Topical Issue Debate

Orthodontic Services Waiting Lists

Deputy Frank O'Rourke

This Topical Issue matter is about the long, outstanding waiting lists for orthodontic treatment. It is regrettable that each time I face somebody from the Department of Health, it is on an issue of long, outstanding waiting lists or on difficulty with the service in general, which is a shame. We know that this subject was very well captured in the recent documentary on RTE, especially around the waiting lists. I spoke in the Chamber a few months ago about the waiting lists for adult spinal surgery being completely unacceptable, as are the associated problems for persons whose treatment is regarded as urgent. After 18 months they are still waiting for their procedure. The disappointing element is that a number of months on there is no change in that situation, despite the promises and commitment given in the House on that occasion a number of months ago. We must get real about bringing solutions to deliver where there are recognised problems.

I have a number of cases from my constituency of Kildare North and from speaking with my colleagues in other constituencies where the orthodontic waiting lists are going out of control. I have examples with me of cases of people who were seen back in 2013 and 2014. They were recognised at that stage as being very urgent. Here we are three years on, and in some cases four years on, and these people are still on a waiting list with no date for treatment or surgery for whatever work needs to be carried out regarding their orthodontic problems. That is completely unacceptable.

I know the Minister of State will probably agree with me, and the Department and Ministers do agree with me and my colleagues in the House when we say it is unacceptable. The Minister for Health said after the "RTE Investigates" documentary programme that he was "ashamed" and "heartbroken", and I am sure he does feel that, but those words are of little use or of any assistance to the people on these waiting lists. There are teenagers on the waiting lists, adolescents who may be in the middle of State mock exams and heading into their leaving certificate or junior certificate exams. They may be trying to plan to go away and work for the summer but their lives are on hold because they do not know if and when they are going to get this important and very necessary treatment that has been suggested after a diagnosis by professionals. That is wrong. It leads to all sorts of problems such as social issues, and in some cases bullying. In one case, one of my constituents is reluctant to go to school because of the difficulties and problems they face. It is completely unacceptable three and four years on from when they were first diagnosed in a consultation and treatment was prescribed that it has not been carried out.

I note that from the same documentary programme the HSE has acknowledged that it hopes to have waiting lists down to a maximum of 18 months by the end of June 2017. Given that this is just four and a half months away, how realistic is this hope? I have a number of cases with me right now that have not yet received a date for treatment. Is that an opportune response by the HSE or is it a real response to the waiting lists? Can I tell my constituents and their families that they are going to have an appointment and their treatment will be carried out before the end of June 2017? That is what it comes down to. We must see results and we have to get outcomes. We can no longer speak about the issues. We must see delivery and the public has to see an improvement and a better service. Four years is not acceptable to be on a waiting list for any treatment.

Minister of State at the Department of Health (Deputy Marcella Corcoran Kennedy)

I thank the Leas-Cheann Comhairle. I also thank Deputy O'Rourke for raising this matter and for giving me an opportunity to update the House on the position on orthognathic surgery in St. James's Hospital as advised to me by the HSE.

Orthognathic surgery, or corrective jaw surgery, is performed by an oral and maxillofacial surgeon to correct a wide range of minor and major skeletal and dental irregularities, including the misalignment of jaws and teeth. The HSE has advised that joint orthodontic surgical clinics were provided previously in St. Columcille’s Hospital, Loughlinstown and in St. James's oral and maxillofacial surgery unit each month. Due to the resignation of the consultant orthodontist at St. Columcille’s Hospital, Loughlinstown in 2014, however, it is regrettable that it has not been possible to continue the joint clinics between the two hospitals as before. The HSE has advised me that all patients under treatment in St. Columcille’s Hospital prior to 2014 have continued their surgical and orthodontic treatment in St. James’s Hospital. The HSE has also advised that, while consultant manpower, theatre and bed capacity issues have also arisen in the St. James's oral and maxillofacial surgery unit over this period, the hospital has maintained its levels of orthognathic surgery over the past 12 months.

The HSE has advised that it is working to progress the recruitment and appointment of a replacement consultant orthodontist at St. Columcille’s Hospital. The HSE has further advised that St. James’s Hospital has been working with the national clinical adviser to the HSE acute hospital division and with the HSE primary care division to agree a pathway of care to allow increased access to orthognathic surgery to meet demand. As part of these discussions, the recruitment of two oral and maxillofacial surgery consultant posts with a specific remit for orthognathic surgery has been identified as a priority. The HSE has advised that a decision on the first of these posts is expected in the near future.

St. James’s Hospital is part of the Dublin Midlands Hospitals Group. Any proposals for St. James’s to develop the orthognathic surgery service further will need to be considered in the context of how the role of the hospital can best contribute as part of the Dublin Midlands Hospitals Group and with regard to resources available.

On the waiting list for orthognathic surgery in St. James’s, as the Deputy is aware, reducing waiting times for the longest waiting patients is one of this Government's key priorities. Consequently, budget 2017 allocated €20 million to the National Treatment Purchase Fund, NTPF, rising to €55 million in 2018. Among other things, the HSE is developing a 2017 waiting list action plan for inpatient day case procedures to ensure no patient is waiting more than 15 months by the end of October, as the Deputy said. A similar plan is being developed for outpatient appointments. I expect that the details of both plans will be available in the coming weeks.

Deputy Frank O'Rourke

I thank the Minister of State. An area of concern in dealing with the waiting lists is the lack of resources and the infrastructure or supports not being in place. When we see that a consultant resigned and took up a post outside the country nearly three years ago and this position has not been filled, I believe we could all accept that this situation is not good enough. One must query the commitment to the process and the seriousness of dealing with these unacceptable waiting times and waiting lists. A waiting time of 18 months is borderline but three and four years is completely unacceptable for people to wait for much-needed prescribed treatment. These are not recommendations by me or others. These are made by consultants who are trained and qualified in this area. They recommend these treatments be carried out under the heading "urgent".

I am concerned that the Minister of State in her reply did not give definite timelines or commitments as to when these waiting lists will be reduced. When will the three or four cases that I have with me today be adequately and fully dealt with? It is very important for these families and for the people involved. We need to get real commitments. I am quite happy to give details of these cases to the Minister of State after this engagement, if she wishes, to try to have the cases prioritised, because the wait is not at all good enough. I accept there is the National Treatment Purchase Fund. Are we going to say that the fund should deal with these lists? Are the people in my constituency who have been waiting three or four years going to be dealt with in the next couple of months? That is what they need to hear. I hope the Minister of State can come back to me with real commitments and timelines to give these people some hope.

Before I conclude, if the Leas-Cheann Comhairle could indulge me for a moment, today has been a very poor day in my constituency of Kildare North. I know this topic is not related to my Topical Issue matter but there are around 500 job losses.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

That is off subject Deputy.

Deputy Frank O'Rourke

It is important we acknowledge the staff and their families who have lost their jobs. We urge that the Government engage as quickly as possible to ensure-----

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Deputy, please.

Deputy Frank O'Rourke

-----that they are retrained in order that they can be re-employed as quickly as possible.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy is taking advantage.

Deputy Frank O'Rourke

I thank the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor, for agreeing to meet me and my Dáil colleagues in the constituency to discuss the issue.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Deputy must allow the Minister of State to respond to the issue we are discussing.

Deputy Marcella Corcoran Kennedy

I assure the Deputy there is no question but that the requirement to reduce waiting lists is a priority for the Government. As he outlined, patients waiting three to four years is unacceptable. There is no denying it. I look forward to the HSE's waiting list action plan and welcome its commitment that no patient will be waiting longer than 15 months by the end of October. That is what we expect it to deliver. I cannot comment on the individual patients to whom the Deputy referred. It would be helpful if he could provide me with details and I will ask the HSE what is causing the delay and what might be done to address it.

Building Regulations

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The Beacon South Quarter development was built between 2005 and 2014 and comprises approximately 600 apartments and several commercial buildings. Built by Paddy Shovlin and Landmark Enterprises, it was a celebrated development during the Celtic tiger years. Unfortunately, we are now seeing the legacy of Fianna Fáil in government in the discovery by residents that their homes contain many structural defects. An EGM notice was issued by the management company to residents on 13 January seeking payment of €1 million in regard to water ingress and €9 million to rectify fire compliance issues. They are facing this bill through no fault of their own. The EGM called by the management company and the agent, Aramark Property, last Monday seems somewhat contrived in that the Statute of Limitations that was mentioned by the chair of the management company, Simon Coyle, has expired. Given that the first issues in regard to leakages and so on were discovered in 2010, it seems very convenient that payment of €10 million is now being sought.

The situation is extremely distressing and upsetting for the residents, who are already paying significant management fees of somewhere between €800 and €1,500 per year and simply cannot pay such large amounts. It is not yet known how the bill will be divided up between the units and how much each home owner will have to pay. Moreover, there is no transparency in regard to the tendering process and residents have no way of knowing if they are getting best value for money or if they will face further costs down the line.

I am asking the Government to assist the residents in finding a fair resolution to this matter. We have seen similar issues at the Longboat Quay and Priory Hall developments. I compliment the Government on introducing new building regulations in 2014 but, as they are not retrospective, they are of no assistance to the residents in my constituency. The Beacon South Quarter owners and residents group is doing a lot of work behind the scenes to assist the residents, and another EGM is due to take place in a month's time. Will the Minister use his political capital with the Minister for Finance, Deputy Noonan, to see whether an equitable solution can be devised in collaboration with all of the parties, including Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown County Council? It should be noted that Clúid, the largest non-profit housing association in the country, owns 58 apartments in block B1 and is looking at a fire safety bill of €540,000.

The State cannot completely wash its hands of this. I am not necessarily saying the Exchequer should foot the bill, but the Government should assist these people in a context where the regulations are not retrospective. Will the Minister consider the possibility of offsetting their substantial bills against tax, similar to what is done under the first-time buyer's scheme, or perhaps offering a VAT rebate on these essential works, as we do in respect of home renovations? We must address this matter urgently and I ask the Minister to act without delay to see what he can do.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Before inviting the Minister of State to respond, I point out that Deputy Madigan mentioned a builder by name, which is not the norm.

Minister of State at the Department of Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government (Deputy Damien English)

I thank the Deputy for raising this important issue which is understandably causing great distress for owners and residents at Beacon South Quarter. In general, building defects are matters for resolution between the contracting parties involved, namely, the home owner, the builder and the developer and-or its respective insurers, structural guarantee or warranty scheme. In this regard, it is incumbent on the parties responsible for poor workmanship and-or the supply of defective materials to face up to their responsibilities and take appropriate action to provide remedies for affected home owners.

It is important to clarify that my Department has no statutory role in resolving defects in privately owned buildings, including residential apartments, nor does it have a budget for such matters. I am not aware of any grants or State supports that have general application in such circumstances. Accordingly, the Department is not in a position to provide financial assistance towards the costs of remedial works that may be required where defects are identified in private developments. However, I certainly will raise the possibility of a tax rebate, as the Deputy suggested, with the Minister for Finance. It is something the residents should pursue in conjunction with the county council.

Under the Building Control Acts 1990 to 2014, primary responsibility for compliance with the requirements of the building regulations rests with the designers, builders and owners of buildings. Enforcement of the regulations is a matter for the 31 local building control authorities which have extensive powers of inspection and investigation under the Acts. Neither I nor my Department has any role in regard to enforcement matters and cannot interfere in individual cases. In response to the many building failures that have emerged over the past decade, my Department introduced the Building Control (Amendment) Regulations 2014 which provide for greater accountability in respect of compliance with building regulations in the form of statutory certification of design and construction by registered construction professionals, lodgment of compliance documentation, mandatory inspections during construction, and validation and registration of certificates.

As the Minister, Deputy Coveney, informed the House two weeks ago, a new building control Bill is a priority for this Dáil term. That legislation will place the Construction Industry Register Ireland on a statutory footing and provide in law for the registration of builders, contractors and specialist subcontractors. We hope to bring the general scheme of the Bill to Cabinet by the end of February.

However, I realise this will not resolve the problems immediately facing the owners and residents of Beacon South Quarter. The issues that have emerged are a matter for the receiver to the developer, the owners and residents and their management company to resolve collaboratively or through such other avenues they consider appropriate. I hope the problems that have emerged can be brought to a successful resolution for all concerned. I am sorry we cannot offer greater help on this matter, but it is not a role of the Department to do so. However, I will talk to the local authority to see if there is any advice that can be offered to the residents. In addition, as I said, I will discuss the possibility of a tax rebate with the Minister for Finance. However, it is important that the residents and all involved should make their own case in this regard.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I thank the Minister of State for his response and his undertaking to discuss the possibility of a tax rebate with the Minister for Finance and to communicate with the local authority on the matter. However, I do not accept the Government cannot intervene on the basis that it is a matter only for the contracting parties. Government involvement would greatly facilitate productive negotiations and a workable solution. Such an intervention would not be unheard of. In fact, it has been done before. It would greatly help the residents, many of whom have no experience in terms of how to proceed and how to find a solution.

I ask the Minister of State for further clarity in this regard. I urge him to come back to me in early course on the question of tax breaks. This is an urgent issue. The building control regulations introduced in 2014 were very welcome but are of absolutely no use to the Beacon South Quarter residents. I am pleading with the Government to facilitate a discussion with Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown County Council. There is also the fact that the National Asset Management Agency had a role in this when it sold block B1 to Clúid. The State cannot simply wash its hands of facilitating a workable solution.

The Beacon South Quarter residents would appreciate any kind of assistance at this stage.

Deputy Damien English

I again thank Deputy Madigan for raising the issue. It is certainly not a case of us washing our hands and if I could identify an area where we could help, it is something we would look at. I certainly will raise the issue with Clúid housing association, as we have responsibility for it. Deputy Madigan mentioned NAMA as well.

The Department does not have any statutory role in resolving defects in privately owned buildings, and these are privately owned buildings. Apart from the statutory powers, we do not even have a budget for this matter. Building defects are matters for resolution between the contracting parties involved, which is the home owner, the builder, the developer, their respective insurers, and the structural guarantee or warranty scheme in relation to Homebond, Premier Guarantee or whichever company is involved. These are issues that need to be resolved at that level.

Certainly, I will raise the issue. As the Minister for Finance, Deputy Noonan, is not here today, I will bring the matter Deputy Madigan has raised to his attention and see if there is any line of hope there as well.

I believe there are avenues open to the groups in the situation and they need to lead the residents through all the proper procedures there. The Department does not have the statutory power to intervene.

The primary responsibility for compliance with the requirements of the building regulations rests with the designers, the builders and the owners of the buildings. All of those are stakeholders and all have involvement in this. I believe the residents need to work this out through the system involving all of those stakeholders.

Enforcement of the building regulations is a matter for the 31 local authorities, one of which Deputy Madigan identified here today. The local authorities have extensive powers of inspection and investigation as well.

The issues are a matter for the receiver to the developer in this case and the owners or the residents and the management company to resolve. I would hope, maybe, through the AGM or other methods, that there can be communication to resolve this issue with all those players together. There should be scope to do that.

Where problems cannot be resolved through dialogue or through mediation, it may be necessary to explore other courses of action. No doubt the residents and all involved will look at that too. I will talk to colleagues in the Department to see if there is any other information that we can provide from other cases that might be of assistance but I want to make clear that we do not have a statutory role to be able to intervene here to help.

Job Losses

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The next Topical Issue, in the names of Deputies Lawless, Quinlivan, Ruth Coppinger and Heydon, is to the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation about the announcement of Hewlett Packard and the future of this facility at Leixlip. Each Deputy, in that order, will have three minutes to make an initial statement, the Minister will have four minutes and then Deputies will have one minute each for a supplementary question. I call Deputy Lawless.

Deputy James Lawless

I come to the Chamber today directly from Leixlip where I was at Hewlett Packard for most of the morning talking to workers, talking to staff and talking to the various management who were available on site. I was disappointed to note I was the only Oireachtas Member on site. There were no Government representatives present. There is a scrum to get into job announcements and I was disappointed to see the same approach is not taken to job cuts.

As the Minister should be aware, this is a devastating blow to Kildare, to the local economy of north Kildare and to the areas of Leixlip, Maynooth, Celbridge, Naas and the wider hinterland. This is one of the key employers in north Kildare along with Intel, Pfizer, Kerry Foods and others and 500 job losses is a huge hammer blow to those workers and their families and to the wider local economy. As the House will be aware, for every ten jobs generated by FDI another seven are generated as a spin-off. No doubt the local economy will begin to suffer as well. Everything that can be done has to be done to support those workers to begin that process of retraining and re-skilling, if that is required, to support them and put the facilities of the State at their disposal. I would be interested in knowing what package is on the table in terms of supports for those workers, everything from social protection through to retraining through such support services.

The writing was on the wall for this one for some time. The restructuring - it was at HP at global level - was announced in November 2015 of HP Inc. and HP Enterprise. It was well understood globally that 3,000 to 4,000 jobs would be cut. If that was not enough of a signal, the CEO of Hewlett Packard globally, Ms Meg Whitman, speaking at the Davos forum last month, made an announcement, which made world headlines but, perhaps, not the Minister's attention, that jobs and humans would be put out of business by robots and automation. Advanced manufacturing is heading in this direction. That was a fairly strong signal and I would have thought the Department and the Minister would have engaged, even at that late stage, given the number of signals that had been given, given the presence of HP in Ireland and given its critical importance not only to the local Kildare economy and those workers but to the wider national economy and our economic model.

I want to ask the Minister what engagement she had with HP management. Did the Minister meet them in Ireland? Did she meet them elsewhere, for example, in the United States? If not, why? What contacts had the Minister or her office this week, this month and over the past 12 months, in light of the announcement of November 2015? Given HP's significant footprint in Ireland, did the Minister take immediate steps to engage with the company? If so, could the Minister elaborate on those? What steps are now being taken, in terms of mitigation?

It strikes me this has happened previously. As the Minister will be aware, I represent north Kildare. Intel went through the exact same process approximately a year ago. Once can be forgiven, twice is careless. It is unforgivable. What kind of mitigation plan has the Government? What kind of crisis management is in place? Unfortunately, these situations occur. We need to be prepared for them. We need to have more than we are doing. What is being done?

Deputy Maurice Quinlivan

I thank the Leas-Cheann Comhairle for taking this discussion. It is important that he has allowed four of us to speak.

First, my thoughts are with the workers and their families. It is a stressful time for them, some of whom are struggling with mortgages and the daily bills they will have to pay. I spoke to a number of those workers today and they are shattered by the reality of what has hit them with the number of job losses.

Whereas HP Inc. announced in October that it would be cutting 3,000 to 4,000 jobs globally over the next three years, nobody expected that 500 workers would be told today that they will lose their jobs in Leixlip. The scale of job losses announced today has been truly shocking.

The loss of these 500 jobs at the HP Inc. factory in Leixlip will be a major devastating blow, not only to the town but to the surrounding area of Kildare and in west Dublin where many of the workers also live. The area needs to be given priority by IDA Ireland. Education and training courses should be made available for the workforce to help them find alternative employment.

HP, as the Minister will be aware, has been a major employer in Leixlip since 1995. The loss of these jobs will clearly be a major blow to that area. The site remains and it must be used for alternative employment.

Since HP announced it would be cutting 3,000 to 4,000 jobs globally over the next three years, questions must be asked about what has happened in the intervening period. As the company has clearly stated that it will invest in new market opportunities, we need to know today from the Minister where the jobs are going to? It is also critical that new investment is secured for this area.

The company has also indicated that jobs will be transferred abroad. If possible - I do not see why not - we should start to access the EU globalisation fund as early as possible. The Minister must ensure that the particular opportunity of funding from the EU globalisation fund is not wasted, as was the case with previous large-scale job losses in the State. My city of Limerick is a case in point, where we experienced a devastating loss of jobs in Dell in 2009. It was a textbook case of how it should not be done. If funding is accessible, the Minister should start leveraging it today.

Those who have lost their jobs must be given access to proper education and training courses to help them find alternative employment. It is clearly a stressful time for them and their families, as many will struggle to pay their mortgages and pay their daily bills.

I want specifically to ask the Minister if she briefed Cabinet on the expected scale of losses because some of her Cabinet colleagues seem to be in shock at the number of jobs losses that have been announced today. Rumour was floating around for a number of weeks or months or, as Deputy Lawless referred to, probably longer, that these jobs were precarious and they could be lost. I want to know did the Minister raise this at Cabinet. Did the Minister raise it at the Cabinet meeting this week? When has she raised it at Cabinet?

Deputy Ruth Coppinger

Five hundred workers and their families had to find out through the media, the television etc. that their jobs had been lost. These workers are from Kildare and west Dublin and many are from my constituency and other Dublin constituencies and around Leinster in general.

What this brings centre stage again is the massive unique dependency of this country on American-owned foreign direct investment to create employment and the lack of any native industrial policy. As a result, 20 out of 25 companies listed on the NASDAQ stock exchange as companies in Ireland are not Irish companies, 40 American companies account for two thirds of the value of Irish exports and one in five private sector jobs is now IDA Ireland supported through foreign direct investment.

Hewlett Packard is also one of the top two technology companies being investigated in the US Senate for tax avoidance on a massive scale. Obviously, much of this is connected with Ireland.

In total, 100% of its cash reserves are kept out of America, which is even more than in the case of Microsoft or Apple. Loans from its companies abroad subsidise its US operations. The Minister says she has daily contact with the IDA, so perhaps she can answer my questions about the largesse Hewlett Packard has enjoyed from the Irish State and the Irish taxpayer since it came here. How much grant aid has Hewlett Packard received since it located here? How many higher capital and employment grants for locating outside Dublin, for which there is a higher rate, has it received from the IDA? What level of corporation tax is Hewlett Packard paying in this country, when its workers are paying PRSI, pension contributions and so forth? How many high-level Hewlett Packard executives were given State appointments by Fine Gael or the Labour Party in recent years? The reason I ask that question is that in February 2012 Hewlett Packard and the IDA announced 150 Hewlett Packard jobs supported by the IDA in Galway and Leixlip. How many of these jobs were given IDA grants to bring them to this country in the first place? Even if they were not, Hewlett Packard is getting huge assistance from the State for other jobs. In April 2011, another 50 jobs in the cloud services innovation centre in Galway were supported by the IDA.

Hewlett Packard is high on the IDA's list of companies that got grants in 2015. It got the third highest amount of IDA grant aid in 1997. Its profits were $2.7 billion last year. There is no need for these workers to suffer in this way. Many of the company's top executives have been feted by the Irish establishment, as well as receiving appointments within the IDA and in many other places.

Deputy Martin Heydon

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for selecting this important Topical Issue for discussion and for giving me the opportunity to speak on it. I represent Kildare South and while HP Inc. is located in the north of the county, today is a significant blow for all of County Kildare and the adjoining counties where a number of the workers come from. It should be put on the record that although we are discussing HP Inc. now, the jobs in the Hewlett Packard Enterprise element remain secure. That is very important and I urge the Minister to continue to engage with Hewlett Packard in the future to ensure everything can be done to keep the other approximately 1,500 important jobs on site. I acknowledge the supports the Government has provided to the research and development sector in recent years to grow that sector, a reason those jobs remain. Today, my thoughts are with the employees and their families but also with the workers and families in the many businesses in Kildare whose business, or a large amount of it, depends on the spin-off industry and economic activity that happens in this plant.

I wish to focus on the supports the State will provide now. The IDA has a significant role to play. A fine site will become available, unfortunately, and I expect no stone to be left unturned to find an alternative economic activity and employment opportunity for it. Kildare sometimes suffers from a perception of affluence. There is a belief that because Kildare has a great deal of foreign direct investment and is located beside Dublin it is fine. I challenge that myth. We have challenges in Kildare and some of them come from being so close to such a large economy as Dublin's. The Minister must ensure there is not a sense that jobs will come to Kildare because of where it is. No stone can be left unturned to ensure these jobs are replaced by other high level jobs.

Another State support is the Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board, ETB, which is ready to support the staff if they require re-training. The European Globalisation Adjustment Fund provides support when 500 jobs are lost in an area. I ask the Minister to work closely with the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Bruton, whose Department would make the application to Europe for this support funding. The European Globalisation Adjustment Fund will help staff who need to re-train and will provide approximately 60% of the funding towards that support to the staff who are losing their jobs today and over the coming year. We should seek to tap into that important support if at all possible. The education and training board will support that.

Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation (Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor)

I thank Deputies Lawless, Quinlivan, Coppinger and Heydon for raising this issue. Today's announcement by HP Inc. is very disappointing and distressing for the 500 employees of the company and for Leixlip and County Kildare. My immediate thoughts are with the workers and their families. Many of these men and women have been with this company for a long time, which makes this news even more difficult.

The Government and IDA Ireland have done everything possible to avert this decision. I have had contact with HP Inc.’s senior management. The IDA has been in intensive daily engagement with the company. Strong proposals were put forward to try to ensure the continuing presence of the business in Leixlip. Unfortunately, it did not prove possible for HP Inc. to change course. The decision formed part of a wider global restructuring process - a commercial decision which was irreversible. This is a company-specific issue where HP Inc. is consolidating its core business.

I wish to make it clear that the decision by HP Inc. is purely a commercial one taken by the company. The company’s senior management has been adamant about this. It has nothing to do with Brexit, the new US Administration, lreland’s competitiveness or any other wider economic or geopolitical factor. Unfortunately, as we know from past experience in Ireland, global companies sometimes undertake strategic restructurings which involve the loss of jobs, as in this case.

In conclusion, I emphasise that I am committed to working with my Oireachtas colleagues in response to this.

Deputy James Lawless

I am very disappointed with the Minister's response. The only thing I will credit the Minister with is her commitment to working with her Oireachtas colleagues and I look forward to meeting her later this evening at the meeting with Members of the Oireachtas from County Kildare.

Apart from that, I cannot find much else to welcome in the Minister's statement. There are no specifics about the support package. There is no commitment to a support package and I do not know what is available in terms of social protection, training and reskilling. We need contact points and dedicated personnel assigned to that. There is no mitigation plan in place. HP Inc. is unfortunate to be the receiver of bad news today. The Minister has mentioned other factors, such as President Trump and Brexit, which do not affect HP Inc. but they might affect other firms. What mitigation or crisis management plan is in place for the future? We had the issue with Intel a year ago, the announcement about HP Inc. today and it might be some other company this year or next year. Is any kind of plan being put together? We need this fast.

I hate to say this but the last time the Minister visited County Kildare she invited members of the council to a photograph opportunity. The time for photograph opportunities is gone. It is time for action.

Deputy Maurice Quinlivan

I too am disappointed with the Minister's response. Tonight, 500 workers and their families will go to bed with little or no assurance from what the Minister and the Taoiseach have said today. I asked the Minister specific questions. One of them was whether she had briefed the Cabinet about this. The Taoiseach appeared to know about it five weeks ago, but the Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government, Deputy Coveney, was quoted in The Irish Times this morning and he did not appear to realise the scale of what had happened. He seemed shocked at the number that was announced.

The Minister also did not answer some of my other questions. It is important that whatever State aid is given to workers from the Department of Social Protection is accessible, so they can get it when they need it, and is not tortuous and complex to access, as it can be sometimes. Every effort must be made by the IDA to source a replacement industry for the area to deal with the jobs vacuum that will be left. Will the Minister confirm that she will seek access to funding from the European Globalisation Adjustment Fund as early as possible on behalf of the workers? Can she confirm that the workers will get proper and decent redundancy payments?

Deputy Ruth Coppinger

Will the Minister even make a pretence of trying to answer any of the questions we submit for the Topical Issue debate? She arrived with a prepared script and did not bother to respond to any of the questions put to her. I asked about the State grants that are still being provided. The situation is reminiscent of the line from the song "Ordinary Man", by the Kildare singer, Christy Moore, "He still drives a car and smokes his cigar...".

The people who run Hewlett Packard are in receipt of massive incomes which have increased dramatically, and some of them are playing leading roles in State appointments. Lionel Alexander, vice president and managing director of Hewlett Packard, served on the board of the IDA from 2009 to date. He has only just been listed as formerly of that board. Last September, the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Bruton, appointed him to the board of the Institute of Technology Tralee. In September 2013, Deputy Burton appointed the managing director of Hewlett Packard Ireland, Martin Murphy, as chair of the Labour Market Council to drive the Pathways to Work programme to get people back to work. Instead of more IDA supports, corporate welfare and tax write-downs that cost the taxpayer, can we, for a change, use public investment to create jobs and develop our own native industrial policy rather than continuing this type of corporate welfare?

Deputy Martin Heydon

The Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Varadkar, has been in contact with the Minister, Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor. The Department of Social Protection stands ready to support the employees and their families at this very difficult time. In the Minister's ongoing engagement with the other State agencies, I ask that the Minister and her Department send a very clear message that Kildare is open for business and that it has the talented workforce and infrastructure to be a very attractive proposition for industry and jobs.

It is a key week for business in Kildare given that both North Kildare Chamber of Commerce and South Kildare Chamber of Commerce will hold EGMs during which their members will consider a proposal to merge. I implore both chambers to grasp the opportunity and to see what happened today as a key example of why Kildare would be much better served by one united, countywide chamber of commerce that could tap into all the resources of Kildare County Council, the education and training boards, ETBs, and all the key Departments and have one united voice. I am confident the members of both chambers will do so and I look forward to this positive outcome from this week, which has been a very dark one for Kildare.

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

I will try to answer some of the questions. I have asked the IDA to seek additional investment for the Kildare area in order that these workers can get new jobs. From today, the IDA is marketing the HP Inc. site in Leixlip to interested buyers. Intreo is ready to accept an invitation from HP Inc. to allow a team to work with its employees on the Leixlip campus or in an alternative location. The Department of Social Protection has already phoned and e-mailed HP Inc. management to set this in train.

Intreo will tailor its response to the needs of HP Inc. employees. Its teams will advise the employees on the Intreo process, jobseekers' payments and redundancy entitlements. It will also provide information on other schemes, including rent supplement. Information will be given on the options and assistance available regarding returning to work, short-term enterprise allowance and training and education options. It will involve the Money Advice & Budgeting Service, MABS, and other bodies, as appropriate. Intreo will liaise with the Department of Education and Skills, the ETBs and the further education and training providers.

Enterprise Ireland will also visit the site. There will be a meeting with Deputies, executives of Kildare County Council and the chambers of commerce this afternoon.

Deputy Ruth Coppinger

How much grant assistance did HP Inc. receive?

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

I am getting to it. I am being interrupted.

Deputy Ruth Coppinger

The Minister has 15 seconds left and she has not mentioned the grants.

Deputy Martin Heydon

If the Deputy lets the Minister answer, she might.

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

If the Leas-Cheann Comhairle could give me a little leeway, I would appreciate it. HP Inc. has received €62.3 million in grant assistance since its operations were established in Ireland. The IDA will recover any moneys outstanding from the company in line with the legal arrangements in place between the IDA and HP Inc. The total amount that will be reimbursed to the IDA will be approximately €3.9 million. I was asked about the European Globalisation Adjustment Fund. We have contacted the Department of Education and Skills, which has agreed to explore it. Certain criteria apply. It is for companies that make people redundant within four months. In this case, it is 12 months, therefore it will be a difficult case to make, but we will explore it.

Dáil Éireann debate - Wednesday, 8 Feb 2017