Skip to main content
Normal View

Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 16 Feb 2022

Vol. 1018 No. 2

Ceisteanna ar Reachtaíocht a Gealladh - Questions on Promised Legislation

The parents and staff of Scoil Naomh Cholmcille in County Louth are at the gates of the Dáil today. They are protesting the failure of the Government to provide the school with an adequate number of special needs assistants, SNAs, for children with autism spectrum disorder. They have just one SNA to share between 12 kids. It is by no means a unique situation. SNA provision is in crisis across the State. Indeed, the assessment process used to allocate resources is clearly not fit for purpose. Scoil Naomh Cholmcille has repeatedly made requests for extra SNAs which have been denied by the Department. The school has been told to reprioritise its resources. The fact is the school does not have enough resources. This is by no means a unique situation. I have come across the same issue in my own constituency. Will the Taoiseach ensure that the Minister for Education, Deputy Foley, intervenes for this school and others?

It is my understanding that the National Council for Special Education, NCSE, is meeting with the school concerned and that the Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, is also engaged on the issue. I must say that SNA provision is not in crisis. The expenditure on special needs education has grown dramatically in recent years. We have expanded the number of SNAs in our schools.

Demand has also expanded.

That should be acknowledged. There needs to be balance in the debate here.

Ministers do not allocate to every individual school across the country. We cannot be expected to do that and neither can the Oireachtas. We make representations in respect of different schools. There is a general allocation system and so forth. However, the numbers have never been higher. It is a system I introduced, as Minister for Education, back in 1998. There was no system prior to that. It has facilitated the integrated nature and mainstreaming of special needs education in the country. We will continue to invest in it.

House prices have risen by 14.4% over the past year, the highest annual growth rate in seven years. The price of second-hand homes rose by 16.7% and the price of new homes rose by 5.1%. Young families are struggling big time. An income of €116,000 is required to be able to afford an average house in our capital city. No matter how much young people save, they cannot deliver because of the cost of rent and the cost of living. Deputy Howlin brought to my attention a situation in Wexford where developers are taking deposits and months later, having not signed a contract themselves, are coming back and looking for an extra €30,000 on the price of a house. It is absolute gouging.

Apartment prices are up by 17% outside of Dublin and 11% in Dublin, yet the Government would not put a super stamp duty of 10% on apartments to stop investors bulk buying them. Given these figures, what action is the Government going to take to reduce the cost of homes and control price inflation in the building sector? Will he now act to stop the bulk buying of apartments by investors?

In the first instance, we have already put a 10% stamp duty on the purchase of ten or more houses, as the Deputy knows. Supply is the answer. It is the only answer, ultimately. The Deputy knows that, as does everybody else. We need to ramp up the supply of apartments and houses. We do not want to take steps that will reduce apartment building.

What about the gouging that is going on?

Gouging is all wrong. That should not happen. If Deputy Howlin knows of specific cases, he should send those details to the Minister for Housing, Local Government and Heritage. I do not think that is in any way proper. Proper contractual arrangements should be entered into and honoured by all parties involved in such transactions.

Recent reports have stated there is a new agreement between the HSE and the St. Vincent's Holdings group regarding the move to the national maternity hospital. The agreement states that all medical treatment allowable under the law will be provided in the hospital. However, it somehow does not even specify procedures like terminations of pregnancy, sterilisation and IVF. Those are not going to be specified in the agreement. I am surprised that the Taoiseach does not seem to have a knowledge of this €800 million investment that is going into a private entity. He does seem to be up to date with what is happening.

Not many people, myself included, believe that the Catholic Church will allow terminations or medical procedures that fundamentally go against its ethos to be performed on its land. I am not sure who the Taoiseach think he is trying to cod with this agreement. The women of Ireland will not countenance any healthcare that will be influenced by religious ethos.

It is not going to be influenced in any way-----

The Taoiseach cannot guarantee that.

The Deputy should let me finish. It is not going to involve or be influenced by any religious organisation, be it Catholic or whatever. What needs to happen is the hospital needs to be built now. Negotiations are ongoing but have gone on far too long. The existing conditions are not acceptable in the modern era. What I am annoyed about is that it is taking so long. I have been Taoiseach for a year and a half. This has been going on for years since the new hospital was announced. Health projects must get delivered much more quickly than they currently are being delivered in this country. It is not acceptable. The issues that have been raised will be dealt with comprehensively. Negotiations are ongoing. A memorandum will come to Government and we will share it with the House then. People can then share their views on all of that. I am clear that we need to get this hospital built.

It is now nearly four years since the previous Government announced a review of out-of-school education provision and appealed for submissions. When is that review going to be completed? I presume there will be a report. When will it be published? The findings are meant to inform future State policy towards education centres, such as the Cork Life Centre. That centre is doing tremendous work and providing a vital service in our community but it is doing so without the support it needs and deserves from the State. When, for example, is the Government going to provide funding for the 12 teaching staff at the school who are currently working on a voluntary basis and are not being properly or fully paid? Does the Taoiseach agree that this is not an acceptable situation and must be resolved as a matter of urgency? When is that report going to be published?

I am a great admirer of the work the Cork Life Centre undertakes. I disagree with the Deputy's assessment, which I think is unfair. I have involved myself personally in this issue over the past two years. I have engaged with the education and training board, ETB, which has also engaged with the Cork Life Centre. Significant supports have been provided to the centre. There have been issues around governance and all that but they have been put to one side. We accept the position that is being taken by those who manage and run what is a good centre for young people, for whom mainstream education does not provide. We have provided a lot of financial supports to the centre. We remain in constant engagement with the centre. I do not have a date for the publication of the national review. We moved ahead of the review to engage with the Cork Life Centre and to deal with issues there that needed to be addressed.

I am a believer, and I think the Taoiseach is as well, in "Mol an óige agus tiocfaidh sí". He was talking about the effects of Covid-19 earlier. Will he please try to remove the masks of the young children, na daoine óga, in national and secondary schools?

I have a petition signed by 14,300 ordinary parents and grandparents, which I intend to hand to the Taoiseach, pleading to take away the masks from these people. Let the children smile. Let them see the expressions on the teacher's and each other's friends and siblings' faces. Nightclubs, bars and every place has them gone and we have them in schools. It is punitive. I would say it is a form of child abuse, actually, and it is time it was dispensed with.

The Taoiseach has been talking about the effects of Covid-19 and the impact on health. What impact is this going to have? Voluntary boards of management could end up being sued. I salute the boards of management in all the schools. I was a member of one myself. They do great work as do the teaching staff. It is time to get rid of this draconian measure, which is causing strife, ill health, stress and torment to children, parents, grandparents and communities.

To be fair to the Deputy, he has had a consistently negative view about restrictions designed to protect public health. The motivation behind-----

Freagair an cheist.

I am answering. The motivation behind the recommendation and the public health advice with regard to masks was an honourable one to try to protect children and teachers.

People have no masks on in nightclubs.

This was in consultation with all the stakeholders in education. There will be a meeting of the National Public Health Emergency Team, NPHET-----

-----and there will be advice in relation to this.

Who is in charge?

Let the Taoiseach respond.

He is not in charge, obviously. He is delegating responsibility. In 30 years he never made a decision.

Tá mé ag bogadh ar aghaidh go dtí an Independent Group.

Last week, I raised with the Tánaiste the issue of the spate of robberies in rural areas in the context of the vicious attack on Tom Niland in Skreen, County Sligo. Again, we all send him, his family and community our very best wishes as he remains seriously ill in hospital.

In response, the Tánaiste said the Minister, Deputy McEntee, had launched the new phase of Garda recruitment. However, the figures from the Garda Síochána website show that between 2010 and 2021, the number of gardaí of garda rank in the Sligo district dropped from 139 to 104, a decrease of 20%. In Sligo Garda station, the numbers dropped from 128 to 93, a decrease of 27%.

I am sure the Taoiseach is sick listening to me saying that we have no armed response unit in Sligo. The previous Government did a U-turn on the building of a new Garda station in Sligo. It did not happen anywhere else. We are told it is an operational matter. Something is seriously wrong with resources and support for policing in Sligo. I ask the Taoiseach to see what can be done.

First, we all condemn what was an appalling attack on Tom Niland. It represents a terrible cruelty, viciousness and savagery that we should not tolerate in our society.

My understanding is that there are 292 members of An Garda Síochána in the Sligo division. Our numbers might differ; we have to correlate them. I will come back to the Deputy in that regard. There are 189 members in Sligo county, specifically, and approximately 57 vehicles in its fleet and so forth.

The first point I will make is that it is an operational issue. We do not run the details of the gardaí. I do not decide how many gardaí are going into a particular division or location. We are increasing the number of gardaí and recruiting more year-on-year and we will continue to do that. Obviously, the Garda Commissioner and Garda senior management will allocate resources as they believe is optimal in terms of the various situations on the ground in different areas.

The Government's cost-of-living package is very welcome, particularly the €200 household electricity credit along with the €125 lump sum to those in receipt of fuel allowance, as well as the 20% reduction in transport fares for the 19 to 23-year-olds, along with the reduction in the drug payment scheme threshold to €80.

The €200 household electricity credit will be applied to more than 2.1 million homes across the State. A number of people have been in contact with me who are on prepaid meters and are seeking clarity around those arrangements for them. Will the Taoiseach raise the matter with the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, and request that arrangements be put in place to give prepaid customers a credit for their meter, not just to the underlying account, in order that they can get the benefit of the credit right away and not have to wait for the adjustment?

I thank the Deputy for raising that specific issue. I will revert to the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, and the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform to make sure that people get what has been allocated, notwithstanding the mechanisms they have in place.

Today is the eighth anniversary of the death of Sonia Blount, the 31-year-old Dublin woman who was killed by her ex-boyfriend hours after her three-year-old's birthday party when she ended their brief relationship. Violence against women remains a problem every day.

Today's review of accommodation published by the Minister, Deputy McEntee, is welcome and important. In Dún Laoghaire, that work has already well begun with collaboration between the council executive, the Garda through the joint policing committees and the Taoiseach's colleague, Councillor Mary Hanafin, to try to find accommodation for 20 family places. The review says ten; it is not enough. I know it is a good start but it is not enough.

There needs to be an implementation plan with flexibility for council areas to be able to get ahead. In Dún Laoghaire we are really struggling. Bray is full and Rathmines is closed. The council is working to try to find 20 extra spaces. If we can find those, whether they are in an old nursing home, religious building, bed and breakfast accommodation or whatever it happens to be, will the Government allow us to get ahead of the implementation schedule for the review for accommodation? Can we get ahead and deliver what is needed for families, women and men across Dún Laoghaire?

In short, yes. I spoke to the Minister for Housing, Local Government and Heritage, Deputy Darragh O'Brien, with regard to this. In the next while, pending the establishment of an agency, this is a very serious issue. That list is priority urgent needs in certain counties and certain areas. I would like to accelerate the provision of refuge places, using local authorities in the interim, while we get more national structures in places to simplify and streamline the provision of refuge places and centres. The current system is that an entity has to apply to become an approved housing body, AHB, and so forth which, in my view, can be cumbersome. If we can do it faster then we should.

Galway Educate Together Secondary School opened in August 2019 and has absolutely flourished since. It has 135 children now from first to third year as a result of the cap of 48 that had been imposed but there will be an intake of 72 students in first year.

The school has outgrown its current accommodation and the Department of Education has advised that it is close to finalising a new place for it which, of course, will only be an interim solution. With only six months left for the reopening for the next academic year, however, it is very hard for them to plan. School buses will be needed etc. and different supports for families. This lack of certainty is of severe concern for the school community. The school is more than happy to engage with the Department. Will the Taoiseach ask the Department to come urgently to a solution for that school?

Again, these are issues with which the Department is dealing on an ongoing basis. There is quite a range of schools at different stages in terms of construction of new schools or extensions and so forth. I will raise the issue with the Minister.

Harcourt Terrace Educate Together National School is located in temporary accommodation in a building that was not designed for primary or secondary school children. In September 2021, Harcourt Terrace Educate Together National School opened its second autism class in order to support further the autism community. The school has applied for an additional special needs assistant, SNA, to combat health and safety and child protection concerns which the building presents, but it has been refused. The Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, cited Circular 0030/2020, which apples to a school's SNA allocation in a standardised situation, which is not applicable to this school as it is in a temporary building. Due to the exceptional circumstances in which the school finds itself, will the Taoiseach ensure that this SNA application will be considered as a matter of urgency?

I do not think it is for the Taoiseach of the day to be allocating SNAs to different schools across the country. I understand the school may have particular concerns with regard to its specific situation. The National Council for Special Education, NCSE, advises on these matters. I do not know whether the Deputy has contacted the NCSE.

Yes, and it is refusing.

There are 3,500 schools in the country. I do not think it is feasible that the Oireachtas is going to have to deal with every individual school application.

The Minister has responsibility.

I wish to raise the matter of pay and conditions for school caretakers and secretaries, which is a long-standing issue. An apparent breakthrough was made last September when the Department conceded that all school secretaries and caretakers should be placed on the public service clerical officer scale. A promise was also made in that deal that these people would not have to sign on during summer breaks. Will the Taoiseach bring the House up to date as regards a conclusion for this really important matter?

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue. I brought the House up to date on it twice yesterday.

Will he do so again?

I will not go through the whole thing but a lot of progress has been made. The most recent meeting was on 26 or 27 January and both sides are reflecting on that discussion. The matter is progressing and we want to see it brought to a conclusion as quickly as it can be.

The Commission on Pensions has asked for the removal of a special exemption that allows the over-66s to avoid PRSI on their non-State income. This would mean retired public servants would have to pay 4% PRSI on their public service pension on amounts over €100. Their pensions have been already reduced by the Government's pensions levy. Many of these pensioners are not in receipt of the State pension and should not be asked to contribute to something to which they are not entitled. I had a very upset former garda in my office this week who said he could end up having to pay €64 per month on his reduced pension if this were to happen. More than 350,000 pensioners could be hit with this. It is unfair that those who have already contributed must to do so again.

I appreciate the Deputy raising this issue in respect of people's concerns regarding the report of the Commission on Pensions. That report went to the Oireachtas committee and Deputies and Senators made inputs there. The Commission on Taxation and Welfare is now meeting and reflecting on the report of the Commission on Pensions and the Government will look at the matter in its entirety when it comes back before Government.

A response I received to a parliamentary question stated that some children who are accessing the child and adolescent mental health service, CAMHS, in south Kerry were also getting supports through Tusla. Some parents have told me that Tusla representatives often sat in on the consultation between the psychiatrist and the child. Parents of children who were mistreated and misdiagnosed feel that not only did CAMHS fail their children but Tusla did too. It was stated in the look-back review of south Kerry CAMHS: "We did not find clear evidence that the appropriate consent for treatment [of children] had been obtained [by Tusla], and a clear process was not described when we raised this with the social workers on the team." We have heard major concerns about CAMHS in north Kerry, Wexford, Dublin and Cork. I suspect that is only the tip of the iceberg. Will the Taoiseach commit to a full, comprehensive and independent audit of all 73 CAMHS teams nationwide, including Tusla's role, rather than just a prescribing audit?

There has been a commitment already in regard to prescribing and so on nationally as well as to a national review in respect of the degree to which CAMHS centres across the country are compliant with the guidance that has been issued to them. The first and immediate priority is to look after and work with the families and children who have been harmed in respect of what transpired in south Kerry regarding CAMHS and to engage with the families of the children to make sure they get the right treatment from now on and into the future.

In my role as Chairman of the Oireachtas Committee on Gender Equality, which has been charged with the implementation of the 45 recommendations of the Citizens' Assembly on Gender Equality, my colleagues and I are getting under way to commence public hearings at the committee. We are conscious of the timeframe we have been given by the Houses of the Oireachtas of nine months from the start of public hearings and conscious that there has been some highlighting of the role of citizens' assemblies and the need to take their output seriously. Can the Taoiseach give us an assurance, in advance of our public commencement of deliberations, that the Government will engage very seriously with the report of our special committee and, in particular, that he will commit to introducing legislation, where necessary, to implement those recommendations? We want to ensure the Government will engage seriously with the committee as we go through our deliberations. In particular, a commitment was given by the Minister for Justice to bring forward legislation to establish a new statutory agency on gender-based violence.

Sin é. The Taoiseach to reply.

Can the Taoiseach give any commitment on the timeframe for that?

I cannot yet give a timeline for the introduction of legislation to establish an agency to bring together all the various strands and deal with the wider issue of violence, including sexual violence, against women. That is one aspect of it. We will work with the Oireachtas committee. Obviously, in advance of seeing recommendations, I do not think it is wise to commit to implement them. We have not seen those recommendations yet and we have to allow that process to happen. We are committed to the recommendations contained in the report of the Citizens' Assembly on Gender Equality and, of course, to working constructively and positively with the committee the Deputy chairs.

I have a question regarding the well-being framework that is under development at the moment. We are quite closely shadowing the OECD framework, Better Life, which is welcome in many respects. It is a good model to follow. However, one of the issues it omits is a measurement around linguistic and cultural outputs, an element that is included, for example, in the New Zealand model. I take this opportunity to congratulate Ballygunner on its win in the all-Ireland hurling championship. I saw the Taoiseach in the crowd at the game. Its success contributes massively to the well-being of people within that community. Tá an Taoiseach an-tiomanta i leith na Gaeilge agus tuigeann sé go maith cé chomh tábhachtach is atá an Ghaeilge ó thaobh ár gcultúir. Does he see a role for a 12th indicator that is specifically designed to measure linguistic and cultural outputs-----

Go raibh maith agat. The Taoiseach to reply.

-----and does he think we will get a well-being budget by the end of this year?

Aontaím leis an Teachta agus admhaím go bhfuil ról faoi leith ag cúrsaí teanga agus cultúir ó thaobh sláinte na tíre. I accept his basic point and will refer it back to my officials and the group that is involved in drawing up the well-being framework. It was a joy to witness Ballygunner win on Saturday. I am not so sure the Ballyhale supporters were as overjoyed. I suppose Ballygunner did to Ballyhale what Ballyhale did to St. Thomas's. The game illustrated the value of community and that the whole well-being issue is rooted in community, parishes and families. The unbridled joy was something to behold and likewise with Kilcoo.

I understand the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform is about to veto an increase in pensions for retired RTÉ staff. I am not talking about the famous and highly paid broadcasters but the ordinary, rank-and-file staff, who have not had a pension increase since 2008 and do not receive the State pension. One can imagine how crippling this is for them, especially with the cost of living increases we are witnessing. One of them said to me today, "This goes to show you it is normal for retired workers not to have a say whatsoever when decisions in regard to their own savings are being made. Pensions are deferred wages." I raise this in the context of the industrial relations Bill we brought to the House last year and which the Minister promised will be looked at and will go out to public consultation over the coming period. When we met with the Minister of State, Deputy English, before Christmas, he said there would be a public consultation process early in the new year. There is no sign of it.

Go raibh maith agat, a Theachta. The Taoiseach to respond.

Will the Taoiseach ensure that public consultation process on retired workers' pensions opens soon?

I will talk to the Minister of State, Deputy English, about that. I am not aware of the Minister, Deputy Michael McGrath, vetoing anything. I will discuss it with him.

Last June, Cabinet signed off on a proposal to transfer Shannon Heritage sites to local authorities. Clare County Council is currently undertaking due diligence on the transfer of Bunratty Castle and Folk Park, Knappogue Castle, Craggaunowen and a retail outlet at the Cliffs of Moher. The due diligence is extensive but it has thrown up the matter of the incredible costs involved in taking over these sites. The thatch is falling off the roofs in Bunratty, as I have seen myself. The roof of the iconic castle, which has withstood sieges and countless attacks, is also at risk of falling in. Operational subvention will be needed and an application has been made to the Government for €3 million or thereabouts per annum. I ask the Taoiseach to look favourably on it. We want to see these sites in Clare taken over but it cannot be done at the expense of the public coffers and potentially sinking the local authority's finances. Some subvention will be needed.

I will examine the matter but I want to give the Deputy an illustration. When the county managers came to me many years ago regarding Spike Island - I believe Senator McDowell was the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform at the time - Cork County Council did not hang around and was not worried about the cost implications of taking over the site. It saw the potential in it, took it over and it is now a major visitor attraction. I said to Deputy McNamara previously that Clare County Council needs to get on with it and take over the Shannon Heritage facilities. We will see what we can do in respect of subvention. We have not been found wanting in terms of capital allocations to local authorities, even in the past two years, on a whole range of projects. I would advise the council to go for it.

Kilbrittain National School is located in a part of the world with which the Taoiseach is very familiar. It is a terrific school with two classes for pupils with autism spectrum disorder, ASD, which are an incredibly important resource for those children.

What will be an even more important resource at this school is the early intervention preschool class, which will be for children who are four and five years of age and who have ASD. However, the NCSE is proposing to close this early intervention preschool class at the end of this academic year. I cannot stress enough the importance of this early intervention preschool class. It is an incredible and important resource for children with ASD and their families. I urge the Taoiseach to do everything possible to ensure that this closure does not happen. The Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, has acknowledged my representation in relation to this matter. It is vital that we keep this resource open. My understanding is that there is an intention to phase out these classes right across Ireland.

I do not believe those classes should be phased out across Ireland. We need more preschool interventions, not fewer. I am not aware of the national policy background to this, if that is indeed the case or what the specifics are regarding this school. I have had a number of specific queries today in respect of SNAs and so on. The State drew up a White Paper on this way back in the context of the Department of Education dealing with preschool special needs. I will have a look at the matter.

What will the Government do about the mass closure of indoor play areas? What is happening appears to be due to insurance costs. Can the Government intervene to help commercial operators or will it instruct local authorities to step into the breach, either directly or through social enterprises? These are important facilities in a country like Ireland because the weather here is unpredictable. They are important not just for children, but for the parents who are otherwise isolated.

The Minister of State, Deputy Fleming, has been working extremely hard with other Ministers in respect of insurance costs more generally. I am not aware of mass closures of indoor sporting or play areas. However, there are issues. There are challenges as a result of high insurance costs. We are working hard to get those costs down. If the Deputy has specifics, we will take them from her and pass them on to the Minister of State who is dealing with this matter.

Top
Share