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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 18 Oct 2012

Vol. 779 No. 2

Topical Issue Debate

Misuse of Drugs

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for the opportunity to speak on what is an important issue for this House and the people. The Minister will agree that there is a subculture of activity which is being protected by certain drug lords who are importing massive amounts of drugs from Europe and other continents for what is commonly known as the Irish market.

We see from recent information from An Garda Síochána that former members of the IRA, and who is to say but perhaps even current members, are involved in the importation, distribution and selling of drugs and in criminality. The Minister and most Members of this House know the damage these drugs do to our society. The one area for which Members of this House have responsibility is giving good example. I am somewhat concerned about the messages sent occasionally by Members of this House and I refer specifically to Deputy Luke "Ming" Flanagan.

I add to illegal drugs and so-called "prescription drugs" the importation of illegal tobacco products which are mixed with toxic and damaging substances. It is often the stepping stone to cannabis use which, in turn, is the stepping stone to illicit drugs such as heroin, amphetamines and other such dangerous and toxic substances.

I refer to the purchase of drugs on the Internet, which are often purported to be cheaper, but they do not meet prescription standards. This is a major and growing problem, of which I know the Minister is aware. We do not know much about these drugs. How do we know what they contain? Two professional people in Cork died recently from so-called "bad batches" of drugs. When I was thinking about this last night, I wondered what Deputy Luke "Ming" Flanagan would have to say about such bad batches.

I would like to send a message from the House to every youth leader, community leader, parent, young person and citizen who is concerned about this issue that we should co-operate fully with the Garda and the authorities to stamp out this dreadful and heinous crime which is wrecking the lives of many people in every parish, village, town and city in Ireland.

I have seen in my constituency and from my experience as a community worker for many years how people are targeted in different ways, in particular through social media, social gatherings, in public houses and even on our streets. Last week I went into Dublin city for the first time in a long time and it was a frightening experience. My wife, who had recently been to New York, was with me and she said that in her experiences over the past couple of weeks, the one occasion in which she was most fearful was in Dublin city last weekend. I say that with great regret.

There is so much more I would like to discuss but I fully accept there is a time constraint and I am grateful to the Minister for coming to the House to respond to this topical issue.

I am very grateful to the Deputy for raising these very important matters. It is very important we discuss them and the difficulties in this area in this House. The problem of drug misuse remains one of the most challenging and complex issues faced by modern society. The Government's overall approach to tackling the problem of drug misuse is being pursued in a co-ordinated and integrated way through the national drugs strategy 2009-16.

Drugs law enforcement is one element of this response and is a key feature of our overall integrated approach. I can inform the House that An Garda Síochána continues to prioritise organised crime and the sale and supply of drugs as a core focus for 2012 through the Garda Síochána policing plan. Work in this area is led by the Garda national drugs unit which works closely with dedicated divisional and district drugs units on a nationwide basis, together with other national Garda units, including the organised crime unit and the Criminal Assets Bureau.

Of course, An Garda Síochána also works in close co-operation with the Revenue Commissioners - customs service - and with other drug law enforcement agencies, such as the Irish Medicines Board. Furthermore, An Garda Síochána has developed strong and strategic partnerships at international level which is absolutely crucial because the drugs trade is international and some of the drugs gangs with which we are confronted operate internationally.

This approach continues to yield significant results, which I would like to acknowledge. For example, from January to August 2012, Garda figures indicate that a total of 11,263 drug offences were detected, with 9,743 related arrests made. Furthermore, with regard to drug seizures, drugs with an estimated value of €59.3 million were recorded during the first six months of the year. They were very substantial drugs seizures. This seizure data do not include a number of significant seizures made at the end of that six month period, which remain the subject of further analysis, nor do they include some very recent large seizures which will appear in the next official statistics when they become available.

For example, the figures do not include the largest ever inland seizure of cocaine in the jurisdiction, which was made in the west Dublin and Kildare areas last June as part of a joint operation involving both the Garda and the customs authorities.

As the Deputy has highlighted the drugs market and the consumption of drugs is a dynamic phenomenon and trends emerge from time to time with users often trying different combinations of drugs, which sometimes involves the mixing of legal and illegal drugs, as well as various modes of consumption. I agree with him that all Members should be categorical in their condemnation of drug use and of drug trading and should not seek in any way to suggest this is a healthy option for any individual in this State nor should they seek to diminish the criminality involved in the supply and sale of drugs. The emergence in recent times of large scale cannabis cultivation sites, the increase in the consumption of new psychoactive substances and the increasing illicit trade in medicines are particular features of the current drugs landscape we are facing.

Our drugs law enforcement authorities remain cognisant of this and proactively tackle new features of the drugs trade as they emerge. Operation Nitrogen is a Garda operation which continues to be successful in identifying and dismantling cannabis cultivation sites throughout the country. For example, during 2011, more than 500 so-called grow houses were located during intelligence led operations resulting in more than 26,000 cannabis plants with an estimated value of €10.5 million being seized. I expect those actions of the Garda would be welcomed by every Member, including Deputy Luke "Ming" Flanagan, who was referred to by the Deputy. This remains a key focus of the Garda's drug enforcement efforts and recent successes in this respect include the detection of major cannabis production sites in Navan, County Meath and in Malin, County Donegal with related arrests.

I refer to an issue of enormous importance, which is a great danger to people. The Deputy drew particular attention to the emerging problems we are seeing with the illegal trade in prescription drugs which has been acknowledged as an increasing problem being experienced across the country. Our law enforcement agencies are also vigorously responding to this problem as demonstrated by the recent successes achieved by the Irish Medicines Board, IMB, Revenue's customs service and An Garda Síochána through their involvement in Operation Pangea V. This Interpol-led operation, which was conducted between 25 September and 2 October 2012, involved an international week of law enforcement action targeting the online sale of counterfeit and illegal medicines throughout Europe. In Ireland, the joint operation by the IMB, the customs service and Garda led to the detention of more than 120,000 tablets-capsules with an estimated value in excess of €375,000. The number of packages detained during the operation in Ireland by the customs service was 282 while 11 search warrants were executed resulting in four arrests. It is important to note the substances seized included products for weight loss and erectile dysfunction as well as mood stabilisers. People who acquire counterfeit drugs may find themselves with nothing better than a placebo or buying the equivalent of Smarties in their local confectionery shop and they can, in some circumstances, place their lives at serious risk. They should not engage in these purchases from websites or from individuals on street corners.

I would love to think the Minister's contribution will be well received throughout the country. In this day and age, it is often difficult to sift through media reports to find good news. This is good news because of the co-ordinated response of all those involved, particularly when one considers the successes. I had details of some of these before I came to the House but I was not informed about the full extent of the success. We ware having enormous success dealing with this scourge but we must remain vigilant and reach out to all corners of our society to ensure we are all focused and engaged on this issue and continue to co-operate with the Garda drugs surveillance unit and drugs squad, Interpol and those working in education and so on. If the Minister is saying the resources are in place to yield that success, I am happy to support him in the work he is doing. It is incumbent on all 166 Members to support him and the authorities in this work.

I appreciate the Deputy raising the issue. I refer back to the issue of counterfeit drugs and medicines. There is not adequate public consciousness yet of the dangers of buying prescription drugs through websites when one does not know what one is being sold and what is its composition. If it is not a placebo, the product could comprise substances other than what one believes it to contain, which places one's health or life at risk.

This highlights the benefit of being part of the European Union and co-operation in the justice area. Operation Pangea V had extraordinary results. It was a dedicated, focused operation across the EU over a one-week period, which led to the seizure of 120,000 counterfeit tablets and capsules in Ireland that might otherwise have been consumed by people in this State who believed they were required for their health. They related to weight loss, mood and erectile dysfunction issues. People would have taken these drugs without knowing their content or the consequences of taking them or knowing that they were counterfeit.

Because it was a European wide focused operation, in that week, 18,000 websites selling these pharmaceutical products were closed.

Health Insurance Claims

I am grateful to the Ceann Comhairle for selecting this topical issue. I mean no disrespect to the Minister of State but I am disappointed that the Minister for Health is not present to take this issue. Ten months ago, I tabled a parliamentary question about this issue because it was leading to a revenue loss to the health service. According to the reply I received, the loss was estimated at €76 million. My colleague, Deputy Conway, was informed at a meeting of the Joint Committee on Health and Children in September by Mr. Tony O'Brien, director general of the HSE, that the figure owed then was in the region of €60 million while last week, in reply to Deputy Kieran O'Donnell at a meeting of the Committee of Public Accounts, it was indicated that €74 million was outstanding.

I asked the Minister in January, which is ten months ago, what disciplinary action, if any, could be taken and he indicated at the time that he wanted the issue addressed under the Croke Park agreement. The Department indicated there was no contractual requirement that medical consultants should sign off on health insurance claim forms. Is there a contract with bus drivers to make sure bus fares are collected? There seems to be one rule for high paid public sector workers and another for those on more modest incomes. Under the 1999 contract, a consultant must co-operate with his employing authority for the collection and maintenance of fees and, under the 2008 contract, consultants are expected to work within the framework of the hospital, agency and HSE service plan. The delay in claiming the fees due is having a major effect on cash flow in our hospitals. While I acknowledge the Minister managed to secure an agreement recently that will lead to substantial savings in the State's drugs bill and the Bill currently going through the House to deal with generic substitution and reference pricing must be commended, I am disappointed there has been little or no action on this issue.

What action has been taken to ensure claims are paid promptly and signed off by highly paid consultants? Was it part of the recent discussions with the IMO and the Irish Hospital Consultants Association? If so, will it be implemented? It is unclear if the deal will come into force. There was media speculation on when exactly the matter will come before the Labour Court.

Yesterday evening, we had a debate about home help. Today, we are discussing a topic I raised over ten months ago concerning €74 million. Consultants need to get a grip of themselves and carry out the job they are employed to do. It is part of their responsibility to ensure the hospital service in the HSE is properly funded. For them to shrug their shoulders and say they will not sign means hospital beds lie empty, wards close and people in need do not receive hospital treatment they require and deserve. I hope the Minister of State carries this message loud and clear. It is no longer acceptable in this country for highly paid consultants not to sign off on insurance forms.

I am responding on behalf of the Minister for Health, Deputy James Reilly. I thank Deputy Humphreys for raising this important issue.

The HSE and voluntary hospitals recoup a considerable amount from private health insurance companies in return for private and semi-private treatment services provided to patients with private health insurance cover. However, lengthy delays can often occur between the discharge of patients and the receipt of payment from health insurance companies. This has led to an unacceptably high level of debtor days and months with a significant amount in fees outstanding. As of the end of September 2012, €204 million was due to the HSE from private health insurance companies in respect of treatment provided to private patients. Of the €204 million, €100 million relates to claims under preparation in hospitals, and €104 million relates to claims submitted to insurers which are either being processed or are pending.

Delays in consultants signing off on health insurance forms is one of the issues affecting the claims collation process in public hospitals. Of the €100 million under preparation in hospitals, €73 million relates to delays in consultant sign-off. The Minister has instructed the HSE to address the issue as a matter of urgency and the HSE has directed hospitals to bring down the value of claims awaiting consultant action. Hospitals are also targeting the highest value claims.

The issue was also addressed by health service employers and the two consultant representative bodies at the Labour Relations Commission. An important feature of the proposals agreed between the parties was a commitment on the part of all consultants to expeditious processing and signing of claims for submission to private health insurers. Consultants will be required to complete and sign private insurance forms within 14 days of receipt of all the relevant documentation and to co-operate with the secondary consultant scheme, whereby a secondary consultant involved in a case can sign the claim form if the primary consultant has not signed it within a reasonable timeframe. They will also be required to support the implementation of electronic claim preparation.

Health service management is proceeding with implementation of this and other measures in the coming weeks, having regard to the relevant provisions in the public sector agreement. In addition to addressing delays in consultant sign-off, the HSE has also awarded a contract for the phased roll-out of an electronic claims management system in 11 HSE sites. The system will address the many deficiencies of the current paper-based process, will streamline the claims collection process and will ensure standardised work practices are implemented across hospitals. The system is live in six hospital sites with a further three to come on board by mid-November.

It is also worth reflecting on the intensive work that has been ongoing between my Department and the main private health insurers to reach an agreement in principle on an accelerated income collection process, which will generate an additional once-off cashflow benefit in the region of €125 million in 2012. The accelerated payment arrangements are at an advanced stage, with the detail of the legal agreements between the HSE and insurers expected to be finalised very shortly.

The Minister has emphasised to the HSE the importance of addressing the issue of income collection, in conjunction with the insurers, in order that the maximum resources possible are available to the health system. He believes the range of measures I have outlined will contribute to improving the collection of income outstanding to the public hospital system.

I thank the Minister of State for his answer and I hope what he has outlined will happen. Some ten months have passed since I raised the issue and it seems that, from the response of the Minister of State, we are getting some action. Is it not a shame it took so long to get consultants to pull into line? More than 2,200 consultants work in public hospitals. They use beds for private patients and draw down enormous salaries from private practice with questionable practices. Are their incomes subject to PRSI? We must examine the practices and methods of consultants in our public hospitals.

I welcome the payment systems outlined and we must wait and see if they are delivered upon. This is very unfortunate. Shame on the consultants that the Government had to go to such lengths to ensure the income stream and cashflow of our hospitals were guaranteed. These men and women walk the corridors of the hospitals and see the shortfall in income yet they delayed on signing off on significant sums that would make a substantial difference to the hospitals of the State. I welcome the response. I will be monitoring the topic closely and I will check whether the target of 14 days is achieved. I will seek further information on the practices of consultants in the public hospitals service. I want to see this saving and cashflow delivered quickly.

I think Deputy Kevin Humphreys. I agree wholeheartedly that these are significant sums of money that could be expended on front-line services but they are held in abeyance because of a lack of will from certain ranks within the health sector and, perhaps, bureaucratic difficulties associated with the payment process. The Minister for Health, Deputy Reilly, has prioritised the solution to the problem. I referred to the opportunity for a second consultant to sign off on an insurance claim, the electronic claims management system, which will shortly be in place in 11 sites, and the ongoing work with health insurers to set up an accelerated income collection process. One can only conclude from the response that these measures will be put in place quickly and will serve to address the issue. I have a funny feeling that, this time next year, we will not have such a substantial amount of money outstanding.

Vocational Training Opportunities Scheme Numbers

I will not be long-winded or engage in a long rant. The purpose behind the vocational training opportunities scheme, VTOS, and the back to education scheme is to take some of the thousands of people on the dole queue, who are unemployed and have no prospects, and give them an opportunity to re-educate themselves and reskill in an attempt to return to the workforce re-energised and with a new skill set. There must be criteria for every initiative offered by every Department but the strictness with which we adhere to the admissions policies for the VTOS and back to education scheme is counter-productive and goes against the spirit of the schemes.

I will give two brief examples. One gentleman in my constituency is three days short in terms of the stamps needed for VTOS. He was turned away and told to go home and sit on his bum for another year and return next year. Another man was 12 days short and is in the same position. Apart from being hugely frustrating, it is crazy that an official of any Department, particularly the Department of Social Protection, would instruct people actively pursuing retraining initiatives to go home and sit on their bums for a further 12 months before they would be eligible the following year.

It is criminal.

I ask the Ministers for Education and Skills and Social Protection to come up with some sort of creative mechanism so that people who are far outside the qualifying number of contributions but who are genuinely interested in retraining and reskilling can qualify for schemes, perhaps by buying extra contributions. We need some sort of creative mechanism so that the initiatives the Government has offered can be made available to those who are genuinely enthused by those initiatives and can avail of courses.

I thank Deputy Doherty for raising this issue.

My Department funds a range of further and higher education and training courses and programmes which are open to the unemployed. All further education and training courses are delivered free of charge to welfare recipients.

The vocational training opportunities scheme, VTOS, is one of a range of full-time further education and training options available to adults who wish to return to education. VTOS is targeted at unemployed persons over 21 years of age. Its primary target groups are the longer-term unemployed, the low-skilled and the disadvantaged. It aims to give participants education opportunities that will develop and prepare them to progress to employment or on to further education opportunities leading to employment.

There are almost 6,000 places available under VTOS, some of which are provided by VECs through the post-leaving certificate, PLC, programme. To be eligible to participate in a course under VTOS, a person must be over 21 years of age and in receipt of a specified social protection payment for at least six months at the start of the course. Those eligibility criteria are specified to ensure that courses delivered under VTOS are targeted at the longer term unemployed. The criteria help ensure that the 6,000 places can be prioritised for people who are longer-term unemployed.

While VTOS is designed to target the longer-term unemployed, I can tell the Deputy that there is a range of other courses and programmes available that are open to all unemployed people. I mentioned PLC courses. Unemployed people who want to do a PLC course may be able to avail of the back to education allowance, BTEA, which is funded by the Department of Social Protection. If a person is more than three months unemployed, they can access the BTEA and in this way continue to receive income support while engaging in full-time further education. Alongside full-time further education, there are full-time training courses provided by FÁS.

In addition to these full-time options, there are a range of part-time further and higher education and training opportunities available. In the further education sector, these opportunities are delivered under the back to education initiative, BTEI. Attendance at BTEI courses generally does not affect a person's social protection entitlement as they are part-time and the person is still available for work.

With regard to the Deputy's suggestion, there are no plans to change the qualifying periods for VTOS payments. Buying days would be a matter for the Department of Social Protection and I understand that there are no proposals to allow those who are unemployed buy any days they might be short, in terms of the qualifying criteria for BTEA or any other programme.

I would encourage anyone who wishes to return to education or training or is considering their options to contact their local VEC or FÁS office or one of the new Intreo offices that are appearing throughout the country. They might contact their local higher education institution or check with their local welfare office, if they are in receipt of a welfare payment, and they will receive high quality advice and guidance as to the education options available to them and that they might pursue.

I appreciate the Minister of State taking the time to attend the House to answer my query, somewhat. However, with respect to him, I must inform those who write ministerial responses that I already know what the VTOS scheme is, its purpose, the criteria for taking part in it and how one applies for it. The Minister of State has read a page and a half of information that everyone in the House is well aware of.

Some part of the VTOS scheme is not working. People in my constituency have been told they are 12 days or three days short and should go home and sit around for the next 12 months. I asked if some mechanism be found to allow a person to do the VTOS course he wants to do, or some other VTOS or back to education course. The answer in the last two paragraphs of the Minister of State's statement is effectively to say sorry, that is not possible. I get that and I will have to find some other creative way to assist these gentlemen.

The Minister of State indicated that other options are available. The reason these people arrived in my office is that they were told to go home and sit around for the next year and wait for the course to be provided again. That is not good enough.

Do Fine Gael not have parliamentary party meetings?

The Deputy is clearly aware of the conditions and criteria applying to the VTOS scheme. There are almost 450,000 people on the live register. About 100,000 of those are now long-term unemployed. The longer they remain unemployed the more unemployable they become. My Department and the Department of Social Protection has, therefore, focused on that cohort of people who are the most vulnerable and have the longest journey to make back to education and employment. That is why the VTOS provision is targeted at that cohort and we are clear cut and unambiguous as to who we support and the criteria a person must satisfy in order to access that support.

If the Deputy e-mails me the details of the two individuals to whom she refers, I will work with her in making them aware of other options. I am confident there are other options they can avail of. They are not required to sit at home twiddling their thumbs for the next 12 months. I will certainly assist the Deputy in that regard.

I am also confident that if they were to visit their local VEC, FÁS or Department of Social Protection office they would receive guidance and counselling as to the direction they should take. There is no requirement on anyone to sit on their hands for a year awaiting the opportunity of training or further education.

Tourism Ireland Website

Last Monday, Tourism Ireland announced that it has acquired the Ireland.com domain name from The Irish Times, in a deal worth almost €500,000. In doing so, Tourism Ireland has greatly inconvenienced as many as 15,000 Ireland.com domain users who have been told they are about to lose their e-mail addresses. The Minister may be able to provide us with more information on this.

The users who have been in contact with me have indicated that from 7 November people who have had @ireland.com as part of their e-mail address will have to change it. It is imperative that the Minister act to ensure that Tourism Ireland's purchase of the Ireland.com domain address does not deprive these customers of a valuable service. Instead of shutting down the domain address, the service should be enhanced and promoted. People who have been promoting Ireland through this address should not be punished as a result of the purchase by Tourism Ireland, ultimately the State, of the domain address.

There are many benefits of the @ireland.com element of an e-mail address. It has been used as a service by many within the Irish diaspora. I know many people who are proud to have the element @ireland.com, and the resource could be expanded and used as a tool to encourage people to come to Ireland as part of The Gathering. Many people use the element in their e-mail address, and more would do so if they were aware of it.

I hope Tourism Ireland's purchase will lead to an enhanced service being made available. It has huge advertising potential for Tourism Ireland and I hope we will hear more about that.

I have received correspondence from a number of concerned e-mail account holders who have been told their service will be withdrawn before Christmas. It is important that some clarity be brought to the situation at the earliest possible opportunity to allay any fears. There are others who, if the service is not to be continued, will have to change stationery and find another service provider. Finding a new service provider may not be expensive but the ancillary costs of having stationery re-printed would be a nuisance and an annoyance.

As the Minister knows, these types of operators, some of them with only two or three staff, are the last people we wish to inconvenience at present.

Clearly, two groups have the most to lose. One is the diaspora, and the huge opportunity that exists there, and the other is small and medium enterprises, some of them single-owner type operations, which will be put to considerable expense if they cannot retain that e-mail address. I appeal to the Minister to examine the real potential here. I am glad the Minister of State, Deputy Michael Ring, is present too. He keeps in regular contact with many in the diaspora, probably by e-mail in some cases, and he will be very aware of the importance of its retention. Hopefully, we can find a solution here. I look forward to hearing the Minister's response. I will try not to be critical until I have at least had an opportunity to hear it.

First, I thank the Deputy for raising this matter, which I am aware has received some media coverage in recent days. However, the decision to purchase the domain name Ireland.com from The Irish Times was an operational decision by Tourism Ireland and its board. Tourism Ireland is a North-South body that is jointly funded by the Irish Government and the Northern Ireland Executive. The issue of accommodating existing @ireland.com e-mail address holders in as helpful and fair a manner as possible is clearly the responsibility of The Irish Times and one over which I have no responsibility.

With regard to the decision to purchase the domain name from The Irish Times, I understand that Tourism Ireland firmly believes that having a simple domain name like Ireland.com will have significant benefits. Primarily it is felt that given the ease of recognition and memorability, the new domain name will deliver greater "stand out" for Ireland around the world. From a tourism perspective, Tourism Ireland believes the move is timely for a number of reasons. First, it is at present redeveloping its suite of websites with the aim of capitalising on the ever increasing importance of the Internet for the planning of holidays by potential tourists worldwide. Second, we are in the advanced stages of preparations for The Gathering Ireland 2013, Ireland's biggest ever tourism initiative. Having a simple domain name like Ireland.com can only help in projecting an even stronger online presence to achieve our ambitious targets for visitor numbers.

It is also worth putting on the record the business case advanced by Tourism Ireland for purchasing the domain name. I understand that the cost involved was just under €0.5 million. While this is a considerable amount of money in the current economic climate, Tourism Ireland is in no doubt that the cost represents very good value. The rationale for this belief includes the fact that at present Ireland.com is a competitor for search engine traffic. In other words, when people overseas are searching online for information on holidays in Ireland, they may be directed towards this site rather than existing Discover Ireland sites. Accordingly, the acquisition will be beneficial in accessing that traffic.

Second, it is believed that the simplicity and directness of lreland.com will facilitate an increase in direct traffic and will also help capture increased organic search engine traffic. Furthermore, Tourism Ireland's business case for the project identified that cost savings will also be achieved through a reduction in its paid search engine optimisation activity. In this regard, a proportion of Tourism Ireland's marketing budget each year is devoted to ensuring that the Tourism Ireland website is advertised on search engine sites such as Google, Bing or Yahoo. In fact, Tourism Ireland's projections show that the costs of the acquisition will be fully recouped in just over three years.

Reverting to the issue of the existing e-mail subscribers, I understand that The Irish Times has contacted all @Ireland.com subscribers to advise them that the e-mail service will be discontinued from 7 November 2012 in terms of sending or receiving messages. Users will, however, be able to access their account until 7 December for the purpose of transferring any data currently saved on their account. To help users to move easily to a new provider, I am informed that The Irish Times has a helpline in operation from 8 a.m to 8 p.m. and there is also a step-by-step guide available on the Ireland.com website to assist its customers with the transition.

In conclusion, my primary focus in tourism is obviously to ensure that we do everything we can to grow visitor numbers in the years ahead and achieve our ambitious targets in this regard. At the same time, I share the Deputy's desire to ensure that nobody is inconvenienced by the purchase of the domain name as discussed. However, Tourism Ireland only bought the domain name, www.ireland.com, and not the customer database of e-mail subscribers. Therefore, any decisions relating to the e-mail service and the matter of accommodating existing users are entirely the responsibility of The Irish Times. I hope the efforts it is making to facilitate a smooth changeover for its clients will continue right up to the transition date.

I thank the Minister for his comprehensive outline of the background to what happened. I fully support what Tourism Ireland has done. It was excellent use of public moneys to purchase this domain name. Clearly, it was ludicrous to have Ireland.com in the ownership of an agency that does not have the promotion of Ireland within its remit. We have seen where similar cases occurred with other brands as a result of how domain names were handed out in the early years. The Minister and I are at one on that. I also accept that Tourism Ireland might not be in a position to purchase the database of subscribers. It was probably prudent to opt for just the domain name.

However, there is nothing of which I am aware that would prevent Tourism Ireland from establishing as a service provider, providing e-mail accounts and e-mail addresses as an enhanced component of the ownership of that domain name. Without purchasing the subscriber database, it could certainly offer the service, with the Ireland.com address, to those who wish to have it. Migration would take place naturally, with no additional cost to the State. There would be an added ability to promote the domain name if it was also offering it as an e-mail address. Many of the other search engines already do so, such as Google with gmail. It is a cost to them but they see it as an essential component of attracting people into what is their community. They do it quite successfully.

There is a very strong argument for Tourism Ireland, which is now offering a new portal or base for the consolidation of its web presence and the capacity to advertise to a broader audience, to add this service provision of e-mail. It is a loss leader for most of the search engines. Yahoo, Google and all the others do it. If Tourism Ireland thinks this through, it will see the benefits. I ask the Minister to raise this issue with the agency. If it would require an additional allocation of resources, I will certainly not criticise the Minister or Tourism Ireland. I would fully support it.

I appreciate the Deputy's comments and concerns. I agree that Ireland.com is a good purchase for Tourism Ireland. It will be in public ownership, or at least in the ownership of a North-South body. A lady in the United States whom I know quite well and with whom I stayed for some time has an Ireland.com address, and she asked me what .ie meant at the end of all my e-mail addresses. In America all addresses are X, Y or Z.com and having the domain name Ireland.com in the ownership of Tourism Ireland is very valuable. The only concern that might arise is that when Ireland.com becomes a tourism portal and website, allowing anybody to have that address might cause people to believe they are somehow associated with official Ireland, the Government or tourism when they are not. However, perhaps that is not a reasonable concern. Everybody knows that if one's address is gmail, it does not mean one works for Google. I understand what the Deputy means.

I do not know what can be done in this space. The duty of care lies with The Irish Times because only the domain name was bought, not the customer database. I will discuss it with the chief executive of Tourism Ireland to see if there is a way to facilitate people retaining those addresses, provided it does not prejudice the purchase of the domain name.

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