Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs and Trade, and Defence debate -
Thursday, 6 Oct 2016

Humanitarian Aid and Crisis Management: European Commissioner for Humanitarian Aid and Crisis Management

Chairman

Today, we meet Mr. Christos Stylianides, EU Commissioner for Humanitarian Aid and Crisis Management. We are delighted to welcome the Commissioner to the committee to discuss matters of mutual interest. The European Union is the largest donor of humanitarian aid in the world. Its role in co-ordinating and building close working relationships with key partners in its humanitarian work, including UN agencies, non-governmental organisations and civil society, has never been more important. The format of the meeting is as follows. We will hear an opening statement from the Commissioner before moving to a question-and-answer session with the members of the committee on subjects pertaining to his portfolio.

I ask members, witnesses and those in the Gallery to ensure their mobile phones are switched off completely for the duration of the meeting as they cause interference even on silent mode with the recording equipment in the committee room. Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person or body outside the Houses or an official either by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable. I draw the attention of witnesses to the fact that by virtue of section 17(2)(l) of the Defamation Act 2009, witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of their evidence to the committee. However, if they are directed by the committee to cease giving evidence on a particular matter and they continue to so do, they are entitled thereafter only to a qualified privilege in respect of their evidence. They are directed that only evidence connected with the subject matter of these proceedings is to be given and they are asked to respect the parliamentary practice to the effect that, where possible, they should not criticise or make charges against any person, persons or entity by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable.

I call on the Commissioner, whose contribution I welcome, to make his opening statement. I note for his information that opening statements made to the committee are published on the committee's website after each meeting.

Mr. Christos Stylianides

I thank the dear Chairman and honourable Members of this historic Parliament who it is a real privilege to meet and address today. As a former parliamentarian, it is always a pleasure to be among colleagues and especially to engage in discussions with national representatives. I believe firmly that it is a strong component of our partnership. My presence here is not only an institutional obligation, it is a democratic one.

Three weeks ago, President Juncker delivered his state of the Union address. He took a hard but realistic look at the challenges facing Europe. Unemployment, social inequality, the refugee crisis, insecurity, digital Europe and acting as a real global player are only some of the issues he underlined. They are issues which require bold decisions and bold actions. President Juncker has asked us to make crucial choices. He proposed a positive agenda of concrete actions for the next 12 months. These actions will be Europe's contribution to reuniting our Union. They will show that we can be decisive on what really matters and will demonstrate to the world that Europe is still a force capable of joint action. To succeed, the Union needs the support of the members of the joint committee who, as national representatives, are the closest politicians to ordinary people.

The role of each Member of any national parliament is important. My strong opinion is that without the engagement of Members of Parliament in each member state or European country, it is completely impossible to link up European citizens. That is why our engagement and discussions with national parliaments are not only an institutional obligation but also a part of our democratic processes. At the same time, it is important to address the needs of citizens. We must deliver a Europe of solidarity. Solidarity is the foundation of the European Union. Let us recall our common past and never forget that solidarity has built lasting peace in Europe. I know that I am addressing representatives of a nation with a strong tradition of solidarity in many aspects. It is a nation that has not forgotten its sacrifices over two centuries. Ireland is truly a generous nation.

My portfolio has two main pillars. The first is overseeing the European Union's humanitarian aid, with an annual budget of €1.5 billion. The second is overseeing the European Union's crisis centre and disaster response system. I refer to the so-called EU Civil Protection Mechanism. Some 250 million people are affected by humanitarian crises worldwide and an unprecedented 65 million have been forcibly displaced. We are facing a global displacement crisis which requires a global response. No one can deal with this crisis alone. That is why I insist we need a global response and engagement not only by European countries but also others, particularly developing countries.

We help people in need, no matter where they are and regardless of their background. Since April this year, this includes countries within Europe because we have a new instrument that allows us to provide humanitarian aid within our own borders, particularly for the refugees in Greece. We could certainly do much more. Member states, national parliaments, EU institutions and civil society can all work together in partnership.

Based on the figures, the situation is better now than it was a year ago due, to a large extent, to the EU-Turkey agreement which, despite the criticism, is working. It remains a key part of our response to the refugee crisis. I strongly believe it is the only way for Europe to deal with what is an unprecedented crisis. That is the reality. I am very pragmatic. We have significantly strengthened our humanitarian assistance for refugees in Turkey.

A few days ago I launched the Emergency Social Safety Net, ESSN, the largest ever humanitarian aid project funded by the European Union. It has a budget of €348 million. The programme is a model of cost-effectiveness. Monthly cash transfers to electronic cards will be effected for 1 million refugees. It is a model because there is no intermediate cost. This is important in our humanitarian actions because a vast proportion of the money, over 85%, is reaching the beneficiaries. At the same time, this allows refugees to cover their own needs, including rent, food and education. The money will boost the local economy and give dignity to refugees. This is important to the humanitarian community and me personally. Ours is not just a philanthropic organisation. We have to determine how to ensure the dignity of the refugees will remain a top priority.

As the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Charlie Flanagan, whom I just met, pointed out in his address during the UN General Assembly meeting, the top drivers of mass movement such as conflict, persistent poverty, inequality and climate change require closer multilateral co-operation urgently. Humanitarian crises are growing more complex, severe and protracted. In this regard, one should think of Syria, Iraq, South Sudan, Yemen and many other regions worldwide. Let us face it: humanitarian aid is not a solution to conflict. It cannot address the root causes. That is why humanitarian problems require political solutions. This is the realistic approach. We need innovative solutions, a partnership with development actors and, as I stated, political solutions. The New York declaration at the recent UN summit underlined these new approaches and I deeply thank Ireland for co-facilitating it. It endorses the concept of global responsibility sharing. It is important to be an advocate for this approach. The tragic situation in Syria calls for such an approach. I am appalled by the deteriorating humanitarian situation, particularly in Aleppo.

The unacceptable breaches of international humanitarian law show the extent of the catastrophe. The EU has spoken out strongly to condemn these atrocities. The immediate priority must be to restore a credible ceasefire. In the face of the humanitarian tragedy, inaction is not an option. Together with EU High Representative and Vice President of the European Commission, Federica Mogherini, we took an urgent humanitarian initiative last weekend. This initiative for east Aleppo, taken in co-operation with the United Nations, has two main elements: first, to facilitate urgent delivery of basic life-saving assistance to civilians, including medical, water and food needs; and, second, to ensure the medical evacuations of the wounded and sick, especially women, children and the elderly. Unfortunately, until now the practical results on the ground have not been optimistic. There are many reasons we are here. We expect, but not until tomorrow, some positive developments in order to see how we can deliver assistance to east Aleppo.

I renew my call to all our partners and all parties to the conflict to unite on this humanitarian initiative. We need support and political pressure to impose on our interlocutors to accept the principle that humanitarian access is not a matter of the cessation of hostilities. Humanitarian access is a completely different issue from the cessation of hostilities. We need only security measures in order to provide humanitarian assistance. In this context, I deeply appreciate that Ireland is a strong partner in the effort. In my discussions with the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Charles Flanagan, I saw his commitment to find solutions for engagement from the Irish side.

Iraq is also a priority. The offensive on Mosul could result in the displacement of two million people or more. My visit last July has convinced me that our engagement in Iraq should be strengthened. The humanitarian needs are massive. In my field trips in Erbil I had many meetings with the UN officials there to prepare ourselves for the humanitarian crisis after the Mosul operation. It is important to find solutions to prepare ourselves on the ground through the Iraqi Government and others, and many local authorities and our humanitarian partners on the ground. During the UN General Assembly, the EU pledged another €30 million, bringing the total humanitarian aid for this year to €134 million.

South Sudan, the Democratic Republic of Congo, DRC, Central African Republic and the increasing violence by Boko Haram in Nigeria remain high on our agenda. Although refugees have reached European shores, the developing world continues to shoulder the largest part of the burden, and 89% of the world's refugees live in developing countries. This is why it is important to see refugees as contributors to a society, not as a burden. Education has a key role to play in this. Education is paramount and is central to our efforts to prevent radicalisation and lost generations. It is the foundation of everything else. This is why I have made education my priority as Commissioner for Humanitarian Aid and Crisis Management. Last year, I increased by four the budget for education in emergency humanitarian aid.

The resilience agenda also has a key role to play in helping developing countries. Ireland is strongly behind this, and I am grateful for it. I am well aware of Ireland's commitment to the cause in the Sahel, the Horn of Africa and the Central African Republic to name a few. Our action in support of global resilience extends to east and southern Africa in their struggle to cope with El Niño. Some 60 million people are affected by food insecurity. Although the EU is responding with almost €550 million, the funding gap remains enormous, unfortunately.

President Juncker called for more union in this Union. In the field of crisis management, we have made concrete steps towards this goal. Member states are co-operating successfully in the EU's civil protection mechanism and are making progress in strengthening it. We now have a voluntary pool of well-defined response capacities. Member states make these available. It is already a success, as we have seen in Serbia and Greece, where thousands of items were delivered to refugees. This is a real definition of European solidarity on the ground. We are building on lessons learned from our experiences.

As the EU co-ordinator, I witnessed the operational gaps and the outstanding needs in dealing with Ebola in the field, in Sierra Leone, Liberia and Guinea. There was an acute shortage of fully equipped medical teams. That is why we set up the European Medical Corps as a concrete solution to problems of a global scale. It is a new instrument to rapidly deploy medical teams worldwide. Three weeks ago we deployed in Angola. I am proud to see the tangible results of this new instrument. Only seven months after its launch, the European Medical Corps has 15 specialised teams from ten member states. We had two successful missions in the fight against yellow fever in Africa, thanks to the work of impressive medical doctors and scientists.

Moreover, in his address, President Juncker presented another initiative, the European Solidarity Corps. This initiative reminds us that solidarity is the glue that keeps the European Union together. For me, it is important to realise we need this instrument to recognise our obligations to keep it together. Through this new instrument, young Europeans will be able to volunteer and offer their help where it is needed most, for example, in dealing with the refugee crisis. They will also be able to develop their skills in dealing with the earthquake crisis in Italy and everywhere else in Europe. We are keen to develop the corps in close collaboration with member states and civil society. We would welcome the committee's views on this outstanding initiative.

Ireland is a country with a proud tradition of providing humanitarian aid. For example, every child is given a Trócaire box at Lent. My dear colleague, Phil Hogan, insisted that I say something about it because it is quite important to the Irish people. Irish children put their savings in it, to be sent to those less fortunate.

The only way to make the European Union stronger is to work together. It is not just a slogan. There is no other way, especially at this critical juncture. Let us build on our achievements. We have to be modest, but, at the same time, we must recognise that the European Union has had many achievements which have been the foundation for citizens' benefits. At the same time, let us learn from our shortcomings. That is why it is important to join forces to implement a positive agenda which is not for us alone. It is also for our children in the next generation and, in particular, the future of this continent. My experience on the ground reaffirms that the European Union is not only a soft global player, a soft key player, in dealing with worldwide issues; it is also a model for the majority of other nations in other regions.

I thank the Chairman for giving me this opportunity and I members for their attention.

Chairman

I thank the Commissioner. The Trócaire representatives present will be pleased that he mentioned the organisation. Trócaire and many other Irish NGOs, with their sister organisations throughout the world, do excellent work in assisting the most underprivileged and disadvantaged communities.

The crises in many parts of the world are clearly demonstrated in the Commissioner's reference to the 250 million people affected by humanitarian crises and the unprecedented 65 million who have been forcibly displaced. These statistics clearly demonstrate the sad reality of a totally inadequate global response to so many crises.

We will take a number of questions, starting with Deputy Darragh O'Brien who will be followed by Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan.

Deputy Darragh O'Brien

I welcome the Commissioner and thank him for his presentation which gives us an opportunity to give our point of view on matters. I do not doubt the commitment of the Commissioner or that of his team to tackling what is the biggest humanitarian crisis since the Second World War. The theme of his presentation is solidarity which is sorely lacking in the global response. I agree with him on the need for a global response. However, there is also a need for a European response.

Prior to the meeting the Commissioner met the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade. I am spokesperson on foreign affairs and trade for the largest Opposition party which has a deep concern about the EU-Turkey arrangement and the EU migrant partnership frameworks. Our fundamental belief is that the arrangement undermines the rights of refugees and migrants. While the Commissioner has mentioned it as the solution - there is a practical element to it - through the EU-Turkey arrangement we have abrogated our responsibility as member states and citizens of the European Union. I will give an example. I will also have a few questions to ask.

There are 6.5 million people who are internally displaced in Syria, while 65 million people are displaced worldwide. They are all individuals. About 13 months ago a young child, Alan Kurdi, drowned and his body was washed up on the beach in Bodrum. We are all familiar with the pictures. At the time every EU member state, including Ireland, responded by promising to take in 3,000, 4,000, 10,000 or 15,000 people. The public in Ireland is way ahead of the Government in its response. The Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade might have told the Commissioner that Ireland had taken in one unaccompanied child under the EU settlement and relocation programme. That is not solidarity with the peoples of the Middle East, including Syria and Iraq.

My concern is that, at a European level, instead of relocation and resettlement to other EU states, the EU-Turkey and the EU migrant partnership framework arrangements are the new deal. They may form part of it, but I would like the Commissioner's view on that, particularly in light of our concerns and especially in relation to talking about Turkey as a safe haven. I do not believe Turkey is a safe haven or a safe country.

I note the EU was looking recently at a framework arrangement with Afghanistan to relocate 80,000 refugees to that country. The Commissioner might be familiar with the leaked memo and I ask him to comment on that. It appeared from the content of that leaked EU memo that there was a stick being held over Afghanistan in relation to aid. The agreement was made in respect of so-called third country arrangements. That is something about which I have a concern.

Will the Commissioner comment on how many other third country arrangements are being negotiated? I believe it is upwards of 16. I am not saying it is not part of the solution and I do not want to be completely negative. I am aware that Europe, all the NGOs, other countries and thousands of people are responding and doing their level best, but I do not want the Commissioner to leave Ireland today with a view that there is agreement among the political representatives in Ireland that third country arrangements are the way forward. Fianna Fáil does not believe that. I believe it has shifted the problem to other countries.

The Commissioner mentioned 89% of displaced people are seeking safe haven in developing countries. We are a developed country and our response to the crisis has been to take fewer than 400 refugees between relocation and resettlement - less than 10% of what we said we would do. I would ask the Commissioner where individual sovereign states' commitments on relocation and resettlement fit in with the migrant partnership framework towards which the EU is moving. Will he say which member states have met or are likely to meet their targets?

Our real concern is we want a co-ordinated response that is right in moral terms. It is right to respect refugees' rights and to give them a safe haven, and third country arrangements do not offer that. It is a diminution of refugees' and migrants' rights. As the Commissioner will be aware, we as a country understand it well from our own history. Where does the Commissioner see this moving to?

On Syria and the situation in Aleppo, I was interested to hear about the moves there might be this week to try to get more aid into the city. Obviously, we roundly condemn the attacks that were carried out on the Red Crescent and the UN aid convoys there. What is the Commissioner's view on a sustainable ceasefire? The situation in Aleppo is simply barbaric. It was discussed in the Dáil. My party leader raised it on Tuesday. It cannot be allowed to continue.

When I was younger and studying history, I looked at what countries in Europe and elsewhere did as they stood around and watched during the Second World War. I was told that would never happen again. During the crisis in Yugoslavia we went back to concentration camps right on our doorstep and which we could see on television, and the response was slow. It does not appear to me that we have learnt lessons. With the Irish Naval Service, whose personnel I commend on their humanitarian work in saving refugees from the Mediterranean, we see real solidarity and real impacts. I am fully aware that the Commissioner does not have a magic wand, but the solution is not to throw money at this problem and push these refugees into states such as Turkey.

Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan

I welcome the Commissioner. It has been a good opportunity to hear his views and to present ours and ask the questions we have. No doubt it is a gigantic task that the Commissioner has at present and ahead of him.

I am struck that when we talk about disasters that require humanitarian aid, we can separate them into the so-called natural ones that come about because of climate, such as hurricanes that we see now in the Caribbean, and the others that are man-made. When we see what is happening in Syria, and I am glad the Commissioner mentioned Yemen, and I would wonder about Libya as well, it is man who is at the root of all those. As the Commissioner said, unless we get to the political solution of men - unfortunately, it seems to be all men, and maybe we need more women involved to have their input into resolutions and solutions - we will not see an end to what is going on. What we see in the meantime is UN resolutions, international law and international humanitarian law being ignored completely. People continue blithely ignoring all this. What are Mr. Stylianides's views on this and his input on the political solutions?

The Commissioner mentioned dignity. I visited the Turkish-Syrian border and saw good examples of humanitarian aid, but I also saw the opposite - the exploitation of refugees that was going on. I, too, would have reservations. I note Turkey's reaction to the coup with the crackdown and the arrest of teachers and journalists and the Turkish treatment of the Kurds. Despite this, we are turning to Turkey to look after refugees. I also note this recent development with Afghanistan and the threat to withdraw aid. We have the expression, NIMBY, not in my back yard, and many European countries, including Ireland, have taken the route that it is okay that the solutions are elsewhere and it is up to somebody else to look after it. None of us is stepping up to the mark.

Are those countries which have pledged aid honouring those pledges monetarily? I am involved in an organisation called the Association of European Parliamentarians with Africa, AWEPA, which involves us working with African parliamentarians. People are leaving African countries because of human rights abuses, for example, because of the lack of access to education. We seem not so much to accept that as not to get into the root of those countries, so to speak, and put pressure on them to respect human rights. Sometimes we look to close the stable door after the horse has bolted when instead we must see what we can do when the horse is in the stable. I have questions about humanitarian aid being targeted at people with a disability - disability is finally in a sustainable development goal - and about unaccompanied minors. I refer to the particularly vulnerable groups.

Returning to the issue of humanitarian and international law being completely ignored, we look at it in terms of Gaza. What can be done with the rebuilding of Gaza? The pledges have been made but nothing is happening. We are familiar with the humanitarian crisis there.

One other matter, given the anniversary of another UN resolution that is coming up, is the relic of the Cold War which is the blockade against Cuba. This has had a significant impact on Cuban society which has lost billions of euro because of it. The UN passes a resolution every year condemning that with few exceptions, yet it continues. When a resolution is passed or a humanitarian law is breached, when do we get into that mindset that we can do something about it? The Commissioner's work will continue until we get back to that position.

Chairman

We are under a time constraint. If the Commissioner could respond to those points, I will bring in all the members in the second round.

Mr. Christos Stylianides

I thank the members for their questions and views. They are constructive in our assessment regarding the situation.

I would like to clarify something from the beginning. I am Commissioner for humanitarian aid.

My role, especially on the ground, is to find ways to provide humanitarian assistance. It is important to act within the framework of humanitarian principles. As this role is important in reaching refugees and migrants, sometimes I have to be very impartial and have no political engagement. Sometimes, frankly, I avoid stating anything which might more or less destroy my impartiality and neutrality. That is why some of the members' questions are difficult for me to discuss, as it might be difficult for me to visit any country to exert pressure behind the scenes for it to provide assistance. For me, the major and moral obligation is to find and reach vulnerable people.

I agree with Deputy Darragh O'Brien in his concerns about some of the controversial aspects of the EU-Turkey agreement. Many aspects of the agreement have faced many criticisms. At the same time, there are specific figures in the agreement which are completely positive for refugees and migrants. First, the influx from Turkey to Aegean Islands and the deaths on Turkey's shores were frustrating because of the image of Alan Kurdi on the beach. Because of the agreement, fortunately, we have minimised the deaths on Turkey's shores and the Aegean Islands.

Many times in politics, as members know better than me, the dilemma lies between idealism and pragmatism. As a politician, I am always pragmatic because I strongly believe in practical results and outcomes, which is important for me. As a politician in Cyprus, I always believed in the pragmatic approach in all aspects of our political activities. Regardless of the criticisms, the EU-Turkey agreement remains the only way to deal with this unprecedented crisis. Otherwise, because of our disagreements within the institutions, we would have many approaches. That is why, in a pragmatic way, we decided to sign the agreement to cope with this unprecedented situation. That is the only way and why, as European Commissioner for Humanitarian Aid and Crisis Management, I try to find solutions to provide assistance to make a difference on the ground. Last week in Turkey I announced the largest humanitarian project ever funded by European funds, a €348 million cash voucher scheme, through which we believe we will reach over 1 million refugees in Turkey. It will deliver cash on prepaid cards to meet basic needs, including education, shelter and rent. I strongly believe this is the only dignified way to provide assistance for refugees.

We found through our implementing partner, the World Food Programme, that we have very good collaboration with the Turkish authorities, particularly the Turkish Red Crescent, Türk Kzlay. Without their collaboration, there is no way to reach vulnerable refugees. Above all, the alleviation of the suffering of vulnerable people is important. That is why we chose the pragmatic way to mitigate the suffering of the people. We have had negotiations with the Turkish authorities to reach this new state of play. Now the situation is getting better. I realise there are many shortcomings and problems, but I strongly believe it is better to give assistance through difficulties than to stay far away from the problem and discuss only principles and values. That is my political philosophy. I have to be pragmatic to reach solutions on the ground. That is my role. I am a doer. I want to be someone who reaches solutions, not just discuss them. That is why I insist on this happening through some of the controversial aspects of the agreement, regardless of its shortcomings.

Until now EU member states did not respond in a better way to give the impression that the European Union could deliver on this issue. At the same time, through the institutions, we must insist on reaching a common EU position. That is the only way to create coherence and increase and improve our reserves on the ground.

The situation is not one where I, as Commissioner, am in charge. However, I note certain points and statistics. The situation is improving compared to where matters stood a month ago. In terms of relocation from Italy, there was no figure as such two months ago. In the interim, however, 1,189 people have been relocated. This is the beginning of the process. By 27 September, 4,455 people had been relocated from Greece. While this is not the ideal figure, it seems we have already started to meet our obligation to conclude our commitments through this process.

I note to Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan my view on the attacks on humanitarian workers and against international humanitarian law. They are completely unacceptable. This is why the European Union insisted - through me - at the last World Humanitarian Summit, or WHS, that our common position is to ensure that international humanitarian law is increasingly capable of putting political pressure on everyone to respect such law. Unfortunately, we cannot achieve our ambition in the WHS but we have seen some improvements. The situation on the ground, especially in Aleppo in Syria and in Iraq, is disappointing. The most recent development has been attacks on and bombardment of medical teams and facilities, which is completely unacceptable. As someone who comes from a medical profession, I note how catastrophic this development is. This is why the European Union is putting pressure on the Assad regime - through all of our instruments and interlocutors on the ground - to find solutions and to protect at least basic medical facilities. This is why we are trying, through our initiative with Federica Mogherini, to find ways to provide medical evacuation from east Aleppo to our hospitals in order that health care for wounded children, women and elderly people can be provided. I share the Deputy's concern and disappointment about this matter.

I was asked specifically about unaccompanied minors and those with disabilities. For unaccompanied minors, we allocate specific money and have many projects in Turkey and Greece. To date, we have allocated €25 million in Greece for 12 specific projects designed to provide social support to unaccompanied minors and to create specific shelters which are child-friendly in order to keep them safe and avoid sexual abuse or similar activities. It is a tragic aspect of the situation. However, through the projects and our humanitarian partners on the ground and in collaboration with the Greek authorities, I am sure that there have been improvements and that we can deliver more attention to unaccompanied minors in particular. In many areas globally, including Iraq, Syria, South Sudan and the Lake Chad region, we have provided a lot of EU-funded projects which provide specific assistance to people with disabilities. I am proud that DG ECHO and our partners always insist that the sensitive issues of unaccompanied minors and people with disabilities are addressed.

Chairman

Five members are offering. I will take their questions together before going back to the Commissioner. In view of the time constraints, I would appreciate it if members could be brief.

Deputy Seán Crowe

I agree with much of what the Commissioner said at the outset on bold actions, decisiveness, the need to demonstrate a capacity for joint action and the need to deliver a Europe of solidarity. Unfortunately, we have not seen that Europe of solidarity emerge. In September 2015, the EU launched a plan to resettle 160,000 refugees from Greece and Italy to other EU member states. So far, this has failed massively. At the beginning of September, just over 1,000 people left Italy and 3,493 left Greece. Countries such as Austria, Hungary and Poland have yet to relocate anyone. Ireland has talked about taking people in but its rate in this regard is less than 10%. The policy does not seem to be working. The Minister of State with responsibility for Europe came before us yesterday and we put the same questions to him. There is a problem. Does the Commissioner see a contradiction in that many of the countries that have shown this lack of solidarity are those which are involved in supplying military aid to the parties involved in the conflict in the Middle East? Every time there is a bombing or attack in Syria, Iraq or Yemen, people leave those countries and come to Europe looking for safety. Yet, the countries supplying the weaponry to the Saudis, Iraqis and Turks are all involved in that. Does the Commissioner see this as a contradiction and what can we do as Europeans to speak out against it?

In short, the system does not seem to be working. Only one unaccompanied minor has been settled thus far in Ireland out of the 400 or so to be brought in this year. We are almost in denial about this reality that the system is not working. I do not mean any disrespect to the Commissioner but his observation that things are better than they were a year ago shows he is in denial. I agree with my colleagues regarding the EU deal with Turkey. It is a scandal that the UN is not being allowed into the camps to investigate what is going on. My concern is that this deal is being used as a model for other conflicts. There are plans, for example, to send people who fled Afghanistan back there. We promised those people democratic values and so on but all they got was more conflict and war. In many of these cases, the conflicts people are fleeing were caused by Europeans, Americans and others, but we are telling them they must return to the areas from which they escaped. There is no welcome for them in other countries. The majority of Irish people would agree with me that we want to see these conflicts resolved and people welcomed instead of turned away. The system that is currently in place is not working and we must state it is broken and must be fixed. There needs to be a collective effort to see how that can be done.

Reference was made to unaccompanied minors at Calais. President Hollande spoke recently about dismantling the camp, which contains vast numbers of children. Do the witnesses have any comments in that regard?

On Gaza, the UN report predicts that the area will be uninhabitable by 2020. Recently, an aid flotilla was boarded by Israeli gunboats. People living there are unable to access food, water and electricity. Will the Commissioner comment on that situation?

High Commissioner Mogherini has talked about the launch of a humanitarian initiative for the political future of Syria. I would like to hear more about this, specifically the intention to prevent further violations of humanitarian aid. Colleagues referred to the situation in Aleppo. It is appalling what is happening there and, again, it does not seem to be on anybody's agenda. People are helpless and cannot see what may be done to help people there. It comes back to accountability once again. The recent intensification of the conflict there means more people will be travelling to Europe. How do we break that cycle and work towards peaceful resolution of conflicts? We must do things differently. I do not see the likes of the Turkish or Afghani deals as the way to solve these huge problems.

Deputy Tony McLoughlin

I welcome the Commissioner to Ireland and thank him for attending the meeting. As Commissioner for Humanitarian Aid and Crisis Management, does he consider Ireland's total contribution to the humanitarian assistance programme - which is in the region of €142,000 for 2015, with a similar contribution allocated for 2016 - to be in line with that of other EU countries in the context of GDP output per capita? Is it his view that this provisions should be increased given the current international crises that are unfolding and, if so, by how much or what percentage?

In 2015, the Government published an updated humanitarian assistance policy which aims to implement further structures and methodologies that will enable Ireland to continue to achieve its goal of providing humanitarian assistance, saving and protecting lives, eliminating suffering and maintaining dignity. Will the Commissioner detail to the committee the areas of international humanitarian assistance provision to which this State and other EU member states should be allocating more resources? I ask this as I seek to understand how Ireland can improve its efforts into the future.

Senator Ivana Bacik

I apologise for being late, which was a result of my having to chair another meeting. The witnesses are very welcome. Other speakers have voiced the concerns I share regarding the slow progress in the welcoming of refugees under resettlement and relocation programmes. The Commissioner outlined the very slow progress at European level. We all are concerned about how slow it has been in Ireland. Colleagues referred to Calais and the number of unaccompanied minors there. I will focus on the question of accountability and what the EU is proposing to do to ensure accountability for the gross violations of humanitarian law we have seen perpetrated in Syria, in particular by the Russian and Syrian Governments in their abandonment of the peace process, the deployment of air strikes on humanitarian aid convoys and the ongoing blockade of civilians, including many children in Aleppo. What does the EU propose to do in terms of further sanctions against Russia, calling in representatives of the Russian Government and so on?

My colleague referred to Gaza. Again, many of us are concerned that the EU is not doing enough to ensure Israel, in particular, is made accountable for violations of international human rights law in its treatment of civilians in Gaza and the ongoing blockade of the region.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

I thank the Commissioner for his contribution. However, I suggest to him that the EU is speaking out of both sides of its mouth on this matter. It is talking about solidarity while, in reality, shutting the doors on the most desperate and vulnerable people fleeing the most appalling circumstances. I did not understand the justification the Commissioner offered for the EU-Turkey deal. It is nothing short of a direct flouting of the most basic humanitarian law in that it is allowing for the expulsion of people who should be given asylum and their exportation or outsourcing to a regime whose human rights record is shockingly bad. Rather than Europe - one of the wealthiest, if not the wealthiest, blocs in the world - opening its doors to the people who are fleeing from Syria and desperate situations in other locations, we choose to seek to corral them in Turkey and pay the latter for that purpose. That is shocking and it has consequences in terms of dealing with some of the root causes of the Syrian conflict.

One of the groups that deserves considerable credit for its role in resisting the malign forces in Syria is the Kurds, particularly the Kurdistan Workers Party, PKK. It is outrageous that the party is still on the international terrorist list and is being persecuted by the Turkish regime. The PKK fought off ISIS and is one of the few progressive forces that could actually offer some type of solution to the horrible situation in Syria. If Europe had any sort of ethical compass, it would be telling the Turkish regime to end its persecution of the Kurdish people.

The witness has spoken about practicality and pragmatism but there has been nothing more practical than the role of the Kurds in resisting ISIS in Turkey and they get no real support from Europe or anywhere else.

I also ask about the Afghan deal. The leaked memo suggests that the European Union strong-armed representatives of the Afghan Government into agreeing a deal for mass deportation of Afghanis from all European states and made further European Union aid to Afghanistan conditional on the Afghan Government agreeing to this. This is shocking. Afghanistan is being ripped apart as we speak with war and it is a dangerous place, with renewed offensives in Kunduz and so on. What does the European Union do? It strong-arms the Afghan Government into agreeing to mass deportations of Afghanis from Europe. Is that true and did that happen? This is the report we are getting. People who attended the conference and so on are saying the Afghan Government was strong-armed. The quid pro quo was that aid would only be continued if Afghanistan signed up to this policy of mass deportations of Afghanis. If it is true, it is shocking beyond belief.

I want to speak about double standards in the wider political stance of the European Union on some of the root causes of these conflicts. Israel is an obvious issue. Why are the human rights conditions around the trade association agreements with Israel not being invoked? Why are those agreements with Israel not being suspended while Israel flouts basic human rights for Palestinians, particularly in Gaza? Everybody knows that what Israel is doing to Gaza is absolutely criminal, breaking every international law, and yet the European Union continues to give Israel favoured trade status. That sort of double standard then fuels radicalisation in the region. Similarly, European states are continuing to export arms to the Saudi Arabian Government, which is involved with appalling atrocities in Yemen. That is the type of double standard I refer to.

I agree with Senator Bacik, who spoke about the need for accountability from Russia arising from its absolutely disgusting attacks in Aleppo. We also need accountability from European Union member states bombing the hell out of Syria. How does that contribute and what is the European Union doing about its own member states bombing in Syria? That kind of double standard is precisely what is ripping the Middle East apart, creating the conditions in which extremist groups like ISIS can flourish.

Mr. Christos Stylianides

I have just three minutes. We have similar approaches and I share some of the concerns of my dear colleagues. I would like to give my thoughts. In South Sudan we face the definition of the man-made conflict. There are two leaders who, unfortunately, are playing a political game with many controversial issues. Sometimes in our institutions we have many regulations and are cautious about ensuring our humanitarian assistance and development aid go to vulnerable people. We decided to continue this assistance because of the needs of the refugees. If we chase this only with a political aspect and approach, in this case maybe we would have to cancel our assistance. I believe in my obligations.

In many areas around the world I face critical regulations regarding the political situation but at the same time, as Commissioner responsible for humanitarian aid, my role is find ways to give assistance to vulnerable people in the likes of Turkey, South Sudan, Egypt or Nigeria. The majority of African countries do not have the basics of the rule of law or the democracy that all of us respect. We must find ways to provide assistance as this is our role, regardless of the political situation, our political disagreements and many other issues. It is why I insist on an EU-Turkey agreement. I call myself pragmatic because I want to provide assistance to these people in need. This is my role. There is a humanitarian principle and role.

If I engage in a political discussion, my role would be marginal at least and perhaps insufficient. Give me the chance to protect my role as Commissioner responsible for humanitarian aid. This is why I must not see the glass as half-empty. That is quite important for me. In order to keep my commitments, I must find solutions to provide humanitarian assistance in the likes of Aleppo, Gaza, Gaziantep, the Aegean islands, South Sudan, Nigeria and everywhere else. Otherwise, these people will lose any hope for their lives, not just for a better future but to survive. Our role is to save lives and protect children from radicalisation, forced recruitment and forced marriage.

Many times I see multiple dilemmas.

I have to protect my role as a humanitarian actor. The humanitarian approach is above all. This is my moral obligation. This is my moral framework. I understand the role of the parliamentarian as I served in Parliament many times, but in my current position it is critical to provide assistance to all people in need.

I thank the committee for their attention.

Chairman

On behalf of the joint committee I thank Commissioner Stylianides for his presentation and his interaction with members. The worries and concerns expressed by members today are indicative of the views shared by Irish society in general. I hope he will be able to bring our worries and concerns to the attention of his fellow Commissioners. Let me emphasise they are reflective of the views of the Irish people on the need for an adequate global response to meet the major humanitarian crises throughout the world. Moreover, an adequate response is needed immediately; not down the road.

I thank the Commissioner for his participation in today's meeting. We wish him well in meeting the significant challenges in the very important work he undertakes.

Mr. Christos Stylianides

I thank the Chairman and committee members. I would like to continue our partnership. We must keep in touch to listen to the members, while at the same time expressing our concerns and capabilities to alleviate the people's suffering.

Chairman

We look forward to continued dialogue with the Commissioner and his officials.

The joint committee went into private session at 11.52 a.m. and adjourned at 12.10 p.m. until 9.30 a.m. on Thursday, 20 October 2016.