I must now deal with a postponed division relating to the motion on tracker mortgages. On Tuesday, 24 January 2017, on the question that the amendment to the motion be agreed to, a division was claimed and in accordance with Standing Order 70(2), that division must be taken now.
Tracker Mortgages: Motion (Resumed) [Private Members]
The following motion was moved by Deputy Pearse Doherty on Tuesday, 24 January 2017:
That Dáil Éireann:
notes that:
- the wrongful removal of tracker mortgage rates from mortgage holders, or a failure to restore mortgage holders to tracker mortgage rates they were entitled to, has affected thousands of families;
- the damage caused by the action of the banks involved goes far beyond a purely financial effect and that the effects it has had on the health and social well-being of families, along with the accompanying social exclusion, must also be considered;
- the confirmed cases number at least 11,700 and that many more are still likely to emerge with the Governor of the Central Bank of Ireland stating that up to 15,000 is a reasonable estimate;
- the unique economic circumstances prevailing at the time this wrong doing was ongoing resulted in a more pronounced effect and impact on families affected throughout Ireland;
- the occurrence of this behaviour across the banking system suggests a co-ordinated and deliberate attempt by Irish banks to deprive thousands of families of their rights;
- the banks have admitted that dozens of families have lost their home as a result, with AIB admitting to 14 cases, Ulster Bank to 15 cases, Permanent TSB to 22 cases and other banks not yet disclosing the number;
- there are also the homes which were surrendered and were a voluntary or agreed sale, the numbers of which are not yet captured but should also be considered a loss of home;
- in October 2015 the Central Bank of Ireland finally launched an industry wide examination into this practice, years after evidence of its existence emerged; and
- former Central Bank of Ireland head of financial regulation, Matthew Elderfield, told the Committee of Public Accounts, in 2013, that he did not believe the current legislation on the Irish Statute Book was strong enough to bring people to account for white collar crime;
commends the families and advisers who have campaigned to bring this scandal to light and pledges its support to all those affected;
condemns the widespread and scandalous abuse of mortgage holders’ rights carried out by multiple banks in which tracker mortgages and the applicable rates were denied to those who were entitled to them;
supports a comprehensive redress scheme that truly works for the customers affected, with a full right to access to tracker mortgages at the rate agreed as per the contract or at the rate applicable at the time the contract was entered into and compensation taking into account the financial and social impact of the bank’s behaviour;
questions the delay in the Central Bank of Ireland's actions in carrying out an industry-wide examination and expresses concerns that no deadline is in place for the banks to conclude their investigations and to put in place a redress and compensation scheme;
calls for the Central Bank of Ireland investigation to uncover the grounds under which each lender decided or chose to carry out this level of wrongdoing;
believes that a major overhaul of existing law is required to ensure that individuals can be held responsible before the law for their actions in financial matters;
calls on the Government to bring forward legislation to ensure that individuals in financial institutions can be held accountable for white collar crime; and
calls on the Central Bank of Ireland, An Garda Síochána and the Office of the Director of Corporate Enforcement to co-operate, with a view to establishing if individuals, as well as corporate entities, can be held accountable for their part in this scandal.
Debate resumed on amendment No. 2:
To delete all words after “Dáil Éireann” and substitute the following:
notes that:
- the Central Bank of Ireland has a considerable range of supervisory, investigative and enforcement powers which have been enhanced in recent years across a wide range of areas to combat and punish wrongdoing;
- in October 2015, the Central Bank of Ireland embarked on a broader examination of tracker mortgage related issues and since then it has produced regular progress updates on the status of the examination;
- the wrongful removal of tracker mortgage rates from mortgage holders, or a failure to restore mortgage holders to tracker mortgage rates they were entitled to, has affected thousands of families;
- approximately 8,200 impacted accounts have been identified to date by the Central Bank of Ireland but that the total number of impacted accounts is likely to be higher;
- the responsibility for causing the problem, and therefore for rectifying the problem, rests in the first instance with the lenders which wrongly removed the right of their customers to a tracker mortgage rate; and
- the Central Bank of Ireland, utilising its powers, has already issued a reprimand and imposed a fine of €4.5 million on one mortgage lender, and also required the lender to provide redress and compensation to impacted customers, in respect of breaches of its obligations to tracker mortgage customers;
supports the Central Bank of Ireland’s actions to initiate an industry wide examination and calls for the examination to be completed, with appropriate redress and compensation to impacted customers, as soon as possible;
recognising its independence, calls for the Central Bank of Ireland to investigate, and where pertinent, to apply appropriate sanctions to regulated entities and/or individuals for wrongdoing where supported by the evidence;
calls on the Central Bank of Ireland, An Garda Síochána and the Office of the Director of Corporate Enforcement to co-operate and act as necessary on matters arising from the examination of the tracker mortgage issue; and
calls on the Government to keep the legislation on financial regulation and white collar crime under review and to bring forward new proposals if necessary.
-(Minister for Finance).
Amendment put:
The Dáil divided: Tá, 53; Staon, 0; Níl, 91.
Tá
- Bailey, Maria.
- Barrett, Seán.
- Breen, Pat.
- Brophy, Colm.
- Bruton, Richard.
- Burke, Peter.
- Byrne, Catherine.
- Canney, Seán.
- Cannon, Ciarán.
- Carey, Joe.
- Corcoran Kennedy, Marcella.
- Coveney, Simon.
- Creed, Michael.
- Daly, Jim.
- D'Arcy, Michael.
- Deering, Pat.
- Doherty, Regina.
- Donohoe, Paschal.
- Doyle, Andrew.
- Durkan, Bernard J.
- English, Damien.
- Farrell, Alan.
- Fitzpatrick, Peter.
- Flanagan, Charles.
- Griffin, Brendan.
- Halligan, John.
- Harris, Simon.
- Heydon, Martin.
- Humphreys, Heather.
- Kehoe, Paul.
- Kenny, Enda.
- Kyne, Seán.
- McEntee, Helen.
- McGrath, Finian.
- McHugh, Joe.
- McLoughlin, Tony.
- Madigan, Josepha.
- Mitchell O'Connor, Mary.
- Moran, Kevin Boxer.
- Murphy, Dara.
- Murphy, Eoghan.
- Naughton, Hildegarde.
- Neville, Tom.
- O'Connell, Kate.
- O'Donovan, Patrick.
- O'Dowd, Fergus.
- Phelan, John Paul.
- Ring, Michael.
- Rock, Noel.
- Ross, Shane.
- Stanton, David.
- Varadkar, Leo.
- Zappone, Katherine.
Níl
- Adams, Gerry.
- Aylward, Bobby.
- Barry, Mick.
- Boyd Barrett, Richard.
- Brady, John.
- Brassil, John.
- Breathnach, Declan.
- Broughan, Thomas P.
- Browne, James.
- Buckley, Pat.
- Burton, Joan.
- Byrne, Thomas.
- Cahill, Jackie.
- Calleary, Dara.
- Casey, Pat.
- Cassells, Shane.
- Chambers, Lisa.
- Collins, Joan.
- Collins, Michael.
- Collins, Niall.
- Connolly, Catherine.
- Coppinger, Ruth.
- Crowe, Seán.
- Cullinane, David.
- Curran, John.
- Daly, Clare.
- Doherty, Pearse.
- Donnelly, Stephen S.
- Dooley, Timmy.
- Ellis, Dessie.
- Fitzmaurice, Michael.
- Fleming, Sean.
- Funchion, Kathleen.
- Grealish, Noel.
- Harty, Michael.
- Haughey, Seán.
- Healy, Seamus.
- Healy-Rae, Danny.
- Howlin, Brendan.
- Kelleher, Billy.
- Kelly, Alan.
- Kenny, Gino.
- Kenny, Martin.
- Lahart, John.
- Lawless, James.
- Lowry, Michael.
- MacSharry, Marc.
- McConalogue, Charlie.
- McDonald, Mary Lou.
- McGrath, Mattie.
- McGrath, Michael.
- McGuinness, John.
- Martin, Catherine.
- Martin, Micheál.
- Mitchell, Denise.
- Moynihan, Aindrias.
- Moynihan, Michael.
- Munster, Imelda.
- Murphy, Eugene.
- Murphy, Paul.
- Murphy O'Mahony, Margaret.
- Nolan, Carol.
- Ó Broin, Eoin.
- Ó Caoláin, Caoimhghín.
- Ó Cuív, Éamon.
- Ó Laoghaire, Donnchadh.
- Ó Snodaigh, Aengus.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Brien, Jonathan.
- O'Callaghan, Jim.
- O'Dea, Willie.
- O'Loughlin, Fiona.
- O'Reilly, Louise.
- O'Rourke, Frank.
- O'Sullivan, Jan.
- O'Sullivan, Maureen.
- Penrose, Willie.
- Pringle, Thomas.
- Quinlivan, Maurice.
- Rabbitte, Anne.
- Ryan, Brendan.
- Ryan, Eamon.
- Scanlon, Eamon.
- Sherlock, Sean.
- Shortall, Róisín.
- Smith, Brendan.
- Smith, Bríd.
- Smyth, Niamh.
- Stanley, Brian.
- Tóibín, Peadar.
- Wallace, Mick.
Staon
Tellers: Tá, Deputies Regina Doherty and Tony McLoughlin; Níl, Deputies Pearse Doherty and Aengus Ó Snodaigh.
Amendment declared lost.
Is Deputy Michael McGrath pressing amendment No. 1?
I move amendment No. 1:
To delete all words after “Dáil Éireann” and substitute the following:
“notes that:
— the wrongful denial of mortgage holders of their right to revert to a tracker rate following a period on a fixed interest rate, or the failure to restore mortgage holders to the correct tracker mortgage rate they were entitled to, has affected thousands of families;
— the damage caused by the action of the banks involved goes far beyond a purely financial effect and that the effects it has had on the health and social wellbeing of families, along with the accompanying social exclusion, must also be considered;
— the confirmed cases number at least 11,700 and that many more may still possibly emerge with the Governor of the Central Bank of Ireland stating that up to 15,000 is a reasonable estimate;
— the exceptional economic circumstances prevailing at the time this wrong doing was ongoing may well have resulted in a more pronounced effect and impact on families affected throughout Ireland;
— the occurrence of this practice across the banking system was widespread and systemic and resulted in thousands of families being denied their contractual rights;
— the banks have admitted that dozens of families have lost their home as a result with AIB admitting to 14 cases, Ulster Bank to 15 cases, Permanent TSB to 22 and other banks not yet disclosing the number;
— it seems certain that there are also homes which were surrendered and were a voluntary or agreed sale, the numbers of which are not yet captured but should also be considered a loss of home;
— in October 2015, the Central Bank of Ireland launched an industry wide examination into this practice, and this remains ongoing; and
— the Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach, is currently examining this issue and has agreed to invite the Central Bank of Ireland to attend before the Committee on a quarterly basis, and it remains open to the Committee to issue a report and make recommendations on any aspect of this scandal;
commends the families and advisors that have campaigned to bring this scandal to light and pledges its support to all those affected;
condemns the widespread and scandalous abuse of mortgage holders’ rights carried out by multiple banks in which tracker mortgages and the applicable rates were denied to those who were entitled to them;
supports a comprehensive redress scheme that truly works for the customers affected, with a full right to access to tracker mortgages at the rate agreed as per the contract or at the rate applicable at the time the contract was entered into and compensation, taking into account the financial and social impact of the bank’s behaviour;
calls on the Central Bank of Ireland to impose a deadline for the banks to conclude their investigations, to put in place a redress and compensation scheme, and to have as the overarching priority, looking after the customers who have been directly affected;
calls for the Central Bank of Ireland investigation to uncover the grounds under which each lender decided or chose to carry out this level of wrong doing;
calls for an independent review of existing law to ascertain if sufficient powers exist to hold individuals responsible for their actions in financial matters;
calls on the Government to bring forward any such legislation that is identified as being necessary as a result of this examination, to ensure that individuals in financial institutions can be held accountable for any white collar crime that may occur; and
calls on the Central Bank of Ireland to use all of the available statutory powers to establish the truth of what happened in this case, including a detailed account of how it happened, who was responsible and to be led by the evidence in bringing any matters to other statutory bodies as appropriate.”
Amendment put:
The Dáil divided: Tá, 97; Staon, 0; Níl, 46.
Tá
- Aylward, Bobby.
- Bailey, Maria.
- Barrett, Seán.
- Brassil, John.
- Breathnach, Declan.
- Breen, Pat.
- Brophy, Colm.
- Browne, James.
- Bruton, Richard.
- Burke, Peter.
- Byrne, Catherine.
- Byrne, Thomas.
- Cahill, Jackie.
- Calleary, Dara.
- Canney, Seán.
- Cannon, Ciarán.
- Carey, Joe.
- Casey, Pat.
- Cassells, Shane.
- Chambers, Lisa.
- Collins, Michael.
- Collins, Niall.
- Corcoran Kennedy, Marcella.
- Coveney, Simon.
- Creed, Michael.
- Curran, John.
- D'Arcy, Michael.
- Daly, Jim.
- Deering, Pat.
- Doherty, Regina.
- Donnelly, Stephen S.
- Donohoe, Paschal.
- Dooley, Timmy.
- Doyle, Andrew.
- Durkan, Bernard J.
- English, Damien.
- Farrell, Alan.
- Fitzmaurice, Michael.
- Fitzpatrick, Peter.
- Flanagan, Charles.
- Fleming, Sean.
- Griffin, Brendan.
- Halligan, John.
- Harris, Simon.
- Harty, Michael.
- Haughey, Seán.
- Healy-Rae, Danny.
- Heydon, Martin.
- Humphreys, Heather.
- Kehoe, Paul.
- Kelleher, Billy.
- Kenny, Enda.
- Kyne, Seán.
- Lahart, John.
- Lawless, James.
- Lowry, Michael.
- MacSharry, Marc.
- McConalogue, Charlie.
- McEntee, Helen.
- McGrath, Finian.
- McGrath, Mattie.
- McGrath, Michael.
- McGuinness, John.
- McHugh, Joe.
- McLoughlin, Tony.
- Madigan, Josepha.
- Martin, Micheál.
- Mitchell O'Connor, Mary.
- Moran, Kevin Boxer.
- Moynihan, Aindrias.
- Moynihan, Michael.
- Murphy O'Mahony, Margaret.
- Murphy, Dara.
- Murphy, Eoghan.
- Murphy, Eugene.
- Naughton, Hildegarde.
- Neville, Tom.
- Ó Cuív, Éamon.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Callaghan, Jim.
- O'Connell, Kate.
- O'Dea, Willie.
- O'Donovan, Patrick.
- O'Dowd, Fergus.
- O'Loughlin, Fiona.
- O'Rourke, Frank.
- Phelan, John Paul.
- Rabbitte, Anne.
- Ring, Michael.
- Rock, Noel.
- Ross, Shane.
- Scanlon, Eamon.
- Smith, Brendan.
- Smyth, Niamh.
- Stanton, David.
- Varadkar, Leo.
- Zappone, Katherine.
Níl
- Adams, Gerry.
- Barry, Mick.
- Boyd Barrett, Richard.
- Brady, John.
- Broughan, Thomas P.
- Buckley, Pat.
- Burton, Joan.
- Collins, Joan.
- Connolly, Catherine.
- Coppinger, Ruth.
- Crowe, Seán.
- Cullinane, David.
- Daly, Clare.
- Doherty, Pearse.
- Ellis, Dessie.
- Funchion, Kathleen.
- Healy, Seamus.
- Howlin, Brendan.
- Kelly, Alan.
- Kenny, Gino.
- Kenny, Martin.
- McDonald, Mary Lou.
- Martin, Catherine.
- Mitchell, Denise.
- Munster, Imelda.
- Murphy, Paul.
- Nolan, Carol.
- Ó Broin, Eoin.
- Ó Caoláin, Caoimhghín.
- Ó Laoghaire, Donnchadh.
- Ó Snodaigh, Aengus.
- O'Brien, Jonathan.
- O'Reilly, Louise.
- O'Sullivan, Jan.
- O'Sullivan, Maureen.
- Penrose, Willie.
- Pringle, Thomas.
- Quinlivan, Maurice.
- Ryan, Brendan.
- Ryan, Eamon.
- Sherlock, Sean.
- Shortall, Róisín.
- Smith, Bríd.
- Stanley, Brian.
- Tóibín, Peadar.
- Wallace, Mick.
Staon
Tellers: Tá, Deputies Michael Moynihan and John Lahart; Níl, Deputies Aengus Ó Snodaigh and Pearse Doherty.
Amendment declared carried.
Motion, as amended, put and agreed to.