Order of Business

The Taoiseach

It is proposed to take Finance Bill 2014 – Financial Resolutions; No. 16, Finance Bill 2014 – allocation of time motion for select sub-committee; No. 17, motion re membership of committees; No. 18, motion re referral to joint committee of proposed approval by Dáil Éireann for a regulation of the European Parliament repealing and replacing the Council decision establishing CEPOL; No. 19, Supplementary Estimates for Public Services - Vote 33, back from committee; No. 20, motion re proposed approval by Dáil Éireann of a Doha amendment to the Kyoto Protocol - back from committee; No. 20a, motion re referral to joint committee of proposed approval by Dáil Éireann of the Horse and Greyhound Fund; No. 33, Social Welfare Bill 2014 - Second Stage (resumed); and No. 34, Civil Registration (Amendment) Bill 2014 [Seanad] - Order for Report, Report and Final Stages.

It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that Nos. 15 to 20, inclusive, and 20a shall be decided without debate, in the case of No. 15, the Financial Resolutions Nos. 1 and 2 shall be moved together and decided by one question, and in the case of No. 19 any division demanded shall be taken forthwith; Private Members’ business, which shall be No. 66, Thirty-fourth Amendment of the Constitution (No. 3) Bill 2014 – Second Stage, shall be taken today, shall not be taken on Wednesday, 19 November 2014, shall be taken on Thursday, 20 November 2014 at 10 a.m. and shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 11.30 a.m. on that day; the Dáil shall adjourn not later than 10 p.m. tomorrow night, there shall be no Order of Business within the meaning of Standing Order 26, the sos under Standing Order 23 will take place after Leaders' Questions for one hour and the business to be transacted after Topical Issues until 3 p.m. shall be No. 33, Social Welfare Bill 2014 – Second Stage (resumed), if not previously concluded; No. 20b, motion re water sector reforms, shall be taken from 3 p.m. until 10 p.m. and shall also be taken after the sos on Thursday, 20 November 2014 and shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 8 p.m. on that night and the following arrangements shall apply: the speech of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for Fianna Fáil, Sinn Féin and the Technical Group, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 20 minutes in each case and such Members may share their time; the speech of the Taoiseach, Tánaiste and leaders of Fianna Fáil, Sinn Féin and the Technical Group or a person nominated in their stead, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 20 minutes in each case and such Members may share their time; the speech of each other Member called upon shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case and such Members may share time; and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a speech in reply which shall not exceed 15 minutes; the Dáil shall sit at 10 a.m. on Thursday, 20 November 2014, there shall be no Oral Questions, Order of Business within the meaning of Standing Order 26, Topical Issues or motions for the Adjournment of the Dáil under Standing Order 32, there shall be a sos after Leaders’ Questions for 30 minutes and the Dáil shall adjourn not later than 8 p.m. on that day; tomorrow’s business after Oral Questions shall be No. 33, Social Welfare Bill 2014 - Second Stage (resumed); No. 34, Civil Registration (Amendment) Bill 2014 [Seanad] - Report and Final Stages (resumed); and No. 35, Workplace Relations Bill 2014 - Report and Final Stages (resumed); and Friday's fortnightly business shall be No. 67, Domestic Violence (Amendment) Bill 2014 and No. 68, Local Government (Rates and Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2014.

An Ceann Comhairle

There are four proposals to be put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with Nos. 15 to 20, inclusive, and 20a agreed to? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with Private Members' business agreed to?

Deputy Micheál Martin

No. We received the latest iteration of the Government's proposals for the week at approximately 3.15 p.m. I believe in parliamentary democracy and that all Members should do everything possible to uphold the concept of parliamentary democracy and proper, ordered, regulated debate in Parliament.

I decry what happened last Thursday, when a vote of the Parliament was defied. It is the first time I have ever witnessed that since I came to the House in 1989. It strikes a dagger into the heart of what parliamentary democracy is all about and sets a precedent we should not want repeated. Equally, the Government should respect the Parliament. This proposal and the remaining proposals before us do not respect the House and the concept of orderly, regulated debate. In essence, because of the debate on water, Private Members' business has been put back to Thursday, there is no Order of Business on Wednesday or Thursday and there is no Topical Issue debate or Question Time on Thursday. It was also proposed that Leaders' Questions not take place on Thursday, until our Whip contacted the Government Whip this morning.

The Taoiseach

That is completely incorrect.

Deputy Micheál Martin

When the schedule was published on Friday, no Leaders' Questions was scheduled for Thursday. Our Whip, on behalf of our party, protested strongly. This is undermining the Parliament and the Dáil, and confidence in and respect for the House. There is no compelling urgency about this issue. There is no reason the debate on water cannot take place this week and next week.

It is almost the anniversary of the guillotining of the Water Services Bill 2013. Has the Government learned anything? It should stop trying to ram things through the House because it might be convenient to do so. The Taoiseach is undermining respect for the Dáil, and I genuinely think we need to cop on and keep calm about debates. Legitimate demonstrations and protests are part of democracy. There should also be space for people to debate the water issue, as well as other issues, this week. Members may have wanted to raise Topical Issues, legislation on the Order of Business, various questions and so forth. This is shambolic in terms of how the business of the Dáil is being dealt with.

There should be a regular order, which no Government should be able to cast aside unless there is a real emergency. If there is an Order of Business on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays, we should continue to have it. If it is agreed by the House to have Topical Issue debates on a regular basis, we should continue to have them. We should continue to have Question Time and Leaders' Questions. We can organise debates around that. There is no compelling urgency that I can see to finish the debate on water on Thursday at 8 p.m. The next big demonstration is on 10 December. I ask the Government to go back to the drawing board, allow normality to return and have the order of the House as it was.

Deputy Gerry Adams

Usually, we get a sense on a Wednesday of the draft Order of Business for the following week. We did not get the information this week. We received the first draft schedule including a debate on water charges on Friday. We then received an entirely different Order of Business today, and there was no consultation with the Sinn Féin Whip on that issue. In the schedule we received on Friday, there was no Leaders' Questions planned for this Thursday. We protested about that. There is now no Order of Business or oral questions tomorrow or Thursday. There is no Topical Issue debate.

I defer to the Taoiseach in case I am wrong, but the Order of Business he read out is not the one I have. I tried to keep note of what he said. He introduced No. 33, the Social Welfare Bill, which is not on the schedule of business I have for tomorrow. I have accused the Government of ignoring the Oireachtas and Dáil. It has majored on the need for political reform, but there has been no consultation with the Sinn Féin Whip, and an Order of Business that is entirely different from the schedule we were given on Friday has been produced for the next few days. Can we get an explanation for that? If there is one, I am only too happy to listen to it.

Deputy Joe Higgins

I would like clarification of how the Taoiseach intends to deal with No. 19a, the motion on water sector reforms. I assume it is on the Order Paper for tomorrow. When will Members of the Dáil be furnished with that report? For several days Government Ministers have been placing stories on water charges - the changes they propose to make and the alleged good news they propose to give - with their favourite journalists, who then go on broadcast media, like Government spin doctors, to relay that news. It is highly cynical of the Government, and contemptuous of ordinary people and elected representatives. For several months we have had fear, insecurity and uncertainty, particularly among vulnerable members of our community such as those who are on pensions and living alone, about the new tax the Government proposes. The situation has been stoked up and made worse by all the speculation in the media, which is planted and fed by Government Ministers. Early tomorrow morning, for example, there will be a full motion, in which is encapsulated the latest proposals to resolve the incredible mess the Government has made of the illicit attempt to introduce a new water tax. It is critical that we have that debate.

The Taoiseach

It is not the first time the Order of Business has been changed in the House. There have been many occasions over the years when a matter of considerable importance arose and times or topics were changed. In the past number of years Deputies have made requests which have been facilitated.

Deputy Micheál Martin

Nothing like this has happened before.

The Taoiseach

We have changed the Order of Business on quite a number of occasions. The Opposition Whips were informed last week that there would be a motion on water, as it has been an issue of very considerable national comment for the past number of months. People would have been informed of the change in the Order of Business at about 2.10 p.m. today.

Deputy Micheál Martin

It was 3.15 p.m.

The Taoiseach

Deputy Adams mentioned that he received a different Order of Business from that which I read out. My understanding is that all of the office administrators for Sinn Féin, Fianna Fáil and the Technical Group were contacted by telephone to ensure they had received the revised Order of Business.

Deputy Gerry Adams

The Taoiseach is supposed to consult with us.

The Taoiseach

Perhaps if Deputy Adams checks with his office he will find that to be the case. It is important that today's business goes ahead as scheduled, with the first element of Private Members' business in the name of a Sinn Féin Deputy being taken this evening. Tomorrow, we have Leaders' Questions in the morning and-----

Deputy Micheál Martin

There is no Order of Business.

The Taoiseach

We will take the Order of Business today for tomorrow. The Government will sign off tomorrow-----

Deputy Micheál Martin

What does that mean? There is no Order of Business tomorrow.

The Taoiseach

-----on the issues surrounding Irish Water.

Deputy Willie O'Dea

We do that every week.

Deputy Micheál Martin

Why is there no Order of Business tomorrow?

The Taoiseach

The important thing for Deputy Martin to remember, if he casts his mind back, is that time and again Ministers in his Government-----

Deputy Micheál Martin

What is the problem?

Deputy Dara Calleary

This is supposed to be the revolution.

Deputy Micheál Martin

There is no legislation coming before us tomorrow.

The Taoiseach

They went outside this House-----

Deputy Dara Calleary

There was supposed to be a revolution.

The Taoiseach

-----to make very expensive announcements about issues concerning the House, about which the Dáil was never told.

Deputy Micheál Martin

Explain why we cannot have the Order of Business tomorrow.

Deputy Willie O'Dea

The Taoiseach was going to do things differently.

Deputy Micheál Martin

The Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Alan Kelly, will make a statement to the Dáil tomorrow, indicating the decisions of the Government in respect of Irish Water.

Deputy Joe Higgins

It is all over the newspapers already.

The Taoiseach

He is informing the House, as is appropriate. If the Minister decided to do that outside the House, Deputy Martin would be the first on his feet saying it should be done in here. It will take place in here.

Deputy Micheál Martin

It is great that he is doing it in here, but when can we have an Order of Business?

The Taoiseach

The Minister will present his Dáil statement as a motion which will continue to be debated tomorrow after his announcement in the House. We will have the second half of Private Members' business on Thursday morning, after Leaders' Questions, and then deal with the motion again, with a vote at 8 p.m.

Deputy Micheál Martin

There will be no Order of Business. The Government just wants to get in and out.

The Taoiseach

Last week we had the diversionary tactic of the Sinn Féin deputy leader sitting here for four or five hours, costing the taxpayer another €130,000.

Deputy Gerry Adams

What does the Taoiseach draw?

The Taoiseach

Delaying tactics, delaying legislation such as the discussion on the Social Welfare Bill, which has implications for the payment of the Christmas bonus-----

Deputy Micheál Martin

The Government is conducting the business of Parliament no better; it is equally undermining debate and confidence.

The Taoiseach

The Sinn Féin leader then comes into the House today to speak about placing stories and all the rest-----

Deputy Gerry Adams

The Taoiseach is the one who talked about reform. I would add for Deputy Joe Higgins that I have listened to a few stories being placed in the past few months, many of them from his quarter, from the Sinn Féin Party and from others-----

Deputy Joe Higgins

For example-----

The Taoiseach

Stories about privatisation and the estimated cost of water.

An Ceann Comhairle

Can we please get back to the Order of Business?

The Taoiseach

Tomorrow at 3 p.m. the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government will outline in the House, as is appropriate, the decisions taken by the Government on Irish Water.

Deputy Micheál Martin

The Taoiseach has left him plenty of time to have them clarified.

Deputy Gerry Adams

They might change again.

The Taoiseach

I know that Deputies Micheál Martin, Gerry Adams, Joe Higgins, Niall Collins and everybody else on the other side of the House will want to have this issue debated and discussed.

Deputy Willie O'Dea

Why finish at 8 p.m. on Thursday? What is the rush?

The Taoiseach

As I indicated last week, Members will have an opportunity to engage in discussion tomorrow and on Thursday on the decisions of the Government, with a vote taking place on Thursday evening at the end of the debate on the motion to be proposed by the Minister tomorrow.

Deputy Gerry Adams

If by then the Government has not changed it.

The Taoiseach

The motion will be discussed in the Dáil, where it should be discussed. For years other parties refused to bring such business before the Dáil. They went off outside and had their big day, with their big notices, and then failed to deliver. After the discussion, the matter is back before the House, where it should be debated.

Deputy Willie O'Dea

What is the urgency?

The Taoiseach

The Minister will deliver the information tomorrow on behalf of the Government.

An Ceann Comhairle

The question is that the proposals for dealing with Nos. 15, 16, 17-----

Deputy Micheál Martin

The Taoiseach did not answer the question as to why we were dealing with it in this way.

Deputy Charles Flanagan

For the purposes of clarity and certainty, the Opposition is going to get the information tomorrow, but it is still not happy.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle

Sorry, but I am in the middle of putting the question.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

It will be less than the €400 a year proposed by Fianna Fáil.

(Interruptions).

Question put: "That the proposal for dealing with Private Members' business tomorrow be agreed to."

The Dáil divided: Tá, 79; Níl, 52.

Tá

Bannon, James.
Barry, Tom.
Breen, Pat.
Butler, Ray.
Buttimer, Jerry.
Byrne, Catherine.
Byrne, Eric.
Carey, Joe.
Coffey, Paudie.
Conaghan, Michael.
Conlan, Seán.
Connaughton, Paul J.
Conway, Ciara.
Coonan, Noel.
Corcoran Kennedy, Marcella.
Creed, Michael.
Daly, Jim.
Deasy, John.
Deering, Pat.
Doherty, Regina.
Donohoe, Paschal.
Dowds, Robert.
Doyle, Andrew.
Durkan, Bernard J.
Farrell, Alan.
Feighan, Frank.
Fitzgerald, Frances.
Fitzpatrick, Peter.
Flanagan, Charles.
Griffin, Brendan.
Hannigan, Dominic.
Harrington, Noel.
Harris, Simon.
Heydon, Martin.
Howlin, Brendan.
Humphreys, Heather.
Humphreys, Kevin.
Keating, Derek.
Kehoe, Paul.
Kenny, Enda.
Kenny, Seán.
Kyne, Seán.
Lawlor, Anthony.
Lynch, Ciarán.
Lyons, John.
McCarthy, Michael.
McFadden, Gabrielle.
McNamara, Michael.
Maloney, Eamonn.
Mitchell, Olivia.
Mitchell O'Connor, Mary.
Mulherin, Michelle.
Murphy, Eoghan.
Nolan, Derek.
Noonan, Michael.
O'Donnell, Kieran
Ó Ríordáin, Aodhán.
O'Donovan, Patrick.
O'Mahony, John.
O'Reilly, Joe.
O'Sullivan, Jan.
Perry, John.
Phelan, Ann.
Phelan, John Paul.
Quinn, Ruairí.
Rabbitte, Pat.
Reilly, James.
Ring, Michael.
Ryan, Brendan.
Shatter, Alan.
Sherlock, Sean.
Spring, Arthur.
Stagg, Emmet.
Stanton, David.
Tuffy, Joanna.
Twomey, Liam.
Wall, Jack.
Walsh, Brian.
White, Alex.

Níl

Adams, Gerry.
Boyd Barrett, Richard.
Broughan, Thomas P.
Calleary, Dara.
Collins, Joan.
Collins, Niall.
Colreavy, Michael.
Coppinger, Ruth.
Cowen, Barry.
Creighton, Lucinda.
Crowe, Seán.
Doherty, Pearse.
Donnelly, Stephen S.
Dooley, Timmy.
Ellis, Dessie.
Ferris, Martin.
Fitzmaurice, Michael.
Fleming, Sean.
Fleming, Tom.
Grealish, Noel.
Healy, Seamus.
Healy-Rae, Michael.
Higgins, Joe.
Keaveney, Colm.
Kelleher, Billy.
Kirk, Seamus.
Kitt, Michael P.
Mac Lochlainn, Pádraig.
McConalogue, Charlie.
McGrath, Finian.
McGrath, Mattie.
McGrath, Michael.
McLellan, Sandra.
Martin, Micheál.
Mathews, Peter.
Murphy, Catherine.
Murphy, Paul.
Naughten, Denis.
Ó Caoláin, Caoimhghín.
Ó Cuív, Éamon.
Ó Fearghaíl, Seán.
Ó Snodaigh, Aengus.
O'Brien, Jonathan.
O'Dea, Willie.
O'Sullivan, Maureen.
Pringle, Thomas.
Ross, Shane.
Shortall, Róisín.
Smith, Brendan.
Stanley, Brian.
Troy, Robert.
Wallace, Mick.

Tellers: Tá, Deputies Emmet Stagg and Paul Kehoe; Níl, Deputies Aengus Ó Snodaigh and Seán Ó Fearghaíl.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle

The third proposal to be put to the House concerns the sitting of and business to be conducted by the Dáil tomorrow. Is it agreed to?

Deputy Micheál Martin

No, it is not agreed to, on the basis that the motion states there will be no Order of Business tomorrow. I cannot see any logic or rationale for this. I do not believe there is any compelling reason or urgency in the context of the debate on the water issue to justify the Government, without any notice or consultation with the other parties, arbitrarily and simply deciding there will be no Order of Business tomorrow. I do not understand it and I believe it is the wrong move. It undermines confidence in Parliament and the Dáil and weakens the Government's credibility in trying to attack others who may do so. That is the key point the Taoiseach should bear in mind.

Deputy Gerry Adams

The key point concerns the Taoiseach's remark when he said the Opposition Whips had been informed of these changes. Telling us what to do and informing us of what the Government has decided is a long way away from political reform.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

What about what happened last Thursday?

Deputy Micheál Martin

The Chief Whip is not consulting us.

The Taoiseach

The Whips were notified. Last week, when we discussed this issue, I indicated to the House that the decision would be announced in a statement to the Dáil on Wednesday and that there would be a debate thereafter.

Deputy Micheál Martin

We have no problem with that.

The Taoiseach

We have had discussions here before about having one Order of Business to discuss business for the entire week. This is an issue on which everybody has commented, perfectly legitimately, in the past few months. It is important that the Minister is making a statement to the Dáil, by way of a motion, on which the debate can start thereafter in the House, involving the leaders and all other Members.

Deputy Micheál Martin

That is not the point.

The Taoiseach

There will be Leaders' Questions tomorrow, as normal, and the Deputies can ask whatever questions they wish to ask. However, it is important that, once the Government has signed off on the announcement, the House be informed first as to what it is. The debate will then take place on it.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

Has it been agreed to?

Deputy Micheál Martin

We are not talking about that issue; we are talking about the Order of Business being cancelled.

The Taoiseach

As the Government has not formally signed off on any of it, the decision will be announced to the House. That did not happen on many occasions in the past.

Question put: "That the proposals for dealing with the sitting and business of the Dáil tomorrow be agreed to."

The Dáil divided: Tá, 78; Níl, 51.

Tá

Bannon, James.
Barry, Tom.
Breen, Pat.
Butler, Ray.
Buttimer, Jerry.
Byrne, Catherine.
Byrne, Eric.
Carey, Joe.
Coffey, Paudie.
Conaghan, Michael.
Conlan, Seán.
Connaughton, Paul J..
Conway, Ciara.
Coonan, Noel.
Corcoran Kennedy, Marcella.
Creed, Michael.
Daly, Jim.
Deasy, John.
Deering, Pat.
Doherty, Regina.
Donohoe, Paschal.
Dowds, Robert.
Doyle, Andrew.
Durkan, Bernard J..
Farrell, Alan.
Feighan, Frank.
Fitzgerald, Frances.
Fitzpatrick, Peter.
Griffin, Brendan.
Hannigan, Dominic.
Harrington, Noel.
Harris, Simon.
Heydon, Martin.
Howlin, Brendan.
Humphreys, Heather.
Humphreys, Kevin.
Keating, Derek.
Kehoe, Paul.
Kenny, Enda.
Kenny, Seán.
Kyne, Seán.
Lawlor, Anthony.
Lynch, Ciarán.
Lyons, John.
Maloney, Eamonn.
McCarthy, Michael.
McFadden, Gabrielle.
McNamara, Michael.
Mitchell, Olivia.
Mitchell O'Connor, Mary.
Mulherin, Michelle.
Murphy, Eoghan.
Nolan, Derek.
Noonan, Michael.
Ó Ríordáin, Aodhán.
O'Donnell, Kieran.
O'Donovan, Patrick.
O'Mahony, John.
O'Reilly, Joe.
O'Sullivan, Jan.
Perry, John.
Phelan, Ann.
Phelan, John Paul.
Quinn, Ruairí.
Rabbitte, Pat.
Reilly, James.
Ring, Michael.
Ryan, Brendan.
Shatter, Alan.
Sherlock, Sean.
Spring, Arthur.
Stagg, Emmet.
Stanton, David.
Tuffy, Joanna.
Twomey, Liam.
Wall, Jack.
Walsh, Brian.
White, Alex.

Níl

Adams, Gerry.
Broughan, Thomas P..
Calleary, Dara.
Collins, Joan.
Collins, Niall.
Colreavy, Michael.
Coppinger, Ruth.
Cowen, Barry.
Creighton, Lucinda.
Crowe, Seán.
Doherty, Pearse.
Donnelly, Stephen S..
Dooley, Timmy.
Ellis, Dessie.
Ferris, Martin.
Fitzmaurice, Michael.
Fleming, Sean.
Fleming, Tom.
Grealish, Noel.
Healy, Seamus.
Healy-Rae, Michael.
Higgins, Joe.
Keaveney, Colm.
Kelleher, Billy.
Kirk, Seamus.
Kitt, Michael P..
Mac Lochlainn, Pádraig.
Martin, Micheál.
Mathews, Peter.
McConalogue, Charlie.
McGrath, Finian.
McGrath, Mattie.
McGrath, Michael.
McLellan, Sandra.
Murphy, Catherine.
Murphy, Paul.
Naughten, Denis.
Ó Caoláin, Caoimhghín.
Ó Cuív, Éamon.
Ó Fearghaíl, Seán.
Ó Snodaigh, Aengus.
O'Brien, Jonathan.
O'Dea, Willie.
O'Sullivan, Maureen.
Pringle, Thomas.
Ross, Shane.
Shortall, Róisín.
Smith, Brendan.
Stanley, Brian.
Troy, Robert.
Wallace, Mick.

Tellers: Tá, Deputies Emmet Stagg and Paul Kehoe; Níl, Deputies Aengus Ó Snodaigh and Seán Ó Fearghaíl.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle

I now turn to the final proposal to be put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with the sitting and business of the Dáil on Thursday agreed to?

Deputy Micheál Martin

It defies logic why the Taoiseach would attempt to organise things in this manner. This is asking us to agree that the Dáil will sit at 10 a.m. and that there should be no Question Time, no Order of Business and no Topical Issues or motions for the adjournment of the Dáil. Under protest, the Taoiseach has allowed Leaders' Questions. I have a simple question - why? The Taoiseach has not answered that question so far today.

Deputy Jerry Buttimer

Sit-in.

Deputy Micheál Martin

That may be it, Deputy Buttimer. That is my point. This is no response to what happened here last Thursday - if that is what it is all about. I hope it is not, because it is very silly thing to do. The motion on water is important. We will not be here until 8 p.m. on Thursday and the Taoiseach and the Government Chief Whip know that. Let us call a spade a spade. The Government can play things out and do things any way it wants, but many people talk about the lifestyle issues in the Dáil and doing our business in a sensible and orderly manner. There is no need to be here until 10 p.m. tomorrow night and no need to be here until 8 p.m. on Thursday night. All the Government is going to do is bring the House into disrepute, because it will be able to count the number of people who will be contributing to the motion.

Many Deputies could have Topical Issue matters they want to discuss and questions to which they want answers in the normal way. If we want to do our business properly, we should have regular order. We always have the Order of Business, Leaders' Questions and Question Time on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. There is no compelling urgency or rationale as to why we should change that this week. I welcome the fact that the issue of water will be debated tomorrow but the debate could be finished next week. There is no logic to this. It undermines credibility in this Dáil and marginalises it, which is a very serious thing to do given all that is happening in terms of democratic politics.

Deputy Gerry Adams

I asked the Taoiseach to give us an explanation as to why he has ordered the business in the way he has done, but he did not give us one. He still has an opportunity to give us an explanation. This reflects how this Government does its business. It makes a mess of even the most straightforward piece of work.

Minister of State at the Department of Defence (Deputy Paul Kehoe)

There would be no business done in the House if you were in control.

Deputy Joe Higgins

The last time the Taoiseach imposed a guillotine in respect of water charges was when he was introducing his bondholders' water tax. That decision was to fill the black hole left by the billions transferred to bondholders in the European financial markets. There is no mystery about that. It means the Taoiseach did not hear the representatives from this side who would have told him that this tax would bring his party and the Government close to perdition, which it has, and that it would face a national revolt, which it has.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Joe Higgins

People will no longer tolerate being lied to in general elections - pretending there will be no water charges and then stabbing them in the back, as the Labour Party did.

The reason we need more time is that the latest political trickery the Government is up to, which involves pretending to people that water charges will only cost them a crooked halfpenny and telling them they should not be too worried about the charges, will not be accepted.

People know what the Government is up to. The minute it gets them embedded, which it could do but will not, they will rise inexorably as soon as the pressure is off. We need the time to explain that to the Taoiseach because he is a very slow learner with regard to what our people will and will not tolerate.

Deputy Patrick O'Donovan

Deputy Higgins did not learn much from the anti-bin-charge campaign.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

He is taking a long time to learn himself.

Deputy Patrick O'Donovan

He did not learn anything. He helped to privatise the bin services.

Deputy Joe Higgins

They will not tolerate any more of this last-----

An Ceann Comhairle

I think the Deputy has made his point.

Deputy Joe Higgins

-----massive sting of the Government's austerity taxes. The Taoiseach needs to be told that and we need the time to do it. Therefore, there should be no guillotine.

An Ceann Comhairle

Does the Taoiseach wish to reply?

The Taoiseach

I thank Deputy Higgins for his recognition of my academic brilliance. If that is the way he feels, I cannot force him to say something else.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

He said that as a former teacher.

The Taoiseach

We have Leaders' Questions on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. We have a Private Members' motion in the name of the Sinn Féin Party this evening and Thursday morning. We have a motion on water reforms, which have been requested by every Deputy in the House on Leaders' Questions, Topical Issue debates, emergency debates and questions every day for the last number of months. I know very well that if the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government came here tomorrow to announce his water reforms or announced them outside the House, Members would scream to have the matter debated immediately.

Deputy Micheál Martin

The Taoiseach should not be so upset.

Deputy Timmy Dooley

He has gone very sensitive.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputies have had their say.

The Taoiseach

I know Deputies Martin and Adams well enough. They can complain about it if they wish but I think it streamlines the business of the House. We now know the business for the week. We discussed this before and Deputy Martin would not agree. When he requested changes, we made them.

Deputy Micheál Martin

There was no discussion.

Deputy Timmy Dooley

Is he worried about holding the backbenches?

The Taoiseach

I think it is very orderly. There are Leaders' Questions and Topical Issues today and we will take Leaders' Questions tomorrow and Thursday. We will take Private Members' business this evening and on Thursday morning. There will be an announcement in the Dáil, where it should be made, tomorrow at 3 p.m., and thereafter we will have a debate tomorrow evening and until 8 p.m. on Thursday, with a vote.

Deputy Micheál Martin

Can we have a piece of cake as well?

Deputy Patrick O'Donovan

What about your teas?

The Taoiseach

We learned a lesson last year because there was a lot of criticism about the build-up of legislation in the context of the troika and everything else during the last session of the Dáil.

Deputy Dara Calleary

Where is the legal services Bill?

The Taoiseach

No legislation was guillotined this year. I do not think one will find its equivalent in the records of the Dáil over the past 40 years. Legislation was guillotined time after time, Government after Government. There was no guillotine on any legislation in 2014. What we have here is a motion on water reforms, on which the House will vote at 8 p.m. on Thursday.

Question put: "That the proposal for dealing with the sitting and business of the Dáil on Thursday, 20 November 2014 be agreed to."

The Dáil divided: Tá, 78; Níl, 50.

Tá

Bannon, James.
Barry, Tom.
Breen, Pat.
Butler, Ray.
Buttimer, Jerry.
Byrne, Catherine.
Byrne, Eric.
Carey, Joe.
Coffey, Paudie.
Conaghan, Michael.
Conlan, Seán.
Connaughton, Paul J..
Conway, Ciara.
Coonan, Noel.
Corcoran Kennedy, Marcella.
Creed, Michael.
Daly, Jim.
Deasy, John.
Deering, Pat.
Doherty, Regina.
Donohoe, Paschal.
Dowds, Robert.
Doyle, Andrew.
Durkan, Bernard J..
Farrell, Alan.
Feighan, Frank.
Fitzgerald, Frances.
Fitzpatrick, Peter.
Griffin, Brendan.
Hannigan, Dominic.
Harrington, Noel.
Harris, Simon.
Heydon, Martin.
Howlin, Brendan.
Humphreys, Heather.
Humphreys, Kevin.
Keating, Derek.
Kehoe, Paul.
Kenny, Enda.
Kenny, Seán.
Kyne, Seán.
Lawlor, Anthony.
Lynch, Ciarán.
Lyons, John.
Maloney, Eamonn.
McCarthy, Michael.
McFadden, Gabrielle.
McNamara, Michael.
Mitchell, Olivia.
Mitchell O'Connor, Mary.
Mulherin, Michelle.
Murphy, Eoghan.
Nolan, Derek.
Noonan, Michael.
Ó Ríordáin, Aodhán.
O'Donnell, Kieran.
O'Donovan, Patrick.
O'Mahony, John.
O'Reilly, Joe.
O'Sullivan, Jan.
Perry, John.
Phelan, Ann.
Phelan, John Paul.
Quinn, Ruairí.
Rabbitte, Pat.
Reilly, James.
Ring, Michael.
Ryan, Brendan.
Shatter, Alan.
Sherlock, Sean.
Spring, Arthur.
Stagg, Emmet.
Stanton, David.
Tuffy, Joanna.
Twomey, Liam.
Wall, Jack.
Walsh, Brian.
White, Alex.

Níl

Adams, Gerry.
Broughan, Thomas P..
Calleary, Dara.
Collins, Joan.
Collins, Niall.
Colreavy, Michael.
Coppinger, Ruth.
Cowen, Barry.
Creighton, Lucinda.
Crowe, Seán.
Doherty, Pearse.
Donnelly, Stephen S..
Dooley, Timmy.
Ellis, Dessie.
Ferris, Martin.
Fitzmaurice, Michael.
Fleming, Sean.
Fleming, Tom.
Grealish, Noel.
Healy, Seamus.
Healy-Rae, Michael.
Higgins, Joe.
Kelleher, Billy.
Kirk, Seamus.
Kitt, Michael P..
Mac Lochlainn, Pádraig.
Martin, Micheál.
Mathews, Peter.
McConalogue, Charlie.
McGrath, Finian.
McGrath, Mattie.
McGrath, Michael.
McLellan, Sandra.
Murphy, Catherine.
Murphy, Paul.
Naughten, Denis.
Ó Caoláin, Caoimhghín.
Ó Cuív, Éamon.
Ó Fearghaíl, Seán.
Ó Snodaigh, Aengus.
O'Brien, Jonathan.
O'Dea, Willie.
O'Sullivan, Maureen.
Pringle, Thomas.
Ross, Shane.
Shortall, Róisín.
Smith, Brendan.
Stanley, Brian.
Troy, Robert.
Wallace, Mick.

Tellers: Tá, Deputies Emmet Stagg and Paul Kehoe; Níl, Deputies Aengus Ó Snodaigh and Seán Ó Fearghaíl.

Question declared carried.

Dáil Éireann debate - Tuesday, 18 Nov 2014

Order of Business

Tá

Níl

Tá

Níl

Tá

Níl

Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 18 Nov 2014