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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 27 Feb 2008

Vol. 648 No. 3

Other Questions.

Proposed Legislation.

Joan Burton

Question:

18 Deputy Joan Burton asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if the Government is planning changes to the law governing financial donations to politicians of political parties; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7734/08]

The programme for Government contains a commitment to establish an independent electoral commission which will take responsibility for a range of electoral matters including the functions currently exercised by the Standards in Public Office Commission relating to election spending. The electoral commission will also examine the issue of financing of the political system. In this regard, a procurement process is under way for the carrying out of preliminary research on issues arising in relation to the establishment of the electoral commission.

In accordance with the programme for Government, my Department will publishing a Green Paper on local government reform shortly. The Green Paper will examine a number of issues with the objective of making local government more transparent and responsive, and will set out options for reform in advance of a subsequent White Paper. One of the issues which the Green Paper will address is the question of expenditure limits at local elections. There are currently no such limits, although expenditure, as well as donations over a €635 threshold, must be disclosed. I am satisfied that the proposals for the electoral commission, together with the initiatives which will emerge from the Green Paper, provide an appropriate framework to progress our extensive and complex agenda for electoral and local government reform.

I have an image of the Green Party inside the Fianna Fáil tent at the Galway Races and I am reminded of the observation of Lyndon Johnson regarding the water flow and its direction. It is apparent that the Green Party has given up on dealing with this issue.

I will bring two points to the Minister's attention and then ask a supplementary question.

Mr. Justice Matthew P. Smith, chairperson of the Standards in Public Office Commission, in his report last summer said: "There is a strong case to be made for a new approach to the general funding of political parties and sound arguments to be made for increased transparency in such funding and for greater scrutiny of political party expenditure." The Minister, Deputy John Gormley, then in Opposition, said that if the Taoiseach and the Tánaiste were serious about new ethics legislation they would accept the proposals put forward by the Green Party to ban corporate donations, restrict spending — not just at election time but between elections — and to severely restrict personal donations and advertising. My question is——

I am loath to interrupt the Deputy but quotations are not allowed in questions either.

My questions are simple. Has this report been brought to the Government? Does the Minister accept its recommendations? When will legislation be implemented to put in place these recommendations? Let us not mind the Green Paper, which is happening anyway — this is in the programme for Government. Is there a timeframe for this, given the proximity of the local elections? Considering that there will be local elections next summer, it is ridiculous that there is a cap on general election spending but no cap whatsoever — in fact, the sky is the limit — on local election spending.

The Minister for Finance, Deputy Brian Cowen, has already rejected pleas by the Standards in Public Office Commission to change the law to strengthen its investigation powers. Is the Government now saying that it is telling the commission to just buzz off on this issue as well?

That is unparliamentary language.

Is the Minister inside the Galway tent on this with Fianna Fáil or is he going to do something about it?

I will make a general observation before the Minister replies. Under Standing Orders, there is one minute to put a question and one minute for the Minister to respond.

The Labour Party is much closer to my colleagues in Fianna Fáil with regard to corporate donations than the Green Party because it sees no problem at all with corporate donations. If the Government was to impose a ban on corporate donations, Labour Party members would be up from their seats, saying they did not want it. The Labour Party accepts donations from builders or anyone else, but my party does not. That is the situation.

Is the Minister sure about that?

Likewise with my colleagues in Fine Gael. There was an initiative at one stage from the former party leader, Deputy Michael Noonan, to stop the practice of accepting corporate donations——

We did a U-turn on that, just as the Minister did a U-turn yesterday.

The Minister is being disingenuous, considering that the Labour Party introduced the current legislation——

The fact is that in my reply I said, very clearly, that the Green Paper will examine the question of capping expenditure at election time. I am committed to doing that and believe it is possible to do it between now and the local elections next year. The implication of Deputy Lynch's question is that the Green Party is somehow turning its back on the Standards in Public Office Commission and its recommendations, but it is doing no such thing. The electoral commission is something this country has required for quite some time. I am committed to putting the electoral commission in place that will examine the entire question of funding. It may even suggest a ban on corporate donations and——

Will it be in place for the next local elections?

——at that stage, we will see what the Labour Party has to say.

Will the Minister give an assurance to the House that no member or public representative of the Green Party accepts corporate donations?

The Minister has no responsibility to the House for his party role.

I have never come across an instance of it. That is the Green Party rule. I am speaking here as Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government but I am happy to tell the Deputy that we have a rule in the Green Party that we do not accept corporate donations.

That is fair enough.

That is the rule, clear and simple. As I said, I know that Fine Gael had that rule. If the Deputy has information for me——

I might have, or I might not.

It is a bit rich to have to listen to a Minister who wanted to increase the amount of donations one could make to a political party so he could give more of his salary to his own party, which would then be spent on himself and his own election campaigns, berating other parties. The Labour Party introduced the limits on expenditure on elections and introduced the legislation dealing with accountability and transparency in relation to donations. It is a bit disingenuous to say what the Minister has just said.

I am more than happy to be generous to the Labour Party. In fact, former Deputy Eithne Fitzgerald introduced some very good legislation in the area. Fair play to her and I recognise that.

It also introduced a very good Electoral Act in 1997.

That was proposed by the Leas-Cheann Comhairle.

I think the Leas-Cheann Comhairle, as Minister, had something to do with that and I compliment him on it. Let us work together. I have always said that as Minister I am more than happy to listen to any suggestions coming from the Opposition benches and if they are positive ones, I will act on them.

We are always positive on this side of the House.

The Minister did us a favour yesterday. He listened carefully to us.

Planning Issues.

Olwyn Enright

Question:

19 Deputy Olwyn Enright asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the steps he will take to remedy the situation where many housing developments are not being completed by developers up to the standard demanded by local authorities which result in local authorities not taking them in charge for a considerable length of time; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [8164/08]

The non-completion of any development in line with the planning permission for that development is unauthorised development, which is an offence under the Planning and Development Acts 2000 to 2006. As indicated in the reply to Question No. 227 of 7 February 2008, enforcement of planning control is a matter for the planning authorities, which have substantial enforcement powers and duties under the Planning Acts.

The Planning Act 2000 also contains other relevant provisions related to the completion of housing estates, including provision for planning conditions requiring the giving of adequate security for the satisfactory completion of a development and conditions for the phasing of developments. I am satisfied that planning authorities have very substantial powers to compel the completion of housing estates by developers in accordance with the terms of the planning permission.

In addition to this comprehensive legislative framework and in keeping with the programme for Government commitment, my Department yesterday issued updated policy guidance to planning authorities on the taking in charge of estates in the form of circular letter PD 1/08. Each planning authority is now being asked to develop or update, as appropriate, its policy on taking in charge by the end of June 2008 on the basis of the framework and wider housing and planning guidance, as set out in the annex to the circular.

The new guidance is primarily focused on proactively addressing the issue of taking in charge at the pre-planning stage. The main principles now set out in the overall framework for taking in charge are as follows. A statement of the facilities that will be taken in charge and the maintenance services that will be provided must be set out and the issue of taking in charge must be addressed at the pre-planning stage with the approved design facilitating the taking in charge of core facilities. Developers will be required, through the development management process, to complete residential developments to a standard that is in compliance with the planning permission granted.

Additional information not given on the floor of the House.

Planning authorities must take all necessary measures in this regard in particular through securing adequate bonds, inspection of construction and the taking of enforcement action when necessary. The procedures for taking in charge will begin promptly on foot of a request by the majority of the residents in the development or by the developer, as appropriate. Protocols, including timeframes, must be set out by planning authorities to respond to requests for taking in charge. In general, planning authorities must not attach the establishment of management companies as a condition of planning in respect of traditional housing estates. In relation to older estates, priority must continue to be given to resolving those estates that have been left unfinished or not taken in charge for the longest period.

I am satisfied that this new approach, coupled with the extensive powers already available to planning authorities to deal with non-compliant developers, will appropriately address the issue of unfinished estates.

I thank the Minister for his response. There is a major issue surrounding the taking in charge of housing estates and developers' bonds, which are too low in some instances, with developers walking away from new housing estates and not finishing them properly. There are, for example, many unfinished roads and substandard houses throughout the country. While local authorities carry out some checks, there are not enough people in most planning enforcement sections, which are under-resourced and under-staffed, to adequately cover this area.

I welcome the Minister's circular letter issued to the various local authorities but it is not sufficient. We must make it compulsory for new developments to be regularly checked by local authorities. Will the Minister consider issuing a new circular to the effect that it is compulsory for new developments to be regularly inspected by planning authorities? I also ask him to standardise the taking in charge document and ensure there is strict enforcement, adherence to timetables and a reduction from seven to four years for the taking in charge of estates because the current system is not working.

The main elements of the policy guidance contained in my circular letter will be incorporated into the new sustainable residential development guidelines, which are currently available for public consultation. They will be issued under section 28 of the Planning and Development Act 2000 later this year, which will give them more teeth. The planning authorities are obliged to have regard to such guidelines in the exercise of their functions under the Planning Acts, which is important.

The implementation of the new policy in this area will, as the Deputy pointed out, require the commitment of additional resources by planning authorities, particularly in terms of pre-application consultation and inspection of construction. I am aware that it will require extra resources and, therefore, my Department has completed a review of planning application fees, which were last increased in 1998. I am currently considering the review recommendations with a view to determining whether the increases are warranted and the level of any such increases.

As has been the case in terms of the Adamstown project, we have all been approached by residents whose estates have not been taken in charge for eight or nine years. The builders may not be in business anymore. In the Adamstown case, specific quantities of housing needed to be completed and brought up to standard before the next development phase could occur. I urge the Minister's Department to consider the issue in this context so that the situation of a series of housing estates being incomplete and necessitating taking in charge can be avoided. I urge the Department to take on board the suggestion that the development should be dealt with incrementally as it is being rolled out.

I welcome the circular, but the issue is the compulsory enforcement by local authorities. Given that 61,127 units have not been taken in charge, a sizable portion of housing estates, the process is not working. Home owners do not know their rights, including that local authorities must take their estates in charge if a majority of owners agree. It must be communicated to the people.

Deputies have raised important points. Deputy Ciarán Lynch's point on Adamstown is particularly good. This year, a new local government service indicator will be introduced to provide benchmark data in 2009 for monitoring the taking in charge process. Priority will be accorded by individual authorities to the taking in charge of unfinished or legacy estates.

While my circular will address the situation from now on, our legacy problem dates back many years and must be dealt with. Housing estates springing up all over the country is a Celtic tiger phenomenon. What has occurred in terms of planning and letting down so many individual house owners is disgraceful.

Social and Affordable Housing.

Richard Bruton

Question:

20 Deputy Richard Bruton asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he has assessed the extent of vacant housing property in the Irish market; and its implications for public policy. [2120/08]

I am aware of information regarding vacant dwellings published by the Central Statistics Office as part of the 2006 census results, which was derived from analysis of cases where census forms were not received from dwellings by enumerators. The total number of dwellings reported vacant by the CSO on this basis on census night, 23 April 2006, was 266,000. This represented approximately 15% of the overall housing stock, slightly lower than the EU average according to data published by the International Monetary Fund and well below the reported vacancy rate in some individual member states. An estimated 50,000 of the dwellings reported vacant in the 2006 census were reported by CSO to be holiday homes. The remaining 216,000 represent approximately 12% of the total housing stock. Dwellings can be vacant at any given time for a variety of reasons and a significant level of vacancy can be expected in a dynamic society experiencing significant mobility and demographic change.

An important element of the Government's housing policy is to promote the availability of an adequate supply of housing to meet demand and to provide support to those who cannot meet their accommodation needs without assistance, as outlined in the Government's housing policy statement, Delivering Homes, Sustaining Communities. My Department will continue to keep developments in the housing market, including trends in housing supply, under review in consultation with other relevant agencies.

The Minister of State's reply is complacent given the evident background. Excluding holiday homes, the CSO figures show 46,000 houses vacant in Dublin city, 25,000 in Cork city, 9,000 in Limerick city and 16,000 in Galway city. The Minister of State would know better than anyone that the Government's social and affordable housing programme has collapsed. According to Government data, the programme has delivered less than half of the amount set out in the national development plan.

Does the Minister of State see a serious contradiction in the rental accommodation scheme, the Government's latest initiative, in Dublin city being massively oversubscribed when 46,000 units are vacant? We cannot offer local authority tenancies to a housing list that is running into the thousands. Some 9,000 people are on the affordable housing list. For the 3,000 whose incomes justify their applications, only 300 houses are coming on stream. Is this not a serious mismatch in public policy, namely, tolerating a housing crisis despite so many vacant properties? Surely, the Department has the capacity to link them.

I wish to address the vacant houses figure, which the CSO puts at 50,000. There is an acceptance that tax issues relate to many holiday homes and that there is a significant further number of holiday homes.

Not in Dublin, Cork, Galway or Limerick.

The Deputy will understand the dual abode situation obtaining in Dublin. A significant number of people own second homes, particularly in Dublin, where they conduct business.

They are accounted for separately by the CSO.

They have bases of work in Dublin and homes elsewhere. Given market trends, there is an overhang of approximately 30,000 vacant units in the country, of which 5,500 are in the Dublin area. It is important to remember that certain developers have generated significant buyer interest by reducing prices. The House will recall a 28% increase in house prices in the 18-month period between 2005 and 2006. The current situation shows that, when realistic prices are offered, people are willing to buy and weakened sales have improved dramatically as a result.

I was not asking about the overhang in the housing market, which is another's day work that developers are well able to look after. Thousands of people on housing lists in Dublin are awaiting the rental accommodation scheme, the social and affordable scheme and so on despite the existence of the 46,000 houses in question owned by developers, individuals or whoever. Surely, there is an opportunity to consider creatively how to match them up. People in Dublin city cannot avail of the rental accommodation scheme, which was an interesting initiative.

The question put by the Deputy concerned the overhang of houses, but he is discussing a separate issue.

On a point of order, I will read my question. It states: "if he has assessed the extent of vacant housing property in the Irish market; and its implications for public policy." I did not mention overhanging.

The Deputy is discussing RAS. As part of our development plan in the 2008 to 2010 period, we will transfer an additional 1,000 new units from the private sector. There is ample evidence that many developers are making private accommodation available to RAS if there is an overhang in the market. We will continue with our policy. This year, we will spend €2.5 billion in the affordable and social housing sector.

That is less than half the target set out in the national development plan.

We will spend €18 billion in the period of the national development plan, which is unprecedented.

Has the Minister of State read the targets?

The rate should be double that now being sought.

We achieved 2007's social housing target.

The Government has not.

Environmental Policy.

Willie Penrose

Question:

21 Deputy Willie Penrose asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the breakdown of the number of European Commission first written warnings, final warnings, referrals to the European Court of Justice, Court of Reasoned Opinions, court judgments and decisions to fine that are currently operational against Ireland in respect of breaches of environmental law; the breaches in respect of same; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [8035/08]

In areas for which my Department has responsibility, the European Commission is currently in correspondence in respect of 28 cases relating to possible infringements of EU environmental legislation. The cases are at various stages of proceedings.

Under Article 226 of the EU treaty, seven cases are at letter of formal notice stage, the initial stages of the formal proceedings. These are generally about transposition of directives on waste, environmental impact assessment, contained use of genetically modified organisms, GMOs, and the water framework directive. Six cases are at reasoned opinion stage under Article 226. These are about transposition of air quality and environmental liability directives, waste and urban waste water.

The Commission has decided to refer three cases about waste, environmental impact assessment and habitats to the European Court of Justice and the Commission applications to the court on these are awaited. Three cases about environmental impact assessment, urban waste water treatment and public participation in plans and programmes relating to the environment are before the court awaiting hearing. Judgment is awaited in one case about environmental impact assessment heard on 14 February 2008.

In eight cases about waste, water and habitats issues my Department is working to meet the requirements of judgments of the court. Of these, five have moved to the next stage in proceedings of which one, on waste, has been the subject of a letter of formal notice under Article 228 of the treaty and four, on water, habitats and wild birds, are the subject of reasoned opinions under Article 228 of the treaty.

I propose to circulate with the Official Report a tabular statement listing the directives involved and setting out the various stages of proceedings in respect of these cases.

There is no case awaiting a fines decision against Ireland, and fines have never been imposed on Ireland in relation to an environmental infringement.

Directive/Decision Number and General Reference

Stage in Proceedings

Article 226 Letter of Formal Notice

Article 226 Reasoned Opinion

Being Referred to the European Court of Justice

Before the European Court of Justice for a hearing or awaiting judgement

European Court of Justice Decision to be Implemented

Article 228 Letter of Formal Notice

Article 228 Reasoned Opinion

75/439/EEC on the disposal of waste oils

1

0

0

0

0

0

0

75/442/EEC the waste directive

2

1

1

0

0

1

0

76/464/EEC on dangerous substances in water

0

0

0

0

0

0

1

79/409/EEC on wild birds

0

0

0

0

1

0

1

80/68/EEC on groundwater

0

0

0

0

1

0

0

80/778/EEC on the quality of drinking water for human consumption

0

0

0

0

0

0

1

85/337/EEC on the assessment of the effects of certain public and private projects on the environment

1

0

1

2

0

0

0

91/271/EEC on urban waste water treatment

0

1

0

1

0

0

0

92/43/EEC on habitats

0

0

1

0

1

0

1

98/81/EC on the contained use of genetically modified micro-organisms

1

0

0

0

0

0

0

99/31/ec on landfill

0

1

0

0

0

0

0

2003/35/EC on public participation in certain plans and programmes relating to the environment

0

0

0

1

0

0

0

2000/60/EC the water framework directive

1

0

0

0

0

0

0

2004/35/EC on environmental liability with regard to the prevention and remedying of environmental damage

0

1

0

0

0

0

0

2004/107/EC on Arsenic, Cadmium, Mercury, Nickel and Polycyclic Aromatic Hydrocarbons in Ambient Air

0

1

0

0

0

0

0

2005/33/EC on the sulphur content of marine fuels

0

1

0

0

0

0

0

Decisions No 280/2004/EC & 2005/166/EC – reporting requirements

1

0

0

0

0

0

0

TOTAL NUMBER AT EACH STAGE

7

6

3

4

3

1

4

The tabular statement will be helpful because it is difficult to get a break down of cases, even if one goes to the European Commission. According to the European Commission's latest survey, carried out in 2006 on the 2005 position, Ireland was the third worst offender with regard to open infringement procedures relating to environmental law. Ireland was the fourth worst offender in cases that had already been ruled on by the European Court of Justice under European law.

We have a very bad record and I have put many parliamentary questions to find out the latest on particular cases. Today there is a parliamentary question relating to the Environmental Liability Act. It does not seem as though things have progressed much since the Minister came to office, though this is an issue he felt was important when he was in Opposition. Deputy Ciarán Cuffe said the judgment on the public participation directive was another black mark against Ireland relating to environmental law.

Dr. Mary Kelly of the Environmental Protection Agency said the EU has driven environmental law in Ireland. This issue revolves around people's right to a good environment, clean water and the things they should be able to take for granted. What will the Minister do to make a difference and make progress that will allow Ireland become a leader in Europe in terms of compliance with environmental law?

The Deputy is correct that the European Union has made a tremendous difference and I am on record as saying that without it our environment would be in a far worse state. This is one reason the Lisbon treaty is so important, especially with regard to combatting climate change, though there are also other initiatives.

I have made this subject a priority and when I became Minister I sought to examine all of the infringement proceedings. On looking at the large pile I inherited on my desk I made a point of visiting Commissioner Dimas. I have spoken to him and his officials on a number of occasions and I have made it clear that I am completely committed to dealing with these complex and difficult issues. The issues are difficult because we require extra resources. I succeeded in getting extra resources for the Environmental Protection Agency, which received a budget increase of 43%, and the National Parks and Wildlife Service, NPWS, which received a budget increase of 37%.

The Minister should take charge of those organisations, keep an eye on them and observe their reports.

They are doing well in keeping an eye on the environment. I observe all of their reports and compliment their staff on doing difficult work well. The EPA and NPWS required the resources because of the key issues of enforcement of and compliance with environmental law. Ireland's full compliance will probably require further resources and I do not for a moment underestimate the extent of this difficult challenge.

Waste Management.

Kieran O'Donnell

Question:

22 Deputy Kieran O’Donnell asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government his objectives for mechanical biological waste treatment as part of a national waste strategy; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [8193/08]

The EU landfill directive sets challenging targets for the diversion of biodegradable waste. It requires the attainment of specific diversion rates projected to equate to 59% for 2010, 73% by 2013 and 80% by 2016 for this waste stream. The recent National Waste Report for 2006, published in January 2008, by the EPA presents the scale of the challenge in sharp focus. While the recovery rate for this waste stream increased to 38% from 35% in 2005, the quantity of this waste going to landfill rose by 15%.

A national strategy on biodegradable waste was published in 2006 and sets out a range of measures aimed at progressing the diversion of biodegradable waste from landfill. The programme for Government is clearly committed to the effective implementation of the strategy.

I have already placed on the record my position that over reliance on incineration is not the answer. In line with the commitment given in the programme, a major review of waste policy will be commencing shortly. The review will examine the potential role of mechanical and biological treatment and other technologies.

In addition, my Department will be driving the roll-out by local authorities of segregated brown bin collections for biodegradable material. This will make a significant contribution to the diversion of household waste from landfill, as we have already seen in places like Waterford.

It is clear from the National Waste Report that landfill has become more attractive as landfill gate fees have fallen and I recently announced my intention to increase the landfill levy to encourage recycling. I will shortly be making an order and amended regulations to give effect to that increase.

In the interest of hearing answers to more questions and because we have covered these matters in an earlier question I will not ask a supplementary question.

Planning Issues.

Michael Noonan

Question:

23 Deputy Michael Noonan asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government when the planning guidelines published in February 2008 will take effect; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [8191/08]

I published for public consultation the draft guidelines for planning authorities on sustainable residential development in urban areas on 10 February, together with an accompanying best practice urban design manual, which illustrates how these guidelines can be implemented. The 12 week public consultation period finishes on 6 May 2008 and I encourage all interested parties to submit their views within the consultation period.

The objectives of these new guidelines are as follows: to set out stronger planning requirements to facilitate the development of sustainable communities through strengthening planning and the provision of necessary supporting services and amenities; to help achieve the most efficient use of urban land through housing densities that are appropriate to the location involved and availability of supporting services and infrastructure, particularly transport; and to set high standards in terms of space and facilities to meet the needs of the Irish context.

The timescale for finalisation of the guidelines following the public consultation will be dependent on the volume and nature of the comments and submissions received. However, pending finalisation of the guidelines, planning authorities are asked to have regard to the recommended design standards for new residential developments in the draft guidelines when preparing or varying development plans and local area plans.

I welcome the guidelines. The Minister has spoken at length about his proposals regarding the capping of developments in villages but perhaps he could elaborate on this. The Green Party proposes to introduce local capital gains tax on zoned lands but will this be another stealth tax? What are the Minister's proposals on lands that have been zoned in villages to date? Will a levy or tax be placed on them?

As Deputy Hogan said, there is a need for proper infrastructure in our villages. In my county, Longford, sewerage schemes have been bundled together in Ardagh, Aughnacliffe and Ballinalee. Very little progress has been made on these schemes in the past decade because if one area failed to cross a "t" and another failed to dot an "i", all schemes would be held up. It was not a great system that was operated by the Department. In every area where a community was involved, perhaps there were more progressive people in one particular area or another who wanted to get the development off the ground. On another issue relating to planning, I would like to see greater uniformity——

I am sure you would, Deputy. I call the Minister.

——throughout the country in regard to one-off houses. I have seen anomalies on the outskirts of villages. In County Longford, 14% of applications were refused, while 25,000 were refused in County Westmeath.

As a courtesy, will the Deputy please obey the Chair? Each Deputy has one minute but the Deputy has taken more than two minutes. Two other Deputies have indicated they would like to put a supplementary question.

Will I take the other questions?

Perhaps the Minister would take the questions put in case he loses track of the question.

I am trying to recall the question Deputy Bannon put to me.

Constituency sprawl.

I recall a reference to capital gains tax on land. The Government has no such proposal. The Deputy mentioned villages and towns. The draft guidelines state that in villages and towns of between 400 and 5,000 people, which are not designated as growth towns in the county development plan, the number of existing dwellings should not be increased by more than 15%. That makes sense. For example, a town of 5,000 would comprise approximately 2,000 dwellings. Applying the new guidelines should restrict new residential development to approximately 300 new dwellings, approximately 750 people over the lifetime of the plan. I believe that makes sense.

We spoke earlier about the legacy of bad planning and all the housing estates which have remained unfinished. I see examples of this as I go around Ireland. There are villages to which, quite inappropriately, a housing estate has been tacked on. Quite often there are no footpaths from the village to the housing estate. The whole idea behind taking in charge and the new guidelines is that this type of practice will cease. We will not get that again. The real losers are the people who live in those communities who do not have the facilities and are inconvenienced in a substantial way.

The problem with the guidelines is that they are just guidelines. I know the Minister wanted a formula where he would provide in the planning and development Act that councillors make decisions consistent with the guidelines. That still leaves a significant area open to interpretation by councillors, county managers and so on. Would the Minister consider setting out what he wants to do in the guidelines in the Act, similar to what was done by the previous Government when it set out what was required of strategic development zones, such as Adamstown? It was clearly set out in section 168 of the Planning and Development Act 2000 so that there was no room for manoeuvre. Developments had to be phased and tied to infrastructure. That worked very successfully. Also the guidelines will not stop people rezoning and that is the important thing.

I welcome the sustainable planning guidelines that have been issued for consultation. What the Minister said makes absolute sense in planning terms to avoid the type of willy-nilly development seen in many villages. Will the Minister agree we need to take account of the fact that one size does not fit all in regard to guidelines on these issues and that what might work in a large urban centre will not work in a village? High rise buildings beside a railway station may not be appropriate in a village setting. What does the Minister intend to do to ensure the guidelines are sufficiently robust while at the same time allowing for some latitude to cope with the different circumstances throughout the country?

I will take Deputy Tuffy's question first. The new guidelines on sustainable residential development in urban areas will be issued under section 28 of the Planning and Development Act 2000, which states that local authorities must have regard to them in carrying out their function. I am also looking at what further steps might be needed to strengthen the decision-making process by local authorities in the zoning of land so that decisions arrived at are evidence-based and secure the necessary economic environmental and social benefits for local communities. I am planning legislation along those lines.

The point raised by Deputy Hogan is one that has been raised with me. People have asked how one can compare Leitrim to Dublin. There are different circumstances and, obviously, that is the case. Therefore, there is a degree of latitude there. Local planners will not confuse the fact that there is a low population in the Leitrim area and the level of density required would not be the same as Dublin. That is self-evident.

Written Answers follow Adjournment Debate.

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