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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 26 Feb 2009

Vol. 676 No. 3

Order of Business.

The Tánaiste

It is proposed to take No. 24, statements on the HSE document, Framework for the Development of a Diabetic Retinopathy Screening Programme for Ireland; and No. 25, statements on the Deloitte report, Cost and Efficiency Review of Dublin Bus and Bus Éireann.

It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that the proceedings on No. 24 shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 1.30 p.m. today and the following arrangements shall apply: the statements of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party, the Labour Party and Sinn Féin, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case and the statement of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case; Members may share time; and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a statement in reply which shall not exceed ten minutes; the proceedings on No. 25 shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 3.30 p.m. today and the following arrangements shall apply: the statements of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party, the Labour Party and Sinn Féin, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case and the statement of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case; Members may share time; and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a statement in reply which shall not exceed ten minutes.

An Ceann Comhairle

There are two proposals to be put to the House today. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 24 agreed to?

Deputy Enda Kenny

I do not agree with the Order of Business. There is no sense of realism from this Government in the context of the current economic circumstances. I propose that we set aside Nos. 24 and 25, important though they are, and discuss the grave and escalating situation in the banking sector and the general state of our public finances. Given the imposition of a selective, biased and unfair pension levy, every State office in the country is being picketed today, including the national Parliament, Dáil Éireann. Everybody has the right to protest. However, the point I made yesterday was that the way the Government has approached the hole in our public finances has been selective, unfair and removed from reality. That is the reason people are outside the gates of this establishment today. I propose, therefore, that we set aside Nos. 24 and 25 and that the House discuss the continuing and escalating economic crisis.

While I am on my feet, I will point out that it is not within the personality of the Taoiseach to accept any constructive suggestion from any member of the Opposition. I will say to the Tánaiste——

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot go into that now.

Deputy Enda Kenny

All right. I will come back to it.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

I agree with Deputy Kenny about setting aside the business ordered for today. There is an air of unreality about the business the Government has scheduled for the House to discuss. All public and State offices in the country, including these Houses, are being picketed by members of the Civil and Public Services Union. Every social welfare office in the country is closed. This House, instead of discussing the items scheduled for today, needs to discuss the serious economic circumstances the country is in. The Government has had its lap-dogs out over the past week or so asking why the Opposition does not stay quiet and support the Government and why we cannot all get together and agree these things.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

That is right.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

This forum is where we agree things. This party has been saying to the Government for some time now that we want to reach agreement on an economic strategy to move this country forward. Last week I said to the Taoiseach, specifically on the issue of jobs, that if the Government introduces a strategy for protecting and creating jobs it will have the support of the Labour Party. We want an open discussion led by the Government and contributed to by the Opposition to address the economic situation, the jobs crisis and the sense of unfairness and hurt felt by all those staff of the State's services standing on picket lines today and to find solutions to the problems we face. Unfortunately, the Government is not responding.

An Ceann Comhairle

Only brief comments are allowed on the Order of Business.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

Yesterday, instead of being agreeable to entering discussions on the issues causing grief, the Taoiseach stated the time was not appropriate for discussions with the trade unions. The reality is that the economic problems facing the country will not be solved in the absence of agreement. Unfortunately, we are in a situation where the Government repeatedly comes into the House to insist on doing things its own way and then spins the line that it cannot get the agreement of the Opposition.

Deputy Noel Dempsey

If it came up with a few ideas, we would have something to discuss.

The Tánaiste

The Order of Business——

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

We produce more ideas in one day than the Government does in 12 years.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please allow the Tánaiste to continue without interruption.

Deputy Martin Cullen

Platitudes.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

The Minister's bright idea was using electronic voting machines.

The Tánaiste

The business ordered for today was set aside previously at the request of the Opposition. We have been asked to facilitate other debates but, unfortunately, people are not available to meet these requests.

Deputy Enda Kenny

Rubbish.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

Absolute rubbish.

The Tánaiste

It is disingenuous of the Opposition to ask us to change the Order of Business.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

You are the ones being childish.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please allow the Tánaiste to continue.

The Tánaiste

We have spent the past two days debating the economy. There was a further request on the Order of Business to arrange debates on these matters on the basis that they had been previously deferred.

Deputy Enda Kenny

We would be happy to meet tomorrow or Monday instead.

The Tánaiste

Therefore, we are not agreeing to a change to the Order of Business.

Question put: "That the proposal for dealing with No. 24 be agreed to."

The Dáil divided: Tá, 68; Níl, 56.

Tá

Níl

Tellers: Tá, Deputies Pat Carey and John Cregan; Níl, Deputies Paul Kehoe and Pat Rabbitte.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle

Is the proposal for dealing with No. 25 agreed? Agreed. I call Deputy Kenny on the Order of Business.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The position we are in is that the Government apparently has no sense of reality in terms of the scale of the situation we are facing.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Kenny cannot discuss that matter on the Order of Business. Provision is not made for Leaders' Questions on Thursday mornings.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The Ceann Comhairle has not given me an opportunity to ask about legislation, promised or otherwise.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Kenny knows the rules.

Deputy Enda Kenny

Perhaps the Ceann Comhairle will allow me to make my point.

An Ceann Comhairle

I have no problem with that provided the Deputy's point is in order.

Deputy Enda Kenny

Thank you. We are facing a range of problems in this country. Deputy Catherine Byrne spoke earlier of the loss of three teachers at the Mater Dei national school in Basin Lane, a DEIS school, owing to the €20 billion hole in our public finances.

I say to the Tánaiste, in respect of the legislation dealing with these matters, that the Taoiseach does not have it within his personality to accept any constructive suggestions from the Opposition. I have spoken to the Minister for Finance on a number of occasions and I recognise the gravity of the banking crisis and that our financial independence is at stake. Will the Tánaiste confirm if the Government gave its view on the appointment of the new chief executive of the Bank of Ireland? I do not know the person involved but an internal appointment does not send out the right message.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Kenny must ask questions relevant to the Order of Business.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I will sit down after I make my next point.

An Ceann Comhairle

It is unfortunate that provision is not made for Leaders' Questions on Thursday mornings. I must implement the rules of the House.

Deputy Enda Kenny

That is the fault of the Taoiseach who will not come into the House on Thursdays.

Deputy Michael Creed

There are no Leaders' answers on Tuesdays or Wednesdays.

An Ceann Comhairle

I do not know whose fault it is; I am only implementing Standing Orders as presented to me.

Deputy Enda Kenny

It is most certainly not the Ceann Comhairle's fault. The Ceann Comhairle is not culpable in this regard.

An Ceann Comhairle

I am not.

Deputy Enda Kenny

If the Taoiseach saw fit to come in here on Thursday mornings, we could tease out these matters. However, he does not. In any event, I make the following offer to the Tánaiste as deputy head of Government and a senior economic Minister. I am prepared to supply financial spokespeople from the Fine Gael Party to participate in an all-party group which will set out clear regulation, a clear mandate and strategy, provide for no deals and ensure proper oversight in the banking sector if the Government is prepared to participate in such a group.

Any offer we have made in respect of the national jersey or bipartisanship——

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Kenny will have to raise that issue with the Taoiseach next week.

Deputy Enda Kenny

——has been rejected and spurned by the Government.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Kenny will have to raise the matter during Leaders' Questions next week.

Deputy Jim O’Keeffe

It might be more timely now.

Deputy Enda Kenny

Will the Tánaiste consider my suggestion——

An Ceann Comhairle

I must ask Deputy Kenny to remain in order.

Deputy Enda Kenny

——and give me a response on behalf of Government?

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot discuss that matter now. I call Deputy Gilmore.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I do not mean an all-party committee; I mean an all-party grouping——

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot get into that now.

Deputy Enda Kenny

——that could set out clear guidelines for the oversight and regulation of the banking sector, which is our responsibility.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Frank Fahey

The Deputy tore up the jersey last weekend.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

The Deputy never wore the jersey in the first place.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

The Deputy has never worn the jersey.

Deputy Noel Dempsey

Not a white one anyway.

An Ceann Comhairle

I call Deputy Gilmore.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

This country is in the most serious economic situation in which it has ever been since the foundation of the State. Last Sunday the Tánaiste in an interview with a Sunday newspaper——

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy must stay in order.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

I am in order.

An Ceann Comhairle

I must be consistent. I cannot have a situation here on a Thursday morning where it is around the house and behind the dresser. It is not on. The Deputy must stay in order.

A Deputy

Of course, it is Lent.

A Deputy

We may as well close down and go home altogether.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

Last Sunday the Tánaiste gave an interview to a Sunday newspaper in which she described some of the measures in the Government's budget in October as a disaster. Will the Tánaiste say if the Government has any plans to introduce a new budget, given that she, as deputy leader of the Government, considers the last budget to be a disaster, given that the budgetary figures since the last budget are completely different and given the entirely different and worsening financial circumstances in which the country now finds itself to that in which it was in October?

An Ceann Comhairle

I call the Tánaiste to answer on plans to introduce a new budget.

The Tánaiste

There is no legislation promised to introduce a new budget.

Deputy Jim O’Keeffe

That is not an answer to the question.

The Tánaiste

We passed the legislation on the banking sector.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

The Tánaiste should answer the question.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle

I can only implement the regulations before me, as Deputy Gilmore is aware.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The Government passed legislation on the banking sector, but the Tánaiste has now rejected an offer of participating in an all party——

An Ceann Comhairle

Let us not get involved in that now please.

Deputy Enda Kenny

Will the Tánaiste say if I am correct to state as much?

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

She says one thing out there and another thing in here.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I wish to clarify that.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will Deputy Gilmore please try to stay in order. I must ensure the House proceeds in an orderly fashion. If I start allowing questions and so on that are not in order the whole place and the whole system will break down. I cannot allow it.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I seek clarification from the Tánaiste and the deputy head of Government that she is rejecting an offer of support with definitive, clear guidelines.

An Ceann Comhairle

I can only implement the rules. If the Members wish to change the rules, please do so. It would make life a good deal easier for me.

A Deputy

That is hypocrisy, like that which we heard last night.

A Deputy

Deputy Kenny is not in order.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I seek clarification from the Tánaiste, please.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Gilmore is in order at this stage. I can call Deputy Kenny again.

Deputy Enda Kenny

This is a matter of great importance. It is about our financial independence.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Gilmore is in possession at this stage.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I seek clarification of what the Tánaiste just said. Is she rejecting the offer?

An Ceann Comhairle

We can suspend the House, but I have no wish to do so.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The Tánaiste has rejected the offer.

A Deputy

The Ceann Comhairle might as well.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy may ask a question which is in order.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I need an answer to the question.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Gilmore is in order and I will call on Deputy Kenny later. Deputy Gilmore is in order and it is his turn.

Deputy Enda Kenny

It is a one word answer I need to hear, either "Yes" or "No".

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

I asked the Tánaiste.

Deputy Enda Kenny

What is the answer?

An Ceann Comhairle

Let Deputy Gilmore finish his point, please.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

I asked the Tánaiste a question which, I believe, is in order. That is the question as to whether the Government intends to introduce another budget and when it intends to do so. I ask the question first, because it is manifestly clear that the budget introduced in October no longer applies and that the Tánaiste described some of the measures in it as a disaster.

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot go into that now.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

We are aware that the budgetary figures are different. The Labour Party stands ready and willing to engage with the Government if the Government intends to introduce a new budget. However, we have not——

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy has made a statement.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

I seek an answer to the question.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy seeks an answer to the question. Is a new budget promised or not?

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

Will we have a new budget, and if so, when?

The Tánaiste

No.

An Ceann Comhairle

"No" is the answer. I call Deputy Crawford.

The Tánaiste

No.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Tánaiste said "No".

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

There will be no new budget.

An Ceann Comhairle

That is what the Tánaiste said.

Deputy Michael Creed

Not until after the local elections.

Deputy Noel Dempsey

It is a very difficult word to understand. The Deputy should try to get real.

Deputy Michael Creed

The Tánaiste left Agriculture House in a mess and then she made a mess of the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment.

Deputy Enda Kenny

With respect to the Chair, I wish to put a question to the Tánaiste. I seek clarification as to whether she would accept an offer of support in respect of setting out clear regulations and guidelines about the banking sector, given that we have a very grave situation. I seek a "Yes" or "No" answer.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy must raise that matter with the Taoiseach on Leaders' Questions next week. There are no Leaders' Questions today. I call Deputy Crawford.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle

Can the Tánaiste be helpful to move this on?

The Tánaiste

I can be more than helpful, as long as I am allowed to go out of order. On that issue, it is bizarre that the Opposition is offering to facilitate the Government when every time the Government asks the Opposition to facilitate it, the Opposition is not forthcoming.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

We have been listening to this rubbish day and night.

The Tánaiste

That being said, it is a very grave and difficult situation. We are all aware of that and that is why we should not be playing politics with it.

Deputy Noel Dempsey

Hear, hear.

The Tánaiste

If there are forthcoming suggestions, the Government will listen. The Taoiseach has indicated ad infinitum that he is more than happy to facilitate it.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The Tánaiste heard the Taoiseach's remarks yesterday.

The Tánaiste

When we discuss issues of regulatory reform, the Government will put forward proposals on those issues.

Deputy Enda Kenny

It rejected a nine point plan last night.

The Tánaiste

The Minister for Finance will bring forth new regulatory frameworks and I am certain all Members of the House will have the opportunity to have an input in that and would welcome it.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The Tánaiste said yesterday that the public finances were under control, but now says the situation is very grave.

An Ceann Comhairle

Leave the recapitalisation until next week and all those points can be made then. I call Deputy Crawford.

Deputy Seymour Crawford

Some three years ago——

Deputy Enda Kenny

We know about Deputy Dempsey now.

Deputy Noel Dempsey

We know about Deputy Kenny.

Deputy James Reilly

We know about Deputy Dempsey too.

An Ceann Comhairle

I call Deputy Crawford.

Deputy Enda Kenny

We know what the Deputy was saying. We know of Deputy Dempsey's agenda.

Deputy Noel Dempsey

I know Deputy Kenny's agenda.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I know Deputy Dempsey's agenda.

An Ceann Comhairle

Side bar discussions are not allowed. I call Deputy Crawford.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Noel Dempsey

Say it outside the House. The Deputy is saying one thing behind peoples' backs.

Deputy Seymour Crawford

I cannot compete with the Minister.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Dempsey, please. In the name of goodness, let Deputy Crawford make his point.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle

That is childish stuff.

Deputy Seymour Crawford

In light of the difficulties of many industries at present and the need for the simplification of the rules and regulations, when will the company law consolidation and reform Bill be introduced? In light of the fact that a group of young people were drinking all night in a park outside Monaghan last week, and one of the company, unfortunately, lost his life, when will the sale of alcohol Bill be introduced to ensure this type of situation can be minimised? When will the eligibility for health and personal social services Bill be introduced to guarantee services to the people who deserve them and not only to the HSE?

The Tánaiste

The company law reform Bill is very sizable legislation. The Department has appointed some additional support to bring forward the legislation as quickly as possible. However, as we have indicated, it will be some time before it is brought to finality. I will have an undertaking with the Chairman of the committee as to the way to move ahead in the discussion of the Bill. Regarding the sale of alcohol Bill, it will be the middle of this year and there is no date for the final legislation to which the Deputy referred.

Deputy Joanna Tuffy

I refer to an OECD report, just published, on the employment situation in Ireland. The report makes recommendations concerning what training schemes and community employment schemes should be put in place. In light of the growing job losses and since it is relevant to the Department for which the Tánaiste is responsible, will she organise a debate on this report and on the pressing need to provide opportunities for the unemployed?

An Ceann Comhairle

There is no legislation promised. I presume it is a matter for the Whips.

The Tánaiste

To be helpful, that report is part of an ongoing undertaking by the Department. If it is a matter for the Whips I would be more than forthcoming.

Deputy Noel J. Coonan

I refer to the minerals development Bill, the purpose of which, we are told, is to modernise and consolidate all mineral developments in the country. In view of the fact that Galmoy Mines has already closed and that the largest zinc ore mine in Europe, namely, Lisheen Mines in County Tipperary, is due to close in two years time, when will that Bill be introduced? Given that the Tánaiste's colleague, the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food has made an unprecedented attack on agriculture, no doubt the hatchets and chainsaws will be out soon for the forestry sector.

An Ceann Comhairle

That is very interesting but it is not relevant now.

Minister for Transport (Deputy Noel Dempsey)

He threw money at them. That was a ferocious attack.

Deputy Noel J. Coonan

When will the forestry (amendment) Bill be introduced?

The Tánaiste

The heads of the minerals development Bill were passed some time ago. It is expected to be introduced this year, but I understand it has taken some time to complete the work.

There is no time decided yet for the forestry Bill.

Deputy Noel J. Coonan

If the Government does not act soon all the mines will be closed.

Deputy Terence Flanagan

When is the Local Government Bill, to introduce a €200 charge for a non-principal private residence, coming before the House? I know that the Tánaiste is taking a personal interest in SR Technics on the north side of Dublin where 1,135 jobs are at stake. I hope she has some good news to report on attempts to find a new owner.

An Ceann Comhairle

There is another way to raise that issue which Deputy Terence Flanagan will have to use.

The Tánaiste

The heads of the Local Government Bill were passed on 10 February and it will be introduced if possible in this session.

I will speak privately to the Deputy on the other issue he raised.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan

Health managers' budgets around the country are being stringently cut which will close wards, affect patient care and cut services. These budget cuts are far in excess of the figures we have seen in the media. In the past two days we have asked about having a debate on the health services. When will we have that debate? Can we get real information on the extent of the cuts in the context of that debate so that we can protect basic patient services?

The Tánaiste

The Whips will discuss that and we hope to hold the debate next week if possible.

Deputy James Bannon

There is a proposal to establish a single national inland fisheries authority to replace the Central Fisheries Board and the seven regional boards. When will the fisheries (amendment) Bill be brought before the House because people involved in the industry are concerned about the long delay in establishing this central authority?

The Tánaiste

We hope to bring the heads of the Bill to Government fairly soon and to have the legislation available this year.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

Deputies have asked about the legislation to control management companies on numerous occasions, including in the past few days. The Taoiseach has indicated that progress could be reported. Will the Tánaiste update the House on that progress and when we will see the heads of the Bill?

The Tánaiste

The heads have been drafted and we hope to introduce that legislation as quickly as possible. There is an important timeframe for us all within which to have that available.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

Indeed, it is an important time for this Bill.

There has been a noticeable lack of information recently in the content of responses to parliamentary questions. This is not the fault of the Ceann Comhairle. It may be regarded as cute codgerism. It is a serious erosion of the parliamentary entitlements of the Opposition, and of democracy. Some Ministers are notorious for this.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy can get that raised at the Committee on Procedures and Privileges because I cannot have a discussion on it here.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

Economies in responses are not acceptable.

An Ceann Comhairle

I cannot have a discussion on this here.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

The Ceann Comhairle will enjoy my last question.

An Ceann Comhairle

I did not enjoy the last one.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

This one is about promised legislation. I listened with interest while a chat show compère on the national broadcasting service this morning indicated that he had not heard the Opposition admonish Government about the way the economy was going in the past few years. I am glad to say that my colleague, Deputy Michael Ring, roundly rebutted this statement.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy will have to ask a question.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

Apart from a FÁS course for those who were not watching and listening in recent years, there is appropriate legislation to transpose the EU directive on data retention which might be of some help to the compères who could not or did not listen to or hear what was going on for the past six or seven years. That legislation is No. 29 on the Government legislation programme. Will the Tánaiste indicate when the legislation will be brought in so that we can have a debate in order to enlighten people outside the House?

The Tánaiste

The subject matter of the legislation is far from what the Deputy seeks but it will be introduced in the middle of the year.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

It can be used very effectively for that purpose.

Deputy Joe Carey

Will the Tánaiste clarify the Government's plans for the general hospitals throughout the State? This refers to No. 62 on the Government legislation programme, the eligibility for health and personal social services Bill. I am led to believe that the HSE plans to close between four and 12 hospitals across the country because of its budget deficit of €1 billion.

Deputy Phil Hogan

It will be a photo finish.

Deputy Joe Carey

The people of County Clare are concerned that Ennis General Hospital will be one of these. I need a clear statement on this from the Tánaiste.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy cannot get that. He can put that down as a matter on the Adjournment or as a question. The Tánaiste may reply on the legislation.

The Tánaiste

There is no date for that legislation.

Deputy James Reilly

I am sure that the Tánaiste is aware of the maternity hospitals report which suggests that the three hospitals move to new locations beside adult hospitals where all facilities will be available. When will the nurses and midwives Bill come into the House? Will it accommodate new changes, given that in the current financial climate it is most improbable that these moves will happen? These hospitals are bursting at the seams and are barely able to cope. The role of the midwife could be greatly enhanced. Does the Bill take account of that?

The Tánaiste

There is a consultation period on the legislation which will be brought in later this year.

Deputy James Reilly

The education patronage Bill still refers to the provision of primary education by vocational education committees and to empower them to act as patron of a primary school. Educate Together is not mentioned. We have brought this up time and again. When will the legislation come before the House and will it include provision for Educate Together, which has been educating children for the past 30 years and which President McAleese has praised highly?

The Tánaiste

The heads are coming to Government soon so the legislation will be ready later this year.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

The legislation to give effect to the announcement by the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government that he will cap the spending limits for local elections must be enacted a minimum of 60 days before the date of the local elections which means it must be enacted before the beginning of April. When will we see that legislation?

The Tánaiste

The Cabinet approved that legislation this week so it will work within the timeframe the Deputy mentioned.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

I read recently about the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government's plans for the electronic voting machines. I have no doubt that the Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism, Deputy Martin Cullen, who is sitting beside the Tánaiste is well aware of the money wasted on electronic voting machines. He spent €60 million on electronic voting machines and said it was "small change" in his time as the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy must ask a question.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

Would he think the same way in these times?

Will the Tánaiste outline what plans the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Gormley, has for electronic voting machines? This is very important. A brief statement will do.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Kehoe must put down a question to the Minister about that and I am sure he will answer it.

Deputy Enda Kenny

He is never here to answer questions.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy should put down a written question.

Deputy Liz McManus

Earlier this morning the Tánaiste sought regulatory reform and insisted that she was willing to take on ideas from the Opposition. Will she, as Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, deal with the regulation of communications? She is more aware than most that new jobs can be created in the digital sector but the environment needs to be right. If the Government persists with the broadcasting Bill it will unnecessarily establish yet another quango at a time when we need one regulator in the communications sector.

An Ceann Comhairle

This has been discussed.

Deputy Liz McManus

The communications (amendment) regulation Bill refers. Will the Minister take this up with the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources? It makes no sense in this climate for us to pursue the setting up of a separate parallel organisation when we could have one regulator dealing with the technical side of communications and the cultural and content side.

The Tánaiste

The legislation is promised for later in the year and I have been in touch with the Minister to discuss several issues pertaining to the broadcasting Bill.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

On the basis that we are desperately trying to prevent unnecessary expenditure and save the taxpayer from unnecessary debt, I call on the Tánaiste to ask her junior colleague at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment to ensure that Swissco pays its legally binding debts to its employees.

An Ceann Comhairle

There is not a hope we can go into that now.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

It should not fall to the taxpayer to make these payments.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

The Ceann Comhairle should have another look at it.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

Deputy Lynch can praise me any time she likes.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

I would like to raise another issue.

An Ceann Comhairle

The first one was a complete non-runner.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

God loves a trier.

An Ceann Comhairle

I know all that.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

I am trying to save us all from ourselves at this stage. Does the Tánaiste propose to negotiate with the people who are on strike today?

An Ceann Comhairle

No, that is not on.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

Negotiation is needed if we are to ensure we do not do further damage to the economy.

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot deal with that now, as the Deputy knows.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

If workers from a private company were on strike, we would be insisting that they go through the process.

An Ceann Comhairle

There is not a hope that I will allow this matter to be raised.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

Why is the Tánaiste not engaging with these groups to ensure this does not happen again?

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy knows there is not a hope that it can be dealt with now.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

It is outrageous that we are not——

An Ceann Comhairle

There is not a chance.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

——following the rules that we apply to others.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Lynch is well aware that there is another way of raising that matter. If she does that, we will try to ensure she gets to have her say.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

I thank the Ceann Comhairle.

Deputy Pat Breen

I am looking forward to the Tánaiste's visit to Shannon, County Clare, tomorrow morning. I hope she will have some good news in respect of Intel and Shannon Development. I ask the Ceann Comhairle to bear with me as I am about to ask about legislation. While she is in County Clare, perhaps the Tánaiste will take some time to visit Ennis General Hospital to see at first hand the excellent work that is being done by the staff there. This is a question of public health. There are rumours that four of the 12 general hospitals in the country are to be closed.

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot discuss rumours on the Order of Business.

Deputy Pat Breen

It would be useful for the Tánaiste to see at first hand the work being done in Ennis General Hospital.

An Ceann Comhairle

I must move on.

Deputy Pat Breen

She comes from a county that, like County Clare, has significant geographical disadvantages.

An Ceann Comhairle

If the Deputy does not ask a question that is in order, I will have to move on.

Deputy Pat Breen

I am asking about the public health (miscellaneous provisions) Bill.

An Ceann Comhairle

That is very tenuous, to be honest.

Deputy Pat Breen

There needs to be a focus on public health. Perhaps the Tánaiste will take some time off tomorrow to visit the hospital I have mentioned.

The Tánaiste

The heads of the Bill in question are expected shortly. I am sure the Minister of State, Deputy Killeen, and Deputy Dooley will look after me very well tomorrow.

Deputy Pat Breen

The Tánaiste is the No. 2 in the country.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Breen will look after the Tánaiste as well.

The Tánaiste

It is great that they all love me so much.

Deputy Phil Hogan

Arising from Deputy Kehoe's question about electronic voting machines, when will an electoral commission be established, as promised in the programme for Government and as announced by the Minister inside and outside this House?

The Tánaiste

Consultation on that matter is ongoing. No final decision has been made.

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