financial, to the absolute maximum to ensure compliance with the law.

Mr. Allen

Did the Minister call in the managers of the authorities that were highlighted in that programme to get explanations from them on their failure to implement and enforce the planning laws? Has he considered introducing legislation to prevent those cowboys who breach planning laws from applying for and receiving planning permissions until such time as they apply the conditions on permissions already received?

Mr. Cullen

I am always looking at ways to improve the law. There is no law in place that cannot be improved. Issues such as those the Deputy rightly raised and were raised in that programme represent areas in which we could improve planning law. I have asked my officials to do that. I meet the city and county managers association on a regular basis and I have spoken about these issues. In my last discussions with it I laid great emphasis on the range of enforcement that is required. It is not simply a matter of new laws passed by the Oireachtas. What we need is a lot more emphasis on enforcement on a range of issues within local authority areas. I will not be satisfied until I see those who degrade the environment stopped in that activity.

Building Lands.

Eamon Gilmore

Question:

3 Mr. Gilmore asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he has considered the report of the All-Party Committee on the Constitution on property rights; his views on the findings of the committee that legislation can be introduced to cap the price of building land without the requirement for a constitutional amendment; if he intends to introduce legislation to give effect to this recommendation; if he has completed his consideration of the results of the research he has commissioned from consultants (details supplied) into the ownership and control of building land in certain development areas, particularly Dublin, to determine whether current practices are retarding the overall delivery of building land or impeding long-term market stability; when the results of the research will be published; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [16763/04]

Bernard Allen

Question:

5 Mr. Allen asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the reasons he has not published the report commissioned by him on the hoarding of building land in the greater Dublin area; and if he will report on the status of that report which he stated was to be completed by the end of 2003. [16762/04]

Mr. Cullen

I propose to take Questions Nos. 3 and 5 together.

My Department continues to examine possible measures aimed at moderating land costs for housing and other essential public infrastructure. As part of this process, my Department is giving consideration to the report on ownership and control of building land, which was commissioned from Goodbody Economic Consultants, and to relevant recommendations in the Ninth Progress Report of the All-Party Committee on the Constitution, on the subject of property rights. The National Economic and Social Council is conducting a major study on housing and land policy and its report, which is expected to be finalised shortly, will also be very relevant in this regard. I intend to publish the Goodbody report in conjunction with the publication of the NESC report.

I welcome the report of the all-party committee. I note its assessment that, having regard to modern case law, it is likely that the central recommendation of the 1973 Kenny report, namely, that land required for development by local authorities should be compulsorily acquired at existing use value plus 25%, would not be found to be unconstitutional. Based on this assessment, the committee has recommended that this "designated area scheme" should be re-examined with a view to its implementation following such modifications as are necessary or desirable in the light of later experience.

The committee has also identified a number of different mechanisms that could be considered as an alternative to the designated area approach in order to recover betterment, including development levies, planning gain, and new taxation initiatives. Moreover, it has suggested that, notwithstanding its view on the constitutionality of the Kenny proposals, change along the lines recommended in 1996 by the Constitution Review Group may be desirable, that is, that existing constitutional provisions concerning property rights would be replaced by a single new provision. As I am sure the Deputy will agree, these are complex issues with significant implications for the role of public authorities and the operation of the building, and in particular the housing, markets. They merit, and are receiving, careful consideration by my Department.

Meanwhile, the operation and future potential of Part V of the Local Government (Planning and Development) Act 2000 as a mechanism for the provision of social and affordable housing should be emphasised. Following its amendment in December 2002, activity under Part V has increased significantly. During 2003, 163 housing units were acquired, with nearly 1,900 units under construction or proposed on foot of Part V agreements; this compares with delivery of only 46 affordable units in 2002. A further significant increase in output under Part V is expected in 2004.

Mr. Gilmore

In the week when we have been told the average price of a new house in Dublin has gone up to €320,000, that is an obtuse reply from the Minister about the issue which is at the centre of high house prices, namely, the cost of building land.

I have a number of specific questions arising from the Minister's reply. First, when did he receive the Goodbody report on land hoarding, particularly in Dublin? Why is he now proposing to delay its publication until the NESC report is published? What is in the report that will cause discomfort to supporters of Fianna Fáil that he is delaying its publication? Why will he not publish it immediately? Second, for anyone who has not read the report of the all-party committee it is useful that the Minister should summarise its contents for us but can he tell us what he intends to do about it? He told us that he welcomes the report. Does he accept the recommendations in the report and will he do anything about implementing them?

Mr. Cullen

As I already told the Deputy and am happy to repeat, the report was received at the end of 2003. There is nothing in the Goodbody report that discommodes me.

Mr. Gilmore

Why does the Minister not publish it?

Mr. Cullen

If the Deputy will let me answer I will tell him. The NESC is doing a major study on this issue — we referred it to NESC — and it is important that the two reports are published together. That would be helpful. We will then have the differing assessments, and I would be interested to see the NESC report on these issues, which are complex.

I and I am sure all Members, appreciate the work of the All-Party Committee on the Constitution which paves the way in one particular area for dealing with these issues. The NESC report, which should be published soon, is badly needed. I would be interested to see what is in the report, although I have no foreknowledge at this stage of its views on this issue, particularly in terms of land policy, its usability and availability and all the questions that surround that. We must have a factual discussion on these issues to come to conclusions.

Even though there is not a simple pathway forward, based on some of the issues that have been signalled already, I am struck by the level of activity under Part V which I have seen while travelling throughout the country. That is beginning to bed down and managers and the various developers in different parts of the country are putting much better methodologies in place, which are speedier, and we can see from the figures what has actually been built and what is beginning to come through the system.

There is another aspect I find difficult to understand. Ten days ago I opened an affordable housing scheme. It happened to be in Tramore, in my constituency, but no one would consider Tramore to be a poor or backward area. Property in the area can be very expensive but this affordable housing scheme consisted of three bedroom houses, with three bathrooms, the main bathroom being en suite. They had fine gardens and were finished extremely well, yet the price of each house was €118,000. To say I was surprised at the value is to understate how I felt, particularly in terms of the quality of the houses which were built by a major national company, not a small local builder. I have opened other schemes throughout the country and the prices of those houses are €138,000 and €140,000, which leads to some questions.

I am coming around to the view that in regard to this issue the problem is largely focused on Dublin — that was probably always the case — in terms of people getting housing here. I am aware in other county council areas, and Deputy Allen will be aware of this in Cork and other areas, that there was a shortage of people to take up the affordable houses being built. That is not common to particular areas; it happens throughout the country.

We need a rational debate on this issue and what the Oireachtas committee has said points the way forward. I am enamoured by the view that where land is becoming available, it is vital that the local authorities' land banks do not diminish and that we continue to enhance them, particularly for housing. If we do that, and the report highlights an existing land use value, plus 25%, to the local authorities, that would be extremely helpful throughout the country, not just in Dublin. If the Deputy is asking me my view, I am certainly positively disposed to that. In fact, I believe it is necessary.

Mr. Allen

The Minister appears to be living in a cocoon. He has mentioned figures but I am aware that his PR people pumped up the issue of affordable houses being available but not being taken up.

Mr. Cullen

That did not come from me.

Mr. Allen

The reality is that in Glenheights Road, Cork city, there were more than 400 applications for approximately 20 houses. That is the level of demand. If affordable houses were available, people would take them. That is the reality. The Minister should not believe everything he hears from his PR people.

Will the Minister agree that since his Government took office, house prices have trebled? Houses are now 25% more expensive here than in the United States yet the Minister abolished the first-time buyer's grant, opposed development levies and increased VAT. There is now a 45% take by Government.

I want to ask the Minister a simple question, although it will not be the answer to all the problems in the housing area. Why is he suppressing the report on land holding in the Dublin area? Last October in this House he promised that the report would be published at the end of the year but we are now into the month of June and the report is still being suppressed in that it is not being made available to Members of this House. We can examine the spectrum of factors involved in housing because it is the most crucial issue for economic development and social cohesion but Members of this House are not getting the full picture because reports available to the Minister are not being made available to us. Why is the Minister going back on his promise to make the report available so that we can judge whether or not there is exploitation of first-time buyers and of all house buyers by a small few? Let us get the full picture.

Mr. Cullen

I refute the suggestion that I am suppressing the report. I did the courtesy to the NESC, which is preparing a substantial report, of giving it sight of this report.

Mr. Allen

What about courtesy to the House?

Mr. Cullen

The basis of the Deputy's supposition is that land hoarding is going on in Dublin. He might be surprised to see what is in some of the reports.

Mr. Gilmore

Why does the Minister not publish the reports?

Mr. Cullen

I am anxious to publish this report. I have done the courtesy of showing the report to the NESC, which is preparing a major report on this area. So that we do not have just one view but an overall balanced view coming into the marketplace, it is better for the Oireachtas and those who are interested in the discussion nationally to see all the reports made available together. We should be able to do that shortly. That will lead an interesting debate on this area.

There are many conflicting views, as Deputies know. I am sure Deputies Allen and Gilmore have been told that land hoarding is taking place, as I have been. I have also heard the that land hoarding is not taking place. A recent report, which was not carried out by my Department, said there was no land hoarding in Dublin and showed that the land bank in Dublin is held by 27 different developers. One could not describe 27 developers as four, five or six, as is the perception. We need to get to the root of the facts in these reports. That will help to point our way forward and to come to conclusions.

I accept Deputy Gilmore's point, which was previously made in the committee. There must be a basis for local authorities to acquire land at existing land use value plus approximately 25%, as the All-Party Committee on the Constitution has suggested. There is a solid basis for that. The upholding of Part V confirms that we will be within constitutional grounds to do that and that will play a useful role.

I do not suggest to Deputy Allen that we have resolved all problems in this area and I did not mean to point specifically to Cork. There are areas where tremendous value is being given and other areas where we cannot build enough quickly enough. I accept that. We must strike a balance between the two.

No more than the Deputies, I want to see the cost of housing reduced. People's incomes and costs have gone through the roof in recent years. I do not say that is a bad thing. People's standard of living and their earning capacity is enormous. However, as a percentage of people's disposable income, there is very little difference between house prices now and 20 years ago. Like me, most Deputies were caught at the time when interest rates reached 29% and 30% and nearly destroyed us all. Those rates were not sustained over a long period but rates of 14% and 15% were the norm when we were trying to buy houses years ago. It also took us some time to save 20% of the cost of a house to get an 80% mortgage. I do not say this as a justification for the way things are today but we must take a balanced view.

We are building more than 72,000 new houses every year and the majority of them are being bought by first-time buyers. The funding is there to do that. I accept that we have a gap. People are falling between below the income level for a commercial mortgage and are above the level which qualifies them for social housing. We are trying to fill that gap by imaginative mechanisms. Part V is one of those. Other initiatives in that area will also be helpful.

Local Authority Housing.

Arthur Morgan

Question:

4 Mr. Morgan asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the measures he is undertaking to redress the predicament whereby single persons, in particular single men, who make up 32% of the 48,000 on housing waiting lists, find it virtually impossible to secure social housing; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [16674/04]

Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Mr. N. Ahern)

Single people who are unable to provide housing for themselves from their own resources are entitled to apply for social housing which is provided by either a local authority or a voluntary housing body. While it is a matter for individual local authorities to decide on the allocation of houses to single persons and other categories on their waiting lists in accordance with their schemes of letting priorities, my Department continues to advise local authorities of the need to provide a reasonable mix of dwellings suited to the different kinds of households already on waiting lists and to plan their future programmes taking account of the estimated size and type of households likely to be seeking housing in the future.

Local authorities have been asked to submit action plans setting out their social and affordable housing programmes for the period 2004 to 2008. My Department expects to have these plans in draft form from all authorities over the coming weeks. Given the nature of continuous housing need, the preparation of these action plans will be beneficial to local authorities in identifying priority needs over the coming years and providing a coherent and co-ordinated response across all housing services, including delivery of housing by the voluntary and co-operative housing sector. My Department will be examining individual plans to ensure that they match the profile of needs in local authority areas. It is intended to agree activity levels with each local authority in the autumn of this year.

Mr. Morgan

I did not need to come to the House to hear that reply from the Minister of State. When I raised this matter last November, I received exactly the same reply. I was preparing to make notes on what the Minister of State would tell me so that I could challenge him but he has given exactly the same reply as last November.

I asked the Minister of State what he is doing to house people on housing waiting lists. Of the 48,000 people on housing lists, 32% are single people. What is the Minister of State doing to reduce that number and to provide social housing for single people and particularly for single men, who are the biggest sector of that 32%?

The Minster of State's reply means that nothing has been done in the past eight months. The crisis in the housing sector, particularly among single people and, more particularly, among single men, has got slightly worse and not better. Informing me of the letters being sent out to various housing authorities means nothing and is not an indication of measures taken. Will the Minister of State shorten his answer to informing the House of what he is doing about the crisis?

Mr. N. Ahern

I have tried to answer the Deputy's questions. The housing budget for this year is €1.88 billion. A few weeks ago, the local authority spend, which is approximately €700 million, was announced. That will allow the needs of approximately 13,000 of the 48,000 people on the waiting lists to be met this year. They will include a number of single people. If 25% of the people on the lists are having their needs met, the number of single people housed may not be high, but these figures give an indication of what is being done.

We are trying to break down the attitude among local authorities that they must build three-bedroom semi-detached houses. It takes a while to break down that attitude. When the new local authority action plans are submitted, they will be judged. When an authority establishes the housing needs of its area, my Department will examine its plans to see if they are in accordance with the needs of the people on its housing list. For families with five or six children we will want to see four bedroom houses, and if a local authority area has a large number of single people, we will want to see provision of suitable accommodation for them.

Mr. Morgan

If the Minister of State is suggesting that what he is doing constitutes action and is effective, will he inform the House how many single people have been accommodated under the actions he has taken? Can he furnish the House with figures or indicate any alleged success from what he is doing? Organisations which deal with homeless people highlight the lack of provision of social housing, specifically housing designed for single people, as one of the most severe hurdles in accommodating homeless people and enabling them to make the transition from emergency to permanent accommodation. Will the Minister of State provide the House with those figures?

Mr. N. Ahern

Approximately 10% of all local authority housing allocations are to single persons. Given there are almost 7,500 to 8,000 direct allocations per year, approximately 750 or 800 single people are being accommodated each year. Also, approximately 1,800 units will be provided this year by way of voluntary housing, a growing sector. A much higher percentage of voluntary housing units are allocated to single people perhaps because many housing associations cater for elderly people and those with special needs. I do not have a specific percentage in that regard but it is much higher than the 10% provided by local authorities.

Coastal Protection.

Trevor Sargent

Question:

6 Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if his Department is making financial provision for the measures needed to counteract some of the damaging effects of climate change in view of the fact that Dublin City Council alone estimates a need for €150 million for coastal defence work and that the Chartered Insurance Institute world-wide says that with present trends, losses due to climate change will outstrip global GDP in 60 years. [16809/04]

Mr. Cullen

The Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources, Deputy Dermot Ahern, is responsible for ensuring that Ireland's coastal zone is used in a sustainable way to the best advantage of the Irish people from an economic, aquacultural, leisure, social and environmental perspective. In this regard, he requested in July 2002 all coastal local authorities to submit proposals for coastal protection works for the period 2003-06.

From my perspective, the EPA published comprehensive research undertaken at NUI Maynooth in 2003 entitled, Climate Change: Scenarios and Impacts for Ireland. This identifies, inter alia, the possible implications of a sea level rise for Ireland and the impacts this may have. Major cities such as Dublin were seen to be most vulnerable from an economic perspective. The research specific to Ireland, and international policy analysis of the impacts of climate change through the Inter-Governmental Panel on Climate Change, IPCC, will help inform long-term planning in coastal zone management and other policy areas to allow the expected impacts of climate change to be integrated into policy formulation and the costs of adaptation to be best managed.

The prime global response to climate adaptation requirements is to reduce emissions of greenhouse gases to levels that would prevent dangerous human induced interference with global climate systems. The Kyoto Protocol is consequently important as a first step towards the necessary global reductions in greenhouse gas emissions of 60 to 70% by the end of this century, as identified by the IPCC. Achievement of these reductions will delay and reduce the damages caused by climate change and the need for adaptation and, will ensure that the global costs of adaptation will be lower than those identified in the report referred to.

The IPCC third assessment report, the authoritative scientific perspective on climate change mitigation and adaptation, was not able to determine comprehensive quantitative estimates of the benefits of stabilising greenhouse gas concentrations at various levels but is satisfied that stabilisation at lower concentrations will generate greater benefits in terms of less damage. It is also clear that the impacts of climate change will be greatest in those parts of the world least able to afford the cost of adaptation in the required time frames.

Accordingly, my priority has been to support international efforts for ambitious targets for emissions and to meet these targets nationally.

Mr. Sargent

I do not propose to ask a question relating to the Kyoto Protocol because we are dealing with the extent to which climate change is already having an impact. The Minister is dealing only with the matter from an economic point of view given he stated Dublin was vulnerable for economic reasons. Given the costs associated with the floods two years ago of €10 million on clean-up and €2 million on damages, will the Minister act on European Commission research in terms of Ireland's likelihood to experience not just increased rainfall but, increased heavy rainfall and, likewise research from the Institution of Civil Engineers to which he may also have been referring in his reply given NUI was involved in the research which predicted a half metre rise in mean sea level in the next century?

Is the Minister taking on board that advice which stresses the need for not just coastal local authorities but river-basin local authorities to erect considerable defence walls? It has been mentioned that Dublin would require a three metre defence wall. Will such projects be included in his Department's Estimates? In planning terms, will he take on board the retreat of clay cliffs in Killiney and the dunes at Portrane not alone in terms of existing flood plains but in terms of predictions of likely increases in flood damage in areas currently not affected from a planning point of view? To what extent is the Minister taking on board what is already happening regardless of our success or otherwise in enforcing the Kyoto protocol, which is another day's work. I believe the Minister appreciates that we must deal with what is happening now. Will such projects be included in his Department's Estimates?

The Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Cullen, referred in his reply to the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources, Deputy Dermot Ahern. To what extent can local authorities depend on the Government for assistance in terms of providing necessary defences against rain and flooding in particular?

Mr. Cullen

The Deputy will agree this is a complex area. Much of the impact referred to will not take place until the end of the current century from approximately 2075 to 2100. Plans are being put in place to deal with this issue. I am aware from time at OPW that climate change capacity was built into the various schemes designed to deal with the floods. Even though we had not reached existing impacts, significant allowance was made not alone for the worst case scenario that had ever occurred but for potential scenarios taking account of models in different parts of the world. Climate change has been directly catered for in the flooding schemes initiated in recent years.

This is a much more complex issue with which to deal in terms of coastal areas. There is a threat to Ireland and many other countries in terms of how one mitigates this problem. Clearly, one can put in place various elements of coastal protection but, we could spend all the money in the world on this issue and still not resolve it. One has to deal with this matter in a targeted way. My Department is working with the local authorities in that regard.

The Deputy may be aware that my Department is currently rolling out the river basin management systems, some of which have already been completed. The systems will not alone manage the river basin but the entirety of issues in terms of what is happening to the water within those areas. This measure was seen by the EU as the way forward. Ireland is leading the way and, in that regard many schemes are already well advanced in different parts of the country. These schemes will throw up potential solutions to dealing with such problems. However, it will take a combination of Departments and local authorities to come up with agreed solutions to the problems. The question of finding the necessary resources arises, but resources are being made available to deal specifically with flooding issues and the erection of barriers to combat flooding. That is a wise decision.

Deputies may recall the major flooding incident some years ago whereby a new motorway was flooded while old roads were not. The NRA should have taken into account potential water levels and its ability to deal with them in extreme scenarios. With road levels, in terms of the topography of an area in which road is being built, such issues should also be taken into account. We have asked the NRA to ensure that is done in future. There is no excuse for the failure of the development, planning and construction sectors to take into account existing impacts and potential future impacts. That is the best way of getting value for money in terms of dealing with these issues.

Mr. Sargent

This is an important issue. Will the Minister say if his Department is currently engaged in discussions with some of the insurance companies which are threatening, and in some cases have already carried out such threats, to withhold insurance cover on the basis of risk of flooding? Are attenuation tanks in new developments viewed as a critical factor in providing house insurance? Will the Department assist householders in existing and new developments in obtaining insurance cover? He will be aware that there are threats hanging over properties because of insurance companies withholding or threatening to withhold cover.

Given the prediction of the Chartered Insurance Institute, is the Government liaising with insurance companies to ensure ongoing cover is available and that conditions are taken into account to ensure they are satisfied they will not have to withstand costs that will bring them down as companies? This is obviously what they are afraid of.

Mr. Cullen

This issue largely concerns the Office of Public Works, which is the responsibility of the Minister of State at the Department of Finance. When I had this responsibility, I instigated an all-Ireland mapping and modelling process to identify potential dangers for local authorities and developments to ensure we would not build in areas that would obviously be prone to flooding, either now or in the future. That is important. It is equally important that people are able to insure their properties. There were instances in countries where there has been flooding in which people could not get insurance and had to seek alternative methods.

I do not have information on the question on my Department's engagement to date, but if the Deputy tables a parliamentary question, I will certainly obtain it for him. Generally, the OPW, as the operational arm of the State, is more fundamentally engaged in this area on behalf of the State. It is doing a very good job.