Vol. 687 No. 3
31 Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment if she will make a statement on the proposed job subsidy scheme which is proposed to form part of the national recovery plan; the types of companies to which it will apply; and the way it will be funded. [27946/09]
The Government is working on the detail of a temporary employment subsidy scheme, the purpose of which will be to help the economy retain its productive capacity and help employers to retain the labour, knowledge and skills of the workforce, thereby supporting a faster return to sustainable growth; help employees to retain their jobs; and ensure that economic and fiscal stability is promoted by avoiding the costs of unemployment, including statutory redundancy payments and the longer-term cost of social welfare.
It is proposed the scheme will involve paying a subsidy to firms to retain a person in employment who may otherwise have been made redundant.
The scheme is intended to apply to companies in the manufacturing or internationally traded service sectors that are currently engaged in exporting. In addition, in order to qualify for support it is intended that a company must not have been in difficulty on 1 July 2008, and a financial assessment must establish that it is now facing such difficulties as a result of the global and financial economic crisis that redundancies are likely to have to be considered within 12 months. It is also intended that a company must also be judged to be viable and capable of growth in the medium term to receive support under the scheme.
I thank the Tánaiste for her answer. I have a number of questions, my first being whether the Tánaiste would be prepared to publish the draft proposal she is making. I have heard it talked about in this House, by Ministers and the Taoiseach in the media, and we know it is being discussed with the social partners. It is certainly being discussed in the media as well. It would be appropriate at this stage and would show respect for the House and for the Opposition if the Minister were prepared to publish the draft of her proposal so that we may all see what is proposed and the potential consequences.
How will the Tánaiste assess which employees would "otherwise be made redundant"? An employment subsidy regime can have a huge deadweight effect if it subsidises jobs which are not in danger. In such cases there is cost to the taxpayer but no jobs are saved. There is also the danger that subsidising a business which is in trouble will simply displace jobs from another business which may be equally in need of subsidy.
I will not be in a position to publish the draft proposals as I must first bring them to my Government colleagues. They will then be made available to the public.
It is proposed that the scheme will be administered by Enterprise Ireland, which has considerable experience of the stabilisation fund and the criteria set down for it, which are deemed appropriate. Those criteria will deal with the issue of deadweight, to which Deputy Varadkar has referred. It is not my intention that companies in the scheme will not be viable. Qualification will be based on viability and on opportunities, particularly for exporting, which will be available to these companies when the market returns to where it needs to be. The assessment will be based on the criteria set down by Enterprise Ireland and by agreement with a national monitoring committee, which will be set up to assure taxpayers and the people involved in the scheme that it will be working and that it is the right thing to do.
It is interesting that the Tánaiste referred to the enterprise stabilisation fund. The proposal, as she outlines it, is similar and will assist the same sort of companies as are already assisted by the enterprise stabilisation fund. That fund is only barely in existence and it is too soon to know whether or not it is effective. I am concerned that the Government is basing a new scheme on one which is only a few months old.
I understand the new scheme will cost approximately €250 million, coming from the surplus in the training levy fund, and will only benefit exporters in the manufacturing or internationally traded sectors. Given that the scheme is restricted to that sector, only a small number of workers will benefit from it. People in construction, services, retail and other sectors will not benefit. Only a small number of business and workers will benefit but all workers and businesses will have to pay. Could that €250 million not be more effectively used to do some of the things Fine Gael has proposed, such as reducing both rates of VAT, abolishing the travel tax and introducing an exemption from employers' PRSI for employers who take on new staff? Such a measure would benefit all businesses, consumers and workers and would save more jobs. The Government's targeted subsidy approach will only benefit a small select area.
I am disappointed to hear the Deputy, once again, oppose many of the Government's proposals.
When the Tánaiste publishes her proposals I will tell her whether or not we oppose them. She will not publish them.
The proposals deal with the sustainability of the many enterprises we have and where we will have opportunities to sustain and grow employment. The targeted group consists of approximately 3,600 agency listed clients involving almost 300,000 people. It includes ICT, food, chemicals, medical devices and many others. It is important that we target these industries where there are specific opportunities.
It is only 10% of the economy. What about the other 90%?
Many other proposals are being worked through other parts of the economy. This is only one part of the solution to the difficulties we face. There is a suite of Government proposals, including pilot schemes which we hope will work out well. Pilot schemes such as the graduate placement programme and the training initiative for people in part-time work, which was proposed by the Labour Party, need to be evaluated. I hope they will prove successful. I also hope the new job subsidy scheme will work. The feedback from the stabilisation fund has been nothing but positive.
32 Deputy Willie Penrose asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment if her attention has been drawn to the recent report published by ISME which found that 50% of firms surveyed had applied for credit and had been refused by their banks; the steps she is taking to address this situation; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [27643/09]
I am aware of various surveys carried out by ISME. The results of individual surveys from the enterprise and banking sectors can be useful in highlighting the generality of the credit supply issue but they must all be examined in the context in which they are carried out and the methodologies applied.
The banks' recapitalisation package was about securing the long-term health of the economy and about enabling our banks to get back to the business of lending to viable projects and about saving jobs. The package includes many supports for small and medium enterprises, SMEs. The recapitalised banks have committed to increasing their lending capacity to SMEs by 10% over 2008. This should ensure that sound businesses will receive support from their banks. A €100 million environmental and clean energy innovation fund is also being established by each bank as well as a further €15 million each to new or existing seed capital funds. Much of this funding will flow to small and medium enterprises. SMEs are also covered by the code of conduct on business lending to SMEs. This code which was published by the Financial Regulator came into effect from 13 March 2009. The application of the code will promote fairness and transparency in the treatment of SMEs by the banks and should facilitate access to credit for sustainable and productive business propositions. Allied Irish Banks, Bank of Ireland and Ulster Bank will also provide funding for SMEs on foot of €300 million facilities provided by the European Investment Bank to assist developing SMEs.
The recapitalised banks agreed to pay for and co-operate with the carrying out of an independent review of bank lending to SMEs. Additional banks have now participated in this review with the result that the five major lending banks are now included. The purpose of the review is to ascertain the position on credit availability to SMEs here and to recommend appropriate action to improve credit availability. The independent review has now been submitted to my colleague, the Minister for Finance, and will be published shortly. I welcome the completion of this review as it should allow all stakeholders an objective view of the state of lending from the banks to SMEs and provide some clarity on the level of credit being declined.
Arising from the recapitalisation package, the Tánaiste, along with my colleague the Minister for Finance, also established a credit supply clearing group with bank, business (including ISME and SFA) and State representation.
Additional information not given on the floor of the House.
This group is responsible for identifying patterns of events where the flow of credit to viable businesses appears to be blocked and for seeking to identify credit supply solutions relating to these patterns. The group is, however, not an appeals mechanism for cases where credit has been refused by the banks. Individual business decisions remain the responsibility of the banks. The credit supply clearing group is being chaired by my Department and will work to provide a clear picture of any emerging lending patterns while facilitating direct discussion by all the relevant interests in addressing problems. The group met for the first time on 28 May 2009 and will meet again shortly following the publication of the independent review of bank credit.
To assist and complement the work of the credit supply clearing group, I have held seven regional meetings, beginning in Cork on Monday 29 June, to discuss with representatives of business, banks and the State sector, their experience of gaining access to bank credit at local and regional level. I have, to date, held meetings in Cork, Waterford, Dublin, Bundoran, Shannon, Galway and Athlone. The last meeting will be held in Dundalk on Monday next 13 July. In the course of these meetings I met with local representatives of the major banks, business representatives from local chambers of commerce, ISME, SFA, IFA and the Irish Hotels Federation. Local representatives from the various State agencies, such as Enterprise Ireland, city and county enterprise boards and Fáilte Ireland, also attended. The outcome of these meetings should facilitate a greater understanding of the issue at both regional and national levels.
Outside of the banking sphere, my Department's continuous support for enterprises arises through maintaining a positive business environment and through particular interventions from the State development agencies such as Enterprise Ireland, FÁS and the county and city enterprise boards. The significant allocations in my Department's Estimates for 2009 for the development agencies ensures that we can continue to build on this strategy for the future.
The Department has also introduced formal arrangements to reduce the payment period by central Departments to their business suppliers from 30 to 15 calendar days. This commitment has effect on all valid invoices received on and from 15 June 2009 and should help ease cash flow difficulties for SMEs.
The Minister of State will note that the focus of this question is jobs. It is important that money flows to create new jobs and to sustain and retain existing jobs.
Ordinary people and owners of small businesses are saying banks are running rings round the Government. They got huge funding for recapitalisation with no lending conditions attached. There is a credit famine which knows no bounds. Overdraft facilities are being withdrawn or renegotiated, loans are not being given or are given with huge conditions attached. Additional security is demanded and punitive charges imposed. Is the Minister of State concerned that banks are refusing to lend to 50% of small firm applicants and of the impact this credit famine is having on small businesses?
The Minister of State and the Tánaiste doubted the ISME survey. I will bring them up to date. Does the Minister of State also doubt the county enterprise survey? Mr. Michael Tunney, chairperson of the CEB network says, "If the situation continues many good businesses will be forced to close as a result".
The number in receivership in the first half of the year has quadrupled. Some 523 companies are involved in liquidation, the highest since records began. Business closures outnumber formations for the first time since 2003. The Minister of State may doubt the ISME survey. Does he also doubt the county and city enterprise boards, which relay these figures to the Minister of State's Department?
The Minister of State launched a credit evaluation programme in Cork on 29 June. What did he hear from that programme which is inconsistent with what ISME and the CEB is telling him? What is going on? Why will the Minister of State not tell banks to release credit to businesses which need it?
I am well aware of the survey. Mr. Mark Fielding, CEO of ISME attended one of the seminars I held in Dublin to discuss the whole issue. I have also met the county enterprise boards and chambers of commerce throughout the country. We invited regional bank representatives and the representatives of broader industry from farming to the chambers of commerce to the seven meetings to date.
I have an in-depth knowledge of the difficulties facing small and medium-sized businesses, SMEs, but we must put such matters in context. The most important decision to provide credit to SMEs was the bank guarantee of 30 September 2008, which was intended to stabilise financial institutions. Subsequently, we recapitalised the two main banks and nationalised Anglo Irish Bank. In light of the recapitalisation, we introduced a code of conduct in respect of lending to SMEs whereby the banks are obliged to have a capacity 10% greater than their 2008 lending figures.
We are conscious of the SMEs' difficulties in accessing credit, but there is a fundamental issue that we should discuss at a later date, that is, normal lending practices stopped some years ago. This is a fact. Credit was generously and easily handed out. SMEs must now submit projections and cash flow plans whereas submitting audited accounts to managers used to be sufficient to receive extra credit facilities. There is a tightening, but we must ensure we can wean the country from excessive lending practices to sustainable practices and that, in the meantime, SMEs are not hurt. With most of these exercises, the Government and every Deputy present have one purpose in mind, that is, the retention and protection of jobs.
Absolutely. We can concur on that objective, but I want to ask a related question. Into what black hole did the €350 million that was to be made available by the European Investment Bank, EIB, disappear? It does not appear to be going where it was intended or was Mr. Fielding out of date when he stated that some banks were ignoring EIB funds for SMEs, that two thirds of bank staff had no knowledge of those funds and that many of them did not know what was the SME lending code? Are the rescued banks snubbing the Government? Now that they have the capital, are they trying to run the show their way on the basis that, even though the State was fairly good to them, that was nine months ago whereas they are now where they want to be and will tighten up the rules, thereby letting businesses go to the wall?
This is a matter of jobs. Thousands of jobs are being lost in the retail, manufacturing and technology sectors. Every sector, including hotels, is being hit by this situation. Why are the banks not lending the promised €350 million to SMEs at reduced interest rates?
As I stated at the outset, ISME's survey was useful in that context. Mr. Fielding raised this issue at one of our seminars and the banks gave an undertaking they would re-advertise through their staff or inform their staff of the importance of the EIB's funding. The major banks have drawn down the funding. It is not for normal credit and short-term working capital, as criteria apply. It is for long-term working capital and liquidity purposes. The major banks were in discussions with the EIB. At a fine meeting this morning in Athlone in the Deputy's county, I met some people who spoke highly of him——
I am glad to hear that.
——and other Deputies.
I know that, too.
The EIB's money will begin to flow into businesses quickly. The banks took on board views expressed at the regional seminars and in ISME's survey and undertook to educate their staff regarding the EIB's funding.
33 Deputy Denis Naughten asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment her views on the fact that the standard of Irish science, engineering and technology graduates is high enough for industry and enterprise based here; her policy on awarding work authorisations for third country science, engineering and technology workers; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [27943/09]
The proportion of students studying science and mathematics at junior and leaving certificate levels has been stable since 2001 and Ireland ranks as one of the leading countries in the European Union in terms of science, mathematics and computing graduates. However, in terms of engineering graduates, Ireland is ranked well below the EU 15 average. This is a direct consequence of the prominence within Ireland's higher education system of science compared to engineering.
The National Skills Bulletin 2009 published last Friday by the Expert Group on Future Skills Needs, EGFSN, concluded that skill shortages persist within the economy and have been identified in the specialised high-skill areas of IT, science, sales-marketing, health, accountancy, engineering and management. Demand is confined to those with third level qualifications and with specific expertise and experience. For example, companies are still finding it difficult to source advanced IT system management skills, experienced engineers for the development and implementation of lean manufacturing processes and scientific technicians for the development and prototyping of specific medical devices.
Government employment permit policy is to ensure that general labour and skills needs are met from within the workforce of the EU. Employment permits will issue only in respect of non-EEA citizens on a vacancy specific basis where skills or labour shortages in areas strategic to the economy exist. The majority of employment permits in strategic high-skill areas are facilitated by way of our green card permit scheme. Green cards may issue in respect of vacancies where the salary on offer is at least €60,000 per annum or in respect of any occupation where the salary is in excess of €30,000 per annum provided that occupation is listed on a green card occupation list maintained by the Department. This list of occupations eligible for a green card has been recently reduced to reflect labour market conditions. The main categories are IT, health care, industry, education and finance.
In addition, the researcher mobility hosting agreement scheme, which provides for the entry into the State of researchers from third countries under Council Directive 2005/71/EC, has been operating successfully since 2007 with some 570 hosting agreements issued to researchers, representing more than 59 nationalities. Some 18 third level institutes and one private enterprise have been accredited to issue hosting agreements under the scheme. In addition, a hosting agreement extranet was established enabling relevant key departments, such as immigration authorities, embassies and consulates, access to an electronic database, thus expediting immigration procedures for third country researchers. Under both of the above schemes, the person will be allowed fast-track access to the long-term residence status to be provided under the Immigration, Residence and Protection Bill 2008.
I thank the Minister of State for his response and compliment the steps taken to fast-track specific positions. I wish to flag an issue, namely, a comparison in the recently published Quarterly National Household Survey, which showed a decrease of 9,000 Irish nationals employed in the professional, scientific and technical sectors up to the end of the first quarter of 2009. During the same period, the number of employees from the EU 14 countries and third countries increased by 2,000 and 1,000, respectively. It would be worrying were this trend to continue, given the Government's planned significant investment in the smart economy and the Minister of State's comments last week to the effect that €100 million in EU research funding is entering Ireland per week.
The concern is that we are not producing graduates to a high enough standard to fulfil the roles being created. We must address this concern in terms of our education system and its focus on maths. The Minister for Education and Science has suggested a loan scheme for third level students. Elsewhere, this has been shown to force many people with technical skills out of their countries. Has the potential impact on retaining such skills been evaluated?
The Quarterly National Household Survey is an interesting reflection of what is occurring in the labour market, but we can do nothing about the 2,000 people from the EU. If 1,000 people from outside the EU are securing jobs in the categories in question, we must examine the matter, but there are schemes whereby third country nationals can enter Ireland where——
It seems strange, given that we are discussing 9,000 of our own people.
——skill shortages have been identified. In the IT, banking and many other sectors, specific skills are required that are not available in the Irish labour market. Obviously, a stringent test is applied to employers who make this case. It is not true that employers can lightly invoke the reason of skill shortages. Rather, they must rigorously prove that an appropriate person is not available or cannot be accessed within the domestic or EEA labour market.
Deputy Naughten is correct concerning the issues regarding science and maths. There is a considerable difficulty associated with the quality and standard of leaving certificate and university students in the area of science and maths. It is a very considerable problem in that only 16% of the leaving certificate cohort take higher level maths.
Bearing in mind the Minister of State's previous and current roles and the fact that the quarterly national household survey shows 3,700 people from outside the European Union fall into the category in question, some of whom I hope will remain in Ireland and establish new businesses that may become the Intels of tomorrow, will the Minister of State examine the eight-month delay in the approval of business permits for people who have a good idea, want to develop it into a viable business and employ Irish people? I have asked the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment about this previously. One third of the applications are being abandoned because of the long delay in processing them.
I have obviously discussed that with my colleagues. The Minister of State, Deputy Billy Kelleher, in his previous remit, examined the issue of work permits very carefully. I reassure Deputies——
The Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform.
——that where it can be proven that an issue arises in respect of our own people — unemployed or otherwise — not being able to gain access to our labour market owing to people coming in from outside the European Union, it will be investigated vigorously. We do not want to be importing labour from outside the European Economic Area. We would investigate every matter in this regard, particularly the eight-month delay about which the Deputy spoke.
34 Deputy Deirdre Clune asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment if she is satisfied her financial and policy-related oversight of FÁS in the past ten years was sufficient in view of recent examples of practices and programmes that did not show value for taxpayers’ money; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [27944/09]
My Department and I closely monitor the operation of FÁS and the implementation of its labour market programmes. The medium-term policy direction of FÁS is set out in its multi-annual statement of strategy, which is developed in close co-operation with officials in my Department. Overall responsibility for the management of FÁS lies with its board. Its internal governance structures include an executive board comprising the director general and seven assistant directors general. The executive board reports to the senior board.
Senior officials from my Department meet senior executives in FÁS on a regular basis to maintain the alignment of Government policy with programme delivery. In addition, a senior official from my Department is a member of the board of FÁS. The budget for FÁS is agreed on the basis of detailed discussions between FÁS, my Department and the Department of Finance in the context of the annual Estimates process. The allocation of funding to FÁS is aligned to Government policy in the context of the provision of active labour market supports to meet the changing needs of the labour market.
The annual financial accounts of FÁS are audited by the Comptroller and Auditor General. These accounts include a number of statements relating to financial compliance, which form part of the FÁS annual report and, in accordance with the provisions of the Labour Services Act 1987, are presented to me by FÁS and laid before the Houses of the Oireachtas.
When issues of concern relating to expenditure in FÁS were brought to my attention following my appointment as Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment last year, I acted quickly to seek assurances from FÁS that the issues highlighted by the Comptroller and Auditor General's value for money report had been addressed. I then proceeded to request the Comptroller and Auditor General to carry out an examination of the activities of the FÁS corporate affairs division since 2000 and to report on the effectiveness of management and control systems across the FÁS organisation. I have recently received a report from the Comptroller and Auditor General that deals with the examination of advertising and promotion in FÁS and it forms part of this investigation. This report will be laid before the House in due course.
In addition, my Department is currently carrying out a review into the active labour market programmes funded by my Department, including those delivered by FÁS. The review focuses on the efficiency and effectiveness of these programmes in the context of current labour market policy changes and challenges. The review will draw conclusions on the balance of resources and the rationale for the allocation of public funding in the context of current and future labour market policy challenges, including the implementation of the national skills strategy. It is expected that these conclusions will inform policy decisions on the allocation of funding in the context of the Estimates campaigns of 2010 and future years.
The FÁS Science Challenge programme was established in 2003 and was described as being part of the Government's effort to promote science, engineering and ICT. Another programme, Discover Science and Engineering, was also established in 2003 with the objective of promoting awareness of science and engineering. Science Foundation Ireland was established formally in 2003 and has a similar remit. It was recently brought to our attention that the FÁS Science Challenge programme was investigated on the initiative of the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment and abandoned. An official of Science Foundation Ireland stated the programme was characterised by a lack of data on objectives and what was intended to be delivered.
The Department, in terms of its role of overseeing investment in science and technology, was throwing money like confetti at a wedding at various different programmes, with no targets——
The question is on FÁS.
I am talking about FÁS.
I believed the Deputy was talking about Science Foundation Ireland.
I am talking about that also; it has similar projects. Science Foundation Ireland was involved in a review of FÁS's Science Challenge programme.
Bearing in mind all the various programmes that were supposed to encourage people to become involved in science, technology, engineering and ICT, what was occurring in the Department? The programmes were all going in different directions and vast quantities of taxpayers' money were spent on all of them.
We had better differentiate between the FÁS programme and that of Science Foundation Ireland. The latter has been absolutely superb, not without the Minister of State and me keeping a cute eye on expenditure and determining where commercialisation opportunities arise. Our focus is certainly on enterprise.
The Science Challenge programme was established to encourage education and research and, eventually, high-level careers in science, engineering and technology. This is what we wanted but, unfortunately, on the basis of expenditure, value for money analysis and outputs, I felt the programme needed to be reappraised. On receiving the result of the reappraisal on my behalf by the Department, FÁS, Forfás and Science Foundation Ireland and senior officials from the Higher Education Authority, I decided immediately that although the programme was beneficial in one way, it certainly did not work within the remit of FÁS and was not good value for money. It is on this basis that I decided not to continue with the programme. I have instructed my officials to secure the orderly wind-down of the programme.
There are a number of initiatives, contacts and opportunities within the programme that can be availed of by people such as Professor Frank Gannon of Science Foundation Ireland with a view to considering other types of opportunities. In the context of the challenges that arise at present, FÁS would be best to focus on the unemployed. We must continue to train those who are employed to increase productivity. I decided on the basis of the views brought to my attention that we would not proceed with the programme.
The Discover Science and Engineering programme and the FÁS Science Challenge programme seemed to be operating at the same time. Was the latter operating under Government approval? Will the Minister be publishing the report thereon?
I asked for the evaluation within my own Department. I would have to consider whether I should publish it. The most important point is that I made a decision on it as soon as I received it, and we are progressing accordingly. As everyone knows, on the basis of matters that were brought to my attention, investigations have been carried out. The Comptroller and Auditor General carried out an investigation on my behalf in consultation with the Committee of Public Accounts and a further investigation will be carried out. It is my clear intention to consider new measures that can be delivered by FÁS and its board in addition to new corporate governance measures. The latter have been introduced at my behest and they will need to be appraised once I receive the final report from the Comptroller and Auditor General.
35 Deputy Damien English asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment the average time taken by her to pay out redundancy payments upon receipt of an application for support; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [27945/09]
The considerable increase in the number of redundancy payment claims lodged with the redundancy payments section of my Department in the latter part of 2008, and to date in 2009, is unprecedented and is giving rise to delays in the processing of redundancy payments for individuals and companies within acceptable timeframes. The scale of the challenge is evident from the statistics for the first half of 2009, which indicate that the number of new claims lodged with my Department stands at 42,724, an increase of 160% over the equivalent period last year. Moreover, claims lodged at this half-year point now exceed the total number of claims received for the full year 2008, which, of itself, was an exceptional year by comparison with earlier years when claims received were of the order of 25,000 or less.
I am acutely aware of the difficulties the inability to deliver an acceptable turnaround of redundancy rebate payments is giving rise to for both individual employees and the business community. Together, we have taken and continue to take all possible steps to address the issues. Measures already taken include the reassignment of 19.7 additional staff, full-time equivalents, from other areas of the Department to the redundancy payments area since early 2009 with ongoing review of trends and demands; the prioritisation of the Department's overtime budget towards staff in redundancy payments section to tackle the backlog outside normal hours; the establishment of a special call handling facility to deal with the huge volume of telephone calls from people and businesses who are naturally concerned about their payments, using the facilities and co-operation of the National Employment Rights Authority, NERA; and the provision of better quality information on current processing times on the Department's website. This enables the staff in the redundancy payments area to concentrate on and prioritise the processing of redundancy payment claims.
The average time it takes to process rebate applications from employers filed on-line is six months while claims submitted by post take seven months. In respect of lump sum payments paid directly to employees in instances where the employers are unable to pay the statutory redundancy entitlements, the current processing time, assuming all of the necessary supporting documentation is filed, is between six and eight weeks.
I agree with the Deputy that this is totally unacceptable and that is why I have streamlined a transfer of my human resources, and, to the disgruntlement of every member of my staff all of my overtime budget, to deal with this inordinate difficulty. I appreciate that it is not good enough and we will do all that we can to correct this as quickly as possible.
I thank the Minister for her full reply. I will not be as grouchy as usual because I got a good answer this time. Did the Minister say that the Minister of State sitting beside her had ‘cute' eyes or ‘acute' eyes or is keeping ‘a cute eye' on something?
Acute eyes.
The Deputy should wait until Saturday night.
I should have said sharp eyes. He is cute all right but not in that way.
I would not like the other Minister of State, Deputy Conor Lenihan, to be jealous.
I accept why there is a problem. Allocating 19 extra staff is a good move but the figures have been very high for the past six months and will unfortunately be just as high if not higher for the next six months. Can anything else be done to reduce those waiting times? The Minister has said that a six or seven month wait is not acceptable. It is a massive jump from six weeks and is not good enough. We know that businesses are under great pressure. They cannot get money from banks or from their customers or even from the Department. The small sums, €1,000, €2,000 or €3,000, are a great deal of money. They need that just to pay some of the bills each week. It is very serious. Does the Minister have any statistics on the average sum in rebates owing to companies and if so could she furnish them to me later?
Is it possible, in prioritising those to whom money is owed, to examine the serious cases that are owed a large sum of money because some businesses are under immense pressure to get the money back? They are legally obliged to pay it out and do so as the person leaves the premises. We must work with them on this because it is not acceptable that they must wait six or seven months, which could become eight or nine months in some cases. I will not argue with the Minister because she has given a fair answer, and has admitted it but we must do more to address the problem. The Minister needs another plan A to deal with this for the future.
The Deputy is right. Had we discussed this four or five years ago the complaint would have been that the work permit section was not delivering quickly enough. We have transferred many of those people to the redundancy section. Following further meetings with the Minister of State, Deputy Calleary, we have not just added 20 staff but transferred an additional 14. I have also requested another staff transfer which I believe the Minister for Health and Children will facilitate with an additional ten people to effect that transformation as quickly as possible. We will also use NERA so that people can do the work while someone else answers the telephone.
I do not disagree. I know that everybody is crying out for the few euro to which they are entitled, for one reason or another. We have met several businesses which have asked us to transfer the money to the Revenue Commissioners to get these people off their backs. We have facilitated that on an individual basis but only with the client's imprimatur. We continue to do all we can to try to deal with this problem.
I hope that the Deputy will be proved wrong about the number of redundancy notices that have been put in. There was a high number between January and March of this year but we will do all we can. If other ideas, or initiatives that need to be taken, I will be forthcoming. One suggestion was that we outsource this work but I have not yet come to a final agreement on that but if necessary it is another option.
Have the deals with the Revenue Commissioners begun yet? It was agreed that something would happen but is it happening? Is that only a PRSI offset or can they offset other taxes due?
Although we do not have electronic funds transfer from one to the other we do facilitate a full offset, at the employer's request, of the amount against its tax liability.
Is that regardless of the tax category?
Yes. The Revenue Commissioners do not mind.
