Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use: Motion

Minister of State at the Department of Health (Deputy Hildegarde Naughton)

I move:

That Dáil Éireann:

approves the establishment of a Citizens' Assembly, to be known as the "Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use", to consider the legislative, policy and operational changes the State could make to significantly reduce the harmful impacts of illicit drugs on individuals, families, communities and wider society, and to bring forward recommendations in this regard; the Assembly shall consider, inter alia:

— the drivers, prevalence, attitudes and trends in relation to drugs use in Irish society;

— the harmful impacts of drugs use on individuals, families, communities and wider society;

— best practice in promoting and supporting rehabilitation and recovery from drug addiction;

— the lived experience of young people and adults affected by drugs use, as well as their families and communities;

— international, European Union, national and local perspectives on drugs use;

— the efficacy of current strategic, policy and operational responses to drugs use;

— international best practice and practical case studies in relation to reducing supply, demand and harm, and increasing resilience, health and well-being; and

— the opportunities and challenges, in an Irish context, of reforming legislation, strategy, policy and operational responses to drugs use, taking into consideration the implications for the health, criminal justice and education systems; and

notes that the Citizens' Assembly shall:

— consist of 100 members in total, including 99 randomly-selected members of the general public, and an independent Chairperson to be nominated by the Taoiseach; — preclude from membership any individual who is either:

i. under 18 years of age;

ii. not normally resident in the State;

iii. a politician currently serving in either House of the Oireachtas, in local government or in the European Parliament;

iv. a lobbyist as provided for under the Regulation of Lobbying Act 2015; or

v. a person unwilling to adhere to public health measures as prescribed by Government and public health authorities from time to time;

— hold its inaugural meeting in April 2023 and conclude its work and submit a report to the Oireachtas by the end of 2023;

— have flexibility to determine a revised timeline for completion of its work in the event of extraordinary circumstances delaying or disrupting its work;

— submit a report and recommendation(s) on the matters before it to the Houses of the Oireachtas. On receipt, the Houses of the Oireachtas shall refer the report to a Committee of both Houses for consideration; this Committee will, in turn, bring its conclusions to the Houses of the Oireachtas for debate. Furthermore, the Government shall, on consideration of the report from the Citizens' Assembly, provide in the Houses of the Oireachtas a response to each recommendation of the Assembly, setting out a timeframe for implementing those recommendations which it accepts;

— have a Secretary and secretariat staff assigned to support the effective governance and operation of Assembly meetings, to support the Chairperson and members in their roles, and to support the drafting of the final report;

— agree its own rules of procedure and work programme to enable the effective conduct of its business in as economical and efficient a manner as possible;

— operate in an open and transparent manner, including by live streaming public proceedings;

— determine all issues by a majority of the votes of members present and voting, other than the Chairperson, who will have a casting vote in the case of an equality of votes;

— develop innovative programming to feature individuals and communities directly affected by drugs-related issues, and those working in front-line service delivery;

— engage subject matter experts to inform its deliberations, including as invited speakers or as members of an Expert Advisory Group;

— engage with stakeholders and the general public, including through a public consultation process, and by inviting select speakers to participate in meetings of the Assembly;

— make payment of an honorarium to the Chairperson at a per diem rate to be sanctioned by the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform; and

— make payment to the members of the Citizens' Assembly and members of the Expert Advisory Group of a nominal honorarium to recognise their civic service.

Throughout Ireland, individuals, families and communities are grappling with the harmful impact of illicit drugs use. Directly or indirectly, illicit drugs use affects all of us. No matter what our gender, age or socioeconomic background, whether we live in rural or urban areas, no one is immune from the risks or harm caused by illicit drugs use.

Some of the harmful effects of drug use are hidden and opaque. More often, they stare us in the face. We see the devastating toll addiction takes on people's lives. We see the needless and often preventable loss of life through overdose and disease transmission. We see the impact of drug-related violence and intimidation in communities throughout the country.

Too many families have lost loved ones through addiction. I believe there is a strong consensus in this House and among the public that the State and society generally need to respond far more effectively to the problems caused by illicit drugs use. We need more lives saved, more people in treatment and rehabilitation, and more people in recovery. We need to reduce harm, reduce supply, reduce demand, and increase resilience, health and well-being in society.

The programme for Government, Our Shared Future, commits to progressing the establishment of four citizens' assemblies on biodiversity loss, the type of directly elected mayor and local government structures best suited for Dublin, the future of education and drugs use. The first two of these, the Dublin Citizens' Assembly and the Citizens' Assembly on Biodiversity Loss, have now concluded their work. The Dublin Citizens' Assembly submitted its final report and recommendations to the Oireachtas in December 2022. The Citizens' Assembly on Biodiversity Loss held its final meeting on 21 January, and its report and recommendations will be submitted to the Oireachtas in the coming weeks.

At its meeting last week, the Government agreed to the establishment of a citizens' assembly on drugs use. As Minister of State with responsibility for public health, well-being and the national drugs strategy I am pleased to bring forward in this House the motion approving the establishment of the citizens' assembly on drugs use. The terms of reference for the assembly have been designed so that they are sufficiently well defined to provide a clear focus for the assembly. At the same time, they are not so prescriptive as to inhibit the scope of the assembly to define its work programme as it deems appropriate. We have learnt from the experience of previous assemblies that the terms of reference should not be expressed in an overly precise way. Every citizens' assembly needs discretion and flexibility to define and organise its work programme as it deems appropriate. I believe the proposed terms of reference for the citizens' assembly on drugs use, as set out in the motion before this House, provide sufficient scope for the assembly to determine its work programme, consider all issues it deems relevant to drugs use in Ireland, and deliver carefully considered recommendations to the Oireachtas.

The terms of reference state that the assembly shall consider and make recommendations in respect of changes the State might make to reduce significantly the harmful impact of drugs use on individuals, families, communities and wider society. In its considerations the assembly will be asked to take into account the implications for the health, justice and education systems. An important part of the assembly's work will be in developing an understanding of the lived experience of individuals, families and communities impacted by illicit drugs use. The voices of those most affected by illicit drugs use must be heard if the assembly is to deliver on its mandate. Alongside this, the members will be asked to consider a range of perspectives on drugs use both from a national viewpoint but also from experiences across Europe and internationally. It will also consider the efficacy of current responses to drugs use and best practice in promoting and supporting rehabilitation and recovery from drug addiction.

Ireland is widely regarded as a world leader in deliberative democracy. Citizens' assemblies have become an important part of the Irish democratic process, and the recommendations of previous citizens' assemblies have influenced significant changes in how we in this State live our lives, including through constitutional change, legislative change and changes in the design and implementation of policy. It is clear to me that a citizens' assembly on drugs use can make an invaluable contribution to inform the Oireachtas and Government in our response to the challenging issue of drugs use. The citizens' assembly can also make a valuable contribution to a wider societal debate on drugs policy.

There are differing viewpoints in this House, among front-line service providers and among the public about the most appropriate way to respond to the challenges posed by illicit drugs use. The Government has set out its approach in the national drugs strategy, which emphasises the importance of a health-led approach. In recent years, several Oireachtas committees have considered issues around drugs use, and I expect Oireachtas Members will follow with interest the progress of the citizens' assembly.

The assembly will engage comprehensively with professional bodies, stakeholders, representative groups and the public as well as national and international experts. It is important the assembly is afforded the time and space to undertake its deliberations carefully and comprehensively.

The citizens' assembly should, and must, operate entirely independently of Government and the Oireachtas. There is, of course, a reporting relationship between the citizens' assembly and the Oireachtas. The motion before the House today proposes that the assembly should report in the first instance to the Houses of the Oireachtas, which, on receipt of the final report of the assembly, will refer the report to the relevant Oireachtas committee for consideration. In addition, it is proposed that the Government will provide, in the Houses of the Oireachtas, a response to the recommendations of the assembly and an indication of a proposed course of action, where appropriate. The Dáil will debate the report of the assembly and the Government's response.

The citizens' assembly on drugs use will include an independent chairperson and 99 members of the public selected using a random selection process. Building on the successful experience last year, eligibility for membership will extend beyond those enrolled on the electoral register to include all residents in the State.

This opens the citizens' assembly up to non-Irish residents and others who, for whatever reason, are not enrolled on the electoral register.

Recruitment will be done by a postal campaign, with 20,000 randomly selected households invited to apply to participate in the assembly. Members will be selected on the basis of gender, age and geographic location to ensure the citizens' assembly is as representative as possible of wider Irish society. We have learned much from the experience of previous assemblies, and following the use of this process last year, I am confident this approach will continue to optimise the profile of the citizens' assembly.

The timeline for the citizens' assembly is ambitious but achievable. Its inaugural meeting will take place in April, with the assembly scheduled to conclude its work and submit its report by the end of this year.

Successive citizens' assemblies have demonstrated how this unique exercise in deliberative democracy enhances Ireland's democratic system. Involving members of the public in considering and proposing solutions to complex societal challenges makes an important contribution to the deliberative processes of the Government and the Oireachtas. It also enhances the public sphere, informing wider conversations and societal debates about matters of public importance.

The House will join me in wishing the citizens' assembly well in undertaking the important work it is being asked to do. Molaim an tairscint seo don Teach. I commend the motion to the House.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Gould is sharing with Deputy Cullinane. To clarify, there are two elements to the Deputy's amendment.

Deputy Thomas Gould

I move amendment No. 1:

To delete the following words "best practice in promoting and supporting rehabilitation and recovery from drug addiction;" and substitute the following:

"— best practice in promoting and supporting people on rehabilitation and recovery journeys from drug addiction;"

To insert the following after "the efficacy of current strategic, policy and operational responses to drugs use;":

"— the past, current and future role of Drug and Alcohol Task Forces and how this facilitates localised, community responses to addiction;".

I am actually sharing time with Deputy Ward.

I welcome the movement on this citizens' assembly motion. This is an issue I have raised numerous times. It is of the utmost importance that we see the assembly convene as soon as possible and operate efficiently. I acknowledge the Trojan work that has been done by stakeholders like CityWide and Members of the Houses in keeping the pressure on and getting the assembly to this stage.

Citizens' assemblies have presented the House with an opportunity to work together for our communities and to put politics aside. This has allowed for the improvement of society as a whole. We have seen the positive impact of citizens' assemblies on emotive and contentious issues. They highlight just how informed, engaged and diligent our citizens are. Addiction and drug use can be highly emotive topics, and for families and individuals affected by addiction, this assembly may be difficult. I want to know that their voices will be heard. I acknowledge and appreciate the Minister of State's comment that the voices of those families at the coalface and who have suffered the most will be heard.

With this in mind, I have tabled two amendments to the motion. They are not substantive, as I recognise the work that has gone into the terms of reference, but there is an opportunity to strengthen those terms. The first part of the amendment recognises that recovery is not simple. It is a journey, and one of the bravest journeys on which a person can embark. It is not linear and is often complex. It is a journey that requires support and involves many difficult choices and tough decisions.

I am proud to have published the only specific policy on recovery on this island. Included in that policy is a commitment to the right of those on a recovery journey to participate in decision-making. We must create the space for those in recovery to participate in this assembly. I welcome the inclusion of lived experience in the terms of reference. I urge the Minister of State to accept this amendment, which would further strengthen the space we are creating for people to expose their lived realities. Recovery is not easy. It is not a quick fix. However, it is worthwhile, and those on their recovery journeys have a great deal to teach us.

The second part of the amendment allows the citizens' assembly to explore the role of task forces and emphasises the importance of localised community-based approaches to addiction. We must recognise that the root cause of addiction is poverty and, in so doing, understand that tackling addiction means community-based initiatives that tackle poverty and recognise the harmful impacts of addiction. Groups at the coalface tell me that, when task forces were first introduced, they enabled communities to be involved in decision-making and to tackle the issues on the ground at local level. There is a concern, though. In recent years, it seems we have moved away from having task forces on the ground and listening to communities. We need community leaders. We need to move forward with a localised approach at the centre of our policy. I ask the Minister of State to consider this amendment.

I acknowledge the Social Democrats' amendment. While I do not necessarily agree with every line of it, I recognise the spirit of the amendment and we will support it.

This citizens' assembly will explore more than addiction and I welcome the conversations that will be had across the board. I hope these are constructive, respectful and dignified. I look forward to the recommendations of the assembly and the positive change we will see as a result.

The Minister of State spoke about those who had lost their lives to addiction and the families who had been destroyed by it. This citizens' assembly will give us an opportunity to listen to their stories. I hope the assembly will come forward with a report we can all support.

Deputy Mark Ward

I welcome that progress has been made on the Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use. Sinn Féin has been calling for this for the past four years or more.

I am from an area of high disadvantage and have seen the devastation drugs have inflicted on my area since I was a child. I have lived in a community that has seen intergenerational addiction and trauma within families. When I say "high disadvantage", I am speaking about Government policy of the time placing thousands of families from the same socioeconomic background into the same areas without putting the necessary infrastructure and supports in place. While we were put at a disadvantage by Government policies, we were not at a disadvantage by the strength of character in our community. Everything we have in our area today, ordinary people like my parents, Deputy Gino Kenny's parents and other people in my area had to fight tooth and nail for, and fight they did. They fought for schools, something as simple as bus routes, access to local health services, community centres and basically everything else the Government failed to provide for.

Unfortunately, many of our young people ended up in addiction over the years. It began as a way to escape poverty and trauma, sometimes to escape the multigenerational trauma of industrial schools, Magdalen laundries, and mother and baby homes. Drugs give people the ability to self-soothe and to give calm to an anxious inner world. They work until they stop working, and then the problems begin.

I worked for years in addiction centres across Dublin as a counsellor, key worker, outreach worker and manager. I know the work our front-line services put into helping people addicted to drugs, those people's families and our wider communities.

I welcome that we are now going to have a grown-up conversation about drugs in the form of a citizens' assembly. Every voice must be represented at this assembly. We have heard many calls for legalisation, decriminalisation, regulation and a healthcare approach when it comes to drug use. These voices must be represented.

I am not going to pre-empt what I believe the recommendations of the citizens' assembly are going to be, but I will call on the Government to start planning now for all outcomes. For example, if we are to move to a decriminalised, regulated, healthcare approach, then we must start resourcing our services now. There is no point in bringing an end to the current legal situation without putting the appropriate resources in place in our community in spite of commitments to a health-led approach.

We need to build on the crucial role of our community drugs projects, as Deputy Gould stated, in responding to the needs of individuals, families and communities. We also need to recognise the need for significant and increased investment. As public representatives, it is incumbent on us to use the right language when it comes to talking about people with addiction issues. When you hear Deputies from Government parties dehumanising people by calling them junkies, this needs to be challenged at every single opportunity. It is not right, and it is not fair to people suffering with addiction and their families. I support the Sinn Féin amendment. Having a voice of recovery is vital to this process.

Last week, I had a debate with the Minister of State on the Health (Amendment) (Dual Diagnosis: No Wrong Door) Bill 2021. The Government stated that a citizens' assembly was one way that this matter could be dealt with in the next year or so. I ask the Minister of State to guarantee that this will happen. I am not saying that the citizens' assembly will agree with what we are asking for, but the concept of dual diagnosis must be at the centre of the citizens' assembly's work.

All voices must be heard, including those of families and communities that have been ripped apart by criminality. They need to be central to this process. We also need to hear from young people. I previously stated that only people aged 18 and over can take part in the work of a citizens' assembly. We must find a way for young people to have their voices heard. That is vitally important. We need to hear from people in the context of dual diagnosis, and we also need to hear from those who are campaigning for legalisation, regularisation and decriminalisation. They all need to be part of this.

I take this opportunity to call on the Government to also establish a citizens' assembly on Irish unity. Councils across the State have supported this call for a united Ireland assembly. We must see the immediate establishment of a citizens' assembly on Irish unity in order that we can reimagine matters, make plans and include everybody in the conversation.

Deputy Aodhán Ó Ríordáin

I have already congratulated the Minister for State on her efforts in this regard. The former Minister of State, Deputy Feighan, also did work in this space. This is one of the most important debates we are going to have in the House. It would be only fair for me to acknowledge the efforts of the Green Party in the discussions on the programme for Government to make sure there was a commitment to establish a citizens' assembly. I also acknowledge the Trojan work done by my colleague from the Green Party, Deputy Hourigan, to ensure that we got to this point.

I appreciate the contribution the Minister of State made. She spoke strongly about timelines. This is a once-in-a-generation, once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for us to do something to stop the body count. There is a body count of poor people. If the body count was of anything else but poor people, we would have done something before now. I say with all sincerity that if the body count was of cattle, we would have done something by now. The people who die as a result of drug overdoses just do not matter as much. As previous speakers indicated, they are called names, even by some in this House. They are derided and dehumanised and their families are accused of poor parenting. Their families cannot come forward and talk about the matter. They are expected to travel from where they live to places miles away in order to get something as basic as methadone treatment. They are hated and despised. They are dying in huge numbers. We have the third highest overdose rate in Europe. We cannot get this wrong. Even though I appreciate Government finally establishing this assembly, I am concerned that, if nothing comes out of it, we will have raised expectations unfairly and would have been better off not having the conversation at all. If the assembly reports by the end of the year, what will happen then? The matter will go to a special committee of the Oireachtas, and we will all want to feed into that. There must be a commitment from the Government to do something about it.

With previous citizens' assemblies and constitutional conventions, we, as politicians, had the get-out clause of giving a matter over to the people. When it came to marriage equality, we could just give it to the people and let them decide. When it came to abortion, we could just give it to the people and let them decide by means of a referendum. We had cover. We cannot do that with this matter. If we are going to make radical change in order to effectively stop the body count of poor people, then the responsibility is going to lie with us. We are going to have to take on that responsibility.

The Labour Party deliberately chose not to table an amendment to the motion. This is not because we disagree with those who have tabled amendments, but because we want to start this off on a level of good faith that we are going to work together collaboratively. The stakes are far too high and the lives being lost are far too valuable. We will do everything in our power to work with the Minister of State and the Government. We will also take the criticism and take the hit. It is not a very popular political position to take to be on the side of the person in addiction. It is much easier to go with the just-say-no, war-on-drugs line, and pretend to be the tough guy. It is harder and politically more dangerous to make the case for those who are most vulnerable and are dying in the biggest numbers from this epidemic. We will take the risk and work with the Government to get this over the line. It will require us to do it. We cannot give this over to anybody else. I suggest to the Minister of State that at the heart of this must be the person who is a service user, who is in recovery or who is in addiction. We do not hear those voices in the media because they have been told to be ashamed of themselves. Society blames the victim - it is their own fault. We are talking about a central issue of inequality. If this comes down to a debate about drugs being bad and telling people to stop taking them, then it is a waste of oxygen.

Deputy Thomas Gould

One hundred per cent.

Deputy Aodhán Ó Ríordáin

We need a realistic debate. Many people from all sorts of professions, different parts of the country and various age groups are taking drugs, but we treat people from disadvantaged backgrounds differently. If you go into any court in the country, you will find it stuffed full of poor, sick people who do not belong there. Our thesis, which I think is replicated across this House, is that we can have an exclusively health-led approach to those in addiction and get rid of the criminalisation and criminal justice approach to it. We must do that, and it must happen within the lifetime of this Oireachtas. Otherwise, the body count is just going to pile higher and higher. None of us can have that on our conscience.

Deputy Emer Higgins

Citizens' assemblies play a crucial role in driving social and policy change across Ireland. Over the past few years, we have seen how effective they are at starting a national discourse on the issues impacting people and because of that, Ireland is widely regarded as a world leader when it comes to deliberative democracy. The recommendations of previous citizens' assemblies have influenced significant changes in how we in this State live our lives. They can and do lead to constitutional and legislative change and change in the design and implementation of policy. They lead to changes in society. I welcome the commitment to establishing a citizens' assembly on drug use because the prevalence of drug use and addiction has reached a very worrying level. Meanwhile, the underground drugs trade booms on our streets and preys on young people in vulnerable communities. The connection between casual drug-taking and the funding of the illegal drugs trade is not always made. The Minister for Justice, Deputy Harris, made that point well in the Chamber last week. The Minister of State's predecessor, Deputy Feighan, articulated that well when he met constituents of mine in Clondalkin recently. It is something we must highlight as much as we can. It is clear that our current approach to drug use is either not working completely or is not having the impact it needs to have from the point of view of health or in the context of the criminal aspect. Who better to inform our future approach than people who have lived experience of patterns, trends and changing attitudes around drug use in Ireland?

Drug use can be a hugely divisive topic, with people's opinions spanning a wide spectrum. That is why a citizens' assembly is the perfect vehicle for public dialogue. The discussion in this space is often dominated by the question of legalisation, which is important and which is one that we, as a society, are ready to discuss. I am glad that will be discussed as part of the citizens' assembly. By investigating the opportunities and challenges of reforming legislation and policy in this space, we will be able to look at how we could potentially change our response to drug use when it comes to health, education and the criminal justice system.

The remit of the citizens' assembly must go further than this. It must look at drug use in Ireland using a whole-of-society approach. This includes attitudes on and trends in drug use, the impact of drug use on individuals, families, communities and society, best practice in promoting and supporting rehabilitation and recovery from drug addiction, the lived experience of young people and adults affected by drug use, international, national and local perspectives and the efficacy of current policy and responses to drug use.

We also need to look at international best practice when it comes to reducing supply, demand and harm and increasing resilience, health and well-being. We are seeing some concerning trends and we cannot and must not ignore them. Discussion on State responses, policy education, addiction and other areas are needed. As a society we all look forward to hearing the report from the citizens' assembly. I am glad to say this sounds like it might be something that will happen this year. We need to focus on it. It is time that as a nation we stood up and had an adult conversation on drug use and the way forward.

Deputy Neasa Hourigan

I very warmly welcome the establishment of the Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use and the good work of the Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, and the former Minister of State, Deputy Feighan, on pushing forward with it. When we first got it into the programme for Government we viewed it as a way to allow the complexity of the drugs debate to be on the table but not under the consistent pressure of political debate. We saw it as allowing the conversation to happen and be based on evidence and experience. I am very hopeful this might happen.

More than anything I view the citizens' assembly as a way for people who rarely get a chance to have their voices heard to speak up, raise their heads above the parapet and make their views known. It is a way for families who feel as though they have lost their loved ones, even though those loved ones might be here with us, to tell their story and what it feels like. It is a chance for people in addiction to explain to us as a cohort and to the citizens' assembly as a cohort how the laws that we make in here might impact and improve or damage their lives. It is a chance for people who every day choose to take what we describe as illicit drugs and feel it is okay to do so to explain what their thinking is.

The citizens' assembly will be an opportunity for communities to outline how so many issues, from poverty, deprivation, criminalisation, intimidation, gang activity, debt, mental health and a million other things, are impacted by the drugs debate and are related and entangled in the issue of illicit drugs. There is an immense social cost to the continued increase in drug use in Ireland as it stands. The people who are chosen for the citizens' assembly on drugs might not feel lucky when their names are picked out of the hat but I will consider them very lucky to enter into this debate. They might actually save lives in the long term.

I echo what Deputy Ó Ríordáin said and I also hope we can hold the person at the very heart of the discussion. What I mean by this is that the drugs will come and go. We will speak about crack cocaine and cannabis this year but it could be fentanyl next year. I see this happening in the US and it is very scary. In the US people are not speaking about drug gangs or supply any more because people can go into a laboratory and make this stuff with no problem. The substances themselves will change but people do not change unless we are brave enough to do so. I really hope we can put this at the very centre. I urge the political establishment, and by that I mean we in the Government, to do so in the establishment of the citizens' assembly and in our response afterwards. The time will be tight. The time for the citizens' assembly is fairly lively. With regard to us being able to turn it around and legislate the time is pretty tight. I hope we do not focus too much on particular substances but on the structures of legislation and services and on people's motivation.

The journey over recent years, whether Deputy Feighan or Deputy Naughton was the Minister of State, has been genuinely collaborative and cross-party. Deputy Ó Ríordáin mentioned this. It has involved people such as Senator Ruane and Deputies McAuliffe, Cairns, Gannon and our partners in Sinn Féin. People such as Deputies Ward and Gould speaking out is incredibly important. Perhaps people speaking up about this is not necessarily about party politics but about those of us living it, perhaps because we are in a constituency where it is meaningful and we see it. On the streets of Dublin Central there are mammies whose 12-year-old children are lookouts for drug gangs. One such woman came to me because she does not know what to do. I do not know what to do. It is a very difficult conversation. Members may have lived it in their own families. I know some of us have done so. We may be representing a constituency where it is on the street every day and desperate people are coming to us. This is why we are willing to enter into the debate. I hope we can keep in the debate the Deputies of any party or none who are involved in the issue and that they will work on pushing this through before the Government is out of office.

I echo Deputy Ward's concerns about not second-guessing the recommendations of the citizens' assembly. I know one thing for absolute certain as we go into it, namely, that what we are doing now in terms of drugs legislation has failed badly. The number of deaths is too high and the cost is too much. Today is the day that we can start doing better for people.

Deputy Paul Donnelly

I welcome the Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use. It is something that has needed to happen for many years. I commend all of those who campaigned and worked hard to get this far. I acknowledge there is no one voice on this issue. While we are speaking about a citizens' assembly I call on the Government to stop dragging its heels and establish a citizens' assembly on Irish unity as soon as possible to give all the people a say in the future of our island.

Drug misuse and abuse destroys individuals, families and communities. For many decades there has been one way to tackle the issue of mind-altering illegal drugs and abused legal drugs. Fractured communities are struggling and ever-expanding drug support services have had enough of the so-called "war on drugs". In effect this means a war on working-class communities. It has led to the criminalisation of a vast number of young and older people who have been left with criminal records which have affected the entirety of their lives. I welcome that we are looking at international best practice. I look forward to some of the models used throughout the world being explored and discussed to see how we can use some of this best practice and adapt it to an Irish context.

I acknowledge that the citizens' assembly will look at the lived experience of young people and adults affected by drug use as well as their families and communities. I hope that we also look at the lived experience of young and older people with regard to non-problematic drug use. We need to hear the voices of those who use drugs on a recreational basis. It is important this voice is also heard in the debate. It is recognised throughout the world that we can never rid our communities of drugs but a citizens' assembly can chart a way forward to help get rid of the blight of drug debt intimidation and local, national and international drug gangs which maintain their iron grip on our communities through more violence and intimidation.

I hope that the citizens' assembly can help to get us to where communities' voices are heard again and respected. As somebody involved in the establishment of a drugs task force a good number of years ago, as well as in community-led drugs projects, therapeutic and youth supports, I know the community-led approach works. Many of us in the Chamber know this. Unfortunately for the past ten years at least it has been very challenging.

I commend all those working on the coalface supporting those with problematic drug use and supporting young people, especially those on the local drugs task forces, family support networks and the brilliant work of our community drug teams in Dublin 15. We have the Tolka River Project rehabilitation programme, Genesis and Blanchardstown community counselling services and youth services such as Foróige neighbourhood youth projects and Blakestown and Mountview Youth Initiative. There are also all of the mothers, fathers, families and unpaid community activists who keep the struggle going to help and support people who are addicted to drugs and in recovery. I ask Members to support Deputy Gould's amendments to the motion.

An Ceann Comhairle

I call Deputy Cairns, who is sharing time with Deputy Gannon.

Deputy Holly Cairns

While I greatly welcome this motion establishing the Citizens’ Assembly on Drugs Use, it is truly shocking that it has taken this long. There are almost two drug-related deaths in Ireland every day, and this rate is almost five times the figure for those who die in road traffic accidents and twice the European average. Now that we have the assembly, it is essential that it is empowered to discuss and examine fully the complex issues involved while learning from the experiences of those affected and effective policies in other jurisdictions.

The Government’s proposal for what the assembly will consider is irresponsibly narrow. It does not cover the impact of criminalisation of drug use and possession, which is a key component of understanding a medicalised approach to drug use. We need to face up not only to the harm caused by drugs, but also the harm of systems that punish addiction. There is no reference to the importance of wraparound services to help individuals to recover from drug addiction. Also missing is the need for an assembly to hear from international best practice around drug policy and operational approaches.

We have a significant opportunity to learn from the success and challenges of Portugal and other countries that have transformed their approaches to drugs, with considerable success. This is a long overdue conversation but, like the other assemblies, it must have a broad remit to examine and discuss all aspects of drugs policy and its impact. Previous citizens’ assemblies and the constitutional convention have proven that the general public, especially when equipped with the facts, are way ahead of the Government on important social issues. Drugs are a social issue, a health issue and a class issue.

I have submitted an amendment to the motion to allow the assembly to have a fuller examination of drugs policy and its impacts on individuals, their families and whole communities. As is, I believe the Government’s wording is too restrictive and it will not facilitate the conversations we desperately need. The strength of the citizens’ assembly model is in giving them the freedom to discuss any topic and make recommendations based on the evidence and their deliberations. Let us give them the widest possible remit to engage critically with this complicated area.

Deputy Gary Gannon

Let me in the broadest and warmest sense welcome the citizens’ assembly on drugs. As I was sitting here listening to a previous speaker mentioning the pathway to this much-needed and long overdue assembly, I was thinking to myself of the journey that has taken place in communities all over this country and, in particular, in my own community in the north inner city. If we believe the citizens’ assembly reflects democracy as a forum where these ideas are going to be discussed, trashed out and improved, which has been the case in the past, I remember that my first political engagements many years ago were on my local drugs task force as a community representative. That was my first involvement politically and, in fact, the very first political meetings I had ever been at as a kid in the north inner city were assemblies about the scourge of drug addiction in those communities.

These assemblies and the discussion of the atrocious, incredibly devastating impacts on communities, individuals and families have been taking place around this country for decades. It is with this in mind that I strongly implore the Minister of State and those who will be involved in creating this scenario in a very short space of time to recognise that an incredible responsibility will be placed on those lucky enough to be on this assembly. If not exactly looking in from the outside, then certainly looking in with great curiosity will be the communities and families who have been impacted by this scourge and its devastating impact, who will want to know what is happening and will want to feel engaged. I ask the Minister of State to find the means by which we can explain to all communities the purpose of the citizens’ assembly, the matters that are going to be discussed and the ramifications of it, because this will be a topic of conversation throughout all of our communities that have been devastated by this issue over the last four decades.

I want to conclude by referencing some of the people in my own community who have demonstrated huge leadership on this issue over the last four decades. In particular, when I go out to talk to communities about this assembly, the person I will miss most is Mr. Fergus McCabe, who passed away a couple of years ago and who was the founder of CityWide and a number of other drug-related responses. Community leaders such as Fergus, who for years demonstrated incredible leadership in fighting back against the scourge of addiction and bringing care and compassion to the forefront of this issue, will be sadly missed.

There is a job of work for all of us around the political and civic leadership space to talk to our communities about the assembly, and a job of work for those of us across the Chamber who will be on the bodies afterwards in terms of working with great speed to implement its recommendations. I think we can do it and I am very excited about it. I congratulate those who have brought this to the fore.

Deputy Frankie Feighan

I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, for bringing forward this motion approving the establishment of a Citizens’ Assembly on Drugs Use. I also thank all of the other stakeholders, the Members of the Dáil and Seanad and the many people who have pursued this in a very measured way. I am delighted that, after many years, the citizens’ assembly will start. I want to highlight that the national drugs strategy that is in place for the period 2017 to 2025, Reducing Harm, Supporting Recovery, has brought a health-led approach to people who use drugs, and we should certainly acknowledge the great work done in that regard. I believe the terms of reference of the citizens’ assembly have sufficient scope and we look forward to the carefully considered recommendations which will come to the Oireachtas. There is huge scope to reduce the harmful impact of drug use on individuals, families, communities and the wider society. The citizens’ assembly will also take into account the implications for the health, justice and education systems.

This is not a Dublin problem or a city problem. Unfortunately, individuals, families and communities are affected by the harmful impact of illicit drug use in every city, town, village and rural area in this country. What we want to do is reduce the harm and the risk of harm caused by illicit drugs. Yesterday, I was in Ballybofey at a drug-related intimidation and violence engagement seminar which was bringing people together to deal with drug-related intimidation, which is happening not just in cities but in every area of our country. I commend those who are working on that.

We need more lives saved, and there are now more people in treatment, rehabilitation and recovery. Again, we want to reduce harm, reduce supply, reduce demand and look for a health-led approach and for well-being in our country. The citizens’ assembly's work will be about developing an understanding of the individuals, families and communities impacted by illicit drugs. We need those voices of drug users, their families and those affected by illicit drug use to be heard.

When I go around the world, I find Ireland is regarded as a world leader in regard to the citizens’ assembly and we have led the way in many areas. It is a great way of taking the politics out of very delicate, emotive and difficult situations, which is what the citizens’ assembly has done. I am looking forward to seeing the assembly engage comprehensively with professional bodies, stakeholders, representative groups and the general public and I also look forward to seeing the national and international experts. We need that time and space.

There is one aspect I would like to highlight. Last August, I was in Colombia, where they are taking a different approach to the war on drugs. Something I did not realise is that they see the United States, Europe, the United Kingdom and Ireland as the problem. We are the market. Every time we think of Colombia, we think of the drug cartels and corrupt government. What is happening in Colombia is disgraceful. Many people here talk about snorting cocaine and taking whatever, and they also talk about fair trade and giving a fair price to developing countries.

Think, however, of the farmers who have been punished by having their crops destroyed and by the deployment of troops to coca-growing areas. This has cost billions. It has cost the lives of thousands of innocent farmers, civilians and soldiers in clashes and drug-related violence. There must be sustainable alternatives to coca. Coca buyers and the drug cartels have moved in. They have moved in from Mexico and taken over all these areas. When you are snorting your cocaine, we say think about the children and about the families in Ireland, but think about the hundreds of thousands of farmers and innocent people in those countries that your money is going to keeping imprisoned by drug cartels. This is an aspect of the debate that should be brought to the attention of the citizens' assembly. It is an aspect that has been highlighted, and one that I witnessed. People came to me and pleaded that they need help. The Government of Colombia needs help. Following on from the Minister for Justice's comments in recent days, this is an aspect that we need to think about. We are talking about free trade, fair trade and coffee, but there are people who are suffering repression by drug cartels. That is something we need to discuss.

I thank the Minister of State and the officials in the Department. I thank all Members, Opposition and Government, for the measured way in which they have discussed this matter and expressed their feelings on the floor of the Dáil. That augurs very well for the citizens' assembly, which is much needed and anticipated and which will save lives.

Deputy Maurice Quinlivan

I welcome the proposed Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use. It is long overdue. I wish those who will be members of the assembly the very best in their deliberations. In the first instance, however, we are the citizens' assembly. The people of this State elected us to legislate on these issues. While the input of the assembly will be most welcome, this cannot be a case of taking its feedback and then allowing it to gather dust on a shelf. The time for action on drugs is now.

The approaches that have been taken over previous generations have failed utterly. The so-called war on drugs has been an absolute disaster. Colombia's President, Gustavo Petro, has stated recently the war on drugs has killed more than a million people in Latin America without denting the power of drug traffickers or the supply of drugs into Europe and the USA. The old approach of criminalising users has failed so many drug users, their families and many of our communities. I have been a member of the local drug and alcohol forum in Limerick for more than 12 years and have seen first-hand the devastation addiction can have not just on the user but on their families and wider community. Dependence on illicit drug use can rip families apart. I have spoken to mothers, fathers, grandmothers and grandfathers who have put themselves in debt to try to pay their child or grandchild's dealer. I have seen others make the difficult decision to report their own children to An Garda Síochána. It is my hope that the citizens' assembly will be able to consider the impact of illicit drug use on the lives of the family members of those who have been consumed by addiction and how we as a State can better support them.

Unfortunately, these types of scenarios have become more prevalent in Limerick over the past three years. The scourge of heroin remains, but it has been added to by the introduction of cheaper and highly addictive crack cocaine. It has taken hold of my beautiful city of Limerick and it is devastating. It often serves not only as a substitute for heroin but also as a complement to it. In 2020, I raised my concerns about the surge in the availability of crack cocaine in Limerick in this Chamber. I outlined my concern about the fact that the use of this addictive form of cocaine would increase unless action was taken. Regrettably, I have been proved right. Despite the efforts of the Garda and drug support organisations, use of crack cocaine has become widespread across Limerick. Indeed, the drugs supermarket, which I have referred to in this Chamber on a number of occasions, continues to operate on a 24-7 basis. It is from there that so much of the crack cocaine in my city is being sold. There must be a greater police focus on the operations of such shops and less of a focus on those people unfortunate enough to become dependent on this substance.

My party and I see harm reduction and prevention as our guiding lights in our approach to the issue of drug misuse. In that context, I welcome the holistic approach due to be taken in Limerick very soon in response to those who are using crack cocaine. The Garda has committed to an approach that will see its members, with the consent of users, refer users to the Ana Liffey Drug Project for support. The law engagement and assisted recovery approach has been in place in Dublin since 2014 and I hope its adoption in Limerick, specifically in relation to crack cocaine, will free up resources to tackle not the unfortunate users but the higher-end peddlers who profit from this misery. I acknowledge the work of organisations in Limerick such as Ana Liffey, which has been in the mid-west for the last ten years, and the Northstar Family Support Project that helps families. They do tremendous, non-judgmental work with both users and their families. Their workers are tremendous people who do so much good daily.

I hope the forthcoming assembly looks at models across the world with an eye to seeing whether they have been successful and to whether parts or all of those alternative approaches could be implemented in Ireland. The Portuguese model, which has been in place for ten years, is where I would start looking. While it has not been a panacea and is not perfect, it has led to a reduction in deaths, a massive reduction in people being imprisoned for drug addictions and has reduced HIV, hepatitis and other infections. We need to look at what works across the world and take the best parts. What we cannot do is sit in this Chamber and subcontract this out to the citizens' assembly. When the assembly comes back with what I hope will be a good report, we must deal with it as fast as we can and address this issue, because it is causing huge devastation.

Deputy Gino Kenny

Obviously, I welcome the establishment of the Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use. It is a very important debate and probably the most important of this generation where drug use is concerned. Why it took three years in the lifetime of this Government beggars belief and why it has taken decades to come to this level of discussion also beggars belief. We have seen other models across the world where drug use and addiction are treated more holistically and with more empathy. By locking people up - and the majority of people in Irish prisons are there for some form of the drugs business - it shows the level of failure of the State's policy for those who are in the drugs industry. The majority of people in prison are there for that purpose. We have seen other models across the world such as that of Portugal. Those other models have saved lives. I have said many times in this Chamber that if it can save one life, then a change of policy is worthwhile.

We cannot talk about decriminalisation without talking about regulation. Under decriminalisation, which is a much better model than the status quo, the black market still exists, and so all the drugs we are talking about would still be illegal. What gives the game away on this failed policy is a question I have asked many times, yet nobody has come up with an answer to it. Who are all the controlled drugs under the Misuse of Drugs Act controlled by? They are not controlled by the Government; they are controlled by the black market, and that gives the game away. As long as there is demand for drugs the black market will exist. I do not say this to dilute the issue of decriminalisation but we have to talk about regulation of some drugs that are illicit, such as cannabis and possibly others. We have to because otherwise the black market continues. You are decriminalising the person, which is good, but you need to go further than that.

Public opinion on this matter has shifted. In recent years, public opinion has moved beyond opinion in this House. A type of rot has set in whereby we keep the status quo because people did not see an alternative. There is an alternative now, and public opinion is looking at alternatives on this issue. It is a complex matter. Drug use can be very dark, to say the least. I have seen it in my community where drugs have taken hold of people, families and communities and it is absolutely ugly. Even having seen all that and looking back now, do I think there is a better model and a better way to treat people who fall into addiction for many reasons, including poverty and alienation? People take drugs for all sorts of reasons.

People take drugs through trauma. If people have problems with alcohol, we do not send them to prison. If people have a problem or a dependency on drugs, however, they are alienated and will be sent to prison. This is why I think the system is a failure.

In the last 50 years, in the context of the Misuse of Drugs Act 1977, when we look at the proliferation of all drugs, demand across the world has risen exponentially. It is impossible to stop the demand for drugs, their sale, etc. Even the President of Colombia, a country which has suffered terribly in recent decades from the narco wars, having lost hundreds of thousands of people, is saying, "Look, this policy just is not working anymore and we must do something different". I believe other countries are now following suit to look at a different model. This model is decriminalisation. I must again emphasise regulation and looking at how we take control back from the mire of the black market. I say this because a small number of people have enriched themselves from this market, and through violence. It is incredible how much money they have and how powerful they are. The only way to undermine these people is to take control back. If we do not do this, then these people will always have control. We must, therefore, take control back. This is a wider argument, but hopefully we can have it over the next months and years.

Deputy Jennifer Murnane O'Connor

It is welcome that we are bringing together a Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use. We must find a better way to meet the diverse health needs of people who use drugs and, at the same time, explore ways to prevent the harmful impact of drugs on children, families and communities. I have seen families torn apart, where perhaps a child or someone else in the family has started to take drugs and they have been crying out for help. This citizens' assembly, therefore, is going to be crucial.

Looking at the Port of Rotterdam, which is Europe's second largest container terminal, this is well known as a prominent entry point for illicit drugs shipped to Europe from Latin America. Last month, data reported to the European Monitoring Centre for Drugs and Drug Addiction, EMCDDA, highlighted how "cocaine seizures in Antwerp had risen from 91 tonnes in 2021 to close to 110 tonnes in 2022, making Antwerp the leading port for cocaine seizures in Europe". This seems far away, but it is not.

We see the rise in this regard, leading to a rise in competition between criminal networks and an increase in violence and clashes all the time. We see this violence spilling over to those outside the drug market. This is the criminal side of drug use and we need to call it out. On the other side, service providers across the country, dealing with people suffering due to drug use or addiction, are facing closure because of a lack of funding. This is a major issue. There are so many places with great facilities crying out for funding and it is not there. There is an increase in demand for drugs. Local and regional drug and alcohol task forces in communities all need funding. The use of drugs is on the rise and people need to be educated about the links between drug use and long-term mental health issues. If we saw greater investment in the local task forces, then we could achieve this change. I go to all the joint policing committee meetings and all over the country, time and again, drugs are always cited as one of the most challenging problems in society and more resources are always sought.

It is vital that we hear the voice of young people on this topic, as they can be especially impacted by drug use. I look forward to hearing the outcome of the consultation with Comhairle na nÓg and the youth drug projects in disadvantaged areas, which will be presented to the citizens' assembly for its consideration during its inaugural meeting in April 2023. When it concludes its work and submits a report to the Oireachtas by the end of 2023, I will be eager to hear what steps we can take to best reflect a partnership approach and give a stronger voice to the civil society implementation of the drug use strategy. This is crucial. All of us must be so mindful of drug use and I really welcome this citizens' assembly.

Deputy Paul McAuliffe

I welcome this motion. I see that the former Minister of State, Deputy Feighan, has just left. I know the contribution he made to the preparation of this citizens' assembly. It is important to say we would not have reached this point without significant voices in all political parties and many at a community level calling for this citizens' assembly to be established. We know the Misuse of Drugs Act 1977 is not working. Drug use has increased over this time and the State is allocating huge resources to try to tackle the management and implementation of this legislation. The 100 people who will form this citizens' assembly have a difficult task. Many of them will be coming to it with no background in or awareness of addiction, or the illness that is addiction. Many of them may come from communities that have experienced the impact of drug use for many years, while many will also come from communities where the problem may perhaps be more hidden. We should be clear, however, that the drugs issue impacts every community, although it may be more open in some.

These 100 people will come together and they will have to tackle the issue of the legal framework and service provision. There is a tendency in this debate for us to get lost in the argument around decriminalisation or regulation. Access to services, though, is key in terms of the outcome of the citizens' assembly. I do not want to say too much in advance of it, because, in some ways, we are pre-empting its work. As other Deputies said, my view is that the illegal drugs industry has grown to such a scale and size, in terms of the international networks and resources it can deploy and its willingness to use violence, we have effectively put some of the most vulnerable in our society, those with an addiction, at the end of a supply chain for this illegal drugs industry. Whatever we can do, therefore, to ensure people with problematic drug use can be protected from that network is something we should consider.

Decriminalisation of the person will be a necessary first step in this regard. This is not to say we believe the consumption of drugs is a positive thing. We all, or many people, consume alcohol and we know the negative impacts it has. Many people also smoke tobacco and we know the negative impacts that has too. Saying that it should not be a criminal offence, therefore, for people to use some of the substances that are currently illegal is not an endorsement of their use, but rather an endorsement of a compassionate approach to those people who find themselves having problematic drug use. Let us just think about a situation where we, our sons, our daughters, our mothers or our aunts ended up with problematic drug use. Would we want the Garda calling to their doors or would we want a counsellor, a doctor or a nurse to do so instead? This very simply answers the question of whether we want a justice-led approach or a health-led approach in this regard.

Politicians cannot hide behind this phrase "a health-led approach": we must spell out what it means. I believe decriminalisation of the person is this necessary first step. It removes the criminal sanction and allows us to concentrate on alternative approaches. These include those used in Portugal, although we should not rely too heavily on the Portuguese model. We should come up with an Irish model which is compassionate. This idea of us considering our brothers, our sisters and other family members in this context is how I think we can persuade people this is the right way forward. We have had these difficult conversations in the past, societal conversations, that required changes to be made in referendums. Resistance is often eliminated when we bring proposals back to the human level, the example of our neighbours, our friends, etc.

In some ways, we have an extremely hypocritical approach to drug use in Ireland, given the scale of use of one type of drug, alcohol, and the availability of, for example, methadone, which is a legal product supplied free of charge by the State. Then there are the other classifications of drugs which we make illegal. There is, therefore, no consistency in how we approach this issue. Ultimately, this is about people who have an addiction. Regardless of the substance, addiction is an illness and something that needs to be tackled. This is an opportunity for Ireland to be compassionate and to have a grown-up conversation in this regard. Right across the board, therefore, I encourage people, not just in the Oireachtas but outside it as well, to speak about this issue.

We need to have this adult conversation. We need to make the changes in the legal framework and in the service provision to protect those people who find themselves experiencing problematic drug use.

Deputy Dessie Ellis

The establishment of a Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use is long overdue. Hopefully, this April we will have in position the necessary 100 people to look at this and to consider all aspects of drug use, including recovery facilities, legal and policing issues and the roles of task forces and policing committees. I am a long-time member of the Finglas-Cabra drugs task force. Drugs task forces have done marvellous work with very poor resources. I hope the citizens' assembly will be in a position to look at the financing of these because many of them have been let down over the years.

Drug intimidation is also a major issue in mainly working-class areas. People are crying out for help and guidance and help are needed. Maybe we will come up with some answers through the citizens' assembly. Recovery must be a key focus of the assembly. The work of groups like Recovery Academy, SMART Recovery and Soilse will be reflected in it. Sinn Féin is the only party on the island with a specific policy focused on recovery and the rights of people. We need to make sure the assembly explores how to support people who are in recovery. We need to listen to people who work on the ground to learn from their experiences and invest in health and social care to reduce long waits to access residential rehab. We also need to hear from those who have experienced drug and alcohol use and those who have gone through recovery.

Since 2017, we have had legislative provision for supervised injecting facilities to help reduce harm and death from addiction and heroin use. The establishment of the first facility in Merchants Quay Ireland is long overdue and has been delayed for many years. It has only recently received permission to go ahead. The conversation in this space has now moved to supervised consumption rooms for a wider range of substances, which should be explored by the citizens' assembly.

The issue of dual diagnosis is one area that needs urgent attention. I commend the Finglas Addiction Support Team, FAST, and the Ballymun drugs task force on the work they have done in this area. I hope they will get a day out with the assembly. Open drug dealing is now common and in some areas it is fairly visible on the street. It is quite visible in the city centre of Dublin as well but one of the worst areas is around schools. The effect this has on minors and other people needs to be explored and we need to examine whether zones should be set up to deal with this and keep drugs out of school areas and not in proximity to schools.

There is also the issue of the proceeds of crime. I would hope the assembly would have a word in regard to this. This money should be directed into areas where the major seizures were and the most affected areas. I would like to think the assembly would have something on that.

The attitude of people to those who have addiction problems is appalling. That is something we need to address. We need to educate people. Cocaine has become a major substance in our society. You see it in pubs and everywhere, even in Dáil Éireann. It has become acceptable. Education is needed. We need to teach people that this is unacceptable. We need experts from all areas, not just from different local groups but from outside the country, to have an input. That is very important.

Deputy Peter Fitzpatrick

First and foremost, I commend the Government on the national drugs strategy, which rightly promotes a more compassionate and humane approach to people who use drugs. By treating addiction as a health issue rather than solely as a criminal justice issue, we have the opportunity to educate and empower people at an individual level to improve their health, well-being and quality of life through the promotion of rehabilitation and recovery. The establishment of a citizens’ assembly on drug use is another step forward in reducing the harmful impacts of illicit drugs on individuals, families, communities and wider society. The resulting policy will have the opportunity to make a significant difference in the promotion of health and addiction recovery in Ireland.

The prevalence of drug use in recent years is shocking. In Europe, Ireland is among the highest users of cocaine, with cocaine now more common than alcohol. However, there is a significant link between alcohol use and cocaine use. According to the European Monitoring Centre for Drugs and Drug Addiction, an estimated 7.8% of the Irish population have used cocaine in their lifetime, with the average age of first-time regular use being 22 years of age. Substance abuse is through the roof and I passionately welcome the creation of this assembly so those most affected can impact decision-making on drugs policy.

Not a day goes by that I do not speak with a constituent who has been affected by drug use and addiction. Research shows significant links between trauma, drug use and addiction. Trauma includes anything from adverse childhood experiences to poverty and stress, to name a few issues. People use drugs as a coping mechanism to numb their pain and stress. Adolescents are particularly vulnerable to drug use and addiction while their brains are still developing and maturing, and studies highlight that drug use in adolescence creates a vulnerability to drug addiction in later life. This is why education is paramount. Let me be clear: drug use affects all members of society. Whether someone is homeless or a CEO, an adolescent or in their 50s, directly or through families and communities, everyone is affected.

The assembly will examine the range of issues around illicit drugs use in Ireland, considering the lived experience of people impacted by drug use, as well as their families and communities. Citizens’ assemblies have become an important part of Ireland’s democratic process and have made a significant contribution to the process of constitutional reform and change. The widening of the selection process to include all residents in the State, including non-Irish people and normally hard-to-reach groups who are not on the electoral register, is to be applauded. I would also expect the assembly to listen to qualified experts in the field of addiction. Given the growing prevalence rates in Irish society, an awareness regarding the brain and behavioural effects of substance use is crucial so the transition from casual use to addiction can be understood and so legislation and policy can incorporate biological, psychological and social dimensions. Furthermore, I expect to see an international component to the citizens’ assembly, whereby the efficacy of current strategic, policy and operational responses to drug use are evaluated and pulled apart. Merging the best practices from the European Union drugs strategy 2021-2025, the Sláintecare implementation strategy and action plan 2021-23 and the Healthy Ireland strategic action plan 2021–2025 should result in an all-consuming policy. The Government will then need to push forward the resulting recommendations through policy measures in education and the provision of services.

Combining a preventative approach with a person-centred recovery strategy is crucial. However, it must be acknowledged that drug markets and drugs are continuously evolving. The drugs war in my constituency of Louth and east Meath is frightening. Drugs are everywhere and the likes of heroin are becoming more common. It is crucial that we keep on top of new substances coming on stream and their transition into the community. Sharing of information and intelligence both nationally and internationally has been very useful. Policy must incorporate operational responses to drug use, taking into consideration the implications for the health, criminal justice and education systems. Many people who use drugs problematically come into contact with the criminal justice system and acquire criminal convictions, either directly or indirectly related to their drug use. I see this daily.

The scale of the societal problem around drug use is such that it now needs a dedicated resource to drive change, namely, this assembly and Government intervention. A critical element of the assembly on drug use is the co-operation and collaboration between Departments, agencies and support services. A co-ordinated whole-of-government approach is required alongside statutory bodies and civil society.

A young girl came to see me recently who has a problem with alcohol. She is only 18 years of age. Her parents threw her out. I rang the parents and they wanted nothing to do with her. I contacted my local homeless centre and they told me the girl has a serious drink problem and she was in the Simon Community hostel but they threw her out because she was drinking again. She then came back to see me. Where does this young girl go from here? Nobody seems to want to know anything about this young girl, neither the HSE nor the mental health services.

She is only 18 years of age. She slept for three nights on top of the new Halliday Mills apartment block on Quay Street in Dundalk. The system does not work.

Addiction is complex; there are psychological, social, and biological elements to it. It must be acknowledged that people who use drugs are not a homogenous group. Their needs can be varied, multifaceted and complex. In this girl’s case, the joint commitment of the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage and the Department of Health is required to address her needs. We need to work together by considering individual needs. By ensuring alignment across strategies, this will ensure a holistic, whole-of-government approach to addressing the differing needs of the individual. Policies and strategies need to reflect the same aims, have joint commitments and complement each other rather than duplicate issues.

It is expected the citizens’ assembly will commence in April and conclude its work by the end of the year. Through its contribution, research and the lived experience of its participants, I believe we can succeed in combating our prevailing use of drugs.

We have a serious situation in Dundalk at the moment. No matter where this girl goes all of these doors keep closing on her. We have some fantastic services but to me, they are lip services. I am appealing to the Minister of State to make these places better. If a person walks into the local authority with a problem, it should either send the person to the HSE or even to other Departments. At the moment, nobody is working together. I guarantee that if one walks down any street, whether it is in Dundalk, Dublin or elsewhere, there will be homeless people who are crying for help. I am a firm believer that prevention is the best cure and if we can catch these people at an early stage, we have an opportunity to sort this out.

I know the Minister of State is new in her job but I am pleading with her to help these people, whether they are young, old, or going to school, because there is a serious problem at the moment. I am lucky in that I do not drink, smoke or take drugs but I see it first hand in my constituency office. People are coming in, families, mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, grannies and granddads, and they want help. We are pleading with the Minister of State and her Department and all involved to work together to help these people.

Deputy Fergus O'Dowd

I welcome this timely and important debate. There is probably a consensus in the House as to the way forward but I will reflect, like my colleague, Deputy Fitzpatrick, on issues in my constituency. What brought not just Drogheda, where I live, to national attention and international notoriety was the context of the murder of Keane Mulready-Woods, who was a young person, a child, as a result of a drug feud. That epitomised how low those people who are involved in criminal gangs and the drug trade can go.

It was a shocking and appalling murder and our town was and still is riddled with drugs, unfortunately. At that time, we were short significant investment in An Garda Síochána. There has been an increase of more than 47 in the number of gardaí dealing with the drug trade in Drogheda, 18 of whom are community gardaí. There was a significant response to that murder and it has been very successful and helpful in that respect.

The debate on the citizens’ assembly must encompass listening to the real witnesses who deal with criminality on a day-to-day basis, that is, the gardaí. I want to suggest the name of a former chief superintendent, Christy Mangan, who fought all his life, but particularly in his latter years in Drogheda. He is retired now. He has put most of these drug gangs behind bars. That was what needed to happen. He had a tough hand which he gave to the gardaí to ensure these criminals were put away.

On the other side, one has the Red Door in Drogheda, which deals with drugs issues on the ground. There is a lady there called Louise Mahony, the manager, who runs an outreach service for those who are suffering from drug abuse and for those who are outside of society. The service works day and night to ensure these people are dealt with and that the support services are there for them.

I refer to the Health Services Executive, HSE, which I think I might call the health seekers executive. I have a copy of the final report of the HSE review of addiction services in Louth and Meath, published in June 2021. I would have thought that when I asked the Minister for a copy of it, I would get it but I did not. I had to go through the freedom of information process to find out the dysfunctionality in the HSE in my region of Louth and Meath, in particular. It operates in silos where there is a refusal to integrate and work with community services. The HSE is dealing with that now and this report deals with the changes it is making, but documents like this should not be hidden from public view. They should be put into the public domain where people can get them; where Deputies or anybody who wants them can get them. They can read about what exactly is going on, what the HSE is doing, what the pluses and minuses are, and what the community service is like. If it is bad, it is bad, but let us get it out there and deal with it. We should not be hiding these facts.

I am aware my time is very short. I was hoping my colleague, Deputy Lawless, would not come into the House, so I would have the opportunity to speak for the other four minutes. This point is on the Drogheda implementation plan which arose from the Drogheda: creating a bridge to a better future, the Guerin report, which dealt with the awful murder of Keane Mulready-Woods and how the community was dealing with that. The Minister for Justice, Deputy McEntee, has done a fantastic job and is providing significant funding to the communities which suffer most from drug abuse in my town. They work with policing, family supports and with children and young people in education and on the creation of employment and on business and enterprise. That is not to forget community development, arts, culture and sport.

I do not have enough time to say what I want to say. That is one of the problems when one is a backbencher. The Minister of State, who had 20 minutes to speak, is excellent. I was lucky to get my four minutes. I would like to have more time to talk on this. We should have an interim report from the citizens’ assembly where we should be able to make our own input into it. I know I am using Deputy Lawless's time, but I know he will forgive me for that.

Deputy James Lawless

I will need to use the cameras to get my time back.

Deputy Fergus O'Dowd

We need more time to go through how we solve the problem but I welcome the fact the citizens’ assembly has been set up.

Deputy James Lawless

I thank the Minister of State and wish her good luck in the new role she has been assigned. I have every confidence she will make a great success of it. I am very pleased we are moving now towards the establishment of a citizens’ assembly.

At the outset, I thank my colleagues across the parties on the Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice. I also thank my secretariat, the clerk, Alan Guidon, and his team, and all of the stakeholders who come in to us. Almost a year ago, we set out to have hearings on this subject. We selected it because we felt it was an area of public policy about which there was increasing concern among the general public and where perhaps the policy was misguided, or at least in need of an update. Our approach, as it is to any topic we examine, was to invite stakeholders from every side of the House and of the policy spectrum to present to us.

One of the first findings we made was in respect of advocates in favour of modernising the approach, whether to decriminalisation, legalisation, a public health framework or some combination of those. These greatly outnumbered advocates who wished to remain with the current model and system. I would almost say we had to go looking for people to advocate on behalf of the status quo. I thank those who did so very well and with great professional integrity and experience. However, I believe it is fair to say, and as the report pointed out, that view was in the minority.

I will summarise the views and I hope the committee report will provide a useful context to the citizens’ assembly. It could have an input and I would recommend, if at all possible, that it be distributed to the members of the citizens’ assembly when it convenes because we made close to 20 recommendations. These were all expert-based and evidence-led and were achieved with cross-party consensus throughout our hearings. That report should feed into the assembly.

We should accelerate the process of decriminalisation, which is already in being. Last year at Electric Picnic, we saw substances being tested for the first time. We see the medical cannabis programme being advanced and rolled out. We see the drugs Acts differentiating between the quantity of substance and the type of substance a person may have and the actions which are taken as a result. We need to accelerate the process of decriminalisation, which is already under way.

We should consider a legalisation framework. I understand some are less comfortable with that than others. I believe, however, this is about consistency. Anybody can walk out of this House and walk two or five minutes away, depending on whether one is staying inside or going outside of the campus, and can purchase another drug, alcohol, which can do irreparable harm to communities and to individuals. That is perfectly legal.

From 10.30 a.m., one can buy it on any street corner in Ireland. Other substances that may be available on the opposite street corner have no testing, regulation, quality control or checks and balances and, yet, are prohibited, often because of an accident of history. There is a place to examine that model; a kind of a regulatory model that would test, quality control, sample and manage and, in so doing, drive out the criminal gangsterism and profiteering that goes on as part of this and bring some consistency to that debate.

The third spoke in the wheel would be to apply a consistent public health lens to all of these substances, whether it is alcohol, a "soft drug" or a "hard drug". We should have an educational, proactive stance that is based upon public health policy and a health-led approach and invest in education, treatment and counselling for those who need it. That is a very good balance to strike. I am slightly over time, but I am trying to make up for time lost to the speaker before me. If those three pillars could form part of the building blocks of the citizens' assembly, our committee report would have done the State some service. I wish the assembly well in its deliberations.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

The Rural Independent Group welcomes the opportunity to speak about the new Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use which has been established by the Government. While it is due to start in April and conclude before the end of the year, I argue against its formation and for why we think it is a waste of time and money. First, drug use has a significant impact on society, imposing significant health and financial costs. However, involving a group of hand-picked citizens in decision-making on drugs policy is not wholly appropriate. This process represents a cover for a Government that has failed to invest in addiction services and drugs education, particularly for those who are less well off. Local community groups, GAA clubs and families are struggling to gain access to these services. The Government could immediately intervene and invest in these services today. Setting up an assembly will do nothing but delay and postpone any governmental action to provide the much-needed supports to local communities that are required.

My colleagues and I in the Rural Independent Group fully support a health-led approach to drugs which focuses on treating drug addiction as a health issue, rather than a criminal justice issue. This approach recognises that drug addiction is a complex medical condition that requires treatment and support, rather than punishment. However, in tandem with that, while decriminalisation of drugs is often seen as a solution to the harms of drug use, it is not necessarily required for a health-led approach to be effective. Decriminalisation may remove criminal penalties for drug use, but it does not necessarily address the underlying health issues that lead to addiction. A health-led approach to drugs can be achieved through a range of strategies such as harm reduction, access to evidence-based treatments and support services for people who use drugs. These strategies aim to reduce the harms associated with drug use, including overdose and transmission of blood-borne diseases, while addressing the root cause of addiction.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I am glad to get the opportunity to talk about this. I am opposed to the setting up of a citizens' assembly, because we are the elected people in here to represent the people out there. Hand-picking a group of people, as the Government did in previous citizens' assemblies, is not fair. When one thinks about it, one of those assemblies which was very important did not include any representatives from 11 counties, County Kerry being one of them. I am afraid of the Government setting up an assembly here, where there is no representative from a place as expansive as County Kerry, which has a drug problem.

I am greatly worried that this is an orchestrated move to legalise drugs, instead of criminalising them. The story is bad enough as it is. They are in every small town and village in our county. Instead of the Government doing something to help the people who have a problem and who develop mental health issues, we see the hames that is being made of the mental health issues in County Kerry with south Kerry and north Kerry child and adolescent mental health services, CAMHS, and all over Tipperary and every other place. There is no proper psychologist or psychiatrist to deal with the young people who are developing problems. It is no wonder they resort to drugs to find out something different. This is totally and absolutely wrong.

In France, a citizens' assembly was set up and, before it went halfway in its deliberations, they all walked out of it. It was the same with the Brexit citizens' assembly which was widely criticised for not being representative of the population. Again I say, we are the elected Members in here. We have been elected by the people. If we do not do our job, we will be found out and told that at the next election, when we go before the people on our record. These people the Government will appoint here inside can walk into anonymity the minute the citizens' assembly is finished. They will probably come up with some idea and the citizens' assembly will be held accountable, regardless of what it comes forward with. That is what the Government will follow then. It is only a cop-out by the Government. The Government is made up of the people who are elected. Deputy Naughton is a Minister of State and she and the other Ministers have a duty to respond to the issues that are arising out there. Drugs are a big problem, but to leave it up to a citizens' assembly is totally and absolutely wrong. It is too costly and will not be properly representative of the people who are affected. I am calling on the Government to forget about it and deal with the issue itself, if it is Government enough to do that. If it is not, it should pull out and leave it to someone else.

Deputy Joan Collins

I welcome the formation of the Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use. Can the microphone be turned on?

I have co-signed the amendments put forward by Deputy Cairns and me, supported by Senator Ruane. Ireland's drug policy has never achieved what it set out to achieve. There are thousands of convictions each year, the majority of which are around personal use. Young people face the brunt of this and it sees thousands criminalised in their youth and facing serious and permanent obstacles in their futures. There has never been any benefit to criminalising children or young people.

I am a member of the Canal Communities Local Drug and Alcohol Task Force. For decades, community-led organisations working around drug use have known that it is a rehabilitative and health-led approach that makes real differences in the lives of those affected by drug use and addiction. The current drug policies are a significant block to the hard work of many who are working in health services and in their communities. It is not a coincidence that those who work closest to the ground and organisations such as the CityWide drugs crisis campaign, Ana Liffey Drug Project and Youth Workers Against Prohibition, are at the forefront of calling for decriminalisation, or illegalisation of drugs use.

People on the ground know that the first step to move our drug policy to a health and rehabilitation-led approach is to remove the punitive approach in our legal system. I support the amendments brought forward. As much as I welcome the citizens' assembly, this motion is far too tilted towards the status quo, when it is time for a debate and real change in this matter. The consensus on a health-led approach is there. There is no need to put any qualifications on this. I support the call to include a broader range of research perspectives and advocacy groups to the assembly. There is a clear consensus on a health-led approach, both from the recent Oireachtas committee and from advocacy and community groups. This should be at the centre of the assembly's considerations.

I support the call for this to be a consideration of the impact of criminalisation, not just to be a consideration of the impact of drug use. There needs to be an understanding of how the current policy has worsened the lives of many in communities affected by addiction. I support the call to promote greater public awareness and understanding. We have had decades of a punitive and criminalising approach to drugs use and this has failed, but it has a hangover effect on how the public sees drug use and addiction. We need to end the stigma and marginalisation. I support the call for a harm-reduction model, with a greater range and diversity of supports. How much money has been wasted on convictions and locking people up? These resources need to be put back into services and communities in a way that starts to reverse the harm caused by current policy.

Issues around drug use and addiction are the symptom, not the cause of issues affecting our communities.

While the establishment of this assembly is a welcome move, we cannot get rid of the problems around drugs use without getting rid of the deep poverty, neglect and inequality that has plagued many communities for decades. We need proper supports and resources around addiction, but this must be part of a wider reaction to poverty and inequality. I support the motion and ask the Minister of State to comment on the inclusion of the amendments in the name of Deputy Gould and in my name and that of Deputy Cairns.

Deputy Violet-Anne Wynne

Gabhaim buíochas le Deputy Collins for sharing her time with me so that I could speak on this very important motion. While we are here today debating the motion on the establishment of a citizens' assembly, we are a year behind schedule already. There have been several delays and I hope there will no further delays. The Minister of State's predecessor, Deputy Feighan, had said that all of the relevant background work was being put in place to facilitate the establishment of this assembly as soon as possible this year.

In the short amount of time I have, I want to talk about criminalising the drug user. This has not worked. It is not grounded in evidence or respect for human dignity. Why are we in this Chamber having to talk about the need for a citizens' assembly? It is because of the stigma, the shame and the fear associated with conversations and debates around the use of drugs and those who are in need. More than 30 countries have decriminalised drug possession for personal use. Here we are only now talking about the establishment of the citizens' assembly. I hope, by the time the recommendations are implemented by this House, the people who have needed these structural and policy changes are not bitter from the wait they have had to endure while the Government and this House take action on behalf of those who do not have voices. I am so happy that at least some people will have their say. Until policymakers have the ear of the victims, those who have been harmed by the policies implemented in this House, we will not see the changes that are needed.

Minister of State at the Department of Health (Deputy Hildegarde Naughton)

I thank the Deputies for their thoughtful and constructive statements in support of the motion before the House. It is clear from the statements over the past hour or so that there is widespread support in Dáil Éireann for a citizens' assembly on drugs use. There is also a clear sense of the urgency of the task.

As I said in my opening remarks, this country has seen too much pain and suffering caused by drugs use. Too many families have lost loved ones through overdose. Too many lives have been ruined by addiction. Too many communities have been living in fear of the criminal gangs who supply drugs in towns and villages throughout the country. As this debate has once again demonstrated, the challenges arising from drug use are complex and multifaceted. While we know there are no easy answers, there is a clear sense in this House and beyond that the time has come for bold action and new solutions. This is why the decision to establish a citizens' assembly to look at the issues is so timely.

Citizens' assemblies serve to enhance the quality of Ireland's democratic system. Previous assemblies have shown that members of the public have an important contribution to make in addressing complex societal challenges. I expect the citizens' assembly on drugs use will be no different in this regard.

In their statements, Deputies have identified a range of priorities they think the citizens' assembly on drugs use should address. A number of amendments have been tabled that seek to nuance the terms of reference or explicitly itemise various things Deputies believe the citizens' assembly should look at. I fully appreciate the intent behind these proposed amendments. Every Deputy who has spoken has a keen interest in ensuring the citizens' assembly does not overlook or neglect important issues. All parties are looking for the same outcome, which is a comprehensive, careful and considered process in which the citizens' assembly looks at all issues mentioned by the Deputies today. Experience shows us that we should not be overly prescriptive or too detailed in the terms of reference. We must trust the process and the members of the citizens' assembly. Let us consider that Ireland's citizens' assembly model is regarded internationally as a leading exemplar of deliberative democracy in action. Citizens' assemblies have become a valuable part of Ireland's democratic system.

Recommendations from a citizens' assembly can have a considerable influence on changes to policy, legislation and even the Constitution. They also have a significant role in informing wider public debate on important topics. Previous assemblies have made recommendations on topics such as marriage equality, repeal of the eighth amendment, gender equality, climate change and biodiversity. We must continue to learn from experience and build on what has worked successfully in the past. This principle applies, in particular, to the framing of the terms of reference. We know from experience that an overly detailed terms of reference can inadvertently inhibit the autonomy, discretion and flexibility necessary for the citizens' assembly to define and organise its work programme as it deems appropriate. Experience with citizens' assemblies has proven time and again that the Oireachtas can trust and, indeed, must trust both the process and the members of the assembly.

The importance of the voice of young people was raised earlier. I reassure Deputies that the voice of young people will be heard at the citizens' assembly. To this end, I have initiated a consultation with young people through Comhairle na nÓg and youth drug projects throughout the country, which will be presented to the citizens' assembly for its consideration.

On the selection of members of the citizens' assembly, there is now a new and improved method to randomly select members. People are not handpicked. There is no guarantee that every county will have a person on the citizens' assembly, but there is a guarantee that the final 99 members will correspond with the population profile by region, age group and gender.

I am satisfied the terms of reference as set out in the motion give the citizens' assembly the scope and flexibility it needs to consider all relevant matters relating to drugs use. This includes each and every issue Deputies have emphasised today.

The citizens' assembly secretariat will be fully apprised of this debate and will be cognisant of the concerns and priorities Deputies have highlighted. Ultimately, it will be up to the members of the citizens' assembly to determine their own work programme. Once we are clear that the terms of reference are sufficiently well defined to allow for the assembly to examine the issues, we will need to step back, respect the independence of the process, and allow the members the space and freedom to get on with the task in hand. In due course, the assembly will report back to the Oireachtas, at which point the appropriate committee will have the opportunity to consider, debate and respond to the report and its recommendations.

Meanwhile, I am pleased to confirm that the assembly will be up and running in a few short weeks. Recruitment of members will begin in the coming days, and the first meeting of the assembly will take place in mid-April. All going according to schedule, the assembly is due to report back to the Oireachtas by the end of this year. I wish the citizens' assembly every success in its work and I look forward to seeing the outcome of its deliberations in due course.

Amendment put.

An Cathaoirleach Gníomhach (Deputy Alan Dillon)

In accordance with Standing Order 80(2), the division is postponed until the weekly division time on Wednesday, 22 February 2023.

Dáil Éireann debate - Tuesday, 21 Feb 2023

Citizens' Assembly on Drugs Use: Motion

Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 21 Feb 2023