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Joint Committee on the Secondary Legislation of the European Communities debate -
Tuesday, 27 Mar 1979

Amendment of Orders of Reference of Joint Committee and Relations with Members of European Assembly.

This draft report arises because we have to draw the attention of the Houses to the fact that the assumption on which the Committee is appointed is, in one particular, no longer true. At the time the present Joint Committee was established there were delegates to the Assembly of the European Communities. The first Joint Committee had such delegates as Members and during its currency the practice grew of supplying them with all the papers we got on various matters in so far as they were relevant to items appearing on the agenda of the particular committees on which any of them were serving in the Assembly. In fact they got them before they were circulated to the other Members of that first Joint Committee.

When the present Joint Committee was being established it was provided that delegates should be notified of meetings and allowed to attend and take part in proceedings without having a right to vote. In establishing the present Committee it was also provided that none of the delegates, with the rights they were given of notification and attendance, would be Members of the Committee. In doing that the House adopted a recommendation that the first Joint Committee had made in its Fifty-Fifth Report. When we were being established the Minister for Foreign Affairs made it clear in the Dáil that the practice of supplying briefs to delegates should be continued even through they were no longer Members of the Committee. In June last the delegates were replaced by directly elected representatives. The provisions of the resolutions with regard to delegates lapsed and with them the arrangements for supplying briefs. We propose to draw the attention of the House, who passed these resolutions constituting this Committee, to a meeting we had with the present Irish representatives in the Assembly on 19 December last to which they were all invited. In the event and because of their other commitments only three of the Irish representatives came to the meeting. The terms of the invitation were to consider to what extent arrangements for mutual assistance could be evolved which would help our Committee to discharge its obligations to the Houses of the Oireachtas and, at the same time, the members of the European Parliament to discharge their parliamentary duties there.

We say in the draft report that we have neither the time nor the resources to examine all the matters which come within our terms of reference. The way we select material for examination is, therefore, important. We express the view that we would be better able to determine what should be given priority if we could have the suggestions of the Irish representatives in the Assembly. It would help us to do our job of selection and order our affairs better if we used the practice, which has lapsed since June, of giving briefs to Irish representatives who are Members of either House. The representatives believed they should be notified of our meetings. Paragraph 8 of the draft report which has been circulated contains a suggested substitution for the paragraph in the orders of reference which is no longer applicable because of the change in the status of the representatives in the Assembly:

That representatives in the Assembly of the European Communities who are also members of either House be notified of meetings and be allowed to attend and take part in the proceedings without having a right to vote.

We also recommend deletion of certain words in another paragraph which are no longer relevant.

The Committee may think that it does not seem appropriate that we should discuss the matter. When our report on this matter comes for discussion, and this would be for the Minister for Foreign Affairs to decide on, Members of either the Dáil or Seanad might well think it a matter for their consideration as to what should be done in respect of those Members of the Assembly who have been elected but who are not members of either House. They will have to consider our view which is that we should be authorised to brief those who have been elected and who are Members of the House as we did previously.

The secretariat has corrected me as to what we are recommending which is a change in the Orders of Reference to the effect that representatives who are Members of either House be notified of meetings and be allowed to attend and to take part in the proceedings without any right to vote. We are also recommending that any Irish representative who agrees to help should be given briefs freely. We do not recommend that those who are not Members of the Houses be notified of meetings and allowed to attend. That may be a matter for either of the Houses to debate.

Deputy Leonard

Would we have power to invite them to our meetings and allow them to assist us?

We have not that at the moment but we are recommending that those who are Members of either House be notified of meetings and allowed to attend. Somebody not in the Dáil or Seanad may take the view that they should be invited to attend and to take part in the proceedings without having a right to vote as well. That is more a matter for the Houses to decide rather than us.

Deputy Leonard

It is important that they be made aware of what we are discussing and that we provide them with an agenda and have some type of contact with them.

I take the view that the Houses, which set us up, should decide.

Refer it back to the Houses?

Yes. It would be more orderly that our recommendation should be to the Houses that set us up, that those Members of the Houses who are in the European Assembly be invited to attend our meetings and that any representative who agrees to help us should be briefed. There could be a situation where none of the representatives in the European Assembly was a Member of either House. That is a matter which in principle arises when this has been determined. We have two representatives in that position at present. There is an important question of public policy which is essentially for the political parties to think about. Our business could be better done if all those who agreed to help us were briefed. We should be authorised to invite—as we have been up to now—members of the Houses who are not elected representatives.

Paragraphs 1 to 8, inclusive, agreed to.

Draft report agreed to.

Ordered: To report accordingly.

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