Vol. 799 No. 2
6. Deputy Derek Keating asked the Minister for Education and Skills if his attention has been drawn to the fact that there are 400 children in a school (details supplied) in County Dublin being educated in prefabricated accommodation; the reason he has decided to build a new school 200 m from this existing school; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17451/13]
As the Deputy will be aware, there are two schools on this site, a junior school and a senior school, both of which have temporary accommodation in addition to their permanent structures and have applied to the Department for replacement permanent buildings. The next step to progressing a building project for the schools involves the appointment of a design team and the commencement of the architectural planning process. School building projects such as this one that are not included in the five-year construction programme will continue to be progressed to final planning stages in anticipation of further funds being available to the Department in the future.
My Department has decided to build a new primary school close to the schools in question in order to meet an identified demographic need in the area. Lucan has been identified as an area in which there will be a requirement for significant additional school provision at post-primary and primary levels during the coming years. It is within this context that, in 2011, the Minister announced the future establishment of a new 1,000-pupil second level school and a new 16-classroom primary school. The primary school will open in temporary accommodation in September 2013 under the patronage of County Dublin VEC. It will be a multidenominational, English medium, co-educational primary school. Both primary and post-primary schools will cater for increasing demographic demand in the general Lucan area.
I am aware that the Minister of State, Deputy Sherlock, is deputising for the Minister, Deputy Quinn, today who is on Government business in London. I heard the Minister, who is a man for whom I have tremendous respect as a person and as a Minister, in the course of the opening of Adamstown library last year indicate that during the course of his tenure it was his intention to ensure that all children had a permanent building, a warm classroom, a chair and a desk. That is something I very much support. Even in the short time the Minister is in office he has made significant progress. In my constituency of Dublin Mid-West nine schools building projects have been approved, including extensions. I welcome the new schools, the campaigns for which have been ongoing for many years.
I wish to raise the issue of temporary accommodation. In advance of this Dáil session I discovered that the difficulty is that some of the schools in my area – I will stick to Lucan as the Minister of State referred to it in his reply – are at a less advanced stage of progression than was the case many years ago. Within a couple of hundred metres of the school to which the Minister of State referred, there are 13 prefabricated buildings in Archbishop Ryan junior and senior national schools. Many people in the community are at a loss as to why the school has not been prioritised. In the case of Esker junior and senior national schools there are 17 prefabricated buildings. Those schools in particular feel they have not progressed much in the intervening years. St. Mary’s national school in Lucan village is another such school.
Thank you, Deputy.
If I could have another minute, I will not respond further to the Minister of State.
Only one minute is provided for the Deputy and for the Minister’s response. I will allow the Deputy to proceed. I appreciate his co-operation.
I would be happy to forward the list that has been compiled to the Minister’s office. I seek the assistance of the Minister of State, through the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Quinn, in arranging for me to meet departmental officials to examine the process. Much information has been collected and there is a great deal of frustration at the number of prefabricated buildings. I have provided examples of the numbers involved. I ask the Minister of State, through his good offices and those of the Minister, to arrange a meeting for me with departmental officials to discuss the matter to see how we can explain the situation to the relevant schools in Lucan and to help to progress the issue. I would be grateful if I could achieve that today.
The Deputy should make the request.
Does the Minister of State not have anything further to add?
Could I not make it now?
The Deputy should make the request in writing. It is on the record. The Deputy will appreciate that the demographic issue is clear. His situation in Lucan is not untypical of other parts of the country, including my area where there are serious demographic demands. There is a feeling among existing schools that they have been bypassed in favour of the creation of new schools. However, the demographic projection figures do not lie and therefore we face a cliff in certain parts of the country in terms of educational provision and it is necessary to build new schools. Without plámásing, I sympathise with the views expressed by Deputy Keating. If he makes a request to the Minister, Deputy Quinn, the Minister will take it from there.
7. Deputy Robert Troy asked the Minister for Education and Skills if he intends to provide specialist training in the area of mental health for teachers and principal teachers; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17559/13]
34. Deputy Charlie McConalogue asked the Minister for Education and Skills his plans to provide specialist training in the area of mental health for teachers and principal teachers; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17544/13]
48. Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív asked the Minister for Education and Skills the training measures he will put in place to help teachers deal with mental health issues in pupils; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17551/13]
59. Deputy Sean Fleming asked the Minister for Education and Skills the training measures he will put in place to help teachers deal with mental health issues in pupils; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17536/13]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 7, 34, 48 and 59 together.
The promotion of student well-being and positive mental health strategies in schools is a key aim of my Department. Accordingly, the Minister, Deputy Quinn, has directed my Department's support services to review and prioritise support for schools on the guidelines for mental health promotion which he launched recently with my colleague, the Minister of State, Deputy Kathleen Lynch. The guidelines bring together existing guidance and programmes to ensure a more integrated and holistic policy approach is taken towards student well-being. The guidelines, which are evidence-based, are an essential reference point for teachers and school management in terms of their planning for the implementation of the social, personal and health education, SPHE, curriculum, the whole-school guidance plan and for accessing the National Educational Psychological Service, NEPS, continuum of support framework. Relevant supports for schools are outlined in the document.
The focus of my question is the pressures and stresses on teachers in the course of carrying out their work and the impact that is having on the mental health of teachers. I accept that mental health is also a serious issue among the student population.
The recent Irish Primary Principals Network conference in Citywest highlighted how stress and mental health difficulties are affecting many primary school teachers at present because of the pressures they are under as a result of the increasing difficulties of running a school and the workload that falls on principals and teachers as a result. That is something that must be addressed. The Department must act in that regard to resolve the issue. Principals now have a massive workload, in particular because of the financial difficulties that exist. Capitation grants have been reduced. The minor works grant has been eradicated. Much of the responsibility falls on principals, in addition to the administration duties involved in running a school and on top of their teaching duties, as many primary principals also have teaching responsibilities.
I would welcome a comment from the Minister of State on the issue. The Department must address the matter. Everyone is finding the current climate difficult. Many principals made the point that the Croke Park II agreement would make it more difficult to get people to become principals. The stresses involved are affecting the number of teachers interested in taking on the role of principal. Increased pressure is also evident for ordinary teachers. The Department must address the issue and come up with a solution.
I accept the point the Deputy is making. Perhaps it is a commentary on life in this country at present for people who are unemployed, employed or in specific professions that the level of stress has increased dramatically. We have had a recession for more than five years at this stage and that takes its toll. Decisions have been made on budgetary issues pertaining to education involving a reduction in services as a result of the macroeconomic situation in which we find ourselves.
In my experience, teachers as a cohort are very supportive of each other in terms of developing mechanisms for dealing with stress. I have an open mind on the issue. I honestly do not know how the Department can put in place mechanisms that are funded to assist teachers specifically to alleviate stress. I do not know how one would achieve that without achieving it in other areas of the public sector also. There are definite guidelines on students. It is an apolitical space. Through providing guidelines for the promotion of mental health and suicide prevention, the State is doing a lot to ensure the health and well-being of pupils.
The straight answer to the Deputy's question is that I do not know how one would develop a mechanism that is funded specifically for teachers but I have an open mind on the matter.
It is important to point out that children in schools are also under enormous stress; it is not just a problem for the principals and teachers. There is no doubt that the cutbacks to guidance counsellors have put more pressure on everybody, both teachers and pupils. The biggest school in Wexford is Gorey Community School, which has 1,500 pupils. The students themselves have reacted to the problems in the school because they see that the principal, the remaining guidance counsellors and the teachers are under too much pressure. They have set up a project, called Project Smiler, whereby they are trying to highlight to pupils who are in trouble or not feeling great about themselves the importance of communicating and talking to others. They are putting helpline numbers in students' lockers and so forth. While that is a very positive development, the State must play a greater role in making sure that such developments happen in schools all over the country. It only took a handful of kids with initiative in Gorey to get the project started. I know such projects do not exist in all schools but the State should examine the possibility of promoting such initiatives.
I was interested in the Minister of State's response to the question of how we deal with the whole area of mental health, particularly with regard to the stresses that teachers are under, because it is a growing issue. If one speaks to any representatives from the teaching unions, they will tell one that it is a growing problem and something that must be addressed. Various initiatives being undertaken by individual schools could be examined more closely by the Department to determine whether they could be expanded on a pilot-project basis. If the Government is going to continue to put pressure on the teaching profession, through cuts in pay and working conditions - I do not want to get into that argument now - then that will obviously have a trickle-down effect on the students. As a parent and someone who sends my children to school, I am relying on the teachers, the principal and those working within the school environment to care for my children while they are in that environment but if those individuals are suffering from their own stresses and pressures, then the care provided might not be what it should be. An increasing number of teachers are taking sick leave and much of that is down to mental health problems, stress and strain. This is something the Department must examine. It must look at initiatives in individual schools, as in the example just given by Deputy Wallace regarding a project in a school in his constituency. Such projects are being replicated right across the State and the Department must assess whether they can be expanded on a pilot-project basis.
There is common ground here. What has amazed me since becoming Minister of State at the Department of Education and Skills two years ago is the well-spring of initiatives in schools and the level of cohesion between teachers and pupils in their collaboration on such projects. We all acknowledge that and I accept the point that we should examine some of these projects to determine whether we can pilot them across the educational landscape.
We are often accused in this House of being out of touch but very often we have our fingers on the pulse in terms of what is happening in our own communities. I have noticed an enormous amount of enthusiasm from pupils about trying to ensure the emotional and mental well being of their fellow pupils. I have not seen anything like the level of positivity that I have seen in the last two years, in terms of the willingness of pupils to engage with and try to help their fellow students. That is having a knock-on effect on overall well being within schools. The evidence for that may be anecdotal but we are seeing an improvement in this regard.
I take the point made about the stresses and strains that teachers are under. I also understand their in loco parentis role in schools but schools are communities made up of students, teachers and parents, all working together. The question was asked as to whether we can specifically fund services for teachers who are in distress or under stress without also doing so for the wider populace but I do not know the answer to that. As to whether we can get specific schemes or pilot projects under way, I do not see why not. Wearing my research hat, I can say that it can be very easy to do so. Good ideas, like the CoderDojo initiative, for example, are very easily replicated across the landscape. If specific initiatives are being carried out in schools in certain areas at present, I do not see why they cannot be replicated across the country. There would be no additional cost because it is simply about learning from other schools and replicating that across the system. I am always happy to engage on this agenda.
8. Deputy Joe McHugh asked the Minister for Education and Skills the level of funding that is being provided for support services for children with autism; the numbers of people who are employed in associated programmes; if he will provide information on support services that are provided at regional levels to parents of children with autism; if he will outline the relationship with the primary and secondary schools; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17447/13]
The Department currently spends some €1.3 billion or 15% of its budget in support of children with special educational needs, including those with autism. Many children with autism are supported in mainstream schools where they are integrated with other children, including those with other special educational needs. These children have access to additional resource teaching hours and may have access to special needs assistants, SNAs, as required. Complete details on funding and staffing specifically to support children with autism is, therefore, not available. There are 540 classes specifically for children with autism. These classes are staffed with a ratio of one teacher and a minimum of two SNAs for every six children. Other supports include home tuition, special school transport arrangements, special equipment and training for teachers and parents. The National Council for Special Education is available to support parents who may be considering the most appropriate placement for their child or who are transitioning their child from primary to post-primary level.
I thank the Minister of State for his reply. He is correct in saying that autism-related services are a good-news story. In my own county at primary level, Scoil Íosagáin in Buncrana and Woodland national school in Letterkenny provide excellent autism-related services. Last September saw the opening of two more special classes with autism-related services in St. Patrick's national school in Lurgybrack and also an early intervention class in the Little Angels school in Letterkenny. If there is one wider point to be made it is that we should look at the provision of autism services as a model of best practice that could be applied to other areas of disability where there are service deficits. Autism service provision should be used as a bar to which we should aspire to raise other services for children with disabilities.
While there is a positivity around parental choice and whether parents want to opt for mainstream or special classes, there is a geographical consideration at play in this regard and I know Deputy McConalogue will be aware of this. In Inishowen many secondary school children with autism have to travel for over an hour to get to school and while the transport is provided by the Department, the distances involved are proving to be a difficulty for some pupils.
In Buncrana there is a drive, through the local council and the VEC, to develop a new secondary school campus located in Buncrana itself. I ask that the Department work closely with the VEC on this. Myself and my Oireachtas colleagues from the county will be meeting the VEC representatives on Monday next to get an update on that project. It is in band 1.2 and, as the Minister of State will be aware, that band refers to the provision of special accommodation for children with special needs such as autism, speech and language impairment, severe and profound intellectual impairment and so forth. The focus, from the Department's point of view, should be on how to facilitate secondary school children from Inishowen and whether it would be possible to provide services on this new campus, even though the Crana College itself is available for such children.
Perhaps in future there should be proper consultation with parents dealing with a wide range of disabilities and not just autism.
There is an ongoing conversation about Crana College so perhaps we should be consulting at a very early stage with parents who have children with mild or more severe disabilities at both primary and secondary level within Inishowen to see how we can build a service provision on the campus to cater for many children in that part of the world.
I thank the Deputy for raising the issue, which is specific to his area. Department officials and I would be very interested to hear how the process with the VEC could take shape, with a view to engaging further in the process. If we are talking about a very specific geographical location, my own view - without being in full possession of the facts of the case made by the Deputy - is that the issue should be considered seriously. I hope that is an acceptable response, although it may not fully answer the question with figures. If there is a specific project in which the Deputy or other Members are involved, and where the Department should be more active, I am quite happy to engage further with the Deputy on the issue.
I do not wish to anticipate what will happen in the meeting, as Buncrana campus development will be on the agenda on Monday. Could a delegation from the VEC meet the Minister, Minister of State or officials in the Department?
If the Deputy could make a request to the senior Minister, I will refer to the fact that the issue was raised in the House, along with the matter raised by Deputy Keating.
I realise it costs much money to run these programmes but I listen to people in Wexford, particularly from St. Senan's primary school in Enniscorthy and Scoil Mhuire in Wexford, who say they are hurting because of cuts. The applied behavioural analysis education system involves analysing a child's skill levels and applying intensive one-to-one teaching, breaking down a whole task into small and achievable steps. It applies particular methods to each child's needs and regardless of age of the learner with autism, the goal of the intervention is to enable him or her to function as independently and successfully as possible in a variety of environments.
These people have already experienced cuts and they are afraid that the reviews of the National Council for Special Education, which are due soon, will leave them seen as being overly supported already with numbers. The truth on the ground is very different and the kids are regressing because they do not have the same support they once had. The notion that there will be further cuts in the next review is frightening for these people. I know there is an end to the money but these people deserve the attention.
The Minister of State mentioned the home tuition scheme run by the Department, offering 20 hours of one-on-one tuition. For the past five years with the grant allocated to parents, there was a certain discretion. For example, many parents would have used four or five hours in a group setting within preschools in particular. There seems to have been a change in the Department's policy as letters have been sent recently to people in receipt of the home tuition grant stating that using part of the grant for a group setting to develop social skills is not allowed. The Department has asked parents to refund any element not used for a one-to-one basis. I do not expect the Minister of State to answer the question today as I do not want to put him on the spot but he should revert to the officials and make inquiries about it. The discretion was always there and there was a benefit in using some of that grant for group settings rather than one-to-one sessions. It seems to be a recent change.
I join Deputy McHugh in asking that the assessment be done on the demand for dedicated classes and supports within the Crana College development. It is a worthy proposal. There are many gaps in the autism related supports. In my own area of Inishowen there is good work carried out by the centre for autism related education, or iCare, which operates from funds raised and which has no support from the State. There are many gaps and we must consider how the State can support young people with autism related needs.
We should also consider how we apply resource and special needs hours in mainstream education. There has been an undoubted squeeze in the past couple of years and that will continue this September as the number of special needs assistants and resource teachers will not increase proportionate to the increase in the school-going population. I have asked the Government to consider this and the issue should be addressed.
I acknowledge each of the contributions. It is important to state that there are 540 autism-specific classes approved throughout the country. There are specific pockets where there are shortages or where issues may need to be addressed. They can be raised through this forum and on the floor of the House but also by way of direct representations to the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Quinn, or parliamentary questions. With respect to Deputy Wallace, I would not be expected to be completely au fait with the school to which he refers. Perhaps he would table a parliamentary question to address the specific issue about the services rather than me giving a stock answer.
There are a maximum of six children in each special class with a teacher and at least two special needs assistants. Extra assistance is provided where the children require it, and sometimes on a one-to-one basis. Funding for home tuition is also available at ten hours per week for children with autism up to three years, increasing to 20 hours per week once the child is three years old if a placement is not available in an early intervention class. I do not know if that speaks directly to Deputy O'Brien's issue but we can engage further on it.
9. Deputy Micheál Martin asked the Minister for Education and Skills the changes he plans to make with regard to school patronage at primary level; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17541/13]
12. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Education and Skills the degree to which changes in school patronage are in line with expectations in both urban and rural areas; the extent to which ethos and tradition is reflected in any proposals; if he intends to address any issues emerging; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17578/13]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 9 and 12 together.
The surveys of parental preferences were undertaken largely in towns and suburbs. It was also open to parents of preschool or primary school children in rural areas or rural schools to participate in the surveys. The purpose of the surveys was to establish if parents want a more diverse range of primary school patrons in their area. Following on from the recent publication of the results of the surveys of primary school patronage, the Minister, Deputy Quinn, has written to the Roman Catholic patrons in the 23 areas where parental demand for change has been confirmed in the most recent surveys. He has requested they consider options for reconfiguring schools under their patronage to allow the transfer of a school to a new patron. The Roman Catholic patrons have been asked to submit an interim response within three months and a final response with detailed proposals on divesting schools within six months. Earlier surveys had been conducted in five pilot areas and, as a result, options for change are also being considered in respect of these.
I thank the Minister of State for his response. There is a degree of hypocrisy in making it more difficult for some small schools to operate through changes to the PTR, minor works grant and capitation fees while seeking greater plurality.
Undoubtedly there is an issue of how we provide choice to parents but the Minister's approach has been unfortunate. When he entered office, he announced to great fanfare that he would change the patronage of 50% of primary schools, more than 1,500 national schools. The reality, however, is somewhat different, with the Minister talking about changing the patronage of 28 national schools, less than 1% of the total.
The Minister's approach from the outset has been unfortunate and I note the Catholic Church has been willing to work with the Minister on this and indicated its cooperation with the surveys on patronage. Would the Minister of State agree that the response to the patronage surveys in many areas was disappointing?
The surveys were conducted in 43 areas across the country. We have taken the responses to those surveys and are acting accordingly. There is a process under way with the existing patrons to consider the options. There is a timeframe for responses.
The small schools issue has not been decided yet so the link with this issue is incongruous. The accusation of hypocrisy, therefore, does not stand. This goes back to the set pieces where questions are put to the Minister and the Deputy is entitled to make whatever political charges he wants. That is part and parcel of the game of politics. I do not see the link between the two, to be honest.
Surveys were conducted in 43 areas and we should wait and see what the results were and what response the existing patrons will make.
It is entirely congruent to link small schools with the plurality issue because many small schools are multidenominational or denominations other than Catholic and provide a choice to parents from that area. It is incongruent of the Minister of State to respond to so many genuine questions by commenting on political theatre. It is a good opportunity to get to the nub of the issues and it is unfortunate that instead of dealing with these questions, the Minister of State too often comments on their political bent.
The Minister for Education and Skills said he would change the patronage of 50% of national schools. Where does that promise stand now?
The Minister made a mistake when he put a figure on the number of schools he would change. We can only provide the sort of school people want. If they are happy with the local patron system, it does not change, it comes down to parental choice. The mistake was trying to put a figure on this before any research was carried out. The data are now coming back from the surveys but the response being good or bad is not the issue. We must work from the data.
The Minister of State would enjoy the line from Shakespeare that "All the world's a stage, And all the men and women merely players".
This is Question Time.
None of us is averse to a bit of political banter from time to time but the purpose of this set-piece is to get to the nub of the questions. Following the recent publication of the results of the survey on primary school patronage, the Minister has written to the Catholic patrons in the 23 areas where parental demand for change has been confirmed in the most recent surveys. A total of 43 areas were surveyed for parental preferences on the patronage of primary schools. Two thirds of the 43 areas surveyed showed sufficient parental demand and, of the areas surveyed, there was sufficient parental demand for a wider choice of school patronage in 28 of those areas to support change in the patronage of schools.
Parents expressed a preference for Educate Together as the alternative patron of choice in 25 of the areas and in two areas the alternative patron of choice was the local VEC and community national school model. That is the system of plurality. If in the majority, parents have decided on the existing system of patronage in their area, that is based on a model of collaboration with those parents who have voted with their feet. As a Government, we must respond accordingly. While the Minister might have made an aspirational statement coming from his own view, he is a reforming Minister and he has taken on board the views of parents articulated in these regions and this will be reflected in Government policy in due course.
Written Answers follow Adjournment.
