Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 19 Feb 2014

Vol. 831 No. 2

Topical Issue Debate

Tax Credits

Deputy Regina Doherty

I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Brian Hayes, for taking this Topical Issue. The single person child carer credit has been raised with me by a number of fathers since the budget in October. We were waiting to see how it would work out because neither the Department of Finance nor the Revenue Commissioners was exactly sure how it would do so. Since their January wage slips have been processed it is quite obvious to the gentlemen who approached me how it will work out.

Everybody who contacted me completely agrees and understands why the credit needed to be reorganised. In some instances we were paying on the double or triple.

Consequently, I completely concur that the merit behind the credit is to recognise that families which split up have twice the expenses of a normal family that is still living under the same roof. However, the issue of how the credit is being distributed, or rather not being distributed, is a cause of major concern and, in some cases, serious angst on the part of some fathers. The manner in which it has worked out is that the credit of €1,650 is only attributable to the primary carer and the Revenue Commissioners are determining the primary carer is the parent who is receiving children's allowance. In the vast majority of cases, that parent happens to be the mother. With respect - I acknowledge this is a delicate matter - in a great number of such cases, the relationships are not good because, obviously, things did not end well and they ended badly for a reason. The relationship and communications between parents on this credit are not as easy or straightforward as the Revenue Commissioners appear to think. In their view, the mother gets the credit, the mother and the father should be able to speak to each other and work something out with regard to maintenance and thereafter, it is Bob's your uncle. The reality is completely and entirely different. I believe it had been thought the €1,650 could be shared by the Revenue Commissioners on the basis of the proportion of time a parent had the child. I will provide a particular instance in which a gentleman has his children for 40% of the time, while the mother has them for 60% of the time. However, the father must still maintain the three-bedroom house, with heating and so on. Any reduction in these circumstances from the father's perspective would curtail completely and reduce his access to his children, which is obviously not a runner from his perspective. Moreover, it definitely is not a runner from a State policy perspective. Therefore, I ask the Minister to give serious consideration to allowing the Revenue Commissioners to redistribute and share the allowance because this is not possible at present. It either must go to the primary carer or the primary carer who, in most cases, will be the mother must give up the allowance and allow the father to have it. In practice, that is not happening.

This will have two effects. First, it can reduce the father's income and, therefore, have a genuine impact on his access to his children. He may not be able to afford the travel expenses to and from his children or be able to maintain the accommodation he needs to have access to the children. Second, given that mothers, in many cases, do not earn the €16,000 needed to avail of the entire €1,650 credit, they will suffer because the father will be obliged to incur expenses to bring the case back to the court to have the maintenance reduced to reflect his reduced salary and, in such a case, the mother will experience a reduction in maintenance payments from the father. Therefore, I ask for greater thought and consideration to be given to the distribution of this credit. In particular, I ask this given that families will incur almost equal costs when they attempt to maintain two homes to be able to maintain access to the children from the perspective of both the mother and the father.

I merely seek fairness and equality, not to make a moot point; the letters and correspondence I have received have been extremely emotional. A number of fathers who have spoken to me believe the Government is discriminating against them completely. In essence, based on the manner in which the credit is being distributed, I would be obliged to agree with them. I sincerely ask the Government to give further thought to this issue and allow distribution of the credit.

Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Deputy Brian Hayes)

I thank the Deputy for raising this important matter. I was involved in the Committee Stage debate on the last Finance Bill and recall this was an issue of considerable discussion both for the select committee and during the plenary session of the House. At the time the Minister for Finance gave a commitment to the House that he would consider the operation of the new credit to make sure it was operating in the fairest way possible. As the Deputy will be aware, the new single person child care credit is of the same value, that is, €1,650, as the previous one parent family credit. It also carries the same entitlement to the extended standard rate tax band of €36,800 per annum. The new credit is targeted such that it is available only to the claimant who is the principal carer of the child, that is, the individual with whom the child resides and who looks after the child for the year or the greater part of the year. A maximum of one credit is available per single carer claimant, regardless of whether he or she cares for more than one child.

Given the difficult fiscal environment, it is essential that all tax reliefs, credits and incentives are kept under review in order to ensure they are properly targeted and, if necessary, refocused in order that they can achieve the objectives all Members seek. The one parent family credit was in certain cases being claimed by multiple individuals in respect of a single child. I recognise this point was raised by the Deputy in the initial part of her contribution. A system that allows multiple claims in respect of the same child is unsustainable in current budgetary circumstances. It is important to point out that the new credit has been designed to work as an activation measure and is to be an in-work benefit to support the primary carer to take up, maintain or remain in employment. It will assist single parents or carers with the cost of child care.

In addition, it should be noted that this new policy has been agreed to by the Government based on a recommendation brought forward by the Commission on Taxation that the credit should be retained but that it should be confined to the principal carer only. The Government is satisfied that the restructuring of the credit will achieve such an outcome. In the first instance, it is the responsibility of the parents to look after a child, including financially. Tax credits should not be considered a supplementary source of income or an alternative to the financial support of a parent. It is worth pointing out that where a principal carer is married, in a civil partnership or cohabiting, he or she will not be entitled to the new credit or indeed the former one. In such circumstances, the principal carer cannot relinquish the credit to a secondary carer. In addition, a secondary claimant who is married, in a civil partnership or cohabiting will not be entitled to the new credit or indeed the former one, regardless of the marital status of the primary carer.

The single person child carer credit initially is granted to the principal carer. This usually is the parent who receives child benefit in respect of the child from the Department of Social Protection. In these circumstances, the Government believes the approach it has taken, difficult as it is, attempts to restructure this tax credit in such a way as to help people to get back to work and, equally, to help people who need that support. As the Deputy noted, the Government is conscious and aware of the fact that many such relationships which break up on an acrimonious basis must be handled sensitively. The Minister for Finance did give a commitment to the House which I will reiterate today, namely, that the Government will consider the operation of the credit this year to ascertain whether it can be improved and establish whether it can be tapered in such a way as to maximise the benefit for those concerned. The matter is under active review, as are all such credits. This was the intention with the original objective, as set out in the Bill.

Deputy Regina Doherty

That response was very comforting because, without being rude, I had expected the Minister of State to tell me it was a done deal and would not be reviewed. Consequently, I am greatly comforted that it is under active review. What is the expected time during which the concerns raised with me and, equally, the Review Commissioners will be taken into consideration? When would changes or modifications made to the credit come into effect? Would it be necessary to wait until the passage of the finance Bill at the end of this year or does the Minister of State think mid-term amendments would be made to it? Such amendments in the first instance would allow for cases in which there was no agreement between the two parents as to who should have the credit before forcing fathers to go back to the High Court or the District Court to get changes in maintenance payments, thereby incurring all of the additional expense, which, obviously, is something no one desires. The second instance is where the mother is not earning €16,000 to enable her to take advantage of the entire €1,650 credit with the result that neither parent is winning. While I am greatly comforted to hear this matter is under active review, the Minister of State should indicate when he expects changes, if any, to be made. Would this happen sooner rather than later?

Deputy Brian Hayes

As the Deputy will be aware, any change, obviously, will occur in the finance Bill which is published directly after the annual budgetary process in October and November. The Government must ascertain in discussions with Revenue how this measure has progressed this year. My understanding is that somewhere between 13,000 and 15,000 people have been affected by this change. It is also worth pointing out that one amendment introduced by the Minister for Finance, Deputy Michael Noonan, in the course of Committee Stage of the Finance Bill reduced that number by approximately 2,000, whereby secondary claimants could claim the credit if the primary claimant was unable or did not wish to avail of it.

The Minister has already shown some flexibility in this regard in the original amendment. We will look at it again and, in discussion with Revenue, see how many people have been affected by this. From the information I have I understand that approximately 76,000 individuals availed of the one-parent family tax credit. That includes everybody, but not everybody can claim the maximum because of their income level. Of the 76,000, 24,000 were single males, a significant cohort of people, as the Deputy rightly brings to the attention of the House, so we will have to examine it this year in discussions with Revenue. If a committee of the House were also to investigate the issue this year we would re-examine it given the circumstances in which many men find themselves.

Deputy Regina Doherty

I thank the Minister.

School Textbooks Rental Scheme

Deputy Dominic Hannigan

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for picking this Topical Issue. I am a little disappointed that the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Quinn could not be here himself but I see from the monitor that he is addressing the other House. I want to talk about the school book rental scheme and the funding available to schools to establish and maintain them. The recent budget announcement of €15 million over the next three years for new schemes is a very positive measure, equivalent to approximately €100 for every pupil who participates.

We all know how expensive buying school books can be and it is particularly expensive if one has two or three children going to school at the same time. It can cost up to €100 per year per child to get books for the school year, not including the cost of uniforms, shoes, sports equipment and the other things a school pupil needs daily. A school book rental scheme can help parents because it reduces the costs. In addition to the money the school book rental scheme gets from the Government, parents pay on average €40 per child per year to participate in a scheme so on average a family will save approximately €60 per year per child for taking part in this scheme. It is very good news for hard-pressed families.

If a school has no scheme it can apply for funding to help establish one. That is all really good news and we all welcome that. The problem is that funding is not available for schools that have already set up a scheme. A school could have a scheme that operates for only half the classes in the school or is running on a shoestring budget, but it cannot get extra funding. I will give some examples. Gaelscoil na Mí in Ashbourne established a scheme in 2011 through parents' donations. Now it cannot get access to this new funding. The people in that school are extremely worried that they may have to stop the scheme or take funding from another part of the school budget, which is under pressure.

St. Patrick's national school in Stamullen established a scheme last year and because it had limited funds, raised from parents, it established it only for children from junior infants up to fourth class with no scheme in operation for children in fifth or sixth class. When they heard the announcement they wrote to me, as follows:

It was great to hear that additional funding has been allocated to establish a school book rental scheme in budget 2014 but now I learn that Stamullen is not acceptable as this. As a result I now feel that I have actually hurt the school by putting in so much work last year and making the school ineligible to apply for additional funding even though we have only a partial scheme set up covering the years junior infants to fourth year. We would have all been better off now if we had done nothing at all last year.

That is the feeling out there. People are thinking they went out, tried to better their communities and their children's education and as a result they get no reward at all for it. What can we do to help schools such as those in Ashbourne and Stamullen which have half schemes or which are running schemes on very tight budgets? Can the Department consider the possibility of extra funding being put into schemes such as these?

Minister of State at the Department of Education and Skills (Deputy Ciarán Cannon)

I thank Deputy Hannigan for raising this issue and I welcome the opportunity to clarify the position. The Minister, Deputy Quinn, and I are very conscious that the cost of textbooks is a considerable burden on families. We believe that participation in book rental schemes offers the best opportunity to reduce that burden. Schools which already have rental schemes can save parents up to 80% of the cost of buying new books. Since his appointment, the Minister, Deputy Quinn, has attempted to take steps to increase participation across the country in book rental schemes.

In January 2013, the Minister launched the Guidelines for Developing Textbook Rental Schemes in Schools. These guidelines provide practical advice to primary and post-primary schools on how rental schemes can be established and operated. The aim of the guidelines is to help as many schools as possible to start book rental programmes. The publication of the guidelines followed a survey of schools by the Department in 2011. This had a 99% response rate at primary level, and showed that 76% of primary schools already operate a book rental scheme. These results show that we have a good foundation to build on across the country, especially at primary level. We can achieve a position where every primary school has a book rental scheme in operation in the 2014-2015 school year.

Budget 2014, as Deputy Hannigan indicated, provided additional funding which will involve an investment of €15 million to support the establishment of book rental schemes in primary schools that do not currently operate them. The Department will provide €5 million in seed capital per annum over a three-year period to such schools. The Department will continue to provide a book grant as usual to all primary schools. This grant can be utilised for the purposes of updating or expanding a school's existing book rental scheme. I commend the schools that have used the book grant to help build up book rental schemes over the years. Their efforts mean the high costs of books is being significantly reduced for parents.

At the Minister, Deputy Quinn's request the National Parents' Council surveyed the views of its members about currently operating book rental schemes. Parents have reported that where book rental schemes operate, they are open to all parents in 95% of cases and that the cost per child is under €40 per year in a considerable majority of schools. Perhaps most tellingly the survey has found that 93% of parents believe that book rental schemes help with the costs of educating a child. Ensuring that book rental schemes are available not just to some parents but to all parents must therefore clearly be our aim. I understand that it feels unfair to those schools that have invested time, energy and money to establish such schemes, that they now cannot benefit from the additional funding which was secured as part of the budget. It is unfair, but equally, the status quo was deeply unfair on many parents.

Deputy Dominic Hannigan

Did the Minister of State say it is unfair?

Deputy Ciarán Cannon

Yes, it is unfair, absolutely, but equally, the status quo was deeply unfair on the many parents who had no access whatsoever to book rental schemes and who needed support to establish them. That is what this measure sets out to do.

Deputy Dominic Hannigan

I thank the Minister of State for his honesty and his response. I agree with him that this is a very good scheme but I also agree that the way it is applied is unfair. I am very disappointed with the tenet of the response. We are all in politics because we believe it to be in the interests of people to work on their behalf. Politics is the art of the possible and if the Department says its own scheme is unfair I cannot believe we cannot look again and try to make it fair. I realise this has probably landed on the Minister of State's desk very recently and he may not have been aware of it in the past but, bearing in mind that he agrees with me that the current situation is unfair on schools such as the ones I named, St. Patrick's national school in Stamullen and Gaelscoil na Mí in Ashbourne, I ask him to re-examine this.

Deputy Ciarán Cannon

Perhaps unusually I am very aware of this issue because I have discussed it at length with the Minister, Deputy Quinn. Recently in the Dáil the Minister and I answered several questions on the operation of the scheme and we both pointed out that it was unfair but, in the context of the resources available to us, it is the most that can be done now. If more resources were available to us within Government or the Department we would have extended this support beyond those schools which did not have a scheme in place already. To a certain extent, with the limited resources available to us, we are trying to level the playing field, to bring in all the final schools that have no scheme whatsoever in operation and to support them in establishing that scheme.

We hope that in the future, when we will hopefully have more resources available to us, we will be able to go back and support those schools which took the initiative and made the commitment and effort to put in place some kind of scheme. For the moment, we have an unfair decision, but the best possible decision in light of the resources available to us. It was perhaps even more unfair to parents who had no access whatsoever to any book rental scheme and it was those, at this point in time, we sought to support but we hope to support all the others in the future when resources become available.

Railway Stations Upgrade

Deputy Terence Flanagan

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for the opportunity to raise this very important issue, that is, the need for accessibility ramps to be provided on all DART trains. The current position in respect of wheelchair accessibility on trains is that a portable wheelchair ramp is located at each station. The problem with these ramps is that a member of staff must be present to ensure the ramp is safely deployed. Therefore, the customer is required to provide advance notice of at least 24 hours that he or she intends to travel.

The current policy is completely outdated and action needs to be taken to ensure the DART is more accessible to those customers who have mobility problems. I am concerned that people of reduced mobility have to give 24 hours notice at any time they wish to use the DART. I do not think this is fair and it means many people have to plan their journeys ahead and cannot jump on the DART at a minute's notice if their plans have changed. It is a form of discrimination.

As a developed country it is shocking that this outdated system is still in use. The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Leo Varadkar, has assured me that Irish Rail is currently investigating the feasibility of retrofitting electronic ramps on the DART fleet. I am aware of the budget constraints in Irish Rail at this time but it is my opinion that there should be at least one wheelchair accessible carriage with an electronic ramp provided on each DART service. The accessible carriage could be located at the back of each train so customers in need know the ramp is available. I am happy that the Minister is aware of the current problems in this area. It is important that Irish Rail examines the matter thoroughly to ascertain what action can be taken to make it easier for people to access existing trains if funding is not available for new trains to be purchased with built-in electronic ramps. The possibility of retrofitting electronic ramps to existing trains needs to be seriously considered and, if feasible, put in place as soon as possible.

I take this opportunity to ask the Minister of State for an update on Irish Rail's efforts to resolve the problem of overcrowded DART trains at peak times. A number of constituents have reported to me that they remain unsatisfied with the service being provided, especially given the increased prices for DART services currently and cuts to carriage size and no improvements made in terms of the frequency of the trains provided. Action needs to be taken in this area. I would appreciate if the Minister of State could give an update on developments in this area and also what action Irish Rail is taking to improve communication with its customers in regard to delays. Recently a constituent of mine who was travelling to work experienced a delay due to a signal failure on the southside. The train left Connolly Station and proceeded to the bridge at the back of Store Street where it stood for more than ten minutes. Quite rightly, customers were upset. Such delays cause much unnecessary anxiety, particularly when there is a lack of communication as to what is happening with the train. Perhaps the Minister of State would respond to that issue and provide information as to whether he is in regular contact with Irish Rail on these issues.

I am delighted the Minister has considered the whole issue of reduced fares for off-peak travel times and that he has been in consultation on the issue. I acknowledge that the National Transport Authority is considering the issue currently.

Minister of State at the Department of Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation (Deputy John Perry)

I thank the Deputy for the opportunity to address this issue in the House on behalf of my colleague the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Leo Varadkar, who is abroad on Government business.

The Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport is funding an ongoing programme of accessibility improvement grants to upgrade existing public transport infrastructure and facilities. This includes funding for the upgrading of Iarnród Éireann stations to ensure they are accessible to people with mobility, sensory and cognitive impairments. Funding in the region of €48 million has been provided to the company for this purpose since 2006. This programme is being administered on behalf of the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport by the National Transport Authority.

I understand that Iarnród Éireann's current policy is to have a portable wheelchair ramp at all stations and they are also located on board inter city trains. A member of staff is made available to deploy the ramp safely for use once advance notice is provided, which is the point the Deputy raised.

On the matter of electric ramps the company advises that due to the variability of the interfaces between trains and platforms, including curved platforms, and platforms of different heights, the only possible option for electric ramps is for them to be permanently fitted on board trains. In this regard, Iarnród Éireann undertook a feasibility study into the installation of automatic wheelchair ramps. The study concluded that retrofitting the existing fleet is very challenging from a technical viewpoint and would involve considerable structural alteration to the train design. The best approach would be to incorporate ramps into the train at the design stage of new rolling stock. In effect, due to their complexity this would require that they are built into the train when it is first constructed. The company is committed to such a requirement when ordering new rolling stock in the future. Accordingly it has amended the technical specification for future procurement of new trains to include costed options to incorporate an automatic wheelchair ramp. However, there is currently no requirement for additional rolling stock and no funding is available under the current capital plan to purchase new rolling stock.

The question of retrofitting the existing rolling stock to incorporate electric ramps would also require significant funding and there is no funding available at present for this work.

Iarnród Éireann is currently undertaking an audit of all rail stations on behalf of the National Transport Authority which is close to completion and the outcome of this will inform future proposals for improving access at railway stations.

I understand that Iarnród Éireann holds regular meetings with accessibility user groups and has produced an information leaflet to assist those with disabilities using its services.

In addition, Iarnród Éireann is also in discussions with the Central Remedial Clinic regarding the use of Killester station by wheelchair users and has put an agreed protocol in place to assist wheelchair users when travelling on DART services at Killester station. This has ensured that there is generally a member of staff available to assist wheelchair users at Killester station. If a member of staff is not available, Iarnród Éireann is committed to redeploying a staff member to ensure assistance is available at Killester station. It has also invited representatives from the Central Remedial Clinic to future meetings of its accessibility user groups.

The issue raised by the Deputy is dependent on funding availability. Iarnród Éireann is in consultation with its station and is making every effort to engage with the groups who would require a ramp. A huge attempt was made to deal with the issue at Killester station.

Deputy Terence Flanagan

I thank the Minister of State for taking this matter on behalf of the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport. We are dealing with a real issue here. It is unsatisfactory that disabled persons are not in a position to board a train at a moment's notice. That is a major issue and a matter of concern for many people. In his response, I understand the Minister of State to say that there is no funding available to retrofit the existing rolling stock. However, not every carriage needs an electronic ramp installed. What I am seeking, at a minimum, is that one carriage in every four or five has an accessibility point incorporating the electronic ramp. I would appreciate if the Minister of State would convey that request to the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport.

I welcome the developments at Killester station and the fact that Irish Rail is seeking to make progress in consultation with the Central Remedial Clinic. If the service can be rolled out to all DART stations there is no reason a dedicated member of staff cannot be available to assist with the ramp and to make the DART more accessible for those who are disabled rather than discriminating against them.

No Member of this House would like to see discrimination continue against people because they use wheelchairs. That is very wrong. I thank the Minister of State and I would like him to raise this issue directly with the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Varadkar.

Deputy John Perry

The Deputy’s point is very valid, and I will raise it with the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Varadkar. I fully understand the Deputy’s very clear point. Iarnród Éireann does its utmost to facilitate all passengers. On the Sligo line a ramp is available. Many of the station personnel, when they are on the platform, can make this ramp available very quickly on the Sligo-Dublin line. The cost of adjusting the rolling stock would be prohibitive. I believe the Minister is in consultation with Iarnród Éireann, which is co-operating to facilitate this in times of great financial constraint. I will raise the issue with the Minister.

Deputy Terence Flanagan

The problem with Iarnród Éireann is the 24 hours’ notice that the wheelchair user must provide.

Deputy John Perry

That is the maximum requirement but according to my information 24 hours is not an exact stipulation. If somebody arrives at the station an hour or half an hour before his or her departure and makes this known to personnel the ramp will be made available. A lot of common sense is used.

Deputy Terence Flanagan

If it is being used.

Deputy John Perry

I am quite certain that 24 hours is the maximum stipulation, but managers have discretion and the person can arrive half an hour before departure.

Driver Licence Applications

Deputy Timmy Dooley

I recognise that the Minister of State is standing in for the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport.

We have reached a crisis point in the issuing of driver licences. Last October responsibility transferred from local authorities to the National Driver Licensing Service, NDLS, under the auspices of the Road Safety Authority, RSA. At that stage it was clear that significant delays had built up at the start of the process of issuing replacement or new driver licenses. At the time I refrained from public comment because I felt that a new agency would inevitably have teething problems and should be given an appropriate length of time to resolve whatever teething problems might exist. The situation has, however, gone from bad to worse. Over the past couple of months the waiting time has gradually lengthened and people are very frustrated.

Many of our young citizens have unfortunately had to travel outside the country to find work. They are in Australia, the Middle East, the United States and many other countries. Most of them require driver licences in those countries. Some come home expecting to have their driver licenses renewed or replaced within a normal holiday period. That is not happening. The waiting time is now close to eight weeks. It is really frustrating for the people concerned. They have to leave an application form here and do not have a licence when they return to the country where they work. People going on holidays who need their driver licences renewed cannot hire a car. This is having a real impact on the lives of many citizens at home and abroad. I am not sure why it is happening. I hope the Minister of State can give some indication today of the reasons for the delay, but, more important, I want to hear from the Minister of State, on behalf of the Government, what solution it proposes to ensure these delays are brought to an end at the earliest possible opportunity.

I am not jumping on a bandwagon, and never have done so in respect of this issue. I accepted the need to allow a bedding-in process for the new service provider to get its act together, get its systems in place and operational, and then resolve any outstanding glitches in the system. We are well past that stage now. From October 2013 to almost the end of February 2014 is far beyond the timeframe one would expect for a resolution of the problem.

I appeal to the Minister of State to communicate the concerns of this House to the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport and to put an action plan in place if the Government does not already have one. People are extremely frustrated. They are contacting Deputies’ offices throughout the country in the expectation that we can somehow involve ourselves in the process. That is not the right thing to do. It would be wrong for us to try to help people jump the queue. There are acute circumstances in which calls will be made to the NDLS, but that is not good enough. The system needs to deliver better than that. The expectation was that there would be a more uniform approach, a better system for our citizens. That does not seem to be the case. Unless the Government can resolve the issue without delay, people will suffer further annoyance and discomfort.

Deputy John Perry

On behalf of the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Varadkar, I thank Deputy Dooley for raising this issue.

Following a Government decision in May 2011, the RSA was given responsibility for the operation of a centralised driver licensing service. In preparation for the introduction of the new plastic card licences, the RSA became the sole licensing authority for the country with effect from January 2013. The RSA operates the service through the NDLS, which comprises a central unit in the RSA and three outsourced contractors: a card producer for the plastic card licence, a front office to engage with the public, and a back office to process applications. This service came into operation from 29 October 2013.

There have been problems with the speed of processing applications in the NDLS since the system came on stream. The Minister has had regular discussions with the acting CEO of the RSA regarding the difficulties people have experienced and how the RSA proposed to address them. The RSA acknowledged that there were teething problems when the service opened. Some were technical and systems issues, while others related to new staff becoming familiar with the rules and processes around driving licences and permits. However, the system is improving.

The RSA responded by increasing resources in NDLS centres experiencing delays, as well as in the licence processing centre, and providing further training to staff. There are no major technical difficulties now affecting the service. A booking system to allow for customers to make appointments has been operating in a pilot phase, which was successful. This system is currently in use in Dublin, Cork and Tullamore, and is being extended on a phased basis to all NDLS offices.

In number terms, of the 150,804 applications received since 29 October, 124,688 licences have been issued. Dealing with what the NDLS regards as problem applications is taking longer. These are cases in which the application is incomplete or further information or documentation is needed to process the application. This involves contacting the customer, and finalisation of these applications is taking several weeks.

The NDLS is on track to have a ten day turnaround by the end of February and a five to eight day turnaround by the end of March, which would be a major resolution of the problem. There is, as the RSA acknowledges, a backlog within the system, including problem applications, which must now be prioritised to ensure that customers get speedy contact from the NDLS to advise that there is an issue requiring resolution.

It is evident that there are significant numbers of customers who attend at NDLS centres without getting their application processed because they have incomplete or incorrect documentation. Some of this arises because there is a tighter ID regime in place than before the NDLS, in line with the SAFE 2 standard. The RSA is carrying out an on-the-spot survey over the next two weeks at several large NDLS centres to determine the exact nature of the problem. This may reveal that the information provided to customers on the application form or supporting documentation is not clear or complete or is unnecessarily complex or contradictory. The RSA will act quickly on the outcome of that survey if it suggests that changes need to be introduced. The Minister has asked me to convey to the House that he is continuing to monitor progress, but that overall he is satisfied that the RSA has taken appropriate actions to address the problems that have arisen.

Deputy Timmy Dooley

I recognise the bona fides of the Minister, Deputy Leo Varadkar, in this regard. I have no doubt that he has been in contact with the Road Safety Authority, that he is concerned and that he is receiving information similar to this from his constituents and people around the country, but I disagree vehemently with his acceptance that, in general terms, as the Minister of State put it, he is satisfied that the RSA has taken the appropriate actions to address the problem. I am not critical of the RSA. It does a fine job, particularly in regard to road safety, but it has been caught on the hop to some extent on this issue. It did not expect the number of problems that have arisen. Clearly, it is training staff on the go, but that process should have been up and running in some parallel way for some time to ensure the staff would build the competencies needed and that we would not see a backlog developing.

I am not happy that the RSA has done enough to solve this problem which was identified in early November. We are coming towards the end of February and still do not have the level of turnaround needed. If we are down to a ten day turnaround by the end of this month, that will be a phenomenal improvement and, by and large, acceptable. If it can be brought down to a five to eight day turnaround by the end of March, it will be a good result, but from what I am hearing from people generally, that is not the experience. I hope the matter can be addressed, but we need much faster action from the RSA; a two week pilot study is not enough. The process is not moving quickly enough when we consider the negative impact the lack of a replacement licence is having on the lives of so many. I thank the Minister of State for coming to the House and addressing the issue in the way that he has done.

Deputy John Perry

This is a major transformation of the service. Of 150,000 applications, almost 125,000 licences have been issued. In respect of incomplete applications, regardless of how good the office is, if an application is incomplete, the licence cannot be issued. There is a responsibility on the applicant to correct his or her application. The National Driver Licence Service, NDLS, is on track to have a ten day turnaround by the end of February, which represents a complete transformation of the service. That is a major achievement in moving from a unified system. I respect the issue the Deputy has raised which the Minister will take on board and is monitoring closely. I compliment the staff who are working tirelessly to get this system up and running in the most efficient way possible. No matter how efficient an office is, where there are incomplete applications - I deal with incomplete applications in my office - they cannot be dealt with. That message should also go out.

Deputy Timmy Dooley

I understand the difficulty associated with incomplete applications, but that is not the issue I raise. I have great sympathy for any group of people who have to deal with the public on a daily basis because there will always be a number of cases in which documentation will be incomplete. I am talking about applications that are complete and where it still takes seven to eight weeks to turn them around. That is the problem.

Deputy John Perry

Have faith; it is coming. It is on track.

Deputy Timmy Dooley

I have great faith in the Minister of State, but I am deeply concerned about the impact this is having on the lives of so many.

Deputy John Perry

The Minister is very concerned also.

Deputy Timmy Dooley

I have no doubt about that, but we need more than concern; we need action. If it is an issue of resources or a requirement for the RSA to be provided with more funding from the State, that should happen in the short term. When this issue came before the transport committee, there was a discussion about the fact that the service would be self-financing. It should not, therefore, be a resource issue. I hope the problem can be solved and that people can receive their licences in a timely manner to allow them to go about their daily business.

Sitting suspended at 1.55 p.m. and resumed at 2.55 p.m.