Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 24 Jun 2014

Vol. 845 No. 1

Beef Industry: Motion [Private Members]

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

I move:

That Dáil Éireann:

notes:

— the vital role the beef sector plays in the agrifood industry generating €2 billion a year to the economy;

— that some 100,000 farms across the country produce beef, helping to make Ireland the fifth highest beef exporter in the world and forming a core part of the 150,000 people employed in the agrifood industry in Ireland;

— that the Food Harvest 2020 report and Beef 2020 Activation Group set ambitious targets to increase beef output by 40%, worth an additional €550 million to the economy; and

— that the annual Teagasc income report recorded grave disparities in farm incomes, with dry stock farmers falling seriously behind their counterparts; cattle-rearing farms saw incomes decline by 22% to €9,469 due to higher production costs associated with severe fodder shortages early last year;

further notes that:

— over the past 12 months there has been a collapse in bull beef prices; prices have fallen from 15% to 20%, with producers being forced to accept losses of up to €200 to €300 per head, pushing under-pressure farmers over the edge;

— factories have abused the quality payment system and shifted specification requirements in order to drive down farm gate prices;

— labelling issues have been used to create artificial trade barriers and deny Irish beef access to the British market with cattle finished in Northern Ireland refused their traditional labelling status;

— processors have created unwarranted delays in slaughtering cattle that is further driving down price; and

— Russia has arbitrarily banned offal meat eliminating the €7 million export market;

condemns the:

— failure of the Government to take decisive action on this long-running crisis in the beef industry; and

— cynical use of Beef Forum discussions as mere talking shops to distract from Government inaction; and

calls on the Government to:

— establish an independent beef regulator;

— move forward with legislation to recognise beef producer organisations;

— convene a meeting with their Northern Ireland and British counterparts to set out a strategy to overcome outstanding labelling issues;

— ensure that there are no barriers to the transport of live cattle to Britain directly from this State; and

— implement in full the recommendations of the Dowling report.

I wish to share time with Deputies Dara Calleary, Seamus Kirk and John Browne.

Acting Chairman (Deputy Liam Twomey)

Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

I am delighted the Minister of State, Deputy Tom Hayes, is present to take the motion, but, once again, it appears the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Simon Coveney, is away on what he considers to be more important business. We had a situation last week where he could not attend Question Time, even though we had facilitated a changing of the day in order that he could be present. We also had a situation where he was not present for Leaders' Questions to deal with the issue of beef production. Again, tonight, we find that beef farmers are let down by the fact that he does not think it is sufficiently important for him to be in the House. I welcome the Minister of State and wish him well in the forthcoming Cabinet reshuffle because it is clear the Minister has signed off, headed off into the sunset and is nowhere to be seen. However, he has left a trail of destruction behind him. For the past two years, since I became agriculture spokesperson for Fianna Fáil, I have been saying that in the long term the biggest issue that will have to be resolved is that of price to ensure farmers get a fair return on their product. The motion calls for the crisis since the back end of last year and earlier to be addressed.

Long before the bull beef price issue arose in the spring, I had been highlighting the fact that Irish prices were falling behind prices in British supermarkets. This is our primary industry. It affects 100,000 farms and 150,000 people across the country and is the backbone of the farming sector. I note the comments made by the ICMSA today that the cost of keeping a cow means that the production of weanlings is not paying and - a point I have been making for some considerable time - it is ridiculous in the long term to expect farmers to supplement their farming income from the single farm payment.

We are being told by the Minister that nothing can be done. Again, I have highlighted the fall in the price of liquid milk during the years; the farmer used to get over 43% of the price per litre in a shop, but this has fallen to 32%. According to the Irish Farmers Journal, in its agribusiness section last week, in 2013 a farmer was getting 57% of the price consumers were paying in a UK supermarket; he or she is now getting 42%, a fall of 15%. However, despite all of the evidence, the Minister says the market regulates itself. I put it to the Minister of State that because there are only a few players in the telecoms industry and several other, we have provided for regulators. Where there is a dominant player against a multitude of small players, a regulator is needed because somebody is needed to referee the match to ensure there is fair play. What does the Minister say? He says we should let the market regulate itself and let a few big players control the game

We had a situation which was particularly acute in the Minister of State's county where farmers with a considerable amount of livestock were advised to produce bull beef. We all know that beef cannot be provided according to the new age specification being required by the factories. There had been discussions with them and Teagasc about bull beef, but, suddenly, when it came to payday, there was no price to be obtained and many strong farmers were significantly burned because of what happened.

We are asking for a number of things to be done. At this stage, it should have impacted on the Government that there is a crisis, that something needs to be done and that we cannot continue with the current arrangement. Therefore, we have asked for the appointment of a beef regulator. We have also asked for an explanation as to why cattle can be put on a lorry and a boat in Larne, yet the same companies will not carry cattle from Dublin to Holyhead. A lot of ridiculous excuses were given as to why that was so, but we need to have the issue dealt with.

It is amazing that, with a Sinn Féin Minister in Northern Ireland, it has proved impossible to resolve the issue of nomad cattle. It is amazing that we cannot have weanlings brought from the west to the north east of Ireland and that there is a huge Border difficulty with labelling in that transaction. Nothing is happening. We see no evidence of the Minister pushing that agenda with this Northern counterpart, Ms Michelle O'Neill. I was very interested - he is in the same party as Ms O'Neill - when I listened to Deputy Martin Ferris at Question Time last week. He asked the Minister of State to persuade his boss to sit down with Ms O'Neill to resolve the issue. If we can prove that there is intransigence in the North, we can go to Ms O'Neill and take up the issue as to why she is being so intransigent. However, all of the indications from Ms O'Neill's colleague are that this is not the case.

There are things to be done. There are recommendatins in the Dowling report that should, no doubt, be implemented. However, just sitting around and talking about it in talking shops, with no action being taken, while farmers are suffering huge losses in their businesses - the bigger they are, the bigger the losses - is not acceptable. It is important that, rather than the platitudes in the counter-motion brought forward by the Government, the Minister of State as someone who comes from a strong farming area and a strong farming background outline the actions the Government will take, rather than words, and tell us that he is going to do something more than provide for the soft supports outlined in the amendment.

I refer to the quality assurance scheme. A quality assurance scheme should be a way of guaranteeing premium prices, as I am sure the Minister of State will agree. However, it is interesting that while 87% of farmers are in the quality assurance scheme, the reality is that the bonus is being paid in respect of only a very small number of cattle. The reality is that the scheme has been manipulated in such a way that the quality assurance bonus is being paid in respect of one quarter of the cattle going into factories. Instead of being a scheme to put up prices for farmers, as the farming organisations have highlighted, the quality assurance scheme is being used as a mechanism to have a very tight specification, even though most of the cattle are being sold into the British market and at the same price as the rest. Many cattle are now being discounted because the quality assurance scheme is doing the exact opposite of what it was intended to do.

This is a Bord Bia-promoted scheme. I understand it comes under the Department's policy. Again, it is having the opposite effect on farmers.

The biggest issue facing farming and the primary producers of food in this country and Europe and around the world is the inability of the small producer to ensure fair prices from dominant multiples and processors. We have often heard talk about Fair Trade coffee and other products. This is not a crisis of yesterday or today but one that has been going on for some considerable time. The Government has refused even to recognise that this is a major issue for all primary producers and that we need to level the playing field to ensure that primary producers, not only in this country but across Europe and the world, are protected against the powers of forces much greater than themselves.

Deputy Dara Calleary

I thank Deputy Ó Cuív for giving us the opportunity to discuss this crisis facing the Irish beef industry this evening. Imagine a situation in any other sector of the economy in which the average income had fallen by between 13% and 22%, in which that frame was from just over €9,500 to €15,000, in which prices were down between 15% and 20% in one year, and in which the primary producer was taking a loss of €300 per head on the primary input. It would be a crisis and there would be an outcry. Instead, what do we get? The Government amendment this evening is as watery as the Titanic. It talks about the importance of the beef sector to the economy - lovely motherhood and apple pie stuff. The amendment then says the Government has set up a round table - happy days. Those at the round table are talking while this crisis is happening on the ground and the quality of supply and the economics of the industry are literally going through the floor. Meanwhile, the Government has set up a round table. The Government set up a "Beef Pricewatch" online tool to make price information more accessible. That is absolutely no good to farmers with a limited choice of where to send their animals, when the price differences are so small that the cost of transporting animals across the country, which has been jacked up in recent times, will obliterate any price difference.

The beef round table should be asking why those prices are the same and why there is such a small disparity between prices. Is that kind of issue being put to the producers? It is probably not being put to them because this is a Government that kowtows to the big industry players - no offence to the Minister of State - and forgets the producer and the place of the producer in the important chain of our food and beef industries. The same approach is being adopted by the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation with regard to the Competition and Consumer Protection Bill. Amendments that tried to strengthen protection for the primary producer - the farmer - against the might of big grocery multiples were voted down. The Minister's view was "Let them eat cake. Let the market decide." This seems to be what the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine is intent on doing here in respect of the beef market.

We must inject urgency and then action into this debate. Farmers are key to all of this, because this element seems to have been forgotten by the Department in respect of the beef round table. If the Minister of State has confidence in the beef round table, he will commit to the establishment of an independent regulator who will have the power to say who is wrong here and to challenge the factories and the prices they are paying.

We also need a discussion about our market access policies. There is no sense in highlighting the fact that the Minister has given Bord Bia €500,000 to expand and target the promotion of Irish beef. For a start, that is a drop in the ocean and, frankly, what is Bord Bia doing with it when prices for consumers have gone up in supermarkets across the UK but prices for producers have gone way down? The demand is there. People want Irish beef, and to know that it is Irish beef, but the people who producing it are not getting paid enough and that is where the Government is continuing to stick its head in the sand. We will very quickly end up in a situation in which we will not have the produce and stock because so many people are getting out of it. So many people are deciding that this is not a space they want to be in and to put their families into. Meanwhile, the Government has a round table - well, good luck with that.

We need a Minister who is a Minister and who is not on a glory tour of the world before he moves to his next Ministry. We need a Minister who actually has the courage to challenge the beef industry and to say to it that at the end of the day it is dependent on the primary producer and it must treat that primary producer with respect, not just with regard to price but with regard to the quality of stock, the input and the way it deals with him or her. We do not have that relationship at the moment. We have a relationship that puts the industry first and the farmer very much second and last in line, and that is across a range of Government policies in a range of different areas in the Department. It cannot last.

Surely, at a time of collapsing beef prices, there should be some kind of emergency plan in terms of income? Instead we have seen the farm assist scheme restricted and cracks beginning to emerge in the GLAS programme in the past week, which have been highlighted by Deputy Ó Cuív. In the amendment, the Government is highlighting it as a significant investment for the lifetime of the rural development programme, but we have seen that there are so many restrictions around it that many rural farmers will not actually get into it. What specific initiatives will there be for beef farmers? What specific initiatives will there be to assist with the price of stock, which is what we are discussing here tonight?

The Government talks about the beef genomics and beef data schemes and the beef technology adoption programme, all of which are welcome and significant. However, at the end of the day, when farmers are leaving the beef market, that is no good to anybody. When they are not getting the price for their stock and are trading at a loss of €300 per head, that is no good to anybody. That will not put bread on the table.

Again, we are looking at market access areas. Deputy Ó Cuív has already raised the area of live exports. We seem to have lost the hunger for promoting that. I do not know what will happen in the Department after July, but please give us a Minister with hunger who actually cares about the primary producer and a Government policy that cares for the primary producers in all other Departments. We will get an indication of that next week in the House when the Competition and Consumer Protection Bill is debated on Report Stage and when we will move the amendments we moved on Committee Stage that seek to protect the producer. We will challenge the entire House to debate them and to go and vote either way. Hopefully, Members will decide to protect the producer.

There is no more time for talking, round tables, or, in the words of the amendment, "bringing together farm organisations, beef processors and relevant State agencies to discuss recent challenges." The Government put that up as the first line in its amendment as a significant achievement. They should be coming together anyway. There should be regular dialogue anyway, but it seems that this is a sudden big achievement on the part of the Government when it is included in the first line of the amendment. We need urgency, because it is not there. If anything comes out of these two nights, if urgency is injected into this situation and if the reality of the situation is impressed upon the Department, it will have been successful. I know all the Government Deputies will come in here tomorrow night, troop in behind this amendment and cheer the Minister of State on, but what happens at 9.10 p.m. tomorrow will make no difference to the beef farmers of this country, who will still face huge challenges and the prospect of possibly having to leave the industry. Where will that leave us?

Deputy Seamus Kirk

There are 100,000 farms across this country that depend on the beef industry. Out of that group, some farmers are full-time while others are part-time. It is very much down to the structure and fragmented nature of farm ownership that the change that is needed in this area has not materialised over the years. When we examine the industry here tonight, the various contributions will identify the serious loss that has taken place over the past 12 months. The beef industry has been in a serious downward spiral.

The beef industry has been an integral part of the Irish agricultural industry.

It is worth approximately €2 billion a year to the economy, a statistic which should not be underestimated. Over the past six months, beef prices have plunged by up to 20% while retail prices in the UK are increasing at the expense of the primary producer. Changes in the Internal Market through beef specification restrictions and the external market through trade barriers with the UK via labelling have combined to drive down prices. The Michael Dowling report recommends the establishment of an independent beef regulator which, as Deputy Ó Cuív indicated, we fully support and the opening up of Northern Ireland to live cattle exports. The Teagasc interim survey in 2013 revealed that beef producers earn on average €9,500 per annum. This crisis will be the last straw for many farmers. The bald statistics along with the minimum wage position in other areas in the economy graphically illustrate the needs of farmers.

Over the past 12 months, bull beef prices have collapsed with factories altering the age, weight and specifications required to slaughter cattle. Producers have been forced to accept losses of up to €300 per head. Teagasc estimates that producers need to earn €4 per kilo for beef to be economically viable in the long term. The current price of between €3.50 and €3.75 per kilo falls very much short of that requirement. A continuation of the present crisis will have profound implications for exports and employment in the sector. The Food Harvest 2020 strategy targets will not be met if prices continue to stagnate while the viability of the suckler herd is under threat if income levels are not increased. Without direct payments from the EU, beef farms would be out of business. The Michael Dowling report identified a number of issues needing urgent attention, including improved transparency, the potential for producer organisations, more formal contract arrangements between factories and suppliers, the small number of processors in the State and the cartel problem, which is a major difficulty for the industry.

The Minister must negotiate with his British and Northern Ireland counterparts. Northern Ireland has a Sinn Féin Minister of Agriculture and Rural Development in Stormont. There is a clear opportunity for our Minister and his counterpart in Northern Ireland to develop an all-island industry. The moment is now and let us get on with it. Live exports to the UK would provide the safety valve for an export-dependent industry. Let us empower primary producers in Ireland. The targets under the Food Harvest 2020 strategy will not be met unless there are radical changes in one of our most important industries. The time for change is now. The Michael Dowling report mentioned specific changes that are needed but, at the end of the day, we need to examine the overall position of the industry and realise where the dynamics lie and where the control and empowerment within the industry lies. We need change quickly.

It is difficult to believe that we cannot work towards a position where there is a much more integrated approach to the overall development of the beef industry in Ireland and the UK. There would be a mutual benefit for primary producers and consumers in both jurisdictions. Both ourselves and Britain are members of the EU and there is potential to develop a better, more coherent and more co-operative approach to the development of the industry to ensure its sustainability in the long term.

I call on the Minister to realise he must achieve movement on the issues I have mentioned because otherwise we will have no industry. Suckler farmers will go out business and our exports will collapse. They are worth €2 billion annually, which is of significant benefit to the economy and the Exchequer. It is vitally important that the Minister and the Department realise the importance of that statistic and move to implement the changes that are urgently needed.

Deputy John Browne

I welcome the opportunity to contribute to the debate and I compliment Deputy Ó Cuív on tabling the motion. Beef farmers, of whom there are many in County Wexford, feel the Minister has lost the plot and has caved into the factories and allowed them to run roughshod over them in respect of beef prices. If the current scenario continues, many of them will go out of business. They will be seeking social welfare payments because they will be unable to continue in farming. I spoke to one of the most progressive farmers in Wexford earlier and he said that payments are down approximately €400 per head or €1.10 per kilo in comparison to last year. He was paid €4.85 per kilo last year but he is in receipt of only €3.70 per kilo this year. He predicts the suckler herd will be halved over the next two years. Prices are reducing and he referred to increased payments and other bills, including the property tax, water charges, universal social charge and health insurance.

The beef crisis is jeopardising the livelihoods of 100,000 farmers. A cocktail of retailers, processors and Government inaction is undermining prices and destroying the Food Harvest 2020 strategy targets. Under the strategy, the suckler herd is to double, yet the farming community predicts it will be halved over the next two years. I read last week that many farmers in County Clare are getting out of suckler rearing and that must be a serious concern to the Minister in the context of the viability of the beef industry.

The meat factories are changing regulations willy-nilly and introducing new concepts regarding how they define quality but this is being done at the expense of the farmer. Retailers are achieving a higher margin than ever, again at the expense of the farmer. The Minister has not taken action to deal with this. There are a large number of beef farmers in my county. We also have meat factories, which employ many people, that depend on these farmers to supply them. Many jobs have been lost in my area and in every part of the country and we do not want to lose the jobs in the meat plants.

Changes in the Internal Market through beef specification restrictions and in the external market through trade barriers with the UK via labelling have combined to drive down prices. While I accept prices have reduced in Europe, prices in Ireland have reduced more. Surely this anomaly needs to be corrected in order that farmers are paid a decent price for their product. The Minister, as previous speakers said, seems to have washed his hands of the issue. Instead of giving decisive leadership, he has convened two summits on the issue but farmers are tired of summits. These are talking shops with no action and no price increases for farmers. He will find it difficult to get the IFA and other farming organisations to attend more summits because, having attended a number of them, payments have not increased to enable farmers to provide a decent standard of living for their families.

We do not want any more summits, but action from the Minister. The Government must endorse the Dowling report, establish an independent beef regulator and open Northern Ireland to live cattle exports. The Minister, Deputy Coveney's attempt to side-step the issue while he awaits promotion within the Cabinet is an insult to farmers. I was surprised that the Minister, whose sincerity I have always respected, told farmers he may not be the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine next week or next month. Obviously, he is in line to move to a different Cabinet portfolio. Meanwhile, he should not abandon the farmers but ensure that while he is there he makes every effort to ensure they receive an adequate payment for the product they produce.

For far too long the retailers and supermarkets have been ripping off the farming community. I do not blame this Government alone; different Ministers have failed to act on this issue. We have heard may promises of action against the supermarkets which seem to drive down the prices paid to farmers every year. A number of supermarkets are selling products such as carrots and potatoes way below the cost of production. How is that happening? They are forcing down prices and playing havoc with the livelihoods of the farming community. Coming from Tipperary, which has a large number of beef farmers, the Minister of State, Deputy Tom Hayes, is well aware of the situation. I hope he will take a direct interest in doing something in a sincere way that will ensure the farming community will have a decent and adequate standard of living.

The Dowling report seems to be good. It arose from an initial round-table discussion in April. It emphasised a number of areas that need to be addressed, including improved transparency and timely communication on price and market specification, particularly between suppliers and processors, which is not happening. The report also recommended a formalised mechanism for ensuring that research, breeding and education remain consistent with evolving market realities. It noted the potential for producer organisations recognised under the EU’s Common Market organisation rules to play a role in building scale for farmers in the supply chain and building more professional relationships with the processing sector. There seems to be a "them and us" situation between the farmer who is not receiving an adequate price, the beef factories in the middle, and the supermarket and retailers which are creaming off large profits. These three areas should come together. The Dowling report also flagged the possibility of more formalised contract arrangements between factories and their suppliers.

In my county, factories will no longer take a load of cattle from a farmer. A few years ago one could put 25 or 30 cattle into a lorry and the factory would take them all. Now, they might take between three and seven cattle, and might postpone delivery of them until another day or week. It is important that the Minister of State find out why that is happening. While it is to the benefit of the factory and retailer, it is not to the benefit of the farmer.

The Government must establish a fully independent beef regulator to oversee the long-term sustainability of the industry and ensure transparency. The concentration of a small number of processors exposes the industry to the threat of cartels, as Deputy Kirk said, which a regulator would help to prevent. A regulator would help promote communication and medium to long-term planning between the facets of the industry rather than the short-termism that is destroying the beef industry. I am sure the Minister of State, Deputy Hayes, will take the message to the Minister that the situation is dire. When I hear very good beef producers in Wexford talking about going out of business, not having a decent standard of living for their families and going to claim social welfare payments, it is time for all of us to wake up and do something about the situation to ensure the beef industry will survive into the future.

Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine (Deputy Tom Hayes)

I move amendment No. 1:

To delete all words after “Dáil Éireann” and substitute the following:

“notes:

— the importance of the beef sector to the economy, demonstrated by the 8% increase in the combined value of meat and livestock exports in 2013, rising by €245 million to reach €3.3 billion;

— that the beef sector performance has already surpassed the Food Harvest 2020 target by 18% and has almost reached the Beef 2020 Activation Group revised target of 40%;

— that total live exports to date this year are over 150,000 head, of which 25,000 went to the UK, an increase of 14% on the comparable period in 2013;

— that beef prices have weakened since the high of 2013, but prices in Ireland still remain above the EU 15 average; and

— that there has been evidence of weakened consumer demand due in part to competitive factors from other meat products;

recognises that the beef sector remains a priority for Government in terms of support of agriculture and that a number of actions have been taken by the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine to date to deal with current challenges including:

— a round table on the beef sector has met on two occasions bringing together farm organisations, beef processors and relevant State agencies to discuss recent challenges;

— a ‘Beef Pricewatch’ online tool to make price information more accessible and free of charge to farmers is being developed;

— legislation for the recognition of producer organisations in the beef sector is being developed and a consultation with key stakeholder groups will commence shortly;

— Bord Bia has allocated €0.5 million to expand and target promotion of Irish beef through its campaigns in the UK and in certain continental markets, added to the annual overall beef marketing budget of €9 million;

— the Dowling report has been completed and recommends a simple and transparent system of price recognition for animals within market specification based on the Quality Payments System, with a bonus to incentivise production to optimal market specification;

— the Report also calls on processors to ensure that communication with farmers on any changes to market specifications takes account of the normal production cycle;

— Teagasc, Bord Bia and the Irish Cattle Breeding Federation are working together to ensure that advice, education and breeding policy remains consistent with evolving markets; and

— the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine discussed beef trade challenges with his Northern Ireland counterpart, Minister Michelle O’Neill, at a recent North-South Ministerial Council and discussions are ongoing in this regard; and acknowledges that:

— significant commitments have been made by Government to invest in the beef sector through a revised Common Agricultural Policy negotiated by the Irish Presidency of the EU worth €12.5 billion to the Irish agrifood sector;

— €295 million is programmed for the Beef Data Programme and the Beef Genomics Scheme under the Rural Development Programme, RDP;

— the new agri-environment scheme, GLAS, will provide for a total investment of €l,450 million over the lifetime of the RDP, significantly benefitting beef farmers;

— in 2014, €40 million is being invested in the beef sector through the Beef Genomics Scheme, the Beef Data and Beef Technology Adoption Programmes;

— targeted on-farm capital investments will also be provided to suckler farmers through the new RDP;

— market access has recently been achieved for beef in countries such as Japan, Singapore, Egypt and Iran; in 2014, access terms have been agreed with the Lebanon and Namibia; inspections and negotiations are ongoing in regard to the Chinese and Canadian markets; and, after a significant diplomatic and technical effort, the United States Food Safety and Inspection Service will shortly be auditing Irish plants with a view to allowing beef access to the US;

— the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine is currently embarking on a very significant trade mission to the US regarding beef access and negotiations on the Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership; and

— the US Secretary for Agriculture, Mr. Thomas Vilsack, and senior Chinese representative Mr. Liu Yunshan both visited Ireland last week to discuss beef trade issues and other agrifood opportunities.”

Developing the beef sector for the betterment of the 100,000 Irish livestock farmers has been a clear priority for the Government since taking office in 2011. I am the first to acknowledge, as does the Minister, Deputy Coveney, that prices are down on this time last year, mainly due to 2013 being an exceptionally high year for beef prices in Ireland. The price per kilo was €3.79 in 2014, €4.07 in 2013, €3.86 in 2012, €3.46 in 2011 when we came to power, and €2.90 in the last full year of the previous Government.

Prices are matters to be determined between purchasers and sellers of cattle and it is neither appropriate nor possible for me to intervene directly in this issue. The days of market intervention are gone. My focus is on developing the potential of the beef industry, and expectations that I can intervene in the price relationship are misplaced. It is disingenuous to say that I can intervene. The relationship between processors and farmers is an interdependent one. Farmers and processors always fight their own corners to get the best prices.

It is important to acknowledge market evolution in recent years. In 2013, the performance of the beef sector was strong, with output of over 518,000 tonnes, an increase of 5% over 2012. The value of beef exports increased in 2013 by 10% to €2.1 billion. Irish beef prices were 106% of the EU average in 2013 and, notwithstanding recent fluctuations, remain above the EU average. Beef prices are under pressure all across Europe and especially in our key market, the UK, which takes almost 50% of our beef exports. Three weeks ago I compared the UK prices in Sainsbury's supermarkets to ours. The managers of those supermarkets told me we are consistently under pressure in their supermarkets and there is a strong determination by the UK National Farmers Union that they sell only UK beef. That is a real problem which we, as a country, should work together to change in the next few years, if possible.

As Deputies will be aware, Food Harvest 2020 outlines a strategy for the development of Ireland's agrifood industry, including the beef sector. My clear focus has been and will remain on delivering on the actions necessary to allow the beef sector to deliver on the targets it set for itself in Food Harvest 2020.

It is important at this point to acknowledge the significant existing Government support for the beef sector, contributing towards its development. During the Irish Presidency of the EU, the Government negotiated a CAP package worth €12.5 billion to the Irish agrifood sector, which will see considerable investment within the beef sector. It was acknowledged by almost everybody in the country including the farming organisations and those involved in the industry as well as those who witnessed the performance of the Minister in the talks at first hand. The geonomics programme in the rural development plan is worth up to €52 per year for farmers. Last week at Grange, the determination of farmers to change the industry was evident in the large number of attendees. I attended and saw their determination first hand. In 2014, there is €40 million of national Exchequer funds for the beef sector through a range of schemes. I am pleased to note that €10 million in payments commenced today to farmers under the data programme announced last year.

Deputies will be aware that in response to recent issues, the Minister, Deputy Coveney, invited key stakeholders, including farm organisations, beef processors and relevant State agencies, to a round table discussion on the future development of the beef sector. This initiative was intended to provide a useful forum for all main players in the industry to engage positively and present constructive ideas on positioning the sector to address current challenges. Discussions at the second round table included presentations from the ICBF, Bord Bia and Teagasc with the main focus being on the presentation by Mr. Michael Dowling, who had updated his work on the implementation of the beef activation programme. Under no circumstances did Mr. Dowling at any stage recommend a regulator for the industry. In his report, Mr Dowling recommended improved transparency and timely communication on price and market specification between suppliers and processors and consideration of possibilities for more formalised contract arrangements between factories and their suppliers.

On transparency, my Department has made a number of improvements to its website in order to facilitate farmers. Arising from the round table discussions, I announced an additional allocation by Bord Bia of €500,000, which brings its total international marketing spending to €9 million. I urge stakeholders to reflect carefully on the proceedings at the first two meetings of the beef forum and on the Dowling report and to take time to engage with each other on its recommendations to find mutually satisfactory solutions to the current crisis. I acknowledge with everyone else that we face a difficulty. We need to co-operate.

There is a misconception out there that no live exports are taking place. My Department attaches considerable importance to the live export trade. Total live exports to date this year stand at more than 150,000 head, of which 25,000 went to the UK, an increase of some 3,100 head. These are the facts. There are live exports and the Government will not stand in the way of them. In fact, we will encourage live exports wherever possible.

We are in ongoing dialogue with our Northern Ireland counterpart, Ms Michelle O'Neill. I have met her twice in the past three weeks and the Minister, Deputy Coveney, has met her on several occasions. There is no issue about meeting her. We will meet her tomorrow morning if it will help. The reality is that the issues are difficult to deal with. What we need is a proactive relationship with everybody to ensure we increase profits for farmers. As a beef farmer myself, I acknowledge the difficulties that exist. However, we will not get results when we condemn the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, who goes to the United States of America and who is currently walking around its supermarkets to deal with the issues. Last week, a Chinese representative visited to help us. We need co-operation and support, not condemnation of the industry.

Deputy Andrew Doyle

I thank Deputy Ó Cuív for moving the motion. The Joint Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine raised this issue first at the behest of my colleague, Deputy Deering, and asked that we do some work on it. With that in mind, we set about conducting hearings with all stakeholders, including farm organisations, the meat industry, ICOS, Bord Bia and Teagasc. While the issue initially was about bull beef and the change in the spec for the animals, which was definitely contentious, it became clear that unless all stakeholders sat down together, we would not have a beef industry in future. Nobody could project what sort of future it held. I am a still-active suckler farmer myself and I understand exactly what is going on here. I do not normally sell finished animals, but the issue has a ripple effect down upon us all. When the price is depressed, it feeds back down through the system.

I was amused at one stage. I have heard Deputies from the other side condemning the forum as a talking shop, yet part of the motion calls on the Government to implement in full the recommendations of the Dowling report. It seems contradictory. If one is not going to get people together to talk and to provide a forum in which people can thrash out the issues, chaired as this will be four times by the Minister, something vitally important will not be done. Some four or five years ago, we had the very same crisis in dairy when milk prices hit 20 cent per litre. It was unsustainable in the long run for farmers to continue to produce milk at that price. It was then and it is now. We must look at what constitutes a sustainable cost base on which the beef industry will be built. There is a variable in there compared to milk where people buy animals in the open market at different stages in their progression before they become ready for slaughter. We must look at that.

A few years ago, the meat industry told us it could process 40,000 cattle per week, but it does not seem to be able to do because markets are depressed. We must look at the big picture, an integral part of which is live exports. Live exports have increased but there is more to be done. Some would say it is sacrilegious to sell sometimes our best and sometimes our poorest animals on the hoof. Without it, the industry will not survive as it does not have alternatives. We must look at that. I hope further progress can be made with the North. There is an issue, but it can definitely be sorted out. At North-South level, the Minister, Deputy Coveney, has met regularly with his colleague, Ms Michelle O'Neill. Members of Sinn Féin might also urge the Northern Minister to get proactive with the Irish Government on this.

There has been significant investment. Geonomics and the beef data programme are about making improvements. My sons and I are involved in beef discussion groups which help to improve efficiency inside the farm gate. What we must do now is to see that the forum ensures that stakeholders in the industry work towards a single goal. If one does not have a primary product which can be produced for a margin, one will not have an industry.

Deputy John O'Mahony

I am glad to contribute in the short time allocated. Everyone acknowledges there is a problem. It has been outlined by the Minister of State in the motion. While everyone acknowledges there is a problem, it will not be solved by the farmers, the factory owners and the Minister firing shots and accusations at one another. Round table discussions, which have taken place, and the actions proposed must be progressed.

I looked at average deadweight prices over the past few years. There was an exceptionally high price in 2013 and the graph moves upwards from 2011, 2012 and 2013 compared to previous years. It has now gone back to the level of previous years, which is the topic under discussion. The quality payment scheme was the agreement between the IFA and the factory owners and it is important to acknowledge there is some issue that must be sorted as quickly as possible.

The main problem is the reduction in the consumption of beef. In Britain, the reduction amounts to 8% and some of the large multinational stores have seen demand reduced by up to 18%. This means there is a reduction in consumption that does not just affect Ireland. I am glad to note that €500,000 extra is being put in by Bord Bia to market beef and to get people consuming it again. It should be noted that beef prices in Britain are down and there was a bigger gap last year. This is not something exclusive to Ireland. The Minister is not here because he is in the US doing something about the situation. In the last budget, there was investment of €40 million in the beef sector. Actions are being taken and this issue is better addressed by everyone working together rather than by people taking shots at one another.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

Fluctuations, or peaks and valleys, in the beef or meat sector are nothing new to this country. Years ago, particularly after periods of firm prices, there tended to be a valley that severely punished the unfortunate people who found themselves exposed in those situations.

At present, there is considerable suspicion between various stakeholders. For instance, producers, processors and retailers raise the question of who controls prices apart from supply and demand. There is a certain amount of suspicion and we must spend time dealing with it. People in the beef business tell me that a cartel operates among the slaughtering facilities. I do not know whether it is true and I have no evidence to support it but the suspicion exists. Similarly, people tell me retailers have a controlling influence and there is considerable room for suspicion. In the US, the Government directly controls food prices, particularly beef prices, and sets the price on a weekly basis. There is advance recognition of the price for those producing, processing and retailing and for the consumer.

The peaks and valleys carry a major risk. Until there is some regularisation, if not a guarantee, of prices and expectations, we will continue to have these kind of issues. I recognise that the Minister and Minister of State are doing everything possible to ensure the market prevails in a healthy state.

From the point of view of economic recovery, it is also important that the product of the agricultural sector is well recognised on the international market, and that a good price is achieved by the producer so that, as a result, the producer is able to continue to produce product in the future.

The first disappointment concerned bull beef, which was referred by other speakers. In the expectation of certain things happening, producers decided to cater for a market they thought was there. It was not, and it disappeared almost overnight. It was hugely disappointing for those involved, who took a huge financial loss. The producers are sore and vulnerable as a result. I would like to have the contentious issues examined in an analytical way, with a view to ensuring we address them in the future.

Deputy Paudie Coffey

I refer to the amendments to the motion. I acknowledge that beef producers are suffering from weakened prices in comparison to last year. This is having a negative effect on farm income and the sustainability of the sector. I met representatives of many farming organisations and farmers who outlined the difficulties they are facing. They are experiencing a difficult time.

However, this Private Members' motion is political opportunism at its worst and is an attempt by Fianna Fáil, for political gain, to undermine the Minister when he is working to enhance and improve the markets available for Irish beef at a critical time for the sector. Is Fianna Fáil seriously saying there should be direct intervention by the Minister in the market, to the effect of price fixing? Can the Fianna Fáil Members clarify that point for the benefit of the House and the beef producers of the country? It is a dangerous road to go down. When tabling this motion, Fianna Fáil Members knew the Minister would be in the USA working to ensure new markets are available for Irish beef producers. The Minister should be supported by all Members in these efforts.

Over the past year, I have been engaged with farming organisations to increase live market export opportunities from Rosslare port. Progress is being made in increasing opportunities to the UK market. The Minister and his officials have been supportive of these efforts. The Fianna Fáil motion calls on the Government to ensure there is no barrier to live exports to the UK. Members on this side of the House all agree with that and fully support it. Will all Opposition Members support that statement? I will watch with interest to see how the Opposition votes in respect of live exports. This year, live exports have increased by 14% compared to 2013. We should recognise and welcome that.

The beef sector is significant for the Irish economy and there has made been an 8% increase in the value of meat and live exports in 2013, rising by €245 million to €3.3 billion. Last week, Chinese representatives were in the country examining the Irish product for export to Chinese markets. This week, US inspectors are carrying out final inspections in Ireland before giving the green light for beef exports to strong markets on the east coast of America. These markets have been closed for over 16 years since the BSE crisis. The sooner those markets open, the better for all involved. Beef prices have decreased this year, which we recognise, but they have dropped across Europe due to weakened consumer demand and competition from other meat products. The Minister's response is to allocate an additional €500,000 to Bord Bia to enhance new opportunities. We should all be working to improve the sector for the sake of all us and the Irish economy.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I welcome the opportunity to contribute to the debate on the beef sector. At the outset, I acknowledge the vital role the beef sector plays in the agrifood industry and, in turn, the major contribution agriculture makes to the Irish economy. I acknowledge there is a problem with beef prices at the moment.

Unfortunately, many farmers are going through a very difficult time. I have spoken to many of these farmers. The terrible winter last year, combined with the poor spring, resulted in high feed costs for farmers and the fall-off in beef prices we are experiencing now means that producers are simply not able to recoup the moneys they invested during the difficult period. We need to find a solution.

I believe what we need is a collective approach from producers, processors and farm organisations in order to address this matter. Currently, there is a lack of communication in the beef industry and this is in nobody's interest. We have two main players here, the processors, who are looking for security of supply, and the producers, who are looking for security of return and a reasonable margin. These groups need to come together if a solution is to be found. To this end, the Minister has held a number of round table discussions with key stakeholders. I welcome the fact the Minister and the Department are now considering legislation for the setting up of a producer organisation for the beef industry. This legislation could allow for groups of from 50 to 60 farmers to come together to use their power of supply to negotiate and agree mutually beneficial terms with the processors. We have seen this work very well in the mushroom industry, whereby producer groups can guarantee a continuity of supply to processors and in return, there is stability of price for the producer. I believe there could be similar benefits for the beef industry. This would help to provide an equilibrium of supply and help eliminate the peaks and troughs farmers experience in terms of price.

Price brings us back to the core issue of supply and demand. Beef is like anything else. When there is a shortage of supply, prices are high and when there is over supply, prices are low. Producer groups, in conjunction with the processors, could forward plans to try to even out these dips in the market. I reject some of the Opposition criticism regarding the Government's lack of supply for beef farmers. The Government has taken important steps to assist farmers with a €40 million package to beef farmers in 2014, including €23 million for the beef genomic scheme, €10 million for the beef data programme, €5 million for the beef technology adoption programme and €2 million in residual payments on the beef suckler cow welfare scheme.

As the Minister has said, the beef data programme will begin to issue in the coming week and this will come as a relief to many farmers who have been anxiously awaiting these moneys in order to meet outstanding bills. The Minister has far from washed his hands of this issue. He has worked tirelessly, as has the Minister of State, Deputy Hayes, to expand our export markets and we have seen this work has paid dividends, with the resumption of live exports to Libya last year. There was a further boost last week when the US Secretary of Agriculture stated that he fully expects trade will resume between Ireland and the US before the end of this year. Good progress has also been made in terms of re-entering the Chinese market. Opening these markets would be a huge boost and can only be positive for our beef farmers. As I said earlier, the Minister and the Government are committed to the beef sector and we must all work together to resolve the issues.

Deputy Anthony Lawlor

I am delighted to be able to speak on this issue. I acknowledge that the beef industry makes a huge contribution to the Irish economy, with almost 100,000 people involved in it, whether on the suckler side or, as in most cases in my constituency, in the finishing of cattle for the factories. The main issue being discussed here is price, but there are other issues that must be acknowledged. Many of my constituents are having problems in two areas, first with getting cattle into the meat factories for slaughter and second with getting confirmation on the size or weight required.

Many of my constituents are finishers who end up producing big, heavy, continental type cattle, but they cannot get them into meat factories currently. They are being penalised because of the size of the cattle. Meat factories are now looking for O3 type cattle, which are mainly the beef cattle coming off the dairy sector. This is completely wrong. I know from my experience in the sheep sector that any time I produce a lamb in excess of 21 kg or 22 kg, I do not get paid for the extra weight produced. Something must be done in this regard. The factories must be made pay for the cattle that are brought to them.

We must acknowledge what both the Minister and Minister of State have done. It is cynical of Fianna Fáil to criticise the Minister. I was with him last week on a suckler farm in Kildare when he brought the US Secretary of Agriculture, Tom Vilsack, to the farm in his effort to open up a market. The key to this issue is improved markets. We have a quality product - grass fed cattle. Look at Europe and the US and it is all corn fed cattle there. We have a quality product we should be selling to the market and must send out a strong message on that.

I welcome the €500,000 that has been allocated to Bord Bia. More must be done on that. I also stress that while we are opening up markets, we should acknowledge what has been done in the past. I would like to highlight in particular the Irish Dairy Board, which branded Irish butter as "Kerrygold". Perhaps we should look at this in the context of beef. We must pull the meat factories together, pull Bord Bia together and get Irish beef recognised as a specific brand so the world will recognise it as coming from a grass fed animal and quality produced. What the world needs is a quality product. This is the message we should be sending, instead of sitting here and listening to the bickering coming across from Fianna Fáil, which has no positive outcome at all. Based on what has been going on within Fianna Fáil in the past couple of days, it would rather have Irish agriculture out of Europe. It is important we market our quality Irish grass fed beef properly.

Deputy Pat Deering

I am delighted to have the opportunity to say a few words on this important issue. It is not too often we get an opportunity to speak on agricultural matters, so it is important to point out the importance of agriculture to the economy. In years gone by, under Fianna Fáil administrations, agriculture was not treated with any respect. Now, for the first time, agriculture is more important than bricks and mortar.

Farmers, beef farmers in particular, have gone through an early winter and a difficult spring. We have seen prices collapse in the industry. Prices were artificially high last year and an unreal expectation was created as a result. If we look back over the figures for the past number of years, the average price was €3.79 per kg. It is now €3.67 and at its height last year it was €4.43. An unreal expectation was created at that point. We need to put proper structures in place to ensure the current situation does not happen again. While I acknowledge there is a problem, there is no quick fix solution. There never has been a quick fix solution to the problems.

As my colleague, Deputy Doyle, mentioned earlier, we had an issue in the dairy industry three or four years ago. I am well aware of that as a dairy farmer in Carlow. Nobody came to bail me out three or four years ago when I was getting 20 cent a litre for milk. I had to grin and bear it and get on with it. We have difficulties currently, but we must ensure these difficulties do not arise again in the future. We must put proper structures in place to ensure stability for the future. We are ahead of the posse on that, as Deputy Ó Cuív knows well from attending our Joint Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine, which has been bringing in the different people involved. All the stakeholders have been involved in the committee, producers, factory people, Teagasc and so on. We brought all of these on board to ensure we had a round table discussion. This has been rubbished by some of the Opposition, but round table discussion and getting people together are the only way to sort this, to put proper structures in place and ensure we have stability. As a result of the round table discussions, we have had the Dowling report, which will be key to ensuring stability for the future. The recommendations that have been published must be implemented as soon as possible to ensure we have a proper structure for the future.

It is ironic that we are discussing this issue when the Minister is in America trying to get alternative markets. One of the solutions to the issue is an alternative market. It is an issue of supply and demand as we know. More alternative markets are essential. It is important for the Minister to go abroad or to wherever the markets are to try to ensure viable markets for the future. Under the CAP negotiations last year, we got a good deal for agriculture in this country, despite the fact the Opposition might disagree. It is also ironic that the main beef producing farmers are the productive farmers in the south east of the country, as Deputy Browne mentioned earlier. They are the same farmers whose single farm payment Deputy Ó Cuív wanted to reduce to a maximum of €400 per hectare. That is what he wanted to do. They are the productive farmers who are producing the beef to go to the factories for the supermarkets, but he wanted to reduce their payments to €400 per hectare. At the same time, we had to battle to ensure we got €700 per hectare.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Analyse the figures.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy should conclude. I must call the next speaker.

Deputy Pat Deering

It is essential that all stakeholders come together to come to a solution at round table discussions that will put structures in place to ensure these issues do not recur.

Deputy Martin Ferris

I read in the Irish Farmers’ Journal last week that the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Simon Coveney is "acutely aware" of the problems facing the Irish beef sector. Great words but to be honest, there are lots of people in this society who are fed up hearing members of the Fine Gael-Labour Party coalition telling us that they are acutely aware of our plight. Acutely aware does not cut it, when what we need is action. There are times when the Ministers on the benches opposite are nearly telling us that it is hurting them more than it is hurting us, that this situation is hurting them more than it is hurting the farming community. Well, that will not wash with Irish farmers anymore and it will not wash with beef farmers in particular. Twice last week we had farmers at the door of Leinster House, protesting. They were angry and to be honest, I am angry on their behalf. In my life time I have never seen two mobilisations by the IFA in one week and that in itself tells all of us that there is a crisis in the beef sector which needs to be sorted out.

The big retail multiples are reducing their prices while their own profit margins are growing at the expense of farmers. Figures show that in 2013 the farmer received 57% of the average price of beef on the British retail market. The retail price per kilo has risen by 7% but the farmers’ share has dropped to 42% and that is some whack to take. I repeat - the farm-gate price for Irish cattle has fallen by 15% while the price of beef on the shelves of British supermarkets has gone up by 7%. Beef farmers have lost income to the extent that they are in crisis. They have also lost confidence in the Minister who on "Morning Ireland" last week publicly washed his hands of the crisis and said on air that it was all down to the market and he could do nothing about it. He blamed the situation on the market.

We know that this Government looks to the rich and powerful and ignores the plight of the more vulnerable, but this one takes the biscuit. Is Simon Coveney so divorced from the reality of beef farmers lives’ that he does not know what is happening in the industry? In response to this crisis he set up a talking shop, called a "round table", where the beef factories’ representatives can talk to each other and tell us that we are all doing fine. I want to see the beef barons before the Oireachtas Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine. We discussed this matter this week and members want to see them brought before the committee. I want to see the powerful individuals who control this industry and not their press and publicity executives, their public relations men or their image consultants. I want to see the beef barons themselves, individually, come before our committee to account for their actions. This industry is too important for the Government to take a back seat and let these people ruin it and ruin the livelihoods of beef farmers and their families.

The farmers who were encouraged by Teagasc to rear bull beef but who now find that the prices have collapsed and their sheds are full of cattle they cannot not sell are not impressed. The Minister has sat on his hands and allowed the beef barons to call the shots and to manipulate the market to the extent that some farmers have been pushed over the edge.

There is an individual out there, a beef baron who is known to everyone in this House - whose name comes up decade after decade, not just year after year - who plays a leading role in the beef industry in this State and who, it seems, is allowed to do what he likes to manipulate the market and he continues to do so. He is allowed to own and control a large herd of cattle and at his whim, he can flood the market and collapse prices, which he does. He is not alone in this but has allies scattered around the country. When he wants to, he calls the shots and brings the prices down. When farmers present to his factories with cattle, they are offered a price that is 5% below what they expect so they take the decision not to send their cattle in. Then the beef baron lifts the phone and his people all over the country make sure that he has a supply of cattle, making it almost impossible for the farmer who must sell his cattle to meet his overheads, repayments and so forth not to accept that man's price and the price set by others who control this industry. Nothing is being done about it. This has continued, year in, year out. When the beef barons want to, they can manipulate the market to collapse the prices. Last week, there were demonstrations going on outside by members of the IFA. What happened this week? The price was cut by another five cent. This is what they can do. They are an all-powerful cartel and their representatives are sitting in on the round table discussions. Their representatives appeared before the Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine and stonewalled for the duration of the meeting. They are getting away with murder because they are being allowed to get away with it. Any Minister worth his salt would move to control this kind of behaviour, but this Government looks after the likes of him and the small man can go to hell or to the wall.

The factories have abused their power and continue to do so. They have changed specifications at will and have driven down prices by penalising farmers who are struggling to put bread on the table. Farmers are tempted to abandon cattle at marts at the moment because the prices being offered are so low. They are not making ends meet and are producing at a loss. The reason they are producing at a loss is that the beef barons are manipulating the market to suit their agenda and continue to do so.

I said in this Chamber last week that many farmers suspect that the beef barons run the industry by this kind of manipulation and by having access, crucially, to the AIMS database. I know that the Minister denies this. Last week the Minister of State, Deputy Hayes was here when I said it and the Minister was not here. He did not turn up to answer questions, but sent along the new Minister of State to answer questions about data management and transparency within the beef industry. In fairness to Deputy Hayes, he did his best to answer the questions. He was in an unenviable position, trying to deny something that everyone knows is true; that they have access to the AIMS database.

Deputy Tom Hayes

They do not have access to it.

Deputy Martin Ferris

Yes, they do have access. That is how they are able to manipulate the market by flooding it when it suits them.

It is widely believed that the beef factories have access to the database and to farm financial data, while farmers are not given access to figures collected by the Department on the numbers of cattle slaughtered each week, or, crucially, on the level of inter-trading among the beef factories. Unless the factory managers are clairvoyant, how do they know when finished cattle are coming on stream? The Minister of State cannot sit there and tell me, in absolute terms, that they have not got access.

Deputy Tom Hayes

I can.

Deputy Martin Ferris

He cannot do it because he does not know if someone in his Department is leaking it to them. He does not know.

Deputy Tom Hayes

If they are doing that, they are doing it illegally.

Deputy Martin Ferris

Yes, but it is happening.

Deputy Tom Hayes

The Deputy must prove it so.

Deputy Martin Ferris

The information is being bought. It is happening-----

Deputy Andrew Doyle

That is a very serious allegation.

Deputy Martin Ferris

-----and nothing is being done about it.

We can see that the representatives from the beef factories who turn up to the round table circus are always vague and evasive in their answers. No one is prepared to speak about the real situation with regard to slaughtered cattle. This talking shop is going nowhere because it is not getting to the bottom of what is going on - manipulation of the market by the beef barons and the suspicion of access to the database. They know when cattle are coming on and can purchase them at their chosen price.

Will the new transparency promised include the figures for the number of cattle slaughtered and the inter-trading between factories? Is there any evidence of that coming from the round table talks? All we hear is that same old excuse, that this is "commercially sensitive" information. Commercially sensitive for whom? It is commercially sensitive in the context of the profits being made by the beef barons at the expense of the farmers and producers. Commercial sensitivity is used by this Government to protect and back up the beef factories as opposed to protecting the rights and entitlements of farmers and producers. The beef factories will not allow this information to be published. The all powerful beef factories will simply not allow publication of this data. Well, the Minister would want to take a stand on behalf of farmers and not allow the factories to call all the shots, which is what they are doing. They are calling all the shots at the expense of farmers all over the country.

We need a beef regulator to oversee how this industry is operating because, above all, it is not fair. It is anything but fair. There should be transparency and equal opportunity for producers, the farmers who produce the cattle. This is not a question of market forces, it is a question of the unfair advantage of the factories who have the figures while the farmers do not.

The traditional trade with the North, where cattle dealers came down to the South to buy cattle, has collapsed too. Labelling issues have been used as a pretext to create barriers to that trade. The Sinn Féin Minister for Agriculture and Rural Development in the North, Michelle O’Neill, is happy to go to the EU seeking a derogation on the issue of labelling. She has met representatives of farming groups, including the IFA and has listened to their concerns.

She is concerned about current beef prices and has plans to meet the representatives of processors and retailers in the next couple of weeks in order to discuss the specifications which have recently been implemented. She is also extremely concerned about the current labelling situation, which is having a negative effect on the cross-Border trade of cattle. She has raised this matter with the Minister, Deputy Coveney, and the Minister of State on a number of occasions and wants their agreement to seek a derogation from Europe in respect of the current anomaly. We want a single island-wide produce label which will not threaten traceability standards. Such a label can be achieved. If the will is there, we can find a fix for this situation.

Deputy Tom Hayes

That would not benefit farmers in this jurisdiction.

Deputy Martin Ferris

Another serious problem exists in respect of cattle that have been owned by four or more people. Who is being penalised in this regard? Again, it is the producers. What happens to cattle when they enter the production chain? If they have had four or more owners, are they sold more cheaply? The answer is "No". Those who are the fifth and sixth owners of cattle are being penalised. When they take their animals to the factory, they are penalised because they have had more than four owners. Right along the food chain, there is no difference in the price. In other words, the customer pays exactly the same price for meat regardless of the number of owners that the animal from which it was produced may have had. Is that not fraudulent?

I was contacted earlier by a man who buys large numbers of cattle throughout the country. He informed me that in recent weeks, when he brought animals to the factories, he did not even bother to seek a price. What does that tell the Minister of State? The individual in question has been broken by the way in which the factory owners have manipulated the market for their own selfish ends. They have manipulated it in such a way that they have managed to take everything they can get from producers. That is happening on the current Government's watch. In fact, it has been happening for many years, but no one done anything about it. Action must be taken. The Government must put something in place in order that we might know-----

Deputy Tom Hayes

What is the something to which the Deputy refers?

Deputy Martin Ferris

The Government could start by regulating the trade. If it does not do so, those in the industry will continue to do what they want. The people in question are not interested in what is good for Irish producers or farmers. They are only interested in what they can put into their own pockets and in making profits for their shareholders. They do not give a goddamn about producers and never have done so. They continue to get away with what they are doing. It is time the Government grew a pair of balls and stood up to them. It is time the Government took them on and said "Enough is enough". Everyone in this House knows the identity of the main individual involved in this regard. He continues to get away with doing what he has done for many years. He is one of the main people responsible for manipulating the market. Nothing is being done about that manipulation.

We need to take action to protect the producers and farmers to whom I refer in order that they might continue to earn viable incomes and live in rural areas. It will not be done by engaging in round-table talks. Such talks are nothing more than a circus whereby the people who manipulate the markets send in their PR people to put their spin on it. They have done the very same thing on each occasion they have come before the Joint Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine. We want them to come before the committee individually, and our Chairman, Deputy Doyle - who is very good at his job - is prepared to try to facilitate this. We want to be able to sit across the table from these individuals, look them in the eye and challenge them to justify their behaviour.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

I thank the members of the Technical Group for allocating some of their speaking time to me. I compliment Deputy Ó Cuív and the Fianna Fáil Party on bringing forward this excellent motion.

My closest personal friend of many years, Mr. Bernard Collins, who has worked in the Tralee mart for over 35 years, has been warning me for some time about what is happening in the beef sector. We all know that the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine is for the road, and more luck to him. He is going to be promoted, or whatever one wishes to call it, and I wish him good luck. For the time being, however, he cannot take his eye off the ball and he must concentrate on the job at hand. Round-table talks my eye. Such talks will get farmers and beef producers nowhere. Independent regulation designed to create fairness in the context of the prices the factories are offering is not only necessary, it is vital.

I compliment Deputy Martin Ferris on his excellent contribution. He referred to cartels and the fact that beef producers have been ground into the earth. The Minister of State and I are great friends. I wish him every success. He is a sensible, practical man and he is aware that it costs €700 to €800 to keep a cow for 12 months. If it costs that much to keep a cow and if one takes into account the prices the factories are paying for beef at present, then it is obvious that one cannot make money producing beef. What is happening in this country is a disgrace. We had tribunals and investigations in the past, but I am of the view that what is taking place now is criminal. The Minister of State is a sincere individual and I wish to ask him a straight question. What young man or woman would want to take up farming at present? If farmers in Tipperary, Meath and Kildare are giving up and getting out, then what will happen to the farmers in the Black Valley, Glencar and other areas which I represent? Carrying on just does not make financial sense for some people.

I apologise for not being present for the Minister of State's contribution. However, I listened to every word he said on the monitor in my office. I am obliged to inform him that he sold himself short when he asked those who brought forward the motion whether they wanted him to intervene in respect of prices, etc. There are two individuals with responsibility for agriculture in this country and the Minister of State is one of them. Both he and the senior Minister are extremely influential and - I say this in a very respectful way - they should throw their weight around. They should put it up to the people who are organising the cartels and who are flying around in helicopters while beef producers are struggling to fill their jeeps with diesel. What is happening just does not make sense; it is neither fair nor right.

I appreciate the fact that the Minister of State is a fair-minded man. He must realise that if the senior Minister is falling asleep at the wheel, it is not our job to throw him out of the car. It is our job to wake him up, however, and that is what Deputy Ó Cuív and Fianna Fáil are doing this evening. They are right to do it. The grid should be the grid and if it applies when cattle prices are good, it should also apply when they are bad. The chairman of the Kerry branch of the IFA, Mr. Sean Brosnan, is an excellent organiser and mobiliser of farmers. He and I are acutely aware of what is happening in our country and throughout the remainder of the country at present. Everyone involved in beef production is losing money. There is just no money to be made in rearing and fattening calves and then selling them on to the factories. The sums do not add up.

What are the Minister and the Minister of State doing, for God's sake? They should forget about these round-table negotiations, because those who attend are only going to talk rubbish. The targets for 2020 are rubbish and will not be met. It is impossible for such targets to be met when beef producers are literally being killed off. If producers cannot make money, the entire enterprise is going to grind to a halt. The Minister of State knows that I am saying all of this in the most genuine and sincere way. I hope I am talking on behalf of the farmers of Ireland who are producing beef, who are losing money and who are working damn hard. They work all hours of the day and night and they and their families are operating under pressure. They are trying to better themselves and they are just trying to keep going. However, they are not making any money at a time when certain fellows are flying around in helicopters and peeing down on top of them.

Debate adjourned.

The Dáil adjourned at 9 p.m. until 9.30 a.m. on Wednesday, 25 June 2014.