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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 2 May 2012

Vol. 764 No. 1

Leaders’ Questions

As the Taoiseach is aware, a transformation has occurred in the treatment of cancer in the past decade, with outcomes and survival rates improving. Skin cancer is very common in Ireland because the majority of people have fair skin. Over 1,200 people were diagnosed with malignant melanoma in 2008 alone. Fortunately, the majority of skin cancers are treatable, but metastatic melanoma is one of the deadliest forms and more common among younger people. The latest drug - Ipi or Ipiluminab - is highly successful in treating this type of melanoma. It is the most significant breakthrough drug to be produced in 30 years for the treatment of serious skin cancers and has been classified as twice as effective as the nearest competitor drug. Nevertheless, it is not being provided or funded by the Minister or the Department of Health. This is despite the fact that the National Cancer Control Programme recommended to the HSE in January that the drug be made available. It has been approved by the European drugs agency. Irish clinicians have confirmed that the delay is having devastating consequences for Irish patients with advanced melanoma. There are at least 16 patients awaiting the drug treatment, some of whom have articulated their frustration, despair and disbelief on Joe Duffy's "Liveline" programme that the health service is denying access to the drug. The treatment is available in the United Kingdom, Switzerland, Austria and other European countries. How many patients must die before the Government will sanction use of the drug in the health service?

A number of friends and acquaintances of mine have died during the years from melanoma, an horrific ailment to contract. The Minister for Health, Deputy Jame Reilly, is in negotiations with the drugs companies on a range of new drugs deemed either to be preventive or life-saving across a broad spectrum. There is a process to be followed in releasing drugs to the market. Ipiluminab is on release in the United Kingdom on trial, but was refused in Australia. The cost estimate per person is approximately €85,000. I have spoken to the Minister as the matter was raised previously and he is confident of securing a conclusion to the negotiations in the not too distant future. On the consequences of treating persons with the drug, the evidence is that for one in ten there is a really good reprieve, depending on circumstances, while in other cases, there is a shorter term reprieve. I am glad the Deputy has raised the matter and the Minister is well aware of the interest in the drug and the consequences of its use. There is an issue of the cost involved and the Minister is negotiating with the relevant companies. I understand a conclusion will be reached quickly, allowing the drug to be released to the market.

I do not entirely accept the veracity of the Taoiseach's reply. One of the country's great strengths was its facilitation of breakthrough drugs, particularly in oncology and cardiology. We are known for having this strength because breakthrough drugs become commonplace in time. The European drugs agency approved this treatment across Europe last July and the drug is available in the United Kingdom and Holland, the home of the universal health insurance scheme which the Taoiseach has lauded. Patients have been denied access to it for too long.

Through the National Cancer Control Programme we have radically changed the provision of advanced cancer care. Access to breakthrough drugs, even in clinical trials, forms a critical part of that approach in seeking better outcomes and survival rates. Senator John Crown, a cancer specialist, is on record confirming the efficacy of this treatment among his patients. Will the Taoiseach intervene to ensure the drug is made available and that the policy environment and framework will encourage the use of breakthrough drugs in the proper context? This is the best way to ensure even better outcomes and survival rates for Irish patients in the weeks, months and years to come.

It is not that there has been a deliberate hold-up. The Minister for Finance, Deputy Michael Noonan, started the national care strategy many years ago when he was responsible for dealing with health matters. Ireland has always been to the fore in the use of breakthrough drugs. The drug is available at other locations, but one does not qualify for reimbursement of the cost. The intention is to have the drug released and the cost reimbursed here. It is also important to note that there are different classes and categories of other drugs available, of which the Deputy is aware. There is a process to be adhered to and that is happening. There are discussions taking place between the Minister for Health and the agency involved. The intention is to release the drug for reimbursement and to conclude that as quickly as possible. I am aware of the interest expressed in it by people throughout the country, especially those who have had loved ones suffer as a consequence of this disease, and we want it clearly understood this country will continue to be at the forefront in the use of breakthrough drugs, but a process must be gone through. For those who prescribe this drug at the end of the day, it is important, given the cost structure outlined, to negotiate to get the best result for the patients who will use it.

It has been known about for the past two years.

In thanking the Deputy for raising this, I would like him to understand that the drug is due for release and, when it is, it will also be reimbursable, which is important, because this is different from what applies in other countries where it may be available but not for reimbursement.

Tá a lán saoránaigh faoi bhrú mór ag an achar deacair seo agus tá sé mar seo le blianta anois. An gcuimhin leis an Taoiseach an toghchán agus an five point plan a bhí aige? Dúirt sé go bhfeidhmeodh a Rialtas ar dhóigh dhifriúil agus go mbeadh difríocht mhór idir Fine Gael-Páirtí an Lucht Oibre agus Fianna Fáil. Dúirt sé go mbeadh sé macánta le saoránaigh.

The Government's austerity programme is causing huge hardship. It is clear austerity is not working with 500,000 people unemployed, tens of thousands emigrating and families struggling to pay bills. Under the programme, this will continue for a three years and there will be another €8.6 billion in cuts and tax increases. Citizens want to know where this money will come from. Where will the Government get the money to pay for the guards, nurses and public services?

Not from the Northern Bank anyway.

How will the Government pay for the austerity treaty?

Will the Deputy please tell us how he will pay for his alternative?

Will the Taoiseach please tell the citizens the real cost of this treaty, how his Government will pay for it and how many more cuts or tax increases such as household and septic tank charges will be introduced to pay for austerity, particularly when it clearly is not working?

Is maith is cuimhin liom an plean cúig phointe a bhí ag ár bpáirtí roimh an toghchán agus is maith is cuimhin liom an toghchán. Is cuimhin liom na nithe a raibh an Teachta féin ag caint faoi. Agus an Teachta ag rá go mbeadh difríocht ann idir sinn féin agus páirtí an Fhreasúra, is cinnte go bhfuil neart pointí éagsúlachta ann.

Cad é an difríocht?

Tá a fhios ag an Teachta go maith go bhfuil an tAire Airgeadais ag plé lena chomhghleacaithe san Eoraip ó thaobh athruithe ar an phlean a leag an troika amach agus go bhfuil athrú i gceist ag an troika. Tá a fhios ag an Teachta gur luaigh mé iad seo sa Dáil.

The Deputy always speaks of austerity. Yesterday, he said it was quite bizarre that comments should be made by myself and Deputy Martin in respect of supporting the fiscal stability treaty because of the clear opportunity to keep confidence levels for investment in Ireland high. The Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation is in the United States with Industrial Development Authority officials talking to a range of companies that are considering investing in Europe. The reason they want to consider Ireland is the package we offer in terms of our tax system, technological capacity, talent and track record in meeting every objective and bar that has been set. The Deputy has first-hand evidence of that in his town of Dundalk where PayPal decided to add 1,000 jobs. He found the discussion I had with Deputy Martin and the comments we made quite bizarre. I do not understand that.

Every job created in the country as a result of investment from abroad reduces our deficit by €20,000 and, therefore, the announcement of 1,000 new jobs means a €20 million reduction and 5,000 jobs means a €100 million reduction. I have made these announcements because of decisions made by investors abroad in the recent past such as PayPal, Apple, Cisco, Eli Lilly, Mylan, Microsoft, HP and so on. They have made decisions to invest their money in various locations in this country where people will have gainful employment and can make a contribution to their local economy and to their own lives and families. That is not austerity.

We have set out our plan for growth to deal with our budgetary strategy in the years ahead but it is important people understand the reality that a "Yes" vote will lead to confidence and further investment and, as a consequence, more jobs. That means the deficit will be reduced and it will be easier for Government to plan a way forward between rectifying our public finances, stabilising our debt and growing our economy. I therefore do not accept the argument put forward by the Deputy at all. There are good reasons for voting "Yes" to this treaty. The first is the continuation of the line of investment in Ireland. The second is the introduction of good housekeeping rules as we get our own house in order and the third is the permanent backstop of the European Stability Mechanism, which will be available to countries that ratify the treaty,

Those companies in the US today that are considering investment in Europe want to look at a country that has confidence in itself, the eurozone and the European Union. That is where we stand, and even if the Deputy's heart is not in this argument, he has first hand evidence in Dundalk that investors have put their money where their mouths are in his constituency and his town. Young men and women will be the gainful beneficiaries of that, and fair play to them.

I welcomed and I also commended the Government-----

So keep it going.

Any new jobs coming in is obviously good. Like others in the Sinn Féin ranks, we work to try to bring jobs into our constituencies. The Taoiseach ignored the question. I asked him how he would pay for this treaty. The Government has to find €8.6 billion in cuts and taxes. An additional €6 billion will be needed if the people are tricked or bullied by his Minister for hardship and others into voting "Yes". The Taoiseach has also failed to tell people that we have to pay €11 billion into the ESM.

I found it bizarre to listen to the Taoiseach and Teachta Martin discussing this issue because his party caused the economic collapse. Teachta Martin cannot even persuade his own party to vote "Yes" so I thought it was bizarre listening to the two of them chatting.

Can we have a question?

What both of them have in common is they are on the same road. There is no talk now about the Taoiseach's five point plan, only rhetoric about a jobs stimulus. This is where Sinn Féin parts company with everybody else. One cannot cut one's way out of recession.

Sinn Féin is all things to everyone.

Could I have the Deputy's question? He is over time.

One cannot cut one's way out of recession. Jobs are needed. People need to be taken off the dole and this austerity treaty will cost the taxpayers more than they have had to pay at this point in time. The Taoiseach should answer the question. How will he find all these billions of euro to pay for the treaty?

Is that from the money grows on trees school of political wisdom?

I thought Deputy Shatter was going to stay out of the campaign.

I thought he was supposed to be on holidays.

Please allow the Taoiseach to reply.

I am delighted to hear the Deputy is interested is seeing that gardaí, nurses and teachers can be paid. There was a time when he did not have that interest in the gardaí in the past.

And a few members of the Government as well.

We set out our budgetary plan. We are in a programme for two years and, under the excessive deficit procedure, we want to have our deficit down to 3% by 2015. I do not accept the Deputy's argument about the need for €6 billion beyond that because there will be a corrective period beyond 2015 where the methodologies that will be put forward by Ireland will deal with that issue-----

Answer the question.

-----because we want as many people off the live register as possible and in gainful employment. The figures for the live register for April this year stand at 430,000, which is much too high. It represents a decrease of over 4,000 in a month and a decrease of 9,500 in the year.

How many are abroad?

Why not ask how many are employed?

The figure is much too high but, as I said to the Deputy, every job that is created in this country reduces our deficit by €20,000. The continued stream of investment is very important. Since Deputy Adams began his career in politics-----

A long time ago.

-----he and his party have opposed every single European treaty.

And we were right.

(Interruptions).

They do not believe in the eurozone, they do not believe in the euro, they do not believe in the European Union-----

We do not believe in you, Taoiseach.

If they follow their own logic, they do not believe that companies abroad should invest in this country and should put 1,000 jobs up in Deputy Adam's own town. What kind of political philosophy have they got?

They do not work.

However, you have to balance your books and, treaty or no treaty, we have to balance our own public finances.

How is the Government going to pay for it?

How would Sinn Féin pay for anything?

Order, please.

I want Deputy Adams to understand this. The European Central Bank, as he knows, has put €150 billion in liquidity into the Irish system. The Government has set out its projections for growth and our views on no further taxes on employment and work. This treaty is not a panacea for all of Europe's problems-----

Then vote "No".

It is one of the tools that are needed to restore stability, to bring back competitiveness and to bring about employment and social cohesion. That is why we have always been up-front with the people in saying that, in parallel with this, we do need the agenda of growth, investment and opportunity.

Deputies

Hear, hear.

That is where this Government is focused and that is where we have convinced our European colleagues at leadership level that this should apply for every meeting of the European Council in future.

Where is the money?

As I said yesterday, I support every other leader who is now saying we need a parallel growth and investment strategy so jobs can be created.

Deputies

Hear, hear.

I recognise, as the Deputy does, that when other economies in Europe are thriving, it is good for Ireland as an exporting nation because they can buy our products and goods, and that means jobs, job creation, investment and opportunities here at home.

(Interruptions).

The Deputies are clapping for austerity.

Order, please. I again remind Members they are in Parliament. I call Deputy Boyd Barrett.

Here is Sinn Féin light.

The Government and the Taoiseach have shown great urgency in ramming through legislation to impose austerity and cuts on working people in this country. With his new best pals in Fianna Fáil, he is showing great energy and enthusiasm in pushing through the austerity treaty.

Did the Deputy ever hear of the national interest - or just his own?

Where is his energy and urgency when it comes to protecting worker's rights in this country? Over the past year we have seen a litany of cases where workers in Jane Norman, La Senza, Lagan Brick, Vita Cortex, Game and Connolly Shoes in my constituency have been treated with despicable contempt by rogue employers. The latest victim of rogue employers and the Government failure to protect workers are 110 workers in Irish Cement working in counties Limerick and Meath. These workers have for three decades not been involved in any industrial action but were forced out on strike on 3 April because Irish Cement has refused to pay a Labour Court-recommended set of bonuses to the workers. This is despite the fact the workers agreed to a rationalisation programme three years ago, cut 33% of their staff and raised productivity by 40%.

What is positively disturbing about Irish Cement's failure to pay these workers the money it owes them is that the parent company of Irish Cement is Cement Roadstone Holdings, CRH, one of the largest building materials companies in the world-----

A question, please.

-----one of the biggest companies in the country and one of the most profitable. Last year CRH boosted its profits by 33% to nearly €750 million-----

Sorry, Deputy. Will you put a question?

-----and its CEO, Mr. Myles Lee, was paid €2.4 million in salary and bonuses. A third of that, his salary alone, would pay the workers the moneys they are owed.

Will the Taoiseach condemn Irish Cement and CRH for their despicable treatment of these workers and tell them to pay the money these workers are owed, as the Labour Court has recommended? Will he pull in the CEO of CRH and Irish Cement and point out to them that they have benefited from €220 million in free profits given to them by this State in carbon credits, a scandal in itself?

Thank you, Deputy.

As the Taoiseach of the country, will he insist those workers are paid and allowed to return to work, where they want to be?

Does the Deputy want us to nationalise it?

I want Deputy Boyd Barrett to understand that when my party was in opposition, in respect of all the referendums that have been held in regard to Europe, we supported each of these consistently.

They did not do a lot.

In respect of the Lisbon treaty, which was voted on twice by the people of this country, the Fine Gael Party supported that very strongly and took the position of the Government of the day, just as the Fianna Fáil Party, in its political philosophy, supports the eurozone, the euro and the European Union. I welcome that support and the support from so many other groups and sectoral organisations around the country who see the validity of keeping confidence at a high level and not cutting off a lifeline, should this country ever require it in the future, way beyond the lifetime of this Government or any succeeding Government.

Will the Taoiseach answer the substantive question?

I answered questions on this yesterday. We in this country have set up a very well tried and tested mechanism for dealing with industrial disputes and their resolution. While I do not have the details of the Labour Court recommendation in regard to the CRH dispute the Deputy mentions, I would expect that the recommendations made in these cases should be respected. I am quite sure the Labour Court made its recommendations in the best interests of finding a resolution to this particular problem.

The last interaction I had with CRH-----

Were they in the tent?

-----was in regard to its continued investment in China, where it is doing exceptional work in the north-eastern region. I undertake to find out the detail of what is involved here. I would expect that everybody involved would respect the outcome of the industrial relations mechanisms that we have in this country, which were set up for very good reason and which have been tried and tested over the years. I hope a resolution can be found to this dispute.

Were they at Punchestown last week?

My point was that the Taoiseach shows great urgency and energy when it comes to protecting the interests of bankers, bondholders, financiers and the super-wealthy.

That is the point.

Can he show the same energy, enthusiasm and urgency when it comes to protecting the rights of workers which are being trampled on in a whole series of cases by rogue and unscrupulous employers? I am asking a very specific question in this case, where we are talking about one of the biggest companies in the State, which has been a huge beneficiary of State support, including a big portion of €220 million in windfall profits from the carbon allocations regime - free profits - and where the CEO was on €2.7 million a year, yet the company will not pay workers moneys owed to them which the Labour Court has recommended should be paid to them. Those workers have been forced to march around outside those plants for the past three weeks when they want to go back to work.

Thank you, Deputy.

Will the Taoiseach condemn CRH and Irish Cement's failure to do what the Labour Court has recommended and pay these workers the money? Will he directly contact Irish Cement and CRH and point out to them that they are beneficiaries of State subsidies and, therefore, he is invoking his authority as Taoiseach and demanding that they pay those workers the moneys owed, and show a bit of backbone and urgency when it comes to protecting the workers of this country, whose rights are being trampled on?

The Deputy did not display much backbone himself down in Galway when he neither saw nor heard anything.

(Interruptions).

I did not hear Deputy Boyd Barrett condemn those who spat at security personnel or gardaí or his colleagues who taunted ordinary people going about their democratic business while attending the Ard-Fheis of the Labour Party. I did not hear Deputy Boyd Barrett condemn them.

What about the cameraman?

(Interruptions).

Cool down. Would you mind, please? Would you please stop?

I enjoin the Irish Congress of Trade Unions and the employers' organisations. They have issued a joint statement on this matter calling for the appointment of an independent chairperson to bring about a resolution. I am sure the recommendations of the Labour Court can be taken into account when that happens. I would like to see an end to this dispute and for people to be able to go back to work.

The Taoiseach intervened.

Obviously there are two sides to this story. The congress and the employers' organisations have issued a joint statement which I support and I hope it can be used to bring about a resolution.

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